>Pay your respects edition
Discuss the viability of the Warcraft universe as a tabletop RPG setting. Have fun, don't go full autist, and keep your cool. This is not /v/ or /vg/. Keep your asspain to yourself.
>Previous thread:
>>46651205
Reminder to help and support our guys stand up to shitvannas, the burning legion and general stupidity.
>>46667404
you're that guy that did the policemen edits right
>>46667454
Yes, if the bad paint ms didn't tip you off.
Can anyone tell me why the Ebon Blade remade the four horsemen, and why Nazgrim supposedly is one of them?
>>46667502
>Can anyone tell me why the Ebon Blade remade the four horsemen
To be a powerful weapon against the Legion.
>why Nazgrim supposedly is one of them?
They were pretty sure he would accept.
>>46667502
Defending the azeroth citizen!
Don't question.
>>46667491
keep going then
>>46667502
Because Azeroth need silent protectors, watchful gardians ... dark knights
>>46667516
So it's pretty much just to use old characters that people liked before they died?
>>46667557
I wouldn't say so, no.
BREAK YOURSELVES UPON MYDIAMOND COCK.
>>46667346
[F]
>>46667346
>Go to his tomb
>See a DK with a crowbar
What do?
>>46667608
Give this gentleman defending Azeroth's freedoms a thumbs up.
>>46667502
>Remade the four horsemen
Wait what. Any good place I can catch on the major lore points seen/datamined from Legion so far?
They better fix Whitemane's hair so that it's actually white.
Wait what the fuck happened
Can someone give me the quick version of how varian died and how the DK's are now full SS mode?
>>46667775
Just wait for Legion.
>>46667775
I just saw it on Wowpedia, but it's a new group consisting of Tirion Fordring, Nazgrim, Thoras Trollbane and Sally Whitemane according to the wiki.
>>46667859
They're not in SS mode they're just gonna make the Scourge great again
>>46667905
details pls!
Turned into belf slut
wat do
>>46667346
Question in chronical it mentioned that to kill a demon you need to have it killed in the twisting nether or in area where their energies heavily influenced, so would that mean to execute demons on planet you would have place srt up to be the literal chop block for demons? Like a scaled down fel wood to a building or something
>>46667988
Suck dick for free gold.
>>46667988
Death grip, asphyxiate a wizard and detain him.
>>46667346
*spit*
When the hell did Warcraft lore become such a shitfest? I played WC3 and TFT, and a little of WoW vanilla and TBC, and it seemed to be fine at the time.
What happened?
>>46668187
same as Dragon ball z
>>46668187
Inconsistent goals of the writers coupled with the continuous need of justifying new content.
The content had to be as inclusive as possible while somehow being related to established enemies so the authors had to extremely twist the lore around to justify having both Horde and Alliance go after the same evilguy.
Hope that helps.
Question:
Having race/class combo specific skillsets available was a largely approved feature.
Which such skillsets would you create for tabletop?
>>46667502
>Can anyone tell me why the Ebon Blade remade the four horsemen,
to protect you of course, don't look into it
>and why Nazgrim supposedly is one of them?
TIP OF THE SCOURGE SPEAR, NO GREATER HONOR
>>46668187
BC was where it all began by making Illidan a nutjob, Kael a supervillain, and completely retconning Draenai and Eredar lore. Not to mention the naaru bull.
>>46667977
jesus just read the fucking thread
>tfw playing DK
>tfw getting shit done
Sylvie's head on a platter soon.
>>46668465
>Get our guy from her clutches
>Eventually she becomes a raidboss
>Everyone expects pandalands2.0
>Koltira and Thaussarian drop by and just behead her right there
>Every shitvanasfaggot goes nuclear
10/10 metzen u got my coke money
Now, maybe I've missed a few things about the lore, but how did an ORC, became the lich king?
I understand how he hot his powers and all, but it seems like a weird transition. The legion is fire, demons and whatnot, brutality basically.
And suddenly, an orc,the embodiment of brutality, gets the power over death and ice? I would have understood something closer to the Eredars honestly.
Especially since, for me, liches were always humans.
>>46668636
The legion buttfucked his asshole inside out.
Chained him to ice and told him "suck a dick, nathrezim gonna be your jailer"
>>46668636
wc liches were initially orcs.
They were ner'zhuls dark shamans.
![Angry+marines+are+angry_40c3f8_5287204[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/j6t3ZOV.jpg "Angry+marines+are+angry_40c3f8_5287204[1].jpg")
>>46668465
> tfw living in a world where death knights can theorically hijack a Burning legion felship and crash it down
Fuck I'm hyped
>>46668397
It didn't become really terrible until the retarded fucking Death Knight class and THERE MUST ALWAYS BE A LICH KING in WotLK. That's when you realized that balance and sense had no more place in the setting.
>>46668387
I feel that humans get the extra feat, orcs get a free rage like a barbarian. Trolls I could see getting extra action for three rounds when they frenzy, tauren are able to either have a buff to hp or use their stomp thing to stun for a full round, dwarves get immunity to poison n disease, Jeez I don't know what some others night be really
>>46668714
Humans don't get extra feat.
Get once a day immunity to any effect.
>>46667598
>Figures the one time i forgot my hood it would rain
>im standing next to jane
>i dont like jane
>good lord cathy smells like orc dick even in this rain
>This weapon hurts my hand
>why cant i just ride a battle cat
>i would rather be at home prancing about smelling of lavender and rose buds
>>46667874
God dammit when did Tirion die?
>>46669104
I think during the Legion Paladin weapon quest
>>46668808
Joke is appreciated, but I feel I must intervene on that last part
>Savage nocturnal wood elf who impressed even Grom with their murderboner
>Smelling of anything but sweat from constantly strangling invading shits and the blood of their slain enemiesWhy did BZ forget how hardcore NElves were?
>>46669139
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YVwYKtgFYCc
Haven't played since finishing the Green Fire quest on my lock, felt like that would be a good ending spot for her.
Do we get anything cool in Legion?
>>46669139
Because their players are colossal faggots.
>>46669262
butthurt hordie detected.
>>46669139
>nelves
>hardcore
>ever
>>46669254
Affliction gets the scythe of the first necrolyte, Demo gets a floating skull, Destro has the scepter of Sargeras. We have a demon world as a class hall, and the Eredar Twins as followers.
>>46668745
So take the mmo abilities and tweak into pnp format?
>>46669313
Yes.
>>46669305
NOBODY is suspicious of this right eh?
>>46669254
Demo is finally shaping up to be an interesting spec, but they've flat out murdered affliction
>>46668187
The sort of storytelling that an Expansion-Based MMO tend to have is the same that comic books do: Everything has to be the status quo, except when you kill off a character or make them evil for shock value.
>>46668636
He was a shaman, yeah?
They did a lot of work with spirits and such, so that's not too much of a stretch.
And he knew how the Elements worked, so he probably made whatever Air and/or Water Elementals that lived in Northrend his bitch so he could have better control over the place.
>>46667502
Kel'Thuzad was bored and has a sense of irony
>>46669362
Which is a shame because I love playing afflic lock just so I can have the full set of verdant spheres behind me at all times.
>>46669574
No sign of the spheres either. Locks aren't allowed to have anything nice
>>46668187
Things held together largely up until the end of Wrath of the Lich King. TBC had a few questionable decisions (the madness of Illidan, Kael'thas, the Draenai/Eredar retcon), but worked. Wrath was strong throughout, with perhaps exception to be made to the Horde belligerence to the Alliance in Northrend (we're facing an enemy who raised the dead? LET'S MAKE MORE CORPSES! LOK'TAR OGAR!).
Cataclysm is where things start to fall over, for two main reasons I feel. First, huge amount of effort went into rebuilding the game world to allow flight, and to update/improve the zones in Azeroth. This meant that new storylines had to be assembled, new quests had to be written, not to mention the physical changes to the world, all diverting attention away from adding 'new' content for levels 80-85.
Second, and this is more important; they had finished the storylines begun in WC3. Arthas was no more. Illidan was dead. Kael'thas was double-dead. They needed to have a big-name bad guy, but pulling the Legion out would have seemed rushed, given that we really dealt a blow to them by defeating Kil'jaeden in the Sunwell.
So, Deathwing, and the Twilight's Hammer. As enemies go, not the worst, but it was irritating to have to deal with *yet another* cult hidden in society (having had to deal with the Cult of the Damned during Wrath, I'd have thought we would have gotten very good at spotting such things). Add a dash of Old Gods, and there we go. Expansion done, right?
Nope! Gotta shoe-horn in some good ol'Alliance versus Horde conflict in there! With a literal apocalypse unfolding around them, let's have the two sides slaughter each other!
Oh wait, scratch that, let's have the Horde pull of great victories, while the Alliance struggle to survive even in their home territories. I shall admit to being biased, but the Horde storylines (not to mention the map changes, such as destroying Southshore) have the Alliance generally losing everywhere, and badly.
>>46669350
We are not warlocks, we are fire mage!
>>46669591
In the fucking demon based xpac.
I am not sure how I feel about all specs going back to a soul stone resource. I liked each spec feeling completely different then the others because it gave me more variety per character. In a pure DPS class that is important.
On the other hand, I do agree somewhat with trying to bring the specs back in line with the warlock concept. Question is though do we want the warlock to be just one concept?
>>46669654
If you sac your pet as destruction spec you are in fact a superior fire mage.
>>46669646
yeah right. what they actually need to do is focus on the alliance v horde angle (like the original warcraft games basically) and have some other interesting lore plots going on in the background to spice things us
but then cuck faggots like you would complain because your pet fantasy niggers would be dying
>>46669702
> complaining about the war being completely one-sided
> is a faggot
fanboy like you need to die first for the world to clear up.
>>46669665
I think them all sharing a resource is fine when affliction and destro generate them similarly to how they used to. What's not fine is affliction going from the attrition spec to burst for some godforsaken reason
>>46669735
>complaining about the war being completely one-sided
what is this supposed to mean? i didnt say anything about a one sided war
one sided war is what we have now with da good community leader orcs ass raping ally every chance they get
the fucking 9/11x100 the alliance with literally now serious repercussions
>>46669749
I'm ok with it going back to being a dot-n-dash spec. Having to channel what used to be a finisher spell to get the most out of the spec is just not my style.
>>46669767
>now
i mean no
>>46669646
I'm on a rant now.
The Alliance storylines, by contrast, seemed incomplete (Sentinel Hill eternally on fire, Twilight Highlands intro being a joke), and also seemed only to serve as a mechanism to lose us characters (High Priest Benedictus going evil with next to no foreshadowing, for instance, or Malfurion being a neutral force despite the Horde invasion of Ashenvale).
The writing going into Pandaria was mixed. Theramore getting exploded was ridiculous, and the game seemed to then relish making Jaina out to be some mad person for wanting revenge after she was betrayed by the Blood Elves.
On the plus side, Pandaria was a nice change of pace. A little preachy at times, mind you.
Then the Siege of Orgrimmnar, where Blizzard really, really fucked up. So, Garrosh goes Orc-supremacist, building up an army in secret that could challenge the Alliance+rest of the Horde despite the war on seemingly every front at once, we storm the city, defeat his army and...
...the Alliance chose not to disband the Horde. They actively let the Horde continue to exist, with a vague warning that they'll be watching. No truce, no treaty, no reclaiming of lost territory while the Horde attempts to regroup, nothing. Orgrimmnar isn't even damaged in game, while Stormwind is still on fire from Cataclysm. Good game, Blizzard.
We don't even kill Garrosh, which leads into Blizzard successfully managing to retcon the past of the Warcraft games so badly I cannot be bothered to list the problems with it. Needless to say Warlords of Draenor managed to make some of the most interesting characters in the series dull, and the world they came from make no sense whatsoever.
>>46667598
>that sameface
>>46669829
>Malfurion being a neutral force despite the Horde invasion of Ashenvale).
what alliance heroes arent neutral at this point? only horde heroes are allowed to like and support their people. otherwise thats racist
>>46669855
we still have Jaina.If blizzard kill her due to blood elf whining I am gonna be mad.
>>46669702
You appear to have mistaken me for a Horde player.
I played Alliance primarily. I just found the times that Blizzard have attempted to write the conflict between the Horde and Alliance recently to be so piss-poor that it beggars belief.
Cataclysm was a joke, Pandaria started off reasonable (untapped resources, potential new allies etc), but jumped the shark by the end. In Warlords, the split between the Alliance and Horde is beyond pointless, and yet there is still war between the two parties on Draenor itself.
>>46669874
Jaina is going to be a dungeon/raid boss, for sure. She left Dalaran very angrily when Khadgar made it neutral again.
>>46669874
yeah but thats also a recent development. dont forget she betrayed her dad and the alliance just to try to get some BIG GREEN COCK
>>46669829
>Horde is constantly made out to be the bad guy
>Horde players don't even get to play it straight because Blizzard is too lazy to go full faction war so Garrosh has to be objectively evil and not just violent and pro-Horde
the Alliance is always right
the Horde always wins
>>46669874
Jain is such a big fan favorite that if she get's killed off blizzard will lose subs
>>46668396
Is that the new meme for Warcraft like the set backs?
>Tip of the Thunderlord spear, no greater honor.
>>46669908
>everything must be about sex and parents
thanks freud.
>>46669894
I can't wait to see blood elf avatars rejoicing on the story forums
Anyone browse the story forums here?
>>46669908
how often do you think metzen wakes up in a cold sweat in the middle of the night because he wasnt able to push the "jaina bred by thrall" plot?
>>46669574
>>46669591
>>46669665
I think the removal of spheres was because Fire mages get non-fel versions of them.
(Though they currently only have one that shows, and it floats statically over the left shoulder, making everything feel annoyingly off-center.
>>46669933
Sure the stories is how the elves are gonna try and kill each other for nonexistent noble points.
>>46670014
The sad part is that if it was done in the right manner, it could work for better, like its just a political marriage to unite Kalindo more, and then it makes Gilneas and the other broken kingdoms get more mad that she done such a thing in the first place, without thinking that her position close to horde territory could end in total destructuion for her city and people.
>Thrall and Jaina marry
>Political shenanigans, backstabbing, breaking of alliances, making of alliances, fucking your own anbassator.
>Thrall continue doing his shit
>Jaina does her shit
>They have one house they "live together", but are always out into their respective cities governing, actually never used the couple bed.
>Some gnome makes a fanfic tier statue of them together
>>46669924
the only thing I remember about Nazgrim is him saying TIP OF THE HORDE SPEAR, NO GREATER HONOR every time I clicked on him
>>46669855
Its almost like BZ is pushing SJW agenda
Wait a minute...
>>46670392
what the fuck is that even supposed to mean?
>>46669909
Horde IS the bad guy since WC1
>>46670014
I want to hug Jaina and tell her everything is going to be alright.
>both of her crushes turn evil
>a friend that made her seek peaceful coexistence with horde leaves in his place a stereotypical orc warlord
>her city state gets nuked
>the other city state she's in charge of gets abused for more horde shenanigans
>probably about to end up as a raid boss dropping welfare epics
Being Jaina is suffering.
>>46670413
Orcs being "poor oppressed race" and therefore everything they do is fine
Humans being "evil oppressive white guy race" and therefore they should be sorry about everything they do.
Just from the top of my hat.
>>46670449
Not really. It's aspiring to be good guys in WC3 (Thrall listens to Medivh right away, unlike Arthas and Terenas) and is portrayed as ambiguous in WoW, just like any other country pursuing their interest. Theramore bombing is unambiguously evil though, and it's not addressed until that bell fiasco.
>>46670509
>Orcs being "poor oppressed race" and therefore everything they do is fine
That has more to do with the fanbase being rabid fanboys than any agenda
>humans are rayciss
and well justified too. Don't conflate blatant fanboyism with agenda pushing. Blizzard devs are just riding the edge carousel.
>>46670509
You spend too much time on /pol/.
If Blizzard wanted to deliver Orc = oppressed minorities narrative, they would definitely not let them be aggressors, much less deploy weapons of mass destruction.
Alliance players are SUPPOSED to be outraged at those actions and to sympathise with Jaina.
>>46670583
and the horde players are suppose to support the deploy of WMD as we see on forums?
The other I can think about is the Aggra things.
"all your learned from human is stupid! orc culture superior! you are stupid!"
>>46670583
I think some of Blizzard wants to keep the WC3 style orcs, but with Metzen busy on Overwatch Kosak's WC1/2 necrophiliac faction has taken over much of the Horde and Orcs in general.
>>46670671
No, it was supposed to be their crowning cunning. The horde in the lore was constantly supposed to be on the backfoot, against the alliance's tech superiority. Garrosh doing that was a big slap in the alliance's face and was to show that the horde was on equal footing.
>>46670509
/pol/ and its victim-complex
>>46670701
so you are saying the Horde players were suppose to cheer about them having WMD and use it
>>46670734
I don't read /pol/ at all.
I don't live in US and have no interest in US politics.
>>46670909
>I don't live in US and have no interest in US politics.
I think that is better for all of us, love.
>>46670909
>so you are saying the Horde players were suppose to cheer about them having WMD and use it
Yes, it was their big whoop moment in lore.
They were nazi germany tier who followed hitler when he led germany to victory in the battle of france.
>>46670970
I only heard of the SJW stuff from the siege of dragonspear thing.
Sounded bad.
>>46671014
wait, are you saying Horde players are like nazi german supporter?
>>46671014
>Yes, it was their big whoop moment in lore.
>They were nazi germany tier who followed hitler when he led germany to victory in the battle of france.
except for the part where they're forced to disagree with it so they could also do SoO
Siege of Stormwind when
>>46671053
>wait, are you saying Horde players are like nazi german supporter?
people like being winners. The germans supported hitler when they were winning didn't they?
>>46671071
Don't worry, Jaina will become a raidboss and be fel tainted.
She dared not to help the horde, its like another Shoah.
>>46671071
When the Alliance wipe out half of Horde's occupied area clean.
which is never.
>>46670671
>and the horde players are suppose to support the deploy of WMD as we see on forums?
No, that's just edgy kids being edgy kids. It's kind of sad really.
>>46669829
>Disbanding the Horde.
>While half of your forces are of the Horde.
You mistake the intervention in a civil war with an invasion.
>>46670671
The US is the only country hat used WMD in a war.
And people still like them.
Dumb people do dumb shit, nothing new.
>>46671278
The horde being disbanded as a political structure was a sound move.
>>46671342
Impossible because of what it would do to player characters though.
Conceivably it could just replace old horde with new horde, or something with different name but identical form and function.
Anything else is just not gonna happen. The players chose their sides, and those sides will remain separated for all time.
>>46671342
Offering absorption into a full Hordeliance/AlHordance would have been a good idea.
An actual formal international body for dealing with cross-border issues.
Either way I don't think there's any point in setting a game post Cataclysm.
>>46671456
yes, but in universe and lore wise it makes perfect sense.
>>46671341
Technically, chemical weapons are considered WMD's, and those got thrown around like candy by both sides in WW1.
>>46670671
>The other I can think about is the Aggra things.
>"all your learned from human is stupid! orc culture superior! you are stupid!"
Fucking Aggra trying to manually rebuild Thrall's character. Now that he's going through his crisis of faith in Legion, he's going to turn to Aggra for support, who is going to change his character further.
>>46672012
I still think Jaina and Thrall should have got for the political marriage bulshit. It would not end with bombing of Theramore, Xenophobic Jaina, Kalindor would be a little more united, Thrall would have a better support that would not end with him just throwing an ax crazy asshole in power...
>>46669104
When he stood between retri paladin murderhobo and artifact grade loot.
>>46672012
I don't think she's trying to change his character, but rather to make him feel better about his choices, including the bad ones, in trying to be supportive.
Could be good pre-WoW. WoW pretty much murdered the increasingly split and multifaceted setting for the sake of a two-faction MMO setting with quests.
>>46672234
she literally said what Thrall believed in is shit and should stay with his Orc side of cultural
Aka let's go genocide another race cultural.
Aggra is the worst thing in Cata, which is saying a lot considering how shit Cata was.
>>46672234
She refuses to refer to Thrall by his slave name that he willingly kept, only his orc name Go'el.
When Thrall is caught in a Twilight trap and has his spirit scattered across the elements, she drags the player by the nose to the zones of the four elements to recover him. Then Thrall proposes to Aggra IN FRONT OF JAINA.
When the two of them first met, she constantly berated him for being a softie angling for peace.
>>46672309
>Then Thrall proposes to Aggra IN FRONT OF JAINA.
so?
>>46672267
I wonder how WoW and setting's history would develop if the faction split didn't exist or was completely voluntary. Perhaps linked with reputation levels too, like aldor/scryer where you could switch sides with some repeatable quests.
>>46672339
If that's not how you sink a ship, I don't know what is.
>>46672358
and its a good fucking thing
They might have been good friends but everything doesn't have to be shipped together.
>>46672309
>She refuses to refer to Thrall by his slave name that he willingly kept, only his orc name Go'el.
Nothing wrong with that. She's just not intellectual enough to see the symbolism and maybe thinks it's a sign of selfloathing. Although if she doesn't love thrall for who he is, it doesn't speak well of her either.
>>46672298
>she literally said what Thrall believed in is shit and should stay with his Orc side of cultural
Well how far into romance was that?
>>46672450
Very early. Like, literally when they first met and were forced to work together. Thrall/Aggra was described as a very belligerent relationship before it actually turned romantic.
>>46672358
Not a big fan of thrall x jaina ship desu. They respected eaxh other but I can't recall anything resembling romance between them except for gnomeregan punchcard.
>>46672358
>>46672374
Yeah, but they had a such a strong ship that a kissing song about them became a Gnomeregan Punchcard passkey.
>>46672490
Heh, Gnomerbro.
>>46672552
>Yeah, but they had a such a strong ship that a kissing song about them became a Gnomeregan Punchcard passkey.
that was an easter egg if there ever was once.
I just realized that the wow forums might have been the precursor to tumblr style justice and shipping.
>>46672585
I know, I was mostly joking.
>>46668029
It depends. Some demons have immortal 'souls' others don't. So it's literally that some reform after being killed (potentially even when killed in the twisting nether) and others don't (even when killed in other places.
>>46672450
She said that when they just met in Nagrand.
Part of the reason I hate Aggra to the guts is because she is a basically a in-story Orc Fangirl.
Orcs have being doing nothing but fuck up through out the entire franchise and she is saying their cultural is the best.
>>46668029
Felwood isn't close enough to the Twisting Nether. Even Outland isn't, you need to be on a Legion homeworld that has completely faded into the Nether like Nathreza or Argus
>>46672804
She spend most of her life in the plague quarantine camp, so she only saw the brutal Orcs as occasional visitors.
>>46672823
Individual areas immediately around the portals may be close enough, though blizzard will leave it vague.
Though some of the Legion portal worlds don't count if the demon soul dialogue in the Demonhunter quest is accurate, but the rules for demon souls of beings born on Azeroth and corrupted on Outland may be different from pure demons. SO being in the nether areas around the portal worlds alone isn't good enough.
So about Legion
Apparently Jaina was furious at the Horde at Varian's funeral.
But every other leader goes "legion more important, we be the bigger man like we always do for the millionth time" , so Jaina told them to shove their head into their behind and left.
Genn agreed with Jaina and left to prepare for the offensive and was not present at the funeral.
pic unrelated.
>>46672884
We know, Blizzard is stupid.
>>46668387
>Having race/class combo specific skillsets available was a largely approved feature.
>Which such skillsets would you create for tabletop?
Can you elaborate? Are you talking things like certain classes being restricted to certain races?cause I would totally bring back the horrendously evil Blood Knights, holy magic 'vampire' paladins who suck the good out of things
Beyond that, I dunno. I'd make more effort to re-introduce some of the defining shit for each race, like blademasters and wolf riders for orcs, Spear/Axe throwers & berserkers for trolls, Totem wielders for tauren. Forsaken are a little bit harder (because there's a distinct line between forsaken and scourge) but they had 'evil' priests and fleshcrafters still.
Dwarves would have their mechanics / gun usuers and animal husbandry things. Elves their rangers / sentinels. Night elves wardens. Humans their knights. Gnomes would not exist, fuck gnomes.
>>46672868
She should at least know what her race did to the others for the last 30 years.
>>46672884
We have no idea how the Horde acted.
Considering Jaina is an overly emotional cuntrag and Genn is a racist dickmonger, it could be that the Horde just said "Wait a second we're trying to save our OWN leader"
>>46672915
>Hating gnomes
They're an awesome edge to the Alliance.
I love the little pit crew fuckers and their Skyships.
>>46672884
Actually, she said that the kirin tor wouldn't stand by the horde after they abandoned their allies. It makes perfect sense. She is all for fighting the legion but doesn't want to stand side by side with the horde.
Neither should any person in fact.
But no, she has to be da ebil rayciss.
>>46672919
Someone mentioned earlier that there are datamined voicelines for the cinematic in question. Apparently, Sylvanas specifically abandons Varian and leaves him to die.
>>46672975
I have yet to find any source on that.
>>46672919
No, every response from the alliance side indicates that they all agree that the horde ran away and the alliance side collapsed on itself.
And no one in their right mind should trust the horde. Not after wrathgate, cataclysm pandaria and ashran.
>>46672975
Which just plays further into the "Sylvanas is scared of her own mortality" angle they've pushed since the end of Wrath. Even though she's arguably the greatest archer in all of Azeroth, she'd rather abandon Varian than stick her neck out against the Legion more than she likes.
>>46672731
Aggra had good potential, if she had literally any introspective qualities or ability to empathize with the struggle of non-mag'har orcs. Unfortunately, she's pretty two-dimensional, and the extent of her character development is
>fuk u go'el
to
>fuk me go'el
She doesn't look at what their history, what these green orcs have gone through, and think that maybe her way isn't the best way. There's no, "Oh, I think I understand why he wanted to keep that slave-name", just "ORC WAY IS ONLY WAY, BE ORC OR BE STUPID". She seems about as wise as bag of rocks.
Not only that, but that side of her is never shown in-game (much like most character-pertinent lore), so players who haven't read the books or gone digging won't realize what a colossal bitch she was, and instead just see her as a doting trophy-wife of a brown orc.
>>46672919
We saw how the broken shore fight went.
The alliance stood alone against the entire Legion force.
(and Velen and Furion, although incredible powerful, are not there, as always, fucking useless trashes.)
The Legion had a lot of Big shots too.
Tichondrius, Anetheron, Mephistroth, Brutalus..
About every named Legion character there was should up.
And lead by LORD JARAXXUS, eredar lord of the Burning Legion!
>>46673011
>And no one in their right mind should trust the horde.
Except the trolls and tauren. Those are the only Horde races specifically cited not to be directly responsible for international fuckups.
>>46673023
Did Aggra ever say anything about Taretha? I mean, she's the only human to ever receive an orc glory song.
A photo taken from the Chinese site.
The quest objective is to survive.
>>46668636
Ner'zhul was previously a powerful shaman but wanted *more power*, he was the first to contact the legion, but had some second thoughts and went 'hey shit, these guys might not be completely honest with us'. Gul'dan tattled on Ner'zhul and got him put on the legions shit list, they stripped him of a lot of his powers, but left him alive and thinking him no threat let him basically do whatever he wanted with full access to shadow council things.
Ner'zhul tattled in secret to durotan and draka which caused them to leave the horde. Orcs lost the second war, gul'dan was dead, and a lot were pushed back beyond the dark portal; Teron gorefiend came to ner'zhul and asked him to MAKE THE HORDE GREAT AGAIN!
Ner'zhul agreed and collected the skull of gul'dan (which started driving him mad), the scepter of sargeras, and the eye of dalaran. He then began to open portals all over draenor and went totally fucking insane with power, giving a shit about number one and only number one. He ripped apart draenor with his portals and when he stepped across the portal... he ran face to face with kil'jaeden who was in no way pleased with him.
Kil'jaeden after flaying ner'zhuls soul for quite some time asked him "ARE YOU FUCKING SORRY?", ner'zhul said yes, begged to work for KJ again and KJ tossed him in a suit of magic armor & sword, encased him in magic twisting nether ice and then gave him to the nathrezim. Nath'rezim taught him *moar* necromancy, and then eventually the shard of ice that contained ner'zhul ended up in northrend somehow.
The ice and armor expanded ner'zhuls powers and mind.
Ner'zhul was the lich king at this point and events of wc3 started, but ner'zhul decided 'fuck the burning legion, i'm going to pretend to work for them but I'm still looking out for me" and he made the frostmourne gambit so he could hopefully have a powerful host; arthas menethil.
>>46672915
The idea is inspired by ingame mechanics, where a Troll Priest would receive a specific skill which befit his religious activities and properly separate him from, say, a human priest, who would receive a skill befitting his faith etc.
Much in that vein I wanted to see what people thought would be could "race exclusive" skills and spells for a class.
However race exclusive classes would and should probably make an appearance in a Warcraft PnP, as well, though I am a little torn whether they should be basic classes or prestige classes obtained after a set of levels has been acquired, first.
>>46673185
Second war death knights were the souls of orc necromancers / warlocks / shamans put into the bodies of slain human knights... and we frostmourne *did* consume arthas' soul. It took a while but arthas eventually made his way to the frozen throne and donned the helm of the dominator, which should have allowed Ner'zhul to possess him completely.
"Arthas" as an entity should not have existed beyond WC3:TFT, except as a set of martial knowledge for NZ to call upon.
>>46673112
Damn that looks cool. It runs against my better judgement but my hype rose slightly.
>>46672926
I find that gnomes add very little to the alliance or its 'flavor', they're obnoxious at best in my opinion.
In addition all of my experiences with gnomes in the MMO have been negative (granted I played horde); the players are all shitheads, which makes them similar to the vast majority of the undead players but undead players were at least y'know *cool* some of the times.
They had awful models, awful animations and annoying voices.
Sure I can understand that they're not 'all' bad, and even why some people would like them, but IMO they add nothing.
>>46673035
We've only seen HALF of the Broken shore, the Horde side hasn't been finished yet.
>>46673185
>Ner'zhul was previously a powerful shaman but wanted *more power*, he was the first to contact the legion,
That's not what happened with Ner'zhul at all. I mean MAYBE in the WC3 manual or WC2 Manual.
>>46673112
I need to know more of these names, and wow Hakkar the Houndmaster got demoted to a mere Felguard/Fel Lord?
They should have at LEAST used the "Burning dude with a Dreadlord animation set" model from WoD if they're not going to give him his own model.
>>46673203
The problem with the race exclusive skills was that they didn't balance them well.
Dwarf preist race skill turned out to be ridiculous overpowered and completely dwarfed every other race's priest, so they removed the race restriction.
Put some balance into it and I don't see why it can't be in the PnP.
>>46673286
gnomes used to be the tech behind the alliance, and for the most part still remain that.
>>46673287
We see in the photo that the Alliance is facing the Burning Legion Force alone at the door to Tomb of Sargares, no Horde help what so ever.
There's LORD JARAXXUS in big letter.
The WC3 dreadlord trio are the ones on his left hand side
Brutalus (The Pit lord at Mount Hyjal battle) being the one behind Destromath.
You can find most of the English name on Wowpedia.
>>46673379
>Brutalus (The Pit lord at Mount Hyjal battle) being the one behind Destromath.
that was Azgalor
>>46673287
"Ner'zhul was the chieftain and elder shaman of the Shadowmoon clan and one of the most popular figures in orcish society. He was admired, respected and venerated by all for his deep connection to the spirits, and was the closest thing the orcish race had to a single leader prior to the foundation of the Horde. However, deep within, Ner'zhul craved a power he did not have."
"Ner'zhul was contacted by the spirit of his deceased mate, Rulkan (with whom he had a regular correspondence), who warned him about the menace of the draenei, who were plotting to destroy the orcs. After several moons, she introduced him to Kil'jaeden, the "Great One", who began to instruct him in the treachery of the draenei. Though Ner'zhul was elated that he was saving his people (and finally getting the power and respect he secretly desired), he was puzzled why the ancestors would no longer speak to him, and why the spirits grew more distant.
Ner'zhul managed to get the rest of the clans to begin attacks on draenei settlements, supposedly by order of the ancestors, but, as he saw more and more of the draenei, he gradually became puzzled; apart from his horns, clothes, and skin tone, Kil'jaeden bore an uncanny resemblance to the draenei and possessed a hatred of Velen unbecoming of a divine being. Seeking answers, he attempted to commune with the ancestors in Oshu'gun, the "Mountain of the Spirits." He was horrified when the ancestors greeted him as a monster and when the real Rulkan revealed that Kil'jaeden had been manipulating him all along."
Most of this comes from rise of the horde novel by christie golden, it's endorsed by metzen
>>46673406
oh yeah, brutallus is the one at Sunwell platue.
>>46673418
Yes but the post I replied to said Ner'zhul reached out to the legion for more power when he was actually duped by illusions.
He did want power but the bigger motivator was his illusionary wife.
Is there any reason that non-green orcs and non-Bronzebeard dwarves aren't playable other than Blizzard being lazy shits?
I mean, it's a reskin at most. How difficult can it be to do a palette swap of each skin tone and face?
Dark Irons and Wildhammers are officially joined with the Bronzebeards in Ironforge, due to the Council of Three Hammers. Unless literally all the mag'har and blackrocks that Garrosh brought to Orgrimmar stayed 100% loyal to him, they'd be there too. It stands to reason that some stuck with Eitrigg, and some mag'har as members of the Earthen Ring and the like.
Is it just that they don't want to alienate the people who don't have those options? Humans have no special skin tones, aside from Cult of the Damned members. Gnomes don't except for lepers. So what's the deal?
>>46671706
Hell, Israel used them not so long ago.
>>46673604
I think they're being idiots and not wanting to balance racial variants between all the races when they should just balance them between factions as a whole. Just make sure people get the same amount of new models and new skins. Though the Alliance is lacking in full New-Model races compared to the Horde's forest trolls and different sorts of tauren and undead.
>>46673722
Willy Pete is not EXACTLY a chemical weapon, just a really brutal incendiary.
Hey there, wanna hear a warcraft joke?
demons
literally WIZZARDS unironnicaly
daily reminder to never trust a elf, specially if they undead
>>46673875
>calling white phosphorous Willy Pete
C'mon grand-pappy, how'd you get on the computer?
>>46673012
Then what the fuck was she doing in the Legion cinematic?
>>46676627
Handing Blizzard the cake after they ate it.
What is the strongest race/class combination, of playable races? (i.e. no vrykul, giants, etc.)
I'm guessing it'd be a tauren death knight, seeing as how they are both fuckhueg and full of unholy might.
Secondarily, the most fearsome would be either orc or worgen DK due to inherent berserker rage tied to their races. Worgen get a bonus because they can tear you apart with their claws and fangs in addition to actual weaponry.
>>46676669
physically strongest would be a tauren dk, most powerful would probably be a draenei mage or belf warlock
>>46676771
The flagship draenei class is the paladin. The flagship belf class is the mage, warlock or rogue.
>>46676771
Yeah, I meant physically- sorry.
Mages, warlocks, and casters in general tend to have some pretty crazy powers that puts them above people who hit things with other things, even if those people are undead and can freeze shit.
>>46676840
Yeah, but a Paladin doesn't necessarily get anything out of being twenty thousand years old, while a mage definitely gets more powerful.
>>46677445
Only to a point. Natural talents trumps training.
>>46672919
>not liking the races that constantly try to genocide you is being racist
what is your point even supposed to be by calling him a "racist"?
![latest[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/1W64W4r.jpg "latest[1].jpg")
Will we ever see these things again?
>>46678487
no, they got replaced by fel cannons
>>46678060
anyone who hates the horde is racists, because the Horde is the oppressed color race.
>>46672309
I always thought that was a shit move.
>>46678882
Which one?
>>46678868
What about Goblins?
>>46678979
what are you an anti-semite?
>>46679029
I just think not sometimes the Goblins act in their own interests and not in those of the rest of Azeroth. I mean, Venture Co. has a long history of really bad behavior and yet somehow they still get to operate around the globe without any serious repercussions beyond the street level.
>>46678915
Aggra in general, but mostly Thrall's proposal to her in front of Jaina.
Jaina is only of my favorite characters, and there have been a few fan stories (diplomacy, frostblood) where she knocks it out of the park.
Her rescent turn in the lore makes me kind of sad, but I dont know how else she could react. There comes a time where you cant turn the cheek anymore
>>46679085
you know this isnt tumblr right? did you misclick?
>>46667404
I hope later on in legion mages and death knights team up to hunt down assholes in dalaran.
>>46679085
>muh thrall and jaina were meant to be together.
In what fucking way?
Why is this even a thing? They never even had a fraction of the sexual tension that Arthas and Sylvanas did.
>>46669305
here I was hoping there would be a warlock quest where Guldan tries to tempt the character to the dark side.
>>46669680
Warlocks have always been the hero class of magi since SL/SL. Hence the tears.
>>46679473
you are saying it like there are people more evil than the Murderhobos.
>>46679474
>>46679704
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uDPPHk0eyRc
>>46679704
>>46679740
>when the other creatures that use your skeleton get upgraded models but Blizzard's forgotten about you since BC
>reading through the Illidan book and it's actually really good
Faggots will nitpick the Naaru scene and ignore everything else, I'm sure.
>>46679402
It was something I think a lot of people liked. They had a close friendship so its not inconcievable. (I actually ship her with someone else). Additionally it would probably have taken less hurdles than introducing a new character and building her up than evolving an exsisting relationship.
I dont think Arthas and Sylvanas had any chemistry. Arthas (and KT and Anub) are very snarky wich can be interpreted as flirty
>>46679826
Its Illidan people will try to keep him down!
>>46679826
I love William King.
Going to pick it up for sure.
>>46670031
Wow that sounds horrible.
Forsaken master race.
I can quest in Forsaken controlled zones from lvl 1 to level 40. All in the Eastern Kingdoms, the heart of the Alliance.
Get fucked humans.
>>46680442
as a human DK I am going to enjoy wrecking the undercity to free Koltiras
>>46680607I can see her being a blood DK
>>46677979
No... just no. Not in the real world and not in Warcraft.
>>46680607
An a horde DK I do the same.
The Alliance created the Forsaken, by the way. We wanted to rejoin our friends and families and live the rest of our undeath out after we defeated the Scourge, but NOOOO apparently anybody with a missing lower jaw is evil Scourge now.
Every day the Alliance doesn't accept the Forsaken back is another human killed only to continue to protect our shared lands.
We wouldn't have to kill you to protect our culture if you fuckers just let us rejoin yours.
>>46680744
>No... just no.
Yes, just yes. Grow out of the shitty moral lessons taught to you by cartoons.
>>46680853
to be fair most "natural talent" boils down to autistic obsessions and/or being forced to do a single thing/sent to focused school since early child hood by your parents so they can use you as a paycheck
"natural talent" is the bullshit lie lazy neets believe in so they can feel superior without ever doing anything with their life ie "i could totally do that better than anyway if i tried because im so smart an talented"
>>46680845
I mean, some of you fuckers would rather be cursed into beasts rather than keep your grandma around a couple decades longer. So what if she smells? She smelled before she died too!
It'd be many times easier to fight the Orcish Horde, the Legion, the Scourge, etc. if you had access to the farms of Lordaeron, and the tens of thousands of people that could have been born and grown up on that land.
You could have an Argent Dawn/Crusade that never fought and recombined- a stronger, more unified one. Hell, without the Scarlet Crusade it's likely that the Knights of the Ebon Blade would've been all Alliance instead of neutral.
So congratulations humans. You've cucked yourself.
>>46681090
>>46680845
>m-muh fantasy racism
>G-Garithos did nothing wrong
with Stormjews, you lose
>>46680845
>>46681090
Forsaken started by slaughtering the nearby surviving lordaeron farmers.
So enough with the lies already
Forsaken was and always is evil.
There's always some idiots in these threads pulling the "forsaken was innocent poor people" lie.
>>46681187
hes a forsaken role player. just ignore him
>>46681211
you mean his brain rotted off already? got it.
>>46680853
Objectively everyone who doesn't have shit for brains will choose the person who has done something for years rather than someone who has done something for a week but is "talented." Please don't assume that hard work isn't worth it or that people who are talented don't need to work hard, your ideas are all making us all look like geniuses by comparison.
>>46681429
this
/pol/yps learnt banter after years of studying the /int/ernational community.
Memes don't come easy.
>>46673604
You can play black skinned dwarfs with red eyes in WoW sure you don't start in black Rock but with the council of three hammers it doesn't matter, hell they can be makes and warlocks now also
>>46667404
bring our brave boy home.
>legion is supposed to be the hour of the demonhunters.
>DKs steal their thunder and Arthas returns to stab illidan again
Would buy every blizzard game on launch.
>>46682061
Nah, you can play slighly greyish white dwarves with slightly red eyes, not coal skinned dwarves with glowing red orbs.
>>46678487Now.
>>46682695
Broken shore is looking so good right now
>>46679826
Just finished reading the whole book, including the naaru scene, and I have to say the whole thing is a bit strange.It effortlessly hides itself from detection on Argus, even in Kil'jaedan's own chamber, and seems to overcome Illidan's own efforts to hide just as easily. When asked if it's a naaru, it distinguishes itself by saying it's an "elder naaru". Perhaps the eldest naaru that still exists. It's said that it's more powerful than A'dal or any of the other Sha'tar, yet it doesn't seem to hold any sway over them as shown in the scene that almost immediately follows.
>He sensed the presence of more than just mortals down there. He discerned the pulsing of naaru. So much for the promises the elder naaru had made back on Argus. It looked as if only one of them had faith in his destiny. The beings down there were certainly against him.
Where the Sha'tar are focused on the Legion, the elder naaru seems to care only about the Void.
Before it leaves, it places a sigil on Illidan's head, which is the last thing he sees as he dies. It's unclear what this accomplished, but the elder naaru seemed to know that Illidan was going to die.
So, all in all, there's still something strange about the situation. At the very least, it's strongly implied that the elder naaru isn't one of the Sha'tar. Also, none of the characters who meet the naaru can bring themselves to completely trust the windchimes.
>>46682695
>nobble
My nigga
>>46672868
The fact that she got displaced and was under quartetine, not to mention the quite literal road made of the dead they had slaughtered that leads a good five miles, or so I think because seriously the amount of corpses to make the path of glory is stupidly high, should be a pretty big fuckng clue.
>>46683047
The orc killed 80% of the draenei population, even the Nazi's can't hold a candle to them (Nazi killed like 70% something of the jews in europe)
So yeah the number of bodies will totally works
>>46669139
Because this is how they look
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7w4pLlvmwqA
>>46672915
>>46673203
See that's better, I rather like this idea of each racial having their own little thing that makes them unique by virtue of different cultures.
Well for the basics...
>Warrior
>Orcs: Blade Masters proficients in two handed swords maybe?
>Humans: Knights/Cavaliers from pathfinder?
>Night Elves: Warden/Glaive throwers.
>Dwarves: Avatars: Regain the stoneflesh gaining a size category, health, damage and damage resistance.
>Scourge/Forsaken: Maybe something like deathknight Lite? Less runework and more unyielding plate of steel that marches on at you regardless what you do to it. Damage reduction for a set amount of turns?
>Troll: Beserkers Go into a rage for more attacks
>Tauren: Totem Pole guy, free profciency with huge weapons? Maybe something like your able to send out small bursts of electrical damage
>>46683204
First of all, I don't think giving extra ability over proficent is a good idea. so here it is.
Blade master is a complete different class.
Orc Warrior is all about the Axe
Specialization into Axe/shield or Two handed Axe is the way to go.
Human Warriors are all sword guy, single handed/duel wield/Two hand swords are the way to go.
NE warrior are the sentries and huntress in WC3, throwable cresent blade for everyone!
Dwarves: single hand mace is their thing, mace/axe combo or mace/shield.
Troll: duel wielding axe!!!
Tauren: totem pole obviously. give them their pulverize as a racial perk for good measure.
>>46683204
>by virtue of different cultures.
>not by DNA
i should be like
>humans: smarter faster and tronger, they have better everything else
>other races:weaker than humans, and smell bad too
>elfs:even weaker, like really really weak, -4, -5 if female
>>46683680
So would ripping off from the old warcraft pnp manuel be a good idea or no? Cuz I think they mentioned some prestig classes as well that were interesting to see.
That being said, if we went that route of different races having different things. What can humans do with a sword that an Orc can't? It is just natural inclination since their culture put's an emphisis on it?
>>46683936
You started to get me at the first half, then the 2nd part made me realize you must be Amani.
>>46680845
>wah wah we're being oppressed
>proceeds to invade and slaughter every surviving human faction north of the Thandol Span
The Forsaken stopped having any sort of moral superiority once they started dropping the plague on civilian populations.
>>46684319
As a Horde player and supporter myself, I honestly wouldn't mind if the Forsaken were wiped out as an organization. They've done nothing but piss people off for no reason since Vanilla. Depose Sylvanas, put the Undercity under martial law, and contact the Cenarion Circle to come and cleanse the area of blight.
Then fortify Lordaeron, northern Silverpine, Andorhal, and the Alterac mountains/Frostwolf Valley as Horde territory. Give southern Silverpine, Hillsbrad, and Arathi over to the Alliance. Fortify the borders and try to get along.
>>46684643
they should just make them count as undead again like in vanilla
oh the rivers of tears that would cause
>>46684878
That was the vanilla beta. Early Vanilla still had Will of the Forsaken that lasted 30 seconds on a 2 minute cooldown.
And when every nigger and their grandmother played an UD rogue, being a human warlock on a PVP server was absolute agony. At least until Death Coil got its horror effect. Then there was at least a chance.
>>46684981
Will of the forsaken was an immunity and not an escape?
>>46685325
Yep, Tauren also got Plains tidings as a racial which was like a mount/travel form but that was also removed too bad they developed the Tauren starting area and the barons with that ability in mind hence why that starting zone is so shit.
>>46685567
They removed that in alpha not early vanilla. And I am pretty sure Plainsrunning unlocked at the same level as mounts.
>>46685567
you didnt get a mount until level 40 anon. if the starter zone is shit its not because of that
>>46679826
Bullshit.>So this guy who like just got drafted into service by Kil'Jaeden, right? And then got fucked up by Arthas before he was even at full power that his toadies had to drag his half-corpse back to outland, right?
>Yeah, so he's so fucking badass and strong that he can launch raids into burning legion worlds and destroy them. Isn't that, like, super cool?
>Oh, we made him a raidboss ten years ago? Oh well, just spin it like that he was right all along, players love this stuff.
>>46684026
>you must be Amani.
>implying there are not people ITT who unironically hold those views
>>46680845
>We wanted to rejoin our friends and families and live the rest of our undeath out after we defeated the Scourge, but NOOOO apparently anybody with a missing lower jaw is evil Scourge now
The first act of the Forsaken was to murder Lordaeron's Grand Marshall you cuck
>>46685734
WE
>>46685737
>random hillbilly placed in charge by the kikes in Stormwind
>"Lordaeron's grand marshal"
nice try Varian
>>46685737
Those responsible were killed with extreme prejudice, it's time to let go. Besides you got an Alliance friendly Lich King out of it.
>>46685737
Or if you're talking about Garithos, asshole had it coming. "I'm going to intentionally hamstring my armys effectiveness because non-humans are icky" is not a good strategy for retaking a country.
>>46685791
>>46685759
>>46685748
Garithos was an asshole and he deserved to be executed for gross incompetence but that doesn't change that the Forsaken struck first against the Alliance
>>46685801
Indeed. Neither does it excuse subsequent crimes perpetuated on combatants and civilians alike.
Still, some individual forsaken are alright. Like that guy from Argent Dawn.
>>46685748
Garithos was a Lordaeronian noble. Stormwind, Stromgarde, and Ironforge backed him for the same rrason Kael initially did.
He basically was the only one left at that rank. And for all his fuckups he did a decent job at reopening lines of communication.
>>46686004
>Stromgarde
How do we know?
>Go to the city of Stormwind and speak with Bishop Farthing in the Cathedral of Light. Give him Jitters' journal and tell him you mean to face Morbent Fel.
>Although Stormwind has forsaken Darkshire, Farthing is a kind soul and very wise. He may help you on your quest to save us.
>Your mission is perilous, but hurry, <Name>. With each passing hour, the shadows of Duskwood grow ever darker.
>The light... has gone out. I know not why.
>I am more troubled now than before. I can find little comfort in the everyday. Each day seems darker than the last.
>Please, bring me another one of the Sun Crystals. Its light is so warm, so comforting.
I don't like where this is headed.
>>46686085
Darkshire gets screwed in Legion, we get it.
>>46670014
But Jaina is made for breeding.
>>46686231
Actually in this case it's Stormwind. The text is from a fairly nice quest chain in vanilla.
>>46686250
only for white aryans though, not green niggers
>>46686255
Stormwind was pretty screwed in Vanilla too.
>>46686273
as a city it was doing fine, it was all of its outlying terroritories that were fucked
