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Baldur's gate general
>>2827540
Could somebody please explain to me entangle? It seems like a useless spell. It's only ever fucked me over. Maybe once or twice i got lucky with it
>>2827541
Don't use it near your party members. It's used as a "soft" wall, either you go through and chance getting caught, or you go around. Your party, in the meantime, should be using ranged attacks and/or flanking around the affected area to surround those caught in the middle.
It's a tactical spell, much like grease (though the associated tactics with grease are quite different, of course.)
Are the orginal games worth it or am I better off playing the Enhanced versions?
>>2827690
I tried playing the originals a few years back and I just couldn't handle it.
Picked up the EE's last year and loved every second.
>>2827690
Depends. If you're lazy, don't care about purist experiences (some of the EE stuff is awful, like forced BG1 to BG2 mechanics conversion) and just want to pick up and play it immediately, I guess EEs are fine.
But given the fact that you can mod an original version to do everything EE does and more (since some mods are not, nor probably ever will be, EE-compatible) in like 20 minutes tops, and the originals are cheaper, I'd myself go for the originals always.
It helps that I tried EE and mostly hated the bonus content, like the new NPCs -- who are especially jarring in BG1EE, because they stand out too much from the less interactive crowd
As such, I consider most of the EE content to be a subpar mod addition, and when it comes to mods, you can do better.
And EE won't handle World of Baldur's Gate or some other Big World compilations (by which we mean modpacks that install a shitload of content immediately in a funsized package), either.
>>2827724
>forced BG1 to BG2 mechanics conversion
wait...please explain?
>>2827729
Both BG1 and BG2 are based off of a certain mold of AD&D. BG2's system features three bonus new classes (and EE features some more on top of that), a new proficiency point system, the ability to dual-wield, etc.
The problem is, I always found that system kinda unfit for BG1. In BG1EE, you will find NPCs who have proficiency points put nowhere in the right places (Shar-Teel becomes a dual-wielder, for instance, sacrificing precious points into actual skills [giving her a rather crap early game], when in the original she was both a capable skirmisher and archer). It also means you have to decide on a proper weapon of choice from the start: in BG1, you had groups of weapons like "Large Swords", "Blunt Weapons" and "Small Swords", but in EE, due to BG2 mechanics, you have to put points into an individual weapon, so you won't be able to use Scimitars as well as you would Greatswords or Clubs as well as you could Staves.
And I have that autism where I try to recommend the most mechanically "pure" versions of games for first playthroughs, and EE doesn't come with a switch that adjusts what you want and what you don't want.
>>2827690
Up to you.
I kinda like the simplicity of BG1, I grew up with it, but at the same time it'd be exciting to check out EE for adding in things from BG2 that were sorely needed.
>>2827747
>It also means you have to decide on a proper weapon of choice from the start: in BG1, you had groups of weapons like "Large Swords", "Blunt Weapons" and "Small Swords", but in EE, due to BG2 mechanics, you have to put points into an individual weapon, so you won't be able to use Scimitars as well as you would Greatswords or Clubs as well as you could Staves.
That's actually a pretty good point. I don't dislike the more specific proficiency, but BG1 wasn't made with it in mind.
Still, I kinda wanna give EE a go some time.
>>2827752
Yeah. Another point is the BG2 kits and classes. All the EE NPCs utilize them and it kinda rustles my jimmies because it contributes to them standing out like a sore thumb.
>>2827754
whats wrong with NPC's using BG2 kits? Shouldn't that be expected? I mean, new game, new kits. Why WOULDN'T you throw them in there?
>>2827761
They just stand out.
BG1 NPCs were mostly made to have some core personalities and work off the whole "imagination" thing. Kivan the depressed elf ranger, Xan the depressed elf mage, Imoen your cheerful companion thief, etc. Then they are put next to Dorn il-Khan (meaning he's related to one of the final bosses), a half-orc bisexual blackguard (pretty strong powers, particularly early on) with his own cool sword (which is one of the better swords of its kind in the game, given how early you get him), one of the strongest stats for NPCs (no real weaknesses; he's a no-brainer for evil parties) and initiates talk with you all the time. I mean it - he has a lot to talk to you about, and it's just kind of annoying.
But on the other hand you have people like Rasaad who have to start off with a ton of their own gear and they still suck balls because Monks just suck balls in BGEE and Rasaad is no different, but he still is as talkative as any of the other EE NPCs.
>>2827754
I kind of like a lot of the specialized classes in BG2 though, so that doesn't bother me.
>>2827780
What if I treat Dorn as a boss and kill him on sight, then sell his loot?
>>2827690
imo all the originals need is a resolution patch
>>2827747
>And I have that autism where I try to recommend the most mechanically "pure" versions of games for first playthroughs,
The 'good' autism, then.
Saerileth mod best mod.
So in bg2ee is there any point in not making a their? The npc theifs are crap and you don't have imoen for half the fucking game
>>2827862
thats usually what I do
>>2827752
>>2827747
>you have to put points in specific weapons instead of groups
That's actually more accurate to the source material. This is how proficiencies worked in AD&D but it was also one of the least popular rules and is usually dummied out by DMs.
3rd Edition had a great compromise in that most weapons were all part of one of two very broad groups, but you could only specialize in an exact weapon.
So i'm making a Bounty hunter who also backstabs does this look good?
STR 18
DED 19
CON 12
INT 12
WIS 10
CHA 15
>>2829159
should I dump CHA and go for more CON?
>>2828657
Agreed
>>2829412
Jesus. Someone thought that was good.
So after hearing about these games for the last 14 years or so I got 1 and 2 for cheap off GOG and I'm playing through 1 on 2's engine thanks to mods.
HOLY SHIT, I can't stop getting my shit packed. How can I play this game and not suck at it, can anyone recommend a guide or something. I like a challenge but this is beyond frustrating. It feels like every time I enter a new part of the world map there are tons of baddies waiting around the corner waiting to wreck me. I'm trying to play as a fighter with most of my skill points in strenght and endurance. Generally making a tank character in western RPGs is pretty safe. Am I doing it wrong or am I a total bitch
>>2829519
>Throw away offensive damage spells
>Focus on utility spells
>Learn about Thac0
>learn about AC
>pause LOTS
>Have a good mix or melee and ranged.
>try not to enter new areas without buffs
>>2829527
>utility spells
This, offensive spells are pretty poor early on, especially since you'll have limited spell-slots.
You're a lvl1 mage, you have two Magic Missile memorized (because you can only memorize two spells at your level), you can do about 5-7 ranged damage with that if you're lucky, and that's not really going to do you a whole lot of good against a fighter with 17 hitpoints, or an ogre or something.
For low level mages, focus on buffs and disabling spells, cast protection spell on party members, summon something to help you fight, cast sleep on the enemy (leaving your party the opportunity to wander in and just stomp on them as they're on the ground).
Things like magic missile, chromatic orb, Melf's Acid Arrow, Larloch's Minor Drain, you gotta get up a level or two before those become useful for real, you need more spell-slots, for them to be worth your while.
Magic Missile is a level 1 spell, but it improves as your character gains levels, you get more projectiles per casting, they do more damage, they get a bit faster (I think?).
Magic Missile can't miss, and you can't save against it, but a level 1 MM is just inconsequential because of the low damage and the fact that you can't cast very many of them.
Also use character scripts. Get a good archer (like maybe a fighter with a longbow), DON'T get Khalid & Jaheira, they're cannon fodder and not worth sticking with. Get them early to fill out your party, but ditch them once you find better people. Someone should be a cleric and know some Cure Light Wounds and better.
Just having 'one good fighter' doesn't cut it, you need a party.
>used to play this for years and years
>get ee1 as a gift, see it has new kits
>solo the game with a half orc berserker and dwarf defender over the weekend
growing up hurts>roll a wild mage
>petrify myself before im out of candlekeep
kek
>>2829412
So...an eternal fedora wearing virgin wrote this, I see.
>>2829519
Crowd control spells are your friend, especially early on. Anything that charms, fears, disables movement. It basically shuts down parties.
>>2829159
I find that, mostly, Charisma barely seems to do anything if it's not 18, so I'd get CON up to 16, but on the other hand, it's not that big of a deal.
You can also drop a few points from Strength if you want more CON but don't want your character to lose the dashing appeal.
Wisdom doesn't do anything for you at all.
>>2829519
BG1 is won by the power of the bow and melee only gets good by mid-game once you get magic weapons, and all your mages should spam Sleep.
>>2829617
>Get a good archer (like maybe a fighter with a longbow), DON'T get Khalid & Jaheira, they're cannon fodder and not worth sticking with
Veto! Khalid can be turned into one of the best archers in the game, better with time than Kivan and only barely worse than Coran, you just have to put his remaining ranks into bows. Jaheira is kind of meh, but she's a cleric-like that can use a Drizzt scimitar, and that's useful, though normally I'd kill her off to get Branwen or Yeslick later. And anyway, both Khalid and Jaheira are met in Friendly Arm Inn, you are supposed to go there anyway, they're plenty good for initial challenges and can be substituted for later, you have plenty of XP to do NPC switcharoos at leisure.
>>2829842
As an assassin in BG2 is your backstab doomed to miss alot? I just made an assassin elf assassin. 18 str 19 dex. First tried daggers, missed all the time, now using short sword and STILL missing....i have Move silently up to 100 and Hide up to 75
Am i missing something?
>>2829954
Single class thieves dont get much tohit bonuses. Striking from shadows properly gives you bonus 4 tohit tho. I recommend that the best assassin Build early game is dart thrower; 3 attacks per round, each applies poison. Assassin is best early on for disabling mages as poison goes thru stoneskin.
>>2829983
so are you saying early game start with darts, then move on to bckstab later on?
>>2829954
>assassin elf assassin
That's a lot of assassin. Is he a multiclass assassin/assassin?
>>2829986
Yeah, short bow also good with the Tuigan and elf bonuses to bows.
Pure thief is always a meticulous playthru and i recommend lots of oils of Speed and invis items to maximize hiding ability
>>2829987
lel my bad must have been drunk while typing that. No just the thief kit.
>>2829994
awesome. Is it worth anything adding move silent past 100?
>>2829842
>Jaheira is kind of meh, but she's a cleric-like
She's an AWFUL cleric and a very bleh fighter.
I don't think she ever managed to hold more than maybe two or three slots of Cure Light Wounds when I used her way back in the day. She was useless as a healer.
>>2830050
She's great at the beginning of the game. Throw some armor on her send her to the front lines. The best part about her, if she dies who the fuck cares
>>2830050
i keep her untill she gets cursed just for the quest.
>>2830069
>She's great at the beginning of the game
Well yeah, if you have space n your party you might as well pack her along for the moment, she can carry stuff, and though her healing is pretty poor, it's better than nothing, every little bit helps.
I tend to give her a sling and bullets so she can stay at a distance and sometimes hit enemies with them, adds a little bit of usability, but I'd much rather have a proper archer or a cleric who can heal good.
Khalid isn't half-bad, he can be pretty good if you do things right, but Jaheira being attached to him kind of drags him down to me.
I know the trick about the Ring Of Folly, but I just don't have the heart to do that to happily married couple.
>>2830093
oh man that early defensive harmony works wonders early game. Her insect swarm as well makes the slaver quest take 5 minutes. But I agree, past that fucking useless. She usually caries the poisoned guy to the docks for me and parts ways
>>2830112
>defensive harmony works wonders early game. Her insect swarm as well makes the slaver quest take 5 minutes
You're talking about BG2 or EE or something, aren't you?
She was a bit more useful in BG2 because Druids were made to not be as useless, but on the other hand, her better half is dead
>>2830050
>very bleh fighter
Being able to wield a Drizzt scimitar is good enough, and her physical stats are okay. As Fighter, she can imbue herself with Fighter-only STR potions (you don't need 18/xx strength in every trash mob encounter), her DEX and CON are okay, etc. And she has Entangle to make herself useful.
In both BG1 and BG2, she's really a late game character, IMHO. In BG1 because of Drizzt's scimitar, in BG2 because she's amazing with Ironskins and Fighter HLAs.
She's pretty okay for most players. Not the most optimized, but still a far cry from some other NPCs.
FWIW, my favourite powegaming cleric NPCs are Tiax and Quayle, and not because lol irony.
>>2829828
it was a married couple if I remember correctly
>BGEE
>druids dont get Icewind Dale spells
>bards dont get songs
one job beamdog, one fucking job.
>>2827541
The spell is cool, the poblem is just that the aggro range and fog of war in these games is always so short, that's why you always hardly have any space between you and the enemy.
Install World of Baldur's Gate.
you motherfuckers, first Diablo now this, you guys are killing me, I can't keep seeing these threads and then redownloading these games and playing for 24 hours straight, I draw the line after baldurs gate
>>2827540
>Half-realtime-turn-based combat
Absolute haram!
>>2830392
>linking >>>/v/
seriously needs to be a bannable offense now
So, how do you solo as a kensei/mage? Do you just stock up on health potions get spells to open locks detect/disarm traps? I don't get it.
>>2830886
Solo as Kensai/Mage is easy, just dual at an appropriate level (12-13 as solo even), stock up on scrolls and abuse spell scribing XP to rapidly gain levels.
You don't really need a Thief. Any trap can be facetanked, esp. with proper spells before hand. You have Knock for locks, and you can simply bash them open once you readily gain ways into 25 Strength.
All Mages have plenty of ways to turn themselves into total God Mode, and you will end encounters without having taken any damage, so you won't even need that much healing.
You can put on a Ring of Regeneration for a moment to deal with any health woes, anyway. But it never hurts to carry the 27 HP healing potions, anyway.
>>2830964
start as kensai and dual into mage?
>>2831010
Yeah. How else would you do that?
>>2831029
sorry don't really know anything about dual class. So i just lost all of my weapon proficiency for kensai, how and when do I get them back?
>>2831749
Just become a mage of a higher level than Kensai
So is anybody offended by the fact that the beginning of BG2 established that the 'real' playthrough of BG1 is done with Imoen, Jaheira, Khalid, Minsc and Dynaheir?
>>2831826
No.
>>2829082
>theif
I really want to hear you pronounce it.
who is gonna pirate the new expansion from bgee?
>>2831826
Inconsistencies like that get handwaved, hence why you can tell quite a few people that they're "supposed to be dead" and they just brush it off.
That and Minsc hits like a truck, Imoen is an excellent thief, and Jaheira has the ability to raise the dead. They make up a solid fighter/mage/thief party for the first dungeon.
>>2832215
thief my bad, I get excited when I type sometimes.
>>2832380
also thieves
>>2832356
I will, if they ever release it
>>2832215
Thayf.
>>2831826
It doesn't really. It only confirms that you adventured with them at some point. Maybe Imoen is implied to have stuck with you the whole time, but the rest were hired help. It also implies that you adventured with some of the other BG1 losers that you encounter, so obviously this so called 'canon party' weren't with you the whole time in 'canon'.
>>2832365
>big bad motherfucker from the first game that I remember killing
>"Didn't I kill you?"
>remedy this with Horn of Blasting, sending the fucker flying and hemorrhaging
>>2831826
In the book, that is indeed the canon party. Also, the main guy Abel is a colossal douche.
However, the game did a solid thing by pretty much making it clear that you travelled with every npc that you meet from 1 that is in 2 as well. Which is okay by me. Just that the before mentioned party is the one you were with when Irenicus went batshit.
>>2833173
>In the book
Thinking of picking it up on steam, does it work on Windows 10?
>>2833435
EE should work.
>Windows 10
My condolences.
Anyone here mind recommending some similar D&D based games?
I played baldurs gate, Icewind dale, NWN and Planescape torment and I think thats all the rts style wrpgs that I know.
Doesnt matter if its not retro, I just need something good.
>>2834609
bump, also looking for similar
>>2834609
Dark Sun Shattered Lands
Knights of the Chalice
modded ToEE
>>2835382
WAAAHHH!! WAAAHHH!!! I DONT KNOW HOW TO ARTICULATE MYSELF SO IM JUST GOING TO SAY "CASUAL"! WAAAAHHHH!!!
>>2835383
lol nah
but seriously in BG1 there are tons of NPCs for your party, I don't mind that most of them are just a portray and a voice actor. Actually it always lots of flexibility for your party.
In BG2 they reduced the number of NPCs but they all need to have their special backstory and shit, their special quest and equipment, you can romance them etc. I just prefer when I can simply use the normal game mechanics and not have all the NPCs be special etc
>>2835382
You're not the only one, BG's1 it's the best game Bioware ever made.
>>2833520
It is what I have.It was that or stay with Windows 8
>>2835501
Should have gone back to 7 or gone to 9.
I usually say skip every other Windows OS, but I don't think they're gonna stop spying on people when Windows 11 comes around, I think this is it.
>>2835389
You always had the option to use multiplayer to build your own custom group, and then they're back to portraits and a voice.
The way NPCs were handled was always a bit of a mess. Would have been better in my mind to have most of them parked at the Friendly Arm in 1 and let you pick your party without having to wander the sword coast to recruit everyone you wanted.
The whole thing they had going in 2 worked a bit better in that everyone still acted like they had individual goals instead of delivering a line about what they want out of life and basically forgetting about it once they joined your group. The only thing that was really awkward was the 3 females trying to jump in to your pants, except they wanted very specific responses.
Guess the class.
>>2835690
Fighter/Mage/Thief
Lore-wise, what would be the best time to do TotSC?
I usually do it after the second visit to Candlekeep but I don't know
>>2835690
With 18 INT? Wizard.
>>2835849
Bingo. Spent like 3 hours rolling.
Can you have companions join you again after you drop them off?
>>2835865
I rolled all 15+ the last D&D campaign I was at, then the DM asked me to reroll. I wasn't happy with that because the stats don't make the adventurer, the adventure does. Also, why say 4d6, drop lowest and not expect this to happen? I ran with an adventurer with 16, 12, 10, 9, 7, and 3 and didn't ask for rerolls.
>>2835882
Well it makes sense in BG because as a child of god you're supposed to be overpowered.
>>2835690
'Ezy Ryder' kensai/mage dual or a fighter/mage/thief multi
>>2835880
Most of them, yes. Some (like Jaheira in BG2) get pissed when you drop them and can possibly leave forever.
>>2827690
Enhanced if you're new
>>2835690
Strength to 14 (breaking point for getting a reasonable max weight bonus) is really all you need if you aren't playing a melee class. 15 if you want to sacrifice 1 point in hell.
>>2827690
Do you want to mod your game? If yes, avoid EE.
If you really have to play EE look what characters are new and avoid them like the plaque. They're shitty fanfic tier.
>>2836012
It depends on your reputation. As Jaheira is neutral-aligned, she'll stay kicked or leave by her own volition if your reputation gets too high or too low, but nobody leaves at average reputation.
They make it crystal-clear when they do not approve of the party's reputation.
>>2836029
Nah, Jaheira will leave you forever no matter your reputation if
1.) you're in her romance
2.) the whole harper shenanigans already happened and she has "no other place to go"
>>2836067
>exceptional strength
>dual classing to magic user
You can't make effective characters with all-round strengths. Either stick with fighter types to maximize the usefulness of exceptional strength, or stick with wizard types to maximize your casting abilities from exceptional intelligence. Having levels from both just ensures that you'll be worse at both.
>>2835910
Sarevok rolled a 95, just saying
>>2836091
No reason in not maxing out strength if you get the points.
>>2836137
Having to buy int potions whenever you want to learn a few spells can be pretty inconvenient.
>>2836173
Except if you're a wizard and then you could be putting any of those in literally any other stat and be the better for it.
Which is basically the entire point of what I said earlier.
>>2836137
>No, seriously, it barely does anything
Holy fucking shit, ARE you being serious? The pre-requisite for casting a spell is that the caster must have INT equal to 10+spell level.
>>2836202
Not in Baldur's Gate. Or at least, the original Baldur's Gate. EE might have changed that.
>>2836195
Still, if you're making a hybrid mage and need to skimp out on one of the core stat, skimp out on Intelligence.
I either change my difficulty to Very Easy while scribing scrolls or drink those potions anyway before scribing because having a 98% chance of scribing a one-of-a-kind scroll still means I'll likely fuck it up.
>>2836274
>Not in Baldur's Gate
FUCKING VIDEO GAMES.
>>2836278
IWD is much better at this whole "adapting AD&D" thing, isn't it? What with the proper implementation of bards and druids and shit.
>>2836278
That's how the actual game works too. You're thinking of third edition rules.
>>2836294
OK, sorry, the math was INT => Spell level x 2. It's still fucking wrong to say "INT is a bad stat for mages"
>>2836301
Well, it is for Sorcerers, even if the game says that Intelligence does something for them.
For Mages, I figure that the Mage would be the easiest character to play a minimum stat character or a character with little to no rerolling.
I mostly find high Intelligence to be a convenience thing for mages. I'd rather invest that into Wisdom to have better Wish outcomes, or Charisma for the Friends spell (in BG1 at least).
Of course you need to have at least 17 Int to dual into a mage, anyway.
>>2836303
What's this sorcerers shit? AD&D only has one spellcasting class, the wizard (aka mage). Wish isn't affected by WIS and you'd need 18 intelligence to even cast it.
Like, does this game even follow the rules for 2nd Edition or is it just AD&D inspired?
>>2836324
>What's this sorcerers shit? AD&D only has one spellcasting class, the wizard (aka mage).
BG2 introduces the 3rd edition's classes, Barbarian, Monk and Sorcerer, into a rather butchered AD&D form.
The core is there - Barb is the tankiest non-caster in the game, Monk is a speedy brawler with some special shit, and Sorcerer cast spells off the top of his head.
But they didn't give Sorcerer any stat whatsoever that determines his spellcasting.
>Wish isn't affected by WIS
In BG2, low WIS makes your character ask for things that he ends up regretting fast. To articulate the right Wishes to get actual positive benefits, you need high WIS.
>Like, does this game even follow the rules for 2nd Edition or is it just AD&D inspired?
The rules like THAC0, AC, Vancian magic etc. are there, but some sacrifices had to be made when translating the pnp into the computer. Some of those changes suck dick though, like how the Bard song doesn't seem to do anything and how Druids lost a ton of their "utility" spells that they couldn't carry over from pnp while still retaining their bullshit XP progression.
>>2836338
>The rules like THAC0, AC, Vancian magic etc. are there, but some sacrifices had to be made when translating the pnp into the computer.
They really did a fantastic job considering how everything plays out in real time and not on a turn by turn basis like Fallout.
>>2836197
If you have a 90+ roll there is literally no point in not pushing STR to 18+ considering all the bonuses.
>Except if you're a wizard
No. A Fighter/Mage.ö
>>2836439
You should learn to read before you call other people retards.
>wizards
Again, Fighter/Mage. How hard is it to understand?
>>2835382
BG1 WAS the best. It was the only game i've ever got invested into to the point where I was getting excited and felt like I was almost in the game.
I remember that one part where I came across that spider bitch in the spider lair. I was extremely low level but I really wanted that sword from the chest. So I set my guys up in a big line going from the lair to the end of the map, and one guy would run and grab the sword and run to the other guy, hand him the sword, run to the other guy and hand HIM the sword. etc. etc. and as each guy handed off a sword he would take a couple spiders with him to distract them. It was so much fun
>>2835690
Better not be kensai/mage like I did. The game isn't fun anymore. Seriously, WHY do people play that class? Do people actually have fun buffing for 5 minutes before every fight then mindlessly kill things while not taking a point of dmg?
>>2836027
dorn il kahn and rashad are okay. Not great, but at least not absolutely horrid like the others
>>2836137
If I wanted a limited number of spells I would roll sorcerer. The point of being a wizard is its flexibility.
>>2837321
You can memorize all the spells you want if you just drink intelligence potions before scribing.
>The point of being a wizard is its flexibility.
This doesn't translate so well to BG, though. There aren't nearly as many combat situations or spells that warrant you having to change up. Sorcerers are not only straight up better - there are several no-brainer spells that any mage should take, and any extraordinary occurances can be dealt with with scrolls and wands, and you can make a sorcerer for a variety of playstyles - you will also reach certain spells much earlier than a Wizard, limited by scrolls.
Having the option to do something like Death Spell while still questing in Athkatla is pretty amazing. Wizard isn't likely to do that, that scroll is very rare pre-Ust Natha.
>>2837370
>You can memorize all the spells you want if you just drink intelligence potions before scribing
I like min-maxing and all, but I have my limits
>>2835382
>"here get this awesome magic sword but it could only ever work on a specific NPC"
literally never
>>2839810
Moonblade.
>>2839814
u talkin about bg1 or bg2 here retard
moonblade was in BG1 only withtout mods
>>2837138
Want to break the game completely? Human ranger and dual class to cleric at level 9
You get your normal cleric spells and for some also ALL druid spells
2 points in 2 weapon skill makes him a beast with Crom Faeyr + Flail of Ages
Stealth is a nice bonus
>>2835382
>it's really designed only for the main player
>several NPCs have sidequests of their own, will leave the party to deal with their own problems and will argue with the player about your choices
Only thing BG1 had over BG2 was exploration.
In BGEE, at that inn in Nashkel, Khalid just got confused and started attacking us so we moved outside until the spell wore off. While we were outside I saw "Khalid does 1 damage to Commoner" in the log. I went back in after he cooled off, everyone's still friendly apart from the woman he hit. She'd red-ringed but isn't acting aggressively. Thing is, we can't rest because "there are monsters about". Is there any way of making her friendly again?
>>2841082
maybe a charm spell
Fuck you, BG.
>>2841142
They're just bandits, easy pickings.
>>2841148
I dunno, man. My party is half level 1, half level 2. See the 4th character down? That's a gnome thief/illusionist with just 4HP.
My class HP per level says +5 but it only goes up by 3 (testing by lowering the difficulty to where it guarantees maximum HP up).
>>2841158
>That's a gnome thief/illusionist with just 4HP.
He gon die
>>2833221
Yes, that thing with papers which strange people sometimes turn and read words printed on it. Weird, I know.
>>2831826
It's odd because I killed Minsc after he decided to attack me when we first met. I distinctly remember looting his corpse but there he was.
Best magic user in BG1?
>>2841142
>They changed Imoen's portrain on her scarred matured version.
Fuck you, EE.
>>2841321
Bhaalspawn
>>2841321
Quayle due to Illusionist/Cleric cheese and his special ability is nice too.
Dualled Imoen for a powerful mage that also shoots arrows (which are amazing in BG1) and does all the thieving utility.Edwin is a cookie-cutter answer
>>2841472
nice try
>>2841128
Ranger/cleric is already overpowered enough. No need for a kit.
any good portraits about paladin/knights?
210 x 330 it is possible.
>>2841472
The thing is, her original one looks a lot older. She looks like a 40-year-old soccer mom with heavy makeup in BG1. It's really jarring when you call her "little one" at the start, it looks like you're talking to a stereotypical teacher at school rather than a cute little sister. She actually looks a lot more age appropriate in BG2 where they seemed to actually design a portrait for her rather than just tracing a photo of one of the dev's aunties.
>>2842519
the bg2 one has always looked really awkward to me, but maybe it's because i grew up seeing the first one
>>2842531
It does look a bit awkward. Neither are that good. The general rule seems to be that the BG1 ones are more accomplished pieces of art (at least the faces, not so much the bodies) but really don't go with the character (or even race, in terms of Jaheira).
They do have this odd quality to them, though, like the Imoen BG1 one looks like it's reflected in a brass door knob, the way the hair blobs around her head, and her body seems oddly small and warped compared to the face. There's another problem I've noticed that almost every (or maybe every) female in BG1 has a really tiny chin. Plus a shitload of makeup on, typical of an older woman trying to look young.
The BG2 ones fit the characters/race/age more but then look like Photoshop-smudged trash drawings based around a photo of a face. Yet I can't get away from the fact that BG1 Imoen looks like a slutty, mature teacher from a porno whereas at least BG2 Imoen looks vaguely 20ish.
I got BG1 when it came out, I was about 17 at the time, and I couldn't believe how bad most of the portraits were in terms of fitting the character. I always played with a custom party because of that, and because the characterisation was so slight anyway. Remember, BG1 is a game that lets your PC have any portrait in the game and if it happens to be one of an NPC, they get a different one. The portraits actually being those specific NPCs seems like an afterthought. I'm sure they just got a batch drawn in isolation and then attributed them to NPCs later.
>>2842519
Which reminds me, has someone found all the photos the BG2 portraits were based on?
>>2842572
Bottom line: IWD portraits are better
>>2842592
Well just to bitch about everything here, the problem with IWD ones is that look literally like portraits, like oil paintings, rather than like people. A bit too abstract, maybe. But yeah, they lack the "I put a photoshop filter over a picture of my LARP buddies" feeling that BG has.
>>2842597
The BG1 ones are based on real faces too, drawn over photos even, but just of friends of Bioware going by how the "incredibly beautiful" NPC from BG1 - I forget her name - is a complete dog.
PoE has the best portraits.
>>2842623
Full pleb.
>>2842531
the demo was even worst
>>2842640
But I don't want to fuck any of them.
>>2842705
what? there are a couple of totally fuckable ladies there
What are the best Forgotten Realms games in the old school first-person perspective? I've been playing the first Ravenloft game recently and it's put me in the mood.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fOimzp-3vQg
Is there any point to having more than one Turn Undead going at a time?
>>2841741
It needs a kit to give it character. Hence, the focus on beastmaster. And that's half the problem with archer, on the one hand an archer not using bows doesn't benefit as much, on the other hand an archer using just a sling is particularly lame, even compared to an archer using a crossbow, that at least sounds okay.
You should be able to make a crossbow archer, and dual class to a thief or bard, that would feel quite natural.
>>2827540
Whats your favorite way to play Bg2 /bgg/ ?
>favorite party.
>alignment.
>what class for the player.
>solo?
>>2842530
fucking amazing
>>2842760
double the rolls, of course.
>>2842519
No she doesn't. She just looks a little fattish in the first, and then taller in the second. Though it is awkward, the first one looks more appropriate for a spellcaster, the second more appropriate for a thief. The earlier one would even work well for a bard.
Contrary to Edwin, who went from sturdy to kind of fat.
>>2843083
In an in-universe way, she looks like a middle-aged, drunk noblewoman looking for some adventurer dick as her husband's away doing business in the city.
>>2843093
There actually is a decent edit of Imoen's picture which does make her look old, apparently from the same set as this one, which ironically makes Faldorn look so much younger.
>>2843125
There were a bunch of these, IIRC for most or even all characters. They seemed to be mostly for the sake of making BG1 portraits fit with BG2.
>>2843093
Here it is, I can totally agree that this one really does make her look like a "middle-aged, drunk, soccer mom with heavy makeup, looking for some adventurer dick"
>>2843162
there's even one that fleshes out the noblewoman potential
best edit
>>2842930
>favorite party.
Right now is: Saerileth (yes, that one), Keldorn, Ajantis (mod), Isra (mod) and Imoen.
>alignment.
LG of course.
>what class for the player.
Undead Hunter or Lord (mod)
>solo?
Is get boring after a couple of times.
>>2842640
Most of them have that tumblr-style diseased nose look.
>>2843682
>Saerileth
How does it feels to have such a bad taste?
>>2843758
you tell me, you sure go with thief and dirty fighters
>>2842623
too bad its not very good
>>2841142
the infamous 10 bandit random encounter,
the bane of many a solo no-reload run -_-
>>2844012
>solo no-reload run
Stack up on invisible potions.
>>2841472
Same with Jaheira... fucking EE
>>2842592
Yep, they are really awesome. I tried to build every character around an idea of a person in my head and I always found a fitting portrait. I really enjoyed that
>>2842705
Why not?
>>2843556
My dick is tingeling
>>2844071
How did the various kits work in this aspect for you?
>>2844050
again, nice try.
>>2843556
I normally hate these celebrity based ones, but this one is neatly done, particularly with the mix of her BG1 and BG2 hair.
Do some daggers still use the small swords proficiency in BGEE?
>>2841321
In 1? Edwin is still pretty good, Dyanaheir is excellent for blasting. If we're putting in clerics in the mix as well, then that dwarf you find in some mine. Fighter-cleric and a whole lot of bad assitude.
>>2842930
The one I played and enjoyed was:
>>Main character, Keldorn, Korgan, Viconia, Imoen/Yoshimo, Edwin/Minsc.
>>Alignment: Neutral
>>What class the player: Wizard
>>Solo? Nah. I like the banter in this game.
>>2841142
So I kicked him in the head till he was dead. Nyahaha
>>2845246
pretty sure they have their own category
>>2845712
"...I... I can't believe I just said that!"
Does anyone here play using the tactics mod?
>tfw when you give your tanky dwarf fire resistance from multiple sources and then stick him in the middle of enemies while your mages cast fireball on him
truly the best tactic
>>2848617
Even better with fire resistance over 100%
>>2848635
that cheap and dishonest way to defeat firkraag... oh man, the nostalgia.
Haven't played baldur's gate 1 or 2 in a while, is there any pros to the enhanced edition? I have the originals of both, just curious if they are actually worth playing or if all the changes are basically for the worse.
Also whats the most definitive way to play them now? Any fan patches or anything like that out there that improve them without busting its balance?
>>2842930
>favorite party
"Canon party" for BG 1 - Imoen, Khalid, Minsc, Jaheira
BG 2- Yoshimo (replaced with Imoen when reobtained), Minsc, Jaheira, Mazzy, X (rotating position to complete all NPC side quests, ultimately filled permanently by Sarevok)
>alignment
Neutral Good - I go romance with Jaheira and like to imagine him joining the Harpers, so neutral good is the perfect alignment. It also matches what I see as the standard adventurer's alignment.
>what class for the player
Half Elven Fighter / Mage
No one ever goes Half-Elf.
>solo?
Not anymore. Even on max difficulty solo, there's no class in this game that's terribly difficult to beat the game with. I just play for the fun of the experience these days.
>>2849234
>No one ever goes Half-Elf.
But it has access to all the multiclasses without any bullshit
>Not anymore. Even on max difficulty solo, there's no class in this game that's terribly difficult to beat the game with. I just play for the fun of the experience these days.
Go with SCS+Ascension
>>2849215
If you have the originals, they work on your system, and you have the 10 minutes necessary to install stuff like the fixpacks and resolution patches, then there's no point to EEs. All of its bonus content is basically mod-tier in terms of balance/fitting/etc., just a high-budget mod. Might as well install NPCs like Kelsey.
>Any fan patches or anything like that out there that improve them without busting its balance?
Sword Coast Stratagems really improves the AI and makes the battles more interesting. If you normally play BG on Insane, SCS+Standard difficulty is the way to go nowadays.
However SCS won't work on vanilla BG1, so you also need something like Baldur's Gate Trilogy or EasyTuTu to have BG1 work off BG2 mechanics.
>>2849215
>is there any pros to the enhanced edition?
Zoomable view and a slightly nicer interface.
>first started playing when I was in my early teens
>found a really cheesy way to beat the shadow dragon at the temple of amaunator ruins (spamming traps that bypass ac and raped it, just lay multiple traps + rest in front of dragon + lay multiple traps, rinse and repeat until there are enough to instakill it - my MC was the only rogue in the party)
>showed my older brother who got the game in the first place, I was all proud of my achievement
>he shakes his head, calling me out on using dirty tactics to remove any challenge
>I smugly tell him that I wasn't cheating, only using a "technicality"
>play the game the next day
>having difficulty with one of the lich encounters, decide to go for my tried and true "set overkill number of overpowered traps, lure lich to death"
>find out on setting my first trap that older brother had secretly changed the sound file so whenever my MC lays a trap instead of the default "I have set my trap well" message it screeched "I HAVE DECIDED TO USE A *TECHNICALITY*
still raises a smile to this day
>>2849362
Let's be fair, a dragon would very quickly call bullshit on a human laying traps around it.
Traps and skull traps should disappear on-rest purely because of how they're ridiculous as fuck otherwise.
>>2849371
Oh, I know it was cheese, even knew it when I'd first started playing but was too lazy to try to come up with other strategies when spamming traps destroyed most encounters - just found it funny the particular way my older brother chose to mock my dirty tactis is all.
I think ToB set a limit on how many traps you could set in one area (or it may have been a patch, cant remember) to combat this.
>>2849326
>But it has access to all the multiclasses without any bullshit
The only thing it really has is tripleclassing which is a noobtrap.
>all the heals of a cleric, strength of a fighter and magic of a mage!? how can i lose!
Or Cleric / Ranger which I will always maintain is the most overrated combination exalted by BG fans.
>>2848635
>>2849093
What happens with resistance over 100%?
It doesn't...... heal you , does it???
Also nth for BG1 portraits are better because their art guy died before they made BG2
>>2849502
>The only thing it really has is tripleclassing which is a noobtrap.
F/M/T is the most comfy solo playthrough, you get UAI, you fight well and you can spellcast. You can abuse Mislead/Blackblade of Disaster backstabs. It's awesome. F/M/C/ is not too shabby either, but better in IWD imho, where Thieves kinda suck comparatively.
>Or Cleric / Ranger which I will always maintain is the most overrated combination exalted by BG fans.
Why? Either multiclass you pick (let's say Dwarven Fighter/Cleric, for the shorty saving throws), you get only ++ proficiency points, and in base BG2, grandmastery is bugged to be almost worthless. Ranger/Cleric doesn't lose anything (except potential Dwarf saving throws), and you gain both Druid and Cleric spells, which is imba as fuck. Not the super top tier, but a pretty solid combination nonetheless.
Like literally what's your point
>>2849510
>It doesn't...... heal you , does it???
Yes it does.
>rerolling stats for an hour
kill me
Had a lot of fun playing BG1 (in tutu) as a solo Blade. Very strong class. Polymorph self is an absolutely amazing spell.
>>2849587
The best is save/import every character you made in lvl1 for future reuse.
>>2849531
>F/M/T
...why not just roll Bard at that point?
>>2850293
Bard has no search/disarm trap skill which is kind of important.
So, I tried the widescreen patch for BG2. Is it just me or does it really just stretch the screen?
>>2850305
polymorph self > mustard jelly and just tank that shit for no damage.
Another good thing about bards is the crazy amount of caster levels they get, which makes infinitely scaling spells like Skull Trap amazing at higher levels.
>>2850321
>Is it just me or does it really just stretch the screen?
I miss the IWD bard in BG
>>2850896
I'm playing IWD2 right now but I don't have a bard. What's good about it?
>>2842623
PoE is pure shit.
Not even mention that pile of shit in this thread.
>>2850293
Let's see:
>A Bard can't backstab.
In vanilla BG, it's a pretty good skill, and in BG2, you can do all sorts of cheese: invisibility spells are leveraged greatly by the thief part of your multiclass, and Mislead can be abused into something hilariously overpowered, doubly so with Blackblade of Disaster.
>A Bard won't get ** in weapons
Just a single *. F/M/T will have a smoother time fighting until buffs are acquired.
>If you're solo/in a small team, F/M/T's three classes will advance very rapidly
Self-explanatory, really.
>F/M/T has more, better HLAs.
Greater Whirlwind, epic mage spells, epic thief traps, and still retains UAI, compared to bard, whose song is very team-dependent.
>F/M/T benefits more from XP cap removers
You play Bard if you want a single-classed FMT-lite hybrid, it's not backwards. Bard actually fits into teams and such; F/M/T and F/M/C are solo characters. F/M/C is really fucking powerful too; think about how godlike you can make Aerie, and then add Fighter levels on top of that (HP, THAC0, etc.).
>>2852513spoko, mi też nie chodzi xD
>>2852536
I'd still go with a Blade over a F/M/T.
Thief: Between spells and attacks, Backstab is entirely superfluous. Detect/Disarm/Stealth is entirely pointless with spells. Note that the Bard DOES have all the epic thief traps and UAI.
Mage: It'll take 2.25million XP to cast 6th level spells whereas the Bard was casting those a million XP earlier and with an insanely higher caster level. By the time the Mage gets top-end spells, the Bard'll have UAI and can just fire off scrolls of the same.
Fighter: Offensive Spin puts him easily on the same field with the Fighter with the added benefit of wearing armor to compensate for his AC.
So, at low levels the Bard will be stronger. At mid levels the Bard will be stronger. At high levels, the Bard will be stronger. At the very end-game with epic everything, the F/M/T could arguably be stronger, but with the distinction that the Bard can still easily handle every single encounter too so he's not at a disadvantage.
People just have this odd mindset of
>wow, Fighter / Mage / Thief?! I could do EVERYTHING!
But turn their noses up at the idea of playing an "underpowered" Bard.
Opinions on fighter/mage vs kensai 13 / mage 28?
>>2853653
Kensai is the stronger, but cheesier option. The no armor is already a moot point with being a Mage and the Gauntlets / Bracers aren't that big a loss.
If I recall correctly, the Gauntlets of Extraordinary Specialization don't stack with Haste, so you're just missing out on the +1 Dmg, +1 THAC0 from Weapon Expertise which is completely negated by the Kensai abilities.
Spells offset the AC thing pretty well too. Spirit Armor is as strong as Full Plate and lasts so long you basically cast it once after a rest and you're good until the next time you rest.
>>2853653
F/M doesn't have to be solo (for a team-based kensai/mage, you have to dual very early) and has a nicer progression throughout the game (no slump when you're regaining your Mage levels), plus access to Fighter HLAs.
>>2853625
>Thief: Between spells and attacks, Backstab is entirely superfluous
It helps to diversify your tactics (if only just for the heck of it) and hiding can help preserve spellslots you'd use on Invisibility otherwise. Backstab can be pretty ridiculous with Mislead and/or Simulacrum cheese, too. Strong burst damage on your first attack is certainly just nice to have.
>Mage: It'll take 2.25million XP to cast 6th level spells whereas the Bard was casting those a million XP earlier and with an insanely higher caster level. By the time the Mage gets top-end spells, the Bard'll have UAI and can just fire off scrolls of the same.
Scrolls of high level spells are limited - unless we're talking Simulacrum abuse. A mage hybrid certainly can fire them off more often in normal cases. Also, in a solo playthrough, you're still gated not only by XP gains, but also chapter progression. You won't find most high-level scrolls until past Underdark; if you want to capitalize on this advantage of the Bard at its most capacious (as in press your advantage before the mage would be able to), I'd argue you'd do well to get scroll-hunting rather early and leave some of the content for the final chapters.
>Fighter: Offensive Spin puts him easily on the same field with the Fighter with the added benefit of wearing armor to compensate for his AC.
I don't pay much attention to AC, myself - it's a dud stat by mid-SoA, and ToB completely invalidates it. Mage-types have better ways to insure immortality, like the Protection from Magic Weapons spell.
Fighters still enjoy better weapon specialization, progress more often in weapon pips (= more weapon versatility), have 18/xx strength available for early game (before buffs), etc.
(cont.)
>>2853625
>>2853882
Let's talk about HLAs, once again. I'd argue that, past a certain level, classes don't really improve all that much on their climb to level 40. F/M/T will have access to some really cheesy stuff, like Assassination, Greater Whirlwind, Critical Hit, and some more benefits like Hardiness; with something like The Ravager, you're looking at way more damage output.
I'd also argue that the early levels for F/M/T aren't that bad - you have the option of dealing with every encounter with the very cost-effective backstabs; this is an advantage over the bard, you have a much easier time setting up good Sleeps, Webs (edging the LoS of your enemies), and backstabs. On top of the diversity of tactics, throughout BG1 you'll also have access to the Composite Longbow, as well as ** pips in weapons and so on. I think F/M/T wins early levels with the Bard on those merits.
I find your points to be very well articulated, of course - but I still find the triple-classes to have a lot of merit to them. Bard is a very good character, that's for sure.
>>2849587
If you're willing to spend hours until you get the desired stats, just cheat.
>>2853625
>Blade
He can also do cheezy shit like combining Defensive spin with Freedom, wear boots of speed while polymorphed into wolf and having offensive spin on to essentially teleport around the map while shooting wands/rings/necklaces, and can at higher levels go apeshit with tensers transformation.
>>2849510
Yep, it heals.
If you manage to get your physical resistance over 100%, guess what happens? You get healed when you get hit.
>>2842930
>favorite party
Korgan, Edwin, Mazzy, Jan, Viconia
>alignment
Chaotic Neutral
>class for the player
Inquisitor/Blade
>solo
Solo is fun for a while but tends to get boring by chapter 3~5. Still, had some fun times playing a sorcerer with a borat soundset. Casting shitloads of magic missiles while my character yells "ILL EAT YOUR SHIT" was so fun.
What do you think the best power gaming classes are for the PC?
Everyone knows kensai/mage can shit on the game, but what else is super effective?
>>2854979
Inquisitor is just down right overpowered too.
>lvl 35 demilich casting shitloads of protection spells rendering him literally immune to everything in the game
>Inquisitor just goes "lol no", cast Magic Dispel and rape his shit with Carsomyr +6
>>2854979
Blade, Monk (at higher levels), Cleric/Mage and Cleric/Ranger.
>>2854979
Cleric/Thief is a very interesting combo. It's a toolbox character who will do whatever you need - open locks, disarm traps, heal you -- and he also boasts some ridiculous backstab damage numbers. Staff of Striking is the best backstab item in the game due to its special power. Add all sorts of Cleric buffs to your backstab, elevate your strength to 25 with Draw Upon Holy Might, and chunk people for 100 damage in BG1 alone.
Bonus points - you get to play as either a half-orc (19 Strength, but honestly, it's only good in BG1, because you have a shitload of +STR bonuses available to you as a Cleric in BG2) or a gnome (my favored option due to shorty saving throws and massive style points).
And for total minmaxers there's the obvious Assassin/Cleric combo.
Other stuff: the Blade bard, Barbarian (the tankiest non-spellcaster motherfucker ever, Hardiness + Defender of Easthaven = wtf), Inquisitor, all sorts of Fighter/Thief types (Kensai/Thief can get UAI to wear anything anyway), any of the Dwarf/Gnome/Halfling multiclasses (shorty saving throws and a very smooth progression through the game).
Kits that have a walk in the park in all implementations of BG1 on BG2 engine (and are still pretty playable in BG2): Beastmaster, Totemic Druid, Berserker, Inquisitor,
Most dual-classes are pretty damn crazy so it's not really worth mentioning them all by name (unless they're really interesting); if you're willing to go through the arduous process, it will likely pay off. But stuff like Berserker/Cleric is probably what you're looking for.
>>2854979
>>2855018
Also bear in mind that characters like the Kensai/Mage will force you to babysit them for a long time. They're not great if you're not willing to reload a lot and don't know the game inside out, and aren't willing to cheese with things like accepting quest rewards or scroll scribing abuse.
I always figure it's better to ask for stuff that is solid across the board throughout the entire game. Dwarf Fighter/Cleric might not pull the craziest cheese once you meticulously prepare the way for him, but he is really unlikely to ever die, has a response for everything (making the game more interesting at all times) and will contribute to the team in any encounter.
>>2855018
I always found it sad how you can't multi class to a kit. A Ranger/Cleric kit combination would be too fucking OP.
>>2855074
I would have absolutely loved fighter/swashbuckler as a multiclass.
>cant find my BG 1 discs
>cant do a BG 1 to BG2 run
>cant get tomes for maximum powergame
fuck
>>2855074
Beastmaster/Cleric is pretty okay for a nature warrior kinda theme.
What's better for a run through the trilogy, stalker or archer?
When I install the high resolution patch for BG1 (regular, non EE edition) the image is always stuck in the top left corner and surrounded by a huge black box, similar to the letter boxing of movies.
Is there any way to fix this issue?
>>2827724
>new NPCs
This is why I only ever gave it a passing glance in mobile. Shit's optional because it's IAP there.
>Aerie starts whining before i even leave the tent
Now i remember why this whiny piece of shit never was in my party.
>>2837153
Rashad was kinda irritating to me but dorn was alright
Fuck the others though, especially neera. What a colossal cunt, and you cant even tell her to fuck off without her tumblrette ass being a passive aggressive little shit and trying to force her way into your party.
is there something like big world project/bg trilogy but for icewind dale? basically i wanna play iwd1 with 3.5e classes/feats/perks that iwd2 offers.
>>2858476
There's Icewind Gate 2, but it's for BG2. It's the closest I know of.
>>2841321
Edwin is objectively the best. Nothing can compete with that +1 spell each level AND the specialization, totaling to +2. The only downside is obviously no divination, but who needs that shit? A sorcerer could compete with not needing scrolls to learn spells, but that's about it.
>>2842930
Imoen
Keldorn
Anomen
Aerie
Minsc
Lawful Good
Sun Soul Monk
Soloed BGEE one time with an Inquisitor, but it's like you're Superman, especially if you know what's where. Nothing can touch you.
>>2859196
The biggest drawback of playing a wizard was always not being able to compete with Edwin for me. You just feel like a little bitch no matter what.
>>2859196
In a game where you can rest anywhere, anytime, and wands can easily replicate the job? Meh.
>>2859261
Wands have a minimum spell level. Sure they're good for some cheese, but can't replace a mage.
>>2854979
Inquisitors for magerape, obviously. But then you got Keldorn, diminishing their value somewhat.
Gnome Fighter/Illusionist is a stronger variation of this ken>mage or berz>mage powergaming holy grail. Slower progression, no horrid wilting, and slow to catch up with THAC0 bonuses, but no afterdual babysitting/cheesing, bracers and helmets, shorty saves, more spells once he gets them except the highest levels, and fighter HLAs.
>>2842930
Korgan
Edwin
ViconiaSarevokWilson
Neutral evil
Fighter/mage dual
I kinda prefer BG with a party and IWD solo
>>2859268
Play an archer-heavy team and have something like dual-classed Imoen stand behind with wand of monster summoning. Bam, you solved BG. Edwin a shit.
How does IWD compare to the BG series?
Is the enhanced edition any good?
Just started playing the original version of Baldur's Gate 1. Never played before. Any helpful advice?
>>2860090
IWD is much more combat-focused than BG
If I plan on getting keldorn to fill the inquisitor role, should I roll a cavalier if i go paladin?
Is 2 inquisitors overkill? Cavalier seems pretty versatile compared to inquisitor
>>2859208
>Sun Soul Monk
I could never figure the range on some of his abilities and often ended up killing my party members
>>2860135
Inquisitor is a hell of a lot better honestly, and undead hunters are stronger and more versatile than cavaliers too. And then there's cleric/ranger which is a paladin in everythin but name.
Is there a lore reason for not being able to make a ranger/druid mutli/dual class?
>>2860248
Ranger is a hunter, druid protects nature. Makes no sense.
>>2860275
But Rangers are described as protectors of nature too, I think the real reason is that they're limited to good alignment
>>2860284
That's the reason why. Rangers are required to be good-aligned and Druids can only be True Neutral.
>>2860135
I prefer Cavalier over the Inquisitor.
First, there are no other Cavaliers, so it really adds something to him. Also, their focus being on fighting Demons and Dragons really suits the character as the central protagonist. Also, Inquisitors feel more like a Lawful Neutral sort of thing. Witch-hunters stamping out heresy and the like. It doesn't really suit the Paladin aesthetic very well. Anomen would make a fine Inquisitor, Keldorn... not so much.
Of course, if RP isn't your thing, I'd say that the Cavalier still comes out ahead. The Inquisitor's dispel magic is made pretty much redundant by having Casomyr and there's never really a point in the game where you NEED True Sight. So you're losing Lay on Hands, ALL spellcasting and Turning Undead purely for immunity to Hold and Charm.
While the Cavalier is over there with his +3 attack and damage vs the most dangerous monsters in the game, Immune to Fear, Morale failure, Poison, and innately stackable 20% Fire Resistance and 20% Acid Resistance. And all the Cavalier loses is ranged weapons. Let's be honest though, if you rolled Paladin on your protagonist, you're using the Holy Avenger and probably only that.
>>2858412
>not getting Aerie in your group
>not getting Haer'Dalis too
>not starting a love triangle and ultimately romancing Aerie to pick you over him
>not afterward dumping Aerie for Viconia or Jaheira, breaking Aerie's heart
>not watching as Haer'Dalis never tries to initiate another romance with Aerie after you've broken it off with her
>>2860358
>being this much of a cunt in a game about adventures
If Haer wants to ruin his own life by dragging this whiny piece of shit around it's his decision.
>>2860370
If you're playing an evil character, you should commit to the role.
Aerie isn't the most annoying character to join you anyhow.
>When asked about her past, Nalia is a bit hesistant. She comes from a wealthy land-owning family headed by the Lord d'Arnise and while she speaks about relatives with affection, the fact of her upbringing seems to embarrass her at the same time. Nalia clearly identifies more with the 'poorer classes'... but also looks upon them with the eyes of the privileged.
I could deal with Aerie's whining. I could even tolerate Cernd droning on and on and turning every situation into a metaphor for nature. But every time discount-Imoen starts popping off at the mouth, I can feel my eye twitch.
>I don't like cities much. They are built upon the backs of the unfortunate.
>*protag gives beggar a gold* That was a nice thing to do. Although I'm sure you could spare a lot more...what are you saving up for? A golden sword?
>*battlecry* For the needy!
>How are we helping the less fortunate trudging through here!?
>>2860393
That's why I like having Korgan in my party. He puts the annoying characters into their place in a pretty amusing way.
>>2860393
>>How are we helping the less fortunate trudging through here!?
rofl, I remember her saying that in the underdark and I had to quit playing the game for a while. Actually I had both Aerie and Nalila in my party that time, so much whining.
>>2860393
>what are you saving up for? A golden sword?
If you have Jan in your party, that remark sparks a pretty funny banter.
>>2858207
It's not spectacular though. I mean mobile BG is a good idea, but the UI wasn't retooled very well and depending on your screen size it might be made for ants.
>>2858476
You can play it with NWN2 with 3.5 rules.
>>2860547
>Jan
Best party member by far.
>>2860518
Aerie at least has a valid reason to whine. I mean, she was enslaved and amputated after all. But Nalia sounds like some kind of rich people who "helps" others and talk about how good they are doing that.
>>2858476
Last I checked BiG World Setup works for all IE games, but there's nothing like Trilogy or TuTu for anything but BG.
Hey /vr/, what's your favorite BG/BG2 mods that aren't widescreen, fixpacks, engine conversions, tweaks, unfinished business, etc.?
>>2861978
BWS is basically just a big mod installer for all the others though.
jej
>>2861997
Most don't seem bad, but some seem off or just wrong.
>Gorion looks like a villain
>Viconia flat out ugly
>Dorn bishonen as hell
>Keldorn is cool but way too young
>Jan is gnomish Tony Starkkinda okay with this
>>2827540
>play BG1, it's ok pretty good
>play Planescape 10/11 gotyay
>play Icewind Dale pretty obnoxious all these fights but still, alright, whatever, kinda bs but alright
>BG II "omg it's you anon! Omg lets fucking reminisce about BG1 and funny hamster jokes and slog through this really fucking slow dungeon"
I keep having to quit and then come back to it later, I just want this stupid beginning dungeon to end and make the game stop holding my hand. can I just kill my party members and solo this game? Might keep Minsc since everyone says I should keep him. He was okay in BG1.
>>2862083
You can but I doubt you'll enjoy BG2
Are there any must-have classes for IWD? So far I'm thinking:
Cavalier
Fighter/Thief
Cleric/Fighter
Druid Kit (not sure about this, apparently druids are actually good in this game, can anyone confirm?)
Bard
Sorcerer
>>2862083
You'll likely fail anon unless you're a mage savescuming
>11/10 Planescape YES!
>always fail in BG combat.
I bet you rest after every encounter too you piece of casual shit.
>>2862083
Everyone hates the starting dungeon, theres even a mod for it that skips it and still gives you all the xp and non random items from it.
I mean I ran that piece of shit like 4 times today cause I didn't know what class I wanted to play, fuck that place but I sort of like it now, some stockholme syndrome shit
>>2862173
its really sad how shit that part of the game is compared to all that comes after it
>>2862153
>save scumming is bad
>resting is bad
to be fair, if Baldur's Gate 1 or Icewind Dale were an actual DM, I would have chopped him to pieces with a fireaxe 500 times over by now. No player would put up with that bullshit.
>NPCs cast Gate, bring their buddies in all in formation
>you can't do jack shit about it because you're stuck in the cut scene for the whole casting time while they guffaw at you some more after they arrive
no go fuck yourself
>>2862181
Honestly my least favorite thing about BGII isn't even the dungeon, it's how when right after it you can't move an inch without some fucker running up to you and forcing you into dialogue mode for some time limited quest or try to murder you as you travel between the districts. Being constantly accosted like that completely negates the comfy exploration that should be the core experience of towns in RPG games.
>>2862173
I like the opening dungeon. It was really eerie the first time through and benefits greatly from a second playthrough when you know all the background of Irenicus.
Rielev describing himself as a close friend and servant to Irenicus that Irenicus had put in stasis as a means of keeping him alive while he sought a way to restore him... but forgot about as his humanity slipped away.
Ellesime's meticulously recreated chamber or her numerous clones that break free, madly screaming that they are not her. In the same vein as the Dryads that Irenicus was desperately trying to use to force some recollection of feeling or love in his soulless heart.
It's almost a shame that it's the first dungeon. There's so much revealed about Irenicus, but you're not initially equipped to understand the context when you go through it.
Also, from a pure design view, it's a great dungeon. Multiple puzzles, traps, NPCs, a big variety of monsters and mechanics, et cetera.
>>2861982
Banter packs. NPC quest packs. And there are a few music ones I kind of sort of dimly remember.
>>2861997
Making Keldorn young-maybe middle aged when it's kind of part of his entire schtick that he's been in the business for too long and yet still kicking ass.
>>2862437
I hate that in a lot of games, really. Both old and new. When you start the game and are swarmed with input about shit you can't really wrap your hand around. Say what you want about some casual streamlined experiences, it at least takes it slow and not give you a zillion quests and the largest part of the world(city)map to explore.
>>2861982
Saerileth. The best waifu.
>>2860429
Breaking as in imbalanced or causing legitimate problems due to bad coding?
Favourite funny moments/characters from IE games?
BG1: haven't played it
BG2: Pretty much the whole conversation with the Spectator Beholder; Jan and Korgans banter ("Har har! Ye know yer audience well, gnome"; convincing Desharik that you are insane to get into spellhold ("No, we are crazy! Minsc, say hello to the pirate captain!")
ToB: "Bondari reloads"; the Spectator Beholder telling the drow challenging you to combat that he's going to get absolutely destroyed (SB: "Now, before the god child turns you into mush -" Drow: "Hmph. That may not necessarily happen...")
IWD: not played it
IWD2: If you pick up the dead cat you find randomly in a warehouse and talk to the mercenaries before giving you the quest, they'll mention using a cat to clear out rats (also poking fun at all the early level fetch-and-carry quests). Your character says "What, this cat?" and they go "Oh, yeah thats the one. Wait... you found a dead cat in a warehouse and decided to pick that up? Why?" with your response amounting to "Er... I thought it might come in handy..."
>>2862648
The mockery of the fetch quests is actually one massive Baldur's Gate 1 prologue reference
>>2862648 again
in IWD2 the How to Be an Adventurer book raised a chuckle
pic related
"Dungeons to Tackle: Stinky Pieters Caves of Soundly Sleeping Monsters"
"The Wooden Citadel of Darmos the Old and Crippled"
"Archmage "Loose Bowels" Wozley the Milksops Enchanted Item Warehouse"
Dungeons to avoid like the crotch rot:
"The Iron Fortress of Blodax, Devourer of Souls"
>>2862657
fnnng, forgot pic
Seems like a good place to ask. If I wanted to get into RPGs, is Baldur's Gate a good place to start, or would something like Ultima be better?
>>2861982
I found the Isra mod surprisingly decent
>>2862083
>hating on best introductory part of any game ever
>not going through Irenicus' dungeon in horror as you get to know how twisted and fucked up he is
>>2862709
>Baldur's Gate
It's a 90s game, everyone knows it and it's a "classic" to the modern audiences, the whole saga is a satisfactory playthrough, Real Time with Pause mechanics can be found in most other Bioware games. Has a legacy in modern games like Serpent in the Staglands, Dragon Age, KotOR, NWN1&2.
>Ultima
The series is long and pretty unique, but also its final 2 games really suck. It's never been about good combat; it's all about open world and reactivity. Arguably you could say that it's most similar to The Elder Scrolls. Also, the games before the 3rd or 4th one are very archaic and difficult to get into. I figure Ultima, as a whole, will be more difficult to get into, so it's really about your tolerance for this stuff. However, the writing and worldbuilding for Ultima 4, 5, 6 and 7 is top notch, and Ultima 6 and 7 are still pretty servicable.
BG and original two Fallouts are probably the easiest way to get into 90s RPGs: you will find a lot of communities to talk about the games afterwards and they have a legacy. If you want a gateway into first person turn-based dungeon crawlers, try Might & Magic 3 or 4-5 a. k. a World of Xeen. For real-time dungeon crawlers, Ultima Underworld. Additionally, if you're a fan of point 'n' click adventure games, you can make a wonderful transition by playing Quest for Glory (4th game is my favourite, but they're all good).
I wouldn't call any of the 80s RPGs entry level, but there's a ton of pretty good titles in the 90s that are still pretty accessible to play, like M&M from 3 to 7, Ultima 7, Eye of the Beholder, Darklands, Dark Sun: Shattered Lands.
Sorry for the chaotic post.
>>2862648
Let me spoil for you the best piece of dialog in BG1
>Ok, I've just about had my FILL of riddle asking, quest assigning, insult throwing, pun hurling, hostage taking, iron mongering, smart arsed fools, freaks, and felons that continually test my will, mettle, strength, intelligence, and most of all, patience! If you've got a straight answer ANYWHERE in that bent little head of yours, I want to hear it pretty damn quick or I'm going to take a large blunt object roughly the size of Elminster AND his hat, and stuff it lengthwise into a crevice of your being so seldom seen that even the denizens of the nine hells themselves wouldn't touch it with a twenty-foot rusty halberd! Have I MADE myself perfectly CLEAR?!
>>2862648
>didn't play BG1
>played BG2
Doesn't that make things really confusing?
>>2862643
Just imbalanced. It's worse enough, though. Game simply wasn't made with kits in mind. You'll stomp through the game like a god.
>>2862648
Baldur's Gate 1:
>Draw your daggers and spells and let's have at 'er! You've crossed our employers and this is as far as you're going to go, my friend. Should've known that lazy bounty hunting rabble wouldn't get the job done. Never settle for second best, I always say!
>You want to know what I always say? "Always kill the mouthy one," that's what I always say.
Baldur's Gate 2
>Hhmp. Imoen, yer an o'er-lame excuse fer a member o' this party and I be tired of exertin' meself to protect ye! Next time I let ye perish, screamin' like a ninny as ye does!
>The last time I saw you exert yourself over anything was the last slab of pork in an inn. If you could keep up with me with that beer gut of yours I'd be amazed.
>Beer gut?! Why, ye stinkin' wench, how dare ye! Keep up with me axe as if flies toward yer head, more like! Though it'd be like splittin' a hair, skinny as ye are!
>I'd be startled if a drunk dwarven oaf like yourself could hit the broad side of barn with your axe. And while we're talking about stench, let's talk about the last time you passed out in your own vomit.
>An outrage! Yer be a canker on me backside and the world best be rid of ye! Loathsome mongrel she-dog!
>Brutish pig! You're nothing but a boil needing lancing!
>I've seen harlots wi' less open sores than ye, ye pimple-faced, whining gutter-snipe!
>You cantankerous, foul-mouthed excused for a gully dwarf!
>Gully dwarf? Har har! Ye know how to hit low, ye does! Har har! Yer a fine, fine lass, ye are, Imoen. That Gorion of yers would be proud!
>Aw, gee. Thanks, Korgan!
What weapons should I pip up for fighter/mage?
Katanas flails and axes?
>>2864053
It depends on some factors. Who you're going to use in your party, your alignment, etc.
Generally speaking though, you can't go wrong with the Longsword. The first dungeon has one or two magical ones in it alone, and there's plenty of powerful named ones to choose from. The Equalizer, Dragonslayer, Daystar, Blackrazor, Flametongue, Sword of Balduran, the Blade of Roses, et cetera.
Katanas though? Egghhh. There's only a couple of them in the game and even the best of them are just "okay." Still, Dakkon's Zerth Blade is a katana and one of the best Fighter / Mage weapons out there, so if you absolutely want to go that route, it's not a horrible choice.
Flails only really have the Flail of Ages, easily the most overrated weapon by Baldur's Gate fans.
>the Flail of Ages, easily the most overrated weapon
Agreed. It does 1d6+3 with +1 Cold, +1 Acid, +1 Fire. Assuming whatever you're fighting doesn't have some elemental immunity, it's only 7-12 damage. At best, that's just okay. Irritating ol' Lilarcor has 4-13 for example.
The Slow affect the Flail has is sort of meh too. As I recall it has a 1 in 4 chance of slowing which means you have to have a high enough attack bonus to be reliably hitting them anyhow to have a good enough chance of inflicting them at which point the slow's penalty to AC is superfluous. It's not third edition where you can take advantage of a low AC by using Power Attack. You either hit or you don't.
If you have Throne of Bhaal for the +5 Flail of Ages it scales even poorer. The Free Action and 5% Magic Resistance is nice, but ToB just hemorrhages powerful artifacts at you. The Ravager +6, Carsomyr +6, even Blackrazor, the Staff of the Magi or the Silver Sword from SoA are better along with a bunch of others.
>>2864087
>Still, Dakkon's Zerth Blade is a katana and one of the best Fighter / Mage weapons out there
By no means you should consider this a primary fighting weapon, as its bonuses are really weak. You use it this way: put it in your hand, and in your last slot in every spellbook page, put in a spell that you cast at the beginning of the day (like Stoneskin, maybe Invisibility if travelling) and then swap weapons. Zerth's Blade isn't a good combat weapon at all.
You haven't mentioned the Celestial Fury, which is available in one of the more difficult early-mid game encounters, and is a perfectly servicable weapon throughout the entirety of SoA. Hindo's Doom is also decent in ToB.
Short Swords are pretty decent due to the amount of utility items like Arbane's and Ilbratha's, and the amount of hard-hitting mofos like the Mask's Short Sword or Kundane. Solid options throughout SoA. Scimitars and Short Swords can be used in a combo throughout SoA to maximize the amount of attacks per round - Kundane and Belm each give +1 APR, another +APR from a weapon in off-hand, that's 4 attacks. Haste yourself and get 8 attacks per round before HLAs.
In the late game in ToB, you should switch to 2-handed fighting, anyway; TWF is only good as a late game thing if you have a really strong weapon in the offhand (Angurvadal, Crom Faeyr, Foebane) solely for its bonuses.
Axes are a really solid weapon, BTW: if you're good aligned, you can get a pair of amazing axes as soon as you're done with Copper Coronet, and they double as a ranged weapon.
>>2864123
The main point of FoA is to be:
>a solid cleric weapon
They don't have 2-handers available to them other than staves, and staves are only really exceptional in ToB, with Staff of the Ram on Jaheira or Anomen. Spears for Druids aren't top tier either.
>all of its elemental attacks punch through stoneskin
This is self-explanatory.
>easy killing of trolls
>decent enchantment throughout SoA
>interrupts spells more easily
>get a 98 roll
>strength rolls 18/10
REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
I'm just about to debug ctrl 8 this shit
Hi anons. Sorreh fo' teh rude interruption, but I need a help from ya. As I am more-less n00b in a game, I don't like seeing casters have more arsenal of choise in fights then melee classes, barb in particular, who can only auto attack. So, I wanna know is there a way to get high level abilities on low level, and/or getting this mod to work, 'cuz i don't know how to make it work. help pl0x, thx ahead.
Mod:
http://www.shsforums.net/topic/43948-diablo2-kit-pack-for-bg2-the-barbarian-ver-07/
>>2864321
Colossal strength is meh anyway, iyou can get it to 19 pretty fast.
>>2864286
>By no means you should consider this a primary fighting weapon
He said Fighter / Mage so he's not using a shield and will clearly be dual-wielding. Zerth blade is a fine off-hand weapon and one of the few that exist that give a mechanical advantage to spellcasters.
>You haven't mentioned the Celestial Fury
Said there was a couple of them. Celestial Fury is the other one that makes it a couple. It's good, but not great.
That's the problem with Katanas. Lack of options. There are only three non-generics in SoA, all of them are +3 or weaker, and one of them has a next-to-useless power.
Maces have a bunch of good options. Longswords too. Axes, Halberds, Scimitars, etc. Katanas though? Not really. You're just going to be using Celestial Fury and Zerth Blade all game.
>The main point of FoA is to be:
>a solid cleric weapon
There are just a lot better picks. Mace of Disruption for the Level Drain immunity and any undead fights, Mauler's Arm for the free 18 strength, Defender of Easthaven for tank builds, The Sleeper's sleep is better than FoA's slow albeit working on a narrower field of enemies, Crom Faeyr (obviously), Dwarven Thrower works as a great substitute for slings on a ranged build, etc. etc.
>staves are only really exceptional in ToB
Staff of the Magi begs to differ. Hell, a bunch of the Staves are quite good. Staff of Power (I realize you have to be a Mage to acquire it), Staff of Rhynn, Staff of the Woodlands and probably some others not coming to mind too.
Playing through IWD:EE for the first time,
Is 2 weapon fighting as good as it is in BG? I've got a paladin with points in longsword + bastard sword and not sure whether to just keep him with a shield for the rest of the game
>>2864539
>He said Fighter / Mage so he's not using a shield and will clearly be dual-wielding. Zerth blade is a fine off-hand weapon and one of the few that exist that give a mechanical advantage to spellcasters.
In combat, it's going to be the equivalent of any other +2 weapon, and you can find even clubs in the early game that will be much more useful than Dakkon's. I never used it in any serious capacity for any fighting; it really is the best to keep as a temporary utility to cast spells at the beginning of the day and unequip for something way better.
>Said there was a couple of them. Celestial Fury is the other one that makes it a couple. It's good, but not great.
CF's +3 bonus makes it great for most of SoA. The stun is pretty decent, it gives a couple of bonus options like the spells on it, and overall it's not a bad choice. By the time it gets outdated you will have had a ton of pips to spend elsewhere, like transitioning into twohanders. As a F/M, you only have ** pips to spend, anyway. Something like FoA+Belm is a very solid dual-wielding option.
>There are just a lot better picks. Mace of Disruption for the Level Drain immunity and any undead fights,
It's merely a +2 weapon even if upgraded and won't do anything for you at all if not fighting undead. There are a lot of them, but no reason not to have it on weapon switch.
>Mauler's Arm for the free 18 strength
You're a cleric. Draw Upon Holy Might/Strength of One make this obsolete. It's just a +2 weapon.
>Defender of Easthaven
Strictly an off-hand weapon. Not comparable to FoA, a damage-dealer.
>>2864539
>The Sleeper
Are you kidding? Another +2 weapon (compared to +3) and the sleep is at a +4 save penalty. The slow offers no save, it's just a random chance; on an F/C with multiple attacks, you will proc it more often. Again, elemental damage is really good against stoneskin.
>Crom Faeyr
Situational to even make it (you can keep the components), and still better as an off-hander. Or not at all, because any high-level Cleric can get 25 STR easily.
>Dwarven Thrower
Extremely limited - no Dwarf Cleric NPCs out there. Sling of Seeking is superior anyway.
>Staff of the Magi begs to differ. Hell, a bunch of the Staves are quite good. Staff of Power (I realize you have to be a Mage to acquire it), Staff of Rhynn, Staff of the Woodlands and probably some others not coming to mind too.
The first two are Mage-only items, the Staves of the elements which I personally adore as items are only +2 and not that great for straight-up combat, Staff of Rhynn is +4, yes, and the Woodlands is meh. Staves offer a ton of interesting options, but still, none of them refute the raw power of FoA throughout SoA.
>>2827752
> I don't dislike the more specific proficiency
I do. It's dumb as hell to have to limit a character to such specific sets of weapons. I could understand maybe having the higher levels of mastery being more specific, but otherwise you get shit like the bastard sword category.
>>2865951
>In combat, it's going to be the equivalent of any other +2 weapon, and you can find even clubs in the early game that will be much more useful than Dakkon's. I never used it in any serious capacity for any fighting; it really is the best to keep as a temporary utility to cast spells at the beginning of the day and unequip for something way better.
He asked after Katanas. I specifically didn't advocate going that way because of a lack of options, only highlighted that if he did, it'd ultimately be Celestial Fury + Zerth Blade. Of course there's a plethora of non-Katana options, that was never the point.
>CF's +3 bonus makes it great for most of SoA. The stun is pretty decent, it gives a couple of bonus options like the spells on it, and overall it's not a bad choice.
So, like I said, good. Not great.
>It's merely a +2 weapon even if upgraded and won't do anything for you at all if not fighting undead. There are a lot of them, but no reason not to have it on weapon switch.
Sort of like your Flail of Troll Coup de Grace, huh?
>You're a cleric. Draw Upon Holy Might/Strength of One make this obsolete. It's just a +2 weapon.
Both have laughably short durations so require multiple slots dedicated to them and also preclude you wearing heavier items with insufficient strength, gimped carrying capacity, etc. A permanent 18 STR is better.
>Strictly an off-hand weapon. Not comparable to FoA, a damage-dealer.
They're both flails. Your Cleric isn't (or shouldn't be) going to be your primary damage-dealer with melee anyhow, so it IS better. As a defensive weapon the Defender is far better than the Flail is as an offensive weapon. Also, given its AC bonus stacking with shields, I'd argue it isn't an offhand weapon.
>>2865953
>Are you kidding? Another +2 weapon (compared to +3) and the sleep is at a +4 save penalty. The slow offers no save, it's just a random chance; on an F/C with multiple attacks, you will proc it more often. Again, elemental damage is really good against stoneskin.
Both apply their debuff unreliably. Every time you hit with the Sleeper they have to roll, whereas every time you hit with the Flail there's a flat chance of it not triggering. The chance of it not triggering is WAY higher than of it successfully doing so. And of the two, a -4 AC from Flail is far weaker than the sleep status effect.
Also, if you're trying to kill someone with the 3 damage of Flail through stoneskin instead of just dispelling it, you've gone terribly wrong at this game.
>Situational to even make it (you can keep the components), and still better as an off-hander. Or not at all, because any high-level Cleric can get 25 STR easily.
It's better than the sum of its parts. There's plenty of strength enhancing items in the game, so the loss of two of the weakest is no big blow, especially since the weapon itself becomes an even stronger variety than the two lost. And the Hammer of Thunderbolts is pretty meh too. Also, even as a one-handed weapon and before the automatic highest STR in the game is applied, it's one of the highest damaging weapons out there. It's only offhand if you're a complete mook and didn't bother looking it up. It's 10-16, the Flail is only 7-12.
>Extremely limited - no Dwarf Cleric NPCs out there. Sling of Seeking is superior anyway.
Yes, the sling is better than the Flail too. And you're the one who threw arbitrary limitations of "clericz only!" for the flail. I guess narrowing the field to possible Dwarf wielders like Korgan or the protagonist was too unreasonable?
>none of them refute the raw power of FoA throughout SoA.
They all do. Outside "I attack spell-protected targets instead of dispelling them for my 3 damage attacks!" the Flail sucks.
>>2855004
At that point in the game it's easier to just have Aerie turn undead and make it instantly explode.
>>2855004
...if he's using Carsomyr, a weapon that casts dispel magic on hit, why would he stop to cast dispel magic first?
>>2865991
>He asked after Katanas. I specifically didn't advocate going that way because of a lack of options, only highlighted that if he did, it'd ultimately be Celestial Fury + Zerth Blade. Of course there's a plethora of non-Katana options, that was never the point.
If you're going to mention any reason to put pips into Katanas, it'd be CF, not Dakkon's, which was the point all along.
>So, like I said, good. Not great.
It comes with a wonderful opportunity cost, because you can get it fairly early during questing in Chapter 2. A +3 weapon with all the utility it brings is going to outshine or at least match a lot of other weapons.
>Sort of like your Flail of Troll Coup de Grace, huh?
Which boasts a much higher damage output at all times against all creatures, and potentially comes much earlier into the game (you're more likely to go to d'Arnise before Bodhi's).
>Both have laughably short durations so require multiple slots dedicated to them
First of all, DUHM doesn't even have much of a contest among its peers. Second, the amount of rounds you get the buffs on is sufficient to win the battle. Third, all the NPC clerics that could benefit from it don't need it - Anomen has 18/52 STR, Aerie can just use Strength (or put it into a Minor Sequencer for some cheese). Only Viconia can find use for Mauler's Arm, but I always found it better to just buff and go with FoA anyway. It still boasts a better magic and damage at all times.
>They're both flails.
Can you see how comparing Ilbratha to Mask's, both Shortswords, might not be a very easy task?
>Your Cleric isn't (or shouldn't be) going to be your primary damage-dealer with melee anyhow
Any caster will vastly outstrip their pure melee brethren in combat if you choose to gear them so. Even Aerie, who can do shit like turn into a 5 APR poisonous spider with 18/00 STR that can't be hit as early as after recruitment.
>>2866002
>As a defensive weapon the Defender is far better than the Flail is as an offensive weapon.
Then use them in tandem - Defender still has inferior enchantments to the Flail and does not warrant being one's primary weapon and two-weapon fighting is most of the time superior to most shields.
>Both apply their debuff unreliably.
Count the amount of enemies immune to sleep and then those immune to slow. Figure that some of them will have ridiculous amounts of saving throws, whereas FoA's slow can potentially have a chance to proc every round, if you have a lot of attacks.
>Also, if you're trying to kill someone with the 3 damage of Flail through stoneskin instead of just dispelling it, you've gone terribly wrong at this game.
Dispelling takes time if you don't have an inquisitor. Any bonus elemental damage may prove vital to disrupting a mage's spellcasting, no matter what his protective shell is. If he has other spells that need to be breached before his stoneskin can be dispelled (and frequently, casters boast). And, of course, if you're soloing with a class that doesn't have ready dispelling at all times, then wailing with FoA is still an option. And you save a spellslot if it works. And if you have an enemy that isn't very threatening but immune to anything other than your elements, it'll provide a slow, but steady approach to this enemy. FoA gives reasonable damage and is very versatile..
>It's only offhand if you're a complete mook and didn't bother looking it up
It gets outstripped by many of it's ToB brethren - including FoA+5, IMHO - and stays only there for 25 Strength, which can boost any weapon. But you can keep the belt compnent, for instance, and use other Strength enhancing measures to get 25 STR anyway.
>>2866002
>Yes, the sling is better than the Flail too. And you're the one who threw arbitrary limitations of "clericz only!" for the flail.
You said FoA sucks because there's a ton of "blades" which do its job better, so I pointed out there's one weapon class which is great for a fighter that can't use stuff other than blunts. In that cathegory, FoA has no match in terms of opportunity cost, reliability and damage - it's available very early on and gets a ton of mileage more than most of the stuff you mentioned. Same as CF.
Best waifu? EE and mods npcs included.
>>2866349
Cespenar, oh yes
>>2866349
Mazzy. Pure, capable, confident, no-nonsense, and travel-sized.
>>2839969
>You get your normal cleric spells and for some also ALL druid spells
No, you don't. That bug was fixed in EE.
>>2866798
EE a shit.
>>2866823
Ok, keep cheating your cleric/ranger then.
The real disadvantage of the bard compared to the F/M is it only gets 1 attack per round.
How can you fix druids in BG?
Would implementing the druid spells from IWD be enough?
>>2866825
There are better reason to avoid EE like the hot garbage that it is.
>>2866827
The disadvantage of any class is that it's not a F/M
>>2866238
>Which boasts a much higher damage output at all times against all creatures, and potentially comes much earlier into the game (you're more likely to go to d'Arnise before Bodhi's).
The Flail of Ages has low damage output. Even among +3 weapons, it doesn't do a lot. The slow is remarkably unreliable and actually slowing enemies when it does hit makes very little difference in game. So, the draw then is the utility of it having energy damage for killing trolls or penetrating stoneskin for negligible damage. But see, a LOT of weapons have additional energy damage. And so, as a niche weapon, it's not terribly great. The Mace of Disruption will always be better killing undead than the Flail of Ages will be killing trolls.
Do you understand what I'm saying? Taken as a main weapon, it underperforms. Taken as a niche weapon, it's not unique and other weapons in their specific scenarios will outperform the Flail easily.
The Flail is, at best, a 5/10 weapon. It does okay damage, it has an okay ability, but the biggest draw for it was that it was free. It's not a great weapon and it is wildly undeserving of the praise people heap on it.
>>2866238
>First of all, DUHM doesn't even have much of a contest among its peers.
...what? Barkskin scales endlessly, you know that right? It also lasts obnoxiously long. Also, Silence, 15' Radius remains a strong pick through most of the game. The Save v Spell at a -5 penalty and 2 rounds / level trivializes a lot of potentially rough fights. And I don't know anyone who doesn't keep at least one Slow Poison memorized.
>Only Viconia can find use for Mauler's Arm
In fairness, you put some arbitrary limitation of "Flail of Ages is a Cleric weapon!" and Viconia is literally the only single-classed Cleric in the game.
>>2866827
Well, a Blade with Master Two Weapon style and under the effect of his Bardic haste or Offensive Spin and wielding the Belm will end up with like 4 attacks a round.
Also, Tenser's Transformation is also a Bard spell and will stack with Offensive Spin.
>>2862636
Morrowind did it right.
"you should probably meet this guy in that town"
and then you're free to roam.
All these dudes are talking sense about Bards being the bomb.
I was a bit of a Bard specialist, and was able with a little patience to run through BGII without reloads or deaths; key to this is fast leveling, shameless sleeping, and key spells. Blur used to stack, so you could get -2 every time you cast it. Mirror image is one of the most powerful spells in the game. Improved haste breaks the game entirely. Do the duel-wield thing with the +1 attack short sword off-hand and with haste and high STR you are a melee terror. Stoneskin is another game-breaker. I was big into archery as well with web and summons (your bard song works on all you summons, which can get nasty at high levels).
Since you get all the best loot (soloing) you have the best defensive stuff in the game, high Str, overflowing $, etc. It's still hard as hell but a great challenge.
Go for it!
I would probably pick a bard if I could gain acess to level 9 spells
There must be a mod for that somewhere
>>2863171
Not really, it's all handily explained and there's not much you really need to know anyway.
If you're a fan of that sort of continuity thing, that's why we haveBGT.
>>2860382
Always annoyed me that evil people hated it when I agreed to help people. Like you never had the option of explaining to your murder bros that we were going to do all this lovely shit, get rewards, rob everyone blind then kill em anyway. It gave too many rep points for decisions and reputation was broken and retarded anyway.
Evil people should want a great rep to take advantage of people!
>>2867429
I think evil based gameplay was an after thought, there's hardly any good options for evil party members even, with viconia and korgan being the most interesting, shit nearly everyone else in the games period are either good or neutral aligned.
Not to mention that the plot always stays the same with your only options for "evil responses" really just acting like an asshole more than anything.
Doing evil runs never satisfied me because I don't think its how the game was intended to be played, due to the above factors, its like they threw in some evil shit just to sate people that wanted it as an option, but its not fleshed out.
>>2862134
no kits in IWD, but they are in EE
but definitely don't take a single classed thief,
bards get new songs till level 11, the last one has HP regen which means you don't have to rely on cure wounds or resting as much
druids get a lot of perks and shapechanges but I still think a multi or dual classed druid is better
single classed cleric might be worth considering because there is a lot of undead in the game.
>>2867168
>The Mace of Disruption will always be better killing undead than the Flail of Ages will be killing trolls.
Flail of Ages will kill everything other than the undead better than the Mace of Disruption while coming way earlier than that item, you know that, right?
>The Flail of Ages has low damage output. Even among +3 weapons, it doesn't do a lot.
Are you capable of naming any weapons that are +3 and come with all the opportunity cost advantage the Flail does?
Off the top of my head, I can only think of Gnasher and Blackblood, which would be Jaheira and/or Beastmaster alternatives for a FoA-like weapon. Hammer of Thunderbolts has you tackle Mindflayers.
You're ridiculously underrating the slow - few are immune to it, compared to sleep or other effects you mentioned. Anyone with multiple attacks per round (haste abuse) WILL apply it, and then it's +4 AC on an enemy and you can kite them much easier if need be.
>Barkskin
AC barely matters at a certain point and there are better ways to have it; you're better off with Defender of Easthaven+Shield of Faith+Cloak of the Sewers cheese than going for an AC approach against most things.
>Silence
Very useful when not fighting spellcasters, no?
>Slow Poison
Drink antidotes. And what says you can't have all of those spells in your cleric spellbook at the same time? Even Anomen at 12 Wisdom will be able to do it. Not to mention Holy Might and other such.
Swap FoA for Crom all you like, but until you do get Crom, FoA will serve you for the entirety of Chapter 2, no going around that. Even for non-clerics, it hits hard and is very versatile. Even for non-Cleric fighters, FoA+Belm is a good combo.
Also, although it comes much, much later, FoA+5 will also outdamage Crom if you use GWW over Improved Haste.
>>2867539
>Flail of Ages will kill everything other than the undead better than the Mace of Disruption while coming way earlier than that item, you know that, right?
Yes, but the Flail of Ages doesn't kill everything better than a lot of other weapons. So, since it's not even a good general weapon, you keep endorsing it for its peripheral abilities as a Troll-killer and Stoneskin bypasser.
But you see, you don't get to move goalposts and have it both ways. You either compare it to all the weapons in SoA, in which case it's crap, or you get to compare it to niche weapons in specific scenarios, in which case it's still crap. I mean, how many weapons have on-hit fire damage anyhow? Heavy Crossbow of Searing, Rod of Lordly Might, Blade of Searing, Stonefire, Fire Tooth, Harbinger, Dragon's Breath, Sword of Flame, etc. That's not including any weapon from ToB, the infinite number of fire arrows, any weapons with on-use fire damage like the staves, or any of the dozen or so other weapons that use other elemental damage or the far superior DoT attacks vs Stoneskin.
The Flail as a niche weapon is part of a massively oversaturated list of energy-based weapons and is therefore nothing special.
>AC barely matters at a certain point and there are better ways to have it
"At a certain point." Constant goalpost moving. The rest of your slock about making everyone buy and constantly carry potions, save-abusing Silence spells on rest, etc. I think perfectly sums up your knowledge and capability of the game.
"I only prep one spell per level and spam it, then rest after the fight!"
>>2867539
>Also, although it comes much, much later, FoA+5 will also outdamage Crom if you use GWW over Improved Haste.
It really won't. Assuming nothing but raw attacks from each, the fact that Crom Fayer puts your strength at 25 will always cause it to out-damage the Flail. I'm sure what you meant to say was "if I use a bunch of supplemental magic items and spells to make my strength comparable to CF, then the Flail's energy damage will have it do a few points of damage more than Crom Fayer against any elemental-vulnerable ToB monsters!"
'Course, there's an awful lot of Ettins in ToB, so even then.
>>2867687
>But you see, you don't get to move goalposts and have it both ways. You either compare it to all the weapons in SoA, in which case it's crap
Show them and convince me, because out of all the weapons you've told me about,
>The Ravager is only in ToB;
>Carsomyr +5 is obtainable after defeating one of the most powerful enemies in Athkatla and is only restricted to a single party member until ToB; it's +6 version
>Silver Sword is post-Underdark, two-handed and it's only utility is "kill stuff instantly"
>Staff of the Magi isn't a combat weapon, again restricted to mages and has you go through a secret encounter which are tough as shit
>Lilarcor has a damage range of 4-13. You say it's not much of an edge compared to FoA, which is 7-12. That also means FoA's damage averages at 10,5, while Lilarcor's damage to around 9,5 at best, and it's also a two-handed weapon.
>I mean, how many weapons have on-hit fire damage anyhow?
And how many of those compare any of FoA's:
>utility
>opportunity cost
>damage output
?
Firetooth I'll give you, but it's not anywhere in the same class of weapon, you won't have a lot of attacks with it. Great weapon. Doesn't necessarily render FoA obsolete. Every other weapon on the list? FoA deals better damage, lets you use a shield, or has much better utility, or comes at a much earlier time.
Your examples simply do not convince me.
>"At a certain point." Constant goalpost moving.
It is apparent to anyone who has any knowledge of the game that AC stops being relevant and %-based damage reduction becomes king, or just plain making oneself untouchable. Who gives a shit about -20 AC that monsters still punch through with their massive THAC0, attacks per round and magic attacks that plain ignore AC, when at that point you can readily make yourself invulnerable by abusing Hardiness and PfMW?
>>2867687
>the rest of your slock about making everyone buy and constantly carry potions
What else do you plan on doing with the abundance of money, other than buying consumables? Buying and using consumables are how you get through tough fights without constantly having to reload. You don't have to buff up and drink a ton of potions to fight 10 goblins, but you probably can use a few of the items when fighting anything remotely threatening and requiring minimum tactics, whether it's Mencar Pebblehammer or Ascension Melissan.
>save-abusing Silence spells on rest
Where the fuck have I ever mentioned that? You're projecting.
>"I only prep one spell per level and spam it, then rest after the fight!"
What? Where? How?
And even if yes, then why not?
The game hardly ever cares about how often you rest.
And if you're already projecting me to be someone who rests every five minutes, then don't forget to acknowledge that I supposedly have a potion, scroll, wand or Necklace of Fireballs available for every fight.
(Hint: that probably means that I make use of my consumables to smoothen my approach instead of resting at all times, but it's convenient to ignore that, no?).
But it's okay - shit on me for having potions and buffs to broaden my tactics, then accuse me of only using the same tactic at all times. Gr8 b8 m8, I r8 8/8, off to masturb8 and then play Baldur's G8 instead of making another Waterg8.
I like the Staff of the Magi
>>2867798
>Show them and convince me
Firkaag is easy as piss to down and you can get Carsomyr at the exact same time that you can get the Flail of Ages. Further, as has been amply demonstrated, Crom Fayer is better. The Staff of Magi IS a combat weapon, regardless of whether you know enough about the game to use it as one. It's strikes as a +5 weapon, defeating all levels of DR, it ups AC and saving throws, it gives permanent Protection from Evil and Immunity to Charm, the Invisibility is infinite and spammable, like Carsomyr it dispels on hit. Even if you ignore it's on-use ability, it's one of (if not THE) best weapons in the game combatively. The invisibility being refreshed when the weapon is toggled out of hand alone is game-breakingly powerful. I could go on about the other weapons, but since you can't even concede that these three are so painfully obviously more powerful, why waste the breath in adding more for you to plug your ears and stamp your feet to?
>It is apparent to anyone who has any knowledge of the game that AC stops being relevant
Yes, late-game. But you keep harping that Flail of Ages is so great early game before a lot of the late-game becomes available. And when I point out early game stuff like AC-raising weapons your answer is moved goalposts. "Oh, well LATE game that's not useful!" By the time you have Hardiness and PfMW you're not using the Defender or the Flail, so what does it matter?
>>2867995
Too bad it breaks the game to pieces.
>>2867807
>Where the fuck have I ever mentioned that? You're projecting.
"Very useful when not fighting spellcasters, no?" If you want to metagame and only have it prepped for when you fight spellcasters, fair enough.
>And even if yes, then why not?
If that's your playstyle, that's your playstyle. Though abusing the rest system does seem to shine a bit of light on why you would think such a mid-tier weapon like the Flail is so great.
>But it's okay - shit on me for having potions and buffs to broaden my tactics, then accuse me of only using the same tactic at all times. Gr8 b8 m8, I r8 8/8, off to masturb8 and then play Baldur's G8 instead of making another Waterg8.
Look at those goalposts fly around some more! You use Antidote potions to "broaden your tactics"? Why do you backpedal when your post is still up there contradicting you? In this hypothetical you HAVE characters that have Slow Poison. You're not broadening anything. You're autistically spamming what you think must be the most mechanically powerful spell (protip: it's not) and eschewing all other good utility spells. And when called out on not using said spells you fell back to "o-oh, I'll just use potions..."
Except why would you? Half the NPCs in this game have Slow Poison and the protagonist gets it for free depending on alignment.
You buying potions of abilities you already possess because you have some disorder where you have to prep the same STONK spell in every available slot isn't you having broad tactics, it's the exact opposite. It's like buying dozens of Haste potions and having everyone drink them before a fight because you didn't want your Mage to waste a SINGLE fireball slot with a piddly ol' Haste spell.
>>2829159
You don't need the cha at all. Imoen is the best face in the game unless you start out with 18 and can cast arcane spells. Either start with 18 or prioritize your other stats first.
I would bring your con up to 16 (at least 15), otherwise drop it to 7.
>>2835690
hmm
with 17 str and 16 con, probably not a fighter
the 16 wis is throwing me off, because otherwise it looks like a mage/thief and I can't think what would want 16 wis over more str/con, but not 18 wis
if mage/cleric/thief were a class, Id say that
mage/thief is my best guess
Is it just me or is IWD much harder than BG?
I always play on core rules for both and it seems that in every fight in IWD my party loses half their health
It's frustrating because I don't want to rest every fight or resort to cheesy tactics but sometimes I just have to
>>2868461
It's supposed to be harder since IWD is all about the battles.
>>2842930
>party
BG1
Imoen, Jaheira, Khalid, Kivan, Xan (I've also done a charname, Coran, Yeslick 3-team), baeloth is cool too
most fun ive had though was my custom team
half-elf skald, elf archer, half-orc berserker, halfling thief, gnome illusionist, dwarf ftr/cleric (pure cleric seemed like a waste)
BG2
yoshimo/imoen, korgan, mazzy, vin diesel, i dunno, i dont really like most of them
I wanna try wilson, but I hate most of the EE stuff
>alignment
CG, always and forever
>which class for the player
elf ftr/mage/thief, I did a full trilogy playthrough back in 2009 and I just can't go back
>solo?
Haven't tried it, but would as a ftr/mage/thief if I did
>>2853625
can't be an elf, must be neutral, dont care about picking pockets
>>2855004
you can just use a scroll of protection from undead and bam, lich can't do shit
>>2855316
just cheat, bro, its super easy
>>2857942
stalker for later half, archer for earlier half
>>2860090
IWD is simpler, more atmospheric, and combat/dungeon focused
you dont need the enhanced edition for IWD at all, but it does add a few *really* minor things, and yeah, the kits kinda break it
>>2862134
yes, druids are better
bard is great because of their last song (DO NOT pick a kit!)
no single-classed thieves (ftr/thief is A-OK)
make sure you have a gnome or halfling who can wear helmets, because they get the best one
your party is plenty good as is
>>2862450
great points, I agree. It should be in the middle of the game.
>>2862648
the worst part of IWD2, the fucking volcano, has that part where you watch a play and fall asleep
>>2868228
But that's why I like it
Is having just a bard and a Fighter/Illusionist going to be enough arcane power for IWD?
>>2862848
Yeah. It's from dialog with prophet in the woods.
Is there any way to alter a Kensai character's appearance in the EE version of the game? I really hate the shorts-wearing commoner look unarmoured characters have, but I love the kit.
>>2869571
yes
I've beat the game with a party of warriors with one cleric before, as a kid who knew very little about the mechanics. You'll be fine.
>>2870156
If memory serves Shadow Keeper could do that.
>>2868540
cheers mate
>>2842605
>going by how the "incredibly beautiful" NPC from BG1 - I forget her name - is a complete dog
Safana? I seem to recall her having a natural charm ability and high charisma stat in the first game then selling you out to some werewolves in the second.
>>2868461
It should have considerable potential for being harder because you have to design the whole party, that has many times the impact as just the one character from BG, so the natural order is BG including TOSC first at least once, so learning the game dynamics will allow you optimize all those characters.
>>2868540
That's probably the best Imoen portrait I've seen so far. Checked out the artist's deviantart and they've only done Bodhi, Irenicus, Sarevok and Viconia, sadly.
Any suggestions for non-shit portrait replacements?
It's a shame that Archers become so weak in late BG2 and ToB. Is there a mod that can fix this?
>>2868216
>Firkaag is easy as piss to down and you can get Carsomyr at the exact same time that you can get the Flail of Ages
Okay, tell me how. Seriously, I'm intrigued.
We might be playing the game very differently or something, so I'd like to learn. Until then, I still figure that FoA is one of the better one-handed weapons in Shadows of Amn itself at last, and can be more widely used than either Magi or Carsomyr.
Also, I figure that abusing the rest system and preparing spells in advance for enemies (which can be done by simply sending a scout forward, you know? See a guy in robes and all) somehow is up there with toggling the Staff effect over and over, but it's too big of a discussion, too volatile in any way.
I just want to hear out how you fight those fights with a mid-level party, relatively straight out of Irenicus Dungeon.
>>2872235
>Okay, tell me how. Seriously, I'm intrigued.
Group composition matters a lot, and I'm assuming you don't want to cheese the fight by gibbing Firkraag with insta-wins like Traps, Cloudkill / Skull Traps, Death Spells, etc.
The important things to use here: Resist Fire, Remove Fear, Lower Spell Resistance, Breach, Dispel Magic. With those five spells (nothing higher than 5th level, as I recall) he's essentially trivialized to being a big bruiser for you to dispose of however you see fit. Magic Missile and Insect Plague get sworn by a lot, and that level did hand you a Dragonslayer sword before facing him...
>>2871420
Archers aren't weak in the later game, where did you get that crazy notion?
Everyone has 1 attack per round. Equipping a bow automatically increases that to 2 attacks.
At level 7 and 13, that gets increased by 1/2 an attack, so you're up 3 attacks a round.
Specialization with bows increase that to 3 1/2.
From here, gear matters. In Throne of Bhaal in the Watcher's Keep, there's Gauntlets of Extraordinary Specialization that Rangers can wield increases attacks by 1/2 a round.
That's 4 right there. If you're a fan of the Tuigan Bow (available really early in SoA) that's 5 attacks. If you'd prefer a stronger damaging Shortbow or a Longbow, 4 attacks isn't terrible.
And then you activate Improved Haste. You now have 8-10 attacks a round (really puts Whirlwind Attack into perspective, huh?) The only problem here is the fact that you will run through arrows so fast that keeping them stocked becomes a huge issue.
Luckily, we're talking about late game Rangers. The very first floor of the Watcher's Keep has the Quiver of Plenty +1. Infinite +1 Arrows right from the beginning of SoA. Cespenar can later make them +2 right at the beginning of ToB. Or, of course, you could take Tansheron's Bow +3 in Trademeet. No ammo required for that one.
Either way, the Archer remains disgustingly OP from the beginning of SoA right through to the end of ToB.
>>2872574
As a follow-up note about archery in general...
A common misconception is that the Bow determines damage. It doesn't. A Bow +2 generally just means that it has +2 to hit, but it's +2 doesn't apply to damage. So, really powerful sounding bows like Taralash +5 aren't all that great.
Arrows determine the damage, and it's generally not that great. They deal 1d6 and then whatever their enchantment is. So, the infinite ammo means 1d6+1 or 1d6+2 depending on the quiver's upgrade.
A very few bows do offer a small increase in damage. All Composite Longbows give +1 damage, for example. The Tuigan Bow also gives +1. Both the Strong Arm and Heartseeker give +2. And finally, the Short Bow of Gesen gives +2 and then an additional 1-8 Electricity.
Now, there's some debate on which is the better bow between Gesen and Tuigan.
Assuming +2 Arrows:
10 Attacks from Tuigan is 10d6+20 for the ammo, then +10 from the bow itself. The average damage is 65.
8 Attacks from Gesen is 8d6+16 for the ammo, then +16 and +8d8 for the bow. The average damage is 88.
On the surface, the Gesen bow looks better even at fewer attacks per round. But you need to factor in some peripherals. Grand Master Specialization is +5 damage per attack. Tuigan is now 115 and Gesen is 128.
For a Fighter, this is generally where the comparison ends. But an Archer's damage scales with level, every third one grants +1 damage on Missile attacks. The cap for a Ranger is 34, so the Tuigan would be doing 225 and the Gesen 216.
So, by the very end, the Tuigan will have just outstripped the Gesen. Generally speaking though, the Gesen is the superior weapon.
>>2872603
Love a good number-crunch
Hey, I just went through the Gnoll Stronghold and paid off the two ogres. Then they disappeared. Is there any way for me to still get those gauntlets of dexterity?
>>2872980
Nope, I'm pretty sure they're gone for good
might have to reload an earlier save or cheat them in
How do I make him work, vr?
Is there a spell I can cast on him to make him viable? Or do I just need to get EEkeeper?
>>2874231
>playing Enhanced Edition
It's like watching a television show where someone spliced in their own fanfiction of said show throughout it.
>>2874560
fuck you I want a bear!
>>2831826
I foolishly thought this was the result of me loading my BG1 char into BG2 back when it was released. Turns out I just played it "canon". BG1 kind of leads you to that party anyway.
I must have played every class combination except one.
Monk.
Anyone give me tips? is it shit?
>>2875405
>Monk
Played a monk once, dropped it because it was a snorefest. But I'm not a big fan of melee chars without any twists, so your mileage may vary. He's supposed to get mighty powerful though.
>>2875405
In BG2 Monk is like having a permanently hasted fighter with magic resist and some neat stealth abilities.
In BG1 (EE) you're a knife-tossing peasant until you get Ogre strength gauntlets (Chpt 5) or the tome of gainful exercise to get 19 str (end of game).
>>2872603
been a while since i played it, but doesnt the strong arm let you add your strength bonus to attacks which iirc no other bow in the game allows? Think that might make it incredibly useful. particularly with arrows of biting which I found the most useful ammo...
>>2875418 again
hmm. had a look on the bg2 wiki, looks like im wrong. strong arm requires 19 strength.
Was there a bow which added your strength bonus to damage, or was it a crossbow? Convinced there was a ranged weapon that allowed a strength bonus to damage.
>>2875429
>Convinced there was a ranged weapon that allowed a strength bonus to damage.
Sling of Seeking
>>2875405
If your going to play monk you should really get the oversight or monk overhaul mod which gives balthazar abilities as HLA.
Turns the monk into a disruption/utility fighter.
Normally, a monk at high levels is no different then a pure class fighter that walks fast but can't be hasted and can max magic resistance.
Which isn't saying much since fighters can get the cloak to repel spells, various items to stop other status effects and can be hasted.
So monks are basically slightly worser then pure itemized fighters at high levels.
Why the modding scene is so slow and gay?
I hate that empty fucking feeling I get when I finish the series, ugh.
>>2876130
Just play IWD 1/2 then back to baldur again
I'm feeling like rolling a Gnome, since it's the most rarely played race for me.
From my understanding the only BG2 romance available for a Gnome is Aerie, so I'm leaning toward a compatibly good alignment to go along with it.
The options for classes are: Fighter/Thief, Fighter/Cleric, Illusionist/Thief, Fighter/Illusionist, Cleric/Mage, Cleric/Thief. I think I'm leaning mostly toward Fighter / Illusionist. I really dig those shorty save bonuses from a high Con, but I can't justify going over 16 Con for a non-Fighter class. And given their racial is a +1 Int, it seems like I should try and include Mage in there somehow.
I dunno. Anyone have some suggestions?
>>2877424
gnome fighter/illusionist is basically the best combo for that multi as far as min/max goes
>>2877491
Alright, Fighter / Illusionist it is. I'm going to see if I can't run this character from BG1 through ToB.
The minimum STR 9, DEX 16, INT9 for a Fighter / Illusionist helped me get a 90-pt roll in a pretty short amount of time.
what's the main difference between fighter/mage, cleric/mage, and fighter/clerics?
just the buffs they have access to?
>>2877783
>just the buffs they have access to?
The skills won't change. A mage has the same spells no matter what he has as a second class. The only thing which changes is the way to play them. With a F/M you rather use spells which push your fighter abilities, like stoneskin, protection from magical weapons and improved haste.
I've only gone through Baldur's Gate once, long ago. Now I'm playing through the "canon" way in preparation for Dragonspear (even if it does suck, I might as well at least try to have some fun), but I really, really hate the canon party.
Somehow I've rationalized using Ajantis, Branwen, and Kivan instead. If I change my mind though, are the pairs stuck at 2nd level?
I really wish they didn't set in stone your canon party and only alluded to that shit. It flares my autism something fierce.
>>2878104
The canon suggests that you were grouped with everyone at BG1 at some point. Irenicus capturing Jaheira, Minsc, Dynaheir, Khalid and Imoen just means they were with you at that point in time. But the dialogue from all the old BG1 characters like Edwin, Viconia, Xzar, Coran, Safana, etc.
The only ones that don't seem to recognize you and you don't recognize are Faldorn, Ajantis, Quayle and Tiax. But there are probably reasons for that. Ajantis is disguised as an Ogre by Firkraag, Tiax has always been mad, and Faldorn can't exactly be a friend still since you have to kill her for the Druid class quest.
>>2878118
I guess that's the one thing I never really 'got' about Baldur's Gate. Was a dedicated party expected, or is switching out the way to go? I approached it the way one would play Seiken Densetsu 3, with the reliance on the planned composition from the get-go.
>>2878128
The game lore suggested you switched out. Mechanically it was stupid not to pre-plan. The NPCs leveled up without you and they all rolled shit on their HP and took stupid weapon proficiencies.
Ajantis is the perfect example of that. He's out almost 30HP if you don't recruit him early.
>>2878136
Do they stop leveling if you nab them early? Because that solves a few problems, even if it does introduce a few new ones.
>>2878139
You mean if you like have them join up, then remove them from the group and reclaim them later?
>>2878141
Yeah, I told the couple to fuck off for a little while after I finished Nashkel.
>>2878143
I honestly don't know. The only times I've dumped characters were when they filled a temporary niche before acquiring the character I intended to fill their role with (dumping Branwen for Yeslick in a good group, for example) in which case I never went back for them again to know if they kept leveling.
>>2875429
>or was it a crossbow?
....you just clicked my memory, I think I remember this too
looking.....nope
Strong Arm gives +3 to THACO & damage, whereas other bows only give +THACO, and the giant hair crossbow likewise gives +5 damage
but only slings/throwing weapons give str to damage (but not darts and maybe not throwing daggers)
Siege of the dragonspear is gonna be 100% progressive, right?
>>2879139
Probably more like 40%. SJWs don't play hard games.
If you guys have never played BG1 with a full custom party, I highly suggest it. It's loads of fun.
I've got a half-elf skald, an elf archer, a gnome illusionist (I coulda gone ftr/illu but decided not to), a half-orc berserker, a dwarf ftr/cleric, and a halfling thief
My "canon" party on the right is a human fighter 6/cleric x, with kivan and xan replacing minsc and dynaheir
>>2879139
>>2879153
All that matters is it will be 140% garbage.
>>2879153
It has a "story mode" though
>>2879282
But what happens if somebody does something subtle? Where will the poor half-shaves go to figure out how to get the most out of their story-based dungeon crawler?
how come their weapons are ineffective, anyway?
Hey, anyone know if the novelizations for these games were as horrible as the rumours?
>>2879463
Yes. Yes, they really were. The main character was a retarded psycopath (literally) and it character assassinated every other major character. Gorion was some po-dunk that got eaten by ghouls, Khalid was fucking around on Jaheira, for no apparent reason the main character stopped using two-handed swords and switched to using Yoshimo's katana because edgy, etc etc.
>>2827690
You should avoid enhanced at all cost.
There's no cost though so just play the originals.
>>2831826
Offended no, but slightly disappointed.
Doesn't bg2 suggest that you had all of the other characters at some point? Like in dialogue if you meet viconia, xzar, etc.
When will GemRB be complete?
> no 10 party mods ever
>>2879463
They had to suck, there wasn't even any audiobook version!
>>2841481
But Quayle's wisdom is so damn low, he has a chance of failing his priest spells.
Every time I see a BG thread I get the urge to re-install TuTu and do a full runthrough then I remember that 3/4 of the playtime is spent:
-holding tab and waiting for your guy to saunter across the screen rummaging through barrels for minor healing potions and scrolls of grease and potion of barkskin
-tediously moving stacks of bullets around between characters (because you know all those badass necromancers and sorcerers in your party, well they're gonna spend 90% of the time auto-firing rocks at dudes)
-moving the millions of random tiny stacks of 5 arrows over to your bard to identify then distributing them back
-camping / sleeping
then you get to BG2 which is the same with the added bonus of
-spend 15 minutes before every single encounter re-casting the same buffs
How long does it take you guys to finish a playthrough normally?
Are there ways to speed it up a bit?
>>2881347
being a miser and hoarding every gem/potion/minor scroll you come across isn't needed
you can skip 90% and never miss them
being a miser and worrying about arrows and bullets isn't needed
you can just move stacks of 15-20 and toss the rest and never miss them
camping is only necessary before hard fights, try clearing trash mobs with good ol' tank-n-spank instead of full buffing
be an extreme autist and make a spreadsheet of your buffs and durations and use pause after spellcast, reduces buffing to 2-3 minutes
>>2881347
In BG 2 I immediately swing by Watcher's Keep and acquire the quiver of infinite arrows, or failing that, Tasheron's Bow. I hate micromanaging ammunition and I just won't be a part of it.
>>2881347
>TuTu
It's beyond me why people here cling to that deprecated shit. Use BGT.
>>2881953
>>2881741
Meant to say BGT not TuTu
Always get them confused
>>2827540
When should I dual class Imoen on BG1? Got to level 7 for my party, just learned about it. Haven't played the game for six months because I don't know what to do :( .
>>2882052
It depends on a number of things. Imoen being a Thief is monumentally useful for Durlag's Tower. Have you done that yet? Are you willing to postpone doing it until her Mage levels have caught up to her Thief levels? Did you correctly sink a lot of points into Disarm Trap and Open Locks, or did you fall into the Hide in Shadows trap? What's your party composition look like? Often times there's really no strong reason to ever Dual-Class Imoen at all, save for following canon.
I'm not supposed to be in the Kobold mines at level 1, am I?
>>2882474
You can be, yeah. Assuming you skip all the little side quests present in the maps between Nashkel Mines and Candlekeep, it's entirely possible. Hell, even doing most of them you wouldn't be much higher than level 2 or 3.
>>2882242
>Imoen being a Thief is monumentally useful for Durlag's Tower. Have you done that yet?
Not yet. I just finished the Iron Throne Forest quest and have just arrived at Baldur's Gate.
>Are you willing to postpone doing it until her Mage levels have caught up to her Thief levels?
I don't even know where or when to begin. Like, at what point can I safely stop leveling as a thief? Will I miss out on anything?
>Did you correctly sink a lot of points into Disarm Trap and Open Locks, or did you fall into the Hide in Shadows trap?
I tried to distribute them evenly, but I've been putting emphasis in Disarm Trap. I guess I won't put any more time into HiS, then...
First timer here, btw.
>What's your party composition look like? Often times there's really no strong reason to ever Dual-Class Imoen at all, save for following canon.
18 DEX/18 STR Fighter with emphasis on longbows and mace weapons.
Minsc
Dynaheir
Cleric Dwarf-guy
Branwen
Also, sorry I couldn't reply. 4chan insisted the was a connection error.
>>2880106
But why would they even want to put effort into it? Are there any actual things being done with that engine? There's great development of the darkplaces engine, but that's actually used for nexuiz/xonotic, that's very different from something for a game that can already be played 3 different ways.
>>2881741
>>2881978
There's also Icewind Gate, instead of the BG2 engine, you can use the IWD2 engine!
>>2881347
Maybe you should play the game differently because most of that shit doesn't happen to me.
>>2883376
this image is triggering a desire to launch a fireball at them so badly. I can even see exactly where I'd fire it for maximum carnage.
>>2883495
I had the same urge, except with a Skull Trap. It's more satisfying that way.
>>2882498
Honestly, you don't really need to dual-class Imoen to a Mage at all. Dynaheir more than covers the role for you, and Imoen as your only Thief is infinitely more valuable in that position with a shortbow than she's going to be casting Magic Missile two or three times and then switching back to the shortbow.
Ideally, you want to get your Find Traps and Open Locks to at or near 100. You'll find a lot of stuff in-game that'll raise Hide in Shadows - Boots of Stealth and Shadow Armor are both available by Beregost and give a total of +50%.
>>2879759
Hah, I had a friend who had exactly those kinds of peeves.
Particularly, he formed an axe to grind against Philip Athans over it, which got particularly significant because Athans wrote on of the books in War of the Spider Queen.
But then, I never heard of any supposedly decent FR books that are not by Salvatore anyway.
>>2879759
all i remember is that the bg2 book had abdel stick his dick in a dusty old vampire
>>2883868
Yeah, that was something else.
In the game, Irenicus had been a respected Archmage and the lover of Queen Ellesime. It was his sister Bodhi that corrupted him and encouraged him to try and steal the power of the Seldarine which ultimately is why they both got cast out and stripped of their Elven souls.
In the book, Bodhi fucks the main character and is a good guy who helps her fight mean ol' Irenicus. This is while the protagonist is also fucking Jaheira who inexplicably got raised between books.
It really reads like some guy who played the game wrote a fanfic and projected his virginal lust after Bodhi's character into the story.
Hmmm, I don't suppose this would by any chance be any good? This seems to be like the only other thing they released that's set in continental Amn.
I want to play Baldur's Gate but for some reason the game runs in stopmotion on my laptop
I can run more challenging games, but what the fuck
>>2884136
A similar thing happened to me when I tried to run Icewind Dale+HoW on an old version of Wine.
>>2883870
>It really reads like some guy who played the game wrote a fanfic and projected his virginal lust after Bodhi's character into the story.
Pretty sure the author didn't play the game and just got some rough informations about the story, characters and locations. Being a commissioned writer is really shitty though (even more so for video games, I imagine), so I can't hate them for raping their source material.
>>2885287
>Pretty sure the author didn't play the game and just got some rough informations about...
>...and locations
But there should have been a whole lot of information about the locations!
http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Empires_of_the_Sands
http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Lands_of_Intrigue_%28boxed_set%29
http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Volo%27s_Guide_to_the_Sword_Coast
Seriously, before that takeover, TSR went nuts churning out materials!
>>2885293
I'm not a coder at all, I'm much more likely to contribute such things somewhere on the content end.
>>2885474
So that's who Volo is
>>2885287
You make it sound like the guy got a bum deal. Which is nonsense.
He was a fucking upstart, and they gave him the BG adaptations to cut his teeth on.
Much different handling was due. They should have gotten Salvatore to oversee the project and split it between three other junior authors, and instead situated it a bit earlier overall. Then they could have cleared up what happened to the characters with a second book that focussed largely on events in between the two games.
Playing IWD2 so I figure no one would mind if I talk about it here. Trying to design a party that is min maxed but still within RP reason, no warriors with 1 int and things like that. What is the minimum int for a half orc barbarian to still know whats going on around him? What about charisma? Is it better to put leftover points in dex or wis, if using two handed weapons? What about stat placement for a diplomat, sorcerer class, what is the min int for having all the dialogue options?
>>2887190
>half orc
>barbarian
1 int, 3 max
4 if he's a gary stu warboss commander
>>2887201
I said I want to avoid 1 int fighters for RP reasons. 1 int is like livestock level intelligence.
>>2887206
>not wanting to roleplay the "hit door with axe" braindead warrior
>it's even a filthy halfbreed barbarian
anon pls
>>2887208
My group is made of dumbass front line guys with wizards that tell them what to do, they need to at least be smart enough to listen
>>2887208
Anything below a 3 is considered animal intelligence. Below 8 is semi-functioning autist.
>>2887220
Thanks. Autist rage could be a good trait in a barbarian. What about a diplomat character? High cha wizard or high int sorcerer? Anyone know the max needed int for all dialogue options?
>>2884136
Turning the color depth to 32 fixed it for me. 16, the default, was very slow.
Why do sorcerers use charisma for spell casting? I feel like wisdom would make more sense. A shaman that barters with spirits for powers would use charisma. It just kind of bothers me.
>>2887227
I'm confident that intelligence doesn't affect dialogue options in Baldur's Gate. Charisma kind of sort of does, but is entirely substitutable with reputation.
>>2887647
There are hundreds of mods, but not one who rewrites dialogs based on INT/CHR/WIS.
It's kind of sad. I guess waifus are simply more popular.
>>2887647
Thanks that is good to know. Is it that way in all the infinity engine games?
>>2887440
been a little while - aren't sorcerers descended from dragons, in the older editions at least? I always thought of it as the charisma reflecting how powerful their draconic blood was, therefore how strong their natural magical power was, with charisma as a more natural link between spellcasting ability and class than, say, raw intelligence (which makes sense for book learnings for wizard types)
>>2887735
I forgot about that, guess I can see the reasoning there but I still feel like its a little weird. Oh well.
>>2887735
I had a DM that houseruled the Sorcerer casting stat to Constitution, reflecting the usage of users own life force and "blood" to fuel their magic. This lead to some amazing Barbarian/Sorcerer combos that became a sort of shaman/warlord for their tribes.
>>2887768
That sounds cool as fuck
>>2887735
I guess it must imply that supernatural forces giving them their powers must find them cute or something.
So im doing my first play on bg2:EE and after doing the trademeet quests, the town summoned statues for my party and well... it seems the game is trying to tell me something because yoshimo statue has bugs flying arround him
Is he a piece of shit?
>>2888309
Ah, yes, this was added in Throne of Bhaal to give a hint to players about his unique nature mage capabilities that he unlocks after you finish the storyline of SoA and get on with the final third of the game.
It was put there to give Yoshimo an edge, because he was overall kind of boring (he doesn't have any new dialogue written after you finish Chapter 4) and because he's a single-classed thief, which are underpowered in general.
>>2887697
No, Torment it's totally different.
Stats affecting dialogue and things like diplomatic skills it's basically a Black Isle thing.
Is there any way to add more kits to bg1, short of using bg trilogy (it froze on me in the section between the two games) I would love to start a sorcerer that goes through both games.
>>2889336
TuTu I guess.
Vanilla will never get a kit pack because engine.
>>2889652
Thanks, going to try easytutu and see how it goes
Should I install the bg2 fixpack before unfinished business?
Now I can't decide if I should go with tutu or go all out with the big world project. Is it any good? I would use the recommended version if I did.
>>2889785
Yes, the general rule of thumb for mods is:
1. Ascencion
2. Fixpack
3. Mods that add items or spells
4. Quest mods
5. NPC mods
6. Mods that change the rules of the game or add AI (rogue rebalancing, SCS, etc).
7. Tweak packs
wow they finished the imoen romance mod.
Top kek.
>>2883864
>But then, I never heard of any supposedly decent FR books that are not by Salvatore anyway.
elminster the making of a mage
forsaken house
dissolution
elfshadow
I want to be a sword and board fighter, preferably beserker.
What weapon should I specialize in consideration of playing both bg1 and 2, enhanced editions? I just have a massive hard on being a shield using pure fighter.
>>2890497
Long Sword is easily the most common sword. BG1 has Varscona, which is one of the better one-handers. BG2 has shitloads of Long Swords. Long Swords are fucking everywhere. Get Long Swords.
You can also take Axes, BGEE should feature a bonus axe or two to my memory, and early BG2 has two extremely good axes available the moment you free the slaves, one of them being throwable, so you can have a solid distance weapon while being a Berserker (who can't master anything like a Sling or a Bow).
>>2890554
Don't forget the Flametongue +1, which goes from an okay lycanthrope killer in BG1 to your primary beatstick against vampires, liches, and anything that needs a +4 weapon to hit (which it counts as for overcoming that requirement regardless of the target being undead or not and getting the damage and thac0 bonus). BG2EE even makes it one of the import items you get in the starting dungeon, so you can then go nab Namarra from the graveyard district and be set against everything short of clay golems.
cleric class is best class in BG1. prove me wrong.
>>2890725
Only since there is no sorcerer
>>2890592
Also sorry if this is a dumb question but does the big world installer download the mods for me or do I have to get them all myself and then it installs them?
>>2890735
sorcerer doesn't come even close. A cleric in full plate, with bonus spells from wisdom and might active is a one man army.
>>2890747
that is, until you cast summon spells and become an actual army.
>>2890662
>one of the import items you get in the starting dungeon
Isn't that redundant? Or does EE spread them out more?
>>2890749
Summon Deva was absolutely hilarious, the range of spells they get are amazing. Getting access to Summon Deva in SoA renders most encounters an absolute joke.
>summon 1 deva
>she can cast Heal, Restoration, Improved Invisibility multiple times
>uses enhanced Mace of Disruption so vampire/undead encounters become much more straightforward
>can also cast fucking Globe of Blades on herself to single handedly act as a tank
>>2842705
third lady on the bottom has bongo titties, like you could get a good rhythm out of those
>>2890742
>does the big world installer download the mods for me
Yeah, it does.
>>2890452
Oh, of course, Ed Greenwood's munchkin avatar. There's even audiobooks of that series.
Didn't really know about the other two though.
>>2890497
in bg1, you get a good longsword pretty early (if you know how to get it), but the *best* 1H weapons are a couple of scimitars...
in bg2, the best longsword (for non-evil types) can be bough almost immediately, and it's just a +3 that grants a cha boost
axes are good and early, but the BEST 1H is a warhammer
you'll want axes anyway, though, because thats also a missile weapon and one of the three really good ones is also a throwing weapon at the same time
>>2890857
>Oh, of course, Ed Greenwood's munchkin avatar. There's even audiobooks of that series.
>Didn't really know about the other two though.
Read making of a mage. I don't like Ed's other books either, but that one is like it's written by a different person. It's easily my favorite book ever.
>>2891212
Dwarven Defender is the best available fighter.
>>2892006
But it can't dual to mage
Is there a way to play the original BG2 without the horrible slowdown on modern PCs? I badly want to stay away from EE , but there has to be a way to speed BG2 the fuck up!
>>2893512
I don't have any slowdowns. Are you perhaps using Win10?
>>2893513
Nope Win 7. Actually, it's been a while since I've played BG2 on win 7, got a new desktop, will try installing it. But if memory serves, spell animations really slowed the game down.
>>2891318
Oh, you don't like the rest of the Elminster series? I don't suppose you've checked out any of Ed's atypical other titles by chance?
I see he wrote a few in a long running harper series, that sounds like it could be the closest thing to BG novel tie in.
And also a novel blatantly about Cormyr, I wonder if that might happen to be a lot like the sword coast? Much like Tethyr *sounds* a lot like Calimshan.
Hey, get this, someone apparently created a whole new map for an unofficial BG2 add on, and this one appears to look completely fresh and in no way odd!
At least, it seems to be just one map. not two or more.
