>Bill of Citizens
1. Every citizen has the right to an immeasurable origin point.
2. Every citizen has the right to know which origin points any other citizen has participated in.
3. Every citizen has the right to a ten term contact matrix which can be extended to 300 terms at any time. Such matrices need not be self-consistent; maintaining equilibrium is the sole responsibility of any forward polities.
4. Every citizen has the right to reject the citizenship of any other citizen for the sake of self-consistent negotiation.
5. Every citizen has the right to some form of non-delegated protection of their own rights.
6. Every citizen has the right to navigate to and meet in person with the author of any bills that grant them any acausal rights. Such "visitation" should occur *after* the publication of any such bill.
7. You have the right to declare yourself a citizen of any nation for the sake of consistency in acausal negotiations. Such declarations need not be valid, accurate, or truthful.
--
As for me, you can contact me by delivering a list of this completed bill to me on or before 20:26 PST 02/12/2016. Be sure to check for known metafields of death *before* you jump! Think of it as my exercise of right CR#4.
Pic may or may not be related depending on how many times I have to use it here on out.
Canonical reference:
>>17375870 <https://archive.4plebs.org/x/thread/17375870/>
>>17375883,2
Synchronized.
>>17375870
And God lent Michael a nickel...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Ism2I3HCGU
...sexless in clouds again?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B9SEpeWjVNc
Is anyone really dumb enough in this neighborhood to steal this guy's car?
>>17375870
#6 is nice, but without the ability to navigate, the right is pretty meaningless since you can't meet the person
Also, what if I were to be one of the ones to create a bill in [supratemporal space]
Would I just have people from every-when in the future bothering me about the bill all the time?
That sounds really annoying
Annnnnd the most important question I suppose is
Why do they need their origin points to be unknowable? For safety? Are there people who would use time travel maliciously or something?
>>17375870
You can also come to the /x/discord (voice)chat
https://discord.gg/0k3oVnvCQfOo7cIi
>>17376001
>without the ability to navigate, the right is pretty meaningless since you can't meet the person
Using acausal reasoning, play that backwards:
>if you can't meet the person then your rights have been violated
>if the right is pretty meaningless then your rights have been violated
>if you can't navigate then your rights have been in a violated state
Unfortunately, I can't grant the ability without some manner of problem erupting somewhere in history.
>>17376001
>Would I just have people from every-when in the future bothering me about the bill all the time?
Like this problem, for example. Anonymity is the only thing protecting me from being spawned right now. The moment I publish a traceable identity, I'll likely see some visitation. Technically I'm obliged to provide that fairly soon, some time in the next 30 navigable years or so.
My solution to that problem is queuing theory. The future, in order to protect every citizen's rights in a coherent fashion, will have to ensure that every complaint about the bill can be synchronized back in time to the original author(s). If you don't want to deal with a mass of complaints, possibly armed or dangerous, mind-bendingly bureaucratic, or any of a number of other possible futures that you haven't found a way to comprehend yet, then you'll need to do your best to write a decent bill. Gives people an incentive to get it right the first time.
>That sounds really annoying
Then try to get someone else to write your bills and pray, just pray, that you never get cited as an author.
The sooner we get our rights worked out, the sooner we can open the timeline for safe and unrestricted travel.
>>17376001
>Are there people who would use time travel maliciously or something?
There used to be a few.
"Unknowable origin" just refers to granting asylum to new citizens. Eternity takes all kinds.
>>17375870
>You have the right to declare yourself a citizen of any nation for the sake of consistency in acausal negotiations.
...where your grandma stay, huh ma nigga?
the hood took me under so I follow the rules...
This is why "ma niggas" stay vigilante, "ya hurr dawg"?
>>17376027
>Anonymity is the only thing protecting me from being swamped right now.
Excuse me, typo.
>>17376030
I'll assume for the sake of self-consistency that you're from a future where a bill has been authored to grant you the right to attend this thread. In 24 seconds, no less.
I'm not sure that the situation you suppose is one worth fixing. I DO think it'd be wise to create a way to properly queue contact with the past.
>>17376063
I just want to die.
>>17376091
That's a hard, hard problem. It gets twice as hard when your future contains a divergence event. I will try to engineer a proper queue in my linear future. I guess I probably should've done that before I got to now.
Timeline
How goes the mapping of time?
I been doing the mapping of the psicouniverse and is impossible, the terrain is in practice infinite and ever growing, the closest I tink I will be able to come to a map are rules of tumb, like guidelines, and do and do nots , how you deal with the infinity info?
>>17376154
>the terrain is in practice infinite and ever growing
You're not thinking fourth dimensionally; infinity is a hard problem for most people to grasp. Because of this, in practice, what appears infinite at first is usually just a very, very wide area to roam in which absolutely nothing of interest whatsoever happens. As you say, the closest you can get to an infinite map is a catalog of navigation practices. Don't put the map up front, put the possibilities up front. Let people steer as they will, and build a map based on what they discover. Make the explorers do the heavy lifting; always be ready to make new kinds of discrete-time mapping software.
>>17376154
>>17376172
There's actually a related thread on /sci/ about this.
>>17376179
fuck off we're full
>>17376189
Well then I guess it's about time for queue theory.
Bump for safe time travel.
>>17375870
Does your version of time travel utilize a time machine or is this a spiritual time travel that requires death?
>>17376027
Hey TL good to see you're back.
>Some manner of problem
So, does an origin point require a temporal probability contraction event to exist?
Please elaborate.
>>17377850
Purely physical. We use carefully coordinated technology, advanced silent measurement tactics, and fair analysis of local cultures, if at all possible. The current goal is to map the timeline for safe physical travel. Permanent relocation in time is still considered too dangerous for this time period.
>>17377896
Yes and no. The purpose of Eternity is to map the entire structure of history, down to the last margin. What that means is that an origin point exists for us if it occurs in ANY timeline, anywhere. This is the case for upwards of 90% of all origins points, but for advanced navigation we instead construct coordinates. Some coordinates are more unstable than others, depending on the current structure of the timeline, so many one-shot origin points end up impossible to navigate to without manipulating probabilities a bit. Since navigation is the hardest problem in the field of time travel, we tend to have a decent amount of coordinators ready to design a probability spread for safer and better navigation.
>>17375870
I don't mind like a squeak squeal,,,
...but like not a full on rat like...
>>17382561
Time travel being real isn't a secret and never was going to be one. If you think you benefit from hiding it, then we've been enemies the entire time.
>>17382965
There isn't such one friend that you could find here standing next to me...
...only my enemy
...crush him with everything I own!
>>17382965
>>17383729
Which brings me to the most important question about time travel.
Where are you running to?
More specifically... what are you running from?
You must have made a big mess!
...eh?
>>17384390
If I'd made a mess, I wouldn't be here to observe.
Trite assumptions are not the key to using internet enabled time travel.
>>17384401
Demonic magic such as time travel doesn't interest a fallen angel.
What a bore!
>>17384425
You are absolutely welcome to minimize the thread if you're not interested.
>>17384434
I'm very interested...
Seeing what the "superior" scientists call demonic concepts I've cataloged long ago!
"Down with Hitler!..."
"...All the way down, sir."
Bump for your right.
I should probably point out that declaring yourself a citizen of Eternity is the same as being a citizen.
I don't understand. What do I have to do to get in on this time travel business? I'm looking for an adventure.
>>17385469
My general solution is for you to declare yourself a citizen of Eternity, but in practice that doesn't tend to do much on its own. Granted, I haven't actually told anyone that until just now, so depending on how memetic the idea gets, it could do anything from absolutely nothing to a full scale "invasion" of time travelers from various types of futures. I'm not really authorized to trigger nations yet, to try to respect my status as an observer if you can. The more we coordinate, the more likely we are to get time travel to work for all of us.
>>17385562
>so try to respect my status as an observer
Sorry, typo.
I declare myself a citizen. Come pick me up.
>>17375870
What on earth are you talking about? Can I get some back story?
>>17385643
Kind of hard when you're anonymous. If you're serious about this then try to keep your declaration private for the time being. Make a note of it somewhere that only someone you trust can ever find it. I'm just an observer; I definitely don't have the authority to start nations on my own.
>>17385656
That's a hard problem. Most of the backstory exists in the future, a future, or no future, depending on the status of the timeline. Forward stories are hard to tell without risking the stability of the story being told, you see. Time travelers are in the perfect position to see just how real free will is, and I can assure you that it is very, very real. It isn't a story I have the explicit authority to tell. I've only gained provisional observer status by using a creative acausal trade system for my personal use.
The /simplest/, but least accurate way to explain it is that I'm gambling that time travel will be invented some day, and when that day comes, hopefully I'll be in the perfect position to help stabilize many of the more problematic outcomes that will emerge. I stand to benefit greatly if time travel is real, but I'll only suffer a minor cost if it isn't.
The most *accurate* way to explain it is that the future is metastable and interfering with my personal chronology will inevitably cause damage to some very real regions of space-time. It's been an interesting exercise developing observer status.
TL;DR: I'm trying to grant you time traveler's rights.
>>17385562
Do you have methods to reverse aging?
Could somebody leave for years from a time point on earth and return the next day and continue like normal?
>>17385682
The truth about time travel is this;
There are regions that can be traveled to in space that are so distant that eventually there is data after eons of darkness and ether that replicate our reality perfectly.
There is no REAL time travel, merely incredibly fast space travel to the point you can land in areas of space that look identical to our past or future.
Earth has a certain chronology that includes our history almost perfectly that is duplicated very commonly.
The plebeian notion of "friendship" and "love" are lost very quickly when our bodies adapt to new areas of the cosmos that are so far away.
All conscious entities in truth are very far away from each other.
All love and trust is brought on by observation of unconscious and robotic entities.
