Is this worth playing? Dungeon Crawler thread I guess.
Whether or not it's worth playing is based on your value system. If you see value in understanding where first person dungeon crawlers came from, then it's very much worth playing. If you only see value in playing games for fun, then you will probably not get much out of Wizardry, because its gameplay is arcane and tedious.
>>3276825
I thought it was fun
I would suggest playing V first. They cut out some of the bullshit from the original trilogy and spiced it up with more variety without becoming too easy or different.
>>3276825
Make sure you play New Age of Llylgamyn too. Finding the PC version is nigh impossible but it's easy to get the PSX one.
>>3276972
I think the Towns port of 5 is cool.
4 is a special kind of hell in any version.
>>3276982
>4 is a special kind of hell in any version.
Yeah that's for sure.
>>3276982
what port?
>>3278472
FM Towns?
>>3276953
I have the SNES one. I know it's slightly censored but it's otherwise not too shabby I think?
Playing M&M VII, just about to decide whether go Dark side or Light side.
Extremely important question - Day of the Protection -
>Simultaneously casts Protection from Magic; the Air, Body, Earth, Fire, Mind, and Water Resistance spells; plus Feather Fall and Wizard Eye on all your characters.
>Master: Spells are cast at 4 times caster’s Light Magic skill.
>Grand Master: Spells are cast at 5 times skill level.
but one thing the description leaves out - what Mastery level are the spells itself cast on?
Simply put, do I even need to know these spells (on some of my characters) for them to be cast?
And if I don't, then does this mean that with Grand Master Light Magic, I am able to cast Grand Master level Protection from Magic (so I don't need a Cleric for GM Body Magic for protection from death attacks with Protection from Magic)?
>>3279554
Yes, Day of Protection casts all those spells on Grand Master level, so if you have Sorcerer with Light Magic you will never need a Cleric.
Finished playing Ultima Underworld 1 a few weeks ago and all I have to say is god damn that was a great game to play. I was amazed by all the little details and on a technical level just how advanced it was given its age.
Also how's the magic system? I never really played with it and might try a magic playthrough for UU2.
>>3279162
It's probably alright but I think it's more than slightly censored. Monsters are covered up, classes renamed, alcohol turned non-alcoholic and mention of death removed.
The Japanese Super Famicom port would be a better option in my eyes.
I like dungeon crawling but I hate party based games. What are my options?
>>3281147
Roguelikes, Diablo, Ultima Underworld would be common choices.
Xanadu is a game I think could got more attention.
>>3281147
Stonekeep (to some extent), Anvil of Dawn, Ultima Underworld and System Shock (make sure you get the Enhanced Edition).
Arx Fatalis and Dark Messiah are more recent ones, although I don't know if the latter counts as a dungeon crawler technically.
>>3281178
>Arx Fatalis
I know it's not retro, but Arx is fantastic. Not enough people know about it.
>>3276825
Dungeon Crawler?
Uh...
It's Dungeon Creeper.
>>3281147
Towers: Lord Baniff's Deceit
>>3281209
Excuse me?
>>3281290
He's autistic.
>>3281121
I have the SNES one and it takes a little doing, the censorship conspicuously fucks up a bunch of critical puzzles.
A riddle involving rhyming "breath" with "death" is fucked up because every reference to "death" is changed to "DOOM", making it harder to glean that the answer is "VAMPIRE"
A red-faced, hiccuping drunkard is changed to "the Ruby warlock", removing all references to alcohol in his dialogue. The key item to get past him was originally "rum" but it was changed to "soda".
"Give the rum to the alcoholic wizard" is obvious. "Give the soda to the nondescript wizard" is nonsensical.
Oh, and once you do give the warlock the soda to access his floor, make sure you find the shortcut leading around him before you leave the area - if you have to go through his tile again, he will ask you for soda once more - and there's only one soda in the game.
The only way to get past him at this point is to fight him, and this resulted in every GOOD character in my party becoming EVIL, locking one of them out of becoming a LORD until I could grind his alignment back to GOOD by running around, waiting for an optional encounter, and choosing not to fight the monsters. Each time you do this there is a random chance of one of your evil party members becoming good. By the end of it I had got my clerics and fighter back to good, but my wizard was still evil.
>>3276831
Nah, I found the core gameplay pretty sweet and addictive.
The balance in the first 4 is retarded, though, some Japanese spinoffs do a way better job with encounter design while still keeping that feel from the first games.
>>3282130
To be frank wizardry IV isn't so much a game as it is a high concept performance art piece
>>3276825
If you like dungeon crawling WRPGs it's one of the best.
>>3281147
Dungeon Master with only a single character, instead of a party. It's like "hard mode" for experienced dungeoneers.
Go with the Amiga version btw, it has improvements like being able to drink directly from fountains (instead of having to fill waterskin first). Also it has the data disk (Chaos Strikes Back) and the sequel game.
>>3279162
just buy the Japanese version. you can get it off Amazon for about $15. it has the option to set all the text to English. That's right -- you can play it uncensored And with correct dialogue. No reason not to since modding the SNES is so easy.
Also if you ever want to suffer through Wizardry IV, same deal applies to the PS1 game "New Age of Llylgamyn", but it is much more expensive.
>>3282956
There is an extra mode of Wizardry 4 on the PS1 that gives you more control over your monsters but it can't be fully switched to English.
>>3282963
That is the one unfortunate thing. Also some menus in normal Wizardry IV are only in Japanese, but it is nothing critical. Only spell descriptions and the save/load screen, I believe. All plot critical stuff will still be in English
I've heard wizardry is very good, and it established dungeon crawlers. I've also heard it's harder than calculus.
>>3282296
that is one cool screenshot.
Is anyone familiar with the Wizardry games on the PC Engine? Specifically, do any of them have the full-English options that other Japanese ports do? I know that V is only partially-english.
>>3281178
Stonekeep has a great atmosphere/music
>>3283018
PCE is the major exception for Japanese Wizardry ports. 1-4 are also only partially in English.
They also have a different system from most other ports where a character's race determines their maximum stats instead of being fixed to 18.
They're also odd in that 3 is separated from 1 and 2, though I don't think it makes a big difference since 3 has you start from scratch anyway.
4 has some changes that make it easier but it's not like the PS1 arrange version either.
>>3282990
>calculus.
>hard
>>3283048
math was never my strong suit. and I was just being expressive.
OP here. I have been playing Wizardry 1: Proving Grounds. Just got to floor 3 and fell into the pit.
>mfw
>>3283562
>and fell into the pit.
The one with all the warning hints?
The important lesson is never to open camp on a pit to heal. You'll fall into it again when you close the camp.
>>3281159
>Xanadu
I love you
>>3283048
I think dental calculus scores at least a 4 on the Mohs scale
Currently playing World of Xeen, it was fun for the first couple of hours but now it has become too repetitive. I've got a quest log with 20 fetch quests and 95% of the time I'm just spamming S and A. I recommend it though if you're looking at basic 90's rpg fun.
One question though: what's the point of mixing up the two games? I hate having to keep up with two completely different storylines at the same time.
>>3283773
To make one even bigger game. Both sides eventually tie together and the story reaches out to the previous games in the series.
>>3276982
Didn't the japs make wizardry 4 easier?
>>3284487
Yes, I haven't played them for too long because I dislike translations but even with all those change to make it easier it still seems like an insane challenge.
so, Might and Magic III: Isles of Terra.
it's a SNES game. anybody played it? what did you think about it?
I think it's even more elaborate than most early Wizardry games. works the same way for the most part but has really nice features and a lot of eye candy.
>>3284527
I think the SNES port is terrible because they copied a control scheme that was already stupid on computers.
Might and Magic is nowhere as complex as Wizardry. From 3 onward it's particularly simplified.
>>3284547
>Might and Magic is nowhere as complex as Wizardry.
what the heck? M&M 3 has a whole town you can walk around in while Wizardry 1-5 literally doesn't. it's just one town screen with a shop, a tavern and a training center. if we talk gameplay, I have to find time to get into it some more but I doubt it's even less than the bare bone combat system of most early wizardry entries.
>>3284562
Walking around in towns is a flashy gimmick. In some games it's downright annoying because it takes forever to get to the important places. In M&M 1 or 2 you could at least have random encounters while in the city but 3 ditched those entirely.
>but I doubt it's even less than the bare bone combat system of most early wizardry entries.
You'd be surprised. Just spam S and you're practically done. No thinking or planning required.
>>3280890
>Also how's the magic system?
In a word: clumsy. Kinda like Dungeon Master but much more impractical to use.
>>3283035
>>They also have a different system from most other ports where a character's race determines their maximum stats instead of being fixed to 18.
That's what most ports do since at least SNES
>>3284527
Play the MSDOS version, SNES is trash for M&M
>>3284619
You mean the SNES port that was released in 1999 and doesn't have that system?
PS1, SS and WS don't use it either. Only PCE and GBC have it.
>>3284634
Probably a deja vu thing but I distinctly remember dealing with it in the SNES version that way
