I'm an Italian leftie, basically ama but I'd like to discuss with you all why you hate "us" so much.
>>69278986
Mmmm little Italian boys getting dicked by big strong muslim men
wut.jpeg
>>69279088
Not much desu, immigrants and Italians usually stay away from each other. We're not V century BC Athens btw.
>>69279103
That's Shinya Tsukamoto. Look him up, he's a cool director.
Take in more refugees faggot
Please save the Somalian boat, Italian Coast Guard
Give more welfare to the incoming migrants and pray they don't complain about the shitty housing they were never entitled to in the first place
>>69278986
Leftist political thought is on par with that of the average 12 year old.
Its not fair!
Muh Feels!
You're stupid!
Any time people like you face disagreement your first reaction, only reaction, is violence.
>>69279362
Mmm
yeah I'm sure they stay away
You keep telling yourself that as your little brother leaves in the middle of the night
>>69279390
Could make the same exact argument for your side. It's lazy. I study philosophy, I believe in debating and understanding other's point of view. I posted here for this reason.
>>69279606
I like how you prove your point.
>>69279804
I like how you think "refugees" aren't going to rape your brother
I guess it's not rape if he likes it though
How do you make an Italian baby drink from a bottle?
>Glue hair on the nipple
>>69279804
>I believe in debating and understanding other's point of view
i bet you're one of the cunts that post his opinions on facebook. You gotta understand that nobody cares about what you think, you 12yo sperglord
>>69278986
>>69278986
> leftie
> study philosophy
Pick one cuck. Have you read Kaczynski on leftism? That is you. Uncuck yourself.
will you kill yourself please you african loving retard?
>>69280317
OOGA BOOGA GIB ITALIAN WOMEN
>>69280393
i hate itallians because they are flashy niggers with zero future time outlook
>>69280427
>>69278986
I would respect leftists more if they didn't insist on bringing in millions of hostile members of my out-group.
>>69280462
>>69280559
>>69279390
See? This is what I'm talking about
>>69279998
No arguments, no logic. Just memes. If he was to talk about how the sexual practices of Islamic people differ from Western ones and how Western ones are just better (which I agree on), then we could talk. This is worthless.
>>69280179
I don't. I write articles and essays about them, and I don't think anyone cares. That's fine. If that was what I wanted, I'd be making infographics on here.
>>69280488
Weird post. Is it satire?
>>69280264
>Uncuck yourself
Someone hasn't read his Spinoza.
>>69280599
>>69279804
>I believe in debating and understanding other's point of view.
Then you should outline some of your points of view because leftia is a pretty broad term, don't you think?
>>69280629
>>69280676
>>69280723
>>69280601
No, the left in america and europe insists on bringing millions of penniless mestizo peasants who vote for policies that loot me and people like me.
>>69280767
>>69280774
Leftists are so retarded they are blind to the fact they are destroying Europe with retarded niggers.
>>69280601
>thinking there is no argument or logic behind memes
Gosh you really want your brother to have sex with North Africans
>>69280863
>>69280896
>>69280924
>>69280947
>>69280601
you want real debate?
how about you giove something to debate on then?
you just asked a meme question that's bound to get aswered by memes. Americans don't hate italians, many of them are of italian descent and italy is often seen as a cool place, but ofc on /pol/ you get the
>not white
meme
choose a serious topic and stick to it if you want a debate
>>69280661
You're right. I believe in the fundamental worth of a human being as a creator of meaning (much like Leibniz and Spinoza did); I think we're subject to a constant dictatorship of the image/thought, down to the "molecular level", especially when it comes to the moving image; I believe in no government, for small scale organization is always better; I believe in preserving Western culture, and that this action must be performed on an individual level (much like faith). There, a few points.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bcc6dchzJJ0
>>69280863
Exactly. Why they think they can have a welfare state and bring in low-income workers is beyond me. Maybe they're such cucks they need another group to go and fight the right for them.
How do you feel about corporatism?
>>69278986
Because leftism is a mental disorder, a dysfunctional feedback loop elevating logic above data, with guaranteed disastrous results.
>>69278986
What kind of leftist?
Moderate? Radical? Who did you vote last time and who would you vote next?
>>69281051
>>69281045
>I believe in preserving Western culture
Then why do you want men of North African descent to fuck your little brother?
>>69280601
> spinoza
Spinoza's ancestors were of Sephardic Jewish descent and were a part of the community of Portuguese Jews that had settled in the city of Amsterdam in the wake of the Alhambra Decree in Spain
God damn right I haven't read it. Your problem is becoming even more clear.
>>69280601
>No arguments
No shit, you haven't given your views on a topic. If you want us to create and kill straw men start a ms paint meme thread.
>>69281264
>>69281400
>>69278986
You are the niggers of Europe.
You will soon be swallowed whole by the Monsters that you welcomed to Dinner.
>>69281417
>>69281525
>>69281160
Haven't voted. I work with other people in a "commune" to act on my city's issues on a local level, like organizing meeting places for the youth, homegrown vegetable markets, cultural events. Guess extraparlamentary radical?
>>69281266
Apart from the Jew meme, the Jewish comunity he lived him threw him out. So there's that. Also, he's more Christian than almost every Christian author you'll ever read, except maybe Saint Anselm and Kierkegaard.
>>69281553
How does this guy make you feel op?
>>69279127
>>69281313
>>69281400
>>69281417
Tfw Italy had an immigrant nigger for minister of integration and when she went full american sjw on us we called her a nigger and made baboon sound at her.
>>69281589
>>69281621
I remember
based Italy
>>69281417
I love the facial expressions.
Niggy McRapestyle: I Won The Lottery!
Jason Sudeikis: Soon.
>>69281567
i still don't see the point your trying to debate
what region btw?
>>69281707
>>69281235
what is with you and little brothers getting fucked? Dude just stop posting, head to pornhub and jerk off so you can stop being so fucking retarded.
>>69281795
>>69281045
From that you sound like libertarian and that's a stance that a lof people conisders to be right-wing. Give us something explicitly left-wing.
>>69278986
>I'm an Italian leftie
>but I'd like to discuss with you all why you hate "us" so much.
Because if you're an Italian you're already an Arab rape baby
Being a leftist just makes us hate you more
>>69281780
He's just an attention faggot
I can't believe you couldn't tell that from the very beginning of the thread
It's literally "I'm a leftist fite me /pol/"
>>69281828
Oh I'm sorry Chang
I'll make sure not to talk about his brother getting his boyhole stuffed by a big Muslim man
Hey op do you have a sister?
>>69282040
>>69281567
Well, if you're not going to explain your xenophilia, are you a humanist?
>>69281780
>*you're
it's goddamn 2am over here
taking the bait. Note: I will only post about 3 posts.
>>69281045
>I think we're subject to a constant dictatorship of the image/thought, down to the "molecular level", especially when it comes to the moving image;
elaborate on that. So far, this seems to be, just nonsensical nonsense.
> I believe in no government, for small scale organization is always better;
agree. So you are against EU? or more like anarchy kinda way? How far is there a need to control the market, so it can sustain itself?
>>69282266
>>69282359
>>69281780
No precise point. Thought it'd be interesting to start a conversation just by stating "who I am".
>>69281045
Here are a few points, if you feel like commenting them.Veneto, btw.
>>69281882
But, and that's the kicker, me and the people I talk with (all of them left wing) consider them to be fundamentally revolutionary positions. With this thread, I kind of wanted to show how there's not that much of a difference between what we believe in.
>>69282101
Except I've been responding without attacking anyone, apart the rape your brother guy.
>>69282179
Well yes, you may call me that. I don't really care about ethnicity as such, I just kind of want to reach gnosis by the communal cultural effort of humanity.
Are you part of the mafia?
Do you like spaghetti?
>>69282462
>gnosis
Your understanding of gnosis, Gnosticism and language in general is not up to par by evidence of your usage of the term gnosis.
pls stop exporting your calabrian mafiosos over here
>>69282462
Do you believe 6 trillion died?
>>69282309
About the dictatorship: I think the way we as a society handle cultural expression (be it books, movies, music) is codified in such a way as to impede any kind of free thought, elaboration or further creation of meaning on the patt of the spectator. In the basest terms, we believe a film to be its story; I think that's limiting, as a movie should be, first and foremost, a springboard for personal elaboration. Likewise, Christianity as done in ecclesiastical places is merely superstition: true faith is a personal, elaborative endeavour.
And yes, I support anarchy as in, the creation of functional, problem solving workgroups from the population
>>69282462
>Well yes, you may call me that.
Do you believe that different people have different innate abilities? If someone suggested that different populations of humans have different innate abilities, would you consider that?
>>69282462
>except I've been responding without attacking anyone
Youre still attention fagging at the highest of levels
Tbh I couldn't give less of a shit about your opinions or views on politics
Why don't you just lurk more?
Oh and your sister wants to be bred by muslims (happy chang)
>>69278986
>I'm an Italian leftie,
so yer an Arab?
>>69282120
why does liveleak never have any real rape for me to fap to
>>69278986
How do you feel about the fact that your countrymen threw apples at the corpse of the founder of Fascism? I'm not a Fascist myself, but are you not ashamed? He cared deeply for the Italian people.
>>69282946
A movie will never be personal
It's a flawed medium from that perspective (like most)
Faith is also not a personal experience as almost all religion stems from a questioning of reality mixed with dogma and community
Also your sister is a Muslim cumdump and normies can't function under anarchy or small groups
>>69282621
Probably, I'm just know starting to get into this topic - I'd be grateful if you gave me any consuel on the matter, as to correct my errors.
>>69283013
I would respond by saying that I believe individuals are different, and each one displays a different point of view/way of experiencing (and producing) the meaning of the world. So yes, we have different innate abilities: to assert that they are population based is, in my opinikn, an underestimation of what it means to be human.
>>69283207
He cared, and drag us into shit. Regardless of what I think about him (good-ish reforms, unexcusable repression of free though and speech), that alone justifies his final treatment.
>>69278986
The question is why do you hate your country?
Do you think it's ok to promote and participate in globalist false altruism that does nothing to strengthen your community, when southern Italy is one of the most impoverished regions in Europe?
Unplug the bananas from your ears and help your family, community and country.
Cherish your heritage.
>>69282462
>I kind of wanted to show how there's not that much of a difference between what we believe in.
Sure, but the few points of disagreemnet usually tend to have a fundamentel importance for the people that stand behind them. And it can't even be framed as right-left struggle (vide infighting in the communist movement) it just looks to me like an evolutionary feature of a human nature
>>69283565
Kek so a complete rejection of science in favor of feel good individuality?
That's exactly what I would expect from a man who watches his sister used as a Muslim rag while masturbating
>>69283404
A movie CAN be personal - indeed, an excess of authorial intent is a risk of the medium. I suggest you watch "Cove" by Robert Todd and maybe Dog Star Man by Stan Brakhage, for examples of good, personal cinema.
On faith: be as it may that it stems from dogma (wouldn't include community, as it is, in a lot of cases, a secondary element), the Faithful cannot call himself such (in my opinion) unless he finds, reflecting on his own, his way and his relationship with said dogma and the world. Religion is based on the individual.
Also, you'd be surprised at how most people react when put in a position of equal power. Most genuinely try to be constructive, stepping aside whn it's not their area of expertise.
>>69283565
>I would respond by saying that I believe individuals are different, and each one displays a different point of view/way of experiencing (and producing) the meaning of the world. So yes, we have different innate abilities: to assert that they are population based is, in my opinikn, an underestimation of what it means to be human.
To put the question another way, I do not think most people would be einstein if they had the same life experiences he had. There seems to be a biological limitation to what people will do.
Would you be open to believing that behavioral differences between men and women have physiological origins?
>>69283565
The proper meaning of Gnosis is knowledge as gained through experience.
It is a cognate to the Hebrew word "da'ath" think of when the bible says "he knew her" or "he came to know her" when it means he had sex with her.
this is also the word used to mean knowledge as in the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, the implication being here that Adam and Evil were capable of evil in the theoretical form and good, but were not physically capable of experiencing overly decadent amounts of good and overly harsh amounts of suffering.
To experience gnosis is to experience first hand knowledge of something.
This is why gnosis is so important to the Gnostics, it is literally the knowledge and experience gained from interaction with the highest divinity.
(Note the majority of Gnostics actually worshipped the abrahamic God Jehovah, they simply believed Elohim was an imposter who falsely used the name of YHVH.)
>>69283928
I don't want it to be framed as such - thogh I'll admit my original post was inflammatory to try and start a discussion, I've been trying (I feel) to bring the discourse on a more personal level.
>>69283965
Seditious question: do you think yourself to be identical to your (ethnically homogenous) neighbour, just by an accident of birth?
>>69278986
How can we get you to kill yourself? Honest questions, if it works with you we might be able to get other leftists to do it also and solve this problem.
>>69284501
I was under the impression most Gnostics felt like there was some kind of final "completeness" of knowledge and experience to be reached by global effort? Thanks for your clarification.
>>69284470
Yes, I'd be open to believe that - insofar as it doesn't completely hide the effect of "nurture" on one's growth. To say that there is no physiological difference between individuals is feel good bullshit.
>>69284725
I have clinical anxiety. Should take care of itself in its time.
>>69284100
A movie CAN NOT be personal
By the very fact that their are multiple people making it
Stop trying to dress the theatre up as anything above a base art
>it's a secondary element
I strongly disagree
Maybe for the intellectual it's the secondary draw but for the average it's a community based thought in which they don't have to think as hard
When this is taken away they fall into a nihilistic worldview normally taken over by some form of ideology based group (sjwism for example)
Every religion is based on the group
I'll concede that the intellectual works solely for the individualistic aspects though
Maybe in little constructive pot groups where nothing is legitimately on the line a person will give up power and distribute it equally (having done my fair share of meaningless volunteer work I can tell you this is rarely the case)
You completely and utterly overestimate the average man
Funnily enough I find people with your world view to be some of the saddest sacks out there
>>69282946
Man you write not very easy. I don't get what you want to say, but I try to answer.
I guess your are talking about societies either passively or actively impeding the discussion of cultural expression. If so, I don't see why this should be the case. You are free to share everything and anything, but you still have to argument your viewpoints. Yes every society has different impediments, but this is not a problem here, I guess?
If you are complaining about the coding of ideas to a medium. You are kinda right. But this is a more philosophical standpoint. Yes, you would be filtering content to abbreviate it to a short expression aka Memes. This is not a bad thing, because this foreign thought would be taken again by another person, which can take his on spin on it. If this person would get your idea 100%, this spin would necessary be different and I think the variety would dwindle very fast, with every new discovery. Kinda like the good old "Gleichschaltung"
>true faith is a personal, elaborative endeavour.
yes, but mostly this is shared in community, to foster ideas for the well-being of the community. This in return strengthen the bond between the people and fights division, which in return is as necessity for a healthy democracy
>And yes, I support anarchy as in, the creation of functional, problem solving workgroups from the population
not your focus, but anyway: For this you need about everyone actively involved in such matters or else an elite will crystallize again.
>>69284517
No
I see him as the same as my other ethnically homogeneous neighbor though
Cuck :3
I'm moving to italy soon. I've always loved little italian boys. Now with the Muslims there in all now I can touch them and get away with it.
Ya OP why are u all loud and fucking annoying.
I can't stand any of you you're almost as bad as the blacks
>>69285024
There's a limit on nurture. A women can lift weights, but she will not become as strong as most men. Do you believe in evolution? If the human brain consumes 20% of the bodies calories, would natural selection act on the brain?
Switching pc.
>>69285434
About the coding of ideas in a medium: my main complaint is how what you can try to do will not be considered a part of the medium unless you follown a few (said and unsaid) guidelines; but that's secondary. The problem is that the way we create and experience cultural products is centered around a "meaning", a monolithical truth imposed by the author of the product in question. I believe we should create stuff for others to enjoy and think about, making them reflect and create their own meaning associated with our work; movies, books, etc. should be something that allows us to create something else, not a way to make "what we think is right" apparent and obvious and the only correct interpretation.
As for faith: as I said above yes, it originates in communities but ultimately it goes back to individual effort, to personal struggle and reflection.
And, as for anarchy: yes. You're right. You need everybody to be active for it to work - that's why you see radical lefties trying to push their agendas; they want you to be an active part of the political community - even as an opponent.
>>69285024
No the Gnostics actually believed in the exact opposite, saying the belief and experience was esoteric.
That is to say, only for those select few, those within the inner fold of the Mysteries.
What you are thinking of is far more similar to the beliefs of someone like "origen" who was a catholic mystical church father who is now deemed heretical. (Even though his teaching is the greatest inspiration for Augustine.)
Origen believed even satan would reconcile with God eventually.
>>69286015
I won't go into the debate on evolution, as I'm far too under read on it for my contributions to be meaningful. But yes, a woman won't be stronger than a man in most cases - point taken. I believe you're trying to get me to admit that brains evolve differently in different gene pools? I may be prone to admit that, too, but I'd like to see a few studies trying to correlate that to actual degrees of intellectual performance, if such a thing even exists. Not trying to be obtuse, understand me: but to concur on such a general principle is not the same as to say that all Africans are idiots. Sorry if I have misunderstood your point.
>>69286603
Ah, thanks. I will look into that - for the ongest time, it was sold to me as the Gnostic approach. Gotta get my reading going on the actual sources. Don't want to abuse of your time, but any advice? I was thinking about reading a few collections of Gnostic Gospels / Apocalypses.
>>69278986
Because leftists are fucking annoying shits who have no sense of self reflection.
I'm not even a right winger. I'm a moderate through and through, and yet nothing in this world pisses me off more than self righteous leftists. All leftist ideologues have ever been able to demonstrate to me is rampant hypocrisy, and an entire inability to argue their point from a factual basis.
>>69287103
It is understandable, the new agey approach is far more popular because it is universalist In character.
Honestly the best thing to do is just go at it reading everything you can then studying the streams of Gnosticism that catch the most interest.
http://gnosis.org/library.html
>>69286346
Anarchy isn't leftist
The trouble with your memeing here is that there is a very large of authoritarian right wing thought on this board along with right wing anarchist thought
You might get some sympathy and "hey I agree with that" from the anarchist pseudo/near libertarian side but you won't get a lick of that from the side that almost wants a return to monarchies
Personally I agree with you on some level
I came to this board as someone who believed heavily in individuals and their rights
As I've been tainted and perversed I've realized that was only an idealized world imagined in my head
The West is on a dangerous path
Near anarchy isn't what the solution is and it's definitely not the future
>>69285282
Well I'm not exactly sad, the contrary in fact. I'm fairly happy all the time.
As I said before, look into those movies I mentioned (and the whole New American Cinema movement, for what it's worth). Maybe my conception of movie is warped by the foremost importance I assign to the director, though.
As I said here >>69286346 i think Faith, rooted as it may be in the communal, always ends up being an individual effort, even for the average man - but I'll concede his effort may just be to conform to societal rule, at which point I'd argue he's not Faithful anymore.
>>69287344
Thanks for the link, much appreciated. I'll take a look as soon as I can get some sleep.
>>69287577
Well I'm not exactly memeing - I come on this board very rarely in fact, so I know whit all about the milieu I'm trying to talk with. Care to explain? Genuinely interested.
As far as I can talk about my personal experience, in Italy there ends up being not much of a difference between anarchism and radical leftism, at least, not where I live; most of the people sharing my ideals were brought up in almost-autarchic townlets and then grew into extraparlamentary circles, all about action. I think it may explain their outlook?
What's your suggested solution, though, now that you've lost hope on near anarchy / individualism?
>>69287103
>Not trying to be obtuse, understand me: but to concur on such a general principle is not the same as to say that all Africans are idiots. Sorry if I have misunderstood your point.
No, it's not about each individual, it's about the average. The average female height is below the average of men, but some women are 182 cm. Not every african will be stupid, but a greater amount of them compared to whites would be. I assume that you're not a scientist, if you're interested in more the link below is a good start. Particularly the pdf for the 10,000 year explosion.
http://www.humanbiologicaldiversity.com/
>>69287741
Youre telling me a person with clinical anxiety is "fairly happy all the time"?
I've seen good movies
They aren't individual or personal
Visually they are impressive and can invoke feelings yes but personal they are not
Of course you put too much on the director
Everyone does
Never forget the fact that directors rarely write the movies, that they only guide the filming, that they don't make the sets or scenery, they don't design, they are just the dictators of the film
>>69286346
>The problem is that the way we create and experience cultural products is centered around a "meaning", a monolithical truth imposed by the author of the product in question.
What is/are these "monolithical truth"?
> I believe we should create stuff for others to enjoy and think about, making them reflect and create their own meaning associated with our work;
and this is what is already happening. But you can do this only when you are young.[students <30]. When you are starting to settle down, this will change and you don't want to challenge your viewpoint any more. Not because you think you are right, but because changing it, could have severe consequences for your and the well-being of your family. In the end, the only thing, I've seen bringing true happiness to people, is a circle of a good community and a family.
>not a way to make "what we think is right" apparent and obvious and the only correct interpretation.
Well, generally it is not bad. But if you try to pinpoint your populace to do a certain thing you will need guidelines.
Example: Your population is going back, You know in about 30years you can't uphold you securities for your elders. So you either try to pedal back on the security thing, or you promote a "truth", which encourages more families to have children. Here the individual part is replaced by the need for the whole community. aka propaganda
This is currently in use by every government.
>that's why you see radical lefties trying to push their agendas; they want you to be an active part of the political community - even as an opponent.
Which in turn would take away the freedom not too. Also this is on the assumption everybody can and wants to contribute, which is not necessarily the case. You see, power is corrupting everybody. With or without you realizing. Even the assumption: This is "good". Will generate division, which in turn can be used against the community by either foreign or domestic forces.
>>69288191
As I've said, I'm studying Philosophy; thanks for the link, I'll make sure to check it out - from a cursory look, it seems like something I can appreciate. It'd be interesting to see what conclusions (or directives for action) I'll draw from my reading of it.
>>69288467
Eh, yeah. Kind of. There's always a sense of dread and fighting my own thoughts, by I've learned to basically just ignore the part of my mind that's trying to shove me into a recursive spiral of "negative thought".
>they are just the dictators of the film
Well, yeah, that's the reason I'm advocating for those movies that were made solely by their directors - a dictatorship of one.
>>69288169
Spend time with an American militia and you'll know right wing anarchists
>care to explain?
What exactly?
>what's your suggested solution
In my idealized world a benevolent dictator takes control of the West
Sets it on the right path
Then relinquishes control
That would never happen but the period under him would be one of social and economic peace much like the rule of Augustus if we're going that route
>>69289081
There are no such movies (that are good)
The only way for it to be a completely individualized movie is if it was
A one man show, no one behind the camera, and all parts of design under the control of the one person acting
I've never seen that pulled off
Even the theatre can't pull it off since there will always be the audience
Just accept that these are failed mediums at their core
You'll respect them much more
>>69289081
Also
>ignore that part of my mind
Weak
>>69289081
How do you reconcile the empirical reality of the meaninglessness of existence?
>>69288775
>>69289239
>>69289572
Shit guys, I'd like to write some kind of macro answer to you all and continue the conversation for a few more hours but it's like three am here and I've been drinking for the last six hours and I'm about to collapse.
For what's worth, I'd like to thank you for taking the time to talk with me. I've genuinely learned some interesting stuff from these conversations, plus all the things I may have not strictly have learned but I'm going to think about nonetheless.
Feel free to shit on me for chickening out of this thread, but I'm done for the night. Fuck.
But here you go, a parting gift, a nice one-man movie:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tpF5RJgaHwA
>>69290442
That was shit
I assume he made the music as well?
It's literally on par with the wierd visual PoMo bullshit you'll see sometimes on YouTube
/x/ are the only people who would like it but they would equate it to some paranormal bullshit
>>69290442
Why'd you even start this thread?
I'm glad you've at least gotten something out of it but this has been wholly useless
We didn't even get into how you were brainwashed into the left damnit
>>69290442
np, wanted to go to bed anyway. But next time plan a few hours more or anons will shit on similar threads, like brotherfucking guy on tops did.
>>69281589
fuck political correctness, that chinese man just tells the truth but in first world country wouldn't be allowed to speak like this
>>69291798
I responded to the very end faggot
You just don't know a good non shit non attention poster when you see one
Fucking trash
>>69278986
Hi Italian leftie. I hate leftists because most of them have no interest in cultural and ethnic preservation. They do not see the value in these things and actively seek to destroy them. They want to unite the world through what is called "The long march through the institutions". Or more formally, Critical Theory. Which involves a heavy amount of subversion and propaganda to trick people into their ideology. Casting the majority (Europeans, cis gendered, males) as oppressors, and the minority as the oppressed (Ethnic minorities, LGBTQ, women). The solutions to majority europeans? DIVERSITY. The solution to cis people? PAN SEXUALISM. The solution to men in power? affirmative action. ALL of this will lead to the marginalization of European civilization and ultimately, complete breakdown of our civilization.
