Where do you stand on the hard problem of consciousness?
Is consciousness an illusion and all reducible to matter as eliminative materialists might claim?
Or is consciousness an epiphenomenon of matter that arises naturally from complexity and structure?
Or is all matter fundamentally conscious and the question meaningless?
I ask because I have a problem with my consciousness. I am irrational. Insane. Crazy. Psycho. Schizo. Split-personality. Depersonalization. Derealization. My soul is diseased. Possessed by demons of addiction and fear. My psychiatrists claim I need to take meds (antipsychotics) for the rest of my life. I can hardly blame them. I was trapped in an infinite labyrinth of an ARG I had created before I was given them. But I have also been drinking, smoking and abusing hallucinogens (psychedelics, disassociatives, deliriants, etc.) for the past seven years. I almost got off drugs and meds once but then my ex-girlfriend came in town and mindfucked me back into blazing and consequently to the psych ward. I can still remember all the weird theories that I believed. Every one of them is neither provable nor disprovable. Conspiracies eat away at my mind. I try to practice love and acceptance but paranoia invades anyway. It's hard not to feel threatened in such an egotistical society.
Consciousness is a feature of God (Krsna). We also experience cognizance as we are his part and parcel (qualitatively the same, but quantitatively different). Our consciousness can be purified by hearing, chanting, and remembering the Supreme Personality of Godhead.
>>17146628
It is a hard problem to say the least. Ahhh, I oftenly just try to lessen its relevance because I feel that it is a too complicated and specific matter and that requires a deep and profound study to even try to understand it properly. So I frequently just give it a though or two a day and philosophize about it in the shower and in bed.
Honestly, I don't think you should approach philosophy to try get an answer for your problems, as bad as they can be. If you feel that you need to get away from the World, then that should be the reason for you to get into you. Personally, the only philosophers that I think matter are those that give everything to live in an ascetic way, and only then one is truly prepared to study such complicated matters and properly reflect on them.
About the topic of consciousness, all I can tell you is that as irrelevant it may be coming from such an uneducated wannabe philosopher as myself, is that I think there is a need not only for our consciousness to exist, but also for our souls to do so. There is a need for metaphysics and metaphysical elements to exist, or our lives would be truly pointless. I have written some stuff regarding this in the past, I don't know where I may have those word files or if I still have them, but I honestly think that a materialistic approach to life and the denial of the spirit can only lead to nihilism, The modern atheist "movement" has nothing of philosophy in it, they evade the huge problem that is not having a reason to live. If there is no superior being capable of dictating the objective rules of the universe, be it moral or mathematical, and giving us all an objective reason to live, i don't think there is no point in living, really. If an empty void of darkness awaits for us, if we are damned to lose ourselves in death and eternal nothingness, I don't think there could ever be a point in living at all.
Where are you from, OP?
>>17146793
I understand what you mean. I have read a few books and taken a few courses but am still merely probing the surface of the problem. I wish I had greater willpower so I could meditate and read and reflect more often instead of browsing the internet and smoking weed and jacking off. Then maybe I could know truth for myself. I used to fantasize about becoming a hermit -- but the allure of the opposite sex and the possibility of procreation draws me into everyday existence on an almost metaphysical level (although it could be purely biological).
As far as metaphysics go, aside from spiritual feelings about sex, I had my only religious moments when I was out of my mind. I realized so much. But now those realizations seem pathetic in the face of the nihilistic atheistic scientific materialistic worldview that supposedly "cured" me. How could it have been a worthwhile epiphany if it was just the result of misfirings in my brain? This is where suicide calls to me. Everything I thought about souls *seems* to be wrong. Not only does a cold and empty void await me after death but my life until death has no significance either and given that I am a faulty automaton why should I not choose the easy way out?
I'm from Texas btw but I don't see how it's relevant.
I had to stop drugs before I could make any real progress. It blocked me off from truth, but I was too delusional to see it. It might be different for you, but that would be my first step. Good luck.
>>17146628
It's hard. I'm in an ARG that's similar, except I have to do random things sometimes to "throw off the system." I can't cope with being here. I want out. But only if that means a slightly better existence :/....
Fuck op, I can really relate to the crazy theories, and being trapped in my own arg.
I'm not sure if at this point I myself have delved into complete madness, or am about to surpass time and become a god..
The worst part is knowing your possibly mad, but still wanting/trying to believe in the things you say to yourself.
I still do this as i hold the belief that any residing doubt is what is currently stopping me from achieving complete enlightenment. So I try and try.
The risk of breaking my sanity seems to be a risk I am willing to take, to achieve such madness however.
Best of luck in your recovery op. The void awaits us all.
>>17146628
>>17146644
>>17146793
>>17146875
>>17146932
>>17146942
>>17146954
Why contain it? Just chill... The day of judgement will arrive soon, just do an productive happy life with good deeds
This may be content but im posting it anyway: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qGVxdjmfl8A
>>17146628
So what are your theories OP, if you don't mind getting into it. Life is a game, these theories you made were to help you through it. They'll always be a part of you and the only reason you believed in them was because you believed in something better than this life, something that would make sense. So, if you don't mind, I'd really like to hear.
>>17147001
It essentially had to do with immortality and genetic reincarnation (think Jupiter Ascending but before the movie came out) and games being played by immortals. This was also linked to anamnesis and platonism and gnosticism vis a vis Plato: "All knowledge is remembrance" -- given a cyclical reincarnating universe one could conceivably remember past and future. Synchronicity is the guidepost for acting in accordance with your true will. True gnosis.
>>17147040
When I was crazy I thought the Devil and God were placing bets on me and I was trying to get out of their game. What a strange fucking world this is. I really like your image.
>>17146628
OP, I love you, because you are literally just like me. I don't hit the psychedelics though...
>>17147091
Ya, at first it was a fun game but then it got devilish and I wanted out -- hence the hospital visit.
AIUI, the cosmic consciousness which lives outside of time and space rides in our vessel, in the manner of "being John Malkovich". The human mind while crafty and intelligent, is that of an automaton. Experiment and instrumental observation has shown that free will is an illusion, with decisions being made by the "subconscious" aka human mind before the "conscious" aka observing consciousness is even aware of it.
All reality is an illusion of forces and energy, with there being no deterministic outcome until observed by a consciousness. This is the limit of "free will".
>>17147156
So you're saying I'm AIUI observing a mind and cannot control my human mind? I'm confused by your delimitation of free will.
>>17147199
This has been observed experimentally.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neuroscience_of_free_will#Free_will_as_illusion
>>17146875
OP, I love you, because you are just like me and I am from Texas too, though I moved recently to the Pacific Northwest.
Here's my take on the Hard Problem:
>assuming you're up-to-date on the recent academic recognition of the 'measurable' unit of consciousness - Phi - part of the IIT theory (goggle it)
Seeing as believing rocks and trees and stars and planets are manifest points of action in spacetime, just as a 'conscious' human or insect is also manifest - everything represents information.
You can think of yourself as a complex 'information knot', where multiple types of information are going to be produced during the duration of your manifestation. This can the the amount of air you breathe your whole life, or it can be the total watts you generate, or the people and memetics you influence through time. As a matter of fact, TIME is also information generated by you, like it or not.
Your awareness/consciousness is integral to this information.
What's that? Why are you aware? Why do you always wake up in your body, even after a hard night with the salvia and spice? (I'm from Texas nigga, I know what's up) You're awake because you exist in antithesis to ENTROPY. What the hell is life? Earlier I said dead stuff like stars and dirt represent information too, right? They do, but are entropic in nature, even if cyclical. A stellar mass literally converts itself into radiant energy, mebbe leaving behind some delicious matter.... Life seeks to aquire. Sad as it may be, your standing up represents opposition to gravity, your getting money, hoes and gettin' swole are attempts of the manifestation of AWAKE conscious information trying to augment itself by acquiring more information.
tl;dr dillema is that your physical body exists to consume and exert entropy, but your awareness abides and requires augmentum
Problem solved by choosing the light or dark side anakin...plz no kill younglings tho
>>17147240
>there is no consensus among researchers about the significance of findings, their meaning, or what conclusions may be drawn.
I'm also confused by the picture of the monk, how does the conscious mind train the unconscious mind if the decisions are made by the unconscious mind?
>>17146875
>"a cold and empty void await me after death"
You're assuming nothingness and void can be perceived, and in that assumption you have assigned characteristics to it. "from nothing, nothing comes". It's not a cold state, it's a LACK of state. Don't worry, if it all is nothingess after this, we won't know it.
However, I find the nihlistic/atheistic view close minded and ironically unscientific. I won't say I know what there is after physical brain life, but I'm not dumb enough to assume there's nothing because I can't tell now.
>>17147271
The conscious mind obviously has some sort of influence on the subconscious, in the manner of a backseat driver talking to the actual driver.
>>17146628
I think hard and soft is subjective.
>>17147253
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4574706/
How do you feel about this?
Cool, light side / dark side rap tho. I stay woke. Do some good. It just sucks feeling like a criminal because I love herb.
>>17147253
consciousness like a reverse entropy engine or what? The great balancer?
>>17147326
>http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4574706/
Got me an ecig THC/BCD vaporizer. Blazed as shit, but still up for some consciousness deb8s
I say IIT using Phi as a unit of measurement isn't and end unto itself, and nearsighted of the theorists to celebrate it's acknowledgement.
Just like quantum physics had to name the spins on stupid particles, Phi should also come in Flavors... Like I said, your existence generates data unknown/irrelevant to you, like how much jizz you produce your whole life, and where those proteins end up across time
>>17147326
Oh yeah, all of my quantum physics retardation aside, how do you feel about this?? My current cocktail, complete with your and my post in the upper corner :)
>had to screenshot the photo...camera was too good at making big files
>>17147373
>>17147407
Nice. I'm drinking a beer and having a joint. No fancy vapes for me.
Have you seen this video?
http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/simulation-hypothesis/
Gets interesting circa thirty minutes. What does being an observer mean? Is everything a simulation? I always think Arthur Schopenhauer and Buddhism when I get these thoughts. Maybe I need a gf.
>>17147525
Being an observer means you or 'it' is experiencing a state of existing in this 'observable' universe. It's mostly a quantum physics reference, denoting that your soul and rocks are equal in their ability to be influenced, because they exist.
To understand that you have experienced anything at all is to observe.
>>17147580
ay yo
ay yo hol up
hol up ya'll
so u wuz sayin
so u mean
we be turning waves into particles since iunno far back?
>>17147605
SHIIIIIIIT NAWWW
I be sayin', like, the only times u alive
is when you doin' thangs.
You gonna turn into particles an waves and all kins of ill shit when u body break down and caint maintain none of that awareness no mo.
yo infomation son, it's only collected right heer rite nao, any nigga tell you about some bullshit where yo soul came from and where yo shit goin' is a fucking nigger. You'll die someday, and if theres an afterlife, then it must be fucking awesome, because nobody seems to want to come back here. Also, if there's just your soul breaking down into incoherent waves and shit, might as well live it up and be a fucking Gentleman.
>sorry I broke nigger charcter, I get headaches typing like that
Seriously though, I don't know what happens when you die, or where you came from for sure, but evidence points to this 'now' being the only time you'll exist. So live it up nigga.
>>17147684
So should I write a book or have a kid to make a horcrux of myself? I'm trying to lich it up while I live it up.
>>17147706
Kids...or clones...or robots....
Or if you wanna be life the rest of humanity for the past bazillion years....acquire slaves. No point in lifting a finger, when lesser consciousness doesn't know you're manipulating it, amirite?
>plz write a nice book for us
>>17147747
When I was delusional I had this belief in this grand plan I was executing by planting tiny seeds in the minds of all my friends. The idea was to create an ai memetic warmachine that would purge the Earth of misinformation -- or make the misinformation/disinformation/information triad irrelevant.
How do blind people define consciousness?
Our definition usually involves observation and 3D awareness, but for them it must differ greatly.
I'm gonna google dat shit.
>>17147920
they observe the other four senses, smell, taste, touch, hearing. is their consciousness still localized in their head? do they see blackness? can they see colour if they do acid?
The 5 senses have been expanded to something like 20+ now. Hunger is now defined as a sense for some reason, as is being thirsty. Close your eyes and touch your nose, that's a sense, can't remember what it's called though. IDK, maybe scientists have too much time on their hands.
The Blind question is intriguing. I'd like to know a blind persons views on this.
>>17146628
To be conscious, is to look at things different.
/thread
Matter does not matter without consciousness, and consciousness does not matter without matter.
>>17146932
Same. This is the reason I stopped smoking weed. Gotta have a sober mind for understanding.
>>17147271
>the significance of findings
Note that language. The findings that the subconscious makes decisions before telling the conscious mind about it is a fact. What is being argued is how is this even possible, are humans actually automatons, and impossibru!
Just like quantum mechanics makes very clear statements about the nature of reality and observation, the relationship of everything in the universe, all backed by experimental evidence of course. And yet there is a massive section of the scientific community who pretend this doesn't really exist, but it does, but it doesn't etc.
Great thread ya'll
>>17148717
nice job, you killed it. (bump)
>>17147199
You're given a choice not free will.
>>17150089
we got an authority here.
>>17150098
Quality contribution.
