Why does /vp/ hate him? He looks nice
Oshawott Line is the best starter line. Prove me wrong. You can't.
But anon this is Popplio evo line
>>26362524
Looks like garbage and garbage stats. Try acquiring taste if you unironically like samurott or any gen 5 starter at all
Better than ballio
>>26362553
>stats
autism
>looks like garbage
nope
Serperior is a 10/10, so is Samurott
Embroar is passable 5/10 or 6/10
>>26362571
>Serperior is a 10/10
i want furries to leave
1. People don't understand the concept
2. Its too different from Dewott (but Blaziken is fine)
3. Its pure Water, not Water/Fighting
4. Its stats aren't all that and its HA is terrible
>>26362594
>people don't understand the concept
>Samurott is hated specifically because he's a quadrupedal swordsman, two fundamentally incompatible things
If anything it's a matter of people understanding the concept too well and being able to see all the flaws in it. Saying people hate it because they don't understand it is a shitty ploy to make its detractors look ignorant.
>>26362622
What's the problem with it?
>>26362709
Proper swordsmanship is only possible with an upright biped/human body type.
>>26362709
it's a quadruped that is trying to manipulate things with its front limbs to fight. All I can think is that it would be totally off-balance unless it's underwater.
Samurott would have been great if it was bipedal, but instead they gave it that stupid splayed-leg stance.
>>26362724
>Proper swordsmanship is only possible with an upright biped/human body type.
According to who?
>>26362524
>him
>he
>>26362724
Who says? It also isn't only a swordsman. It can use regular water attacks.
>>26362736
It isn't solely quadrupedal. Maybe primarily, but stand on two legs. And it doesn't need to anyway, dogs and other animals can be balanced just fine on three legs., especially for only as long as it takes for Samurott to draw a sword and attack.
>>26362524
He looks like somebody took a bloody diarrhea shit on the ground, then somebody else came along, saw that, and threw up on it.
>>26362524
it looks stupid especially when dewott looks so good. You expect something better after but you get this ugly thing instead.
>>26362736
excuse me, samurott can stand on two legs just fine
even watched the anime??
>>26362594
>Its too different from Dewott (but Blaziken is fine)
That's because Torchic had Combusken, which was a natural midpoint between the tiny-ass Torchic and the humanoid Blaziken.
Combusken itself is also ugly enough to not get attached to, whereas Dewott is actually cool on its own and built peoples expectations toward something that didn't happen. See also Braixen and pre-XY Grovyle.
>>26362594
>but Blaziken is fine
chick > kicking chicken > bigger kicking chicken
bipedal otter > bigger bipedal otter > quadrupedal fucking sealion out of nowhere
they are not even comparable
hurr muh wuadrupedal
>>26362835
>sealion
Post discarded.
>>26362848
>that clumsy, hunched stance akin to a dog on its hind legs that isn't comparable to proper swordfighting stance
This doesn't even bring up that Samurott literally can't draw its swords from its scabbards (its limb are too short) and the fact that the swords are too long for the scabbards
>>26362848
>>26362810
Then why isn't it designed to remain bipedal like Dewott?
>>26362835
But, see, being the kickin chicken was Torchic line's gimmick. Not tonmention Blaziken is not chicken like at all, just generically birdkin like. Im sure most people's first thought when we knew about ablaziken, which was before we knew Torchic and Combusken, was "eagle". Oshawott line's gimmick was sword fighting otters. You didn't say torchix's line was chicken > bipedal chicken > bigger bipedal chicken. Oshawott's line would therefore be otter > sword fighting otter > bigger swordfighting otter/sea lion or whatever.
>>26362806
>>26362881
Samurottfags have sunk this low
>>26362764
Do you have Downs Syndrome?
>>26362902
/vp/ Brobot is everywhere, dumbass.
Shell Smash in 7gen pls T-T = Samurott competitive
>>26362524
>stubby legs and arms quadruped sword fighter
What were they thinking?
>>26362524
>Barely covered with shells
>Gets Shell Armor for its HA
???????
>>26362909
No one cares about your shitty wannabe meme, you chode.
>>26362903
>applying real world logic to Pokemon
Do you?
Honestly if the improbability of a primarily four legged animal using a sword is what breaks your suspension of disbelief, how do you enjoy Pokemon at all? There are so many more ridiculous concepts and even designs that I can't believe this is the one that triggers people.
>>26362874
>proper swordfighting stance
his sword is magic, he doesn't fight against another sword, moron
>>26362921
>T-T
spotted the underage
>>26362810
So can dogs doesn't mean they function well.
IT LOOKS BAD,
It looks fucking stupid.
If you can't see that there is no point in debating you. This faggot Pokemon looks like shit.
>>26362946
You know how hating Popplio became big for no reason other than boredom and memes? Same thing happened with Samurott, and the V starters in general.
>>26362946
Because a lizard breathing fire out of its mouth looks dynamic, and cool, and ties into myths of western dragons.
An animal that walks around on all fours can't wield a sword. You literally couldn't depict it visually while making it look good. It's an anatomical and visual problem. Not a logic or suspension of disbelief problem. I don't believe Samurott can wield a sword because I can SEE it failing to.
>>26362946
>ITS FICTION SO THEY CAN DO WHATEVER STUPID SHIT THEY WANT AND ITS FINE
yeah ash should just fart out a pair of wings and fly across alola in the new anime, but its a world of magical animals so its nothing out of ordinary :^)
>>26362961
Samurott is not a dog nor a real life animal at all
>>26362524
I personally don't hate Samurott, after Serperior it's my favorite of the final evolutions of the Gen 5 starters.
>>26362945
This.
It's a fucking fictional universe where matter can be created out of seemingly nothing and things like that.
What if Samurott isn't a swordsman like the ones in real life and has its own swordfighting style ? What if it adapted to being quadrupedal and fighting like one, instead of trying to do what humans do ?
>>26362524
>Be a samurai
>Has a higher Sp.Atk than Atk
>>26362969
I just think he looks ugly. I also never hated the gen 5 starters
>>26362986
Samurott is a quadruped. Samurott standing on its hind legs is equivalent to a quadruped standing on its hind legs, like a dog. Samurott reared up on its hind legs does not make it a proper biped, it's body is incompatible with swordsmanship.
>>26362998
Swords literally can't be wielded walking on all fours, full stop.
because its just an ugly unicorn
>>26363044
>it doesn't happen in real life, therefore it can't in a fictional world
>>26363044
Eh, maybe it found a way somehow ? I always pictured it fighting with its helmet like a sword, and it's been shown to be able to somewhat stand up on its hind legs.
I don't know, I'd rather imagine it having a way to fight even if it's weird and headcanon than just hate it because its concept doesn't seem possible.
>>26362983
Slippery slope fallacy and a strawman
>>26362971
And am otter that wields sword and armor made from shells is an extremely cool concept, ties into otters, it has nothing to do with mythology but sure.
But it doesn't fail. They've succeeded in depicting it in game. It's animated to do so in the games and it works just fine. Samurott doesn't literally only attack with its swords either. Its not like it has to have the most swordman-like anatomy when it's sword, mustache, and armor are meant to be an intimidation factor as much as functional and isn't even it's only form of attack. That's even similar to a real shogun in fact in that sense. Real huge broadswords aren't the most practical weapon in real life either.
>>26362946
>>26363054
aside from legendaries which are clearly some mystical bullshit the pokemon world has set itself up to be very close to the real world, its just all the animals are intelligent and elemental.
a quadrupedal swordsman just doesn't make sense, especially when it "evolved" from a superior bipedal stance.
>>26363054
IT'S NOT ABOUT IT BEING A FICTIONAL WORLD, IT'S ABOUT THE WAY THE BODY AND THE SWORD WORK TOGETHER.
HOW COULD SAMUROTT WALK WITH BOTH ITS SWORDS OUT? HOW COULD IT SWING EITHER BOTH AT THE SAME TIME OR ONE TWO-HANDED? IT CAN'T MOVE AND SWING SIMULTANEOUSLY. THESE AREN'T PROBLEMS YOU CAN HANDWAVE WITH "FICTIONAL UNIVERSE", IT'S A PROBLEM REGARDING PHYSICAL SPACE AND ANATOMY, YOU COULDN'T EVEN ANIMATE IT.
>>26363072
>it's depicted in game
Where.
>>26363023
We don't know that Samurott on its hindlegs is equivalent to a dog. we don't know Samurott's skeletal structure or its musculature or literally anything about it we would to know to say that it is literally impossible for it to fight with a sword.
>>26363103
When it attacks? And it's taunt in Pokedex 3D
>>26363091
I'm having no trouble picturing it jumping at things with its swords out and slashing. Sure it can't really walk or run on two legs, but it doesn't have to move -while- on its hind legs, it can just unsheath the swords when it strikes and put them back in afterwards.
The fact is it's fucking stupid to hold a sword in one hand while having your other hand planted firmly on the ground.
Sounds stupid, looks stupid, whoever came up with it is fucking dumb. The fact it looks nothing like it's pre-evos and has garbage stats is extra reason to hate it.
Still not as bad as Emboar, though.
>>26363091
It was animations full body attacking with both of its swords. And that wouldn't be it's primary mode of attack at all so it wouldn't need to.be built to do it regularly either. And you're talking about dual wielding those huge scalchop blades. How can you complain about how unrealistic that is when what you're complaining about it not doing is also extremely unrealistic and impractical?
>>26363091
CHILL THE FUCK OUT, DUDE. IT'S JUST A GAME.
>>26363139
Where do you think we are?
>>26362524
>>26362524
God I hope popplio doesnt turn in wotter 2.0
Post the webm of Samurott drawing and then sheathing its sword after evolving in XY.
It singlehandedly displays almost all of Samurott's design flaws.
>>26362524
Stubby legs.
>>26362524
>stubby limbs
>quadruped
>stupid claw hands that look terrible for gripping a sword
>has a horn on hat anyway because its like it has swords or anything
literally everything about it clashes with its main theme, farfetch'd is a better designed swordsman and that's a fucking duck with a leek tucked up its wing
>>26363107
This. There are animals that can function about equally well as both quadrupeds and bipeds. Gorillas, for example. Who is to say that Samurott's musculature, skeleton, etc is more similar to a dog than to something that is equally capably both as a quadruped and a as a biped?
>>26363172
Now as much as I like Samurott in every depiction IRS legs look like absolute shit. I don't think there's any problem with the concept or even with a sword wielding quadruped because there are more impossible things in Pokemon than that. But it's legs and really the torse look really shit and stiff somehow. I haven't been able to actually put into words what exactly is the problem, I just know it looks awful.
With the way dewott was, they could have really took the idea of using the shell swords and ran with it. Guess they decided too dumb it back down to what he is now.
>>26363231
Its neck structure and how its body lies low but parallel to the ground, as well as the resting position of its limbs relative to its body.
>>26363250
where did its sheaths go?
It's not that people hate him, its simply just a misunderstood design. Samurott is literally an ocean's equivalent of an armored warlord. Structured for aquatic combat, armored with ocean material, and loaded with giant shell blades that not just assist the otter on land combat, but also increases it's formidability. Its a shame that Samurott is one of those designs that you wouldn't fully understand at a first glance compared to Dewott. People with one-dimensional minds would just childishly shit on it because is isn't what they expected.
>>26362887
Four legs = Enhanced swimming capabilities. And aren't otters primary quadrupeds anyway? Whats wrong with Samurott being structured like an ACCURATE aquatic mustelid?
>>26362835
>quadrupedal fucking sealion out of nowhere
Samurott lacks the skeletal structure to be considered a pinniped though. Its just a bigger quadrupedal otter.
>>26363250
>they had to make the swords flexy ethereal energy swords while being drawn because otherwise Samurott would literally be incapable of drawing them if they were solid physical objects
>only ever depicted this way in the anime, where Samurott has to be animated with a full range of motion unlike the games
I don't know what this gif was meant to prove, but thanks for exemplifying one of its biggest design flaws.
>>26363256
But we don't actually KNOW what it's underlying physiology would actually allow it to do. It takes more than how it looks. Birds can fly because their bones are hollow. If there bones were like most other animal bones, it'd be impossible, and you wouldn't know that just looking at it. That's the problem with trying to into the realm of realism. we don't have enough information to decide that it is literally impossible.
>>26363302
What's wrong with the swords being made of elemental energy, just like any fucking attack in pokémon ?
>>26363297
Hey, I didn't know it's sword grew. I just assumed it's shell armor had hammerspace.
>>26363307
The bird issue and them having hollow bones is a matter of WEIGHT, a non-visual thing.
Samurott's physiology is a matter of structure. Limb length, range of motion on its joints, it's purely visual. You CAN tell purely from the way its hind legs sit on the ground normally that they don't transition to stand like a human.
>>26363302
Wasn't it evolving in that scene? If that's the scene be was talking about, the swords were probably already in its hands. And I'm pretty sure the energy movement was for a dynamic and fluid animation for a cool scene and not to "hide" anything.
>>26363325
It's a compromise specifically meant to bypass the fact that it's impossible for Samurott to physically draw its swords if they were normal objects (which they're depicted as in the games. The anime had to change they're depiction because Samurott can't be properly animated doing that action if it used the game's depiction)
>>26363341
Lower the Alien skull, as it curves like a real helment would, make the leg things longer, making it obvious he carries swords there, and give it a chest piece
>>26363149
CONSIDERING WHAT THE BOARD HAS BECOME, I'D ASSUME HELL.
>>26363371
>even amazingling drawn fanart can't get away from just how fucking awkward is looks standing upright
>>26363356
But how you can move isn't entirely, and is in fact almost entirely a not visible thing decided by your inner muscles and skeleton and other aspects of your physiology. There are some visual tells but the reason for it is underlying. If you are concerned about how realistic it is for Samurott to do that, how can you decide that without knowing that information?
>>26363371
>is so low crotched it literally can't walk while on two legs
>>26363317
>>26363358
>Samurott "standing"
>it's just sitting on its ass
You know, like a swordsman!
>>26362780i love how tumblr comes here during announcement season
Regardless of the design concept and the physical issues,
I just think samurott's body shape is awkward and clumsy looking. It looks kinda fat and doughy and it's stupid wide stance is goofy.
It has a really small head that is odd and it's helmet reminds me of a Rastafarian hat and why the fuck does it also have a unicorn horn? And it's facial hair seems really unnecessary and at the very least unnecessarily long and dramatic.
>>26363420
What? It looks totally fine in that fanart. It doesn't look any more awkward than Nidoking or Charizard or Typhlosion. Now you could say that's an issue in itself since I don't think Samurott actually looks like that upright but yeah.
Before this they're thread I didn't like him
but the anime gifs have cleared it up for me, it's a great design
>>26363341
>There are faggots who conciser this as 100% accurate
That looks like inaccurate and rushed as shit. Why the fuck is it's upper body slender? Why is the helmet huge and is pointing out it's neck? Why isn't it hunched down to support it's upper body? NO JUST NO.
>>26363407
Even this fan art makes the awkward proportions of the head less dramatic
>>26363457
This
>>26363393
Literally every physical attack in the modern anime is just glowing energy, though. It's not unique to Samurott.
Thanks for showing that you know absolutely nothing about what you're talking about, though.
>>26363448
>being this new
>>26363444
Samurott doesn't have to stand to use one sword. In game it just balances itself on three legs and swings with it and sheathes it immediately which is what those shots are showing.
>>26363502
>trying to fit in this hard
>>26363513
>it just balances itself on three legs and swings with it and sheathes it immediately
Yep, definitely sounds like a very efficient battling strategy.
>>26363467
It looks really cool in motion. Its official art and depictions in game are awful. It looks a little better in XY
>>26363457
>>26363485
>why the fuck does it also have a unicorn horn?
It's a Murex shell. Look it up.
>>26363513
>balances itself on three legs and swings
Now, close your eyes and try to imagine how fucking incovenient and retarded that is
>>26363457
>And it's facial hair seems really unnecessary and at the very least unnecessarily long and dramatic.
Well to be fair that's kind of the joke. But I agree that it's body and legs look really strange. I'm not sure if it's from them trying to mash together a sea lion and otter attributes or because the design is actually designed to make the idea physically work and therefore makes it look really shitty
>>26363529
People greentext each other all the fucking time on calling a Pokemon
>him
or
>her
It's not a tumblr thing at all. It's implying that you want to fuck the pokemon because you really think that it's another gender.
Now fucking kill yourself.
>>26363529
baby I can take whatever you give me
I don't hate it...I just think it belongs in the same evo line as oshawott.
and also female samuwott shouldn't have the moustache and beard.
>>26363550
It only does it for swing and withdraw attacks. It doesn't fight for extended periods with its sword. Its a mixed attacker for a reason. And that would make sense considering its swords are huge, not light and small blades like DeWitt's scalchops probably are.
>>26363537
Looked it up. Interesting thank you. Now I know.
I still think they could have picked a different she'll that didn't have that going on.
>>26363623
I think they used it because it does kind of look like a helmet and having big horn is kind of a Japanese helmet thing.
>>26363589
>Implying
>>26363550
>>26363530
>an aquatic animal isn't the best at terrestial motion
Wow, what a fucking coincidence. Almost every other water starter has the same problem. How the fuck is Empoleon supposed to move when it's a penguin with stubby little legs? Is it going to slide around in its belly like real penguins do, leaving itself completely open to attack? How does Blastoise walk? How does Feraligatr stand? How does Greninja run at sanic speed as a biped?
>>26363548
>scabbard's opening points upwards
>despite this, Samurott pulls its arm across its body, not upward in the direction of its scabbard's opening, and a sword that is too large to physically fit in its scabbard spontaneously appears in its hands at an almost perpendicular angle to it
>Samurott is then relegated to doing a single stationary overhead strike and resheathing it's blade
Good job displaying ALL THE REASONS SAMUROTT'S DESIGN DOESN'T WORK
>>26363604
Its impratcial. The ammount of time to do all that repeatedly is too much.
Should just keep it out as long as necedsary
>>26363161
>>26363250
>swords being unsheathed from the hind legs instead of the front
>front limb scabbards missing
>shell swords are flexible energy instead
???
>>26363645
>missing the point this hard
They all are semi-acquatic animals to start with.
Second, the issue its not it being "aquatic"
The issue is that it is a quadruped trying to use its "hands"
Man, why are Unovabortions so dumb?
>>26363550
How about you make a proper argument instead?
>>26363651
How do you know how the scabbard works? Is there any reason it couldn't come out sideways? The other two had their blades just glued to them and presumably could be drawn from a y angle. How do we know Samurott's blades don't work like that too? We don't know that the pauldrons are literally a sheath. We know it's the aesthetic they're going for but it doesn't mean it literally works like that, especially considering the other two. Yeah it has hammerspace but Pokemon literally live in hammerspace when they go in a Pokeballs so if that's really killing it for you I don't think Pokemon is for you. And the draw, swing , sheathe motion is kind of a samurai trope. It has a name I think but I don't know it.
>>26363641
Sorry anon but I don't follow/care about celebrities so i have no idea who she....he is.
>>26363653
It doesn't have to do it repeatedly. Not in a row anyway if that's what you mean. It has its normal special attacks as well.
>ctrl+f
>"secret sword"
>nothing
Come on now, people. The lack of Secret Sword ruined this starter.
>>26363688
>They all are semi-acquatic animals to start with.
Are you implying an otter isn't semi-aquatic?
>Second, the issue its not it being "aquatic"
>The issue is that it is a quadruped trying to use its "hands"
And the other water starters have their own designs that would make the impossible to function in the real world too. Hell, it's not even just a water starter problem, so many pokemon are oddly designed. But I don't understand why people shit on Samurott so much but no one gives Empoleon or Sentret or any other non-functional designs any flak.
>>26363655
it's hilarious how these 2 actually look somewhat related unlike the 2 preevos.
>2011+5
>Samurott is STILL considered a flawed Dewott evolution
I guess possessing objective shit taste is permanent it seems
>>26363764
The lack of fighting type in the Gen that introduced other fighting type sword attacks and pokemon and lack of shell smash in the Gen that introduced it. So many things went wrong with Samurott.
>>26363764
This needs to happen
>>26363733
...how the fuck is this thing propelling itself through water without body movement?
>>26363704
How about you give me something not retarded to work with?
>>26363787
On the contrary, Samurott's shittiness is totally independent of Dewott and he'd STILL be the worst designed pokemon of all 721 even if he were a stand alone unevolving mon.
>>26363793
I don't know the context of that gif but I'd assume it had some sort of momentum, like it had just dived into the water or something.
>>26363462
How exactly are Charizard, Nidoking and Typhlosion awkward with their posture?
>>26363844
I didn't say they were. What I said was that it didn't look anymore awkward than they did. Compare charizard or Blastoise or something to that image of Samurott
I like it, but I'd like it more if it stood in two legs 24/7.
>>26363849
I actually like Samurott but I would like it 100% more if it did actually look like this
>>26363844
I don't know what that anon was talking about with Charizard or Nidoking, but just fucking look at Typhlosion. It shouldn't be able to stand at all with those tiny feet and short legs. And I say this as someone whose favourite pokemon is Typhlosion. The thing is that I don't have autism and I can accept that in a fictional world, physics don't have to work the same as in our world. So I can appreciate a good design like Typhlosion or Samurott and overlook a few oddities.
>>26363870
Samurott's crotch is so low in that picture that it's legs lie almost parallel to the ground and its hind quarters are touching the ground. It literally couldn't walk like that it would have to swivel its body while dragging its feet across the ground. It looks fucking awful and infinitely worse than Charizard or Nidoking. Do you just not have eyes?
>>26363849
>still not part fighting
sitll that design would certainly be appealing.
>>26363849
That's not official art is it? I already liked Samurott but damn that shit is cool
>>26363889
Typhlosion's design is also shit though.
>>26363849
Why couldn't this have been the final evolution?
>>26363772
>an otter isn't semi-aquatic?
No, i am letting you know that turtles and penguins arent acquatic animals. Acquatic animals are fishes.
>Empoleon or Sentret or any other non-functional designs any flak.
Yeah, but its not their gimmick.
The difference here is how their gimmick is actually unproductive, like doduo being able to fly, or scyther not being able to do so.
Its not wether they work in the real world or not, its wether they defy their own logic or not
>>26363938
Because the artist drew it only after he saw Samurott and realized he hated it as-is.
>>26363961
>Yeah, but its not their gimmick.
>The difference here is how their gimmick is actually unproductive, like doduo being able to fly, or scyther not being able to do so.
>Its not wether they work in the real world or not, its wether they defy their own logic or not
Sentret standing on its tail isn't its gimmick? Really now?
>>26363849
Id like it to be water steel like thisid be fine with 2 in a row if thet were justified like this
>>26363908
Actually compare them. You can say it looks TOTALLY DIFFERENT but it really doesn't. Compare the right to g (his right) to Charizard's. The other legs and it's body in general is low to the ground because of the pose with the one leg stretches all the way out. But compare Charizard's leg to the leg that's bent in the image. The difference is not very large at all.
>>26363961
How is it defying it's own logic? Has Pokemon established itself as a world where a quadrupedal animal couldn't wield a sword?
>>26363980
>Sentret standing on its tail isn't its gimmick? Really now
>missing the point this hard
I never said it wasnt
That is its gimmick, and it makes sense.
It would have the issue that samurott does if its tail was the same way as the one of a rabbit
>>26363992
Except you know, for the fact that Charizard's leg meets its body nearly parallel AND it's leg is also perpendicular to the ground, so it could raise them. In the other picture Samurott is the complete opposite, its legs are parallel to the ground and perpendicular to its body. It couldn't physically raise them off of it.
>>26363589
Do you think female goats shouldn't have a beard either?
>>26363992
Nidoking as well for comparison
>>26364041
Yes idiot. Quadrupeds can't viably wields swords FULL STOP, regardless of "b-but muh fictional universe" or not because the anatomy simply prohibits it from even being depicted visually.
>>26364058
>>26364049
Do you understand how rigid Sentret's tail would have to be to support its body like that? Yet it clearly isn't rigid, because it can manipulate it just fine otherwise.
>>26362524
I think it's because it d look so much better if it was depicted how it is in the amine but as is looks like a big dumb dog
>>26364055
No no i just prefer pokes to not look prodominatly like one gender or the other. Same for female emboar, male braixen/delphox
>>26364069
But that's factually wrong. It's been depicted right in the games. And even if it hadn't, there's no realistic reason to think it would physically be unable to do so. We know quadrupeds can balance on 3 legs, and we know some can even stand up on 2 for a small amount of time. And we don't know the physiology of a Samurott to know that it is unable to do either.
>>26364097
>it's been depicted right in the games
THE GAMES EXPLICITLY DEPICT ITS INABILITY TO FUNCTIONALLY WIELD A SWORD.
>>26362524
He's the only thing in his line that actually looks good, in fact. I don't understand how people can hate clown seal but not clown otter.
>>26363465
>>26363733
At first the positioning of its hind legs relative to its tail made no sense to me; wide, flat tails are usually used for forward propulsion, but Samurott's legs would get in the way of that motion, and its short tail wouldn't have a lot of power.. But after thinking a bit, I realized that its wide stance while on land lends itself to a swimming style like a breaststroke. In this context the tail could be used to control depth, but its hind legs would likely get in the way while diving.
tldr I questioned Samurott's ability to swim at all, and concluded it does alright. It's probably just not good at swimming downwards. So there's one not completely shit aspect of Samurott's design: it can swim.
>>26364108
No they don't. How can they show it and show that it's unable to at the same time? I already replied to a post criticizing it's depiction in game earlier.
>>26364125
Refer to
>>26363651
and
>>26363091
>>26363530
Yes it can hold and swing a sword, but it can't actually sword fight. It can't be a swordsman, or competently perform actual swordsmanship like the samurai it's based on.
>>26364041
>Has Pokemon established itself as a world where a quadrupedal animal couldn't wield a sword?
I meant defying the logic of its own gimmick
It is unpractical for a samurai to have limited access to its hands and weaponry.
Pokemon is a fictional, logical universe.
>>26364076
You are planning on ignoring everything I say, right?
It makes sense conceptually, if its tail was 1 inch big, it would make no sense.
When i see sentret, it makes SENSE, seeing a samurai having its movement limited because they decided to make him a quadruped, makes no sense
>>26364125
Also, I mean, think about it. This design could have been anything they wanted. If they thought it was literally impossible and couldn't depict it well enough in game and the anime, why would they have designed it that way? They could have easily done another slightly different design to better accommodate it.
>>26364173
But the only reason you complain about Samurott is because his body doesn't make physical sense, according to you. You don't see how he could swing a sword or stand upright or whatever.
I don't see how Sentret could stand on its tail.
>>26364178
That doesn't make any sense. That implies that it's impossible for the design to be bad because it's in the game, because if it were bad it wouldn't have made it into the game. That's both pathetic circular logic and implying Masuda is an infallible designer.
>>2636416
and my reply >>26363732
It doesn't have to swordfight in the way you're meaning it. Number one it isn't exactly fighting a lot of opposing samurai, and number two it isn't it's only form of of attack. It's stats pin it as a mixed attacker. That means it's competent with special attacks as well. It doesn't have to attack with its swords all the time.
>>26362553
>>26363925
>shitting on pokemon designs
A reminder to get a load of this
>Samurottfags post gifs to prove their points
>blow themselves the fuck out and prove the opposition right
Just another day on /vp/.Samurott is the single worst designed pokemon of all 721. And by a wide margin as well.
>>26364192
>sentret standing on its tail-
Thats on the same tier as Alakazam bending spoons with his mind.
>4-legged samurai
On the same tier as doduo using its two heads to fly.
Sentrer standing on its tail just means that it is pure, and strong muscle. Samurott's gimick is just a deisadventage for its own design
>>26364199
I didn't say anything about that. What I did say was that game designers generally don't put things they cant actually make work in games. They had total control over this design. It could have been anything. If someone designed this and went "this can't work, it's impossible", especially for people who need to animate it like artists who do game art or concept art for the anime, they can change it. And clearly they thought it worked. You can't draw a comparison to anything else because that's what I'm saying and not about people being unable to make bad game mechanics or something. It's character design basics. It's why gen 1 pokemon don't have many different details and colors in their designs that dbe hard to depict on the small and colot limited screen, or why Pokemon designs nowadays have so many extra details that aren't readily apparent in its " default" look, because they can be animated to show it in game now (which is why the Samurott line has its seashell sword motif, for example).
>>26364192
>Sentret: 13 lbs.
It's seriously unbelievable that a flexible limb could hold up a 13 pound animal for a bit? Be it by muscle, interlocking cartilage/bone, or some other means. You know we have heavier monkeys that hang around on their tails right?
I guess I should congratulate you on successfully deflecting from the Samurott debate, but I couldn't resist calling out such nonsense.
>>26364275
They thought it worked, but it didn't. This isn't hard to grasp.
>>26364271
>>4-legged samurai
>On the same tier as doduo using its two heads to fly.
>Sentrer standing on its tail just means that it is pure, and strong muscle. Samurott's gimick is just a deisadventage for its own design
How do you make that distinction? How do you know Samurott doesn't have strong back leg muscles ornlight upperbpdy muscle structure, or special joints that allow it to use its swords? Once you go "well obviously sentret has strong tail muscles", you are using exactly the same justification.
>>26364303
But they literally had to animate it and make concept art for how it worked. They didn't just draw one picture of it and then go "oops, it doesn't actually work!" after finalizing everything.
>>26364365
see
>>26362874
>>26363651
It's depiction in game is comprised entirely of compromises because it couldn't be shown properly, an explicit example of the design's failure.
>>26362594
I like Samurott and Blaziken
>>26363548
Why didn't they retcon Samurott to be bipedal like they did with Purrloin?
>>26364402
But that's not a very probable result. This is like assuming someone made the one drawing and everyone went "whoa cool!" and put it in the game and then everyone afterwards realized it needed to attack with a sword. Do you really think that was how its design process went down? We even know Samurott was chronologically designed last in its line so it's not like theyade Oshawott and then made Samurott and hadn't figured out they wanted it to use a sword yet.
>>26364430
I can't think of a single other Pokémon that grows a part so cartoonishly. It's obviously meant to be badass, but it just looks stupid and lazy for the sword to grow like it does.
Even the Iaijutsu argument doesn't work since that's supposed to be efficient, and Samurott does that dumbass pose before slashing.
>>26364334
>How do you make that distinction?
Samurott is straight up unpractical.
He has to awkwardly stand on 2 feet like a dog, or wobble on 3 legs.
A samurais have long swords, and need full movibility to be precise with their attacks. Being 4 legged limits the size of its swords, and makes it so its awkward to attack.
Sentret, on the other hand, is 13 pounds. I am going to be nice to you and believe in your abilities to put that together
>>26364484
The pose is just to show off the sword. Iaijutsu (is that what what I was talking about is called?) is meant to be fast and efficient but the animators probably just wanted to show off his sword and sword wielding pose. But the iaijutsu thing was just justification for it drawing and then immediately putting away the sword which would.mean it doesn't have to walk around with the sword out.
>>26364519
But we don't know that Samurott struggles to get up on two legs or balance on 3.Just like we don't know that Sentret's tail is actually muscular enough to hold it up. But we see that it does, and we see that Samurott xan draw and attack with a sword on 3 legs and apparentlt even fight on two for some amount of time. In botg instances wr have only what's depicted to go off of. Samurott isn't a dog. Heck it isn't even based on one particular animal.
>>26364527
Yeah, but it looks stupid. Iaijutsu is a quick-draw technique, and the pose is wasted time. It doesn't matter that they wanted to show off the cool shell sword, it runs counter to what the creature is supposedly trying to do.
>>26364421
I hope that its because they'll make it bipedal with a mega
>>26364470
>but that's not a very probable result
But there ISN'T any discussion of possibilities going on here. Samurott's design DOESN'T work in the game, it's observable currently here and now!
>>26362524
Give him a sweet ass Mega Evolution, problem solved.
>>26364594
Nobody "proved" it doesn't work in game. Unless the hammerspace sword being too big to actually fit beneath his pauldrons really tickles your autism that much but the swords could have just been smaller. Its a pretty small thing to ruin it for you. Does Pokemon going into Pokeballs trigger you? What about spontaneously generating leaves or vines for those attacks?
>>26364573
>Samurott xan draw and attack with a sword on 3 legs and apparentlt even fight on two for some amount of time.
Yes. Thats my point- limited mobility. Thank you for repeting what i said.Yes, we know what its based on
WHY THE FUCK IS IT A QUADRAPED?
>>26364638
samurott is a river otter though. Sea lions don't have tails.
>>26364638
But it's mobility while wielding a sword is irrelevant. It doesn't thave to have the sword drawn to move, and it draws the sword when it wants to attack with it then puts it up so that it can move. The samurai drawimg ita swprs foe an attsc, defeating all hia enemies, and immediately wothdrawing it is a really common motif. It might not be able to literally move with the sword out very well like a real samurai but that wasnt the aspect they wanted to get across. If it needs to be mobile, it has its projectile attacks that its just as proficient if not more so at using.
>>26364730
>The samurai drawimg ita swprs foe an attsc, defeating all hia enemies, and immed
Sorry, just kill me now. Gonna go the way of the samurai and commit seppuku.
>>26364657
anatomically they shouldn't have a tail but the designers themselves said it's based on a sea lion.
Take that as you will.
>>26364779
I'll take that as me being wrong. My bad.
>>26364657
River otters don't have long, doglike snouts
>>26364779
So....an otter turns into a sea lion thing randomly? That doesn't make sense. why? how?
I think Samurott is okay. I think the mono typing is what always made it boring for me.
As far as vp is concerned, I really wouldnt worry about it. vp loves to focus fire pokemon just out of spite.
Disliking a pokemon is one thing, thats fine, we all have our own personal tastes.
Going into every thread you can find and posting hate about said pokemon even if that thread has nothing to do with it, or attacking a thread meant to celebrate the enjoyment of that pokemon is where you see the typical 4chan mentality.
Samurott has weird body proportions, but considering how many pokemon float for no reason and a lot of the other weird shit you find in pokemon, its not as bad as most make it out to be.
Just like what you like.
>>26364803
fish turns into Octopus in Gen2, shit's been whack for a while.
>>26364820
Yeah octillery was weird but we never had THAT level of evo jump for years.
>>26364730
>It might not be able to literally move with the sword out very well like a real samurai.
Thats the issue. He is extremely awkward at close combat. He cant use his swords very well when up close.
He cant run while holding them, so uses projectiles.
Can you now see how innept of a samurai he is?
>>26364803
Gamefreak doesn't like to make starters just bigger versions. Ohmura said in an interview that once he made Dewott he was stumped how to continue its evolution. He saw a sea lion show and it inspired him to make Samurott. It's not all sea lion but it's not all otter either. It's an amalgam. Many Pokemon aren't just one animal. Mudkip line isn't just an axolotl/mudpuppy but also takes fins from mudskippers. Not the first time starter changes species either. Cyndaquil is like 5 or 6 different animals through its entire line.
>>26364820
>gun turns into cannon
fixed that for you
>>26364856
He can use the swords just fine up close. There's no reason to think he can't. Hed have to waddle up to something in the first place but otherwise it's fine. It then does the unshewthe/slash/wishdraw m
pattern to attack with it. It isn't literally a samurai of course. It's just meant to embody certain aspects.
>>26364866
yeah but we talking anatomy son.
>>26362524
If he was water/steel at least and was a bit faster he'd be great.
I know we had water/steel before, but game freak thought it'd be okay to have fire fighting three times in a row, fuck them.
>>26364858
So...artists block?
I can understand that but I'm the kind of guy who prefers for starters evo families to look similar to each other.
kanto starters
johto starters
hoenn starters
sinnoh starters
Snivy tepig
kalos starters(kinda)
All still look like they're related to each other.
>>26364885
>He can use the swords just fine up close. There's no reason to think he can't. Hed have to waddle up to something in the first place but otherwise it's fine. It then does the unshewthe/slash/wishdraw m
>pattern to attack with it.
If he stands on three legs, its really easy to blindside him on the side with the front leg down, since hed have no reach.
On two feet, he cant propperly manouver. He literally would need to swing, sheeth, accomodate itslef, take the sword out again.
He couldnt do pic related.
(Dont get me wrong, samurott is mt fav of the three, but they missed, BY A LOT)
>>26364938
Torchic looks nothing like Blaziken asides from color scheme and being birdlike
>>26364938
I actually think artist's block was the exact words used in the interview
>>26364952
Why would he get blindsided when Pokemon battles are one an one and when they aren't he has other Pokemon to protect his flank? He doesn't have to be able to do everything a real samurai can do. It's a samurai sea lion.
>>26365006
>Why would he get blindsided
Simply moving to his side while he needs to wiggle, or sheeth his sword back
He is a samurai sea lion because for soem fucking reason they thought itd be a good idea to get it on all 4 one of the sudden. If bipedal he could do all a samurai can, AND more
>>26364996
Touche though torchic at least shares its color scheme with combusken and Blaziken.
>>26365045
Chicken -> standing, kicking chicked -> BIGGER standing chicken.
Combusken is the awkward, middle link
>>26365042
Oh fair enough I'm not saying he shouldn't have been bipedal. I'm just saying that it makes as much sense as it needs to and it dowant really look that bad xonceptually imo though I agrre it looks awful in its official art necause of its legs or something. It isn't literally a samurai so it shouldn't need to be able to do everything a samurai can do. Dewott can't even use its blades like samurai swords. They don't make any sense used that way. But I do think Samurott should have been bipedal.
![12157269605_fdda3b4ce3_o[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/OnO0JTe.jpg "12157269605_fdda3b4ce3_o[1].jpg")
It's four legged because they wanted it to be a samurai mounted on horseback
It's also why it has a giant bushy mustache.
>>26365107
The biggest issue is that they had set a premisse- he was heading to be bipedal, and last minute they made him less proficient at its craft.
Thats the reason thst makes me feel dissappointed on samurott
>Dewott can't even use its blades like samurai swords. They don't make any sense used that way.
It looks like a samurai kid, or a samurai on training. Like he cant use Katanas yet
>>26362553
Brah he was lead in the PWT CHAMPIONS tournament. Don't talk shit about his stats.
>>26362524I want to fuck a female samurott while I stroke her whiskers
>>26362524
dumbass hat, absolutely retarded looking beard that comes out of the corner of its jaw, big v for a tail, different personality from facial expression than its prevos. Its terrible.
>>26362531
Is there any art of Oshawott getting abused/murdered?
>>26363655
That shameless tracing tho
>>26365166
But Dewott has many of the same issues that you believe Samurott has. Just look at its feet for a second - you honestly believe that with those short legs and flipper-feet that it could run on land well? At best it could do a short waddle towards someone. And that's honestly even worse than the flaws you believe Samurott has, because given Dewotts tiny arms and short scalchops its reach is horribly, so it would have to be fast to make up for it.
Samurott makes a lot more sense as a sword fighter. It runs to its opoonent on all 4's, which it could do much, much faster than Dewott could, quickly unsheathes its sword, and whacks the enemy. Again, sheathing/unsheathing is a samurai motif. Have you ever played Monster Hunter, for example? In that game you can get an upgrade that gives you a large damage bonus on your first hit after unsheathing when using the greatsword. Does it make for the most efficient fighting style in real life? No, but it's damn cool and part of the Samurai motif.
And don't forget that Samurott can also Megahorn the opponent with its helmet a la a cavalry charge, another part of his Samurai motif.
>>26362524
The neck and "chest" look like ass.
