DEFENCE THREAD
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In this Euros we saw some awful and some good defending. here are those who impressed me the most.
-Italy, well, has a history of great defenders, and the Juve block is playing really good. BUT it is a matter of concentration. If you saw Italy vs Irealnd you can clearly see that Bonucci was shit, because he had no Buffon telling him what to do. Bonucci can easily lose the concentration and fuck it up.
-Germany, they didn't conede a single goal, their best defender is Boateng who is a jolly and can play in any role. Hummels is also pretty based.
-Poland. Pazdan is the surprise, he performed admirably throughout this euros. Kamil Glik is very well known in Italy. Pisczczek and Jadlowiec are perfect on the sides. bonus point for Thiago Cionek who plays in Palermo and he helped us avoid relegation.
-Portugal. Pepe is a GOAT defender, every team should have a player like him. His match against Croatia should be studied in football schools, it was the perfect match. He is also the one who lead the movements so he is very precious. Hope he doesn't get nervous kek.
-Wales. They are literally whos but they are very strong and, most important, they are neat, they don't do strange things.
-France. Umtiti is better than Koscielny. Evra is still good, but I think that defense is not their strong point.
Other teams like Northern Ireland, Eire and Iceland showed some good defending, intensity and efficient teamwork.
As Atletico or Leicester or Iceland or Italy vs Spain demonstrated, we are luckily heading to an era where tiki taka disappear and pressing, balance and intensity are the key for victory
Well what do you know. An actual sports thread on /sp/.
Yeah I agree, Pepe's game against Croatia was nearly perfect. Positioning, 1 on 1, crosses, he took care of everything.
The whole italian team was amazing to watch in the Spain game. And the very few times they fucked up, Buffon was there to save the day.
I'm looking forward to seeing how Lewa deals with Portugal's defense tonight.
>>69078696
>An actual sports thread on /sp/.
>one answer in one hour
kek
>>69079020
Go write on Ultimo Uomo or something nerd
>>69079038
go suck a dick
>>69078426
>Evra
>still good
I don't see how you could rate France in your best 6, actually. It's been known for the last 2 or 3 years that this defense is absolutely awful. There's always 1 or 2 guys completely off the mark or wondering where they are in the first place on every fucking kick to the box. Half of them are blundermachines, and the other half are penaltymachines.
This will be their demise. They'll concede 3 or 4 in the first game against a team that knows its deal in front of the goal rather than being Albanians or Romanians.
>>69079120
yes I know I talked about them because they are still in the cup.
Deschamps seems confused. the only good thing for >you is Greasemann and Kante.
>buffon 0 goals
>noier 0 goals
>>69079164
both goat keepers
>>69078426
>Evra is still good
>>69078426
>its a shitskin tries talking futbol thread.
Nah
>>69079201
>This flag
>This comment
>>69079189
well, he is experienced, he knows how to handle pressure.
maybe he is no more athletically good as ten years ago but I think he is a reliable player and would be a starter in almost every team in the competition.
>mfw I saw him playing in Marsala against Palermo in fucking 1998
>>69079179
Neuer is far away from the GOAT status, he fucks up too much when rushing out.
Buffon is unironically the best goalkeeper in history.
>>69079224
Yeah I don't like Evra but this team needs players with experience.
>>69079218
No literally
>that comment
>that flag
Not only does your national team have more niggers than ours, your general population has more muzzys.
>its a france thinks they are relevant in any way that doesnt include getting literally blown the fuck up by terrorists post
>>69078426
Just came here to say that Rami is wank
>era where athletes over talent can do well
>England and USA are still ass
>>69078426
>As Atletico or Leicester or Iceland or Italy vs Spain demonstrated, we are luckily heading to an era where tiki taka disappear and pressing, balance and intensity are the key for victory
these things always go in cycles and the success usually comes to the teams that do the opposite of what all the other teams are *trying* to do. then all of the shit teams with no identity just flip flop and try to copy whatever the best teams are doing but never succeed anyway.
the best tactics are the ones that get the best out of the players on disposal, nothing more. the really, really good teams like world class national teams or clubs that are high in the table in the first division get way more options to their style though because their players are more technically and tactically literate.
but there is no one style that will ever die and no style that will ever be the best. we have all of these archetypal styles that will be here in the sport for a very long time. (until the sport starts being played by robots/aliens in space arenas)
>>69079261
This. It's a shame Buffon is retiring soon, will possibly be the end of Italy's success when he retires.
>>69079261
I think you are right but the reality is more nuanced.
Buffon is the best keeper at the moment, but Neuer did a revolution in the keeper role.
He plays almost as a defender, he plays like ten metres away from the goal line.
He sure is also a great 'traditional' keeper but he is interpreting the role in a very innovative way
>>69079365
How does he play as a defender? Just because he's away from the goal line when his team is attacking?
>>69079334
>these things always go in cycles
agreed
>the best tactics are the ones that get the best out of the players on disposal, nothing more.
this.
this is the difference between Ranieri at Leicester and Hodgson. it is more simple that it might appear, but it is also hard to pick the right players.
I like coaches like Mou, that change their style depending on the player they have, more than Guardiola that have a style and pick player to fulfil it. you have to be elastic as a trainer, in my opinion
>>69079400
Gonde only plays 3-5-2 tho
>>69079383
because he is very talented with his feet.
he is also athletically explosive, more than your average goalkeeper.
I have the feeling he is one of the very few keeper that could play in a movement role. he is also good at positioning so he doesn't need to do extraordinary saves, like Claudio Bravo or Fabianski.
I don't know man, it feels like he is interpreting his role in an innovative way
>>69079415
at Bari and Siena he was playing 4-2-4/ 4-4-2
>>69079344
>will possibly be the end of Italy's success when he retires.
you what? Italy is much more than Buffon. We have a new goat keeper named Gianluigi alredy anyway
>>69079483
There's no guarantee that Donnarumma will be good though, he's just a promise like many others before him
Sirigu was super hyped as well ten years ago
>Defense thread
>Almost all of the posters are Italian
>>69079528
>this shitskins still posting
>>69079692
Why hate
>>69079365
This is true. Thing is to be considered a GOAT for me you have to stay on top for the longest amount of years possible. And in that regard Buffon eats up basically every goalkeeper.
And iirc he said he'll play at least till 2018, but who knows. If he still has it in 2 years I don't see him retiring.
>>69078426
>Bonucci.
Dude is the troll king of defenders with his ability to fool attackers.
https://youtu.be/d_fcf-3I-WE
>>69078426
>Pepe is a GOAT defender, every team should have a player like him.
Why is everyone is suddenly saying this? He only did ONE good match against Croatia, but you all forgot his mistakes vs Hungary and when he literally run away from the striker in Iceland's goal.
>>69079365
Don't expect a Pole to say something nice about a German.
>>69079528
Is Scuffet the goods? I always bought him on Football Manager
>>69080045
>defending highlights
who makes and watches this shit
>>69080083
Do you honestly believe Neuer is better than Buffon?
>>69079692
Murricans can't deal with serious sports discussions so they try to derail the thread.
>>69080169
shut the fuck up you kraut piece of shit
this thread is terrible. I don't come to /sp/ to hear the rantings of some poo coloured italian cunt
>>69080078
pepe is a very situational player
>>69080197
Rude uezs.
>>69080078
He made a choice actually. If the ball went to the other guy he'd be there to cut the ball.
Decisions.
>>69080096
Patricians
>>69078426
>>69080096
I-i do...
>>69079798
The average poster on /sp/ just wants to shitpost and spam whatever meme is popular at the moment. They don't understand this thread.
You also have to deal with americans posting in every "soccer" thread to let us know how much they don't care about it.
>>69079434
at the start of his Juve reign he used all that and also the 4-3-3 then found success with the 3-5-2
not enough is being made of that Icelandic defender who jumped in front of Vardy to deny him a header in the last few seconds. If it wasn't for him that was a goal
>>69079275
Brad im gonna tell Tyrone and Ahmed what you said about blacks and muslims on 4chan they are going to fuck your mom so hard for the racist shit you said
>>69080415
Was it the same guy who made that desperate tackle in the box on Vardy moments before ?
>>69080415
true.
I wish I could edit to add him.. someone remembers his name? it was an insane save.
Also another (or maybe the same?) Icelandic defender made a very risky but beautiful tackle inside the box, maybe vs Kane but I can't remember.
we will see them against France extremely good forwards
>>69080514
>>69080461
just checked, the Vardy tackle was No 6 Sigurdsson who also scored the first goal
the header was No 14 Arnason
>>69080461
>>69080514
yes I was referring to this.
here I found it.
it was based Ragnar Sigurdsson
https://streamable.com/65xb
wew lads
wonderful, it reminded me of 1998 F. De Boer vs Ronaldo.
>>69080078
his Croatia match was incredible, also he won the CL this year so he is worth a mention.
>>69080096
Watch it, his defending is truly patrician.
>>69080527
both very good, thanks anon.
>>69080527
thank you anon good job.
they were both great
>>69080598
Barzagli was bought for like 300k by Jewrotta wasn't he?
![misserimichele[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/YFkjqFH.jpg "misserimichele[1].jpg")
>>69078426
zio michele, sei tu?
>>69080660
yes exactly.
he was GOAT in Palermo (he won the WC while playing there).
then in Wolfsburg he was shit and Marotta was able to resurrect him and make him GOAT again
>>69080699
no m8, actually I am picrelated.
they gave us wifi in jail so I pass my time shitposting, is pretty comfy desu
>>69080553
Kek Vardy denied.
>>69080704
A lot of that resurrection was thanks to Conte though. Same goes for Pirlo. He even made Giaccherini useful in Juventus and now he does in Italian NT
>Kompany injured
>Lombaerts unfit
>Vermaelen suspended
>Vertonghen out
who /nodefence/ here?
>>69080229
First he was defending him and then suddenly he left, that's clearly a mistake
>>69080750
don't worry Lewa forgot how to core
Hey question in defense. So it seems as though it's the most under appreciated positions on the team. Mainly because you are really only noticed for fucking up. The expected outcome is that you play well, stop fast agile forwards etc. for forwards if they screw up they miss a shot, fbs it can give up a goal.
Question being do teams ever build around a solid defender or two? It doesn't seem to really happen. I'm guessing good defenders don't get paid more, and definitely don't sell more shirts except in the rare case. It seems like the least upside most stressful positions
>>69080245
capitano
>>69080815
im not sure what the problem is here. Pepe was clearly man marking no 9 while the guy who scored was marked by the other guy who for whatever reason decided to stay at the near post and let his guy go to far post.
>>69077479
>>69077479
habbening
>>69080972
I had the same impression desu famalam
Pepe had no idea about Thor behind him
I think that the other defender took a look at Pepe and thought that since Pepe was closer to Thor than him, he was now marking Thor, but Pepe never even saw Thor
No?
>>69080888
a good goalkeeper and a good defense is what usually make a great team.
you can have the best strikers but without a strong defence you are fucked.
look at Poland. they have a great striker that couldnt manage a single goal yet. but they have Pazdan-Glik so they are still into the tournament.
yet you are right, is probably the hardest job in football. imagine being a defender facing Messi and Suarez
>>69081027
I think being a goalie is worse in that respect
Plebs especially will blame you for every goal even though it might be the fault of the defender
>>69081090
true. every remembers when a goalie fucks it up. no one remembers the 4 saves he made before it. its kinda funny how its the opposite for attackers. you can fuck up 4-5 good chances and everyone with suck your balls when you finally score one.
>>69078426
>we are luckily heading to an era where tiki taka disappear and pressing, balance and intensity are the key for victory
But tiki taka is all about pressing, balance and intensity, Luigi.
Not to mention Krauts will expose your deep-defending wait-for-setpiece-deflected-fluke luckball "system".
>>69081181
>create chances all game
>constantly press the ball
>after the FK 3 players rush the ball compared to 1 from Spain
>this is somehow luckball
Hasan Halihodzic pls
>>69081142
Just think about Joe Hart.
I know, he's not the best of GKs, >English goalkeeping, blah blah. I was seriously thinking about the two he got against Iceland.
1. A long throw-in, some Icelandic attacker got the ball with his head and the goalscorer suddenly "appeared" 5-6m in front of the goal unopposed by any defenders. Like the defence was invisible.
2. Just a few passes to get as close as needed to shoot. The defence was invisible again, static play, neither covering the attackers nor the spaces in which they ran, it was awful to watch.
Of course Hart fucked up big time, but he was """"supported""" in that by a completely invisible defence.
>>69078426
I love italian defenders, such class is seldom found elsewhere.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5X0JVTdQwmY
>>69080103
He is.
He's not only about running out of his goal to intercept passes, he is also perfect at everything involving conservative GK play. Great on the line, great refelxes, secure while catching crosses, imposing in one-on-ones, good penalty stopper.
Tell me one weakness he has, or why another keeper is overall better than him right now.
I bet you can't but sure think you know better than the professional journalists who voted him the best keeper the last three years.
>>69081245
The defense on the second goal was especially pathetic. They just looked at the players passing the ball around, no one ever bothered to make a challenge, no pressure whatsoever.
>>69081245
England is one of those teams that turn GKs(and pretty all the other players) to shit. like arsenal on steroids. its not even worth comparing. Hart is a fine keeper, he was partly to blame for that goal just like the Bale goal when he got to it but coulndt push it away enough, but thats the aura of that cursed shirt. its amazing how just a few months back he was practically the only City player worth his salt against Real.
>>69078426
>Evra is still good, but I think that defense is not their strong point.
You don't think it's strange for a defencer ?
And btw wtf is his strong point ??
>>69078426
>Umtiti is better than Koscielny
crazy what barça's interest can do to some player's reputation
>>69081181
In tikitaka is indeed important the intensity and the pressing.
the main difference is that Barcelona's/Bayern's tikitaka didn't have the defensive phase: there were no options when the opponents had the ball other than stole the ball and start the possession again.
Conte, Simeone, Ranieri and now Iceland, Wales etc have build their team on the non-possesion phase. I think this is the main difference.
you could ask based Blaz Sliskovic if this is true or not m8
>>69081305
agreed.
Hart is a good keeper, too much shit on him
>German's faces when Bonucci moves up into De Rossi's spot and Ogbonna comes off the bench
You're fucked.
>>69081328
I was referring to France team. the attack is their strong point, not defence.
in this comment >>69079224
I explained why I think Evra is a very useful player.
>>69081366
man I judge what I see. Koscielny is not bad at all but I never saw him playing and he seemed a good player.
Maybe you are right, I should wait for more difficult games to judge
>>69081426
you know gonde is just going to slide parolo to the middle and play sturaro on the wing. it's going to be disgusting.
>>69081266
>you know better than the professional journalists
The only point I could criticize, but perhaps it's because I'm also German and we see him differently than a Pole or Italian sees him.
Journalists just try to sell papers and therefore nominate the most recognizable GK. And Manuel Neuer is surely the biggest superstar goalkeeper.
Overall, you're right and there is no point in just repeating what you said.
So lads what's Conte going to play against Germany?
>>69078426
>bonucci was shit
bonucci is probably the best cb in the serie A and pep is coming for that booty
>>69080972
>>69080815
it could seem Pepe is wrong, but let me explain.
if you see number 11 is Vieirinha, he is the right back.
since like 15 years there is nomore man-on-man marking. there is zone-marking.
Pepe is protecting his zone. Paradoxically enough, if he was going to mark the one who scored, it would be a position error.
I am Italian and I despise zone-marking, because it started the decline of Italian school of defense, but here Pepe is just doing what the coach asks him.
it is Vieirinh who fail to cover his zone. if you pay attention, you will see Pepe looking at Vieirinha and going to mark number 9 who is in his marking position. it is Vieirinha's fault because he is the right back and he have to be the last in line.
I'm really afraid of facing Italy not because of their defence but because of ours.
In almost every game, it seemed like the opponent kept his defenders in line, locking up the penalty box and especially Poland pulled back the midfielders to form two rows of four. Every other team could do this simple task but >us.
This wannabe tiki taka Löw plays just couldn't do anything against a strong, physical defence. Wierdly enough that's one of the reasons why tiki taka is outdated nowadays and even Spain plays with a real 9 again. At least he learned after the Poland match...
However, on the other side of the pitch, >our defence looked like shit. The defenders on the wings were too busy in the offence to return after a failed attack, they rarely locked up the German goal against attacks. It's just not solid enough to face Italy and I expect Löw to be too stupid to do something against a non-meme team. The reason >we disn't get one yet is solely the huge insividual class of Boateng, Hummels and Neuer. Both CBs prevented countless opportunities in 1on1s that would have otherwise totally exposed the goal and the few shots on target they allowed were always extremely dangerous.
The reason why >we didn't get one yet is not tactics, but luck. And I fear this will be exposed against Italy
>>69081905
Then again Ogbonna might play as CB so rejoice
>>69080891
how do torino fans feel about his move to monaco? in his interviews he says that if he moves he wants the club to at least make some shekels off of him
