Previous thread - >>2899049
This thread is for the spirited discussion of CRT displays - Televisions, monitors and projectors used for the playing of retro games!
>Try to keep it /vr/-related: Nothing past 5th gen(+Dreamcast). Slight OT might be okay if related to CRTs (E.G. 16:9 compatible models, flatscreens, etc.) Systems with backwards compatibility are also pretty safe territory, assuming you're focusing on the older games. PC CRTs are also a-ok.
>Produce OC! Get out your real cameras and take beautiful pictures of your CRTs displaying recognizable characters with the kind of beautiful accuracy that brings tears to the eyes of young and old alike! If you take 100 photos, at least one of them will turn out alright! (maybe)
>Try to be as detailed as possible when asking info on a specific model. As always, google is your friend, and we are your friends with benefits. Older archived threads aren't a bad place to look either.
>Share appreciation for others choice of technology and personal philosophy of gaming. As always show courtesy in your discussion and moderate yourselves first.
Discussion of video processing and scaling devices is okay, but try to keep the focus on CRTs and CRT accessories
CRT Pastebin (WIP): http://pastebin.com/1Ri5TS3x
S-Video Pasta: http://pastebin.com/rH2h6C7W
Thread Survey: https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1PhdXJYwA8xModrTV1Yt-i1tvNgwiagpeBx0m_xNIVtc/viewform?edit_requested=true&fbzx=9009823977812318933>>2899049
Still wondering what setting would I look for in the service menu of a PVM to lower the intensity of the blue? I notice there's some bleeding going on.
I have a question about CRT's wearing out, and how to tell what the problem is.
I have a Smile KFC CA-2011 PC CRT rebadged by Viewmaster, and I'd like help determining if the capacitors are failing. It's not anywhere near bright enough unless I set the termination to high - and then it gets blurry from signal reflection along with the fact it's still not very bright.
However, if I displayed any one quarter of the screen white, that quarter can get nice and bright. But if i then changed the whole screen to that same white, it only stays bright for an instant and then fades to being much dimmer overall. So some parts of an image can be bright, but when the whole screen is meant to be bright, the overall brightness fades within half a second or so. Or doesn't fade; just never gets very bright, if no part of the preceding image was bright.
Does this mean the capacitors are wearing out? Given the phosphors are capable of being bright as long as the whole screen isn't, i'd say they're ok. And given the monitor is in perfect focus with the termination set to 75R, i presume the Flyback is in reasonable condition. The only thing left is the fading effect.
I've actually pulled it apart and kinda begun cleaning it and removing the caps, so i hope they're the problem!
Feedback appreciated; i'd love to know if there are certain caps it's not worth replacing, etc.
Photos to follow completion of the project :)
>>2929086
Ah, ok then.
>>2929358
>However, if I displayed any one quarter of the screen white, that quarter can get nice and bright. But if i then changed the whole screen to that same white, it only stays bright for an instant and then fades to being much dimmer overall.
Just a shot in the dark, but perhaps that could be the result of some type of over voltage protection? A full brightness, white screen needs the most power to actually display, and the fact that it suddenly dims when you try to do that, it could be some sort of protection circuit kicking in.
>>2929353
Blue Bias/Gain, I would assume.I have still yet to poke around at the service menu of mine, this is just based off of a glance at an M2/M4 manual.
>>2929562
Yeah, but how do i identify that? Gonna be a pain in the ass for sure.
>>2929604
oh, and thx for trying to help :) I'm aware that BVM's have detection circuitry that will let you know what you're pumping what the set thinks is too bright an image through.
Hmm, might be time to go over the chassis and see if there's anything to be found.
>>2929609
>>2929562
Hmmm, the brightness setting, for a white image, scales up from really dim at zero to still bad but brighter at just under halfway. Sliding the brightness higher from that point does nothing. It would seem weird to include a circuit on a monitor that cut the brightness due to overvolting without giving the user a choice? Why not just limit the brightness range to the lower 50% to begin with?
Does that make sense?
I have an old Grundig in the attic?
Is this an okay brand? I found in on the street years ago and I put it up there for God knows what reason.
>>2929681
Why is this being reposted? Also is there any point to PS3 on a CRT?
>>2929204
Thank god we finally got a CRT thread without a pic of weeb game shit.
>>2929707
Some men ask why. Others ask, "why not?"
>>2929707
From what I can tell PS3 can't out put 240p, but the PS2 can.
On the same topic, is there a list of 240p compatible Virtual Console games?
I have a JVC PVM that can output 480i through to 720p
Will it suffer from lag and upscaling if I just use it for DC and PS2 games via s-vid, which I believe natively output either 480i or 480p for selected titles?
>>2929842
>trading weebshit for autism
>improvement
>>2929562
Hmm alright
Another question is my model 1 HD Sega Genesis seems to be washed out as far as the color on this PVM. Any idea why? Its going though composite.
>>2929842
I just go with what gets requested. Someone asked for cute "moe" stuff and I did what I could to comply.
Battletoads was 4 threads ago, which wasn't that long of a time ago, and there was Bomberman not long before that.
>>2929848
The monitor shouldn't be doing any type of scaling, so if you feed it 480i, it'll display 480i.
Also, S-Video is limited to 480i(or 240p). You'll need a VGA box/cable for the DC and either component cables or a way to deliver RGsB from the PS2 for 480p on either.
>>2929896
Composite output on the Genesis is quite bad, particularly on early models. Before you start thinking there might be a something amiss, test it with RGB.
>>2929914
Well, its weird because it was fine on another TV.
And yeah, I don't have the cash right now to invest in cables so I'm running off composite for the time being. I have it hooked though a pair of Y RCA connectors with my PS2 though an RCA switch. Might try and test it without those splinters.
>>2929848
Your monitor won't lag on anything
>>2929919
That's always a good idea. Remove as many variables as possible when you're troubleshooting something and if it goes away, slowly add them back in one by one until you recreate it.
>>2929681
are you in alaska? this is the only place I've seen saggy roof mobile homes with wood heat.
>>2929670
don't expect any replies for consumer grade hardware in this elitist circlejerk, sure it wll play games but looks old enough that it may be lacking even a composite input. stick to models that have a s-video input. models with a component input tend to have the best picture.
>>2930043
People respond to consumer stuff all the time in here. You just have to consider that Grundig is a European brand and that you're not likely to get many replies when it's the middle of the night in Europe.
Or at least that why I didn't way anything.
>>2930043
Or maybe it's the fact that the guy has a german TV that most of us are completely unfamiliar with.
I've only known trinitrons since I was a kid. I have no experience in anything else.
And as far as it being elitist, you can go ahead and check the survey; PVM users only make up a fraction
>>2929949
note that there are panasonic clones of those jvc monitors and as such you may find the equivalent card under the panasonic brand, BT-YA702P
right now it's about as expensive as the JVC one, but keep look periodcaly look for both and one or the other might pop up at a reasonable price.
>>2929670
Could we get maybe a model number or a picture of the inputs? Do you live in Europe, if not how will you compensate for the different voltage?
>>2930043
Do you even lurk on here? Peeps are constantly asking about consumer CRT's. Maybe you just notice more of the PVM stuff because of the bigger explanations they garner
>>2930336
>Next time I'll post weeb shit to piss you off though.
Appreciated.
Actually, I find myself coming to these threads less and less now that I actually found a good CRT. I just used to come here for advice and hunting tips.
I've got a BVM-14F5U coming in tomorrow, and the manual states that I should have 75-ohm terminators on the out connectors, is this 100% necessary or can I go a couple days without doing so?
>>2930581
the picture will be bright and shitty without them. they're cheap. hell, you could just stick a 75ohm resistor in the bnc input and wrap it around the grounded bnc jacket.
>>2930604
I ordered some but they won't be in for a couple days. I was just wondering whether or not I should wait it out or not.
>>2930605
if you have a PVM as well, you could always output to that, since it auto-terminates.
a guy posted pics of term'd and unterm'd in the last thread, check it out.
what pvm or bvm should I look for? I think 14 inches is good enough for me
>>2930691
check your local craigslist, make sure they at least have RGB inputs.
>>2930661
>if you have a PVM as well, you could always output to that, since it auto-terminates.
>if you have a completely different monitor, just use that instead of waiting for cheap-ass resistors
The fuck is wrong with some of you people? Do you even think before you fucking type? God damn.
>>2930691
Depends what systems you're going to hook up to it. Are you interested in RGB? If not, I wouldn't bother with a PVM, but you'll always have the option at least. Hunt around for a 14L5 if you want to play anything in 480P. Otherwise any other model will do as long as it's in good shape.
>>2930710
>The fuck is wrong with some of you people? Do you even think before you fucking type? God damn.
in case you haven't noticed, this is /crt/, where all of us autists typically have a number of monitors. to daisy chain from BMV->PVM would terminate the video signals.
it was absolutely a valid reply, go fuck yourself.
Hello there CRT friends, I kinda need your help. I may even posted some pic a long time ago but now my 14" TV which I had since childhood is in the sheer need of assistance. I won't ask how repair it myself, just if it's an easy fix and some tech details I could tell the guy in charge of fixing it.
I live in a PAL territory, so naturally my set is equipped with a SCART input. What I think happened, the SCART plug I was using was SO heavy it brought down some mechanical components inside the slot which are interfering with normal behaviors.
What I got most of the time, was what you could call a forced RGB rainbow all over the screen which changes in intensity according to what video the TV is fed. After tons of trying to adjust the scart input, I just slammed my hand over the TV and voila, she came back to life, but not quite so.
Apparently now the default vertical stretch (I think it's called amplitude) has gotten crampier, but the thing is I couldn't even touch the thing without the amplitude going crazy (sometimes the whole video signal was teared down into a pair of inches, I couldn't even see scan lines anymore).
Now even when I get lucky and it stabilizes, it gets worse because it even pans the whole screen up and down (until half of the lower screen is gone beyond overscan) while maintaining the same amplitude. Even the TV's own sounds create small enough vibrations to fuck something up eventually.
http://www.mediafire.com/watch/fwkwaas658o2zb2/Video0024.mp4
This is a potato recording from a while ago, look how much jumpy the output has become (I'm using composite, I fear ever trying RGB again). Every instance of touching the casing results in the signal going nuts (on 0:35 I just pick it so it comes stable, but then I repeatedly slam my hand above it so I can show you the aforementioned RGB rainbow effect at 0:45).
So /crt/, what's your verdict? Can I still restore the amplitude to its factory settings and make sure the output is stable?
So just how bad are HDCRTs for retro gaming? I wanted one so I could have an all-in-one solution for retro, 6th gen and the little bit of HD shit I care about.
>>2930898
Exactly as bad as an LCD
>>2930898
You're going to get a lot of opinions so just test one out
>>2930890
Broken solder joints at the SCART port but possibly more, I think that resoldering everything that looks crappy will help very much.
>What I got most of the time, was what you could call a forced RGB rainbow all over the screen which changes in intensity according to what video the TV is fed
That looked like the CRT lost it's focus voltage.
It's very likely that the solder joint of the wire is broken, it goes from the flyback transformer to the neck board and supplies the CRT with around 7kV. If you're unlucky then it falls off and short something that will fuck up the entire chassis.
>Apparently now the default vertical stretch (I think it's called amplitude) has gotten crampier, but the thing is I couldn't even touch the thing without the amplitude going crazy (sometimes the whole video signal was teared down into a pair of inches, I couldn't even see scan lines anymore).
That set might have a trimmer (variable) resistor which defines the vertical size, also a dead capacitor could cause that too.
Good luck, anon. This whole thing looks very fixable to me.
are any pal snes games fullscreen?
>>2930898
Assuming you mean PC monitor CRTs, they are objectively the best display. Use with sharp-bilinear shader to get nice clear pixels with no ugly scanlines.
>>2930920
It's impossible to output more than 239 lines of video with any SNES but there are PAL N64 games that are fullscreen like Zelda: Ocarina of time.
>>2930917
Thank you, thank you very much. I mean it. You have given me hope, here's a close up from when the TV looked good.
>>2930920
No PAL game can really get fullscreen because most PAL TV's overscan starts around line 512 (256p), and SNES can only render up to 239p without hassling the borders. The first game that reaches 239p that I can think of is SMW.
>>2930917
Another thing: right now the TV started randomly humming what I believe is the 15KHz sinusoidal wave. It was really audible (although the volume was very low) but it seemed to go away when I started pushing the power button. Not even outright pressing it, just pushing it slightly. Is this bad?
>>2931021
>Not even outright pressing it, just pushing it slightly. Is this bad?
I don't think so
Maybe the switch needs to be replaced, good luck finding something compatible.
>>2930364
Thanks! That's great to know.
I almost regret buying it, its a great monitor but only having composite, s-vid and SDI makes it limited usage.
I was told I can get rgb to SDI converters relatively cheap, but all the ones I see are hundreds and hundreds.
If nothing else it'll be nice for 480i games!
:o)
>>2931057
How can the switch be involved in producing such noise? Thanks for all you've done anyway.
New pickup, how'd I do?
>>2931128
And the back
>>2931131
Newfag here, what am I even looking at? Are you going to use the rack mounts when you set this up?
>>2931067
don't, it looks like a great monitor, even if only using it with s-video at best for now. If you ever part ways, be sure that the person that gets it knows how good and for what usages it is.
Any chance of taking pics of it running games ?
>>2931147
It's a Sony BVM 14-F5U, just picked it up from a liquidation store (purchased through eBay). The important thing is that it accepts RGB inputs, as you can see from the back. Now I just need to get my SNES cables for RGB output.
>>2931234
How many hours on it?
>>2931242
I'm back at work now, so I'll have to wait until I get home to see.
>>2931242
i know you're proud of your incredibly crazy find, but it's a big bummer to us that have BVMs with 50k+ hours.super jealous
>>2931340
I paid about $120, but like I said I haven't checked the hours yet
>>2931338
Might only have 50k on the chassis, but the tube has been replaced. I want to say the tubes would have been replaced every 30k or so in professional use?
>>2931338
Hehe sorry. I knew it was in fine shape from the pics but got a BIG surprise when it turned up and I took a peek at the status page...
>>2931340
Paid £100 but a combination of poor packaging andUPSmeant the bezel got pretty badly smashed up on its way to me. Whipped a good one off my beater F1 and it was pretty much good as new. Seller refunded half too so I'm happy with that.
>>2930747
>>2930710
>>2930661
autist who was asking about termination here, I actually do have another PVM (it's half broken doesn't deguass and the screen is damaged, which is why I'm getting this BVM), so their response was totally valid, but I don't have cables to daisychain them so I'm kinda boned, I'll have to wait until my Cheap-Ass Resistors arrive.
Anyway, I have http://www.ebay.com/itm/Female-RGB-Euro-SCART-to-4-BNC-Audio-Cable-Sony-PVM-Sega-Genesis-SNES-Neo-Geo-/201493707446 for my SCART connections. It states it has RGB + Composite Sync, is there a difference between "Composite Sync" and "CSYNC"?
For instance: https://www.retrogamingcables.co.uk/sony-playstation-1-2-ps1-ps2-rgb-scart-cable-lead?tracking=5543fb4c077bb
These cables offer 'composite video + sync' or 'CSYNC' for an additional cost, is there any real difference in these cables in my instance?
I'm looking to buy these SCART cables for my Sony PVM 14-M2U monitor.
http://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/201493707446
I noticed the eBay seller, wookieewin, had the same cable only with a built in sync stripper.
http://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/191766429870
Does it matter which cable I purchase? Like I said, I have a Sony PVM 14-M2U if that helps.
>>2930927
I doubt he means monitors. It's more likely he's asking about crt's like the hi-scan trinitrons, Xbr models
>>2931131
That's one fine ass
>>2931345
I like this kind of thinking because I have a monitor with 35k hours
So I just got one of these bitches here, and all I can say is I'm fucking amazed by the step up in quality I've achieved over my genesis's shitty composite cables
Only problem is it doesn't have a built-in pass-through for sound. Not a problem for the genesis, since I pull audio from the headphone jack anyway, but I can't get sound from my other consoles. without an adapter.
http://www.amazon.com/kenable-THROUGH-Adapter-Phonos-Switch/dp/B0055P2JFY/ref=sr_1_14?ie=UTF8&qid=1453339705&sr=8-14&keywords=scart+audio
I bought this piece of shit, but it's trash and has an incredibly fragile and loose connection. Anyone know where I can get a decent scart cable/adapter with break-out RCA audio? There are similar-looking ones on amazon, but now I'm not sure if they're all just as bad.
Also, why is this wookiee guy the only person in america that's selling SCART-BNC cables? His prices seem like a ripoff compared to retrogamingcables.co.uk
>>2931740
Here's the audio breakout you should buy. http://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/161612341108
>>2931752
Oh sweet, didn't know her store was back up. Thanks.
>>2931159
Definitely will take pics of both running games, in just waiting on cables for the JVC to run ps2. Will run vc on Wii on 240p on the Sony Trinitron via component cables this weekend hopefully.
On that note, will the standard component cables for Wii work on pvm? Or does it need a sync cable and or scart first?
>>2932273
If the monitor accepts YPbPr Component, they'll work.
I'm going to assume you're talking about the M2A that you got along with the JVC, so yes. You just need to make sure you go into the menu(normal menu) and set that input to Comp-INT.
Should I be concern
>>2932289
It's a broadcast monitor, they all have a shitton of hours on them.
>>2931131
wait a minute is this the one the guy posted as a PVM NOT A BVM??? I think I saw this one.
>>2932294
Depends, was the seller based in Anaheim?
>>2932283
OK I'll look at that on the weekend. This week has been so flat out I haven't been able to even look at them, can't wait to start fiddling.
I think I'll get last blade 2 and metal slug to try 240p mode
>>2932313
well all I recall were someone selling a BVM posted as a PVM, I saw the price thought it was a little steep for a P so I was just looking at it and noticed the sticker on the back definately said BVM not PVM and thought " hmmm... might be a good deal if it's not bullshit" but I already have a really good PVM so whatevvs.
>>2932362
Wait, I thought they both meant the same thing? Or do you mean pvm being specific to Sony Trinitron branded?
>>2932383
Hmm.
Does this only happen with the Genesis, or anything over composite. If there's a Chroma knob on the front(or a setting in the menu for the slightly newer PVMs), try turning it up. Chroma not being set right can lead to things looking unsaturated to just straight up B/W.
>>2932405
No, it doesn't happen with any other systems over composite. The chroma looks fine and is fine for other systems.
Just the Genesis.
Any tips or recommendations for 15kHz/31kHz multisync monitors? I'd like to get one so I don't have to have a computer monitor and regular TV next to the Dreamcast and switch between them since not all games support the 480p mode.
Are there any brands/models that can be recommended or should be avoided?
>>2932362
That's actually pretty funny because that's probably the seller I just got the same BVM model from. Noticed that it was listed wrong only after I payed, but the person was cool and cleared things up. He had it listed as PVM 14N5U when its the same BVM 14F5U the other guy is talking about in here.
>>2932712
*And I mean it works too. I live a state away from the seller so it got here fast. I just don't have much to say about it since I could only test my PS3 (its all I have component readily available for) on it while I wait for my SNES scart and scart to bnc adapter to get here.
Still, I played a bit of G-Darius on it through the PS3 and that was pretty great. Tried a couple other PS1 titles, but I'm honestly feeling like I'm going to be most impressed by how the SNES looks like on it.
>>2929670
Looks oldschool, probably has a SABA or Phillips counterpart. If it has SCART you're golden. But it's an old style CRT, so no fancy stuff.
>Tfw I still can't find a RGB monitor on CraigsList
>Checked on eBay and sorted by zip code and the closest matches are hundreds, if not thousands of miles from me
>Even regular ass consumer TVs don't pop up much, and if they do, they're usually 13" composite/mono-only Chinese pieces of shit
>All the Goodwills in the D/FW area are no longer taking TVs or monitors of any kind
Jesus Christ, I really don't want to shell out for an XRGB. How in the hell are people easily coming across some PVMs and I can't find shit?
>>2932802
I'm in DFW and got a nearly new NEC XP29 from an Oklahoman seller on craigslist around 2 years ago. I also got a decent Viewsonic PC CRT from cl. Just keep checking, you never know what might show up.
>>2932802
It ain't easy niggy keep at it
>>2932802
It's all about patience anon.
You just gotta wait for the right opportunity to come up.
>>2932956
And don't jump on anything to fast, look it over and make sure it's a good deal. Otherwise when the next better tv comes along for cheaper(or free) you'll be kicking yourself.
>speaking from experience
How do I access the Analog Input on a BVM? I have my cables hooked up and I'm powering on my SNES but no image is appearing? Help me familia
>>2932995
It would help if you let us know the exact model bruh
>>2932995
do you have a remote?
>>2933019
p.16 http://www.cjoint.com/13jv/CADhEm4GSS3_bvm14f5u_operations_manual.pdf
input a channel, set up what signal that channel should show
>>2931740
Alright /crt/, samefag here with a follow-up question.
So the component transcoder delivers an absolutely beautiful picture for my genesis. However, my saturn doesn't display right. I'm getting a super-distorted picture; I'm guessing it's a problem with the sync.
I'm using csync cables from retrogamingcables.co.uk designed for NTSC saturn. I have a model 1, but I don't believe this should matter.
Unfortunately I don't have a PVM (yet) so I can't test out the SCART cable separately from the component transcoder, but from what I've read online, other people have no problem putting saturn RGB through a transcoder and getting an image. So my next thought is that they could've messed up and given me cables designed for a PAL console? Or maybe there's some other issue?
alright, got my bvm-14F5U showing an image. Is there anyway besides brute force to get the Absolute Video Settings for this thing?
>>2933037
have you read the manual? you should read the manual.
>>2933039
I guess skimming it isn't really an option?
>>2933042
at least read the relevant parts. I don't know what Absolute Video Settings are, but getting the image right on mine took about 5 minutes on the menu in your pic.
>>2933037
You mean global convergence and geometry settings?
In the maintenance menu, E board. Password is 1111 unless it's been changed
how does everyone clean their CRTs?
>>2933060
Like with a cloth or something
>>2933064
Microfiber, I've got a pack of around 50 for cheap.
Different question, what's the best way to ship a pvm/bvm?
This guy is telling me he'll instapak a foam piece bubble wrap over the screen, then into a box, then in a cushioned box with large packing peanuts and 80lb packing paper. Marked as fragile with delicate instructions.
Is that safe enough?
>>2933079
I got a pvm in the other day (14inch) and it was packed similarly and arrived in relatively good condition
>>2933079
On a palette
Anything else is a huge gamble if you ask me
>>2933079
>Marked as fragile with delicate instructions.
I have my doubts that the people in charge of shipping would care.
I think it's a better idea to claim that the box has "lithium batteries" inside and must be handled with care or else it could catch fire and that's why they can't take any risks here.
Paid 120 for a 14in BVM with roughly 4000 hours on it.
>>2933079
Probably safe, but holy shit that must cost a packet in shipping. How far I'd it going? I'd its a few hours drive, consider making a road trip?
TWO BVM-20G1U's located in brooklyn up on craigslist for $325 each, might be worth looking into if you are local.
>>2933239
We know, you won't stop posting pictures of the service menu's counter.
>>2933382
nah senpai, i don't have a 20, mines 14. haven't posted any pictures of it yet.
>>2933382
Lol that was me.
For the record I've only posted it twice. Must really stick in your craw eh?
Whats your audio solutions /crt/
>>2933446
I want to get a nice pair of stereo speakers so I can plug everything into a receiver
Nothing before Xbox would have 5.1 sound right?
>>2933452
I've heard that some speakers are capable of damaging CRT screens, I don't think any consoles discussed on /vr/ are capable of surround sound.
>>2932960
Had that happen to me jumpes the gun and overpaid big time for a bvm, but live and learn.
>>2933446
>STR-7015 receiver
>SS-B1000 speakers
I've posted a shitty pic of my all-Sony setup before, but here's just the audio components. They work great, and old Sony receivers sound clean and they're basically invincible.
>>2933452
>Nothing before Xbox would have 5.1 sound right?
Negative. Unless Dreamcast did, but I don't think it did.
So I've got a PVM-14M4E, everything was working fine but suddenly when I turn it on the image is purple and it slowly fades out into black.
I can still load the status menu & service menu without issues even when this is happening. Under the status menu it says my colour mode is YUV instead of RGB even though I've got it hooked up by SCART via BNC.
Is there a factory reset I can run on it since I think one of my friends was fucking with the service menu options and has probably written something to the memory or does anyone have an idea of why it's happening?
>>2933460
Dolby surround/pro logic is old as fuck.
http://www.mobygames.com/attribute/sheet/attributeId,136/p,9/
>>2933469
I'm fairly sure there are DC games that support Dolby Pro Logic, I think even some N64 games do. Not true 5.1, but pretty damn cool if you have the receiver and rig for it.
>>2933452
A pair of creative pc speakers, shielded. For their size, they pack a surprising punch and have really good lows.
Before I tried some shitty Trust pc speakers bought at flea markets, I was kinda amused they put fake piezo tweeters.
>>2933474
beat me to it and better info, bravo and thx anon.
>>2933479
There's more games in the Pro Logic 2 list, but not exactly retro. Its the improved version of dolby surround/pro logic.
http://www.mobygames.com/attribute/sheet/attributeId,206/offset,0/p,7/so,1a/
>>2933472
Ok now the image is in colour again but it quickly fades out to black. Doesn't do it on a PS2 via BNC or SNES via s-video but when connecting the SNES via BNC it fades out.
What are the best CRTs of the 2000's ?
I want to upgrade my PC monitor
>>2933496
pretty much anything over 20 inches has a confirmed good res and refresh rate
hey guys i found a 20 inch crt tv today for 35 dollars
it has a flat screen but just 2 componant cables from what ive seen
is it worth picking up?
i plan to get a sega dreamcast or NES soonish
what would i need to hook it up to those or my PC?
thank you
there's a sony monitor line not often talked, the SSM series (security surveillance monitor I think ?).
While it seems many are B&W, have composite only, some do have S-video in, and can be as high as 500 TVL.
So for those composite purists, or those who can't/don't want to go above S-video, searching for a Sony SSM might be a good middle ground, or an entry into SD monitors.
>>2933512
here are specs
>>2933505
Do you know model number or res details? Might be a good pick up!
dont know if off topic but what is the maximum resolution you can run through each type of cable?
from my research
composite-480i
s-video-480i better color
component-720p
hdmi-1080p+
I have a samsung blu-ray player hooked up to a crt through composite and it will run 1080i but gets a weird stutter when it switches menus etc. someone told me this is impossible with composite. will also run at 480p. without the stutter.
>>2933538
I think it has to do with unshielded magnets inside of the speakers.
excuse my piss poor phone quality
testing out the ps2 240p patch
>>2933532
i dont
can i still get decent quality if all it has is componant?
>>2933571
component can go up to 1080p, but no bluray player supports it because MUH HDCP
>>2933590
googled that, it is lame.
>>2933571
>s-video-480i better color
More luminance bandwidth than composite that brings a sharper and clearer image.
The chrominance (color) information is equal to composite.
>>2933590
I think it can go even higher, it all comes down to the cables, parasitic capacitance (reduces bandwidth) and the quality of the ADC, DACs, amps..
It's similar to VGA, only a different sync and color format.
>>2933359
it's a dude from here that's selling them.or maybe it's you :o !!!
>>2933704
any help
>>2933761
what type of SNES? what type of cable?
>are there any other options?
well, you're in /crt/...
>>2933775
its a north american SNES, and Im using a NA hdtv, some samsung 5000 series hdtv its last years model.
im looking for options that involve me just using my current tv, dont have room for a crt in my room.
>>2933780
forgot to mention, im just using the standard cables that the snes came with. i dont even know what those are called. sorry for being such a nub, i havent done any retro gaming since i was a kid, and back then I thought it looked and sounded great on my oldschool big screen tv.
>>2933754
oh shit is it actually, it's not me. I was gonna grab one but they have like scratches or something on them
>>2933780
>>2933785
Yeah if you're using the basic Composite (Yellow, Red & White) cables, you're gonna have a pretty lousy picture with a good bit of lag. Assuming you have the original SNES (not the mini), it outputs RGB natively.
RGB, if you don't know, if different from Component (the Red, Green, Blue, White & Red cables). Your HDTV won't have an input for RGB, which is why you'd need something like in your pic. I don't know much about the different upscaler models; maybe someone else can recommend one. I know that the framemeister is the best, but that setup would cost you hundreds.
>>2933329
> cost
$179 shipping
>drive
Cross country
im hoping the box will be big enough that it needs a palette
>>2933785
have you tried setting the tv to 4:3 (narrow on my aspect options. also check that the cables connections are clean and are getting a good connection (the outer ring can become loose giving a poor ground). try to avoid running the cable along side power cords. n64 and gamecube use the same composite cable. if you have one of those consoles you could try swapping cables and see if that helps. also try a different input on the tv if it has multiple.
>>2933503
thanks
why are 16:9 computer CRTs so hard to find? id love having one for multimedia and movies.
>>2933872
I've tried setting the tv to 4:3, yeah, same problem. It's weird, I notice its worse on some games, and every game its really bad on certain screens. i'll try your other tips though. thanks, anon.
>>2933801
yeah thanks for the help!! I think I'll pick up a fragmeister, I don't really mind the price tag (I'm spending a ton more on boxed snes games anyways)
>>2933908
If you get a framemeister, make sure you get the right cables. EuroSCART and JP21 look identical, but it'll only accept one of them (I think JP21, but you should check)
>>2933908
just checked the website, which is the solaris japan one, right? will cost me 38200 yen, which convereted into canadian dollyroos is almost $500. jesus. welp, can anyone here confirm that the video quality is just *THAT* much better, or maybe recommend me one I can get from the US, or preferably, Canada, that would cost less and perform as good as a framemeister?
and the framemeister will work with a lot of consoles, too, right?
>>2933914
what do you mean by right cables? you mean the cables that I will be using with my SNES, or the cables the framemeister comes with...? if the latter, no idea what you're talking about, what is EuroSCART and JP21?
As I've said, I live in canada, and am using a standard north american television and north american snes unit. the old one, not the mini.
>>2933894
Because 16:9 started becoming more standard at the same time that LCDs started taking over.
>tfw bought a PVM online and the seller is shipping it
wew lads, wish me luck. I'm getting it for a steal, all things considered, but all it takes it one asshole dropping the thing to fuck my day up. I stressed how important proper packaging was, but only time will tell.
It's shipping via fedex. I wonder if I can call them up after it ships and I have a tracking number and tell them to hold it at the fedex office so I can pick it up myself. One less trip from the office to my front door, which means one less chance for someone to throw around a 75 lb box.
>>2933894
16:9 HD CRTs are pretty common.
>>2933915
like I said, hundreds lol. if you're just looking for picture quality and don't mind the lag, cheaper options will work for you, but I don't know anything about those.
If I understand correctly, they should work with any console that outputs RGB.
>>2933916
The cables that feed into the upscaler. It'd be Console > SCART cable > Upscaler > HDMI cable > TV
There are two types of SCART cables - EuroSCART and JP21. They look exactly the same but are not compatible. The japs just switched a couple pinouts to avoid paying royalties. All you need to find out is which one to pick, which is something the upscaler seller will specify.
to be honest, the fact that you're going from a shitty composite signal on a flatscreen to being willing to spend hundreds of bucks in no time kinda worries me. you should probably read up a bit before shopping. http://retrorgb.com/displayrgb.html
>>2933032
>designed for NTSC saturn.
You mean you got an ntsc cable? As in JP-21?
>>2933940
does the framemeister come with these scart cables? does it matter if I go euroscart or jp21? will they work fine with my NA snes?
Is this picture still relevant for people new to CRTs and retro video? Or is there something particularly wrong with it?
Been thinking about making one specifically about the 4 major types of CRT (SD CRT TV, HD CRT TV, PC CRT, pro monitor), and their different uses.
>>2933952
>does the framemeister come with these scart cables?
no, AFAIK it's not even provided with the female scart-to-minidin that connects to the framemeister.
>does it matter if I go euroscart or jp21?
yes, go with euroscart unless you're adamant on getting rarer, japan only JP21 cables
>will they work fine with my NA snes?
If you get one made for NA SNES.
>>2933979
RGB is missing the sync signal, should mention that you can get it from the composite signal, the S-video Y signal, or sometimes from a dedicated pin from the console.
Maybe should also point that SD-only TVs with component input are fairly uncommon.
>>2933974
hmmm
all ik is it only has two (colored holes) instead of three (the usual that im familiar with) i could see
is there a way to check whether its composite or component without powering it on?
>>2933952
>>2933990
I'd double-check this dude because I'm not sure he knows what he's talking about. I'm nearly certain it does matter whether they're EuroSCART or JP21, as I've said a couple times now.
I get that this thread is here to discuss this stuff, but dude, do a little bit of research on your own. between the two threads, you're asking an obnoxious amount of questions that are easy to find the answers to.
>>2933084
I had a 20" set shipped on a small pallet. The pallet was ripped to pieces and the set looked like someone had dropped a cinderblock on it from two floors up.
The other attempt I made was a 14" set, which I had spacefoamed. and it arrived in perfect condition.
>>2934012
I wouldn't say fairly uncommon. all the trinitron wegas from the early 2000s have composite + s-video + component inputs, afaik. At least every model I've ever seen. And wegas are common too. I see them all over the place
>>2933417
Not him, but nah, we're just sick of fuckwits bragging. One post is more than sufficient. If it becomes relevant to discussion or to a question you want to ask, feel free to post again, of course.
>>2933571
Component tops out at 1080p, doesn't it? And HDMI does as well. To go higher res/rate on a
PC you need to use DP or dual-link DVI, no?
>>2933925
I feel you, I just bought a 14-M2U a few days ago, and I'm a bit concerned. Hopefully it will be alright, the guy stated that he'll be double boxing it, and plus it seems like he was an experienced seller.
>>2934076
Hdmi can do up to 4k 60hz maybe higher depending on which version is being implemented
Recenty got a RGB cable for my wii because I want to play pc engine and wonderswan games through it on my pvm. Cable was pretty cheap and I can't get anything but a rolling picture out of it (before you point out the obvs yes my wii is pal). I opened the cable up and from what I can see on this site http://members.optusnet.com.au/eviltim/gamescart/gamescart.htm#wii the pinout is in total about 50% completely wrong.
2 questions:
1st - have I read this completely wrong and the picture should be fine?
2nd - is the diagram on that site correct if I attempt to rewire it that way?
Thanks.
>>2934183
another pic
>>2934183
That cable looks fine to me, I don't know where you got that it is 50% wrong, unless you think that the fucking plastic sheath colour on the cables indicates what signal the cable has.
Rollover is caused by wrong sync (Sony stuff tend to be bitchy about needing c-sync instead of composite input), or maybe wrong rgb switching voltage on pin, errr... 8 and 16, I think.
>>2934213
if he is connected to the pvm via BNC, he doesn't need 8 and 16.
but if he's using one of those uncommon CMPTR connectors, then he might need pin 8 to carry voltage.
guys is composite really that bad?
i remember using it as a kid
>>2934224
>if he is connected to the pvm via BNC, he doesn't need 8 and 16.
If he connected via BNC then he also needs a sync separator on the composite video line.
>>2934259
It's not THAT bad, and some games even used the faults of the composite signal to create more colours. It really depends on the game. And it's a huge step up over RF that many consoles shipped with.
>>2934267
which one is composite
>>2934276
The blurry one.
>>2934276
Neither, they're both filters emulating a game at a resolution way larger than ever intended for the game.
>>2934283
I should also add that the game in question is Super Contra, a game that isn't displayed in anything but RGB, and the filter in question isn't meant as a composite substitute by any means.
what if you're using a vga box? how does the quality turn out then? on dreamcast for example
>>2933512
>>2933515
>SSM-14/20N5U
Looks to be just a slightly cut down PVM N5U.
>>2933848
>$179 shipping
...Is this a monitor on ebay, because this is the same quote I got from someone recently.
>>2934267
>If he connected via BNC then he also needs a sync separator on the composite video line.
Unless it's a particularly old set, PVMs are perfectly fine accepting CVid for sync.
Need to put this up on the Megaview for a more accurate screen comparison.
>>2934330
VGA is 31khz RGB; Increased resolution (and a progressive video signal rather than interlaced with the vast majority of the Dreamcast's library) over 15khz RGB, but other than those points, the picture quality is the same.
so basically if you have a 31khz crt (the majority) you just use it? unless you have one of those old radeons?
>>2934430
>31khz crt (the majority)
PC monitors, sure, but your normal CRT tv is 15khz only.
>unless you have one of those old radeons?
If you have a VGA box/cable for the Dreamcast, you just connect it directly to the CRT monitor, no interaction with a computer what so ever.
>>2934303
composite is much better than RF, I have both for a snes and it is quite a difference. worth it just to get rid of signal noise.
RF is the superior connection
Is there a reason why people here seem to use CRT TVs more than CRT computer monitors? Or is it just to not have to fuck around with vga conversion and stuff. I'd love to hook a NES or something up to my old Dell CRT instead of buying a PVM or something on ebay.
>>2934529
CRT PC monitors do not support the low resolutions that retro consoles output.
Almost every conversion is shit (component <=> RGB is the exception)
There's a GDM-F500 nearby that is really tempting to get, but I don't know if I really want to drop $100+ on something like that.
It'd blow any other PC monitor I've ever had out of the water without a doubt.
>>2934213
Did you look at the link I posted? The pin out is completely different. Perhaps it's just hard to tell because of the shitty photo? Sorry about that.
I have tried both the normal sync (through a breakout rgbs adapter) and composite as sync (through another breakout pass through adapter I use for sound)
>>2934259
Some system's composite signal is shittier than others. Most Nintendo consoles have pretty good c whereas the mega drives is pretty bad.
>>2934267
That picture is comparing a lcdlike every line look to 240p double strike look and has nothing to do with composite/rgb
hey guys, the obnoxious dude from last night here again. I promise, this will be my last post. just have a couple more questions before I spend half a grand on this stuff.
so... basically I want to keep using my hdtv, no room for a crt. I want to run my snes to my hdtv, and get a really good signal, one thats better then my regular composite cables that came with the system. plus, theres some wiggling problems with the video signal... cant even play games really.
anyways... to clarify:
I need the following items: my na snes, a SCART cable, that will plug into my SNES, a special SCART converter, that I will plug my snes scart cable into, and feed into my framemeister, and then I will run the framemeister to my HDTV, right?
If anyone could give me a link to finding this scart converter thing, that would be great too, I've tried looking on ebay and can't find it.
My shitty Sylvania seems to have shit the bed. I don't have any other CRT TVs to replace it with, but I do have quite a few CRT monitors laying around. Does an RCA to VGA adapter exist that isn't shit and wouldn't cost more than it would to just get a new TV? And if I used one of these monitors, would it work for light gun games?
>>2935092
The only non-shit RCA to VGA converter, at least that comes to my head, is one of the older XRGBs, but good luck finding one of those for a decent price.
However, from what I've heard those cheaper RCA to VGA converters on ebay aren't so bad. So you shouldn't have too much trouble with those.
As far as light gun games are concerned, if I remember correctly you wont be able to use light guns with 31khz CRT monitor.
I have some questions about this CRT I recently got.
Why do I get this scanline effect on 240p games?
What causes this weird smearing bullshit and how can I fix it? The smearing is a lot more visible with a bright color right next to a dark one like in the picture.
>>2935141
How old is the TV, and what kind of signal are you playing your game from?
Often, shit like this is just the symptom of a worn out tube, especially when mixed with a lower-quality video signal.
>>2935154
This TV is from 1992 and I'm using composite. This TV was my parents' and they used it a lot, so the tube probably is worn out.
>>2935173
Sounds like it. It might not even be that worn, but composite is a very weak video signal. You'd see some blurring like that even on a newer set.
I still have my old game TV from 1987 stashed away at my parent's house. Now that I've been spoiled by a PVM, I kind of want to dig it out and see just how abysmal everything looks in comparison, especially considering I was using RF most of the time. But I played every game from 2nd gen to 7th on that thing. I'll be damned if I'll ever get rid of it.
>>2935051
>The mini uses a custom 8-pin mini-DIN connector for RGB input. Most users will want to connect either SCART or RGB21 style cables via an adapter. The Mini ships with a Mini-DIN to RGB21 adapter. Never directly use the European standard SCART cables with the RGB IN adapter that comes bundled with the Mini. Standard SCART is wired differently to the Japanese only RGB21 standard and regular SCART cables will not work with it.
http://junkerhq.net/xrgb/index.php/XRGB-mini_FRAMEMEISTER#Important_:_about_the_supplied_RGB-IN_adapter
I'm thinking about getting a 5" PVM for playing Famicom. I'm looking at a Sony and a JVC, any recommendations? JVC stuff is cheaper because it's not Sony, but does anyone have any experience with small PVMs?
>>2935284
at 5" you might as well just not.
>>2935141
looks like misalignment dude
>>2935285
I knew I would get at least one response like that. It has to fit on my desk, I live in a small apartment. I used to play NES on a 5" B&W TV anyway so I know what the size is like.
>>2935290
are you sure a 14" couldn't fit on your desk?
>>2935284
the 8 inchers are very popular
>>2935292
I measured, I can't even fit a 9". I have a two-tiered desk so it has to fit under the top part.
>>2935293
Looking at 8", how are PVM medical monitors? Any different from video production gear?
>>2935305
No. Other that the fact that they have likely exclusively been used to display the insides of peoples' butts.
>>2935313
kek
>>2935305
first of all you should look up the dimensions of the 8 inch pvm (it isnt 8 inches tall)
then if it will fit look for a seller on ebay who will ship the damn things and tell them to double box it
>>2935371
I found a ton on eBay, but the 8" models are generally over 8" tall from the dimensions I've found online.
>>2935295
I know the feel, I'm so sad I can't fit a 36' trunk in my room
>>2935092
Use RGB cables and a line doubler that outputs VGA. Then use a scanline generator. Don't try to convert from composite.
>>2929707
>Also is there any point to PS3 on a CRT?
Free downsampled AA at the cost of resolution. Also better color/black levels, motion and no noticeable input latency.
So yeah actually, it probably looks half decent outside of the fact that he's not going to be able to read tiny ass text.
Hey /vr/, I bought a tiny pvm just to test the waters before moving up to something larger scale. I have a giant trinitron, but I want to figure out the strange inputs that are standard on pvms.
I have it plugged into a Wii with component female to bnc male and I'm getting a rolling picture; does this have to do with the sync that these monitors have? I can't seem to find the menu to mess around and get it to stop rolling.
>>2935686
what?
>>2935686
why would you buy a pvm when you already have a giant trinitron?
>>2935686
What size is that?
>>2935686
>Wii with component female to bnc male and I'm getting a rolling picture
is your wii set to 480p? that pvm can't handle anything other than 240p/480i.
look for a sync button, you don't want ext sync on if using component.
lastly, make sure it can take component as well as RGB
>>2935241
So the mini doesn't come with a european scart to mini adapter, so I'll have to get one that works with the european one, right? Other then that, I should be good, right?
>>2935840
or, I could just get JP21 scart cables, right? are those included with the mini, and if not, are they harder to find and are there any compatibility problems with the JP21 scart cables with a na snes versus the euroscart ones
>>2935729
It says component/RGB on the back, the wii is set to 480i.
>>2935851
then you must have external sync on, find a sync button and hit it.which i assume you've already done, so i'm out of ideas
>>2935849
These aren't included with the framemeister, are they? http://www.ebay.com/itm/Super-Nintendo-Famicom-SNES-SFC-csync-XRGB-Japanese-21-pin-RGB-JP-21-cable-lead-/201405920500?hash=item2ee4ba74f4:g:waMAAOSwHnFVymPE
And if not, if I get these, everything should work for me, right?
snes > jp21 xrgb > adapter thats included with the framemeister > framemeister > hdmi > tv is how it should look, right?
so essentially what i need is the console, the jp21 xrgb scart cables (not sure if these are included with the framemeister, need clarification), adapter, framemeister unit, and an hdmi cord and hdtv... right guys?
>>2935880
Right right, no problem. Yeah I hit the sync button and that causes signal to show, but it's rolling.
>>2935887
did you try v-hold?
anyone in rochester area interested in this bnc switcher?
8 input, RGBs/RGsB/RGB/Component/Composite/Svideo with balanced/unbalanced audio input, 4 output of the same
US$25 bucks and it's yours (i got it for 37.50)
other anons that would require shipping i can give you quotes, if there's any interest.i ended up grabbing a 16 input model
All I want is a CRT of decent size with component inputs.
I have a CRT (garbage CRT) with S-Video inputs.
I have an HD-CRT (garbage digital input lag) with component, hdmi, s-video and composite inputs.
I have a PVM-1380 (garbage compshit only pvm) with composite input.
And NONE of these solutions are satisfying. Especially with this (currently wasted) SCART -> YPbPr set up I have for my Genesis and Saturn.
I wish god would descend down from the heavens and open up a company producing brand new CRT televisions.
Just fuck my shit up senpai!!
>>2936016
sell all of them and get a good pvm.
>>2936016
try to find a Sony KV20/24-FS120
According to manual, SD only but with component in
>>2936016
Just grab any 90's set from Europe
>>2929204
No really, why are these threads allowed here? There's nothing even remotely video games about them. You should go to /g/ or something.
>>2936086
the idea is they think crts are only good for retro games
but they're also superior to IPS pc screens as well
so yeah i think it should gather on /g/
>>2936036
The PVM-1380 (I would imagine) is next to worthless, as is the generic set with s-video inputs. Maybe I could get something for the HD-CRT but I doubt with all three I could get money to buy a decent sized pvm.
It doesn't help that I'm in Canadanistan where we get charged $20 just for shipping something up from the states, nevermind paying shipping for a 24" CRT set...
>>2936069
I'd love to, I've been looking off and on for years, and looking particularly hard for a few months now.
>>2936070
Shipping costs man, I'm talking wanting a 24"+ size set here.
>>2936103
very true
ive been making the crt generals a few times there and they fucking despise it
they'll only acknowledge the tiniest tiniest of problems crts have but wont acknowledge ANY of the problems of IPS
the only like brand new shiny plastics
i have a question guys
how does a vga crt monitor look compared to a 15khz tv
ik its not exactly the same but how much worse does it look? (and i would assume it looks better than lcd)
ive got a nice crt monitor and im considering if its worth it to pick up a pvm as well
>>>/g/52551749
why was this deleted?
>>2935912
Hey how was the packaging on your 16 input model? I was surprised with have overwrapped it was, or maybe im just use to subpar packing practices.
>>2936115
it doesn't look as good for consoles, never mind the fact that IT DOESN'T SUPPORT 15khz SIGNALS HAVE YOU READ THE THREAD??
If I have a PVM-14M4E is it worth picking up any of the following:
BVM-1410P
BVM-1411P
BVM-1415P
All 3 of those are local to me and I was possibly thinking about getting one if the quality jump was enough.
>>2935881
>snes > jp21 xrgb > adapter thats included with the framemeister > framemeister > hdmi > tv
correct (I feel like I've said that a couple times now)
the ebay seller you linked is legit. you should buy from there because, no, there are no SNES JP21 cables included with the framemeister (something you could have easily looked up in seconds)
good luck and please don't come here for troubleshooting when you end up buying the wrong stuff
>>2936345
ik it doesnt support 15khz but what will happen? what will it look like?
>>2936474
You dont get an image...
I like mini crts. They are cute.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ML3F3fXPs4
