While I'm not 100% opposed to the Zygarde formes appearing in S/M, it's not like anime exclusive formes/mutations are a new concept.
>>25968297
>Only two out of four on pic is actually related
Come on anon, you can do better than this.
Saying that SpaceshipGenesect is an alternate form is like saying Samurott with unsheated swords is a form
>>25968335
What? That literally makes no sense.
Genesect literally changes its entire body shape when it goes into that car forme. Samurott visibly has swords on it's body, so unsheathing them is only natural.
>>25968325
They're all mutations exclusive to the anime.
>>25968297
Are you the same fag from the Zygarde thread who thinks the forms will not be in the games? WHY WOULD THEY PUSH HIM SO MUCH? I bet he's getting a post-game like the delta episode.
>>25968411
Okay so it's like saying sandshrew curved into a ball is a different form.
The transformation is a function of genesect, even if you can't see it happen in game.
>>25968411
Genesect doesn't change its body shape. That's like saying you enter a different form when you curl up in the fetal position.
Nothing's grown or shrunk or appeared or changed color. It's just in a different position. The only parallel there is with Aegislash, but Aegislash has those two forms because it works in battle in an interesting way.
>>25968440
Sandshrew Pokedex description
>To protect itself from attackers, it curls up into a ball. It lives in arid regions with minimal rainfall.
None of Genesect's Pokedex entries say it can turn into a flying car, and none other piece of media except the anime and (I think) the TCG depict it doing so. It's an anime exclusive forme.
Again, I'm not saying Zygarde's formes aren't going to appear in S/M, I'm just saying that it wouldn't surprise me.
>>25968411
Genesect is in its car form when you send it out in Gen VI. It unfolds as it goes onto the battlefield.
>>25968440
you actually can when you send Genesect into battle
>>25968411
>They're all mutations exclusive to the anime.
Genesect was literally it's shiny design ergo not anime exclusive.
We know nothing of Ash Greninja regarding the games, it might be advertising a pseudo customization mechanic for the starters.
The other two were anime exclusive. As for Zygarde however we already know that it isn't anime exclusive because it has made appearances in several side games and the TCG.
Think before you post.
>>25968478
>several side games and the TCG.
???
Why does that mean anything? Ash Ketchum's Pikachu, Jessie and James, and an evil version of Professor Oak have also appeared in the TCG and spin off games. That means nothing.
>>25968478
>it has made appearances in several side games and the TCG
The same applies to Ash-Greninja as well.
>>25968297
Doesn't Genesect turn into the ship form for its intro/exit animation or do I have that wrong?
>>25968458
this
>>25968493
Are you implying a completely regular Pikachu that happens to have its trainer's name specified, Jessie and James, and Oak are TCG/anime exclusives?
>>25968493
>Why does that mean anything? Ash Ketchum's Pikachu, Jessie and James, and an evil version of Professor Oak have also appeared in the TCG and spin off games. That means nothing.
>obvious proof that they aren't anime exclusive
>NUH UH
Really.
You're going to be like that?
If you want to argue semantics too I suppose Ash's Pikachu had appeared in several games through events on top of the fact that Pikachu uses the anime cry now.
>>25968496
>>25968458
>>25968469
Just watched it's animation again, and no, it isn't in it's car forme when entering the battle.
When it's sent out, it's back area (the huge drive segment of it's body) is stuck to it's back, before folding out when it hits the ground. It's not the car forme at all, it's legs and arms are even sticking out.
>>25968297
Ash Greninja is coming to Pokemon Shuffle, they're not anime exclusives.
>>25968539
*and Zygarde 10% was added
>>25968507
>a completely regular Pikachu that happens to have its trainer's name specified
Come on now, that's just desperate
>>25968511
>obvious proof that they aren't anime exclusive
What are you talking about? Where's the proof? Unless ''my opinion is right and you're wrong'' is proof, then you got me good.
>>25968457
>None of Genesect's Pokedex entries say it can turn into a flying car, a
Yet when you send it out in gen 6 Its folded like the pic you put
Its in the game
>>25968297
Don't forget them OP
>>25968554
see:
>>25968526
Find it on Youtube yourself if you don't believe me
>>25968545
>that's just desperate
Fucking how? Ash's Pikachu is literally a regular, common Pikachu you can find everywhere. Why the fuck are you comparing it to alternate forms like Ash-Greninja and the Zygardes?
>>25968565
>Ash's Pikachu
>Ash's
>Ash
>As in, Ash Ketchum
>As in, Ash Only-Appears-in-the-anime Ketchum
My point is, anime exclusive characters can and always WILL appear in the trading card game. Cause and effect, if an anime character appears in the TCG, that means nothing for the games.
The TCG exists in it's own spectrum of the franchise, featuring characters from both the TV show and the games to offer more cards to collect.
>>25968411
There are youtube videos of genesect figures that change between forms
>>25968554
This. Its animation seals the deal. Genesect car form isn't even like a form change or anything. It's no different than Honedge sheathing itself or Blastoise curling up into its shell.
>>25968590
>anime exclusive characters can and always WILL
Except for the majority of different coloured pokemon and such.
That said it's not only the TCG we're taking about here, it's also tretta, picross, shuffle and so on.
Games where anime exclusive things have yet to appear and have no reason to.
Also your logic is eerily similar to the idiot that thought Groudon and Kyogre's new formes were stylistic choices rather than real forms.
>>25968556
>Mewtwo wearing armor and a Mismagius mimicking the appearance of a Ray are considered formes
>>25968590
The point is that Ash-Greninja, Zygarde 10%, Cell, Core and Complete are completely different forms, who have been advertised as such. Their existence in multiple side games and in other aspects of the franchise like the an entire anime arc, the TCG and Tretta can't reasonably be compared to Crystal Onix, Venustoise or Ash's fucking Pikachu.
But sure, if you honestly believe shit like Team Rocket's Meowth having gotten some random TCG cards years ago is in the same level of attention that Ash-Greninja and Zygarde forms have been gettting, and thus an UNDENIABLE proof that their existence in multiple parts of the franchise means absolutely nothing regarding their "canon" existence in the main games, then sure.
>>25968631
>That said it's not only the TCG we're taking about here, it's also tretta, picross, shuffle and so on.
But spin off games will always have a loose continuity, just like the TCG. Pokemon Puzzle League, Pokemon Snap, and like you mentioned Pokemon Tretta, all have strong links to the anime and it's universe.
Heck, Tretta even features Ash Ketchum himself.
>the idiot that thought Groudon and Kyogre's new formes were stylistic choices rather than real forms
not sure what you're talking about there, but trust me, I'm not that stupid.
>>25968297
That isn't an alternate form. Is just Genesect laying down like the insect it is.
>>25968654
You act as if I'm completely 100% against Zygarde EVER appearing in a main series game. I'm not. I've made that abundantly clear.
But what I'm saying is, anime exclusive mutations aren't a new thing, and even though Zygarde's new formes are being pushed heavily, this is no indication towards some huge aspect of Sun and Moon.
In factm Zygarde's heavy presence in the spin-off franchises as of late is most likely Game Freak compensating for a lack of a third version, so they're making money off more aspects from the Gen 6 world via spin offs. Gen 7 is on it's way, and it just seems a little unlikely that these formes, which have ONLY appeared in spin off material heavily linked to the anime, will be major players in wherever Gen 7 is based.
Okay, have any of the other "anime only" pokemon also appeared as a bona fide pokemon card you can play? (note this is to exclude trainer cards or any other types of cards in the TCG, only the pokemon cards
>>25968691
>this is no indication towards some huge aspect of Sun and Moon
We're not discussing whether or not that shitty frog or the Zygarde forms will have an important role in the games, we're just arguing if they'll actually EXIST in the games.
It's debatable if they'll be relevant, but at this point, thinking they'll never ever be available in mainline games is completely retarded.
>>25968661
Not him but you are aware that having characters from the anime doesn't make it a strong connection right?
More often than not it's there as a recognisable face and sound in arcades and such for it to stand out.
That said the difference between Zygarde and things like Crystal Onix is that Zygarde is being advertised in every facet of the franchise at the moment and not only has movie appearances but an ongoing anime arc and game appearances the crystal Onix was a one shot and subsequently forgotten.
Also Ash doesn't make an appearance in Tretta only Ash Greninja does.
Man it'll be great when Ash-Greninja or whatever it'll be called by then will be in the next games, the butthurt will be glorious.
>>25968735
>Also Ash doesn't make an appearance in Tretta only Ash Greninja does.
http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Ash-Greninja_%28Z2-06%29
And that's just one of the many anime character appearances in Tretta.
>>25968735
It's heavy appearances in the anime are noted, but the fact that we're not getting a third version for X/Y is most likely why Zygarde is getting all this attention, not the other way round (or anything similar to that)
>>25968736
Anon, it literally has Ash Ketchum's furry sideburns
Also
>rage faces
Please leave
>>25968691
>Gen 7 is on it's way, and it just seems a little unlikely that these formes, which have ONLY appeared in spin off material heavily linked to the anime, will be major players in wherever Gen 7 is based
Despite the fact that Zygarde already has strong connections to sun and moon.
Your evidence now however is based entirely on the fact that it hasn't made an appearance within the games that haven't been released yet as well, knowing full well that any pokemon this heavily advertised is being set up for a game appearance.
See: Lucario, Zoroark, Mega Mewtwo and so on
At this point you'd have a better time convincing people Margearna is anime exclusive because it's strictly an anime mon at the moment.
Oh and the spin off games aren't heavily linked to the anime, the only link so far in the recent games are Ash Greninja and I don't think Ash has made an appearance within them either.
>>25968495
I don't know why some of you like to make this comparison between Ash Greninja and the Zygarde forms to say that their both anime exclusive. Literally the Greninja is called ASH Greninja, they wanted us to know that this thing would be for the anime. There has been no evidence whatsoever that would suggest these Zygarde forms would be anime exclusive, so it would be stupid to assume that.
>>25968779
>strong connections
>le matching colors maymay
>>25968772
>And that's just one of the many anime character appearances in Tretta.
That's on the card, not the actual game.
And it's only making an appearance there due to the connection to Ash.
Ash doesn't actually make an appearance in Tretta. Using that same logic Ash's Pikachu can be found within the main games through events and Alain is canon despite the fact that we know they aren't.
>in tcg, tretta, pricross, shuffle
>zygarde has lowered bst compared to xerneas and yveltal the same way kyurem had lowered bst compared to reshiram and zekrom
>two moves it still doesn't have access to the same way kyurem had two moves it didn't have access to before bw2
>hurr its forme isn't going to be in the next game guys, these one episode random anime shit is proof
Holy shit you're retarded. Think whatever you want of what gen SM is but Complete Zygarde WILL be in the games.
>>25968790
>I don't know why some of you like to make this comparison between Ash Greninja and the Zygarde forms
Probably because they were announced together, and whenever one of them was made available somewhere, the others followed soon after?
But I don't believe they're anime-exclusive, though. That'd be stupid. Ash-Greninja is probably just a placeholder name like Awakened Mewtwo. I bet it'll be some special snowflake "mega" that goes by a different name, like Primals.
>>25968772
The only one who needs to leave is you because those aren't part of the rage faces family, newfag.
Well this would go into the argument of what is and is not anime based and why. Chances are, you won't even agree on that. Is there even the footage comprehensive enough to tell if there's anything like that in the game itself or not?
>>25968811
>being this late to the discussion
You're the retard here, I'm afraid. Nearly every single thing you mentioned has been discussed thoroughly already in the thread. Your presence is not wanted.
>>25968808
But the issue is, it's still called ''Ash Greninja'', it's still got Ash's hairstyle, and whether or not Ash appears in game or not, his presence is obviously noted because Ash's face is still on the card.
>Using that same logic Ash's Pikachu can be found within the main games through events and Alain is canon despite the fact that we know they aren't.
Not sure if that's the same logic honestly. That sounds like a massive stretch on your part. We know events to promote movies aren't canon, and we know the Alain thing was just a reference added in the localization.
>>25968825
>That'd be stupid. Ash-Greninja is probably just a placeholder name like Awakened Mewtwo. I bet it'll be some special snowflake "mega" that goes by a different name, like Primals.
Calling it now Synchro evolution available only for the gen 6 and 7 starters, designs change depending on what you're wearing and what your hairstyle is.
>>25968851
Required: screenie of the JP text of that exact instance and a translation thereof.
>>25968851
>That sounds like a massive stretch on your part.
Okay
Tretta - Ash is on the card but doesn't make an appearance in the game
Event - Ash is mentioned on the wonder card and is the OT of the Pikachu but never actually seen
There's more of a connection with the event in all honesty because it's actually within the game.
As for Alain, the mega evolution special is referenced within the game.
>>25968851
>Nearly every single thing you mentioned has been discussed thoroughly already in the thread
And yet not a single good counterargument has been given for it. Hooray!
>>25968851
>and we know the Alain thing was just a reference added in the localization.
The only difference is the way Steven mentioned Charizard. Aside from that the line is the same in every version in every region and they're all activated with the event Beldum
>>25968878
it's still a just reference to the anime, and not a confirmation tho. No way am I going to deal with the anime and the games both being real at the same time
>>25968736
I thought it was just a meme at this point and no one actually thought they wouldn't be in S/M, but I guess I underestimated people's stupidity.
>>25968903
But as I said, it's still called ''Ash Greninja''
Ash Greninja = Ash Ketchum. The fact that Ash doesn't appear directly changes nothing. Ash doesn't appear in either Tretta or the main series games, but we know that Tretta has heavy links to the anime for many reasons, namely Ash Greninja's appearance, and the nature in which events are generally distributed. Remember the shiny legendary Suicune/Entei/Raiku they gave out? They were important in the movie, but they don't exist canonically within the games.
>>25968925
That's kind of the point we're trying to make, a small reference like Alain in the games and Ash on the Tretta card are meaningless especially when the character in question doesn't make an appearance within the game itself.
>>25968969
>But as I said, it's still called ''Ash Greninja''
Irrelevant, that's a placeholder and you know it just like mega mewtwo being a "new" pokemon.
Okay, here's my assessment based on my knowledge alone. People seem to believe that "anime only" pokemon appear outside the anime all the time. THEY DON'T. None of them have, not a single one. Not even in the anime based games. As for pokemon touted as or modeled after pokemon belonging to anime characters, I excluded that matter due to semantics. Of course anime related pokemon would appear in anime related games. Technically, there have been distributions for the anime's pokemon for the main series as well. Basically, mitigating circumstances prevents me from using that as a basis for anything. I only focused on pokemon possessing a form or appearance that has otherwise not been seen anywhere else, and I didn't find it anywhere.
>>25968559
That's how its flying appearance is, though. You're just seeing it from a different angle
>>25969020
>I only focused on pokemon possessing a form or appearance that has otherwise not been seen anywhere else, and I didn't find it anywhere.
I hope you aren't OP.
Reminder that going by Ash-Greninja's lore, its original name was "Hero Greninja" and it existed centuries before Ash was even born, which means its association with Ash's name is purely for marketing purposes.
So it doesn't have "Ash's hair", that's just a coincidental resemblance that made an already shit-looking pokémon even worse.
1. Genesect transforming is not changing its Forme.
2. Venustoise was a hallucination by Gastly.
3. The Ash Greninja is stupid and modern anime and I won't defend that.
4. The diamond Onix comes directly from its Gen 1 or Gen 2 Pokedex data where it says something to the effect of Onix becoming diamondlike after living a long time.
>>25969057
I'm not, and the matter that I didn't find any of the other "anime exclusive" pokemon anywhere else would suggest the Zygarde forms and Greninja will appear in the main series at some point.
Masuda later in the year: "surprise it was always Mega-Greninja!"
>>25968556
I actually really wish they gave carbink different forms.
Don't have to be any stat changes, but it was a nice touch
In b4 pink pokemon and baby nidoqueens
>>25969113
I forgot about the baby nidoqueens, shit is hilarious
It would require more models or more textures. All take up more memory.
>>25969127
How is that relevant?
>>25968411
But anon, the crystal onix debuted in a special edition pokemon game.
>>25969174
Naranja is a hack you fuckwit
>>25969057
OP here, and no, it isn't me. Not sure why they made it sound like it was. I don't disagree with them though.
I abandoned this thread a while ago. I bought a spares and repairs guitar online and now it's just arrived, I'm trying to fix it.
>>25968772
>Ash doesn't actually make an appearance in Tretta
>>25970271
Not sure why you didn't just reply to the person they were quoting
>>25969118
It was only because they were babies of clones.
>>25971264
It's hilarious because Nidoqueen can't breed in the first place.
>>25971302
Why else do you think it was cloned
>>25968297
Venustoise is in no way a form, it's simply a stupid joke made by Gastly in that one episode.
>>25968556
Rayquaza possessed by misdreavus is not a form and mewtwo in an exoskeleton are NOT forms.... The carbinks would have been cool to see in game (like gourgeist' forms) but comparing them to Zygarde is apples to oranges or apples to whatever the furthest thing from an apple is
>>25968539
ash-geninja is also in the TCG now, and the zygarde formes are coming next set.
if ash greninja in in s/m i will kms
