I'll start.
>Nintendo saved video games after the market crashed in 1983
>Thinking they didn't
>I think OP is onto something here
>The Dreamcast died because of piracy
It was already pretty much dead by the time people learned it could play burned discs.
>>3262119
>I post on /vr/.
>>3262130
>thinking the market ever crashed
1982 and 1983 were two of the most profitable years for games. With software being developed rapidly for a number of computers, like the new Sinclair ZX Spectrum, as well as the new Commodore 64, European game publishers became very wealthy almost overnight. Meanwhile in Japan the arcade scene was flourishing along with a bourgeoning home console market with the release of the Famicom and SG-1000. 1982/3 were probably the best two years for video games in history.
>>3262130
Uhm. They did. What are you, 12?
> I like to watch Classic Game Room and give $50 dollars a week to his patreon and jerk off to his videos
>>3262154
PC games and arcades probably didn't suffer much but no one wanted consoles anymore. Too many on the market. And this is mainly a US problem in general. Bringing up other countries and how they may have been successful in 83 is irrelevant.
>>3262157
Do you have the reading comprehension of a 12 year old?
>>3262162
Why? They're video games. The world doesn't revolve around America. Maybe instead of video game crash you should say, 'American home console market crash'.
>>3262119
That's true though.
>>3262168
It's redundant to call it the American video game market crash because everyone knows it's about America unless you're a moron (which you are).
>>3262154
The market crashed big time. You're objectively wrong if you think otherwise.
>Saturn was originally designed for 2D and the 3D was slapped on
>>3262168
As much as I usually don't like to revise how things are named after the fact due to zeitgeist, this is one of those that feels warranted. I'm sure there are many that have the mistaken impression that the videogame crash had global ramifications when it really only applied to Atari (the big guy) and a few smaller console makers in the US. Even pertaining to just the US, it's not like computer games and Arcade games crashed.
The Crash affected the UK and Canada too, it wasn't just the United States.
>>3262154
>1982 and 1983
>most profitable
Mien fuckhing Shides
>>3262119
>The Sega CD was a failure
>>3262207
There are a lot of young people who get all their information from American youtubers. They just repeat what they hear. They genuinely believe video games died and Nintendo resurrected them. I've heard kids say 'Sega Genesis' instead of Mega Drive. It's very funny when they play a game like Mario for the first time and it's either much faster or slower than expected.
>>3262119
>PS2 should be retro because it's been 2 years since dreamcast was made retro
>>3262213
Do you know anything?
>>3262119
>PlayStation 4K isn't real
>>3262219
This. Usually accompanied with a picture of Marky Mark: Make My Video or some shit. It was far from a failure.
>PSX
>>3262692
What's wrong with Playstation X?
>>3262694
What does the X stand for again?
>>3262702
Ten
>other people on the Internet are impressed by my deep knowledge of obscure video game trivia
>>3262702
Xtreme
It was the 90s.
>>3262178
Outside of the US and surrounding (it's often called the NORTH AMERICAN video game crash) people didn't even notice anything of the video game market crashing.
I the videogame market had not crashed Atari would have been the biggest console today
>>3262797
>I the videogame market had not crashed Atari would have been the biggest console today
So SEGA always loses?!
>>3262727
/thread
>>3262219
>The Sega CD was a failure
Commercially it was, but still an underrated system.
I also hate all the revisionist history that claims the reason it "died" was because of all the "terrible" FMV games.
At the time, FMV in a videogame was fuckin' mind-blowing, even if it was a pixelated mess. Also, many of those games got strong reviews.
>>3262797
I think game consoles would be far more divided by region. Europe and Japan didn't care about Atari. Europe and Japan would probably be the exact same regardless.
>>3262821
It wasn't a commercial failure.
>>3262821
>Sega Force
>Mean Machines Sega
It's like trying to defend the virtual boy with NIntendo Power publications.
>>3262828
Did you miss the EGM and Gamepro reviews? Gameplayers was also high on the system and its games.
>>3262828
The FMV games were praised at the time though. It was only years after the fact that people started to shit on them. In fact, for an add-on, the sega CD sold very well. It beat their expectations in fact. That's why they made the 32x,
>>3262831
>>3262836
I'm not shitting on the Sega CD, I have one and like some games on it. But still you coul dhave just posted only the gamepro and EGM ones, posting the Sega magazines is kind of nil.
>>3262837
Yeah, my intent was really for only the 3rd party publications to be considered.
I just hate the myth that the Sega CD "failed" because no one wanted to play any of its "terrible" FMV games, when everyone at time was impressed by them.
It also had all the key titles any kid would want at the time. Had arguably the best 2D Sonic game, had Madden, NHL, Mortal Kombat, NBA Jam, best home versions of Lethal Enforcers and Final Fight, as well.
I suppose it wasn't a commercial failure per he >>3262836 said, but I think the primary reason it wasn't 10 million selling add on/console was due to its price. About 530 dollars in today's money, and if the prospective buyer didn't have a Genesis already, ouch.
+1 on the Silpheed. I remember being floored by the game as a kid.
>>3262862
Yeah the Sega CD sold decently considering it was an add-on that cost twice as much as the base console. It's like the Genesis was the add-on to the Sega CD, not the other way around.
CD had essentially three pillars, all we're designed for the wealthier more hardcore kind of player.
1) FMV games, felt like radical and novel arcade technology in the home (e.g.Night Trap)
2) Enhanced editions of Genesis games with cool extras (Earthworm Jim Special Edition)
3) Games that were just too ambitious to fit on cartridge (e.g. Snatcher)
It was never aimed to be a truly mainstream product, just sort of Sega's way to create a 'premium' segment of Genesis software. Not an entirely successful plan, but a moderate one.
>>3262219
If only it could of played dvds. Sega would still be making consoles!
>>3262168
Everything actually does revolve around America, and the market crash being referred to was specifically American regardless.
>>3262220
Nice try, friend.
>>3262965
>Everything actually does revolve around America
This. There's a reason why Sega continued making consoles after the Mega Drive, even though it failed in Japan, whereas NEC practically gave up after the PC Engine when it was moderately successful in Japan.
>>3262968
How is that bait?
>>3262971
>I've heard kids say 'Sega Genesis' instead of Mega Drive
Do you really need to ask?
>>3262978
I have heard that. It shows how American e-celebs are influencing people who don't know about retro games.
>>3262119
>IT WAS NEVER CALLED PSX
>>3262987
I think there is nothing wrong with looking for information, but actually seeking to feel gratification from being knowledgeable to anonymous people on the internet due to your "deep" vidya knowledge is kind of retarded indeed.
>>3262986
>PSX WAS THE OFFICIAL ABBREVIATION OF THE PlayStation Ecks
>>3262983
I mean if you're from yurope it's very stupid to call it the Genesis, but it's not like it's actually 'wrong'. As a USAer I have found myself thinking/saying Mega Drive, but it's mostly due to my obsession with only Japanese /vr/ hardware.
>sega made good games
>>3262220
>I've heard kids say 'Sega Genesis' instead of Mega Drive
Australia-kun, you really need to go somewhere in life. At your age you really need to stop caring about shit like that.
I know you're probably sterile and too autistic to get sexual mating, but maybe look into donating money to children in hospitals or something, you will feel better when you're in your deathbed and think back about your life.
UNRELATED TO OPS TOPIC
Classic Game Room is so goddamn comfy. Lord Karnage/Mark is such an easy going guy
>reviews are him talking about games and videogame related stuff in a way that makes it seem like he really loves videogames
>seems like he genuinely loves making the videos for people
>never acts like a cynical dickhead about everything
>doesn't just whine about what he doesn't like in games like most reviewers
>easy to listen to voice
>doesn't come across as fake
CGRundertow is unbearable though. You're like 35 let your balls drop already m8
Mark has been doing it since 1999 too so he's technically a legit retro reviewer by /vr/ standards.
Top guy.
>>3263014
>You're on /vr/, too, kid.
It was just advice, take it or leave it.
If you want to keep shitposting about console wars from 25 years ago and show everyone how retarded you are, be my guest.
When you're in your deathbed, it will be you and only you.
>>3263020
>give your money to greedy charities, goy, you'll feel better
Yeah, nah, fuck off.
>>3263024
It was just an example, since you seem to care about kids but you can't have kids of your own.
You could also go and help the kids yourself without a middle-man.
Do it.
>>3263015
t. lowest common denominator
>>3263028
Fuck off with your stupid slave morality.
>>3263030
Alright then, as I said, take it or leave it.
You will suffer a lot in your deathbed, guaranteed.
>>3263036
Why is that? Not everyone is a christfag who feels the need to help strangers.
>PC Engine and PC-FX are hentai game machines
>PC-98 and other JP computers are hentai PCs
>>3263039
Are you an atheist?
Damn Australia, you're old for being so edgy.
Anyway it's not about being of any religion. Helping kids is not going to church.
You seem to care a lot about how kids in your country call the Mega Drive.
Well then, instead of complaining about it on /vr/ to show everyone how stupid and autistic you are, why don't you actually leave your house and give away PAL Mega Drives to kids in hospitals? That way you'd be helping kids, and also doing something about your autistic itch about kids calling it the "Genesis" which bothers you so much.
>>3263045
I have a religion, just not a stupid Semitic one. How about I just ignore them when they ask for 'Genesis' shit? That seems to work. If I ask them 'what's a Genesis' they'll point one out or a game in which case I'll say 'oh a Mega Drive! Sega's third greatest console. Why didn't you say so? Everyone knows what a Mega Drive is!'.
>>3263048
I'm curious, what's your religion?
>How about I just ignore them
That'd be cool and actually smart
>>3263030
lmao
get a load of this nietzsche acolyte
99% his 'religion' is some kind of neo paganism
>>3263052
Asatru.
>>3262119
>Shit retards say
>>3262135
>The Dreamcast wasn't hacked within 6 months of its US release
>>3262154
>The European computer game scene of the mid-80s was meaningfulor even good
>>3262207
>A company like Atari failing didn't have global ramifications
>>3262227
>Shitty European developers going from selling 100 copies of a game to 500 because decent video games were unavailable means gaming was in a good place
>>3262742
>Only Americans had Ataris
>>3262821
>>3262836
>>3262862
>Low bandwidth 16 color FMV games were mindblowing nearly ten years after Dragon's Lair
>>3263054
don't insult Nietzsche by associating Australia-kun with.
>>3263057
>>3263057
Only Americans did have Ataris. Honestly, no one else gave a fuck about them. You clearly don't know shit about games outside of America, you stupid Nintendo fanboy.
>>3263060
A very quick glance at European auction sites makes it pretty clear that's wrong.
>>3263063
>American auctions have Master Systems, therefore the Master System was a huge deal in America!
Fucking moron.
>>3263068
Enough that had Sega failed at that time it would have had an impact on the US gaming scene
Why is australia kun always so angry?
Every time I see him posting, he's angry and insults everyone, even when you're not being hostile toward him, his replies always end with a "cunt", "moron", and other insults.
That games on the PSX don't age, and having a wife that doesn't own a Retron 5. Also disliking "cuck" as an all-purpose epithet that instantly wins any argument. Or disliking dank /pol/ memes and not believing that Hiroshi Yamauchi was a crypto-Jew Yakuza boss who murdered Satoru Iwata posthumously as a spirit for dishonoring his company with the Wii and Wii U which were both colossal failures no matter what sales figures have to say about it. And not playing all your retro games with 2xSAI filters in glorious 720p on a factory-second Vizio.
>>3262119
le contrarian 4 chan young person
>>3263072
All of those Ataris were sold in the 70s before Micro Computers and Commodore took off, you fucking idiot.
The Master System failing in America would have hurt the market how?
>>3263075
Did you know, Hiroshi Yamauchi wasn't actually a human being? His body was a vessel that enclosed 7 oni from 7 different regions in Japan.
>>3262119
>MGS overrated
>>3263081
Memes rock!!! \m/ :DD
>>3263078
>Sega failing with the Master system would have affected the market how?
By leaving a vacuum for Nintendo to fill unopposed kind of the way European devs stumbled/were sucked a little ways into the very narrow window that opened in the mid-80s before Japanese manufacturers stepped in and they got btfo
also
>All the tens of thousands of 7800s and 5200s in Europe were sold in the 70s despite being manufactured in the 80s
Australia-kun you so crazy
>>3263089
>implying the MD needed the MS in the US.
Nothing would've changed.
The 5200 was never released outside of the UK. The only Atari thing to do well outside of the US was the ST.
>>3263020
Who's going to be in your deathbed with you?
>>3263015
hehe truxton sega genesis meme lol
>>3263104
I'm too young to think about my deathbed, unlike Australia.
But hopefully my sons and grandsons. Gf is starting to bug me about having a baby, but I still want more time to spend playing the vidya.
>>3263110
I'm too subtle. My point was that everyone is IN their deathbed alone. You might have people gathered about, but actually in the bed? Kinda weird imagery. Though now I'm thinking I may need to kill some motherfuckers to surround myself with. For the company.
And take it easy on Aus. It's okay to be alone. Man can be an island. What's good for you, isn't what's good for him. Different strokes for different cocks, you know.
>>3263097
>Implying that if Sega had failed the way Atari failed they would have still released Genesis
>Implying competition is anything other than good for a market
>Implying "video game console" wasn't synonymous with "Atari" until the mid 80s
You know, I have a theory why Europeans get so butthurt about the video game crash term. It's because they're too retarded to understand that a crash is good for small companies exactly the way they were too retarded back then to take advantage of it and let Japan do it. Their games were shit before during and after the crash. Keeping standards low makes it easy to ignore events at the premium level.
>>3263135
>whiteknighting one of the worst shitposters on /vr/
>>3263137
>Atari is better than any European publisher
Spicy bait, brother.
Japan = Europe >>>>>>>>>>>> USA
>>3263154
What are some good European publishers? U.S. Gold is one of the most infamous publishers of retro vidya and they are britbong despite the name.
>>3263162
Why is it that Americans talk shit about European games without knowing anything about them?
>>3263169
Why do Europeans answer questions with questions when they're only being asked to name a single good European developer?
I would rather have a 2600 and a copy of Yar's Revenge than every single European game ever released.
>>3263169
I'm not even american dude.
>>3263175
You're clearly displaying that you don't know any European publishers. You also seem to think Atari is a developer lmao.
>>3263162
Sega of Europe, Nintendo of Europe, the list goes on
>>3263182
>knows diddly squat
>add "of Europe" at the end
>????
>PROFIT
"Zed Ex Spectrum". This is an AMERICAN board and we speak AMERICAN here. Love it or leave it, Pierre.
>>3263187
>>3263179
>Yar's Revenge was developed somewhere other than in house in Sunnyvale, California
>>3263194
>telegames is atari
>>3263162
>publishers
Are you not aware of the difference between a publisher and a developer?
>>3263240
U.S. Gold was indeed a publisher. And a pretty awful one at that.
What are some actually good European publishers you can name?
![Incredulous+-+Newt+Gingrich[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/HNWvWkD.jpg "Incredulous+-+Newt+Gingrich[1].jpg")
>>3263236
>>3263247
They actually made money for many years, so no they weren't an awful publisher.
>>3263260
They made money because it was the only option for poor souls who only had computers and wanted to play some awful conversions of japanese arcade games.
Defending U.S. Gold? Seriously, man?
>>3263263
>They made money....
Stopped reading there. The only thing they needed to do was make money. It doesn't matter how they did it, regardless of your hate boner for them.
>>3263269
I don't have any hate boner, I didn't have to suffer them personally (I resent Hi-Tech Expressions more for their shit port of Street Fighter II and Mega Man on DOS).
But all my Amiga-loving friends hate U.S. Gold with a passion for the shit port of Final Fight and other Capcom games.
First time I read someone actually defending that company.
>>3263269
>The only thing they needed to do was make money
That's why modern games are so good!
>>3263014
Are you bi-polar? I actually made an effort to have a friendly exchange with you, you dumb shit.
>>3263284
Australia-kun has several mental disorders.
At first I thought he was just shitposting for fun, but over time I realized he's actually insane.
>>3262119
They pretty much did
>>3263290
Yeah, I'm legitimately confused. I thought I was having a friendly conversation, and then I got called a dumb shit. I guess I need to get better at recognizing Australia-Kun, he's everywhere.
>>3263284
Why are you so easily offended? You acted like a dumb shit so I called you what you are. Harden up, you girl.
>>3263307
I'm not offended at all, just confused. I didn't act like a dumb shit in any way, I'd own up to it if I did. You on the other hand...
>>3263326
You said it's not wrong that kids call the Mega Drive 'Genesis' when my point was that they're influenced by American e-celebs. You were a total dumb shit.
>>3263015
Mark is like, the coolest uncle you never had, I think he's fantastic.
>>3262119
>i've got a great idea for a thread. shit retards say
>>3263307
See the problem is that you are objectively wrong about most things and I think on some level you know it
>>3263338
What am I wrong about?
Can't mods just indefinitely ban this australia-kun guy once and for all?
I suspect the OP of this thread is him and the amount of shitposting from him here is astonishing, he's been going at it for hours now without rest. And this is only 1 thread, I can only imagine how much shitposting he's generating in other threads.
Janny can probably check who is Australia-kun and file a formal ban request to mods, but it needs to be permanent, no 3 day shit.
>>3263361
What's he done wrong?
>>3263369
So you just want to ban everything you don't like?
>>3263379
You're still missing the point, you fucking twit. How can you be this fucking stupid? What is wrong with you?
>>3262119
>>3263384
I think I've got a pretty good handle on it.
Check it out; you don't like e-celebs, and you don't like the official moniker of 'Genesis' that was used for the SEGA Mega Drive console in North America, I totally understand. However, that doesn't mean 'Genesis' isn't one of the names that the hardware was officially dubbed.
>>3263403
You have to be one of the stupidest people I have ever encountered.
>>3263373
I'm indifferent about your opinions. It's the amount (quantity, not quality) of shitposting that I think makes you a problem for this whole board.
Your permanent ban would significantly improve /vr/'s quality, I'm 100% sure.
>>3263406
Pretty weak reply to my truly brilliant argument. I proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that I totally understand your entire deal, and that you're factually incorrect. What more could one ask for?
>>3263415
Keep thinking that.
>>3263421
I will! Thank you!
>>3262970
Megadrive was also huge in Europe because of the Master System, whereas the TurboGrafx sold like 3 units. If anything that proves you can fuck up a market as long as you're doing good on the other two, a single market isn't worth shit.
Australia-kun is no mere individual anymore and is now a sort of meme. We have dozens of dedicated shitposters on this board obviously. It's like how there once was legitimately just one guy shilling Retron 5's and mentioning his whore wife and now it's the #1 premiere dankest meme of the board. Why isn't there a drawing yet of /vr/-tan playing a Retron 5 with his cutie wife and used as a banner here?
Not even taking Australia-kun into account, there's at least a few other posters here who aren't tripfags but their brand of mental health professional verifiable autism gives them away in various threads they post in. "Sega Genesis music sounds like wet farts" guy, guy who loses his shit about games "aging" (though he now has his own followers), guy who loses his shit about "PSX" or makes countless threads about these stupid topics to cause another shitstorm of pedantry and tedium.
>>3263502
all me
>>3263502
Nah, Australia is one guy. He wants to force his own memes ("scb", "exodus"; etc) but nobody is that retarded to pick them up. Instead, he himself became the meme.
The genesis fart sound guy (Autismo) is also just 1 guy.
Not sure about the PSX shitposting, that's more vague.
If /co/'s Boco and Australia Kun got into a dick sucking contest who would suck the most dick?
>>3263487
Actually it's just the European market that isn't worth shit. Plenty of consoles have been perfectly successful for half a decade or more despite only being popular in the Asian or American market.
>>3263015
I met Mark and he's just as cool off camera
>>3263502
>>3263534
Also I'm the original guy who talked about his wife all the time. A couple times I mentioned how she doesn't like wired controllers making a mess in old school IR controllers and Wii Emulation threads. That fall when the Retron 5 shill threads were literally being made several times a day another guy who was doing Retron satire threads with pics of 4 slot toasters ran with
>>3263543
Define successful. Commodore was a thing for so many years only because of the European market, but neither them nor early Atari (America) or NEC (Japan) managed numbers comparable to Sega and Nintendo.
>>3262119
Nintendo was fucking godlike tho.
Shits all over earlier home consoles
>>3263546
He'd be a cool guy to sit down and have a beer with and reminisce about retro gaming and arcades and whatnot, except he's like 10 years+ older than me and I wasn't even born for half the shit he probably feels nostalgic about.
That's one thing I like about him too, other than his general affability on-camera... He's been playing this shit since Vectrex and Atari and whatnot but he's still passionate about newer games too, not elitist in any form really either it seems. A lot of the other retro e-celebs give off a vibe that all they are motivated by is nostalgia for shit they only liked as little kids and their interest or knowledge for anything else steeply drops off, as well as them seeming to not have a genuine passion for video games as a medium anymore. Pat, Ian and James all come to mind.
>>3262173
No it's not. Nintendo was just the first back into the market after the crash. If Nintendo didn't put the NES out NEC/Hudson and Sega would have filled the market. Hell things would have been a lot better for the TG16 without Nintendos horseshit rules scaring off other devs. Get Nintendos dick out of your mouth, it's seriously retarded to think that even for a second that Nintendo "saved the industry". Nintendo saw a market that they could sell in, and there's nothing wrong with that. They're the same as any other company and if you think other companies didn't have that same idea your mother must have drank very heavily when she was pregnant with you.
>>3263608
did you know, Hiroshi Yamauchi wasn't actually a human being? He was a vessel that enclosed 7 yakuza oni spirits from 7 different regions in Japan. These oni monopolized the gambling in Japan with the hanafuda Nintendo cards and put a spell so that no other company could produce cards, truly evil.
Yamauchi, often referred to as "大é”王 ãƒ†ã‚£ãƒ©ãƒŽå¤©å ‚" (Great Evil King Tyranotendo), tyranized the video games market with his monopolistic practices, it is said that the Master System or the PC Engine didn't actually ever exist, and that they were invented time after so hide the fact that the Famicom was actually the one and only console existing in Japan.
>>3262983
It was called the Mega Drive quite literally everywhere but the US. The Genesis/MD was huge in other regions other than the US, you mong (I'm saying this as an American too, before you try to strawman that).
The concept that people from a region that it was called the MD and not the Gen shows that they're getting their information from somewhere, and it's probably from idiot youtubers. Genesis isn't the original name, the hardware was out in Japan first, they're from a region that it was called the MD, so why else would they call it the Genesis? But hey he doesn't agree with you he must be trolling right? Go back to crying about Iwata you stupid fuck.
>>3262970
NEC didn't practically give up after the PC Engine, Hudson wasn't interested in pursuing more hardware so they went back to their roots (PC style stuff, with the PCFX) but at that time the Windows/x86 standard started to take off so it was a very wrong place wrong time type situation.
>>3263619
In latin america (sans Brazil, they had their own Tec Toy-branded Mega Drive), the name was Genesis as well, anyway Sega wasn't present officially, but it was possibly to obtain Genesis consoles which were NTSC-U, and even bootleg clones made by chinese, but they were really high quality clones and were called Sega Genesis
>>3262135
This actually increased sales.
Also, DC's couldn't just play burned discs.
Those discs you might have toasted made use of an exploit Datel came up with for their Action Replay device.
>>3263573
this
>>3262119
Except that it's true.
What other game company was around keeping things alfoat in the console market?
Granted, the NES never made it out of Japan until 1985, but it still saved the industry.
>>3263619
>NEC didn't practically give up after the PC Engine, Hudson wasn't interested in pursuing more hardware so they went back to their roots (PC style stuff, with the PCFX) but at that time the Windows/x86 standard started to take off so it was a very wrong place wrong time type situation.
I always remembered that PC-FX was considered DOA mostly due to NEC-HE focusing on anime-based games at the time when the industry was trending towards polygon-based 3D graphics. The fact that they made no attempt to even launch the PC-FX abroad didn't help.
Also, didn't Hudson Soft made some HD Bomberman game on a prototype of the PC-FX hardware?
>>3265242
>all video games are home console games
>>3265463
No, because arcades were still popular when the NES came out, so that is seperate from the home market.
>>3265463
Are you
>implying
that PC and arcade games saved the industry?
They might have kept it alive, but I am talking about the console industry, because when the crash happened, that was what suffered.
>>3265467
Are you stupid? I was paraphrasing the retard who thinks home consoles are the only video games.
>>3265472
>Are you stupid?
Yeah, so?
>>3265470
Save what? American home consoles? Only American home consoles suffered from the American home console market crash. There was no video game crash.
>>3265478
I know.
Not in Japan, or in Europe...hey wait a sec...yeah, okay I get it now.
Gunpei Yokoi was murdered.
>>3266392
What's wrong with that?
>>3267079
nothing, just a salty american ignoramus
>>3267301
Ok name what 82-83 games were better than any other year in gaming then you fucking hot shot?
You Europeans sure love to talk a good game except you have nothing to back it up whatsoever.
>FF VII is the best game ever
>Earthbound is rare
>Sega Saturn and CD were failures all over the world
>who cares about the 2nd gen it had no games
>Genesis has bad music
>SNES music was always graced with masterpieces
>Turbografx never made an impact in the US
>AVGN and /r/retrogaming are the best sources for VG History and opinions.
>>3267309
Thank you for proving your stupidity. He said that 1982/3 was a profitable year in European gaming, it was a great boom in fact. The quality of games is obviously subjective.
>>3267309
He said "profitable" you imbecile. It's not about games being "better" in comparison to some other year.
>>3267338
Are you legitimately retarded? Honest question.
>>3267339
Are you? Apparently you have no reading comprehension and get by with feeling superior to everyone because you're European?
>>3267339
Well, you certainly are.
>>3267340
What are you trying to argue for? That you liked American and Japanese games better? That's totally a matter of opinion.
>>3267345
>1982/3 were probably the best two years for video games in history.
Bold statement is it not?
>>3267347
Well, two of the most influential console manufacturers and game publishers launched their debut consoles, the Nintendo Famicom and the Sega SG-1000. It also saw the rise of the micro computer as a gaming device. This would essentially define European gaming for years to come. So not only did the years see huge financial gains in Europe and Japan but it defined gaming as we know it today.
>>3267345
>>3267339
>>3267334
>>3267331
>>3267301
>>3262154
Euro sales doing well is a drop in the bucket as far as video games go. Dumb ass 3rd worlders.
Like saying the car industry is doing great because Peugeot did well.
Like saying the aerospace industry is doing well because Hoffmann did well.
Like saying the cable broadcasting industry is doing well because the Scottish Digital Network did well.
>>3267362
Like saying video games crashed because Atari went under?
>>3267368
The biggest video game company at the time?
The fastest growing company in American history and in the world?
No not like Atari, brown anon.
HOME video games crashed. And specifically, one admittedly major US game console market. Everyone else, arcades and 8 bit computer games did JUST FUCKING FINE.
Today's gamers are like idiots that think the evil empire of Japan randomly attacked MURICA at Pearl Harbor for no reason and caused WWII. Which is what a lot of people I've talked to actually goddamn believe.
>>3267353
It was a great OPPORTUNITY because of the crash. You are still literally not understanding what a market crash is and what its ramifications are. Also, it was an opportunity that Japan took advantage of but Europe failed to so it is further correct to say "Nintendo saved gaming" because Europe sure as shit wasn't going to do it.
This thread is fun because it does address some broad subjects but it's still an Australia-kun thread at its core.
>>3267394
>Axis-sympathizing as a /vr/ metaphor
PLEASE run with this, Anon.
>>3267432
Okay, let me make this perfectly clear:
Atari, as an american company, disincentivised american consumers with terribly made games, as there was no standard of quality. If you could program, and make a game, you could get it published.
Because there weren't any real "game review" magazines or shows, it was a toss-up if the game you were spending so much on was even going to be fun at all.
Eventually, games became so backed up that stores started selling them off for practically nothing just to clear storage space
Which in turn affected the companies distributing the games, meaning they ordered less to distribute
Effectively slowing game production to a crawl, as less orders came in it became harder to pay programmers
Continuing the drought of good or engaging games, as nobody would work for the pay and still make decent material
Further disincentivising the consumer from buying a game
So on and so forth. Sure, it was cheap for the consumer, and you could find games for pretty much nothing, but as it stood, nobody wanted to make new games because nobody wanted to buy new games. The market crashed.
Then nintendo blew everyone out of the water with their seal of quality.
>>3267432
>A company with no international presence
>their crash had no global ramifications.
This is what 3rd worlders actually believe.
Space Invaders is the biggest grossing video game of all time. At 14 billion dollars. That's just one example.
It's comical how ignorant you are of how insignificant Europe is.
>>3267449
The seal of quality was just a way for Nintendo to force publishers to pay for licensing fees and buy cartridges. It wasn't new and it wasn't quality control. It just cost more to get a game on to a Nintendo system.
That 'crash' only affected American home consoles, anyway. I already know about it, but to say it affected anything but an isolated pocket of video games is ludicrous.
>>3267456
Yes, Taito's hit arcade game was popular, so what? What does that have to do with America?
>>3267362
we go all was cassette deep to emulate this
>>3267456
An example of what? A Japanese arcade game being successful?
>>3267465
It was one of the main reasons for the 2600s success?
>>3267481
Yes, it helped sell consoles in North America. I guess it shows that the American games industry had been dominated by Japs before the American home console market crashed.
>>3267461
>The seal of quality was just a way for Nintendo to force publishers to pay for licensing fees and buy cartridges.
Yeah, so they're not spewing trash that would offend the market. You say that like the crash didn't happen, and that people would be totally okay with ruining the brand's image if it meant more games.
That's literally why the crash happened, everyone saw rich atari programmers and wanted to be the "next big thing".
Why do you think tengen's tetris was removed? It may have been the superior version, but it was illegally made and distributed, something nintendo now had to answer to.
>it wasn't quality control.
You don't seriously believe that, do you? You're outright denying that nintendo did anything to prevent unpalatable material from releasing on their console. It's literally what the seal of quality means.
>It just cost more to get a game on to a Nintendo system.
Because at the time, the japanese developers had seem much more success with their strict policies, and instated them in america as well.
And look what happened.
>That 'crash' only affected American home consoles, anyway.
Which is literally the biggest consumer market you god damn idiot
>>3267494
Going against your point, yes.
>>3267502
>Yeah, so they're not spewing trash that would offend the market.
But they did. There were many awful games on the Nes.
>Why do you think tengen's tetris was removed? It may have been the superior version, but it was illegally made and distributed, something nintendo now had to answer to.
It was removed because they were bypassing Nintendo's licensing fees and restrictions.
>You don't seriously believe that, do you? You're outright denying that nintendo did anything to prevent unpalatable material from releasing on their console. It's literally what the seal of quality means.
You mark. It just means that Nintendo licensed the game. It didn't mean it was good or even playable. The most Nintendo would do is censor things like religious iconography and smut.
>Because at the time, the japanese developers had seem much more success with their strict policies, and instated them in america as well.
Yes, charging publishers more generally helps to make more money when you have a popular system in Japan and NA, but the expensive games seriously hurt the NES in Europe.
>Which is literally the biggest consumer market you god damn idiot
It's still an isolated market. It doesn't matter how big it was, it didn't have any global presence. The only American made things that had an influence were Commodore and, later, Atari computers.
>>3267504
No. How is that going against what I said? I said Atari had no real global presence at the time. Having a port of Space Invaders didn't help them globally.
>>3267515
>There were many awful games on the Nes.
I didn't say "awful". I said "unpalatable". Meaning offensive. Remember Custer's Revenge? That isn't good for brand image, the atari "porn machine".
Since licencing a game was difficult, good games spread by word-of-mouth while bad games had to use trickery to emulate popular titles, to trick unknowledgeable parents. It's why those shitty LCD games existed for as long as they did.
>It was removed because they were bypassing Nintendo's licensing fees (but not restrictions, it's tetris you fucking loon)
Nintendo owned the rights to console distribution of Tetris from the Soviet Union. Tengen did that without the Soviet Union's, and by extension Nintendo's agreement. And as such, nintendo had to pay fines and all that hullabaloo.
>The most Nintendo would do is censor things like religious iconography and smut.
And make sure the game was playable. Yes, that's what quality control is.
>but the expensive games seriously hurt the NES in Europe.
No, microcomputers seriously hurt the NES in europe. Ignoramus.
>It's still an isolated market.
Even more reason to not sully your name you fucking idiot, do yourself a favour and never run a company ever
>it didn't have any global presence.
Sure, that's why Atari of Japan didn't exist.
Anon. Just stop.
>>3267518
>Having a port of Space Invaders didn't help them globally.
I remember when this board started and we didn't have complete retards and underageb& everywhere.
>>3267549
>No, microcomputers seriously hurt the NES in europe. Ignoramus.
That did play a major part, but even the Master System and presumably 7800 had significantly cheaper games over there compared to the NES.
>>3267564
Great, I don't care though. The majority of gamers in the UK played on their computer. While licencing fees may have affected the NES's library, it's still more affected by the consumers who chose other systems to begin with.
Anon, put some thought into your argumentation before weakly throwing around the first refutation you can think of.
>I didn't say "awful". I said "unpalatable". Meaning offensive. Remember Custer's Revenge? That isn't good for brand image, the atari "porn machine".
So you ARE talking about Nintendo's censorship.
>Since licencing a game was difficult, good games spread by word-of-mouth while bad games had to use trickery to emulate popular titles, to trick unknowledgeable parents. It's why those shitty LCD games existed for as long as they did.
Difficult in what way?
>Nintendo owned the rights to console distribution of Tetris from the Soviet Union. Tengen did that without the Soviet Union's, and by extension Nintendo's agreement. And as such, nintendo had to pay fines and all that hullabaloo.
So yes, it was because they didn't pay Nintendo to make it.
>And make sure the game was playable. Yes, that's what quality control is.
I guess they just didn't do a good job of it.
>No, microcomputers seriously hurt the NES in europe. Ignoramus.
Do you even think? They succeeded because they were cheaper. The Master System succeeded for the same reason.
>Even more reason to not sully your name you fucking idiot, do yourself a favour and never run a company ever
What are you trying to say now? When did I say they should sully their name? All I said was that the size of the market is irrelevant on a global scale when it is
>Sure, that's why Atari of Japan didn't exist.
Are you talking about the 2800 or Namco?
>>3267571
Not really, people were still buying computers when the Nes was around and were not adverse to the Master System. But Nes games were way too expensive to justify owning the console.
>>3267561
Great argument. You sure do know the global market.
Why do Americans struggle so much with regional differences? Why are they so stupid?
>>3267576
>So you ARE talking about Nintendo's censorship.
Reading comprehension.
>Difficult in what way?
The reasons you gave, you dense simpleton
>So yes, it was because they didn't pay Nintendo to make it.
Yes, because then they couldn't pay the Soviet Union. Do you not understand licencing, or?
>I guess they just didn't do a good job of it.
It's "control", not "assurance". Damn.
>The Master System succeeded for the same reason.
Yes, cheap systems are preferable, with computers being moreso due to piracy.
>When did I say they should sully their name?
When you imply that the quality control was pointless, it wasn't
>Are you talking about the 2800 or Namco?
Do I look like google to you? Think for yourself, if you think you're capable.
>>3267579
>But Nes games were way too expensive to justify owning the console.
Which is my point
I'm going drinking, please actually put thought into your arguments next time
>>3267585
>The reasons you gave, you dense simpleton
That's not a difficulty of licensing, that comes after licensing. Licensing is easy.
>Yes, because then they couldn't pay the Soviet Union. Do you not understand licencing, or?
Nintendo has the license, Atari makes it for Nintendo. That's how it works. Are you stupid?
>It's "control", not "assurance". Damn.
It was more like a way to make publishers pay extra.
>When you imply that the quality control was pointless, it wasn't
The only form of quality control they had was keeping poor publishers out of it by making their license so expensive.
>Do I look like google to you? Think for yourself, if you think you're capable.
Clearly you don't know what you mean.
>Which is my point
>While licencing fees may have affected the NES's library, it's still more affected by the consumers who chose other systems to begin with.
Hmmm... That doesn't seem to be the case. Why lie so blatantly?
>>3263015
I'm glad CGRundertow got cutoff. Its a miracle Mark took pity on him enough to give him a free ride for a while, because he'd otherwise be some forgotten youtuber.
The height of CGRundertow was the OoT video where he keeps on praising it and calling it the greatest game ever, while Mark just keeps teasing him and saying its not as good as random Sega Genesis games.
I know people hate the Truxton meme thing and yeah, he does push it a bit too much lately, but it just illustrates one thing I find really endearing; in that he just goes his own way and isn't obliged to follow mainstream rankings and opinions. He doesn't just rattle off the same dusty top 10 retro game lists; his preferences really feel like he played a lot of things himself and formed his own tastes independently.
>>3262119
>posting a moron who makes 10,000 a month from patreon to make "awesome videos"
>>3267615
Yeah, he's such an idiot. Making $10,000 a month doing what you enjoy is for retards.
>>3267618
Well that IS something a retard would say
>>3267394
An industry where a large part of it is crumbling is not fine you moron. You're just delusional
>>3267628
The markets were separate, so the death of the American market would be inconsequential to non-Americans.
>>3267692
>The markets were separate, so the death of the American market would be inconsequential to non-Americans.
Except for the ripple effect, and the North American game developers who have influenced the industry, for better or worse.
>>3267729
What was the ripple effect of Atari shock? I don't recall anything changing due to the yankee crash.
Games would be much better without Americans.
>>3267729
>influenced
Yeah, quickly done shit games to cash in on trends sure are influential.
Kids, please STOP parroting the bullshit half-truths you gleaned over the years by skimming gaming history and LISTEN TO SOMEONE THAT LIVED THROUGH IT.
Here's one I hear alot.
>a game needs a massive story or some kind of lore or plot
Eff that I say. Any time a game had a plot that it focused on, the gameplay suffered horribly. Look at the trash that is Final Fantasy 4, 5 and 6. I know alot of people have fond memories of these games, and I don't want to offend anymore, but look again at these games and tell me that they're without flaw. Right off the top of my head, I can name 10 things wrong with them, that they share among them.
>story is massive, full of filler, and unskippable
>many areas act as nothing more than glorified corridors to skip you to the next cutscene (secret cave, the opera house, visiting the turtle guru)
>RNG enemy generation guarantees that you'll run into the same boring enemies over and over, and no strategy is involved other than just slamming them with your strongest attacks
>excessive grinding just to get any good abilities (crystal classes, magicite, or summons/black magic)
>characters often taken away randomly, and you'd have to replay the game multiple times over to avoid losing any items you had on them (except in FFV, but having Galuf's daughter replace him causes the equal issue of cheapening his death by making him easily replaceable. The best way to handle this would be like in Grandia 2, where Mareg died but you got all his items back. However, he couldn't be replaced.)
>bugs, glitches, exploits galore, some which they should've definitely caught in beta testing
>stats and weapons that do nothing (magic evade, the blind status avenger weapon)
>enemy AI that's completely retarded (enemies who are supposed to cast regen on themselves, for example, is immune to it because regen shares the same status marker as, say, slow, or drain. Or the fact that Asura can't heal herself despite casting cure 4 constantly, due to an overflow glitch)
>no replayability because the gameplay is too reliant on the story, and can't hold up on its own
Only a few exceptions exist.
>PS2 only sold because it was a cheap DVD player
On that note though, has anyone watched a DVD on a PS2 before? It looked like shit, like the N64 blur o vision was applied to it.
>>3263057
>The Dreamcast wasn't hacked within 6 months of its US release
It wasn't. Dreamcast piracy didn't become a thing until around 2000/2001, right around when sega was already deciding to kill the console.
>>3263747
>Also, DC's couldn't just play burned discs.
Yes they could. Only later models had trouble playing burnt games. The 2000 model I had played CDRs just fine.
>>3267821
Yes, it was the first DVD player that I owned.
>>3267757
Why so racist?
>>3267919
I am a racist, but what I said was not racist.
>>3267593
I'm back
>Licensing is easy
Yeah. So simple, that throwing away your money by licencing garbage isn't an option. More incentive to put work into your product instead of shitting it out and hoping someone buys it.
>That's how it works.
No, that's not how it works. Nintendo needs to license it to Tengen, which still needs to be approved by the Soviet Union. So in other words, no, you don't understand how licensing works.
>It was more like a way to make publishers pay extra.
You mean, "the amount needed to publish on a console with actual standards". Again, you're acting like the crash didn't happen. You're assuming you're right and writing your argument around that.
You know all those terrible games you're thinking of? Those got through the quality test. Now, imagine these games but ten times as numerous. That is what quality control is for.
>The only form of quality control they had was keeping poor publishers out of it by making their license so expensive.
And making sure that the games published by the bourgeoisie were up to par, I typed sarcastically.
Money != quality
Quality != budget
>Clearly you don't know what you mean.
You mean, "I don't know what you mean". If you can't be bothered to Google "Atari of Japan", and acknowledge that they existed, you're admitting that you don't know what you're talking about when you say "[Atari] didn't have any global presence." Intellectual dishonesty at it's finest. Damn fool.
>Hmmm... That doesn't seem to be the case.
Excuse me? Are you denying reality now?
You're implying that enough people bought an NES to the point where the games would profit as well as the states.
That is simply not the case. It's literally impossible.
Do you get it yet, or am I going to have to shove some statistics in your face?
>>3267927
>I am a racist
>>3262119
>Sega dominated Europe during the 16-bit gen
>>3268089
>Yeah. So simple, that throwing away your money by licencing garbage isn't an option. More incentive to put work into your product instead of shitting it out and hoping someone buys it.
They mostly licensed garbage, so your point doesn't make sense.
>No, that's not how it works. Nintendo needs to license it to Tengen, which still needs to be approved by the Soviet Union. So in other words, no, you don't understand how licensing works.
Atari could have easily developed the game for Nintendo.
>You mean, "the amount needed to publish on a console with actual standards". Again, you're acting like the crash didn't happen. You're assuming you're right and writing your argument around that.
It must be really expensive to approve games. Not. They were just milking publishers for more money. They just didn't want bootlegs, which were a problem in Asia, taking their money away. They had publishers paying for the license before they went to America.
>You know all those terrible games you're thinking of? Those got through the quality test. Now, imagine these games but ten times as numerous. That is what quality control is for.
What an unprovable assertion.
>And making sure that the games published by the bourgeoisie were up to par, I typed sarcastically.
The point is that amateur coders and small companies couldn't afford to get games on the system. They had to go through big publishers.
>You mean, "I don't know what you mean". If you can't be bothered to Google "Atari of Japan", and acknowledge that they existed, you're admitting that you don't know what you're talking about when you say "[Atari] didn't have any global presence." Intellectual dishonesty at it's finest. Damn fool.
There was no Atari of Japan. Not until Namco bought Atari's game division.
>Excuse me? Are you denying reality now?
You said that the Nes failed because people owned other systems moreso than how expensive it was. Which is retarded because of how the Master System succeeded.
>>3268097
No one ever claims that. They won out of other consoles comfortably but didn't dominate. The Master System was a dominant console in most of Europe.
>>3268106
>They mostly licensed garbage
No, "they" allowed garbage to be on their system as long as it barely resembled what they considered to be a game. If it was what Nintendo would consider sellable, it'd make some form of profit, which would find it's way to Nintendo. Devious, maybe, but that's business, pal. And it worked.
If the game was playable, and it wasn't offensive, it was approved. Simple as that.
>Atari could have easily developed the game for Nintendo.
You also don't know anything about Tengen, then. Go do some research.
>They just didn't want bootlegs
Yeah, garbage. If there's a Metal Gear, why have another on the market? Regulate it.
You're ignoring why the market crashed, again. Ever heard the term "Pac-man clone"?
>They had publishers paying for the license before they went to America.
:o i wonder why
>What an unprovable assertion.
:o 1983
>The point is that amateur coders and small companies couldn't afford to get games on the system.
You conveniently ignored this, so I'm going to post it until you acknowledge it
Money != quality
Quality != budget
>There was no Atari of Japan.
http://gaming.wikia.com/wiki/Atari_2800
It may have failed, but you can't deny that the company had a global presense to the point where other companies were taking their hardware and selling it in other countries. And then that company made their own official console.
Improve your google-fu
>You said that the Nes failed because people owned other systems moreso than how expensive it was
Ignoring that retardese of a sentence, no, I said that the cheaper, more versatile computer was more marketable, so more people bought it. Not to mention how you mentioned the Master System didn't have the licensing issue. So, you proved my point. Twice.
People didn't want to pay big bank for games, and bought the systems that allowed for cheap games. How do you not understand this?
Someone already defended Sega CD's honour so I'll mention this but I won't consider you a retard if you believe the following:
>FMV games were bad.
They weren't.
They were a fun novelty at worst and an absolutely engrossing experience like Tex Murphy Overseer at best.
>>3268135
>If the game was playable, and it wasn't offensive, it was approved. Simple as that.
They were really not more playable than the games published by companies, not bootlegs, on the Atari.
>You also don't know anything about Tengen, then. Go do some research
You clearly don't know how game development works.
>Yeah, garbage. If there's a Metal Gear, why have another on the market? Regulate it.
The reason they don't want that is because bootlegs will undercut them, moron. Bootlegs aren't by definition garbage.
>You're ignoring why the market crashed
The American home console market didn't crash because of bootlegs. Bootlegs were never an issue outside of Asia.
>:o i wonder why
For the money.
>You conveniently ignored this, so I'm going to post it until you acknowledge it
But here's the thing, dipshit, you can have the best game ever but if you don't have the money to get through Nintendo's licensing and cartridge fees then you can't publish it. You'll have to sell it to a publisher.
>http://gaming.wikia.com/wiki/Atari_2800
Why didn't you say that's what you meant when I asked? That wasn't by Atari of Japan, that was just Atari selling it in Japan. They didn't make a subsidiary just for Japan and the console quickly failed. It's no surprise with the money they made in America that they tried to get into other markets. They just failed.
>I said that the cheaper, more versatile computer was more marketable, so more people bought it.
You said
>The majority of gamers in the UK played on their computer. While licencing fees may have affected the NES's library, it's still more affected by the consumers who chose other systems to begin with.
Why are you lying through your teeth like that? You're trying to get behind what I previously asserted to you now.
>Not to mention how you mentioned the Master System didn't have the licensing issue. So, you proved my point. Twice.
You never said that. You're just trying to take what I've said and claim it as your own.
>>3268181
>They were really not more playable than the games published by companies, not bootlegs, on the Atari.
I was talking about the flooding of the market, the "crash". Convenient how you glazed over the "Pac-man clone" bit, which was the whole point.
>You clearly don't know how game development works.
Don't sidestep me. Tengen intentionally avoided the 10NES chip due to the licensing you're complaining about. In turn, they violated a strict agreement. Do you understand how this is related, or are you going to glaze over this as well?
>Bootlegs aren't by definition garbage.
Flooding. Yes they are, as it undercuts the original developers work.
Man, and I thought you were for the independent developer, not the random assholes that can do sprite-swapping.
>Bootlegs were never an issue outside of Asia.
Did I say they were? Can you guess why I didn't? Idiot.
>For the money.
No, to cut out idiots abusing fair use to steal other people's work. They also got a lot of money out of it, by banking on the shattered market.
>You'll have to sell it to a publisher.
That was my point you fucking idiot. If the game is good, you can sell it to a trusted publisher. Otherwise, you're wasting everyone's time.
They're called INVESTORS you fucking idiot.
>Why didn't you say that's what you meant when I asked?
Because you're incapable of learning for yourself.
>They didn't make a subsidiary just for Japan and the console quickly failed.
You mean, there was a subsidary made, and quickly dissolved, BECAUSE it didn't sell. My point was, Atari was popular enough to have it's system sold overseas, contradicting your "not globally recognized" bullshit. Fucking EVERYONE knew about Atari.
>You said
No, I said that more people bought the computer, I never said why. You said that the NES's licencing causes the game's prices to go up, and I implied that people wanted cheap games.
Because they do.
Not to mention the higher marketability of a computer over a game console.
Christopher Colombus sailed to America to prove that the Earth was round.
Tomatoes are fruits, not vegetables.
All medicine with mercury in it will eventually kill you.
Quantum mechanics prove the existence of souls.
>>3268202
>I was talking about the flooding of the market
There were more official NES games than non-bootleg Atari games. Many NES games were not only similar, but were essentially clones of one another or of arcade games.
>Don't sidestep me. Tengen intentionally avoided the 10NES chip due to the licensing you're complaining about.
Because Nintendo wouldn't work with them. They very well could have developed the game for Nintendo.
>Yes they are, as it undercuts the original developers work.
That doesn't make them garbage, they could be well done and playable like many bootlegs are.
>Did I say they were?
You heavily implied it here
>>They just didn't want bootlegs
>Yeah, garbage. If there's a Metal Gear, why have another on the market? Regulate it.
>You're ignoring why the market crashed, again.
You're basically saying the American home console market crashed due to bootlegs. Are you bipolar?
>No, to cut out idiots abusing fair use to steal other people's work.
It's not stealing if it's fair use, you idiot. Learn the law.
>If the game is good, you can sell it to a trusted publisher. Otherwise, you're wasting everyone's time.
So you sell it to them for a small amount because you're a no name and they make lots of money off you while you only have what they gave you for the game. If you sell them the game you don't get royalties.
>Because you're incapable of learning for yourself.
I already knew what you meant, you were being purposefully obtuse like the ignorant child you are.
>there was a subsidary made
There was not.
>Atari was popular enough to have it's system sold overseas, contradicting your "not globally recognized" bullshit. Fucking EVERYONE knew about Atari.
Anyone with enough money could sell their consoles overseas, but it doesn't mean people cared, because they clearly didn't.
>>3268202
>You said that the NES's licencing causes the game's prices to go up, and I implied that people wanted cheap games.
No, I said that micro computers were more popular because they were cheap and software was, generally, cheap. That includes games.
>Not to mention the higher marketability of a computer over a game console.
Once the NES came out in Europe (1986/7), actually, micro computers weren't really used for anything but games as software developers had already moved on to the next generation machines. You really don't know shit.
>>3267873
He didn't mean that the DC can't play burned discs at all. He meant that you can't play a burned game on a DC if the iso didn't include the exploit.
Which I'm not sure is true because it's the first I've heard of it.
>>3268219
>There were more official NES games than non-bootleg Atari games
Wow it's like the NES was more popular then the 2600 or something
>Many NES games were not only similar, but were essentially clones of one another or of arcade games.
Yes that's why there's twenty different Balloon Fight clones
>Because Nintendo wouldn't work with them.
Except they did, up until Atari reached the limit of and eventually circumvented their cartridge limit by self-publishing bootlegs.
>they could be well done and playable like many bootlegs are.
You mean, like many stolen games are.
>You heavily implied it here
So, you can't, then. It's because of LICENSING
>Are you bipolar?
No, you just fail to understand how flooding the market with games identical to each other undercuts the profits of those whom actually made it.
>It's not stealing
That was my fucking point you fucking idiot holy fuck
Thieves, not under the legal definition but under the moral definition, make money off of hard working programmers whom made a genuinely good game.
>So you sell it to them for a small amount because you're a no name
Then publish it on PC if you're such hot shit
Oh wait having a good game on the NES cemented your identity as a trusted game developer and is priceless
>you were being purposefully obtuse like the ignorant child you are.
I was, and that's not how you use "ignorant". I was being obtuse because you're too stupid to understand simple concepts.
Understand? I'm getting fed up with your incessant contrarianism.
Use google you fucking ingrate.
>There was not.
Missing the point.
>but it doesn't mean people cared
Yes, that's why they wasted money on consoles nobody wanted. That's why everyone knew their names.
>>3268224
>No, I said that micro computers were more popular because they were cheap and software was, generally, cheap.
That was what I was saying, yeah.
>micro computers weren't really used for anything but games as software developers had already moved on to the next generation machines.
Okay, but I'm not debating about how the NES was the superior choice or something. If anything, the existing games would be more than enough incentive to buy a NES.
I feel like people are getting confused as to what my intended message is.
The Nintendo seal was important, as it gave the American audience confidence in the products they were buying, as opposed to the toss-up of the 2600.
And yet, in the UK, computers sold better because it was all-around cheaper. It's just different markets in different places.
>>3268248
>Yes that's why there's twenty different Balloon Fight clones
Yes, anon, Balloon Fight was a big hit.
>Except they did, up until Atari reached the limit of and eventually circumvented their cartridge limit by self-publishing bootlegs.
No they didn't. They refused partnerships with Atari entirely on multiple occasions.
>You mean, like many stolen games are.
I said bootleg, actually, and that is the correct word.
>So, you can't, then. It's because of LICENSING
Can't what? What are you on about?
>No, you just fail to understand how flooding the market with games identical to each other undercuts the profits of those whom actually made it.
No I don't, your reading comprehension is just poor.
>the moral definition
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
>Then publish it on PC if you're such hot shit
Most successful games were ported to PC.
>Oh wait having a good game on the NES cemented your identity as a trusted game developer and is priceless
I hope you don't believe that.
>I was, and that's not how you use "ignorant". I was being obtuse because you're too stupid to understand simple concepts.
I'd say being purposefully obtuse is very ignorant. Ignorant may also mean rude, you know. Dumb yank. I had to clarify because you were wrong in assuming there was a Japanese subsidiary of Atari.
>Missing the point.
Not at all. You stated that there was a Japanese subsidiary of Atari, which is blatantly false. You said that Atari Japan brought out the 2800. That is false.
>Yes, that's why they wasted money on consoles nobody wanted. That's why everyone knew their names.
They probably did waste their money considering how they failed. Do you have a source on 'everyone' knowing their name or is it just more bullshit and lies?
>>3268256
>That was what I was saying, yeah.
I already quoted you directly and you did not say that.
>Okay, but I'm not debating about how the NES was the superior choice or something. If anything, the existing games would be more than enough incentive to buy a NES.
Obviously not. And I personally disagree, the NES library isn't appealing.
>And yet, in the UK, computers sold better because it was all-around cheaper
And the Master System outsold the Nes because Sega was a more recognisable name and had cheaper games that were more accurate to the arcade.
>>3268265
>Balloon Fight was a big hit.
Missing the point: the reply
You get how it was a conversion of Joust? It was also the only licensed version of a joust conversion. Or is that too difficult for you to understand?
>They refused partnerships with Atari
Are you fucking stupid, what the fuck? I'm talking about their game publishing rights. Fucking moron.
>Can't what?
Explain why bootlegs weren't an issue outside of asia you FUCKING IDIOT
>your reading comprehension is just poor.
Then please, let me know how identical games wouldn't crash the market just like it did in 1983. Please, I would love to see your delusional explanation for that.
>AHAHAHA
So, you don't actually care about programmers. Just checking.
>SUCCESSFUL games
You're really unobservant aren't you
>I hope you don't believe that.
Why, because you can't refute it? It established them as reputable companies. Please, prove me wrong. I'd love to be wrong.
>I'd say being purposefully obtuse is very ignorant.
No, being obtuse implies forgoing explaing the understanding you have, which isn't ignorance.
>Ignorant may also mean rude, you know
You use cuck as ad hominem, kill yourself
>Dumb yank
Canadian.
>which is blatantly false.
As blatantly false as claiming that Atari isn't globally recognized. Tit for tat.
I'll apologize when you do.
>That is false.
It was manufactured by Atari.
>Do you have a source on 'everyone' knowing their name
Obviously I didn't mean literally everyone.
Also, advertising and success in creating an entire new market.
>>3268280
>I already quoted you directly and you did not say that.
What, do I have to explain what "higher marketability" entails now? You guys have no imagination.
>And I personally disagree, the NES library isn't appealing.
Cool.
>And the Master System outsold the Nes because Sega was a more recognisable name and had cheaper games that were more accurate to the arcade.
I knew that, but sure. Also PCs.
>>3268312
>You get how it was a conversion of Joust? It was also the only licensed version of a joust conversion. Or is that too difficult for you to understand?
So one game proves everything?
>Are you fucking stupid, what the fuck? I'm talking about their game publishing rights. Fucking moron.
Then you need to learn to read.
>Explain why bootlegs weren't an issue outside of asia you FUCKING IDIOT
You never asked that at all. Maybe you imagined that. We weren't talking about anything even similar to that.
>Then please, let me know how identical games wouldn't crash the market just like it did in 1983.
There were many identical games on NES that Nintendo licensed. But hey, let's just ignore them.
>So, you don't actually care about programmers. Just checking.
HAHAHAHAHAHA moral definition. You're a freak.
>It established them as reputable companies
Only to people who cared AND owned a Nes AND their game. Most games not made by Nintendo, who didn't accept submissions, were in arcades first if they were good.
>No, being obtuse implies forgoing explaing the understanding you have, which isn't ignorance.
It is ignorant, but you don't know what ignorant means.
>You use cuck as ad hominem, kill yourself
When did I do that?
>Canadian
Same thing.
>As blatantly false as claiming that Atari isn't globally recognized. Tit for tat.
Proof that everyone knew them? Globally recognised by who?
>It was manufactured by Atari.
That's what I'm saying.
>Also, advertising and success in creating an entire new market.
In America. That doesn't mean everyone knew them. Didn't Magnavox make the first console?
>>3268320
>What, do I have to explain what "higher marketability" entails now? You guys have no imagination.
What you said was totally irrelevant as micro computers were still being sold, and doing well, when the Nes came out despite them being long obsolete for anything besides games.
>>3262135
Watched a video on this. Apparently it actually had pretty decent piracy protection. But once the exploit was found years into the DC life it was easy to replicate
Why do North Americans keep pretending Atari was relevant anywhere but their homeland? It defies their own logic, if the crash of Atari really affected other markets there wouldn't have been any Nintendo to """""""save""""""" videogames.
The market was so strongly divided back then, there was no ripple effect. Japanese people played Japanese games, Europeans played European games and Japanese Arcade conversions. That's it.
>>3268343
Americans are too self important to look at things from another perspective. They seriously think Atari was a dominant force all over the world. They're insufferable.
>>3268329
>So one game proves everything?
So, it is too difficult to understand for you. I used a game which was technically stolen to make an example of the lack of copycats on the system due to licensing
Yes, I consider taking entire game concepts stealing. Line me up and shoot me, I'm clearly crazy.
>Then you need to learn to read.
no u
Tengen circumvented the 10NES chip, and created a legal firestorm, because they didn't request a license from Nintendo. Do you understand yet?
>You never asked that at all.
You're right, I didn't. YOU, however, mentioned something about it:
>The American home console market didn't crash because of bootlegs. Bootlegs were never an issue outside of Asia.
I said it clearly wasn't, because making bootlegs would mean circumventing the 10NES chip, which was uncommon.
You were stating needless facts.
>But hey, let's just ignore them.
No, let's have you list them, since you're so certain. Then I'll state how few copycats there are, and that it's impossible to flood the market considering how different the market is from the 2600.
>You're a freak.
Excuse me for wanting the developers to see the fruit of their labour. Asshole.
>Only to people who cared AND owned a Nes
Until they moved on to other consoles.
Which is generally what developers do.
>...were in arcades first if they were good.
Ta-da, you've found the optimal route for making a popular game in that era. Only thing is, it was published under these aforementioned companies whom were more welcoming of new ideas. I hate to say you're agreeing with me again, but you are.
>It is ignorant, but you don't know what ignorant means.
No, I wasn't lacking knowledge or awareness, in fact I was the one that told you that there were 26/800s sold in Japan. The irony is palpable.
>When did I do that?
Just a baseless assertion. No need to get all defensive about it.
>Same thing.
Not really.
>Globally recognised by who?
The market.
>>3268329
>That doesn't mean everyone knew them.
PONG NIGGA
>>3268331
>What you said was totally irrelevant as micro computers were still being sold, and doing well, when the Nes came out despite them being long obsolete for anything besides games.
Maybe I wasn't talking about the technical relevance?
>>3268343
if the crash of Atari really affected other markets there wouldn't have been any Nintendo to """""""save""""""" videogames.
Don't be ridiculous. Had the market not crashed, Nintendo still would have won out through specs and Mario.
The crash simply amplified it.
>>3268354
You sound insufferable you racist miserable piece of shit
>>3268371
>Don't be ridiculous. Had the market not crashed, Nintendo still would have won out through specs and Mario.
You don't get it. If the crash affected the Japanese market, there wouldn't have been any Nes because Japanese people wouldn't have been interested in home systems. Wasn't that the issue in America? Yet the famicom had great sales without that shitty robot toy.
>>3268364
>Yes, I consider taking entire game concepts stealing. Line me up and shoot me, I'm clearly crazy.
It's not really stealing, to steal is to take without legal right. They had legal right.
>Tengen circumvented the 10NES chip, and created a legal firestorm, because they didn't request a license from Nintendo. Do you understand yet?
How could you miss the point so much?
>No, let's have you list them, since you're so certain. Then I'll state how few copycats there are, and that it's impossible to flood the market considering how different the market is from the 2600.
Just a baseless assertion, bro, don't get so defensive. Are you upset? I don't know any Nes games besides meme shit like Mario and Zelda.
>Excuse me for wanting the developers to see the fruit of their labour. Asshole.
HAHAHAHA yet you say they should sell their IP to big publishers. HAHAHA
>Until they moved on to other consoles.
So they had to establish themselves to others who didn't have a Nes.
>Ta-da, you've found the optimal route for making a popular game in that era
Stop claiming my points as your own. Just because you can't get anything right.
>No, I wasn't lacking knowledge or awareness, in fact I was the one that told you that there were 26/800s sold in Japan. The irony is palpable.
Do Americans seriously know what ignorant means? Words have multiple meanings, you dumb yank.
>The market.
The global market they failed in?
