Previous thread: >>43478595
Last time on /SoS/:
Ratko Abuslav mini-fecht
Tanks in Ballad
Ballad 0.5
Song of Swords is a realistic fantasy tabletop RPG that draws inspiration from historical fechtbuchs, weapons and armor. Its combat system is fun as balls and it can be used for both fantasy and historical/mundane settings.
Call of the Void is a pulpy sci-fi tabletop RPG about fighting space-nazis and hunting giant whales with harpoons made out of the moon. Ironically it also has a very realistic combat system based around modern firefights, and can handle mundane or magical settings.
Here's a .rar archive with the newest version of the rules as well as all related current working documents: http://www.mediafire.com/download/12xqm1p2q69m392/Song_of_Swords.rar
Here's Ballad of the Laser Whales' latest version: https://www.mediafire.com/?rtbjk51jnm2wv8a
Here's a wiki detailing SoS's fantasy setting, getting filled up bit by bit as Jimmy reveals more details. Its worth a look before asking for lore questions in the thread: http://tattered-realms.wikia.com/wiki/Tattered_Realms_Wiki
There's also a roll20 room where new players are encouraged to try the rules, test new rules, and find game breaking issues: https://app.roll20.net/join/346755/hRKd4w
Roll20 Note: The Room might be empty, but the people who teach the game still browse the thread frequently. If you're looking to learn and can't catch us in the Roll20 leave a request and we'll get to you as soon as possible.
>>43542954
>tfw the OP is too full for my arms and armour mediafire archive
https://www.mediafire.com/#1x1a2xw3qgvs8
Can we receive some information on the Alandi and the Berkukhans?
>>43542954
>that fucking horrible "ye olde Englandland" grammar
Kill me now.
>>43542954
Since when did Ballad of the Laser Whales became call of the void?
>>43542954
>Here's Ballad of the Laser Whales' latest version: https://www.mediafire.com/?rtbjk51jnm2wv8a
No it's not.
>>43543381
Since Jimmy started working on it a while ago.
>>43543381
Jimmy, who art a faggot, decided that it needed to be toned down for the plebeian masses.
>>43543718
>>43543381
Its full title is Call of the Void: Ballad of the Laser Whales
Sulla looks pretty qt, can we get a pic of him without his helmet?
>>43543838
>>43543838
The last we've seen him.
![Why+did+this+make+the+front+page+_f31ec5b946ca3ada231e070b27e3e54d[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/xRvmCnv.jpg "Why+did+this+make+the+front+page+_f31ec5b946ca3ada231e070b27e3e54d[1].jpg")
>>43542954
>>43543276
>English knight
>Doesn't even speak French
0/10 would not fight a war for the throne with.
>>43543202
Aren't the Alandi a bunch of Hungarians?
>>43544469
>its
>to
>dragons
You are not helping.
>>43544579
Weird, it's almost like people do it on purpose.
>>43544579
That's probably intentional, isn't it?
Also, you missed the "chaifing".
>>43544599
>>43544611
Oh sure, getting punched in the face is *just fine* as long as it's intentional.
>>43544628
There are people who pay good money to get punched.
>>43544721
Yet seeing these grammatical abominations is absolutely free.
History is okay at Song of Swords
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9IAyKBdo-lk&ab_channel=scholagladiatoria
Is Song of Swords complicated?
>>43546651
In the same way learning to ride a bike is completed, learning on your own is good way to pick up bad habits and functional errors but with a teacher it's fast to learn and the rhythm's easy to keep when you know it.
When you break SoS down 80% of what you're doing is rounds of "I use this many dice in the first action, great I'm not dead how do I want to use the rest of the dice? Oh still not dead? Back to first action."
>>43546651
Not terribly. The hardest part is learning all the maneuvers, but you don't actually have to do that since 90% of the time you're just going to want to attack or defend.
When you cut all of the specialized maneuvers out of the picture the game is very simple, to the point of almost being an abstract strategy game like Go.
>>43546651
I got used to it by a practice fecht or two. I think the best way is to find someone to teach you and spar a few times to see how the gist of the game works.
>>43544409
As far as I know, yes, and the Berkukhans are Mamluks, but I just wanted to learn about how their society functions. Just some details on them, really.
Meanwhile, in Santa Cruz
>>43549941
Needs more cabbage
>>43549941
This isn't Instagram, Jimmy. Did you get your tabs mixed up?
Also, you forgot the sepia filter.
>>43549941
You should chop a hatch pepper up real small and add that.
>>43549941
Jimmy, a sandwich goes on bread, not a skillet. If you're cooking on a skillet, cook food that's good fried.
>>43550025
Never liked cabbage. Substitute more meat!
Great experience though, would try again.
>>43550034
Just showing off my experimental worldbuilding. Cuisine is an important part of any campaign setting!
>>43551140
You used the wrong greens. And you added what looks like tofu.
>>43551236
There's nothing wrong with tofu in sukiyaki, that's what you're supposed to include.
The greens are wrong, I'll admit, but I like cilantro more than cabbage, and I like beansprouts more than onions.
There's also a radish in there, along the bottom, that was just weird and I regret adding it.
>>43551315
>Beansprouts
Good man.
>>43551315
>I know literally nothing about cooking
Did you decide that bean sprouts should replace onions because they're both light in color and cilantro should replace cabbage because they're both leafy? In terms of the role they play in the taste, it's more like you replaced onions with cilantro and cabbage with bean sprouts. You've created a terrible fucking Californian travesty. At this point you might as well swap the meat for chicken, through in some artichoke heart, and wander around on your boardwalk telling people how taking it up the ass is a sophisticated hobby that everyone should try.
You probably fucked up the spices too.
>>43551489
kek, stay mad faggot, it was fucking delicious. I think I'm going to go mix some red and white wine together with some Heineken in a jug and drink it just to piss you off.
It'll be great, I'll name it "French Military History," white for the color of your liver, red for the color of the ground after the English beat the shit out of you those 300 times, and a good lager to commemorate the German who knocked up your grandmother on a desk in Vichy Fr--Sorry, the brave Dutch man who your grandma met in the Resistance.
Reminder that this is a thread about a roleplaying game centered around realistic combat.
>>43551675
Jimmy 'What's a PR?' Rome strikes again.
>>43551750
Sukiyaki is traditional games!
Really though, give me something to work with here guys.
>>43551844
You still haven't >>43543202
>>43551750
Behold the fate of all generals.
>>43551844
Tell us about Alandi and Berkukha you catamite.
>>43551844
Got tank rules coming along?
>Jimmy Rome recipe for success
>spend forever designing one system
>Make sure to build hype
>The moment you are close to making the system almost ready for official release, start creating another, derivative system, delaying the original product significantly
>???
>Profit
>>43553243
>the main book is in editing
>making another derivative system somehow delays that entirely separate process
>>43553371
>the main book is being edited by a kangaroo who stole Jimmy's money and ran off to New Zealand
fixed
>>43553404
shhhhhhhhh no tears now
>>43553243
Gotta have something for the kickstarter when it gets double the goals and Jimmy needs to find a way to squander the money and avoid having to actually finish something.
>>43553371
When it comes back from editing, what happens to it? Do we finally get a kickstarter, or do we just use and bugtest and complain about it for a bit, and then get a new one next year?
Because based on what I know about Opaque Industries, it's probably the latter.
>>43553421
I will never stop until I get the game.
>>43553443
Nobody is more cognizant of just how ridiculous this delay is than I am. Twice now I have pushed for the editing to be finished, and in the intervening periods of each of these pushes I have designed a new game. I am starting to suspect that I am the victim of a large and elaborate practical joke. If recently I have started to seem unduly hostile and argumentative, I would proffer this as the reason.
Nevertheless, it is my hope (though at this juncture I am not certain what role precisely hope plays in this process) that after producing an edited document, the tasks at follow will be resolved within the matter of a week and we will be launched.
Surely this is divine judgement. I spend years being lazy and indecisive, and now finally that I am ready to commit myself to the final push, not only is it out of my hands but I am in a situation where everything I could do would only delay our progress.
>>43555294
Then tell us what your NaNoWriMo is so we canjudge youcritique it for you.
>>43555294
Aw poor Jimmu, we never stopped to consider the person to be suffering the most could be him.
>>43555760
That's always been the consideration, because a suffering Jimmy is a productive Jimmy.
>>43555744
I considered writing something, but I was too frustrated over multiple years of actual work not being finished that I kept deleting everything I wrote and finally just settled down to make tank rules. Narrative is easy. All you need to write a good narrative is a bottle of stolichnaya and a cool room. Rules are harder, and worth more.
i want to steal you SoS niggers to come work on ARBITER with me cause you guys made a thing
>>43555905
What?
>>43555905
What the fuck is ARBITER?
>>43555905
What's an Arbiter?
>>43555905
If you have any suitable waifus on offer, perhaps an agreement could be reached...
>>43542954
>tfw Ratko and Tychus are literally Papyrus and Sans
>tfw trying to penetrate Tenja
>Nothing but shitty puzzles and bad jokes
>Suddenly
>BONES
>>43555905
Seriously, what are you talking about?
>>43555905
Hey look a genuine crazy person. Who let you out of your cage you little rascal?
Oi what do you call the people that drive a tank? The whole crew, I mean. Are they drivers, pilots, cavalry officers, what?
>>43556723
They are tankers, I think
.
>>43556755
Tanks, mang.No I will not stop using that pun. Fuck you.
>>43551844
>give me something to work
You should, like, totally stat this for SoS:
>>43531851
>>43557880
>stating retarded LOLSORANDOM fictitious weapons
>instead of stating real weapons that the most harcore urban warriors find and use daily in any well-ordered town...
>>43558546
Are they throwing pigeons at each other?
>>43558654
it sure would appear that way
>>43558654
No, they're throwing 10 range TN 5 3c projectiles with berserk.
>>43559353
So they're throwing quarter pikes?
>>43559498
With berserk.
>>43559525
Are pigeons really that hostile?
>>43559353
If I ever run a less than serious game of SoS this will totally be a thing.
>>43560689
Yes.
Which is more terrifying?
A lone rifleman getting the drop on the party, from cover, a distance away-
or
-a large group of halbrediers who box the party into a building, prepared to smoke them out?
>>43561563
"It's a lever-action breech loader. Usual barrel length is 30 inches.This one has an extra four. It's converted to use a special .45-caliber, 110-grain metal cartridge with a 540-grain paper-patch bullet. Fitted with double set triggers and a Vernier sight. Marked up to 1,200 yards. This one shoots a mile farther..."
>>43561563
If you're GMing, halberdiers are probably more practical. To establish himself as a proper threat, the rifleman would have to kill at least one character, which is inconvenient if you're not going for a TPK. Whereas a bunch of halberdiers with flammable substances present a palpable threat without being immediately lethal.
>>43561563
I'd say the rifleman, at least assuming he has an open field of fire. By the time you notice he's even there you'll probably have at least one of your party choking on blood, and even if you high-tail it like a motherfucker while leaving them behind he'll probably get another one on the way out.
Halberdiers meanwhile will still cut you apart in a fight, but they're right there.You can talk to them, reason to them, worst case just surrender. If you do manage a breakout and run they're not guaranteed to keep up with you either.
>>43561719
>To establish himself as a proper threat, the rifleman would have to kill at least one character, which is inconvenient if you're not going for a TPK
Well, you could have the party accompanied by a bunch of noname goons and kill off some of those.
>>43561904
But then the party is never in danger, which defeats the purpose.
>>43561708
That's not even the most ridiculous western gun ever. Karl May's Old Shatterhand was said to own a "Henry Carbine" which not only was a proper semi-automatic (sometime around 1850), but it was also supposed to hold a whopping 25 rounds in a single magazine, which was described as some kind of weirdly spinning sphere with the cartridges set into it.
Christ, in retrospect those books really committed so many cardinal sins of writing. Still fun, though.
>>43562167
If Karl May had been around today, he'd probably have been diagnosed with some kind of mental illness.
>>43562167
So were these some sort of proto steampunk books?
>>43563477
Nah, they claimed to be accounts of the actual travels of the author. And he ended up kind of believing in his own legend, even though for most of his life, the only traveling he did was with his finger, on a map. Apparently, he had a bunch of nervous breakdowns once he actually did travel to the locations he had described himself visiting.
It's kind of fascinating in its own right, really.
Dude grew up a dirt poor delinquent and became a huge fucking celebrity by escaping into a fantasy world and publishing it.
>>43542954
So when this game is actually released, what is the new name going to be?
>>43563916
That's been brought up. The way I understand it, it's not a problem because the two things named "Song of Swords" won't have jack shit to do with each other.
>>43563975
HahhahahAHHAHAHAHA!
I DID THAT MEME MY FRIEND
>>43563989
u wot
>>43563975
I just found that image by googling "Song of Swords RPG" after seeing this thread. The search results were a mix of both games. I think the potential for confusion exists even if the games themselves are completely different.
>>43563916
>>43563975
>>43563989
I believe the two companies have been in talks and nobody's changed their name yet so...
I think we're cool.
>>43564040
I said the exact same thing two years ago.
Basically, it'd be their fourth rename, so they're reluctant to go through with it.
I *still* think Tattered Realms has a good ring to it.
>>43564285
What were the second and third names? I know it used to be Esoterica, but I thought that went straight from that to Song of Swords.
>>43565060
Were we Song of Steel or was that another project altogether?
>>43565060
Sword of the Heavens, Esoterica, Song of Swords AFAIK.
>>43565127
Sword of the Heavens sounds about a thousand percent anime, and Esoterica sounds like the kind of thing that arranges its character sheet in all manners of weird geometric patterns. If it even has one.
I really like the concept of this but I'm having a hard time understanding the rules. Can someone have a straight up sword fight and post how it works? Like a demo or something?
>>43566622
>>43566622
HEY SENPAI
WANNA HOP IN THE ROLL20 ROOM
YEAH YOU
I KNOW YOU WANT TO SENPAI
>>43567016
link me baby girl
>>43567039
fuck no
how about tomorrow
i'm pussying out today
>>43567158
Alright, i'll post tomorrow. I expect blood to happen.
>>43567222
Alright fuck this. I'll jump in the roll20 momentarily. I may be a fool, but I'm better than nothing and tomorrow senpai can fix the minor errors in my teachings. Link to the R20 is in the OP
>>43560689
If a Russian picked you up and through you at another Russian, wouldn't you be mad too?
>>43567016
>SENPAI
That is not your senpai. He is asking to be your kouhai.
>>43567384
i'm sorry senpai i just typed in family
>>43567384
If you'll be my yojimbo
I can be your long lost tomodachi
I can call you Yuki
And Yuki when you call me
You can call me Takeru
Call me Take-kun
HOW CAN SHE SLAP?
>>43562167
>tfw Adolf Hitler considered sending troops copies of Karl May's works to inspire them
It is so baffling to imagine Adolf Hitler as a western fan.
All these Karl May fans, and nobody to post this? For shame!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V-aVr92R-dQ
>>43568379
What would an army of Heer armed with magic rifles do?
>>43555294
Jimbo, I've already offered to go beat this tosspot til she finishes the editing. Where she at?
>>43570735
It's unfortunately illegal for me to help fans brutalize my employees. It'll be fine.
>>43570887
Berkukha! Alandi! Lore!
Take a break from Nazi Space Elves and give us some TR lore!
>>43571267
Very well, very well.
>>43571997
Tell us about the piercings and tattoos of the tattered realms.
>>43571267
So, let's talk Berkukha. Situated on the West Coast of the Tujani subcontinent, facing the Interior Sea, Berkukha is an old nation, with old problems. One of the most fertile regions in Tujan thanks to the great network of rivers that crisscross it and the famed floodplains of The Seven Deltas, the region has been the heart of a great agrarian kingdom for millennia. Because famine is unheard of there, the people live prosperous, uneventful lives, and civil unrest is rare. Berkukha has historically been stable, with a powerful bureaucracy binding the nation together with strictly enforced laws and competent, meritocratic government made up largely of slaves raised from birth for specific tasks.
Of course, in times past, Berkukha was ruled by a God-King, once considered a serious rival to the Zophkaga of Karthack or the Emperor of Ruvia.
These days, things are different. A war with a steppeland horde that swept through Karthack, then what is now Kurtiye, and finally into Berkukha destroyed much of the old order, and shook the peoples' faith in their God-King.
The King's Royal Slaves, the Aabat, assassinated him, and, since they already made up the bureaucracy that managed the country, simply continued to manage it, installing one of their own as the Chief Minister. The King's son, who was 12 years old at the time, was kept as a strictly ornamental ruler in a lavish palace, but was afforded no real power.
This state of affairs has continued for quite some time. The country is ruled by men who, legally speaking, are slaves to the God-King. Officially they are simply taking care of his property while he commits himself to his duties as the divine heart of the empire. In practice, he is a superficial ornament who would be quickly disposed of in the event that he actually sought power.
>>43569767
Still die, probably. Contrary to popular belief, the personal weaponry of individual soldiers rarely makes a significant difference in the grand scheme of things when compared to overall industrial capacity.
>>43572422
Magic
Rifle
>>43572406
So Karthack wasn't Chinese enough?
>>43572448
Karthack was never China. Neither is this Chinese. What are you talking about, anon?
>>43572406
And so it is today. Berkukha is still run by the Aabats, who are mostly purchased abroad as children to ensure no local loyalties. They are raised fastidiously in secluded forts, and are trained rigorously before being separated into various departments. Military service is something all of them are supposed to be capable of (sickly children are not selected, no matter their talents) and when wars begin, even the bureaucrats (non-essential, of course) can be called up to fight.
This system works, and it has been rescued from corruption by several great reformers, but it has recently begun to smell of decay again as the bureaucracy becomes too bloated and self-important.
>>43572422
Setting that aside, it would also probably accomplish little because the Germans correctly ascertained that rifles didn't really serve an important role in the infantry section anymore. The MG was what did the killing, the men with rifles were just there to carry shit for him and protect him in the event that something went wrong and a Russian got within fifty meters of the gunner.
Though, you never know, they started to come around for the StG-44, so maybe it could've made a difference.
>>43572468
>Neither is this Chinese
>Emperor and empire run by a bunch of ostensibly harmless men
>not Chinese
What?
>>43572488
It's literally the Mamluk Sultanate, plus figurehead.
>>43572601
It's literally China but replace the word "eunuch" with "slave". Besides that they're all slaves, there's literally nothing in common with the mamluks that's not mutual between them and China.
>>43572485
The section detailing horses includes a section that indicates Bite and Kick damage, which is defined universally as "STR-2 b/c"
But then the Mounted Maneuvers for both Kick and Bite include in their math another tabulation for Strength. By RAW, this appears that STR is being added to the damage twice, no?
>>43572639
Except, of course, that the Berkurkans are in the Levant, and not in China.
>>43572661
>One of the most fertile regions in Tujan thanks to the great network of rivers that crisscross it and the famed floodplains of The Seven Deltas, the region has been the heart of a great agrarian kingdom for millennia. Because famine is unheard of there, the people live prosperous, uneventful lives, and civil unrest is rare.
>the Levant
>>43572734
He's wrong. They're basically in Egypt.
Which means that there must be an Ancient Berkukha. What was that like? Who did they worship, their God Emperor? Are there ruins?
>>43572648
That was not the intention, good catch.
>>43572485
>the Germans correctly ascertained that rifles didn't really serve an important role in the infantry section anymore. The MG was what did the killing, the men with rifles were just there to carry shit for him and protect him in the event that something went wrong and a Russian got within fifty meters of the gunner.
Is this different from how other countries did things? Do explain.
>>43573635
I remember an old joke about how to recognize which country troops were from during WWII. The gist was you shoot at them and see how they respond.
British: Rifles
Germans: MGs
Italians: Surrender
Americans: Silence then artillery
Russians: Silence until you freeze to death
>>43573635
The Americans at least had light machine guns as a sort of separate thing that had to be called up, rather than an integral part of a squad's toolset. Their heavy weapons were two BARs, and the fact that every man had a semiauto rifle. The BARs and riflemen pin down the enemy, while other riflemen flank and destroy.
The Germans instead based their squad around the MG. It was the primary killer, everyone else is just there to support it and keep it from being flanked.
>>43573828
Small addendum: Just like everybody else, the germans too saw the value in a maneuver element to flank and destroy pinned enemy positions. So that group (usually dudes primarily armed with MPs/Stgs) served a function that was of similar importance to the MG. The main difference there compared to the allies was that the allies usually had the squad leader advance together with the maneuver element, whereas the germans usually had the squad leader stay back to more effectively direct the fire of the MG.
Mind, then again sometimes they simply put two MGs in a given squad and had one as their base of fire and one in the maneuver element. One of the earlier instances of "more dakka -> better than"
Hey, how might I go about making a nation that used close-quarters combat (preferably with swords or other melee weapons) as a significant, hopefully primary part of their combat doctrine in a period roughly analogous to the interbellum/WWII?
>>43574777
How relatively high tech and/or magic is the rest of the setting?
Basically, you need to satisfy two requirements:
a) There's actually a reason why engaging in melee is at least as or ideally more effective than just shooting the enemy.
b) They have something that prevents them from getting shot to shit in a blink.
a) can arise from a number of reasons. Off the top of my head for example an extremely fortification-heavy style of warfare, where infiltrating and charging through enemy trenches and/or tunnels is very commonplace.
b) is a bit more difficult in that you need to leave reality behind for a bit. One thing I could think of is that there's a material or compound that's sufficiently hard and stable that you can make effectively bulletproof armour out of it that is still light enough to be wearable. Make the necessary technology or raw resources the exclusive property of whatever nation you want to be melee-heavy.
>>43574847
Welp, it's meant to be completely realistic besides having totally different geopolitics.
Guess I'll have to go with the infiltration thing, although that won't make it as prevalent as I'd have hoped (I was thinking something like a predominantly ambush-heavy strategy where infantry play a role by jumping on moving soldiers and stabbing them).
>>43542954
>l'appel du vide
>lit. "call of the void"; used to refer to intellectual suicidal thoughts, or the urge to engage in self-destructive (suicidal) behaviors during everyday life. Examples include thinking about swerving in to the opposite lane while driving, or feeling the urge to jump off a cliff edge while standing on it. These thoughts are not accompanied by emotional distress.
Huh. Didn't know that.
>>43574939
I did. Read it ages ago in a New Scientist.
Is there a word for being intensely smug about happening to know something before other people do? Besides "being a massive faggot", I mean.
>>43574991
If there is, I'm sure it's French.
>>43575173
>>43574939
Oh hey, I used to have those constantly. It was always weird, driving home, because I'd spend thirty minutes of driving, five days a week, talking myself out of wrapping my car around a pole or hurtling off a cliff. Without being any more upset than I already (being suicidally depressed) was!
Thank goodness for my pills now. Chronic depression is a bitch.
>>43575350
I don't think that's l'appel du vide, I think that's depression. Not sure though.
>>43575476
No idea. All I know is that I was calm, and wanted to off myself at every chance.
But when I was a kid I'd always get the urge to touch red hot surfaces, so that also probably counts. Burned myself quite a few times before I stopped paying it any mind.
But enough about me, more about stabbing.
>>43575542
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Misericorde_(weapon)
>Euthanasia was administered by thrusting below the neck down into the heart.
>>43572789
Are we getting alternate TZMs for attacks from dismounted to mounted opponents? Right now, we have the normal set which makes attacking the legs a pain in the fucking ass, and a rule that states that dismounted opponents with short weapons cannot target cavalry "from the Chest up" (why that phrasing in particular? What parts of the arms are above or below the Chest?), but when combined this makes the -only- worthwhile shot an attack to the Belly, whereas many historical riders wore greaves for what should be obvious reasons.
Plus, attacks to the horse have no TZM, and horses are fucking huge, you know?
>>43575350
>>43575542
Anon, increased feelings of CotV are associated strongly with Schizophrenia and other mental disorders (Schizo may or may not actually exist, psychology's a fucked field and has been for a while).
People don't usually actually follow through with those kinds of feelings. Although you *were* a kid -- I remember cutting myself with knives because I liked seeing the blood rise out of my skin and flow away. Shit's fucking weird when you're three.
>>43575861
To expand on the "From the Chest up" problem-
Arms are extremely ambiguous in this situation, whereas in the rest of the book similar situations are delineated along the Waist, which is a very clear-cut situation. This makes the decision even more suspicious.
Thrusting attacks can choose to target the Chest or the Belly, and here the phrase "from the Chest up" works as intended, but Swings aim at the Torso- which includes both the Chest and Belly. Can the Torso be targeted with Swings at all, or how does this pan out?
Finally,the armor section that describes armor coverage terms doesn't include either part of the Back in the list for Full Torso.
>>43576628
>Finally, the armor section that describes armor coverage terms doesn't include either part of the Back in the list for Full Torso.
This is a very old problem. Opaque hasn't made significant change to the game in MONTHS because they're waiting on a book to get back from their editor in Australia.
>there is no Anima armor for the Elbow
>>43579282
This video is intensely arousing
>>43579393
Have another, then.
>>43579425
>>43579393
And once more, with feeling.
>>43572485
>>43572406
What about the Alandi? How's their culture? Attire? Arms and armor?
>>43579450did you post these in /mbg/ or am i just mad
>>43579536You have encountered ME
As depicted, the armor appears to be a Close Helm, with a Bulletproof Cuirass, Pauldrons, Bulletproof Vambraces, (clamshell) Gauntlets, and the aforementioned-to-be-absent Anima Elbows.
That no distinction for this gauntlet type exists in the book seems odd, as well, as it was a deliberate innovation to protect against broken fingers, iirc.
Here we have a man very intent on not dying, armored in some of the best, latest technology.
>>43579282
>>43579425
>>43579450
Dear gods, thank you for posting these. The best videos I've seen all month. My inner knight raises his visor, sir.
>>43579450
They're ferrets, so probably like Mongooses except they're friendlier and enjoy pets.
Something from bit earlier than the previous.
Who doesn't like beakies?
>>43580256
Went to his exhibit in the Wallace collection a couple of days ago to celebrate my brother's 15th birthday, took a metric fuckload of pictures.
Anyone want me to dump them, or should I do that in an Arms & Armour thread?
>>43580350
If you could host a zip for us, that'd be great.
>>43580373
I can honestly say that I have no idea how to do that.
>>43580400
Use 7zip or WinRar to compress all the pictures into an archive. Your computer will consider this archive a single file.
You then upload this compressed archive to your file hosting site of choice, mega or mediafire or somesuch. From there, any of us can download a copy.
Alternatively, Dropbox, and I believe Mega(dot)co as well, can host folders of normal files, but you need to make an account to do so.
>>43580456
>Use 7zip or WinRar
Uh. Yeah. Totally.
>Alternatively, Dropbox, and I believe Mega(dot)co as well, can host folders of normal files, but you need to make an account to do so.
Might just do this.
>>43580504
Google is your friend, friend.
So, how goes it?
>>43580504
>doesn't know how to do basic computer tasks
I teach this to my fourth grade students.
>>43583382
>a fa/tg/uy is teaching our kids
STAT THIS BAD BITCH FOR COV
it's a chassepot
>>43583602
>Jimmy "PR holocaust" Rome has considered becoming a history teacher
>>43584028
He'd be able to accurately recount to the class in thrilling detail the legacy of pederasty begun by the greeks and carried on by their turkic conquerors, relating it through personal experience, and make the entire lesson compelling and memorable.
For what that's worth.
>>43586164
Honestly, I don't think Jimmy would be able to relate and build rapport with middle school and high school kids nearly as easily as with us.
>>43586173
Nonsense. I'm hip and with it, I know the kids' lingo. I know all 'bout that Pirates of Dark Water and Speed Racer.
>>43586521
Quick, Jimmy! What's the viral way to insult someone's shoes?
>>43586532
Call them a Communist and have them arrested by the House Committee for UnAmerican activities.
>>43586561
Your take on the horse and armor problems from earlier in the thread, Jimmy?
>>43586838
I'm balls deep in Fallout 4, I'll get to them eventually.
>>43586942
>Worst Game
Jimmy why.
Are you not hyp for Legacy of the Void? It's even got a similar name to one of your products.
>>43586963
I don't go on /v/ anymore, it makes me too mad. I stick to /pol/.
That said, I see the flaws in this game, but I didn't spend three days pirati-WORKING TO BE ABLE TO BUY it to not enjoy it.
>>43586942
>he says he'll get to them eventually
>I have no Fallout 4
I guess I'll check back in a month then.
>>43580504
>doesn't understand Zipping of files
Jesus, did you just learn what a window was yesterday?
HussarxSamurai fecht when?
>>43587256
When you run itin Dzikie Pola
>>43586942
From the book:
>Some sorts of armor, like mail and lamellar, had the advantage that they were light and could be worn all the time with little problem.
>no special rules for lamellar being travel friendly, or upgrades for the Mail category as such
>Lamellar is heavier than Plate, rules as they are now
I DEMAND SATISFACTION
>>43587318
Yeah, lamellar is in a rather weird place right now that doesn't really seem to mesh with is real-world capabilities very well. It offers about the same level as protection as maille does (after factoring in Layer, at least), while being quite a bit heavier and more expensive to boot. Whereas in reality, at least to my knowledge, one of the advantages of lamellar/scale was that it was relatively less labour-intensive to make than mail.
>>43587056
No, I mean I don't have 7zip or WinRar.I think. Look, I just murder grandchildren and marry aunts in CKII, I don't do technical shit.
>>43587479
Winrar is borderline standard nowadays, chances are you may have downloaded it at some point and forgotten about it. Though you don't even necessarily need it nowadays if you just want to zip stuff, windows has that functionality built in:
http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/compress-uncompress-files-zip-files#1TC=windows-7
>>43587465
6/4/3 vs 5/5/5, so it's a matter of specific strength versus general reliability, taking the two separate, but the benefit of putting a quilt coat under maille is VERY strong (6/5/6).
6/6/6 together, and worse in every way than Anima, but that's fine.
Lamellar seems to be strangely weak, compared to the other options, where it is now.
>>43587506
Always thought lamellar should be 6/6/6 personally.
>>43587840
Ah, but then Brigandine is too weak, and the whole problem is diverted, intact, onto a different armor set.
>>43587306
GizkaxLu Bu fecht when?
>>43587863
I dunno mang.
You have a stat sheet for Lu Bu?
>>43587840
See. my problem was always that lamellar is too strong compared to maille.
It was cheap armor that could be cranked out easily compared to maille that was both labor intensive and required skilled metalworkers to draw the wire out.
If you look at cultures that used lamellar, it tended to be worn by those who could not afford or did not have access to maille. It's use by Byzantium's standing armies is an example, and could be compared with the Lorica Segmentata of Late Republic/Early Imperial Rome; a cheaper armor to outfit large armies economically.
In both cases, maille was used by those who could afford it. Consider that while Byzantine infantry might wear a klivanion (lamellar), the Cataphracts favored a lorikon of maille.
Now lamellar/scale (moreso scale) later on it does acquire a ceremonial aspect and was sometimes worn by those seeking to evoke a glorious past. Byantine dress uniforms or Polish Szlachta wearing "Sarmatian" scale are examples.
However, these were supplemented or replaced by maille and plate, once it develops, when the wearer expected to engage in serious fighting.
Lamellar looks exotic and cool, which is why it is so popular today, but contemporary warriors with exposure to it knew it as a cheap and cheerful armor.
As to the stats, it does compare unfavorably with maille layered over padding, which is fine by me. The price should be lowered considerably but otherwise things seem ok.
One concern is that maille without padding is markedly inferior; this is an issue as there is not convincing evidence of padding under maille until the 12th century and in some cases convincing evidence of absence.
Now, this may be a case of asking the game to take a stance in contested area, but it would be nice to able to run games in. say, the 11th century and have maille over the tunic of a Norman in italy compare favorably to the lamellar of the byzantine infantryman he is riding down. Or whatever.
>>43588594
>this is an issue
Well, how much did one see blunt, dedicated military weapons before then?
Mail as described is shit against blunt, but if the common use of steel maces and the like didn't appear until about concurrently with the padding, then it'd make sense, no?
>>43588594
>lorica segmentata
>cheaper armor
>>43588829
>>43588594
That was laminar armor, wasn't it, not lamellar?
>>43588856
Yes.
Also that anon neglected to mention how Chinese and Japanese preferred lamellar to maille.
>>43588682
The short answer is that maille, independant of padding, seems to have been used by various cultures who also used maces and other blunt trauma weapons for an extended period of time.
Maces and the like were a lot more common in the Middle East and Eastern Europe, and these cultures and those who fought them wore maille as the prefered armor of the elite.
If nothing else, then the Byzantines of HRE, which fought many battles against mace using forces, might have adopted padding a lot earlier than appears to be the case if they were such a game changer.
I am not arguing that padding does not significantly enhance the protective quality of maille. It does.
My argument is that without such padding, maille was successfuly used for centuries and considered the superior form of armor by those who could afford it.
>>43588829
>>43588856
Lorica Segmentata could be considered a form of laminar, and it certainly was not a form of lamellar. The point was that a comparison could be drawn between the two as a cheaper and less effective form of armor used to equip Roman armies.
http://myarmoury.com/feature_mail.html
A slightly more reputable source than an anons ramblings on the case of Lorica Segmentata vs. Maille.
Also do search the myarmoury forums for the myriad of topics discussing lamellar and maille. They are both informative and entertaining, particularly when people try to claim every artwork and sculpture clearly depicts a leather dohickey in the absence of any evidence.
>>43588900
What is the current evidence for absence of padding under mail at those early periods?
>>43588900
You won't dispute the superiority of coat of plates to mail, I hope?
>>43588909
This should be prefaced with the note that there is no mention of padding in any source, no conclusive artistic depiction and certainly no finds.
You have two main areas; literary and artistic.
The literary case rests on the fact that whenever maille is described it is generally worn directly over ones clothing. Poetry generally goes into quite a lot of detail as to what the protagonist and the other noble chracters are equipped with.
We know from later periods that arming garments could be very well decorated, so it would follow that had Roland or Beowulf worn a fine padded coat we would have been told. Likewise such garments are missing from Heriot documents, wills and other legal sources covering arms and armor, as with armory inventories.
Likewise in the Chanson de Antioch for example a blow is said to pierce the hauberk of a knight, go through his gambeson and his clothes to deliver a greivous wound. This kind of detail is missing in earlier sources where such strikes only describe the maille and clothing being pierced.
However the main area I am interested is arming scenes. When the hero puts on his wargear and it is loving described the gambeson is conspicously absent. A late example would be in Chrieten de Troyes Arthurian cycle, where there are numerous passages where the knights are girt for war and the hauberk goes over there tunics. Eric and Enide (verses 691-746) would one example.
One argument is that hauberks may have had integral padding swen or fastened in, which may have sometimes been the case though the lack of any mention of padding prior to the 1100s is still troubling.
>>43588909
Artistically, whenever we have scenes of maille being put on and off it again seems to be worn over clothing. In those cases where we can see the inside of the maille it appears that there is no integral padding.
You could of course argue that the artist didn't include that detail, but then you could argue that the artist could have missed all kinds of details and clearly the vikings had horned helmets its just that no one drew them.
Ulitmately it is fairly hard to argue the non-existence of an item, but every place that we might look to find evidence of padding pre-1100s in Western Europe we come up empty.
The main argument in favor of these illusive items is that maille could not possibly function without padding, which considering the volume of evidence of maille being worn over clothing seems absurd.
>>43589042
Hey, I'm not chainfag. Maille was good but plate is better. Though coats of plates, as opposed to later brigandines, were primarily used to augment a full hauberk of maille rather worn seperately.
>>43580256
So, funny story about Toby here: My HEMA guy is friends with the man, and has seen that suit in real life. Then, that suit got sold to some guy here in South Africa, and is now going on auction.
For about a million rand.
For something which is completely non-functional for anyone else but Tobias and the South African guy.
>tfw you'll never have a suit of armour that costs as much as 10 cars
>>43589276
Was this South African the doppelganger of Dr Capwell that his armour fits?
>>43589230
>>43589144
That's interesting. I was aware there was a discussion about the subject in the context of vikings, but I was unaware that it was a universal thing. I wonder why blunt weapons were not more common on Western Europe, or why there was no adoption of padding in places where maces were common. Could it be that we're overestimating the effectiveness of blunt weapons against mail? Or are we exaggerating the effectiveness of padding against blunt things?
>>43589313
Apparently the...sabatons, greaves, gorget, vambrace and gauntlets? were modified/had separate versions made or something, idk
>>43589328
It certainly appears to be the case in Scandinavia, Britain and France. I believe this was also true in Spain, Germany and Italy but I could not tell you this was certainly the case. Though if evidence that padding was used there I am sure it would have been brought up to justify viking and saxon usage.
I think that one reason for the adoption of the mace as an armor pericing weapon might be that by the 12/13th centuries maille coverage was quite extensive. A knight might be armored cap-a-pie, that is head to toe in mail save for his upper face and the backs of his legs depending on the style of chausses.
Going around the armor is generally more effective than going through, and the shorter styles used pre-1100s make this an easier task.
However my main belief is that maille performs a lot better without padding than many would think. The tendency is to say because maille is less effective at protecting against blunt trauma or thrusts than cuts, then clearly it was no use at all.
Clearly it functioned well enough that it was the main (and in some cases only) form of body armor in Western Europe despite the high cost of production.
>>43589230
Coat of plates is more or less a scale turned inside out though.
>>43589328
Blunt or blunt-ish weapons were decently commonplace in western europe, too. Maces were quite popular sidearms, and of course there's a whole array of polearms that have some kind of blunt-ish hammerhead.
But I guess another factor would be that relatively hefty polearms were already fairly common here as well. If you're in mail and get hit by a solid swing with pollaxe or voulge or something, you're gonna have a really bad time. After all, it's not like being edged makes the impact any less powerful, and having a sharp edge is certainly a nice-to-have if you do end up against somebody with armor that isn't full-coverage.
>>43589429
And each plate is riveted to it's neighbour. Really, brigandine should be no different to plate, statwise.
>>43589464
If that was true, plate would not be invented ever.
>>43589464
The majority of the rivets still tended to be just to affix it to the fabric, rather than each other. Riveting each of the plates to each other in the vein of anima would be much more labour-intensive and make the whole thing completely rigid and inflexible, largely eliminating the very point of it.
Also, the rivets would still be a weak point and would be more prone to failure than a single piece of properly forged plate.
>>43589453
I'm sorry, I meant blunt weapons in the early medieval period, or the migration period. An Englishman serving King Alfred isn't very likely going to have a mace as his sidearm. Of course later in the period there's many, many more blunt weapons, along with the kind of percussive polearms you mention.
>>43587863
Chef Ramsay vs. General Tso cooking fecht when?
Can somebody post the "deader the turk, the harder i jerk" picture?
>>43590381
Any particular reason you want it?
>>43590407
What war is it?
>>43590417
I have no idea. I'm not even sure if those dead guys are actually Turks.
>>43590417
Greco-Ottoman I'd imagine.
>>43590417
Russian conquest of Bukhara.
>>43590508
The artist was famous for drawing realistic battle scenes (i.e. with gore), causing them to be censored.
>>43590527
Vereshchagin's pretty good, one of my favorite artists.
>>43589464
>>43589230
I wonder what happened to Chainfag. Does he still roam image boards, posting images of mail and complaining that it needs buffed?
>>43589464
You could do what Bovine does and say all metal armor is immune to cutting entirely.
>>43592467
I mean... They're not necessary wrong but I'm pretty sure they're not right.
>>43592549
>>43592467
>maille
>immune to anything with a long edge
>it never splits or needs repairing, honest
I can't tell which would be worse. If Dane Axes, Halberds, and Longsword strikes are all shrugged aside with a laugh, or if they fucked up the Blunt AV/DR scaling and made it so that maille actually makes swords kill you just as hard as if you were wearing inferior armors.
Um...
Did we know that Bovine had its own Ballad of the Laser Whales supplement?
>>43592877
Well, it seems to be more like a pulpy 50s scifi supplement.
>>43592877
>sword and planet
What?
Does it also only have literally two reviews both made by company members?
And did we know that they are selling Maneuver cards for as much as or more than the cost of their actual rules?
>>43592877
They're clearly nothing alike, anon.
>>43592950
There is absolutely no reason to beat on them like this. They're already dead -- they were stillborn.
>>43592966
>p-pls stop b-bullying my game
Butthurt Blade developer detected
The rayguns supplement came out in July. The maneuver cards came out on August 29th. Their forums have more traffic than Band of Bastards'. They're clearly still kicking.
>>43593029
>P-please stop bullying my game that I think is completely dead
Wat.
>The rayguns supplement came out in July. The maneuver cards came out on August 29th. Their forums have more traffic than Band of Bastards'. They're clearly still kicking.
167 backers backed their kickstarter.
>>43593029
It always amazes me that BoB the Builder is still in existence. They seem like they're dead for months at a time then pop back up. Their dev time must be even slower than Jimmy's, since they promised a playable release like a year ago in these threads and only have a character sheet now.
>>43592950
Well if the cards are a physical product and the rules are a .pdf it's not that bad.
>>43593093
Supposedly their game is close to done. The devs keep dropping hints on their forums like "guess if we have a maneuver called Slip & Strike". Who knows when they'll actually release a playable game.
>>43593128
Did they have a price drop for their rules? I remember them being like twenty bucks when they first dropped just for the Black and White version.
>>43592772
It seems to trend more towards the former. Even a so-called "swing-optimised" longsword is only about as effective as a simple one-handed club, and even a proper greatsword can only hope to be as powerful against maille as a one-handed mace.
Also goddamn, I forgot how terrible their formatting for the weapons was.
>>43593182
Holy shit, plus one CP for most offensive maneuvers? That's great.
There's something very strange about the damage scaling, though. The greatsword appears to be just a worse blade heavy hand and a half sword.
>>43593297
Maybe they thought two reach steps were worth two DTN?
>>43592772
>Dane Axes, Halberds, Longswords
They refuse to call them longswords for whatever reason, they just call them all hand-and-a-half swords. Afraid of the word "bastard" I suppose. Anyway against leather/horn scale/lamellar armor, a swing-optimized longsword does +3 DR - 3 AVC = +0 damage. Against mail, it does +0 DR - 3 AVB = -3, so certainly mail helps a lot. Against mail without gambeson underneath, it does +0DR - 1 or 2 AVB depending on how they round numbers = -1 or -2, which is still better than inferior armors.
Halberds don't have a blunt DR, I'm pretty sure that's an oversight.
Pollaxes are fucking amazing though, I'll tell you what.
>>43593336
>>43593297
Not just that, but greatswords have their own distinct proficiency from longswords.
>>43593348
It's like they think they're half-pikes or something.
>>43593348
Holy shit, poleaxe is God.
What sort of armor AV are we looking at in this game? Is the scale smaller, like in Riddle?
>>43593401
Right the up here, blind boy >>43592467
>>43593401
You can see all the game's armors here. >>43592467
Know that Bovine lists wounds on a table from 1 to 6, not 1 to 5. There's a bit more granularity in wounds.
>>43593348
>thrusting with the top-spike
>Medium Range
>swinging with the axe-head
>Long Range
>the thrust is shorter than the swing
>the THRUST is SHORTER than the SWING
I'm very confused. Does one only thrust with a poleaxe if they're gripping it right behind the head, or what?
>>43593469
Note that you also get less range holding a sword in two hands than one. >>43593182
>>43593445
The argument for "more granularity" in wounds is a slippery one if one does not make a case for how much detail is enough.
We have 5 because of d10s and 5s are nice, and they have 6 because of d12s, presumably.
Now, if our horses had an extended wound table-
Or more than one target zone. ...or if we had monster hunting rules at all.
Anyway, those wound descriptions annoy and frustrate me. They describe everything but the wound itself. Everything but. Do not tell me how my character reacts, don't impose limp fluff on a scene better left to the maneuvers to define, cut to the chase of it. These are wound tables- how is my enemy wounded?
>>43593469
>the back spike has a longer thrust than the front spike
I think it's assuming a vera croce guard.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uurrSRs5hiQ
