Fish People Need Friends Too Edition
>Rules databases
https://mega.co.nz/#F!pFgm0RKR!J06C1gVYcjzNGsF8YNLsjQ
https://kat.cr/warhammer-40k-pdf-library-t9575373.html
>FAQs
http://www.games-workshop.com/en-GB/Rules-Errata
>40k 7th edition quick reference sheet(s)
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/4104995/Games/7edRef_V7.pdf
>Forgeworld Book index
http://www.dakkadakka.com/wiki/en/Forge_World_and_Apocalypse_Rules_Index
>White Dwarves
https://www.mediafire.com/folder/tx4hcy4u487pv/WD
>Novels (Working link as of 02/02/2016)
https://mega.nz/#F!wx4BiKhD!YhnAf1BqSmAB8dO6xDM56Q
Made some OC
>>47523031 #
Marines having the same BS as the most elite regular humans makes perfect sense, honestly.
Less sense is veteran marines having essentialy the same statline, and of course this idea that there's anything wrong with scouts having WS/BS 3. The average marine scout is explicitly -not- as experienced as a schola progenium graduate.
Where do space marine tanks come from?Surely they don't always use thunderhawk transporters...
>>47522995
>Can anyone point me towards all the Tau Auxillaries we know about, but don't have rules for?
There's this one, although I think it is fanmade, maybe by /tg/.
https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Codex_-_Tau_Auxiliary
5th for Ultramarines are cool
Do Necrons have any dataslates or anything? Other armies at a glance seem to have a bunch, metal skeletons not so much?
This is mostly a for fun build that I'm going to try out in store because I got a big box of badly painted Bullgryns and Ogryns really cheap. Is this dumb idea fun or would it just be painful and boring to try out?
IG
1985 points used
2000 points
[Ogryn Auxilia] [1205]
2x - Bullgryns [315]
> 1x - Bone 'ead w/ Power Maul
> 3x - Bull w/ Power Maul
> 1x - Chimera
2x - Ogryns [275]
> 4x - Ogryn
> 1x - Chimera
Commissar [25]
[Psykana Division] [780]
3x - Commissar w/ Power Fist [50]
Primaris Psyker [75]
> Mastery Level 2
> Force Staff
3x - Wyrdvane Psykers [185]
> 10x - Wyrdvane
> 1x - Chimera
>>47523201
if not a thubderhawk then some other drop ship.
But yes usually they get deployed by thubderhawk.
>>47523275
off the top of my head they have decurion, shield of baal formations, and their imperial armour book. the problem with the imperial armour book is it clashes with the current codex since it was made for necron's 5th edition. check 1d4
>>47523195
vets have 2 attacks and there's a trend in 40k where higher ranked officers gain attacks rather then increased bs/ws. hell i think even the tau shas'ui has 2 attacks but bs3
>>47523286
Can any unit get mastery level 8 normally? Because unless I'm missing something, that's what the Primaris Psyker gets with this formation. (+1 mastery level per 5 Wyrdvane within 12")
>>47523201
Thunderhawks, same way that Tau come from Mantas.
>>47523452
ML4 is the highest, and even ML3 is rare. He doesn't get 8 powers though, just 8 warp charges.
>>47523449
Speaking of 'Crons.
Were the special characters ever available in pewter or did they come out after finecast?
Was pic related an Alpha Legion agent?
>>47523449
Vanguard Veterans are better assault marines because they have two attacks.
Sternguard veterans are "better" Devastators because they have... Two attacks and less heavy weapon slots?
>>47523286
It would be fun, but check out IA13/Vraks. One of the Renegade Shock Master things gives Ogryns as troops, and they can be given chaos devotions, carapace armour, and doggos to help them run down anything they run into. three ogryns and six doggos will mince basically everything, although theyre too expensive to be cheese
>>47523618
Sternguard are veteran Tacticals. Dev marines dont get veterans, same as they dont get devastator Terminators
>>47523618
The wording gives them away. Vanguard is frontline, the leading troops, the advance. Sternguard is literally "Protecting the back/from the back", it's just another word for Rearguard.
>>47523618
yes. i guess even shooty marines consider cqc important
>>47523587
i think gw was done with pewter after 4th edition, so they would have to only be in finecast
>Vehicles gain the Split-fire USR
>Vehicles gain +1 Hull Point
>Vehicles get to reduce rolls on the damage chart by their remaining hull points, counted after the hull point for the hit in question is removed
Are vehicles fixed? The latter two are fairly commonly espoused here, but the first gives Vehicles an edge relative to MC/GC and makes the ubiquitous secondary weapons carried by almost all vehicles a lot more effective.
>>47523593
Doesn't even look like an SM, sauce?
>>47523628
Shit, I may try that out since I already have a regular IG army. The FW models for renegades are pretty sweet, too.
Whats the recommended loadout for an Imperial knight? I just picked up the renegade box set and I'm not really sure which way I should go with it. For the record, they will be allying with Imperial guard and Imperial fists.
>>47523666
Read the filename satan. *Hint* (conan)
>>47523680
I mistook a meme for an actual doubt lol
Trying to start up a Corsairs Army whats better anti-tank:
>S8 AP2 Assault 1 Lance
Or
>S8 AP1 Assault 1 Melta
>>47523671
Thunderstrike Gauntlet because Fists. Call him EXEMPLAR OF THE FIST and call it The Pain Glove.
Proceed to fist fortifications.
>>47523670
FW renegade models are sweet, but i just run three units of four that i converted from WHFB Ogres, with five chaos warhounds each, as converting like mad is two thirds of the fun of Renegades.
>>47523671
Crusader is probably the best one
I really like Errant with a Fist for FUN
>>47523638
Which is hilarious. Early on you have the dev/assault split, then Tactical Marines who are nominally more experienced but are nowhere near as well equipped, then veterans split between generalist and assault specialist with no ranged element.
>>47523671
10 MM magnets.
Imperial Cysts. Totally not a Nurgle warband in disguise.
>>47523692
Alpha legion will do that to ya, as intended
>>47523664
Isn't the problem with vehicles that they can get blown up in one shot or rendered totally useless?
Remove the vehicle damage table
>>47523766
There's a pornsite called Nurgle's Nymphs.
>>47523702
You...
I Like you.
>>47523796
If i wasnt on uni internet i would search that shit
Were Land Raiders ever good? Their fire arcs are horrendous and they have very low firepower to cost ratio even when you can make everything hit.
>>47523839
I think they're more important as sturdy assault transports.
>>47523839
CSM since 5th.. I always liked my Land Raider. It always attracted a lot of fire and Av14 is still kinda tough to pop unless you get up close with Melta, an even then it's still medium-chance. The firepower is versatile too and it carries terminators or a clump of assaulters for any threat coming to fuck you up the tailpipe.
>>47523814
Gotcha, mate.
>>47523839
They... used to be better, when it was harder to crack av14. That said, they were transports that could dakka on their way to choppy.
For an undivided chaos daemon army is it a good idea to get Karanak if you don't have flesh hounds?
>>47523839
They're the only way to make assault centurions useful, and they're so heavily armored that it's not worth shooting them with anything but melta/grav/haywire etc. It's a waste of an S10 AP1 shot that actually has a chance of wrecking something else.
Plus, a Redeemer in a Fist of Medusa detachment can tank shock an infantry squad 12" away and then unleash both Flamestorm Cannons. It's fucking brutal.
>>47523839
Pretty much this >>47523846. The true value of a land raider isn't so much the land raider, but what it is transporting. That said, 250 pts for a sturdy transport is a bit ridiculous to me.
>>47523794
(not that anon, but) with this change, vehicles couldn't be blown up, even with AP1 weapons while they had at least 3 hull points remaining. If they have 2 left, it takes an AP1 weapon to blow it up (on a 6), and AP2 can only blow it up when it takes the last hullpoint off anyway.
(hullpoints left *before* rolling to hit in these examples)
>>47523898
Even if you did have flesh hounds, Karanak isn't super amazing. At best the idea would be not bad. In most cases, it would be a waste of 120 pts.
>>47523698
vs AV12:
>33% chance to pen, 16% chance to explode
>83% chance to pen, 33% chance to explode
vs AV13:
>33% chance to pen, 16% chance to explode
>72% chance to pen, 33% chance to explode
vs AV14:
>33% chance to pen, 16% chance to explode
>58% chance to pen, 33% chance to explode
The Lance probably has the advantage of range, but it's nowhere near as good at killing things.
Why aren't the Barghesi a playable army
>>47523796
You bastard, this is all irl shit
>>47523949
Thats literally the point. People are upset that it is so easy to blow up a tank but a MC requires you to strip off every last wound, while it maintains full functionality the whole time.
>>47523794
It is a problem, but I'd argue that it is a primarily acadamic one. Consider this: with the new damage table, it is harder to guarantee an explosion result unless you're bringing a metric butt load of melta/ap1 to the table. In most cases, vehicles die to Hull Point stripping, especially if they are not av14 all around. However, I would like to posit that the primary problem isn't with Hull Points or getting that Explode result, but with saves or the lack thereof. Vehicles in general have shitty ways of getting saves so 3 good shots and a vehicle is dead, explosion or no. I know that vehicles don't get saves but are offset by having high AV (av10 is the equivalent of t6, av12 is the equivalent of t8) but this rarely works out to even the gulf between monstrous creatures and vehicles in general.
>>47523664
The problem isn't with vehicles, it's with MCs. All MCs need their HP reduced by about a third.
Vehicles could probably stand to have their speeds increased, which would do more to differentiate vehicles from creatures, and make AV10 and AV11 vehicles much more useful.
What are the negative consequences if I want to play allied Iron Hands + Skitarii in CADs but take unbound rhinos for the Skitarii?
Utter newfag here, returning from 3rd ed because a game shop just opened up nearby. I'm going Eldar for reasons of fluffery, and I'm not sure what to get next. I currently have:
Farseer
6 Scorps
5 Dire Avengers
10 Guardians with plat
Wat next? I'm not taking wraith anything until the meta is at 1000+ pts, I hear they are OP as fuck and I don't want to be that guy. I was thinking the box of 3 Vypers or maybe a Night Spinner. Something vehicular, anyways. Probably going up against 'Nids first, though maybe Marines. Any suggestions?
How would you feel about this?
http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2016/05/40k-open-conversation-should-the-movement-star-return.html
>>47524019
Yeah but it's an unholy alliance between Nurgle and Slaanesh. Guess how many STDs each has?
>>47524087
You lose Objective Secured on everything and the reroll to your Warlord trait, and your Rhinos don't get IWND. Why not just take the Rhinos as an FA choice in the Iron Hands detachment?
>>47524071
Not all MCs, Tyranid MCs (i.e. actual monstrous creatures instead of robots) are nearly all mediocre or Flying. What needs to be done is Riptides and Dreadknights to have their points cost increased to reflect how good they are. The problem is appropriate pricing, not nerfing everything because of half a dozen OP-bullshit monsters.
>>47524044
I liked the suggestion of subtracting remaining HP from damage table results. Makes it impossible to one-shot a land-raider, without removing the table outright.
>>47524087
You'll want to confirm a couple of things.
1. Is your group using the first draft FAQs or are you waiting for the finalized product?
2. Is your group okay with unbound?
And finally, when you say negative consequences what exactly are you talking about? Consequences from a crunch/tactical stand point?
>>47524119
Tyranid ground MCs stay the same, then. Flyrants and Hive Crones need to get nerfed along with Riptides and Dreadknights.
And then Nids need a buff so they can actually do something useful other than FMC spam.
>>47524090
I'd definitely like to see better differentiation in how units move that doesn't rely on dice beyond doing riskier maneuvers (i.e. trying to sprint at an enemy) but it'd be hard to do right. Like the article said about potentially slighting some armies as well as just straight up adding more stats.
In a perfect world, I'd love to see a fairly simple ruleset that still allows armies to play significantly differently AND have a lot of options. That's, however, pretty much impossible due to one working against another.
>>47524114
Because I'd have to take two SM CADs to get 4 FA Rhinos for the Skitarii and that's kinda prohibitive in low-point games (1000 - 1500)
>>47524088
You can never go wrong with wave serpents and they are not the utter cheese they once were an edition ago so you're safe there. Barring that falcons are also fun times and both them address a very important weakness in your current model lineup - your models are too soft.
>>47524130
>Makes it impossible to one-shot a land-raider
That's not something that ever happens anyway. With a Lascannon, you need two 6s in a row to blow one up. 1/36 is pretty damn good odds, especially for something that can shrug off so many other attacks. Melta has a much higher chance of exploding a Land Raider, but no one ever just sends a single meltagun against a Land Raider, and if they do there's no reason why you shouldn't assault out and kill them first.
>>47524144
Hive Crones are a fairly decent unit but not amazing at anything other than killing flyers, i feel they're appropriately costed. Flyrants could be given a small price increase on the wings adaptation, or have a hard limit of 0-1 tyrant per army. Finally, give their guns actual AP, increase the amount of adaptations2+ carnifexes again whenand give more psychic variety to powers of the hive mind while making Shadow of the Warp actually do something-minus 3 leadership to psykers is fucking pathetic, make them harness on 5s or something. Finally, give them actually non-prohibitive rules, like giving the instinctive buff when in synapse.
>>47524088
Only the Wraithknight and Wraithguard with Flamers are OP. Unless you're turning up with just Scatbikes and Wraithknights nobody should say shit.
>>47524133
Store doesn't recognize the FAQ even though it's an official GW, manager is waiting for the final draft.
I'm talking purely from a rules/crunch standpoint, I can justify it in fluff once I sit down and figure the list and play style out.
>>47524180
One CAD and one AD. It's not that bad. Or, if you have anything like Lascannon Devastators or something that don't go in a vehicle, you can take a dedicated transport for them and then put the Skitarii in it.
>>47523664
>>47523794
>>47523949
>>47524044
>>47524027
>>47524044
>Remove vehicle damage chart
And yet again, fatguys only think of their own army. Some armies rely on Explodes results from low AP weapons to deal with vehicles, they literally don't have high-strength, high rate-of-fire guns that can ping off hull points.
You lot are fucking shit at rules writing.
>>47524220
You could take three units of whatever and then make the fourth rangers and sit them in the backfield. Unless you're doing four ruststalkers or something.
>>47524133
My store's meta recently went out and decided that we weren't using the FAQ until it's final.
Then again, my meta involves a few given things, such as a specific style of terrain, where there's 50% Area Terrain, and 4 large pieces of line of sight blocking terrain(One in each corner of the board where Dawn of War and Hammer and Anvil intersect). And we use the ITC FAQ.
>>47524231
I am offended! Not once did I propose for the removal of the vehicle chart. When I said the new chart, I am referring to the new one we got in 7th where you need ap2 and a 6 to actually explode something. Because of this it actually makes explode results even more unlikely which has shifted popular opinion towards high rate of fire weapons to strip hull points. That you quoted me twice only adds salt to the wound.
>>47524236
2 5-man double plasma & 2 5-man double arc, for rhino drive-bys
>Broodlord
>£25
>Techpriest Enginseer (the one that used to come with a tank)
>£18
That's all that's leaked so far.
>>47524231
Thats a balance issue with those armies, not with the vehicle damage chart. No one can possibly think that vehicles and MCs are balanced with each other, wich the removal of the chart starts to shorten the gap
>>47524231
And some armies are garbage. What's your point?
>>47524292
>Broodlord £25
Actually kinda an insult. Not quite as bad as Age of Sigmar selling a clampack character with a scenic base and extra packaging for £50, but close.
>>47524289
I would say swap a plasma squad for rangers, and run a CAD with it
>>47524294
Vehicles are balanced against infantry. MCs are not balanced in line with either.
>>47524294
Nope, they're not balanced. In close combat a walker consistently kicks the shit out of an MC. But you're so myopic you can only see the one situation you care about.Reminder that the meltagun isn't the problem, the drop pod is the problem.
Also, everybody having the same weapons set was shit. Some armies not having autocannon-equivalents makes listbuilding more interesting.
>>47524345
How does a model which can lose its x2 S AP2 CCW on a pen, and die to a single good pen, consistently outperform MCs, who can never die in one hit besides ID, & who have AP2 naturally?
>>47524425
S6 vs AV12 front armour.
>>47524425
(not that anon, but) most MCs have strengths around 6ish, and most walkers have AVs around 12 ish, and a single smash attack isn't doing anything.
While most walkers have some sort of higher strength ap2 attack
I won't let you faggots nerf my dreadknights unless you give me better options/formations equivalent to spacreate marines. Until then you can fuck of with your generalizations and rules changes.
>>47524425
Carnifexes pay a premium for S8 Standard, and then have to pay extra for making it S10 by using an Sx2 melee weapon for the same cost as everyone else. Dreadnoughts have a points advantage in that they only pay for S6 standard, and paying less than everyone else for Sx2 melee.
In addition, Dreadnoughts have higher initiative and more attacks than typical monsters. They actually tend to mop the floor with monsters at the same points cost. Therefore walkers are a hard counter for monsters, and indeed they are in my experience.
Has anyone ever used the Onager Gauntlet to great effect? Seems to me unless you're facing a big fucking vehicle like a Land Raider, it's a lot more efficient to just blast it from range and fuck off with JSJ
>>47524485
*space
>>47524500
Your correct
>>47524500
Isn't Onager Gauntlet just Smash? One S10 attack against a Land Raider is useless.
Ok /40k/ I've got an idea so crazy for a list it just might work
It's not specific because rough draft and I'm lazy
HQ:
Chapter Master
Infantry (10 man squads):
5 Tac Squads with Teleport Homer
2 Devastator Squads
Elite Units (5 man squads):
4 Terminator Squads
Transport:
4 Rhinos
Heavy Support:
3 Predators
Artillery:
3 Whirlwinds
Overall it's like 3000 points, or at least 2500 (again, just a rough draft, haven't worked out the specifics)
See pic related for strategy. If paths get too narrow, the formation can break into 1 Pred/1 Rhino/1 Tac Squad with the last rhino doing its best to stay close to the rest of the army. If the path gets narrower still, the Combat Squad can split and follow each rhino and Predator as it goes along.
When there's a huge firefight coming, the Terminators can Teleport Homer into the battlefield with no risk of missing the target
I've already tried this strategy on a smaller scale and it worked pretty well. What do you guys think?
Brought out my Deathwing against a Nurgle CSM force last night.
1500 points. Maelstorm Mission: Contact Lost. Dawn of War deployment. He had first.
He brought a small unit of Cultists and some Plague Marines then 2x 3 Nurgle Obliterators and Nurgle Bikers that included his Lord and Sorceor, they all had plasma. Lastly a Defiler.
I brought Ezekiel with an Interogator Chaplain in a Deathwing Strike Force with a Command Squad (2 TH/SS, Cyclones, Apoth and DW Standard) The other unit of 6 Terminators had 3 TH/SS, cyclones and a chain fist. I brought the RW Support Squadron and two Attack Squadrons as a delivery system.
His Sorceror died to perils turn one and it was pretty grim. He couldn't cross the field to get anywhere near my RW so I was safe. (My Support Squad was Center and the two attacks on each flank). His Oblits had melta stuff and were trying to get close to my Landspeeder unit and his bikers were gunning towards my own from the Attack Squad. He was able to score 2 points.
My turn 1 let me get myGrav Bikersinto range of the oblits and took out one. I typhooned his cultists, they went to ground but still took out 3. I drowned his bikers in 21 Heavy Bolter shots that landed 3 unsaved wounds, leaving him 4 bikers including his HQ. I destroyed the Defiler with Double Multimelta Landspeeder. My melta attack bikes were close to popping the Plague Marine transport but didn't even hit it... I scored nothing.
>>47524292
Hello Cryptus
>>47524540 Cont.
He was able to pop one of my landspeeders and got into CQC with my grav bikers although I got one wound in overwatch but easily lost combat gaining him another point. Everything else kind of moved around and the plague marines disembarked and sat on another objective. Also killed one of my two MultiMelta Attack bikes. He ended his turn with a total of 5 points to my 0.
My turn two brought the Deathwing and I Mind Wiped the Nurlge Bikers making their WS/BS 1. The Deathwing dispersed and I had a unit on each flank. Split fired the Cyclones and my Typhoons at the remaining cultist wiping them out. They then shot the crap out of Oblits. I popped the rhino for shits and giggles. Again I shot the 5 remaining Heavy Bolters at the bikes. Scored a point for shooting some cultists with a load of weapons. The plague marines took one wound from the lone MultiMelta Attack Bike
Turn 3 he assaulted the Support Squadron with bikers and oblits. Took out a biker in overwatch before losing another Landspeeder. His plague marines destroyed the double multimelta Landspeeder. His plan was basically to not deal with my deathwing. Score was 7-2.
I was able to mind wipe and assault his plague marines with the Termi Command Squad and two HQs and beat the crap out of them. I didn't lose a single termi. After that and the shooting they were gone so I could finally get on an objective. The other termis shot uselessly at the last 3 Oblits. Typhoons were able to take one of them out though.
Turn Four he threw his bikers into the regular termis and hid his last few Oblits. They were his only two units left. He called it.
>>47524292
>horror of the Tyranids
Hah! Cruddance will stop them.
So I'm going to be playing in an Escalation campaign soon, starting at 750pts, and I wanted to start an IG army.
I thought I'd start with 2 getting started boxs and a chimera, and I think I could make the following list.
HQ
Pask: Executioner+sponsons
Battle tank
both with dozers and camo
Troops:
Vets: Chimera, 2 meltas and a heavy flamer. Carapace armor and a comissar with a powerfist
Vets: Heavy bolter team, grenade launcher and a forward sentry upgrade.
That's 750s.
Could I actually make this list from those kits. And how good would that list be?
>>47524187
Huh, see I was leaning away from the Serpent because it doesn't bring much gun for the points, and any unit protected by it (i.e. inside) can't shoot. Am I missing something about them, or is it I just can't into tactics? Would you recommend the Fire Prism or the Night Spinner?
>>47524187
Oh coolio, thanks- I'm playing as a splinter of Iyanden that goes out and recovers lost Wraithbone shit, so I'm dying to get my mitts on some 'Guard or a Lord. Obviously I'm gonna gonna start LoW'ing until everyone else is. Are there any other cheesy units that will shit up the game group? Going to be 500pts for the forseeable.
>>47524523
Not exactly. Smash gives all CC attacks AP2 and can choose to make a single attack with Sx2 and Re-roll AP.
I'm just trying to figure out why you would take/use an Onager Gauntlet aside from cool factor and "It's cheap and had nothing else to get"
How often would an Inquisitor be able to make a pilgrimage to Terra?
>>47524498
>SM walkers are a hard counter for monsters.
I think that's what you meant.
>>47524585
> Paskicutioner
Great, you gotta pick the second worst tank to use him with. Try using a Punisher with Pask, he's much more well suited to it. Preferred Enemy BS4 means you reroll 1s to hit AND wound, on 20 hosts. Most people totally forget the part about rerolling to wound. Literally the only thing Pask gives to executioners is that you reroll 1s to wound and have a -slightly- lower scatter, since blasts don't benefit from his rerolling to hit.
>>47524620
As often as he want, I mean, Inquisitors can do almost wathever the fuck they want
>>47524585
2 Russ at 750 will be a pain in some peoples dick.
>>47524648
Wouldn't his job kind of counter that? Which Ordo is the busiest?
>>47524005
Because GW would have to try something daring and new with no guarantee of profitz.
Do we have an ongoing list of all the xenos mentioned in 40k? The HH books keep describing new ones and I swear I lost track by the time the Iron hands fought the Crystal Gems.
>>47524585
You'd need to buy the chimeras seperate, and the Start Collecting box comes with the Battle Tank, Exterminator, and Eradicator.
The other variants must be bought seperately.
>>47524641
okay. I'm going to try and magnetize the Russes as much as possible, so I'll see about different loadouts.
>>47524662
possibly true, but I'm trying to get a good number of points per dollar, and doing that with infantry does not look like a thing I could do, and the getting started get seems like a pretty good deal money wise.
>>47524641
Remember that the FAQ made it so that even though you reroll 1's to wound, you still suffer the effects of Gets Hot!
>>47524716
I mentioned the chimera being separate.
Good to know about the Russes. How about the bits for special weapons etc. Willing to order some bits, but I don't want to be spending another $50 on bits, because then I'll just look at adding another kit.
>>47524732
FAQ isn't official, and the 1 is from to hits, and Pask himself gets to reroll all to hits.
Which still doesn't help, because the Gets Hot! only says being twin linked helped, nothing about to hit rolls.
>>47524740
The Sponsons and stuff are all included, fortunately.
If you want, you could convert the commisars into counts-as tank commanders by just gluing their top half onto the turret, and making it a Commissariat Tank.
Pic related.
>>47524750
>FAQ isn't official.
Kek.
>>47524771
So, any guardsman that runs gets highlighted with the spotlight then blown away with the vanquisher cannon, right?
>>47524771
should have said 'isn't official yet'.
And it really isn't, it's an in progress document, so while many of the things in it will likely become official rules, I'd recommend against taking everything in it as official until it gets published.
>>47524695
Ooh I understand you now
I suppose the bussiest one is the Ordo Hereticus, being heresies all over the imperium constantly
>>47524802
Nah mate, this is for executing tank commanders instead of guardsmen.
The sponson gunners are in charge of executing the guardsmen.
>>47524485
do you legitimately think you have it hard as a SM player?
>>47524771
>>47524716
I meant what options are there for the infantry squad. Just lasguns? or decent number of other weapons.
Can someone rate my list please,
1500 Points of I have literally never played an elf army ever and all I know about Eldar is from /tg/ bitching but space pirates look cool
CAD
HQ
Corsair Prince (Reaper of the Outer Dark, Heavy Mesh Armour, Jetpack, Shimmershield, Venom Sabre, Tanglefield generator)
Elites
5x Malevolent Band (Jetpacks, Heavy Mesh Armour, 2x Power Weapons)
3x Wasps (Void Burners, 6x Shuriken Cannons)
Troops
5x Cloud Dancers (5x Scatter Laser, Tanglefield Grenades)
10x Reaver Band (Jetpacks, 8x Shuriken Catapults, 2x Fusion Guns)
10x Reaver Band (Jetpacks, 8x Shuriken Catapults, 2x Flamers)
Fast Attack
Nightwing (Kinetic Shroud)
Heavy Support
5x Balestrike Band (Jetpacks, Heavy Mesh Armour, 5x Splinter Cannons)
Fire Prism (Kinetic Shroud)
Prince Joins the Malevolents, let me know if I horribly fucked something up
>>47524805
There is one Ordo that covers the guard, and there's 500 Inquisitors. Sure they probably have acolytes in regiment sized and Commissariats to help, but the point still stands.
>>47524854
I'm sorry, but if you think I give a shit about what things you think deserve a nerf, you are mistaken. Enjoy coming up with rule 'fixes' that will never be implemented faggot.
>>47524871
People may bitch at you for the scatterbikes, so grow a nice thick skin to deal with that.
I'd say you're a little bit short of AV14-busting units.
>>47524854
If he's talking about Dreadknights then he's a GK player, in which case yeah he doesn't have it all that great aside from that one unit.
>>47524880
500 inquisitors for the whole Guard is messed up
>>47524867
Vets can take two weapons from the special weapons list, a HWT, replace their lasguns with shotguns for free, take a Heavy Flamer, krak grenades, dedicated transports, and Doctrines.
>>47524989
GW can't into numbers as usual. Maybe each Inquisitor gets one world/regiment, and their acolytes gets each regiment? The commissars probably help.
>>47525037
I interpreted more as every world/regiment gets a few commissars, but the inquisitors are there for those lord-commanders that get delusions of grandeur, decide they're Macharius II and stop listening to Terra.
>>47525037
But remember, if each world has a guard regiment, and the Imperium has countless inummerable worlds, they still can't into numbers.
>>47525037
The guys that keep track of all the numbers of the Inquisitors probably fuck up from time to time.
Most likely they dropped one or two zeros.
>>47525067
>>47525076
These two might be the closest explanations, probably
>>47525113
50,000 Inquisitors with 36 Acolytes each is 1,850,000 dudes to watch over the Guard. That's enough to have one for each world (if there's ~1,000,000 imperial worlds?), or multiples if they're only covering sectors.
>>47525161
I remember someone estimated that there are just over a trillion guardsmen, with the total human population galaxy wide around 11-12 trillion
so each acolyte (not even inquisitor) is going to look after over half a million people people?
I think it is more likely they oversee the administration of the guard, do spot checks, and investigate specific incidents
>>47525276
Commisars exist for a reason too. Inquisitors are more of a executive kind of branch and only go where they are needed. A few million guardsmen can be dealth with the 100k commisars
>>47525067
That might be the case.
>>47525076
>>47525161
>>47525276
The Inquisition is so over worked.
>>47524144
>Hive Crones need to get nerfed
Well fuck you too. They are actually pretty okay unit and don't need nurfing.
what is the most cheesetastic army you have ever fought, and what is the difference between tactically sound lists and power gaming lists?
so how many inquisitors would fall in a year? how about how many would get promoted from acolyte? like 4 per year maybe?
>>47525388
more than 4 a year across all of the ordos surely
as for promotions, it depends on the inquisitor they are serving under. As per Codex: Inquisition, some inquisitors make it a habit to train acolytes to be the next generation of inquisitors, others either work alone or use acolytes as expendable tools.
>>47525388
>>47525442
They also don't have to die to pass on the Inquisitor title. A group of three or more Inquisitors can select an Acolyte to be promoted.
>>47524498
>Carnifexes pay a premium for S8 Standard, and then have to pay extra for making it S10 by using an Sx2 melee weapon for the same cost as everyone else.
Nigga you should actually read the rules before you start to discuss them. Just saying...
>eternal crusade showing off the new Warlock
>it's a reskinned Chaos Sorcerer with the same unimaginative skills.
>>47525385
>Biggest cheese list
Most I've personally played is Tau with a single Riptide at 750.
Difference between tactically sound and powergaming to me often comes down to spam. It's one thing for an Eldar army to have a squad of Jetbikes or Wraithguard to support their other units. Its another thing to see nothing but those.
A good mix of units is more likely to lead to more interesting games.
>>47524440
>>47524451
>>47524498
Thanks for clearing that; I never would have believed MCs had low initiative or strength. Much of my MC experiences have come from Tau & last-edition Eldar.
Like, I know Nids had lots of MCs, but thought they just swam through walker wreckage. They're overcosted & underpowered because Cruddace is a shit & essentially thought the swarm shouldn't have a counter to his Guard leafblowers. My most recent MC encounters were with Necrons, who get an MC for 50 points that's S6.
Jesus, GW, buff the fuck out of Nids. I think I'll get my brother the AbusePuppy Tyranid codex. From what I understand, it can't possibly be worse designed than vanilla.
So Eldar players, what's the best loadout for Vypers going up against Marines at 500pts? Is this a scenario where starcannons are handy? Would you drop any upgrades on them? If so, which?
t. newfag with unopened Vyper boxes
Do you guys have any cool scion paint scheme pics?
Looking for inspiration.
>>47525626
Iron Hands + Skitarii anon from before, anybody want to critique my list?
SM CAD (415)
Techmarine - 90
- Betrayer's Bane
Tacs - 115
- Rhino
- Meltagun
Scouts - 105
- Storm w/Multimelta
3 x Rhino (Fast Attack slots) - 105
SM Allied Detachment (205)
Techmarine - 65
Scouts - 105
- Storm w/Multimelta
Rhino - 35
Skitarii CAD (630)
2 x Vanguard - 230
- 2 plasma calivers
2 x Vanguard - 170
- 2 arc rifles
2 x Onager Dunecrawler - 230
- neutron laser
Total: 1250
I could get to 1500 easily with unit upgrades and a tricked-out bike command squad for the second techmarine to ride around with. What are your thoughts?
>>47524641
Gods why is the Punisher Gatling Gun so fucking sexy.
>How many dice you want, senpai?
>Just fuck his shit up
>>47523220
Yes, but italians used them too, the stormtrooper also used them as they were waaay lighter than the armoured helmet they used.
>>47525651
Everything's better with robes/longcoats.
>>47525624
Two shuriken cannons, you wound infantry on 2+ and still have enough shots to hurt vehicles.
>>47525385
>Tactically sound
Using multiple types of units to support a strategy and back up the rest. Lots of synergy, behaving as individuals but also with the big picture in mind and consideration. All units have a role in mind with their weapons and wargear reflecting this.
>Powergaming
I have the money to buy 3+ of the latest flavour-of-the-month units and my army is nothing but those. I move forward and win. Every units does the same tactic and goes from A to B destroying everything it sees. Every unit is the best so you don't need to pit various units again specific targets, yours are all good against everything.
>>47524088
Hahaha you're playing the gay space elves because you like the fluff? I could at least respect you if you were just picking the strongest army but choosing to be a space elf is just gay
Check my list tee gee. Space Marines with a side of scions.
Stormlance Battle Demi Company - 1130 points
White Scars Tactics
HQ - Chapter Master - 215
Bike
Shield Eternal
Grav/Plasma Pistol
Command Squad - 250
Bikes
Storm Shields
Gravguns
Tactical Squad - 85
Plasma Gun
DT: Rhino - 35
Tactical Squad - 85
Plasma Gun
DT: Rhino - 35
Tactical Squad - 85
Plasma Gun
DT: Rhino - 35
Devastators - 200
4x Plasma Cannons
+5 Marines
DT: Rhino - 35
Land Speeder - 70
2x Multi Melta
Combined Arms Detachment - 500
Iron Hands Tactics
HQ - Librarian - 120
ML 2
Bike
Combi-grav
TROOPS - Scout Squad - 70
Camo Cloaks
Sniper Rifles
TROOPS - Scout Squad - 70
Camo Cloaks
Sniper Rifles
ELITES - Command Squad - 240
Bikes
Storm Shields
Apothecary
Plasma Guns
Allied Detachment - 215
HQ - Command Squad - 125
4x Melta Guns
TROOPS - Scions - 90
2x HSVGs
1845/1850
>>47525748
Cool, best loadout is also the cheapest. Can Vypers JSJ like jetbikes? I'm gonna be fielding 3, each as a seperate fa slot for max target threat.
>>47525696
Nice minis, I love these kind of realistic photos, adds a lot of atmosphere to the army
>>47525774
Taken one too many shurikens up the ass, huh? Nevermind, I'm sure the store manager will go easy on you if you ask nicely.
>>47525758
Give me some examples of 40k units with synergy. The only two codices I've really gone through in detail are Orks and to a lesser extent CSM. I know these two are poor examples, but could you provide me with some good examples? Or does 40k just inherently lend itself to spam?
So my friend just purchased daemons of nurgle starter kit plus an unclean one which he intends to combine with his current CSM force. This brings his total force to 1 unclean one, 1 herald of nurgle, 1 unit of plaguebearers, 1 unit of nurglings, and 1 unit of plague riders as well as 1 chaos lord, 1 aspiring champion, 1 chosen squad, 1 helbrute, and 2 cultist squads.
I have a furioso, 2 captains, 1 librarian, a terminator squad, 2 ten man tactical squads, and a unit of of bikes. Is this a decent matchup or do I need to start looking in to some predators and drop pods? Trying to avoid flying units for now and keep it a ground game, just want to make sure this isn't turning in to a rape.
40k needs twin-linked melee weapons.
>>47525854
see >>47525802
This guy's list, in terms of synergy, is actually not bad. He could just be taking a minimum of troops and spamming gravbikes. Instead, he's got a solid Chapter Master runnng with the bikes to make a solid, deadly core, with three tac squads JSJing out of their rhinos (with that formation's bonus) and a Land Speeder for armor threats. Then he's got Scouts to camp objectives and pick off infantry alongside another solid group of dudes, this time with the bikes basically acting as fire magnets with 3+ invuln and 4+ FNP. Lastly, he has melta gunners and hotshot volley guns for anti-armor and anti-MEQ work.
>>47525880
Why don't the two of you play a couple of games and see how the matchup looks? If one person dominates, and/or there's something in one list that the other guy can't deal with, consider what you might add to address that.
Are you worried about your win/loss rate getting damaged or something?
>>47525854
Pedro Kantor and vets
just by being on the table he gives them objective secured, and by being in their unit he gives them +1A, which complements their already elevated number of attacks
>>47525889
twin linked melee
>specialist weapons
>shread
>>47525385
Eldar/dark eldar fairy boat spam. This was before the faq and he just had spooky D ghosts lined up on the Deldar boats. My russies were eaten so quickly.
>>47525854
A basic example for Chaos would be Noise marine pinning weapons or Skull cannons of Khorne used to prevent squads from overwatching so that CC units can approach and charge more safely.
Using transports to help screen troops from shooting, or bundling infantry to help protect tanks or larger models.
Psychic support is an obvious method.
Its harder with the weaker armies, but I'd still rather play a well-rounded CSM list instead of just Nurgle Biker spam or whatever
>>47525889
>Twin linked Thunderhammer
>>47525854
You could take my Tau list as an example from >>47512581
I don't use cheese units or cheese formations, I have a tactic that involves starting the game with just enough firepower and distractions to pose a small threat with support (markerfinders) and I bring everything from Outflank. The stealthsuits would come first and I'd use the positional relays and JSJ to more or less control where my units will come in. I can bring in a threat to deal against whatever is most opportune, have board control, use precision shots to thin out heavy and special weapons off squads and take objectives with great mobility. The enemy can never know what or where or when I'm bringing in ANY unit, which gives me a great advantage both game-wise and psychological. Every unit supports the other.
>>47525933
Only have played one game (which I won, glory to the emperor!) but I want it to be fair. The only game we played was kind of a rape, we weren't using our units effectively but luckily my units are way better at range so while we were both playing cautiously, it was more to my advantage since a tac squad murders a cultist squad. Points wise our armies are pretty close, I just want to make sure it's a game and not a rape. I haven't used my Terminators or the bike squad yet (honestly I don't even want to use the bike squad but it sounds like they're pretty useful) so it will be nice to field my entire current force soon but a gigantic pile of FUCK YOU psyker tank behemoth sounds threatening and other than my librarian and furioso, I'm not sure how to counter.
>>47525520
Eldar are made of fairy dust too?
>>47526032
Oops, forgot to add the GUO.
>>47526032
You're overthinking things. Two noobs are going to make fuckups which can swing the game wildly one way or another. Just play the game, have fun, learn as you go. And if you can't counter the GUO in one single game, so what?
Oh, but
>Chosen with twin lightning claws
tell your mate I like his style.
>>47526074
Aaaandd then I forgot to add the image.
>>47526003
Y'know I also just realized but a dual-Cyclic Commander with Shadowsun is essentially a poor man's Ghostkeel. Same Ion shot, 6 less range and small blast OC instead of Large and double Fusion shots instead of twin-link. Less cover save, but more mobile. Equivalent toughness.
>>47526086
The whole CSM side is from the Dark Vengeance starter kit (him and I split it) so unfortunately twin lightning claws wasn't his idea. It is good to know that it's effective. Fuck, now that I think about it I forgot it should have had an extra attack when going toe to toe with my librarian.
>>47526107
Don't forget better BS
>>47526131
Oh yeah my bad. Actually I'd say it's even MORE survivable. Can take 4++ for half the price, has Shadowsun's extra wounds and her possible 3++ drones for cheap, extra rules..
Only thing you don't get is the double cover save in the open but that can be worked around. And the fact you lose out on a really cool model. Can't wait to convert mine.
>>47525809
Thats not the cheapest. cheapest would be 1 cannon + tl catapults.
Unfortunatly the cannon bit for the underslung weapon was finecast and is OOP so you have to make something.
A vyper cannot JSJ as it is unit type antigrav vehicle, not jetbike, despite the name. But it can jink.
I am considering purchasing some old Kasrkin and removing their imperial signias for a turncoat/renegade faction
is this considerd heresy to the gaming community?
should I leave some on?
>>47525880
Oh, so I just remembered our points are relatively equal... but that means having 2 captains and a librarian on the field. I'm a little confused, do I only get The Red Thirst if I use the Baal Strike Force? If I were to play an Unbound army, does that mean I can't get the +1 initiative?
>>47523664
Vehicles: All vehicles in the current game gain 1 hull point. All penetrating hits caused by weapons with AP “–“ take -1 on the vehicle damage chart.
Glancing hits cause crew shaken and lose 1 hull point on a 4+.
Penetrating hits lose 1 hull point and roll on the damage chart, subtracting the remaining hull points from the result.
Damage chart for vehicles:
1- crew shaken: -1 BS and WS until end of vehicle's next turn
2- crew stunned: -2 BS and WS until end of vehicle's next turn
3- jammed treads: may only move up to half of normal movement during next movement phase
4- weapon destroyed: one randomly selected weapon on the vehicle may not be used for the rest of the game
5- ruptured armor- vehicle loses 1 AV on all sides
6- explodes!- vehicle is destroyed and all units within 6" of the vehicle suffer a number of S4 AP5 hits equal to the number of models in that unit within range. Replace the vehicle with a crater or suitable marker
Monstrous Creatures:
Grazing wound: if strength of weapon that caused an unsaved wound is equal to or less than target's toughness, causes flinched result on a separate roll of 4+.
Deep wound: if strength of weapon that caused an unsaved wound is higher than target's toughness, roll on chart and subtract remaining number of wounds from the result.
Damage chart for MCs:
1- flinched: -1 BS and WS until end of MC's next turn
2- staggered: -2 BS and WS until end of MC's next turn
3- tripped: may only move half maximum distance during next movement phase
4- weapon destroyed: one randomly selected weapon on the MC may not be used for the rest of the game.
5- ruptured armor: -1 T for remainder of game
6- deathblow!- move the MC D6 inches in the direction it last moved. Any models that it passes over suffer a hit equal to the toughness of the MC with AP-. Remove the MC as a casualty.
Thoughts?
>>47526315
>>47526315
beware the models are metal, which will give you a hard time filing away that aquila.
Some might complin, but then, some always complain about anything, so ignore them
>>47526315
1. Make your own Kasrkin out of Cadian bodies, Scion legs + arms, and Hostile Environment Heads
2. Do whatever the fuck you want. Renegades and Heretics is a very popular faction actually. You're likely to get props.
Easy vehicle fix: all vehicles are now t6 with an invuln save to match their former av. Av14 is 2++, 13 is 3++, 12 is 4++, etc.
>>47526389
>tfw Warlord titan is t6 and has a 1++ invul save
>>47526357
>All penetrating hits caused by weapons with AP “–“ take -1 on the vehicle damage chart.
Don't make it too complicated. Example is the rule above, its almost useless as there is so little Ap- weapons that will reliable put a wound on a Monster.
then you need to take care of so much stuff for each unit, its boggling.(It is already a problem with vanilla 40k)
also MCs are now more vulnerable than vehicles, because they have an Ld. (Shriek for example does not hurt vehicles)
Are there any /tg/ approved tutorials for playing? The one I watched explained the various phases well enough but starts with the moving phase leaving me a bit unsure on: what the fuck is a warlord? when do you roll for mission objectives? does each player roll for an objective? can you get detachment benefits from playing unbound?
>>47526389
congrats, now an autcannon is better against a Land Raider than a lascannon. And melter is useless
You sure about that?
>>47523664
>all get Split-fire
possibly too much, especially with squadrons and big guns.
Maybe S<5 can fire independently. Or something about sponson and/or pintle mounted guns.
>>47526357
more complicated for limited results.
>>47524044
problem with that is most anti-tank guns have decent AP values anyways, so unless they move to giving them a 2+ save, it's going to be ignored a lot. and the 2+ save would make all the non AP2 guns almost pointless.
Basically a problem with how the AP/Save system works.
>>47524071
>>47524119
add Wraithguard, Avatar, and demons to that of MCs that aren't OP.
>>47526466
go to your local LGS/GW, ask for a demo game. there's a bit of list building and set up but it's a lot easier to work it out in person.
>>47526357
i'd rather not have my expensive daemon prince get crippled turn 1 but i sympathize with the tank lovers
>>47526466
Start simple. Don't learn everything at once. Write down what you do not yet understand and ignore it for now. Look it up later.
Learn the basics first. People get the small details wrong, or argue endlessly about it, but knowing the basics makes you able to play.
Army composition (whats a warlord) and what are we fighting about(roll for objectives...)etc. should be for later.
Personally I would start with the intro book from Dark Vengeance.
>>47526466
>what the fuck is a warlord?
Character in your army you elect to be the warlord. This character then benefits from a warlord trait you roll for, and counts as your warlord for stuff like Slay the Warlord and Kingslayer
>when do you roll for mission objectives?
Before anything else, you roll for (or decide on) a mission. If youre playing eternal war, you then roll for board split, if maelstrom then this is chosen for you.
>does each player roll for an objective?
Objective markers? You split them evenly between yourselves then roll off to see who places first, then you alternate
>can you get detachment benefits from playing unbound?
unbound implies no formation/detachment of any kind, so no bonuses at all.
You can run an army with a formation, a detachment, and an unbound part all at once, but only the models from the formation will get the formation bonuses, etc
What's the weakest/worst army in the game right now? Orks?
>>47526306
Ah, I figured as much with the JSJ. 6 s6 rending JSJ shots would be a bit cheesy for 50 pts, no? Thanks my friend.
>>47526609
orks. though nids are close, but flyrant spam.
>>47524191
>No one ever just sends a single meltagun against a Land Raider
I actually did this once
I thought my opponent was playing renegades, not Khorne CSM, and I didn't change my list
My piranha jinked its witchfires and it used smoke
I managed to make it explode in one shot turn 1 while jinking
>>47526455
But they also get an armor save. which while it doesn't always work vs all weapons, definitely helps alot
>>47524979
This. GK used to be top of the heap with their best, and still worthy of any table when using basic units.
Even then, the way I look at it, a dreadknight was created to take on daemon MCs, 1v1. They should still be able to do that, and daemon MCs are some of the best in the game.
>>47526574
>You can run an army with a formation, a detachment, and an unbound part all at once, but only the models from the formation will get the formation bonuses, etc
Lets just clarify this cause I see this come up wrong a lot.
If you go unbound (as in, have any unit that does not belong to a formation or detachment) then the *entire* thing is unbound.
If you are unbound, you do not get detachment bonuses at all. Formations still give their benefits, however
>>47526357
>Everything should be the same
Boring as fuck/10.
>>47526609
Orks by far.
>>47526609
By collective internet wisdom, bottom 3 are orks, chaos, and nids. Most likely in that order for worst to best
>>47524191
I've popped landraiders with a single bright lance attack off a waveserpent twice, both felt too damn cheep.
While 1 melta gun might be semi-rare, 2 meltas is fairly common, and one might miss.
Even if both hit, you're chances of blowing it up are much reduced under 'subtract hp' rule, compared to normal.
Won't save you from a full Fire Dragon squad, but that wasn't the point. Point was to prevent the 'oops blew up you 300pt model with a single shot' stuff that doesn't even feel good to pull off.
Wanted to start a Tau army, but didn't want to me shat on by either players or by /tg/ (as much as a Taufag can be left alone). Is this OK or too cheesey?
HQ: Cadre Fireblade (60)
Troop: x6 Fire Warriors (54)
Troop: x6 Fire Warriors (54)
Heavy: Sky Ray Gunship (115)
Formation: Ranged Support Cadre
x4 Pathfinders (44)
x4 Pathfinders (44)
x4 Pathfinders (44)
x3 Broadsides with HYMP (195)
x3 Broadsides with HYMP (195)
x3 Broadsides with Heavy Rail Rifle (195)
Total: 1000
>>47526745
>the 'oops blew up you 300pt model with a single shot' stuff that doesn't even feel good to pull off.
Probably why D weapons are so dumb.
>>47525684
Stormlord throws 30 if you stay still. Then you can fire 20 heavy weapons out the back as well. 20 Mortars is usually neat.
>>47526730
I'd put Chaos above Bids personally. They have better ranged game outside Flyrants and more Forgeworld support.
While overall Flyrants might be stronger, I think Chaos Marines are better off on average.
>>47526804
Seems fine. Its a lot of ranged firepower, but its mostly stationary.
So, since Jean Steelers are getting models this week, unsurprisingly really as they're neat, does that mean the rumour of Codex: Levi's Thief true? If so, that makes my dick wet because it means the potential of Codex: Deathwatch being true is higher. Which is one thing I've wanted GW to do for a long time. I already have 'ur doods' planned out. How many members were in the Deathwatch: Ignition box? I need to work out how many chapters I can use.
Furthermore, if those two are right, then the new CSM revamp and the Thousand Sons models sounds great.
Also, the Age of Skubmar models will be proxy goodness for Eldar. I'm going to look into Exodite Eldar conversions since Lizzie starter box is dirt cheap.
>>47526936
Yeah, was my plan. I wasn't sure if I didn't take enough Heavy Rail Broadsides, since HYMP are more anti-infantry. Unless they can fill in? I also think the Broadsides are neat as fuck models.
Also, if I have worked it out right, the Pathfinders are 'protected' by Shroud and Infiltrate as long as I don't move them or fire regularly. The Broadsides are BS4 base due to the special rule Tau got given in 7th. Which means even with 4 Marker Lights (which count as 8 if Broadside fires at them) would mean I could make the unit BS10 and Ignores Cover... I think.
>>47524191
>That's not something that ever happens anyway.
It happens a hell of a lot more than I expect it to. Last time I played Tau, the guy fielded one of those tanks with the str 10 main gun. He was 'gimping' himself to make it fair since I play CSM.
1st shot of the game, he explodes my Land Raider, putting 4 Termis and a Termi Lord out in the open. The game was essentially over right there. But we played it out so he could have fun with all his suits.
>>47526941
doubtful, but i get the feeling we'll have get disappointed this year
>>47526999
First, BS higher than 5 does nothing for Broadsides, since they're already twin-linked.
Second, Broadsides should still be BS 3 base unless there's some other bonus to that formation. Either way, you'll only need 2 hits for BS 5 and ignore cover.
I'd consider maybe swapping one of the Missilesides for another railside, although that's really up to you.
The main issue I can see is difficulty with AV 14. Swapping out the Skyray for a Hammerhead or a couple fusion crisis suits might help out.
>>47527028
Damn. I wanted to make a Deathwatch team with
Blood Angel (leader as BA were the only faction in the HH Ally Matrix which didn't have any haters, so makes sense they're loved)
Minotaur (I love Asterions model, alas I can't use him in Deathwatch I guess, but somebody else will do)
Executioners (got away with being involved in Badab War by fighting back eventually and I love their iconography)
Blud Rahvens (Because Magpies)
Red Scorpions (Apothecary bitch if possible option because 'muh geneseed)
Red Hunters (Inquisition Bros, GK bros and SoB bros)
Space Sharks (sekret)
Fire Angels (SoB bros)
The Star Phantoms (Spooky)
The 10th I dunno. Maybe Raven Guard.
Also like The Exorcists, but I assume 10 is the max.
Lascannon Centurions sitting in the corner taking potshots at big shit. Worth it?
>>47527167
Why not normal Devs? Way cheaper.
>>47526553
I'm trying to keep it as simple as possible but since my friend is starting with me but not quite as... bright.. I'm trying to learn the game itself for the both of us, Blood Angels, Space Marines, Chaos Space Marines, and Chaos Daemons and all the fucking special rules that apply. Our first (only) game went relatively well but it was a Purge The Alien where we don't stop until either someone gives up or your last unit dies. I didn't know what Warlords were so skipped that. I don't know any Chaos detachments and obviously focused more on learning my force than my friend's so I don't know what buffs I ignored. In the end I had 2 SM squads alive, a librarian, and my furioso (broke a 10man squad in to two 5ers so technically I didn't lose a single unit) while he only had 2 cultists left so we just called it quits. Since I did follow the Baal Strike Force rules I had Red Thirst but I feel like I gimped my friend because I forgot to apply Mark of Nurgle to any of his units (the DV kit doesn't say they have them but he is building a nurgle army so I intended to use it).
Also there apparently no longer is such a thing as a FLGS in this city. The only two places I knew are gone, one replaced by a candy store and the other closed a few weeks ago and is trying to find a new location. This leaves me with a 30-40 minute drive to the closest fucking store that carries Warhammer.
What does a good CSM list look like?
And dont say none because all armies can be good, some are just harder than others.
>>47524231
Found the Tau player.
>>47527186
I like big models.
>>47527159
Minotaur (I love Asterions model, alas I can't use him in Deathwatch I guess, but somebody else will do)
Use the model as stand in for someone else. As long as the equipment is correct and it is not confusing, it should be okay.
As for deathwatch, if you want to play it, you can probably do it using the codex space marine. Sure it lacks the special ammo and shit but is that really the important part?
>>47524317
That is overpriced, but the Broodlord is a larger model than typical clampack. And the model itself is pretty sweet.
>>47523201
regular thunderhawks can carry a single rhino-based vehicle in the main bay
>>47527235
I could understand that. But Centurions are the most retarded big model in the game. They look worse than baby carrier dreadknights. At least those seem like they could move!
>>47527203
loads of fireraptors, rapiers and heldrakes is a start.
>>47527203
Daemon prince of nurgle with a black mace
Chaos sorcerer with 3 levels, unmarked
Minimum number of cultists
Nurgle Biker squads with melta
A handful of Chaos Spawn
Some of those forgeworld artillery teams for ranged fire support.
Add Heldrakes
Optionally, throw in a Chaos lord with a Mark of Nurgle for Plague marine troops or Slaanesh for Noise Marine troops.
>>47527242
Can't they carry 2 or 1 landraider?
>>47527267
That is why I want to give them lascannons!
If they can't move, might as well make them stationary death machines!
>>47527190
Focus on the basic rules first. When you are comfortable knowing what your basic infantry dude does (melee shooting etc.) go to the next level. Work your way up until you know the basics of one army. It might be a good idea to have the same army fight against each other first. (use csm to proxy blood angels)
And stop worrying about getting some rules wrong.
Starting with multiple armies is kinda hard, double so with demons, because they have a shitload of special this and thats
>>47527309
Yeah, but if you want them to be effective you give them grav and a drop pod and shoot them at something big that needs to die.
>>47524732
Yeah, they ruined Pask in the tri-plas Executioner. Which was my favorite unit to play. I fielded that with 2 Vanq sidekicks - all with lascannons on the hull.
Dont even want to play my IG army now.
That Command Squadron was rule of cool, without it.. meh. Thanks for stripping options GW. Guess those tri-plas Leman Russ' were just too strong.
>>47525548
>single riptide
>cheese
>>47527074
Yeah. You're right. Been a long time since I read the codex. I forgot their weapons were twin-linked. As for the base, I thought they had Fire Support special rule, like the Riptides do. Which gave the unit +1BS if there was 3 in a unit. Why Broadsides don't, I dunno. Guess Riptides weren't good enough.
As for Sky Ray, I was thinking it for AA.
How bout...
Remove Sky Ray
Remove 3 Broadsides
Add
Elite: x1 Riptide with Ion Accelerator and Early Warning Over-Ride (Interceptor) and Velocity Tracker (Skyfire) - 210
Elite: x2 Crisis Suit both with Fusion Blasters and a Shield Drone each.
That makes it 998 total I think.
>>47527237
I guess not. I need to read more about Minotaurs (and re-read IA12) as they seem neat.
>>47527307
REGULAR thunderhawks, dude.
>>47527309
Give them missile launchers as well, because it might scratch a few hullpoints of, too.
And they are much more durable than a dev-squad. So I say go for it, unless you play in a super-duper-tourney-environment or something.
>>47527203
>Psychic daemon princes with Wings + MoN
>Nurgle lords on bikes in a unit of Nurgle spawn
>Mutiple naked cultist units to act as screens/objective holders
>Possibly the new sorceror formation if your opponent is bringing a shooty MC/GMC
>>47527361
He asked for the most cheese, and that by definition is. My other fights have been against all-troop necrons, tactical marines with multi-weapon-type devastator support, and infantry heavy guard.
>>47527361
at 750? yeah it is and it's at least 1/3 of your points.
>>47527402
Nah, just my friend's garage.
>>47527361
Its okay, we all know how hard it is to read a full post before going off and shitposting.
>>47525730
yes
>>47527375
I think it'd be easier to just put the skyfire system on one of the missile sides for anti-air using the spare points from the sky ray. 4 S 7 shots are great for that role.
Then use what's left over to round out your list.
>>47527361
>>47525385
>what is the difference between tactically sound lists and power gaming lists?
Powergaming lists include formations like WarConvo, OSC, Riptide Wing, Skyhammer, Ravenwing, Necron Decurion..
It can also be spamming units like Scatterbikes or Necron Wraiths; or Spamming Grav weapons.
There is a somewhat fine line between building a good list, and being a cheesedicking faggot. With this crowd though, there are a lot of childish, self centered personalities. Guys like that can justify their behavior, and genuinely convince themselves they arent powergaming.
Im not there to judge anyone or get pissy over a game though. I try to be friendly and include everybody. I do avoid games with people playing competitive lists though, as Ive found that players fielding stuff like that tend to take the game too seriously. Whereas Im just there to show off mine, and check out other peoples' latest projects and armies.
>>47527361
>single Riptide
>cheese
>750 points
Thats pretty cheesy bud. I get that you play Tau, so theres a good chance you're a delusional retard. But yes, a Riptide at 750 is questionable, depending on the corcumstances/meta/opponent.
Why cant Tau players into sportsmanship? I swear that army attracts the worst of our hobby.
>>47523147
How do I get started with 40k?
>>47527603
>tfw I own a Stormsurge
>Only played it once because I needed to bring 2500pts for a 2v2
>Never brought more than 1 Riptide
We're out here, anon. There's only a few, but we're here.
>>47527422
>it's at least 1/3 of your points.
A Riptide is 180 points.
1/3 of 750 points is 250. A typical Riptide loadout is 225 points, still not 1/3. In a 750 point game you dont need a kitted out Riptide, so 200 points is probably realistic. Kind of a dick move though.
>>47527603
I just started as tau, had my first 500pt match yesterday and i swear i feel like im intentionally not going to ever get a riptide until 1500+ just because of this stigma
>>47527817
Good to hear anon. Id love to play against someone like that, I cant get a game in vs. Tau though because the 3 guys I know that play Tau are mega-spergs.
>>47526490
Because when something is broken, the important thing is to make sure you don't have to change other rules when fixing it.
Melta: Reduce invuln saves by 1 at full range, two at half.
>>47527826
i'll admit it, i know a little about the Tau and i'm jealous their MC are cheap
>>47527866
Yeah Tau are in a tough spot. The suits are just so much better than anything else they have, so toning a list down can leave you with a really weak army.
I think just fielding a CAD would be the best way to not be cheesy, while still allowing you to get your best units on the table.
>>47526826
well, D weapons are supposed to be rare and limited to superheavies/gargantuans. They're meant to threaten 300+pt models.
The dumbness was putting them on cheap models. Old Distort Rule was better.
>>47527804
Pick an army you think is coolest
Read their lore and see if they're still coolest
Buy a starter kit for that army (use GW to find what you're looking for then look on Ebay or Amazon to buy, usually cheaper)
Build, play, paint
