Hey guys, I haven't played XY yet so I have a question - why does everyone seems to hate mega evolutions?
From what I understand it's just a Super Mode that a Pokemon can enter and all the designs in my opinion were pretty great
So what is actually wrong with them? Is there some flaw in its mechanic?
when it comes to mega evolutions they pretty much fucked up the old format of battle. the old format worked and people were comfortable with it. and when you change things people get all in there asses about it. nothing is wrong with mega evolution its all just people being pissy and dumb.
>>26592691
>why does everyone seems to hate mega evolutions?
It's just /vp/.
I haven't seen one single fucking person hating on Megas besides /vp/. I absolutely love them.
>>26592691
I don't have a problem with it, personally, but it's kind of a symbol of the power creep in Pokémon.
It's pretty much just a /vp/ thing.
>>26592691
they are mostly given to popular and already powerful Pokémon that appeal to 10 year old like Lucario, Mewtwo and Salamance and not to the ones that really need it.
>>26592777
>they are mostly given to popular and already powerful Pokémon
They really aren't. 50% isn't "mostly", it's "fair".
I don't have a problem with Mega Evolution in and of itself. There are a lot of designs I don't like though, and there are Pokemon I think should and shouldn't have gotten Mega Evolutions. Especially Charizard, who has no reason to get two different Megas.
The thing that I really dislike though, is that Pokemon that could get actual evolutions are getting Megas instead. Mega Evolutions should only have been given to Pokemon that already had three evolution stages.
>>26592777
Many Pokemon who needed a boost for one. I'd say in fact the majority. Some popular ones got Megas buy that's only natural.
The big problem with megas is that they are distributed very poorly. Most of the best megas are for pokemon that are already powerful enough and dont need them (Rayquay, gengar, etc.) The pokemon that DO need them (audino, banette, houndoom) have very porrly thought out megas that just don't work that well with the moves they can learn and their roles.
To go in-depth, I LOVE the design of mega banette, but it is utter garbage as a mega. It gets the ability prankster which it can't even use on the turn it mega-evolves so you can only use it against slower mons, and its speed is garbage (75).
The designs are shit. The system feels clunky. Retarded amounts of power creep.
Because of it, Kalos had fucking barely any new Pokemon at all.
>>26592810
But a Mega is basically a new evolution for a Pokemon. People get on Kalos for >only 70 new Pokemon but what about Sinnoh? How many were totally new Pokemon versus evolutions of other ones?
>>26592785
>is that Pokemon that could get actual evolutions are getting Megas instead
Outside Banette, no. You can't say that if megas didn't exist they would EVER get an evolution. GF could as well as have decided even in old gens that that one Pokemon would never evolve.
It's kind of a dumb argument, also because nobody could say that in the future the Pokemon that gets a mega couldn't get an evolution. We went 3 gens with the believe that traded-evolutions could never evolve and what did fourth gen did? Gave us a trade evo that evolved again.
Megas are that one Pokemon in its more powerful form, so they can make an evolution that gets the same stat boost but specializes in something else.
>>26592777
>>26592783
Have to agree with the second guy, its pretty evenly split. i mean, are pokemon like Steelix and Audino even popular?
>>26592691
Mega Evolution is a poorly-implemented mechanic and feels largely superfluous, tacked-on. There's a fine line between adding depth and adding "stuff" in RPG battle systems, but when you've played enough of them you can definitely tell the difference. A good rule of thumb is "simple, but deep", something past generations of Pokemon did really good at, with alterations to the battle system being major shifts that felt integrated into the whole (abilities, double battles, etc.). Mega Evolution feels like something out of a latter Final Fantasy title, simultaneously convoluted and shallow.
>They effectively "mega evolve" Pokemon into a corner
They don't evolve after they receive one, and most only get one MEvo. If it performs badly, that Pokemon is effectively beyond saving without mechanic or movepool changes.
>Most of them look aesthetically silly
Most of them have proportions or body add-ons that make them look very clunky or uncomfortable. Very rarely will one be done that looks natural, and that's due to the very nature of Mega Evolution being a super form.
>>26592777
Yeah. Charizard, Kangaskhan, Mawile, and Lopunny sure were overpowered back in Gen V!
>>26592869
I agrre ega evolutions fee ll tacked on and very shallow which could be considered a flaw (but not aajor one at all, and shouldn't be considered one at all until we know for certain it absolutely means pokemom with one won't get a real evolution), but it is not convoluted at all. Ita very simple.
>>26592838
A mega evolution is not a separate Pokemon. It is a temporary form. Do you think sun-castform or west shellos are seperate Pokemon? Mega evos don't even have a dex entry. By definition, they are not a separate Pokemon while the sinnoh evos actually were seperate Pokemon.
>>26592899
But work-wise I think they count, since they have new models and animations
>>26592838
Don't be a retard. Some Pokemon dexes would reach 230+ if you actually counted alternative forms as a different Pokemon. Mega evos are a form just like every other.
>>26592899
But it takes the same amount of effort to make a mega evolution as it does to make a regular one. No, they aren't strictly or technically real evolutions, but they have new designs, stats, abilities, animations, models, etc. And yes, I do think you could consider form changes the same way. Making a seperate Dex entry is so far from the part that takes the most effort of making a Pokemon in game making terms.
>>26592856
>You can't say that if megas didn't exist they would EVER get an evolution.
Which I never said. You're putting words in my mouth.
>>26592910
They are still not different Pokemon. No dex means not a different Pokemon. Most forms have just as much work put into their animations.
>>26592810
>Retarded amounts of power creep.
I wouldn't solely blame this on Mega Evolution, rather the amount of new mechanics offered and poor management.
>>26592838
>How many were totally new Pokemon versus evolutions of other ones?
about twenty five Sinnoh evo lines are neither Starters, legendaries, or cross-gen.
I dnot have an image with the entire list but its:
>Starly
>Bidoof
>Shinx
>Kricketot
>Fossils
>Burmy
>Bees
>Pikaclone
>Floatzel
>Cherrim
>Shellos
>Balloon
>lopunny
>Purrugly
>Lucario
>skunk
>Garchomp
>Chatot
>Toxicroak
>Carnivine
>Hippopotas
>Skorupi
>Lumineon
>Snover
>Rotom
>>26592913
Different forms isn't including palette swaps like Florges and shinies and stuff. You can't seriously think stuff like that is the same as Sky Shaymin, Hopp Unbound, etc. Or that the work involved in creating Megas is equivalent to recoloring Florges.
>>26592691
The hate for it is really only relegated to /vp/, its a pretty popular concept elsewhere.
>>26592936
That doesn't change anything because they could have spent 4 years designing Mega Aerodactyl's Rock dildos. At the end of the day it's still not a new Pokemon. Kalos added only 72 new Pokemon and I can't believe people actually defend this.
You could add 300 different shellos forms but that doesn't make up for the sheer lack of new Pokemon.
>>26592691
Fells unnatural and forced.
And I liked Pokemon for being natural.
>GF won't do permanent evolutions for new mons anymore
>most are for pokemon that don't need them
>a lot actually look like shit
>GF will use these TEMPORARY forme changes as an excuse to not have a lot of new Pokémon each gen
>>26592970
Amount of work doesn't change anything. It's still not a new Pokemon. It's a form change that only happens in battle. It's practically a pokeball seal.
It's the same old Pokemon you always dealt with in older games. Just because you can temporarily give them rock dildoes does not turn them into a different pokemon
>>26592977
Okay, just go on thinking things are that black and white and that creating Megas took the same amount of time and effort as making different Gastrodons and not to the time it took them to make Roaerade or Electivire or Wynaut because it isn't literally a new Pokemon.
>>26593013
The work does not matter. People feel rightfully peeved because their opportunities for meeting new Pokemon were cut down to add rock dildoes and thirty different mega charizards.
>>26592998
>most
>9 OU Pokémon got it out of 46
>>26593009
But it doesn't MATTER that they aren't real evolutions in any way beyond the mechanics of the game. Mega Charizard is as much a new Pokemon as Electivire. the only difference is one is programmed as real evolution and one is a form change. Why does what it's actually called matter more than the effort it takes to create?
I'm okay with them, but my biggest fear is that megas will be the only new evolution created for old pokemon. A mega farfetch'd won't mean anything if it's too weak to waste a mega slot on. It could still be weak with an evolution, but it's at least considerable for fun teams.
>>26593041
>Mega Charizard is as much a new Pokemon as Electivire
No, it's fucking not.
It's Charizard.
>>26592977
>Kalos added only 72 new Pokemon and I can't believe people actually defend this.
Well start believing it.
Id rather they go with this trend. Less pokemon with stronger designs, and Mega's to improve on old Pokemon.
Mega's have a higher chance of being better than a new pokemon anyways.
>>26593056
No, it's Mega Charizard. Charizard is Charizard.
Eh. I don't like them or hate them, although some of them are fucking atrocious to look at. I was never really all that excited about the idea of megas in the first place, I've always thought they were kind of unnecessary, they don't really add all that much to the game in the first place.
No tears would be shed if they were either removed or weren't making a return in the upcoming games, which they likely are.
>>26593073
And Sky Shaymin isn't Shaymin, I suppose. Your thought process is fucking retarded.
But keep gobbling that Game Freak cock.
>>26593041
It's still the same old Charizard you used in any other game except it looks different in battle and doesn't suck dick. Outside of battle it's still Charizard. It's still called Charizard. If it quacks like a Charizard, it's a Charizard.
Electivire is an entirely different Pokemon than electabuzz. You can't ever change that electivire back. The change is permanent. The Pokemon looks and works differently all the time. No take backs, no form changes. It's an evolution with its own dex entry and personality. There's is no comparison full stop.
Shellos is shellos is shellos
>>26593059
>less Pokemon with stronger designs
Nigga what?
Kalos had terrible designs overall. This quality over quantity meme is retarder when Kalos designs weren't any better than other gens' designs. Not to mention that Kalos made some of the least fun to use and most useless Pokemon we've had in a while.
>>26593048
This thinking is really flawed. There are probably going to be 800+ Pokemon competing for 6 slots on a team. I think that ratio is even more skewed than the 50, maybe 60 including new Megas competing for 1.
>>26592691
It's the exact moment when Pokemon jumped the shark
>>26593113
Unless you have some means of objectively proving that the designs are bad, then can it. You know damn well it's just gonna turn into a "hurr no u have shit taste, no U have shit taste".
>>26593113
>retarder
I know what you mean, but goddamn.
>>26593059
That would be fine if the designs are actually stronger. For the most part, they are not.
>>26593136
You're the one making the claim that less Pokemon means they'll have better designs. Tell me how Kalos designs are better than other gens' designs.
Either do, or shut the fuck up.
>>26593150
>goddamn
I'm a bit drunk, it's gonna happen again.
>>26592691
I don't hate them, they added something different though I do think they basically mean the end of cross-gen evolutions when Pokemon like Mawile and Pinsir are getting megas rather than regular evolutions.
>>26593156
Actually Kalos have tons of my absolute favorite designs from the whole series, but arguing about different tastes is pretty useless, since everyone usually just gets pissed like a little baby
>>26593091
It just isn't that simple. It doesn't inherently take much less time or effort to create an alternate form with totally new graphics (as opposed to palette swaps or slight edits) and stats and etc. Being obsessed with the letter of something but not the spirit is the definition of being pedantic. Legends have dorm changes explicitly because they don't get real evolutions for example. But just because Sky Shaymin, for example, is just a different Shaymin doesn't make it the same as Shellos or Florges or Spinda. The amount of effort it takes to create them is why the dex was so short of totally new Pokemon, because the dorm changes used resources that would be roughly equivalent to new Pokemon or evolutions. Just because they don't function the same or have the same name doesn't change that. Whether you think it's okay that they did that is another thing entirely and I could understand if people would have rather had totally new Pokemon instead, but it's the same reason Sinnoh doesn't have that many totally new Pokemon, even if Mega Evolutions aren't actually real evolutions, because it takes a similar amount of work to basically program what is a new Pokemon and just tie it mechanically to the old one in a different way. I repeat I feel the same about form changes like Shaymin or he Kyurems, but stuff like Spinda or Florges aren't the same.
>>26593205
You still haven't backed up your claim.
>>26592753
> I absolutely love them
> My favourite is Charizard/Mewtwo!
>>26592691
A) They don't like the design philosophy behind mega evolutions.
B) They don't like how wildly they seem to shift between completely overpowered (M-Kangaskhan) to completely terrible (M-Audino).
C) They don't like the implication that cross-generation evolutions (other than for Eevee) are dead and buried as a concept in favor of Mega Evolutons.
>>26592691
The only issue I have with it at all is when it's given to Pokemon that need a regular evolution first, but Pokemon that evolve twice already? Or maybe only have two stages but feel complete? Venusaur? Fine, but audino? No
>>26593380
I do agree that it shouldn't have been given except to Pokemon that can't evolve. That includes 3 stage and legends but also maybe stuff where its meant to be single pr 2 stage or something but it gets foggy there.
>>26593380
Not to mention Audino itself would benefit from a real evolution thanks to Eviolite
>>26592691
I hated them, since that they removed tons of new pokemon in XY that could had been there.
>>26592691
> One or two of them have fucked up competitive battling by being OP little shits
>Some of them look retarded
>Combined with the fact that items transfer through Pokebank, they enforce the fact that you need to buy every new game or be left behind due to power creep
>Everyone on the internet suddenly decided they would design new megas.
>Most of these internet fan-megas are min-maxed out the ass with deviant-art tier design.
>It makes some pokemon fans uncomfortable for stealing from Digimon after many years of making fun of Digimon for being copycats
>The way it was introduced to the player alongside the whole XY Lucario fiasco made a bad first impression to many players
>The way it was introduced in the Anime was in the Genesect movie, which already had people upset about the Mewtwo fiasco
>Some autists have a huge problem with not just one, but two naturally occuring minerals that interact with Mewtwo, a synthetically created 'mon.
>Mega Fug
>Some players feel blatant favoring of some pokemon over others when they get a mega.
>Some megas are actually worse than the originals (Pretty much Garchomp exclusively)
>When a fan favorite with merch gets a mega, it is usually OP as shit. When your favorite pokemon gets a Mega, it is usually craptastic.
>People feel that megas just over-design old, classic pokemon.
>Some people worry that new pokemon will be designed incomplete so that their mega can finish them. Diancie is usually listed as the example
>People get upset that Megas eliminate the chance for a pokemon to get an actual evolution. Mainly a problem with single-stagers, like Mawile
>People worry that New Megas=New Pokemon in GF's design when moving on to the next region.
>People worry that Megas are a slippery slope, leading to more retarded shit like fusing with your pokemon. Primal Reversion is usually listed as an example.
Pick and choose from this list. No doubt I missed a reason or two.
>>26593633
>>Combined with the fact that items transfer through Pokebank,
Shit, Items do not transfer, my bad.
>>26593633
>Most of these internet fan-megas are min-maxed out the ass
Is there even a consensus for an acceptable amount of minmaxing
No one seems to complain about Diancie or Beedrill, or even Absol who gains absolutely (no pun intended) 0 defenses
They aren't new pokemon evolutions
>>26593691
Beedrill is the one I see as an exception to the rule, as it actually needs that level of reworking.
Machamp loosing all of its special attack into speed, and getting Pure Power is not necessary.
>>26593633
>Everyone on the internet suddenly decided they would design new megas
Who gives a fuck.
>It makes some pokemon fans uncomfortable for stealing from Digimon after many years of making fun of Digimon for being copycats
If you actually believe this shit you should probably kill yourself because you are retarded beyond redemption.
>>26593798
These are just common opinions I have gathered.
I personally don't care much.
>>26593691
There's absolutely no way to win with those fan Megas. For every autist you upset by minmaxing there are twice as many people ready to complain about pointless stat buffs, like +10 to a useless offensive stat.
>>26592691
>game freak will never retcon Mega Mawile, Houndoom, Audino, etc to be real evolutions
>>26592691
Megas were designed for competitive and they add nothing of value to single player. I don't play competitive so I see megas as a wasted resource that could have gone to better new pokemon designs and a better game experience.
>>26592777
>mostly given to powerful Pokémon
I'm actually OK with that. You expect something shitty to suddenly go super sayan?
The problem is old shitty mons aren't getting regular evos.
Regular evos for old shit mons, mega evos for powerful mons
>>26596501
This. People can go ahead and enjoy their competitive value but just as a concept I feel it's extremely unfitting for Pokemon. It was ok for Mewtwo being that it's a genetically engineered being that might try to force an unnatural evolution or something but for all the others it's just extremely off putting to me.
>>26593113
>what is talonflame greninja and aegislash
>>26592691
A lot of them are super ugly. Especially in X and Y.
Otherwise I don't really mind them, but they do make the game even easier.
>>26592691
>Says designs are pretty great
>Posts Mega Manectric and Mega Aerodactyl
Manectric and Aerodactyl's designs were great, but their megas are trash. Aerodactyl just has large spikes. Ugh.
I just want MegaHoundoom to have a better ability. Thats all.
>>26596949
And Clawitzer, Tyrantrum, Avalugg, Gourgeist, Dragalge, etc. So many quality mons in Kalos.
>>26592856
If mega evolution applied to all Pokémon, fully evolved or not, then I think would have 3 different megas for pikachu by now.
>>26592691
>all the designs in my opinion were pretty great
>>26599101
>Ugh
WEW
>>26593113
A bunch of people complained that gen V was over-saturated with nothing but piles of shit for Pokemon with only a handful being good, while the rest were things that would never see play.
GF took this into account and decided to reduce the amount of Pokemon, assuming it would result in a full cast of useful Pokemon, while using Mega as a manner to improve on previous Pokemon. Or in Garchomp's case, a downgrade.
This, of course, was a poor decision since what literally determines a Pokemon being good is a movepool that is compatible with it's stats.
Source - My ass.
It's a cool addon to mechanic synce you can megaevolve only one polemon durning battle.
Problem is that some of them are (IMHO) breakig game, by not being balanced.
To simplyfied: Megas givin "legend touch" to one of your pokemon.
>>26592691
I don't like them because the fucking first half of the game's plot revolved around them and it felt lame as hell.
It's not like when they introduced double/triple battles that just happened. The plot had to be about how special you are and how great mega evolution is for your special Pokemon.
