Star Phantoms Neighborhood Watch edition
>Rules databases
https://mega.co.nz/#F!pFgm0RKR!J06C1gVYcjzNGsF8YNLsjQ
https://kat.cr/warhammer-40k-pdf-library-t9575373.html
>FAQs
http://www.games-workshop.com/en-GB/Rules-Errata
>40k 7th edition quick reference sheet(s)
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/4104995/Games/7edRef_V7.pdf
>Forgeworld Book index
http://www.dakkadakka.com/wiki/en/Forge_World_and_Apocalypse_Rules_Index
>White Dwarves
https://www.mediafire.com/folder/tx4hcy4u487pv/WD
>Novels (Working link as of 05/27/2003)
https://mega.nz/#F!wx4BiKhD!YhnAf1BqSmAB8dO6xDM56Q
First for Ultramarines are cool
Reposting, I put this at the very end of the last thread.
What's more broken or overpowered? Corsairs or Craftworld Eldar? I started my Dark Eldar army, but I want to get some occasional games in as Corsairs, but the guy in our group who easily has over 5000 pts of CWE says Corsairs are worse.
>>47512536
Agree.
>>47512469
By far best general picture on the 40kgeneral history
Didn't get a reply or rate, so repost I guess:
Tau Empire, 2 CADs + 1 Formation
HQ: Commander + Onager + Iridium + Puretide + Neuroweb Jammer + 2 weapons from (Airburst, cyclic, fusion, missile or plasma) + Drone Controller + Stims = 185
HQ: Shadowsun = 135
HQ: Cadre Fireblade = 60
HQ: Darkstrider = 100
Troops: 3x5 Fire Warrior Strike team + Shas'ui = 165
Troops: 1x9 Fire Warrior Strike team + Shas'ui = 91
Elites: 2x3 Stealthsuits + Shas'vre + Fusion Blaster + Shas'vre Marker/Target lock + 2x Advanced Targeting System (for Burst Cannons) + Positional Relay = 242
Elites: Ghostkeel + Either weapon + TL Fusion Blaster + Stims + Counterfire (if using Cyclic Ion Raker) = 180
Fast Attack: 1x5 Pathfinders + Shas'ui + Bonding Knife = 70
Fast Attack: 1x4 Pathfinders + Shas'ui + 3x Rail Rifles = 99
Fast Attack: Remora Drone Fighter (Taros Campaign 2nd Ed) = 90
Drone Network Formation: 6 Marker Drones = 84
Total = 1501
Tactics
-------
Fireblade attached to 9-man Strike team. Darkstrider attached to Rail Rifle Pathfinders. Shadowsun, Commander and Marker Drone attached together. Ghostkeel, Markerfinders and Strike teams with Fireblade deploy normally. Everyone else Outflanks, Infiltrates and/or Scouts as rules and opponent permits. Remora in reserve as per flyer rules.
>>47512564
Craftworld eldar by along shot. Corsairs range from higher mid to lower top tier
>>47512580
Agreed
Do nids need a buff?
(Aside from Flyrant Lists)
Do you think they are worse than chaos/orks?
>mfw reading Space0din's Ork dex and finally seeing Rending on Big Choppas
>>47512469
So what do you guys think about the 100th captain rules?
>>47512638
>worse than chaos
n-
>worse than orks
now thats a funny joke anon
>>47512648
The fuck is your face from?
On an entirely different note does anyone write fluff for 1 sergeant of your army or for just a singular model and not for your entire army
>>47512638
Including FW, worse than CSM but better than Orks.
Codex only, final destination, they're better than Orks and about equivalent with CSM.
They definitely need a buff.
>>47512662
How many points?
What are some fun allies for Tau?
I don't really care how good they are.
>>47512684
Whats their main issue?
Whats the main problem with nids?
>>47512675
Yeah.
I play Storm Wardens so I work with their fluff, but I have some stuff written for the Sergeant that has killed a few Carnifexes.
>>47512662
The lack of a point cost or any other indication of how to field him worries me.
His special rule just being ANOTHER usage of the Tactical Doctrine disappoints me. Any Ultramarines player will already be swimming in the damn things. One of each for his Chapter Tactics, one of each from his Gladius, one or two Tacticals from his Demi's, and now one from Centos. That's 8-9 Doctrines. More doctrines than your game has room for.
It's a shame that Ultra's didn't get their own Detachment in Angels of Death.
>>47512711
A lot of their MC's have cost, durability, and/or efficacy issues. Their Psychic discipline is pretty lackluster. The lack of assault grenades kills their ability to effectively engage in CC, and their shooting is near universally poor.
They do have some strengths though. Flyrants are bonkers, Mawlocs are pretty good, Hormagaunts are extremely cheap for what they can do (if they had some way to get Assault Grenades they'd be amazing).
>>47512734
Nah its sad that Neither Blood ANGELS or Dark ANGELS got nothing from Angels of death
>>47512734
>It's a shame that Ultra's didn't get their own Detachment in Angels of Death.
The gladius IS their detachment, the thing is called GLADIUS for fucks sake and it helps their tactics. Whats the next thing UM will bitch about? Lack of characters?.
>>47512711
They arent bad, but the top shooting lists are just so much better. Exocrines are good, Flyrants are good, Venomthropes are made irrelevant through ignores cover and weight of dice.
Nids are fine if the best lists werent so over the top stupid. 2 Flyrants is really strong, but then you look at Eldar, Tau formations, SM formations and you can only shake your head.
I really hope 40k gets some balance soon. I want to enjoy playing pick up games again. And hardly anyone around here plays it anymore.
>>47512777
I don't know, but Exocrines seem to fuck my day up pretty well.
Why don't space marines arm and equip their serfs?
Are they not allowed to?
Would be neat
>>47512785
>it helps their tactics
It duplicates their tactics. The Gladius bonus, other than free shit, is the same as the Ultramarines Chapter Tactic. Between that and the Tactical Doctrines from the Demi, Ultramarine players are fucking swamped with the damn things.
>>47512604
How so? Is it the formations? Or what? Because apparently to him Corsairs takes the best options from Eldar and Dark Eldar and makes them cheaper.
>>47512838
>Why don't space marines arm and equip their serfs?
They do. Board a Space Marine vessel or attack their Monastery, and you bet your ass you're gonna have serfs shooting at you with lasweapons.
>>47512777
>Hormagaunts are extremely cheap for what they can do (if they had some way to get Assault Grenades they'd be amazing)
They should probably just count them as having it or the equivalent of it within x amount of feet of a Tervigon.
Could make it a Tervigon upgrade or biomorph.
>>47512777
So do you still take an initiative penalty for assaulting into difficult terrain if you have move through cover?
>>47512919
I might just be biased as a former 'Nids player, but I'd just go all the way and make it so that all Tyranids ignore difficult terrain for movement and assault purposes. Tyranids striking from tyrannoformed flora is a hallmark of Tyranid invasions.
>>47512919
you could just give hormagaunts back beasts as their unit type, it would make them perfect for what they're made for
>>47512971
so all nids have move through cover and assault grenades?
>>47512581
Any feedback on my list, please?
My meta is casual by choice, but we can agree to mid-tier or full-on cheesefest if we want to for a game.
So what if nids could up their armor save by 1?
How much would you cost to go from 6 to 5, 5 to 4, and 4 to 3?
>>47513244
well a majority of the MCs suddenly have 2+ armor, which only a few of them really need
>>47513274
No, I don't want to infringe on the sacred 2+. Its all terminators really got going for them.
>>47512581
General efficiency of the list aside... Why isn't this just a Hunter Contingent? You'd be gaining Coordinated Firepower (better shooting), Unbreakable Bonds (better overwatch) and Ambushes-and-Feints (faster troops).
You'd lose Darkstrider who's underutilised anyway in the team of four Pathfinders, even if they do have rail rifles. You'd lose Shadowsun which sucks for your Commander, but you're saving points for other toys. You're also losing the Remora but that's fine since AA shouldn't really be a problem anyway for blueberries.
Just make the following tweaks the the list:
Put Stealthsuits and Ghostkeel in the Optimised Stealth Cadre.
You had the components so it'd be a shame to not take one of the best formations in the game. With an Ion Raker and Velocity Traker on the Ghostkeel your anti-air and anti-tank just got a major boost.
Keep Strike Teams as they are.
Hunter Contingents make MSU (multiple small units) a priority to get that +1 BS, but one of your teams will need to be max or at least near max to better hide and make use of the Fireblade.
Take a Broadside
Since you need a "heavy" and are lacking in a bit of Str7, a Missileside is the best pick. Sniper Drones are a budget pick if you'd like.
Take a Riptide
Assuming your Ghostkeel will take the Ion Raker you won't have too much AP2. A Riptide will fix this. You may need to cut some serious fat to fit him in though (like taking those bonding knives off the Pathfinders). Otherwise, a suicide suit (twin flamers/twin fusions) could be a good budget pick.
Anyone have any thoughts on skitarii? Thinking of picking up a skitarii army for the lore, cool unit design, etc. I've heard they're pretty good but lack counters to a lot of things.
If anyone is running skitarii I'd be interested to hear your list.
So I need a little help because I'm kind of an idiot. The kind of idiot who plays armies due to a weird passion for them while bending over backwards to not just copy the meta (which becomes surprisingly effective).
As such I've been wondering if there is a way to make the Black Tide work. I was considering it to be best supported by Helbrecth but I'm up for ideas.
>>47513244
Check this out.
https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Codex_-_Tyranids:_/tg/_edition
If I were to swap out my furioso's frag cannon for another arm, what should I put on it? fist with a melta?
>>47513350
It's not a Hunter Contigent because I don't have the units. I built this for various reasons and a strict stealth/sneaky/ambush theme. I also don't like using any vehicles and no crisis suits or anything bigger than the Ghostkeel. Only reason I got it is because I only plan to field one as my Army's centerpiece and I adore the model too much.
It's not meant to focus on winning at all costs, it's purely for theme and fun with sneaky shenanigans. The only things I'd consider adding would be sniper drones (best fit for theme) or more pathfinders/stealthsuits. I don't use the OSC because it's too strong, I don't really believe in formations, they gives the army the bad rep and too easy to abuse.
Thank you for the feedback though, I appreciate it, just wanted to answer your question and clarify.
>>47513334
then make it a biomorph like in 4e
actually nid biomorphs in 4e are really fucking good
>>47513450
Sorry, wanted to clarify. Again, I really appreciate the feedback but I've no plans to change my army's composition, I only want feedback on it's fun, power-level and efficiency as its presented.
>>47513471
How would Nids be if they were brought back to 4E levels, and some new stuff here and there.
>>47512908
Corsairs are better dark eldar. But, craft world eldar are better eldar. Formations, point values, more viable units, etc... nothing will top Eldar in pure cheesery.
I still use models from Assault on Black Reach. Should I replace them with normal models?
>>47513520
What you are describing is basically what >>47513399 is.
>>47513520
4e nids with the additions from 6/7e, minor buffs in the form of either points cost or making things actually worth their points, and some other new shit would be far better off than they currently are now
>>47513450
Thanks for the response.
Well, if you're going for that theme then there's not too much I can suggest apart from very minor equipment tweaks and unit sizes.
As I said, Bonding Knives are near-useless on a 5-man team. Shas'ui are also not very points efficient on smaller teams but the leadership sometimes comes in handy so this is more of a personal opinion.
Never found Positional Relays very useful and I can't imagine that they would be if the Stealthsuits are starting in reserve anyway.
Ideally you want that max 12 Strike Team squad for the Fireblade but it's fine. Even without these tiny changes the list seems functional.
What if melee 'Nidzilla lists were viable? How would you buff them to make them viable?
Here you go nid players, Have a distraction for the next OP image.
>>47513746
HOLY FUCK ITS HUGE.
>>47513767
THAT MEANS IT HAS HUGE GUTS
>>47513676
Sorry, I didn't want to seem as if I'm being ungrateful for your advice and feedback! You did make me think about weapon loadouts, the Commander is very fluid in what I'll give him as out of the 5 choices I picked, all cost 15 points each and I'd never twin-link the ones that can as he's BS5 so it would be redundant. I'm thinking in general, dual missile pods or cyclic ion blasters would be a good all-rounder loadout for him. Dual fusion is facing vehicle heavy, dual plasma if elite infantry like Grey Knights, dual Airbursts for hordes.
>Shas'ui
I agree with you, that's why I removed it from most but I hit the closest to 1500 and I decided to leave it in cause I had nothing else to get really. ICs give the effect anyway so its either give it to a Strike MSU or the Markerfinders. I'd prefer that last guy run off, losing a single shot instead of losing my last potential markerlight, for all the good it would do me.
>Relays
This is purely cause there is legit nothing I could take for the Steasth Shas'vre so figuring I'd outflank 2/3rds of the army and it's cheap.. I don't lose anything.
>Full Strike team
I'd love to, but I simply don't have enough to satisfy this stupid 2 troops demand! Maybe eventually I'll find 3 dudes worth of bits from somewhere and fill it right up!
Thank you. It just seems really fun to play is all. No two games the same, always have something up my sleeve, very thematic and fluffy to both the faction and my Sept etc. I'm not playing against cheesemongers anyway so I don't really need something minmaxed.
>>47513559
4e nids are a clusterfuck though
>>47513870
Also I might scratchbuild some turrets and replace the MSU strike team Shas'ui with Missile pod turrets instead for a wee bit extra punch. Same points so I keep my coherency, though it kindasorta goes against my fluff. Might be able to write something up about them acting as bait for the grand ambush.
>>47513858
Fantastic!
>>47513244
Almost half the army is unaffected and other half becomes a bit more tougher, overall a shitty attempt at fixing an army since armor saves aren't the problem nids suffer
Hey /40k/ I'm new-ish and I have a question about how Plasma Cannons work with SM
>I fired it at a squad of skitarii and I was told that it hits with a small blast template, but when I killed a few they removed the units closest to the cannon, not under the template.
so I know something is fucked here, but what?
>>47514106
Maybe not, but they are probably the reason no one takes warriors or pyrovores.
>>47514107
Its those close to the center then outward on the template... I think.
>>47514132
>pyrovores
nobody takes pyrovores because they're fucking awful all around
>>47514132
>but they are probably the reason no one takes warriors or pyrovores.
People avoid Warriors because S8 just removes whole units and Pyrovores because it basically is a slow as fuck heavy flamer that begs to be blown by S8. A better armor saves would do nothing to fix them
Guess this got missed earlier. Been looking at switching from Sisters to Templars. Is the Black Tide option still doable or should I look at a different build like Sky hammer?
>>47514193
Okay, cause I was thinking why the fuck use the template if they aren't going to affect those under it.
I have nobody to play with.
How do I find people to play with? I'd feel like a retard if I just walked into my gaming store and just starting asking random people if they wanted a game
>>47514107
>>47514193
>>47514272
Barrage weapons hit from the centre, plasma cannons are not barrage so they do take models closest to the firing model.
>>47514208
Got it. Increase T to 5 then.
>>47514346
So you *do* use the template but you take out units closest to the model? The template just dictates how many hits?
>>47514322
>Call your store
>Ask when the best day and time is best to get a game at
>Ask if there are any groups
Some stores have FB pages for you to fire out requests for an opponent.
>>47512696
Imp knights, necrons, ad mech, and Eldar are the fluffy ones. I particularly like the Necron one with a C'tan shard: teaching the whippersnappers about the glories of religion.
>>47514193
Okay, addendum.
>Blast weapons
Models closest to shooter
>barrage blast
Models closest to center of template
besides warriors and pyrovores, what are some other problem units for the tyranids?
>>47514515
Genestealers, Footslogging Tyrants, Carnifexes and Lictors.
If someone were to bring the nerfhammer down hard on the eldar, would you want them to get some minor things in return?
>>47512945
yes.
just changing that though would go a long way too helping nids. Lack of grenades isn't a problem if you don't need them.
>>47514549
I get that genestealers are overpriced, but whats wrong with slogging tyrants, fexes and lictors?
>>47514557
No.
>>47514549
>>47514515
rippers too sadly
>>47514585
They're slow, have poor shooting and aren't tough enough to reach combat reliably.
>>47514557
ideally you'd only nerf them enough ro bring them down too a level playing field and not need to gain anything.
>>47514557
Sure. The Avatar needs a new model and better rules. Other than that, fuck 'em to the ground.
>>47514557
No.
Their BASIC INFANTRY has:
>BS4
>I5
>a 2-shot rending gun
>JSJ, except the play can choose to jump before or after they shoot
Eldar players deserve to get the nerf-bat harder than any race has gotten it before.Yes, even more than 3.5 CSM.
>>47514618
Yeah, but wouldn't it be kind of fucked to print a new codex and receive... absolutely nothing?
>>47514362
Correct unles like I said earlier and it has the barrage special rule
>>47514557
Eldar get CSM'd, they also get plastics for all their infantry.
>>47514598
Can Anyone Second this? anybody else think rippers are "meh"?
would giving them deep strike and allowing them to assault after deep striking help?
>>47514362
yes.
it's a a deliberate move by the devs to prevent people sniping characters and special weapons with blast weapons.
>>47514697
they already can deep strike, but you're right
all they're good for is popping up on objectives in squads of 9
>>47514697
Swarms being immune to instant death would be a good start.
Okay, I'm going to float one last idea:
How would you feel about giving all Tyranid MC's Regeneration/It Will Not Die?
Iron Hands get it on all their vehicles for free
>>47514717
sorry, i mean free deep strike. as is you have to pay for it.
>>47514724
Some units in the game should have eternal warrior through common sense.
>HWT gets hit by an Autocannon shell
>Both gunner and loader die to a single shot
>inb4 double kill with 1 shot, why would it never only kill one guy?
>>47514786
Honestly, the fucking storage box wins this one: armored crate gets stabbed by a force sword, dies instantly. This is the future you chose.
>>47514764
tyranid MCs can already pay for regen, making it free would be nice
>>47513550
there's no need too. people still ruutinely play with 20 year old minis.
>>47513691
give them assault grenades.
make trygons and haruspex move as beasts.
give scything takons rerolls too hit back and drop points costs about 15%
>>47514786
heavy weapon teams can easily just be the gun their manning gets damaged by the attack even if it only kills one or even none of the guardsmen.
>>47512878
>Oh no, we're getting too much of this awesome bonus, whatever will we do now?!
Hey, not sure if this is the right play to ask, but does anyone know how to make maps like pic related?
>>47514557
At best, some minor touch-ups on some of the worse units, but Eldar are in a good enough place that even a severe nerf across the board could still land them at the bottom of top tier.
>>47514671
See: Grey Knights, Inquisition, Sisters of Battle, and Dark Eldar.
>>47514838
I'm not convinced that 'nids (or orks, for that matter) need buffing. It's not that they're that bad, it's that the meta counters them with trivial ease. Other armies just get too good of equipment at too cheap of a price. You'd be better off taking all the ridiculous toys away. It's similar to the problem that a lot of dedicated melee units (particularly Banshees) keep having: they suck, so we buff them. They still suck, so we buff them more. Unfortunately, we don't fix the core problem (which is usually transportation). Now, they suck until the stars align and then rape everything in sight.
>>47514968
Grey Knights not only received nothing we had shit gutted from us.
>>47514786
It's a disconnect between fluff and crunch. In fluff the autocannon would be firing a volley of blasts, probably like a half dozen to a dozen within a few seconds. In game terms, that translates to two rolls to hit and wound.
It's the same reason a storm bolter fires two shots, when in fluff they're described as unleashing torrential volleys of bullets.
>>47514968
nids legitimately did have multiple things taken from them for no real reason and have been worse off because of it
>>47514968
Regardless of Nids power, I find that their current rules are just quite poor and bland. They don't feel like a bunch of genetically modified monstrosities. They lost most of their cool and interesting biomorph options, and it's difficult to make an army of them feel distinct.
It'd be like if you gutted all the aspect warriors from Eldar. Yeah, they wouldn't be much weaker, but they would lose a lot of color and interesting units.
>>47514968
inkinda agree. that's qhy i was more focusing on delivery buffs, and letting them have better support (because you can afford more)
>>47515007
I know. I seem to have a thing for getting fucked by boring, if technically more powerful updates (I play GK and BT). GW seems intent on never letting me play the armies I want, the way I want. At least Librarians and NDK got cheaper. Mind you, that pretty much makes it Codex: Dreadknights, but c'est la vie.
>>47515019
It's more like they had things nerfed for no reason than outright lost them, but it comes out to the same thing. I'm still pretty sure that it would be a solid codex if not for how insane everything else is. I've seen ork and 'nid players absolutely dominate games when the usual toys aren't around. The preponderance of high strength weapons fucks their big guys and the ever-decreasing price per shot on pretty much every weapon for virtually every other army makes hordes impractical. The current state of codexes makes it almost impossible to build a take-all-comers list. They can tailor reasonably well against most armies, but that doesn't mean much.
>>47515054
Orks, CSM, and 'nids are all in about the same place with that. They really just aren't fun. Even if you can get them into a balanced game, there's not much that makes them entertaining. The last time I played a fun game with any of those, it was because the ork player got excited about playing against a legitimate melee army and we ended up with a combat involving about 3500 points of models (everything but the tanks). That was fun.
>>47515098
Yep. Orks, CSM, and Nids all really feel to me like a lot of their problems are more wrapped up in them not feeling like they fit the fluff rather than strictly being a matter of power.
>>47515098
they shouldn't have to tailor a list though, almost every other army can bring pretty much whatever they want and dominate while nids for example pretty much HAVE to bring a flyrant or two to stay above the water
>>47512662
>>buy a special model, get in game bonuses at no extra points cost.
NOPE. Gw can stuff themselves with their pay to win model lately.
>>47513394
My major issue is lack of transports. If someone brings a whirlwind or god help you multiple wyverns, you are going to fold.
>>47515124
I'm reasonably certain that at least CSM could field a valid tournament list. It's just not even vaguely fluffy. I'm pretty sure that an unbound army consisting entirely of single-model units of chaos spawn is essentially unbeatable.
>>47515135
I never said that this is a good thing, only that they technically can. It's not that the codex is unspeakably terrible, but that everyone else's favorite toys kick their asses. More importantly, they're really just not fun.
>>47513858
The top center ultramarine looks like he is licking the carnifex.
CSM are bad because of 3.5. They are still atoning for their sins.
>>47515181
He's trying to steal his memories with his omnomnomophagia.
>>47515136
its a gimicking but inconsequential special character with the extra rules most special characters get. it's not pay too win.
>>47515160
The bottom tier of codexes do suffer from poor synergy and unit role definition, so they could use some buffs in that department.
>>47512469
I-is.... is that Captain America?
>>47515259Heil Hydra.
>>47515251
I think that's more related to GW not giving a damn than anything else. I can't help but notice that all of the armies with the most variety of rules (whether players actually use them or not) tend to be the best. The rules don't even need to be that great. Half of the special rules in the Eldar codex are pointless, but it shows how much time they put into it. What do Orks have? CSM? Tyranids? It feels like GW didn't even try with them. Some designers made some models, sent the pictures to the rules guys, who waited until printing to figure out what they do.
>>47515222
play ultramarines, bring him and marneus calgar in formation. Suddenly 5 uses of tactical doctrine a game.
>>47515259
He's judging how much freedom is in that marine's backside.
>>47515259
New reaction image of the month
>What its like being a bottom tier codex
>>47515286
Didn't help that we got a brief period of blandening, before they reversed that decision halfway through an update cycle.
>>47515300
so like i said. inconsequential.
when your already getting 4 turns of it 1 more isn't a big deal
I don't know shit about Dark Eldar. What tier are they?
>>47515382
It hurts to live tier.
>>47515382
'Still better than orks'-tier
>>47515098
>I'm still pretty sure that it would be a solid codex if not for how insane everything else is.
It really isn't, the internal balance is horrible and I feel like I have been playing the exact same thing for the past 2+ years. I had to pick up another army because I'm getting sick of Tyranids
During my free time, I was thinking of scratch building a Tau manta from plasticard and weapon bits and shit.
Does anyone have any experiences or thoughts about the Manta?
>>47515547
Bad internal balance is a problem with virtually every codex at this point. Even the absolute top-tier codexes have units that will never see play. The boring part is another thing entirely. I've already said that it's probably the worst thing about any of those codexes. It might actually be the biggest problem with 40k. An army that simply isn't fun to play is about as great a failure as you can have.
>>47515639
It is garbage to fight against. I had a warlord, 2 reavers, and the guard and I could do nothing to damage it. Its 4+ save is dumb.
>>47515728
Should I only bring it if completed when everyone is busting out Apoc level shit?
>>47515754
Uh, yes. This isnt your goto troop transport.
I was thinking of grabbing a Culexus assassin for my Skitarii. Only thing I'm worrying about is mobility which Skitarii don't have.
>>47515986
Ally in Inquisition and bring servo skulls and Chimeras.
I know this is batshit crazy, but what do you think? Basically, Give the tankbustas the mekboy junkas, have the trukk boyz get objectives with them, and have a nice firing line going. Maybe I'll get lucky and tellyport some of my guys in, maybe not.
+ HQ +
Big Mek [Choppa, Gift: Da Lucky Stikk, Shokk Attack Gun]
Mekboy Junka (FW) [2x Grot Bomms, 3x Big Shoota, Deff Rolla]
Big Mek [2x Ammo Runt, Choppa, Gubbinz: Mega Force Field, Shokk Attack Gun]
Mekboy Junka (FW) [2x Grot Bomms, 3x Big Shoota, Deff Rolla]
+ Elites +
Burna Boyz [5x Burna Boy]
Tankbustas [10x Tankbusta]
Tankbustas [10x Tankbusta]
+ Troops +
Boyz
Boss Nob [Power Klaw, Slugga]
11x Boy [11x Slugga]
Trukk [Big Shoota]
Boyz
Boss Nob [Power Klaw, Slugga]
11x Boy [11x Slugga]
Trukk [Big Shoota]
+ Heavy Support +
Lootas [15x Loota]
Lootas [15x Loota]
Mek Gunz [5x Kannon]
++ Fortifications and Stronghold Assault (2013) (Fortification Detachment) ++
+ Fortification +
Aegis Defense Line [Ammunition Dump, 6x Barricades]
Aegis Defense Line [Ammunition Dump, 6x Barricades]
>>47514557
I want eldars to be the new orks.
>>47514557
sure who caresthey're all filthy aliens regardless
If a unit with the Infiltrate USR begins the game inside a friendly vehicle, does that vehicle get to Infiltrate now?
Does it matter if it's a dedicated transport or not?
I've heard repeatedly that the wh40k metagame has come to heavily favor shooting over assault since 5th edition. What factors lead to this change. I've read the PHB and a few codexes and it does seem like shooting is by and large a more reliable means of attack, unless you're going massive deep strike to bog down important units in close combat.
>>47516494
Shooting has increased in power and assault hasn't had any improvements in its ability to deliver assault units to their targets.
>>47516465
I'm pretty sure the answer is no
>>47516465
>>47516526
Ok, so my observation about deep striking being an example of an exception to the metagame change was accurate?
>>47516575
Not really, as deep striking is unreliable and you can't charge when you deep strike outside of marines.
>>47516494
Pretty much everything but assault transports got cheaper. Pretty much every codex has a few "don't get within range of this" units. Melee weapon pricing is insane (why the hell does a power sword cost the same as a grav gun?). Attacks are overcosted. Dedicated assault units are overcosted and easy to focus fire.
Basically, the game has moved a long way since 5th, with the exception of assault units and their transports. There's so much good shooting in the game for so cheap that nothing can reliably get into combat and no transport is actually safe (even land raiders just get laughed at now). Once you're in assault, everything changes. Getting there is the hard part.
>>47516614
What the hell in marines (outside of those two formations) can assault out of deep strike?
>>47516667
Those formations are what I'm talking about.
>>47516494
Doesn't help that most things that get troops into assault are vehicles. With the vehicle dmg chart in place, vehicles are very weak in these editions.
>>47514322
You don't look retarded that's normal. It's like showing up at a basketball court asking to play. Totally normal man.
>>47516689
Yeah that's literally what I did today. Walked in, GW manager was like "what up, what you got goin on" I said my point total + army and I got a game as soon as a table was open (granted, it was with a guy I'd met before, but still).
If your local store are fags about it then you don't want to go there anyways.
>>47516687
Honestly, the vehicle damage chart is probably less than half the problem. Spooky d ghosts, haywire everywhere, heavy grav, and meltacide generally make everything with an AV sad. Deep strike anti-tank constantly gets better and anti-vehicle weapons are getting scarier and cheaper. Haywire practically didn't exist not that long ago. Now, mechanicum units hand it out like they have nothing better to do. D weapons are even more obnoxious.
>>47516749
On the other hand, you have MC/GC proliferation. Why the hell are Tau suits not just Jump Walkers with AV values? It makes them resistant to melta for no reason.
>>47516800
I'm starting to wonder if they should just entirely do away with AV next edition. If a fucking crate can have a toughness, why not a dreadnought?
>>47516827
A dreadnought should be tanky. Most TANKS should be tanky. Glancing from small arms shouldn't even really be a thing.
On the other hand, Riptides and Broadsides should be able to be super fucked over by meltaguns. If it happens to Sentinels, why not them?
So basically, switch all the things that have MC to AV and all the AV to MC (except nids, they don't need more pain).
another problem with melee that no one has mentioned thus far is how much better the "to hit" chart is for shooting compared to melee.
>>47516877
It makes sense to me. Two dudes with equal martial ability have a 50/50 shot at hitting the other guy.
>>47516905
Yeah, but you also get cases where a Bloodthirster is just as good at hitting a Grot as your average marine.
Why do a lot of Imperial (especially IG) emblems and stuff contain those weird black and white chessboard-like patterns? Does it mean something?
>>47516877
You do get two rounds of attacks from assault compared to shooting.
>>47516941gork and mork are the only real gods in 40k, that is to appease them
>>47516941
I'm pretty sure that's more of an Ork thing
>>47516865
I'm fine with things like riptides being hard to kill. I'm not fine with things like land raiders being wiped off the board by below-average rolling by a troop choice (looking at you, skitarii). I'd also be fine with more vehicles getting an invuln save. Pretty much every MC has an armor, invuln, and some way of getting FnP. Walkers get...immunity to fleshbane, I guess. Superheavy walkers don't even get IWND, yet GCs get FnP by default.
Even outside of walkers, the difference is ridiculous. The only way that TANKS can match the survivability of an MC is to just hide in cover and even then, they typically have vastly fewer HP than the MC has wounds. Also, ignores cover is significantly more common than things that ignore invulns.
Whats better on forgefiends Autocannons or Ectoplasma cannons?
>>47516975
>>47516994
Being a maulerfiend instead.
I really like the color scheme of classic ultramarines, but at the same time I want a special snowflake original character donut steel chapter so I can write fanfics
Are there any Ultramarine Successors that stuck with the original Ultramarine colors?
>>47516997
>red
Faster
>green
Da best.
>Yellow
Orky
>Checkerz
da best.
imperium of man konfirmed for digga nobz
>>47515382
They're fun, but they're sort of a "deliberate hard mode" army. They can do some pretty cool stuff (Incubi, Archon, Succubus are all pretty great units), but they suffer from the fact that they really are paper thin and tend to explode whenever someone looks at them cross.
They've pretty much always been this way though. Great models, get 'em for the look and the background, not because you can regularly stomp enemies.
>>47516997
huh I never noticed that
>>47516989
That's more a problem with certain MC's than in general.
>>47516941
Back in the 80s, GW designers were really into british punk
>>47517053
Yes, but we all know that when people talk about MCs, they're not talking about fucking carnifexes. MC has almost become an expletive at this point.
>>47517029
Maybe thats why Orks are so bad. Gork and Mork see that Imperials make da biggest and da strongest stompas.
Are you more likely to let somebody make a substitution if they a upgunned instead of underequipped?
>>47515124
Preach. Lack of any kind of Infiltrate beyond Warlord traits on CSM is a damn shame, as is the fact that you basically have to run a Black Legion style army to be able to handle all the cover/outflank/what have you shenanigans that go on now.
>>47512469
what all should I buy if I'm looking to start painting/assembling minis? I kinda wanna do a World Eaters army.
>>47516989
pop your smoke, scrube
>>47517150
Models
Glue
Xacto knife
>>47517179
should i just use the citadel stuff?
>>47517134
vanilla CSM used to have infiltrate. (In DoW Vidya anyway)
>>47517170
>ignores cover
>snapshooting
>>47517170
Okay, I'm popping my one use only smoke I paid 15 points for.
>2 markerlights
>>47517017
Why do you like them?
In my experience they get shot up before they get to assault.
While with a FF might get two turns to shoot before dying.
>>47517150
You will need
>Clippers
>Hobby Knife
>a few brushes
>Primer (black is good for beginners, white is good for vibrant colors)
>Paints
>Plastic glue (using normal super glue on plastic models isn't preferred - plastic glue gets a better bond and doesn't leave seams)
>and of course some models
Also watch some of Duncan Rhode's videos on youtube for general painting advice.
>>47517192
citidel stuff is fine
>>47512778
Testify
>>47517028
Just make up your own that does exactly that?
>>47517192
Models and glue, yes (to start). Buy the models on ebay New In Box, they're GW but cheaper than in store. Get tools from anywhere but GW. GW plastic glue is great.
>>47512878
Boo hoo every turn we reroll every one, and often every miss entirely
>>47517150
Get a set of paints that complement your army. Get an exacto knife, an razor knife, recasting gear if you want to recast, minis and a set of brushes. I recomend getting stuff at the moment that isn't in the battle for vedros set (https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Vedros ) as it's going to be launching soon. I also recomend getting this set of brushes(http://www.amazon.com/Hobby-Starter-Mega-Brush-Set/dp/B00HC8H4EI?ie=UTF8&fpl=fresh&redirect=true&ref_=s9_simh_gw_g21_i1_r ), as they are far cheeper then GW's and of as good or superior quality. As far as paints go, GW makes nice stuff but paint pots are kinda shit, they don't close well and dry out. Transfer the paitns to dropper bottles or get stuff that's already in them, like vallejo's stuff. If you have a hobby lobby nearby, they sell model paints for cheep. You need acrylic paints for it. As far as clippers go, use some cheep ones that fit you well, I use some radio shack wire cutters.
>>47517192
If you want. The only stuff worth though paying citadel prices is the sprue cutters and some paints. Mepheston and shaders are some of the few paints worth gw price.
>>47517241
Forgot to mention, GW's plastic glue is great. Use it for assembling the majority of your models.Plastic cement is also good. If you're assembling resin models or metal ones, use gorilla glue or loctite, I prefer the former.
>>47517212
That's what I am thinking
>>47513412
Why not.
>>47517206
I never said that I necessarily liked them, only that I find them preferable to FF. Maulerfiends are a whole lot cheaper and are fast enough to actually make it to combat, if you take a couple. The thing with FF is that they come in two varieties: too expensive and too inaccurate. Neither one of them does enough work to justify their cost. Maulerfiends at least have the chance, due to being cheap and able to break open most things. They're great at killing vehicles (something the rest of the codex is surprisingly bad at) and the just-sub-MC class of things (like centurions and other low-mid toughness, multi-wound units).
>>47517208
>>47517230
>>47517241
any recommended armies for a beginner? I noticed GW's big 100'th new shop in NA is actually the closest one to me. Should I check that place out?
I'm kinda blown away by how much everything costs, I picked up Total War Warhammer, decided to look into AoS, then found 40k
>whoa, that's cool
what about Forgeworld? Are they any better priced?
>>47517241
I've never had a problem with the current GW paint pots, just make sure they are fully closed. I've also never liked dropper bottles - way easy to get too much paint on the pallet and they are a pain to shake up unless you put a bead in the bottle. Now the old GW screw tops were shit.
Also I find wire cutters are usually super thick and don't get a precise cut. I don't remember the brand of clippers I use, but they are some super slim model clippers, bought them off amazon probably.
>>47517325
Start Collecting boxes are the best potential value, better if you can find them at a discount on ebay or whatever.
Best armies for beginners in terms of ease of play are probably Marines or Necrons, as they're more durable and forgiving of mistakes, although it's best you pick something you like.
Any armies that caught your eye?
>>47517325
>FW
>better priced
kek
Get start collecting boxes from ebay. They're generally way cheaper than GW.
Also, while I wouldn't start with this, eventually look into china for recasts. Far cheaper, and sometimes even better quality than forgeworld. But again, DON'T START THERE. And try to support your local store if you play there frequently.
>>47517325
If you go there they will sell you something.
You said you like Chaos Marines right?
If so, check out the Dark Vengeance starter set. It comes with a bunch of sweet Chaos models, the core rule book, and a bunch of Dark Angels you can practice on, convert to chaos, sell, give to a friend, whatever.
Forge World ranges from about the same to more.
About the price: It is easy to get sticker shock, but if you measure value by hours of entertainment it is way better than a 60 dollar video game that you finish in 8 hours and be done with
>>47517325
Check it out. Read 40k fluff. Find out what you like.
Battle for vedros is around the corner, I recomend waiting to do a major purchase until then if you want a space marine or a ork army now, just get and start working on a transport.
>>47517331
Different strokes for different folks, anon. https://www.radioshack.com/collections/maker-parts-kits/products/radioshack-4-5-mini-diagonal-cutters?variant=5717833157 is what I use.
I've been wanting to start an Imperial Guard army, and I absolutely love the Deathkorps models, so that's what I'll be using. Is it better to take them from the Imperial Armor lists, or should I make them as a standard IG list and "counts as"?
>>47517369
You laugh, but at one point it was cheaper to buy devestators off of FW then GW
>>47517353
In no particular order
>Imperial Guard/Astra Militarium
I was a big fan of the Guant's Ghosts novels, but didn't realize they and 40k was a mini wargame hobby thing
>World Eaters
>Ultramarines
>Imperial Fists
>Death Guard (pre-heresy)
>Cypher Fallen Angel
and Tau look kinda cool but at the same time kinda meh.
I enjoy Orks but I wouldn't take them seriously.
>>47517369
>>47517382
>>47517406
I've read up on 40k lore, I've never realized there was this wargaming hobby behind it. I thought it was just a really well put together sci-fi setting et al Star Trek, Star Wars, etc.
>>47517428
Gaunts ghosts has some oop tanith models. Gaunt might also have his own stat block
>>47515259
>>47517325
Pick what you think is coolest. Unless you want to compete in tournaments or something you can have fun with anything.
They're expensive models, but other models are not really that much cheaper, and for how much time you spend assembling, painting, and playing with them it's not that bad honestly. Also I got my first stuff back in 1997 and still use most of them.
>>47517203
>paid 15 points for
>being this new
>>47517462
>>47517489
is there an army book/rules for a Deathwatch army? I found this Deathwatch overkill box game and really like how the models are built, can they be used in the tabletop?
Would it be legal/battleforged/ITC-able to have an 1850 list that includes a Nemesis Strike Force, a 1st Company Task Force, and an Oathsworn Detachment?
>>47517518
ITC
Can't wait until new FAQ shits all over their little rules back.
>>47517509
I believe Dark Angels can use Deathwatch as elite units, but you can't have a Deathwatch army (Well you can have a DA army full of Deathwatch, but have some variety, man)
>Disclaimer, I don't field DA so the above stated should be taken with a pinch of salt
>>47517509
They have rules for the tabletop, though I don't think you can have an army only of them, as they're all technically listed as unique characters and thus you can't double up. Easy to include them in a full marine force though.
>>47517602
>>47517623
Rules were made for loopholes gents, what books should I pick up? There are like 9 pages of them, and is what the other anon said about it being DA only true? Or is it any marine army?
I probably need a codex and do I need a general rulebook, or is that included with the Codex?
>>47517665
Rulebook is sold in a bundle with lore and hobby books, so just torrent it lol
OR, if you want to do DA, then GW has some starter box sets with a compact version of the rules plus some DA marines and C:SM units too.
Frankly, if you watch some youtube videos on the gameplay (like miniwargaming) and pick up on the basics, all you really need is a codex and players are usually chill enough to help you through the rest.
>>47517602
>I believe Dark Angels can use Deathwatch as elite units
You mean Deathwing? Because those are two completely different things.
>>47517665
Read a fucking book then, the anon above is why you should never learn something by having random fucks regurgitate wrong info to you, its playing the telephone game with knowledge and you're gonna get shit wrong.
As far as deathwatch goes the list of Overkill is the only thing that they have now, there's an apoc formation for them.
>>47517725
>read a fucking book then
when the books cost 30-50 dollars a piece I prefer to not buy all of them at once to find a single piece of information. Sorry it bothers you?
>>47517725
Deathwing, yeah.
>>47517754
It bothers me more that you cant use the internet to find it, I mean, its on the OP for fucks sake. You have no excuse.
Anyone recommend any good 40k fluff books?
>>47517848
I've literally never looked into anything except Wizards of the Coast's Star Wars miniatures wargaming wise, and that was about 8 years ago.
I was looking for a decent starting point. thanks for providing that I guess.
>>47517891
enforcer
double eagle
space marine
ignore the horus heresy series
>>47517891
Gaunts ghosts before anything else. Its one of the first paving stones that lead to 40k using what terminology it uses today like vox and promethian. Great stories too.
>>47514671
A huge problem is that the creators are knife-ear fanwankers who consider the race superlative in every area, and this is most important, including efficiency.
The Craftworlds writers went unchecked in handing out D-weapons (particularly flamers--ugh), but if they were priced appropriately, fielding them would be a risk in terms of points investment/concentration for Eldar players. Unfortunately, they carried "Elves a best" outside of the fluff and into game balance. That's why it's 20 points more than a KFF Morkanaut for a GMC that would literally never die against one in round 1 of a CC with the worst rolls ever, & can out-shoot it with superior weapons to boot.
Another thing besides easy access to great shooting, Deep Strike/Outflank, undercosted weapons & GMCs & D-shooting, is that CC is inherently weaker than shooting. Think of a close combat D-weapon.
You probably thought of a superheavy's weapon, didn't you? Only some Daemons & occasional MCs get melee D weapons outside of shooting. Otherwise, most factions can only count on D in CC on what used to be Apocalypse units. It costs any faction not only the points, but the tactics to get the D-wielder into CC safely.
But shit, Eldar got facial-ed with a D-gun bukkake, & don't even know what to do with all the unparalleled access to (undercosted) D-guns dripping all over them.
There's no tabletop challenge they can't carelessly swim right through; not even swarms can stand a chance, since D-flamers.
But if those fuckers were 150 points each, my Eldar buddy would think twice before rushing them up the board in view of my Lootas.
Stompa should be 450-500 points vanilla (without even my balances/improvements), & the WK ought to be 500 easy before upgrades.
>>47517891
What faction do you like?
>>47512662
Cute fluff piece.
No points
NO FoC slot
No replacement blurb
Can't be fielded
>>47518220
Son, calm down. All of this anger gave me a little boost to keep trucking on in the night. Use that hate and unleash it in an Orky form of pic related when the time is right.
>>47518220
haha imagine actually having D weapons
>>47518360
I'm interested in pretty much every faction in 40k. It's nice having some light scifi and just wanted to know some good books for any faction.
>>47512469
so i picked this up for 5 bucks.
>>47518435
i only bought him because he looks so cool.
i don't even like Sallys that much.
>>47518435
>>47518448
That is a pretty stylin' Sal
>>47518480
i kinda want this Draigo too, but I really need to stop buying named characters I don't have armies for.
>>47518411
>CSM
Night Lords Trilogy and Storm of Iron
>Space Elves
Path of Eldar and Path of Dark Eldar Trilogies
>IG
Gaunts Ghosts and CIAPHAS CAIN HERO OF THE IMPERIUM
>SM
First 3 Heresy books
Technically 40k is Science Fantasy :^)))
>>47518411
>>47518546
in addition the last chancers books are good for IG
>>47518411
>Orks:
Deff Skwadron
>>47517518
Why don't you just check the ITC rules yourself? Unless you're illiterate, but in that case have your handler check for you instead of typing posts on 4chan.
>>47517293
concept for backstory
>Guilliman's Fists
>Around 40345 a young regional lord with a lot of inherited wealth has a vision, believing he should spend his inheritance on founding a space marine chapter
>so he sponsors an ultramarines successor
>By 40999 the chapter has grown to have over two full companies
>still sponsored by the descended of nobles
>has a thing for mk8 armor, and most of the 1st company cool kits get custom armor, lots of "veterans" with expensive wargear, etc
>Classic ultra colors, checker patterns, hazard stripes on power fists, red weapons, etc
>>47518677
I'm not sure if a regional lord has the funding to bankroll an entire marine founding, especially to the degree that they have Ultra levels of bling.
>>47518716
maybe they didn't fund the entire founding then
the founding was going to happen regardless, but they threw enough money at it to get a chair on the board and the get the marines some bling
Fuck, I thought I was done with Eldar. They have so much cheese...
I need to make a note of it for tomorrow.
Is there ever any reason to take a Tripartite Lance Knight formation at 1850 points? Or is the Baronial Court just flat out better? I've got a Gallant, Crusader, and Warden for my 30k army, but I want to make an 1850 list (I have Grey Knights, Imperial Fists, and Imperial Knights) that can actually win a semi-competitive game.
How many modern pieces of self-propelled artillery equals a Riptide (assuming that the range of the gun is larger than on the tabletop)?
>>47516184
>batshit crazy
I say go even further
>Shokk and Awe
Great WAAAAGH Detachment
HQ
Big Mek (SAG, Thinking Kap)
- Mekboy Junka (SAG)
Big Mek (SAG)
- Mekboy Junka (SAG)
Elites
Mekboy Junka (SAG)
Mekboy Junka (SAG)
Mekboy Junka (SAG)
Mekboy Junka (SAG)
Mekboy Junka (SAG)
Troops
10 Spanna Boyz
10 Spanna Boyz
Combined Arms Detachment
HQ
Big Mek (SAG)
Elites
9 xTankbustas
9 x Tankbustas
Troops
10 x Gretchin
10 x Gretchin
1844 points. 10 Shokk Attack Guns. Maximum insanity.
>>47518922
Piggybacking off of this: this is the list I've been messing around with that uses the models I already own
1841/1850
Nemesis Strike Force
HQ
1 x Librarian, ML3, Stave, Stormbolter, 140 pts
1 x Librarian, ML 3, Stave, Stormbolter, 140 pts
Troops
5 x Terminators, Halberds, Hammer, Psycannon, 203 pts
5 x Terminators, Halberds, Hammer, Psycannon, 203 pts
Heavy Support
1 x Dreadknight, Psycannon, Incinerator, Hammer, Teleporter, 220 pts
1 x Dreadknight, Psycannon, Incinerator, Hammer, Teleporter, 220 pts
Imperial Knight Oathsworn Detachment
1 x Knight Gallant, Meltagun, 330 pts
1 x Knight Warden, Thunderstrike Gauntlet, 385 pts
How much dangerous is to overcharge a weapon on a vehicle compared to infantry?
>>47519564
do you mean gets hot?
>>47519637
Yes.
>>47519640
Vehicles have a 4+ save vs gets hot.
>>47519640
well thereis a 1/6 chance it occurs and then a vehicle has a 4+ save against that, so its a 1/12 chance of losing one hullpoint. Per Shot Mr 5 Plasmashot executioner.
Short version, dangerous if you are already on your last hullpoint, or if you use many Gets Hot shots.
>>47517128
I always let my opponent make last minute changes before the game starts, and since I am the only one well versed in the rules, i often help them too, at least on the gear side, because sure, field what you want, but some choices are just so mind blowing shit that, they are straight up trap choices.
I play Tau, and the only way any of us can have slightly fun and interesting games requires that people don't take batshit insane options, like over-kitted melee comissars or stupid shit like that.
It seems to work, anyway. People are getting gradually better, and I don't really mind the "list-tailoring" this allows. I have fielded the same army since late 5th, and have no plans on making a new list, so they know what I am bringing anyway.
What would be the equivalent of a self-propelled howitzer or mortar for the Tau, An Ionhead or something else?
>>47519763
Yeah that's probably as close as they get.
>>47518637
My boy.
