Richard Dawkins, leader of the atheism movement, thinks that every sick child should be executed.
Source: https://www.theguardian.com/science/2014/aug/21/richard-dawkins-immoral-not-to-abort-a-downs-syndrome-foetus
Why are atheists so cold and heartless people?
>>67863957
they should you dumbass, its an act of kindness to end its suffering before it even begins
>>67864093
I wouldn't even call it an end to the suffering. You're just preventing it from happening.
Its just a preventative measure to ensure individuals don't have to live their live out handicapped, and families don't need to deal with the burden of a child who is handicapped severely.
If someone has obvious deformities and they're detectable prior to birth, I personally think its immoral not to abort. By obvious deformities I mean thinks like zika virus, downies, etc.
>>67863957
>Richard Dawkins, leader of the atheism movement, thinks that every sick child should be executed.
I agree. Hell, I'd even do it myself, personally. For money.
>>67863957
>>67863957
>August 21, 2014
Please use more recent material.
>>67863957
But liberal logic dictates they're not Real People.
:^)
>>67864296
Don't forget long crooked noses. Those should be aborted too
>>67863957
>Eugenics is bad
Christcucks are cancer
I think they should be aborted as well. It's not about the kid's suffering, we just shouldn't fill the world with retards if it's easily avoidable. I mean honestly, who would prefer a downie baby over a regular one? Nobody.
>>67863957
/pol/ develops emotions at the most convenient times
Atheists don't have a "leader" and who wouldn't abort a mentally defective child?
Fuck that shit is a burden, then you gotta worry about the ethics of him getting some other downie preggers and so on...
Fuck that. Also am down for grey hair euthanasia.
>>67863957
Yeah, it's pretty brilliant. My wife and I have decided to get rid of any kids that are going to be super fucked up. We're not throwing our lives away for some retard that suffers every waking second.
>>67865707
This
>>67863957
>Richard Dawkins, leader of the atheism movement,
It is immoral to let someone disabled to the point of not being able to function as a human being be born.
>>67865844
You mean abort them? Yeah good decision, if you catch Down's or other really shitty diseases early best to abort.
>>67865707
>Le spergman
CALL MY NAME!
>>67865807
>who would prefer a downie baby over a regular one? Nobody.
>>67863957
A parent's job is to educate their child about the world and make sure they have e a bright future.
A literal retard cannot be educated about the world or have a bright future. What kind of a life is that, to exist in a world you cannot understand where you need a handler and people laugh and revile you both openly and behind closed doors?
It wouldn't even be ethical for it to reproduce, the primary objective of a living organism. What kind of a life is this to condemn a human being to?
I have autism and I wish my mom had aborted me.
>>67863957
>all sick children are autistic
Well it will be tough for a few generations...but for humanity as a whole he is probably right...overpopulation and all...
explain why hes wrong without using the bible
We have enough retards in this world as it is, we don't need more while losing potentially productive citizens, the parents, to taking care of a retarded kid tbqh
>>67867454
He's not wrong and he's not right.
It's all about morality and opinions. There is also no such thing as objective morality.
But for some reason, society dictates what laws are created and enforced.
Aborting downies and other types of retards should be mandatory
>>67863957
>atheist
>using the term immoral
The problem with people like Dawkin's is their priority. When your country is actively destabilizing nations like Syria (after ruining Libya, no less) and creating needless migrant issues, you'd think the term 'immoral' would be used for something more relevant than 'fetuses with genetic problems should be aborted'. Why the fuck is he focusing on aborting downies instead of some else?
>>67868801
Dawkins just doesn't love sandniggers as much as you reddit-browsing snowflakes. He thinks about internal conflicts, not external ones that are utterly irrelevant.
>>67868801
The subject is downies you dumb illiterate nigger.
They aren't talking about children with microcephaly or children with the Zika virus.
>>67863957
I am not an atheist but I do kind of agree, that said it should be a decision up to the parents. Why would any sane person want their child to suffer through having no productive life. Heck in olden times they were left out to be taken by exposure to the elements now it can be done much more humanely.
EBERY LIFE IS PWECIOUS
JESUS LOVES MY BABY BORN WITH NO SKIN
>>67869023
>aborting downies
>internal conflict
>>67869068
>aborting downies is some how more relevant than current geopolitical actions shaping the world
???
>>67863957
Typical STEMcuck, nothing to see here
>>67863957
>sick child
there it is again. I was called this a lot as a kid, forced to go through all means and manners of tests, all sorts of nu age hipster "treatments" including stuff like ritalin and tranquilizers. That's right. Both at once.
The vegan diet I was forced on through puberty as a method to "calm me down" because of a spectacularly shitty single mother who in all intents and purposes should not have had custody. The facts were there social services just did not want to admit it. They saw them but they don't go back on their decisions over mistakes because they don't make mistakes. My vision went to shit and I developed crohns and became chronically anemic at the hands of this bitch, ever mind the fun those pharmaceuticals put my heart through.
These people have a very wide and immoral application of the word "Sick". They use it to label something that's a problem to them so they can justify torturing it, and they use it as an excuse to protect their interests.
you evil cuck, Why is it you can justify keeping people with downs alive because they are "sick"? They're never getting better, there are no treatments, there is no cure, they are permanently fucked their entire life, and you're advocating allowing them to live and suffer their entire life. Why? So you can feel better about yourself? So you can put this child on a poster about beating the odds and fighting diversity so all your other chuckle fuck friends can get warm feelings about their faux struggles in the line at starbucks and in the cuckshed? I would not want to live with downs, nobody should have to live with downs, and if we can detect it when they're a fetus their parents should get to have the choice whether they want to be a vegetable gardener or if they want to bin it and try again. Even better, When are we going to allow genetic engineering research in this area so we can fix it before it even happens.
>>67865923
He is. Atheists fucking worship Richard Dawkins as if he's Christ himself. They also unironically worship his book.
The parallels are undeniably hilarious.
>>67869528
They look pretty happy to me
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QHwsOPasF0s
>>67863957
>not supporting eugenics
fuck you fag you are everything wrong with this world.
>>67863957
What? I thought this is something most of /pol/ agrees with? I do atleast. Dont bring retards into the world knowingly.
>>67863957
problem with people sometimes is, they mistake taking care of an autist/downie for being kind and compassionate.
little do they know, they just want to have an experiment. try and see if having a downie child is something they can handle.
after some years they realize they dont want a downie and its too much to handle.
then they resent the downie for being born.
now, if people were more "practical"
they would just "abort and try again".
but as we know, we are not generally practical.
also, how are we to know if there is any cure for downies if we never let anyone live?
as mengele as that may sound, downies can be used for research. not as guinea pigs you give diseases to, but see human development and whether the case can be reversed.
that being said, i leave the choice to abort the downie to its parents. there are some who enjoy being martyrs and you have to give them that. maybe the downie is having the time of his/her life with them too.
>>67870074
how do you reverse a difference in chromosomes?
My brother has Down syndrome and I would abort a DS foetus of mine
>>67870187
i dont know.
did i say
>t. doctor/scientist ?
i didn't.
who's to say it is not possible in the future?
>>67869710
>supporting eugenics
>letting the government decide who can breed
Fuck outta here
>>67870314
Get the fuck out asap before you get stuck with him.
>>67870314
is that allowed there?
its allowed in belgium and netherlands, i think?
>>67869710
>supporting eugenics
fuck you fag you are everything wrong with this world.
He's a freemasonic scum
>>67870612
There is literally nothing wrong with being a freemason
>>67870478
Why are eugenics bad?
>>67870747
Because a person like him wouldn't exist if society practices eugenics.
>>67870747
it makes people feel too powerful so they get scared
>>67870396
you would just be making a different person in that case though
>>67863957
He's right. Why would you willingly bring a downs kid into the world? Cruel.
>>67870429
This dude unfortunately, If your parents go/split/whatever or die he may be forced on you when the state is perfectly capable of taking care of him
Agree with him 100%
>>67863957
theres really no point in keeping a vegetable alive
its extremely unhealthy emotionally for the family
they cannot move on with the stages of grief, and it'll just become a burden, draining their energy and resources....all because of feelings.
>>67871287
eh, didnt read the downs. But its roughly the same thing.
>Christians would let people suffer for their entire lives because killing them would be "inmoral".
>>67871211
This thread is about stealthy murder plans now.
How do you create an accident /pol/?
>>67870842
>>67870747
Because it would be a chain reaction and eventually evolve to Hitler type eugenics where only perfect humans should be aloud to reproduce or even live and everyone else is an ape, history has shown why its wrong and where that thinking leads.
Too bad you don't believe in a free society where everyone has a fair chance to live their life and make the best of it. You are less than human if you think that you should deny someone the chance to live and that someone other than yourself should be the deciding factor of your own destiny.
But no we can't have equal value to human life that's absurd
>>67871437
Let's say you wanted a baked potato but your eyesight is bad.
You go to court and plead guilty to manslaughter.
>>67863957
>every sick child should be executed
>abort a child that's going to be a retarded potato with no value to society and get a new one
Pick one, Hans.
>>67866927
And therefore it would be ethical to kill them?
>>67871394
>I have the right to decide whose life is worth living and whose is not
I'm not even Christian, but you're a fucking retard.
>>67863957
That is so fucking stupid. They make excellent employees. Better than non-retarded employees in 99% of all minimum wage jobs.
We're not all good at the same things, we're not SUPPOSED to be. We're humans, not machines. We're not all supposed to run the same program.
>>67871500
China is going to do it anyway though. They are already studying the genetics of intelligence with this as a stated goal.
>>67870747
They aren't. It was practised heavily in the past in the US pre WW2, California esp. used to sterilize any negro they got their hands on (prison or institutionalized)
Eugenics is several things btw they don't all have to be implemented to have a eugenics program, they include:
1. Government/social matchmaking - pairing up best matches for the best children.
This can be overt, as in forced, or covert as in the not forced, the government just hosts some dating websites and offers incentives to hook up with your matches.
2. Sterilizing undesirables - California did this to Felons and retards pre ww2, we should be doing this right now. Next time Takiniasha gets an abortion just go all the fucking way.
Every repeat violent felon should be sterilized.
3. Genetic Engineering
4. Targeted sterilization or weakening of the gametes of entire populations, or targeted spread of an STD. Don't want jews to reproduce? Start putting shit in their food that makes them shoot blanks, or spread syphillis amongst their populations
>>67863957
>downs syndrome
>""""""""""sick""""""""""
>>67863957
I dislike abortion. I hate the fact that a life is cheapened so much. I would not want to ban it though, because it has its uses. I do however wish there was a MUCH bigger emphasis placed on safe sex, as well as the physical/mental trauma that can be caused to a women by having an abortion.
Rape victims and births that would involve complications affecting the woman's health are more than valid reasons to abort a child in my opinion. Others will disagree.
It's a bit morally murky , but I also in principal support abortion of children with Down Syndrome and other such mental or physical defects that are that serious.
>>67871971
So why do you think a downie kid doesn't have a right to live?
>>67871500
Hitler type eugenics are literally the least thing you have to worry about when it comes to reproductive rights. The state could come along someday and institute a one child policy, you may have to literally wait 1-5 years to be approved to have a child and eugenics certainly play a part in that Chinese tyranny
>>67872068
It is likely not a very fulfilling life. & places a lot of burden on parents.
>>67871500
you dont have to limit who can breed, you just need to be able to select and tweak the baby's characteristics
birth selection in the womb eventually lead to that. who wouldnt want healthy, cancer free, deformity free babies with 20/20 eyesight and 100 year old lifespans?
do you want your child to be like this? I wouldn't
www.youtube.com/watch?v=kFV5tjo80QQ
>>67863957
sick and defective aren't the same thing
>>67870074
Every person I've ever met with a Downie kid has been a burnt out shell of the person they once were. You can see it in their constantly exhausted eyes.
>>67863957
I agree, just abort the downies.
>>67872159
I don't think their lives are so unfulfilling. They are capable of all the same emotional highs (and lows) as people with able minds. I don't know if you ever met a downie, but they actually tend to be really positive people.
The 'burden' on the parents of caring for their own child is just not even relevant. We're talking about a child's life, they can suck it up.
>>67863957
He is going all out.
>>67863957
>leader of the atheism movement
Stop being retarded. Or would you buy that I'm king of the universe?
>>67865680
Faulty Comparison is your logical fallacy
>aborting deformed fetuses
>bad
>>67872068
>So why do you think a downie kid doesn't have a right to live?
They do.
Unfortunately though the truth of the matter is that there is very little chance of them having a happy or meaningful life, and they are an evolutionary and reproductive dead end.
The parents also have to enter the conversation. A child like that would be an incredible burden on them. Physically, emotionally, financially.
Adoption really isn't an avenue either. There are too many fully healthy and developmentally unchallenged children without families already. The reality is that there are not very many people who would have even the hint of an urge to adopt a developmentally challenged child like that.
And to clarify, I am not saying 'Abort all Downies!'
If the parents are aware of it, and knowing what both they and the child would go through for the rest of their lives... as sad as it is, I support their choice.
>>67872068
>>67872298
if given a choice between a downie kid and a normal kid which would you rather have? one is objectively waaaaaay better and will be more productive to this world. There are no feelings difference between the 2 choices because both are your offspring.
>but they actually tend to be really positive people.
because their understanding of this world is limited. A pet dog is really positive too.
>>67863957
>A child with the downs is merely sick
>>67866511
Fake
>>67863957
>implying we should waste resources on fucking vegetables and retards
>>67872436
I don't know why you're so convinced that downies can't live happy and meaningful lives. They do have friends and family, they work (if they're functioning enough). Some pay taxes.
As for the parents,
>The 'burden' on the parents of caring for their own child is just not even relevant. We're talking about a child's life, they can suck it up.
Simple as that. Honestly what is more important?
I'm at least glad you wouldn't try to force people to kill their own children over a defect.
>>67872439
Yeah obviously a healthy child is more desirable, more productive, and so on. That doesn't mean downies don't play a part in our society or that their lives are not worth living. And all of us have a very limited understanding of this world, downies just moreso than others.
>>67872416
that's the kind of shit culture that developed on /pol/ where anything even remotely progressive that challenges status quo is considered bad because muh liberal boogeyman
>>67863957
I think autistic people need to be either put down or sterilized.
And I'm pagan, I worship many gods.
Your argument is invalid. (that's IN-VAH-LID, like autistic. invalid1
ˈJnvəlJd/
noun
1.
a person made weak or disabled by illness or injury.
"she spent the rest of her life as an invalid")
>the "right" to live
Honestly the human rights meme has come far enough. Funnily a lot of people actually believe that they're tangible and really exist and are not just mere words on paper. I mean the right is only as good as your ability to protect it
>>67872837
Yes, you're absolutely 100% right Lithuania, kids can't protect themselves so it should be fine to kill them they clearly have no actual real human rights. Silly memes trying to keep us from butchering our own young.
>>67863957
>tell /pol/ about a man, a man who's making a good point
>include that he's atheist
>watch /pol/ explode and disagree with the man
You guys are fucking cucks.
The mere subject has nothing to do with any religion, only with common sense. Why would you let a kid live if he's barely aware of himself, drools all over the place and still needs a babysitter at the age of 22 and onward.
If they can't contribute to the society in any way, they need to be eliminated.
"MUH RIGHT HE LIVES HUMAN RIGHTS"
Here's another rule: The rule of nature.
>>67863957
>thinks that every sick child should be executed.
>link clearly reads not immoral to abort child with one particular sickness
>bait.
>>67872916
By that logic we would kill off our own parents once they were too old to work.
>>67872916
AND THEY RUN WHEN THE SUN COMES UP
WITH THEIR LIVES ON THE LINE
>>67873177
but our parents have contributed to society and earned their right to a retirement
how is that the same logic
Nah I'm with him on this one.
I don't really like people aborting babies, but if it is going to have downs syndrome, it's better to just kill it and move on.
Potatoes do nothing for society and just bring pain and misery onto their family.
>>67863957
>sick child
>down syndrome
Bruh downs ≠ sickness
Kill yourself
>>67863957
>guardian
top kek the cuck are just trying to smear him because he doesn't like feminism
>>67873315
he said,
>"If they can't contribute to the society in any way, they need to be eliminated."
He didn't say anything about having contributed in the past.
Regardless, you simply have no right to judge which lives are worth living and which are not.
>>67873434
>Regardless, you simply have no right to judge which lives are worth living and which are not.
and you do?
>>67873177
>>67872910
>>67872743
>>67872298
>>67872068
>>67871646
sorry about your down-syndrome kiddo
but morality isn't an intrinsic value
>>67872743
Problem is you can only determine if they have downs or not, not the degree of developmental problems. 20% can be a happy downie, somewhat function, 20% won't ever be able to even communicate properly with other humans, and have severe physical issues, with the rest somewhere in between.
>>67873434
>you simply have no right to judge which lives are worth living and which are not
you do know this is /pol/ rite familia
>>67866511
Have the non edited version instead. Much better.
>>67873511
No, of course not. I'm not the one proposing to be the arbiter of human existence.
>>67873526
Whoa, good one! Any more zingers like that up your sleeve?
>>67873553
It really doesn't matter how severe the defect is. The kid has a shot at life, it's not your place to take it away from him just because he got the short straw.
>>67869553
lol, he also preaches like a prophetic fuckin priest
this is 10^24 keks
>>67863957
>>67863957
Well thats how /pol/ thinks.
>>67873575
Can't we have a serious discussion sometimes? Does it have to be dank memes and racial slurs all day, every day?
>>67872743
>I don't know why you're so convinced that downies can't live happy and meaningful lives. They do have friends and family, they work (if they're functioning enough). Some pay taxes.
One of my friends in highschool had a down syndrome brother. As with any kid/teen there were good times and bad times. There were a lot of bad times, and from what I saw/heard this bad times were a lot worse than others.
I know that's just one anecdote, but I just wanted to counterpoint your optimism. I think the likelyhood of a happy and meaningful life is diminished greatly. I also know that approving of abortion based on part because of 'likelyhood' is not such a great thing.
>The 'burden' on the parents of caring for their own child is just not even relevant. We're talking about a child's life, they can suck it up.
Unfortunately I don't think it's that simple, and can't agree with your opinion. No parent's plans for or are prepared for a child like that. It's even harder on couples who weren't planning on any child at all. Some are willing to do the hard yards, to put in all the time, effort, and money required. They are good people. Other's aren't, or they might think they are but then crack after a certain amount of time and heartbreak (just with raising any child). I wouldn't think less of them for aborting a child if they knew it had Down Syndrome, though I would feel bad/sad about the whole situation.
I wish life was so simple and straightforward that there weren't these types of ethical dilemmas, and were less situations about such simple things that vary so greatly in so many different nuanced ways. It's an imperfect world with imperfect people. Not all parents are capable of being a parent to such a child. And there are almost no people who want to adopt them. it's sad. But I think this should be an option on the table, for those that can't (or who refuse to) deal with such an issue, for their benefit and more than likely the sparing of a child's suffering.
>>67864628
that is the cutest picture of hitler i ever did see
>>67873663
>No, of course not. I'm not the one proposing to be the arbiter of human existence.
yeah you're proposing to be the defender of everybody who would be better off not being alive in the first place
>>67863957
BASED
A
S
E
D
>>67873553
Well, you'd tell your boy not to jaywalk if there was a 20% chance of a female driver stopping and sucking their cock, and a 20% chance to get run over, with the rest being somewhere in between.
>abortion is murder
Stormfags will defend this.
Also most aborted in united states are africans who actually don't vote republican, why american right is so against abortion?
>>67865707
correct
>>67872743
pray tell me what productive part do downies play in society.
physical disability is nothing (look at stephen hawking) but mental disability is just a black hole of pity and wasted emotions.
you argue the kid has a shot in life. That shot has a extremely low ceiling which he cannot surpass. Whats he going to accomplish?
>>67863957
>sick child
Defective. If it ever came up I'd abort in a second. And I'm against abortion personally.
>>67873177
>implying that extremely retarded people ever will be able to work
Old people did their time. They were useful.
>>67873434
And we're talking about very young people you dumb fuck, not 80yo people. How are you even expecting a 2 year old to contribute to the society?
It just sounds like you're trying to protect your worthless argument because you misunderstood what I said.
>>67873663
If the parent's still want a child and get pregnant again, then what's to say that not aborting takes this second child's chance away?
Why is the potential of life so important (if you don't believe the soul exists and enters the body at conception) ? Every time a woman ovulates without getting pregnant a potential person doesn't get a chance.
>>67873833
Weird analogy but yes I'm advocating FOR aborting downies.
>>67865707
>Christcucks think eugenics are bad while enjoying their inbred animals who have severe painful existances because of shitty eugenics
its ok because god gave animals to us to treat them like total garbage right hehe
clearly a retard who will never understand the concept of religion, sin, and faith is worth preserving because hes gods creation
>>67873852
He is right that some of them are capable of leading a close to normal life including finding love and gainful employment. Though I think the odds are drastically lower than for a healthy child although as technology has improved and societal viewpoints changed, it has become more than marginally easier for them to attain these things.
Opportunity Village is one such organisation that helps to find employment for people with disabilities. Some of them are actually pretty cool to be honest. I know that they have a fair few with mental handicaps employed to destroy/shred sensitive documents. They lack the mental acumen to be able to understand the documents, and the task itself is a very straightforward one that is hard to do wrong. It's a nice little niche they have found for them.
>>67873993
That's not a bad argument , old people on state pension already did their contribution to society thus they deserve their retirement , most retarded people don't help society at all , they only leech on it.
>>67863957
>atheist movement
what the fuck are you on
have a cousin with downsyndrome, once my aunt got into a fight with me and I said that she ruined her other son's life because he's going to take care of the downie when they pass
>>67865967
It is, and while my heart goes out to people who have had to raise one, or, in more recent years, have chosen to, they shouldn't shame other people who chose not to go through the suffering of trying to raise someone who will never be able to take care of themselves.
The only thing is, that worries me, is this issue opening a whole bag of worms of aborting kids for progressively less-severe issues, to the point that people demand perfection from their wombs, or else.
>>67874183
By the gods, that's what I'm saying.
You worked/working/able to work-> you live
None of the above->not live, what's so hard to understand?
>>67873751
Yes you're right. It is diminished greatly. It's a serious defect. This doesn't give us the right to just give up on a child's life.
>Not all parents are capable of being a parent to such a child.
Well, they must. They have to care for their child. I think this is a pretty basic value for human beings. Denying an unborn child its whole life ahead of it, even a life with a mental defect, sounds to me like smashing the problem to bits in order to fix it.
>>67873781
>better off not being alive
It doesn't matter if you think so, it's just not your life and so it's not your decision.
What if someone looked at you in the womb, saw from your genes that you were going to turn into the massive faggot that you are, and decided to save you and your parents from the pain of your existence?
>>67873852
You have no idea what he migt accomplish, he has to live first.
this really belongs on /b/,hope the mods crack down on this shit soon.
>>67874008
>potential of life
The human fetus is alive, and obviously, it is human. It is not the 'potential of life' and it is not a 'potential human'. It is a living human, in the earliest stage. Souls are irrelevent.
>christcucks actually arguing against this
Man I thought /pol/ was rational but I guess christcucks gonna christcuck, kinda like how jews gonna jew.
I support that actually all babys with any defect should be killed and ppl with defects should not be alowed to reproduce.
>>67874335
>It doesn't matter if you think so, it's just not your life and so it's not your decision.
great idea, let's let the unborn baby decide it's own fate!
you really are a downie though aren't you
>>67874402
Ok a fetus, which is not self-aware, not intelligent, hasn't bonded emotionally with anything in this world. Why should we care? Why should we care more than for instance fully developed pigs or cows, who are much closer to us in respect to meaningful characteristics.
HOW MUCH DO LIBTARDS OVERESTIMATE THEIR ABILITY TO COPE WITH WHAT THEY SAY THEY ARE READY TO FACE?
>>67874246
>>67874335
>You have no idea what he migt accomplish, he has to live first.
recorded civilisation has been around for 8000 years. Find me a downie who changed history. It doesnt even have to be his own doing.
>>67874265
What's even worse is that they are allowed to reproduce , thus producing more leeches.The leftists won't ever accept this in the current conditions , this will be accepted maybe in a totalitarian regime or in a world-wide catastrophe were humanity's survival is at risk.
So, having common sense now brands you the leader of an "atheist movement"?
There is nothing immoral about aborting a DS fetus. If it is born, it will bring immeasurable suffering to the parents. Its own life will be worthless because it cannot think and cannot reproduce.
Actually going through with raising a DS child is genetic suicide.
>>67874335
How much of a fucking pussy libcuck are you, leafman?
>>67874467
I'm not Christian, I'm just a rational human being that does not condone killing the imperfect children.
>>67874508
>let the unborn baby decide it's own fate
...Obviously it doesn't decide shit, but it has been given a shot at life already just by being conceived. It's not your right to take it away.
>>67874514
>not self-aware, not intelligent, hasn't bonded emotionally
Still a human being, faggot. Pigs and cows are not closer, at all.
>>67874568
The worth of a human life and the value of human achievements is not measured in historical significance. How about downies that do simple jobs, laugh with their friends and love their families?
>>67874613
>Its own life will be worthless
Your opinion on the value of unborn children's lives just doesn't fucking matter m8.
>>67874335
>Well, they must. They have to care for their child. I think this is a pretty basic value for human beings. Denying an unborn child its whole life ahead of it, even a life with a mental defect, sounds to me like smashing the problem to bits in order to fix it.
Agree to disagree I think. I suspect neither of us would be able to sway the other's opinion, especially on a platform as superficial as this.
For what it's worth I genuinely don't like the situation. I would most likely have a different opinion if there were more people willing to adopt these children, willing to put in the effort that their parent's either can't or won't. Maybe one day there will be, when teens and adults realise that safe sex exists for a reason, and there are less unwanted and unloved children in the world. Until then though, while I don't like it, I can't condemn parents for choosing to abort in this situation, nor can I argue for a ban on abortion.
>>67874233
This is very much where I stand.
The slippery slope is real, even if it is often misappropriated and used as a fallacy.
I do however support eugenics in principle, which could serve as a way to avoid the aforementioned dilemma and continuing dysgenics. But ultimately it would have to 100% come down to the implementation.
>>67874744
>...Obviously it doesn't decide shit, but it has been given a shot at life already just by being conceived. It's not your right to take it away.
you do realise that your "morals" here consist of allowing people to be born retarded, right?
They are cold and heartless because they have no morality
Start aborting fetuses and there won't be a /pol/ack left to make trump pepes in 20 years time.
>>67874744
>parents will be miserable for life
>kid will be miserable for life (if it can even comprehend that it's a downy compared to everyone else)
>""""""rational"""""
No, you're thinking with your feefees and taking a stance based on your dislike of abortion.
Wow seeing the posts i'm surprised.
/pol/ actually is using logic for once. Nice.
Children with mental and physical disabilities should be aborted so that they do not have to live their life of suffering and hardships.
Also atheists do not have a leader, they are not Catholic, they don't have a comparable "pope".
>>67874744
>How about downies that do simple jobs, laugh with their friends and love their families?
nothing that a normal human cant do.
>>67874818
Agree to disagree then. I think killing your own young is inexcusable and eugenics is disgusting.
>>67874840
Yes, that's right. I don't believe that a birth defect is an excuse to butcher your own young. I know, it's crazy of me.
>>67874931
>miserable for life
>miserable for life
You obviously don't know shit about downs people or their families. You shouldn't talk about what you don't know about.
>>67875025
No fucking shit... it's a mental defect. do you have anything to say that actually matters?
>>67863957
> when men are pro abortion its bad and they are psychopaths
k
I dont approve killing fetuses but Im all for genetic engineering to fix health problems.
>>67873680
They only like him because he smiles like Emma Watson. I bet they'll become crhistians if the pope looked like Taylor Swift
>>67875088
so theres no reason to choose a subpar "product" over a wholesome one!
>here anon, buy this apple
>b-but its rotted on 1 side! and its not even ripe! I only have money for 1 apple
>its okay, you should treasure all apples
>>67874962
>Children with mental and physical disabilities should be aborted so that they do not have to live their life of suffering and hardships.
But that literally don't apply for people with downs syndrome. They are way more happy than people in general even when people are mean to them they might find a piece of cloth or something and have great fun with it.
So that can not be the reasoning that atheists have. They probably want to kill children for recreational purposes or because they enjoy killing people they consider "worthless"
>>67875041
> eugenics is disgusting.
FWIW I don't mean eugenics as in programming a 6ft 5 blonde haired blue eyed intellectual powerhouse. I mean utilising the techniques to reduce the risk of or eliminate the risk of dysgenic disorders such as Down Syndrome. Once again, the slippery slope aspect and general human shittiness is at play, hence my cynicism as to how it would be implemented.
Oh, and I respect your belief in the sanctity of life. I'd like to think I share it to a degree, even though while not approving of it I do think that abortion could and should be an option on the table under certain circumstances.
I've found the world, and the people in it, to be too shitty to enable me to hold onto my principals and ideals with an iron grip. Reality, or my perception of it, has made me compromise on a lot of issues such as this, because I think i think the world would be a worse place if people were forced by law to abide by those original principals and ideals.
Utopia is dead.
>>67872176
but look at how intelligent that kid is and what an insperation he is to others around him. why would you want to prevent that? life shouldnt be perfect. fuck that.
>>67875306
Seriously? You said basically the exact same thing just a few minutes ago. Here's the reply I gave you last time you fag.
>Yeah obviously a healthy child is more desirable, more productive, and so on. That doesn't mean downies don't play a part in our society or that their lives are not worth living. And all of us have a very limited understanding of this world, downies just moreso than others.
>abortion = murder
Kill yourself.
>>67875306
don't bother lad
it's the classic feelings over logic leftcuck argument
>>67872176
>not expected to live past 25
>still has to do homework
>leader of the atheism movement
k
>>67875347
>I mean utilising the techniques to reduce the risk of or eliminate the risk of dysgenic disorders such as Down Syndrome.
It's not something that can be transfered to other people. And there is nothing to do with genes in general, it's just a syndrome that happens once in a while no matter what genes involved.
You murder children for reasons that don't even help your so called cause.
>>67875456
>leftcuck
Um... you're the one on the left here.
Is this one of those famous Australian shitposts?
>>67875545
>a canadian calling anybody a leftcuck
>>67875404
and your point is shit. I asked you what extra special edge a downie has over a normal kid, and the answer is NOTHING, like duh. There is no reason to ever choose a downie except for your feelings, and feelings are nothing but illogical chemicals in your brain.
>>67863957
>cold and heartless
says the German
ohmyfuckingwhat,holyshit
Is it immoral not to have 1.8 million rapist, inbred niggers in your country this year?
>any name ending "in" (putin,stalin,lenin) are evil demon posessed people you should NEVER trust
>>67871569
Holy shit lol.
>>67875404
A quick copy paste.
>The most common form of Down syndrome is known as Trisomy 21, a condition where individuals have 47 chromosomes in each cell instead of 46. This is caused by an error in cell division called nondisjunction, which leaves a sperm or egg cell with an extra copy of chromosome 21 before or at conception.
Eugenic practises could identify and prevent this if IVF etc were utilised.
That is not to mention a whole horde of other dysgenic maladies that are genetics based.
I agree, if you have a cold you should be killed since obviously you are harmful to the real world
>>67863957
>telling people who couldn’t understand his logic to “go away and learn how to think”
>>67875603
Hehe. You're such a funny guy! Please post more of your hilarious memes.
>>67875654
I never said they had a 'special edge' over normal kids. A defect is the opposite of that, obviously. I'm saying we have a responsibility to care for our children, yes even when they have defects. That's not just emotional, it's probably the most important human instinct after surviving and making the children in the first place.
>>67863957
It should never have gotten that far. Those with a history of genetic deficiency should be sterilized. Why were they allowed to breed in the first place.
>>67875833
>Please post more of your hilarious memes
alright here's one
*ahem*
canada
>>67875833
>caring for evolutionary detrimental offspring
>instinctual
>>67875941
You'll never see a chimpanzee kill its baby, no matter how defective.
>>67875833
What part do down's syndrome people play in our society?
>>67875833
>I'm saying we have a responsibility to care for our children, yes even when they have defects
that is indefinitely more cruel than just offing that damn thing. You're not being kind. You're being a jerk to the kid and being a jerk to yourself and to everyone else.
>>67875969
animals kill defective babies.
Dawkins leads shit. Though he does prove somewhat entertaining when you slightly bemuse him. Disregard.
>>67875969
[blue][citation needed][/blue]
>>67863957
Aren't they already aborted if it's detected while babby is in womb?
>>67863957
Speaking as someone who makes his living in caretaking, hell, devotes his life to it, they really should.
You can tie all the flowery language you can imagine to it, but at the end of the day, it is a road of suffering. For every time they stump you with their own unique brilliance, happiness and beauty, there will be countless times more where you pity them for not being able to experience the life you lead, not being able to stand on their own feet, not evolve into their own people, not grasp the beauty of intricate things. You will worry. You will stress. You will be disheartened. You cannot tell people when the child drives you up the wall, because it makes you a monster. Worse than any normal child could. For life.
Remember that. This doesn't end at their puberty. This doesn't end when you retire and can no longer afford to take care of them properly. This doesn't end when you get so old you can no longer stay their blows when they have a bout of aggression (and I have seen the results). This doesn't even end in your dying breath, when you wonder who will take care of them now.
And that's just you. These children know. They understand.
>>67875773
I agree with you every human life is precious. We need to get more money from rich people to give to Africans. Or are you a racist, right wing godless Atheist who dosne't care about Africans
Why even bother researching how to cure diseases since god intends babies to get cancer anyway. Why even bother having a democratic nation when obviously the kings in power were chosen by god to be there.
Pic realted this genetic disorder should not be fixed since all of Gods creations are flawless and on purpose. God works in mysterious ways my friends
>>67875041
Dude, my hairdresser is like 60. Ultra conservative. She wanted 2 kids. Her first kid died, the second was healthy. So she decided to have 1 more.
The next kid was born prematurely. Died a month later but by that time it had problems with its organs and its brain started shutting down. She went and called the hospital every day. She nearly became a wreck. The kid died and she was relieved. She told me that it could have ruined her life, her husband's life and the baby wouldn't have had a good childhood.
Her next kid became an educated, tall guy who works in her shop. She god 2 healthy sons and they have kids and happy lives now.
I'm not sure why you are so emotional and irrational about abortion. Either way you are a muslim or some cry baby who makes decisions based on feelings.
I read other stories of women raising kids like these by themselves. It ruins them, their marriage, so on.
In the end, the kid is gonna end up in an institution. Because the parents get too old to take care of them. Do you know what they do to them their? Fuck them, beat them because these retards are nothing more than a drag.
Nobody really wants them. The only guilt tripping is coming from people like you who are not raising retards, obviously.
>>67876005
Right, because a kid that doesn't function the way you and I do is obviously going to be miserable his whole life and I'm a jerk for not killing him...
>>67876032
http://www.iflscience.com/plants-and-animals/researchers-record-chimpanzee-mother-caring-her-disabled-child-wild0
You could have googled yourself.
>>67875969
Actually you will.
Infanticide and even cannibalism of infants is practised in some mammals, including chimpanzees if I recall correctly. Although I can't confess to remember what specific animal it was, I'm pretty certain I can recall some breed of great cat that will essentially leave her cubs to fend for themself if they smell 'wrong' (due to deformities/illness). Or maybe that was a dream and someone will call bullshit on it, idk.
>>67863957
as mush I despise that asshat dawkins, people with downs syndrome are not sick you idiot.
Oh sure this world needs more people with down syndrome
>>67876123
>anecdote
>ad hominem
well thanks for fucking trying
>>67876126
just read all the recent replies to you man. You're a jerk because you're making everyone suffer, even if your intentions came from a good place.
"mom, this eagle chick that fell out of the nest has no wings!"
"its okay, child. Keep it on life support even though it'll never experience the full, fulfilled life an eagle is supposed to have. It'll never be strong, be able to fend for itself, never feel the wind over its body. In nature this chick would have died. But lets not be "bad" people, and everytime someone remotely looks at this thing they'll be forced to cough out some pity"
Okay, I'm done with this thread now. If you really can't see that parents are supposed to TAKE CARE of their children (while not killing them) then I can't help you see it at this point. I've said it every way that I possibly can. Birth defects are no excuse. Fucking degenerates.
>>67869553
Even if they do worship Dawkins, at least he exists.
kek
>>67876411
Tell that to the Spartans, you degenerate cuck.
>>67876553
kek
>>67876411
again, feeeeeeeelings
feelings make you weak, learn when to feel and when to be strong
>>67876594
the spartans would have thrown this canacuck off a cliff immediately after birth
>>67863957
>would rather force someone to go through life literally too fucking stupid to understand what's happening around them than put them out of their misery before their very first complex neurological activity (i.e. thought) occurs.
It was immoral of your mother not to abort you, I can tell you that much.
>>67876411
I respect your opinion, but do wish you were more accepting of other viewpoints on the matter. There is more than likely no 'right' answer in the absolute sense.
>>67865707
This.
Down Syndrome is a burden on the lives of everyone who has to interact with the person. Families are ruined because of it, and all they had to do was abort.
>>67875404
>That doesn't mean downies don't play a part in our society
They fucking don't.
>>67876245
>anecdote?
My hairdresser's confession?
Do you want to read in Hungarian the blog of a woman who is raising a retarded child? Use Google translate or whatever.
I hope it doesn't inconvenience you that other functioning people use other languages...
Here are some statistics how a retarded child affects a family's life in Hungary:
http://erinto.reblog.hu/a-hvghu-akcioja-a-serult-gyerekek-csaladjainak-szetzilalasaert
http://tudtade.blog.hu/2015/03/23/nem_kernek_sokat
http://www.prae.hu/prae/gyosze.php?menu_id=102&jid=29&jaid=414
I am not trying anything. If you want to ruin YOUR OWN LIFE , by all means.
The problem is that you are forcing your untested ideologies to someone. Probably you don't want to raise a couple of retards, so anyway.
Nobody here is telling you what to do. We are presenting you the facts and you are denying them based on your feelings.
EXTRA STUDY:http://mn.gov/mnddc/parallels2/pdf/50s/59-ESM-CDP.pdf
On pg 78 you can read how disruptive is to have a retarded child.
>>67863957
so from 'i thibk we should abort retarded children' you go straight to 'i want to kill every sick child'
gj pol, allthough i dont know why i expected more, literally every post with this picture is retarded in every way possible
>>67865680
this is either a jew reference or the shittiest compparison ever
youre retarded either way
>>67863957
Why are you so cold and heartless you want kids born into a life of suffering op?
You have no compassion.
>>67863957
people with down syndrome are stupid but do they suffer ? does this mean we could just kill all stupid people next.
Who the fuck is that kid
>>67876788
Can you find out early enough to abort? I hope so. I would definitely abort. Wouldn't you?
>>67865707
I admirer your edge.
>>67863957
He's fucking right. I wish you christcunts would get off your moral highchair and realize what a burden on society downies are.
>>67876608
Feelings are the basis of morality when you refuse to accept a higher metaphysical origin and somehow it's atheists who claim those on the side of Christians are acting on feelings.
You can't have ethical standards without being able to empathize with the emotional state of your fellow human beings. There is no national pride as a motivating force without feeling, or seeking metaphysical principles beyond our emotions. If we act without feeling, we will seek only to strive for our self and not for things higher or larger than ourselves; we are overcome by self interest and by harming the other, make our selves disgusting; that's the same reason why we deride those Jews who all to perfectly fit the stereotype. Can you honestly say that you would not be bothered by killing an unborn life if you did so with your own hands? It should weigh on you if you can understand the consequences of your actions.
Remember the disfigured boy and his ice cream? That moment was all the justification a child like him who faced the utterly perilous life ahead would need to live. Do you think the bad of his life could truly be weighed against the good so easily that one defect should mean death? Suffering is no great evil. Eugenics is a huge recoil from the suffering that is to be natural born man. It is a recoil from chance, from the love of fate, and the ability to weather the life of a difficult child, of all things. Who is acting on feelings? You and your desire for some ideal which is not the mankind you were born into, or those who believe in age old principles beyond their own control which should guide their actions?
Where you see weakness, there is actually the strength that is found in purpose of will.
>>67878301
It's from Neverending Story. And as someone who has been around people with downs yes i do think that they shouldn't be brought into this world.
Just wait until gene alteration arrives in the future. Then the problem will be solved and everyone can be happy
>>67863957
>>67864093
>>67864296
People are pussies today. Early abortion of a genetic abnormality is an act of mercy.
Two generations ago they would drown them you fucks. Its a blessing we can see the problem coming and end it as early as possible.
>>67879266
That's too intelligent for this board.
>>67879608
Too bac the Cuckstians will likely push for it to be banned.
>>67863957
>every sick child should be executed
I'll take "disingenuous German bullshit" for 800 please. Stick to ruining Western civilization via getting involved in idiotic wars instead m80.
