http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/oras-ou-suspect-process-round-6-voting.3569720/page-9#post-6762702
rip
good riddance
*Stalls you for 1000 turns*
...Nothin personnel...
http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/oras-ou-viability-ranking-thread-v4-see-post-1254-page-51.3553516/
inb4 stall
>>25958660
A lot of us had the feeling that Hoopa-U was going to be banned before it was even officially released. Granted it took a long ass time, but they were right.
Now we have to look at what post-Unbound OU looks like and how it will perform in Ubers.
>>25958660
long live stall!
I've been out of the competitive loop for ages. Since before Unbound's release. Explain to me this "stall" and what made Unbound so OP that it was worthy of a ban?
Alright someone give me the most stally list I need to troll the shit out of showdown with this
>>25958660
Rip in peas wallbreaker supreme
>>25958790
hoopa has a lot of strong moves, really good offenses and I think his signature move (dont quote me) can lower defense?
so it was used to break annoying walls
You could have prevented this.
>>25958790
it completely destroyed stall, a play style focused on making you lost your time
thank Arceus
fuck Hoopa-U
>>25958790
Essentially, people use Pokemon with bullshit defenses, alternating between Protect, Detect, and recovery moves in order to make the battle last as long as possible, and win using status damage.
Hoopa's signature move hits through Protect, thus providing one of the few counters to this strategy. Smogon did not like this, and thus they banned a Pokemon with poor defenses, speed, and a x4 weakness to Bug and a x2 weakness to the ever-present fairy type.
>>25958790
Stall is minimizing the strength and mobility of opposing pokemon through huge defenses and indirect damage.
Stall in OU does not have a reliable answer for Hoopa Unbound, as it is extremely strong and has a large amount of viable attack and boosting options.
>>25958860
offense fag Detected
>>25958895
Trick Room, actually.
>>25958778
"Long Live" indeed
>>25958801
>>25958803
>>25958860
>>25958885
Well shit. Watching a battle drag on for a near hour is part of the reason I dropped out of competitive battling. And Smogon went ahead and banned something that can actually counter this kind of cancerous gameplay?
What's your excuse for still playing competitive Pokémon then, huh?
>>25958925
I don't play by Smogon's rules.
>>25958925
I play in UU where the cancer is slightly less malignant
I fucking hate stall and think stallfags are cancerous shitheads, but Hoopa-Unbound deserved to get banned.
It's movepool was WAY too varied, and it's attacking stats were stupid high.
>>25958860
>poor defenses
It's special defense is great though.
>x4 weakness to bug
Not a huge deal, considering bug-type moves in OU aren't super prominent.
>smogonscrubs changing their meme rules for the 50th time
simulators were a mistake
>>25958949
>Not a huge deal, considering bug-type moves in OU aren't super prominent.
>What is U-Turn
I hope the faggots who voted for a Hoopa-U ban are cursed to play against nothing but +500 turns of stallfaggotry for the rest of their lives, so that they know exactly which playstyle this shitty ban helped the most.
>>25958925
I mostly play VGC and doubles. Sometimes i'll play one of the fake other metas if they're interesting enough.
There's two things ticking people off here. One is that it appears that Smogon is making a lot of caveats specifically for Stall to continue existing. The other is that Stall is popularly seen as the most unattractive playstyle to battle against, due to the time it takes and seemingly moving against the nature of how battles are "supposed" to be played.
>>25958968
The people that voted ban on Hoopa are exactly the people that play and enjoy stall.
>>25958968
And that's why I'm stallspamming up to the ladder to show'em :^)
I legitimately never had an issue with hoopa but I run hyper offensive so it was pretty easy to bonk him whenever he showed up.
I know that there are a lot of factors involved in this, but it does feel like another instance of where stall players are catered to. I never ran him so I really don't care.
All I know is that he's going to be absolutely shat on in ubers
>>25958949
It's kind of a shame though, since Hoopa-U gave people a reason to run bugs at all.
>>25958949
Yes, however, its defense is outclassed by such titans as Ivysaur. And almost all Bug moves worth using are physical.
>>25958660
You stall fags are a cancer to the metagame.
>>25958860
>Alternate between Protect, Detect, and Recovery Move
ignore this man's opinion
>>25959002
Especially that even in the slower pace that Ubers moves in, its still slower than every relevant offensive Pokemon but with no real resistances to back it up.
Mewtwo and Mewtwo-Y seems to struggle dealing with other Psychic pokemon, perhaps it could be a legitimate check to both.
>>25958792
Chansey, Skarmory, Clefable, Mega Sableye, Gliscor, Amoonguss
>fuck head in an earlier thread says the way to beat stall is toxic
>>25958792
I'll give you this for giggles :^)
Chansey @ Eviolite
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
- Soft-Boiled
- Seismic Toss
- Stealth Rock
- Heal Bell
Sableye @ Sablenite
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 160 Atk / 100 SpD
Careful Nature
- Knock Off
- Toxic
- Will-O-Wisp
- Recover
Quagsire @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 248 HP / 4 Atk / 184 Def / 72 SpD
Relaxed Nature
- Curse
- Earthquake
- Scald
- Recover
Skarmory @ Shed Shell
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
- Spikes
- Counter
- Defog
- Roost
Weavile @ Choice Band
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Ice Shard
- Knock Off
- Icicle Crash
- Pursuit
Amoonguss @ Black Sludge
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 248 HP / 240 Def / 20 Spe
Bold Nature
- Giga Drain
- Clear Smog
- Sludge Bomb
- Spore
>>25959110
>ABR's shit stall
>>25959132
watch shitplayers get mad
lovin your nonon
>>25959110
>Weavile
>Stall
>>25958989
I get they like playing it against balanced teams because they're evil sadists but how can anyone enjoy playing it in a mirror match?
I'm going to play devil's advocate here and say that stall is a legitimate playstyle and the community hating it doesn't make it broken or ban-worthy.
Hoopa-u forced balance and semistall to run pursuit in all teams just to have a chance at beating it and even then, it was a 50/50 because every single pursuit user in OU could be OHKO'ed on switch.
It may not be as centralizing as Garchomp or Salamence were in DPP but it's way more restrictive for anything that wasn't offense.
>>25958792
HAHA I'M LE SUCH AN EBI TROLL XD IMMA MAKE SO MANY PEOPLE MAD BY BEING A DICK LOL LOL KEK XD
>>25959184
Faggot
>>25958790
It was the one thing that made running Sableye stall disadvantageous, with band, life orb, and specs set
When you took it and you found a stall team built around mega sableye, you KNOW it's gonna KO at least one thing unless you just fuck up
Now it's gone and fatshit will rule again
>>25959165
>he doesnt know about the infamous weavile stall that has been obliterating ladder
>>25959183
>Salamence
>centralizing in DPPt
Smogon literally banned him like 2 months before the release of BW because they were getting bored of the game and needed a new scrapegoat
Literally the only sensible DPPt ban was the Garchomp one
>>25959183
STALL ISNT UPSET THAT THEY HAVE TO RUN CHANSEY ARE THEY NO THEY SHOULDNT BE MAD TO RUN A PURSUIT USER SWITCHING INFINITELY BETWEEN SKARM / CHANSEY / SABLEYE / QUAGSIRE IS NOT A GOD GIVEN RIGHT
>ban something to ubers
>thing it counters goes to tip top of OU
>Uncounterable
>ban it to ubers
>thing it counters goes to tip top of OU
>Uncounterable
>etc.
Why?
Why are people forgetting that not only did Hoopa-U shit on stall, but also balance? Hoopa-U was unhealthy for the metagame because it forces people to run hyperoffense to actually be able to deal with it. It's a shame stall gets to live, but this choice was basically being stuck between a rock and a hard place.
t.balancefag
>>25959265
Most take balance for granted
>>25959165
Yes.
It isn't there to sweep or revenge kill or whatever, its job is fucking up wall breakers so that spikes and burns can take over 9000 turns to grind everything else to dust.
>>25959260
Smogon is a circus of monkeys thinking they know what they're doing, ever since Garchomp in 4th gen they don't know how metagame stabilization works
>>25959287
I used balance in gen 5 and had great success with it.
>>25959265
Hyperoffense is anti-cancer though. Hyperoffense makes the games all around fun, and short.
Any form of defensive shit that makes games drag on is inherently cancerous, and should not exist.
>>25959350
100% this.
It's why with Smash bros people like Melee for competitive play better than Smash 4. Defensive metagames are fucking terrible. Many autists here don't seem to understand that, and think people who like offense are underage or some other bullshit.
>>25959350
>hyperoffense is anticancer
Holy shit, what
Hyperoffense is the main reason gen 5 was so fucking shit. Everything ohko'd everything else.
>>25959418
I miss weather wars
If weathers were actually balanced it would be even more fun
>>25959418
Weather Wars were the real cancer of gen V
>>25959387
Defensivefags also tend to think they're smarter too. They do brainless stuff like switch in Chansey against literally any special attacker, while offense players have to make predictions and double switch to keep momentum up. Stall also expects the game to take dozens of turns, giving you plenty of chances to fuck up and fix it, while offense expects the game to only last twenty, tops. That's a lot less time to make mistakes, and very little room for error.
Stuff like Mega fug's "Press Dragon ascent to win" isn't offense, that's the secret 4th archetype, the one of simply doing broken things until your opponent is overwhelmed (repeatedly switching in Chansey ot neutralize half the attackers in the game can arguably se seen as this too). Poor players using this strategy as a crutch gives off the illusion that offensefags are a bunch of dumb kids, so I think that's where the stereotype comes from.
>>25959350
>its fun for me therefore it has to be fun for everyone else
No you retard, thats not how it works. I personally don't enjoy "click 'x' win lol" teams
>>25959514
Fine, enjoy your "Click Toxic and switch between Skarmory and Chansey for ninety straight turns to win"
>>25958724
>Now we have to look at what post-Unbound OU looks like and how it will perform in Ubers.
We already know Unbound is dogshit in Ubers, every Pokemon is allowed in Ubers and Hoopa U is never used there so banning him from OU won't make him used there more. Mega Sableye on the other hand is used in Ubers all the time and is the only one of the 2 who should have been banned.
>>25959514
>I personally don't enjoy "click 'x' win lol" teams
What an ironic post.
Offensive teams still need strategy's and prediictions.
It is stall users that are the brianless ones, since all they do is switch bulky Pokemon in and out at barley any risk., since each of their mons take 1000 hits before they faint.
Why can't players just build balanced teams with 1 or 2 stall mon?
>ITT: people who have no idea what they're talking about
If you think stall is going to suddenly start dominating the ladder you have something else coming. Even before hoopa-u was introduced stall was having way too much trouble to stay viable over offense and balance.
>>25959814
>suddenly
>>25959637
UU is like that, lately. You'll see, like, 4 attackers, usually dragons and stuff like Hydreigon and Salamence, a bulky guy that's usually a hazard setter (Cobalion is popular for this right now), and something big dumb and wall-like to act as a pivot. I've seen Slowking and Regenerator Reuniclus used for this, as well as Mandibuzz and even Gastrodon since it stops Cobalion and Suicune so well.
UU is basically turning into last gen's OU, but with less weather (rain teams still exist and can be pretty good with M-Swampert, but they're not omnipresent like before)
>>25959387
>Smash 4
>defensive
If this was Brawl we were talking about then maybe you'd have a leg to stand on
If anything, Smash 4's meta is slightly more balanced between offense and defense compared to Melee's hyperoffense that's all about breathing down your opponent's neck while constantly throwing out good moves like Fox's shine
>>25959387
>>25959899
>competitive Smash
Nice meme Nintencucks.
![checksandcounters[1].png](https://i.imgur.com/hCzNRrj.png "checksandcounters[1].png")
>Pokémon A counters Pokémon B if Pokémon A can manually switch into Pokémon B and still win every time, even under the worst case scenario, without factoring in hax.
Name a Pokemon that fits this description for Hoopa-U.
>>25959948
I don't think this description of countering works for pretty much anything that's fully evolved
Can they ban Clefable next?
>>25960083
Nah, Clefable isn't that bad. Thunder Wave should definitely be banned though. Literally the most braindead bullshit haxing move in the game, even worse than Scald.
>>25959948
Mega Beedrill, Volcarona, Heracross, Pinsir, any Fairy...
>>25959899
The Smash 4 Meta is "Little Mac."
>>25960072
This
Aside from a Chansey with seismic toss vs a dedicated special attacker that decides to stay in.
>>25960145
elaborate, and while you're at it explain why you're not a fucking online only scrublord
>>25959110
>watch pokeaim's latest vid
>he's laddering using stall for the first time, using this exact team
>previous vids he's struggling to ladder and having to completely outplay opponents to win
>this vid he easily goes undefeated, while making very few actual plays
Stall is completely skilless. Either you have mons that are strong enough to break stall or out-stall stall, or you lose to it.
>>25960145
What's it like posting from day 1 on 3DS? Also can you me with you, Mac was pretty fun that day.
>>25959948
It only works for special attackers and Chansey, and maybe a few others. Pokemon is a game of checks. Stall is a game of counters.
>>25959350
Hyper offense vs Hyper offense is the most skilled match up.Clicking X to switch to counter isn't an option, and fucking up means you lose. Unlike stall which has enough recovery to withstand poor playing.
Why don't they just automatically quick ban every single event legendary that has a second form. Or any legendary with a second form.
Of course some people are going to get pissy no matter what because it's smogon
>>25959336
As opposed to the VGC, where KANGASKHAN GOES ON EVERY TEAM!
PEOPLE WILL LEARN HOW TO COUNTER IT OH WHOOPS IT DOMINATED VGC2015 I GUESS WE MADE THE BAD META.
>>25960072
It works almost exclusively for defensive pokemon. Mega Venusaur and Keldeo, Hippowdon and Talonflame. That kind of thing.
If a pokemon can switch into another one and win most of the time is considered a check. For example, Azumarril checks Megacharizard X unless Charizard is carrying Thunderpunch or Will-o-Wisp.
>>25960134
Mega Beedrill can switch into Hoopa-U and win every single time? Are you retarded?
RIP Star Platinum
>>25959948
I can't believe smogonfags still use this dumb criteria to determine whether or not an offensive Pokemon should be banned, you are basically telling me you can't play without being able to mindlessly press the switch button every time the opponent has an advantage over you
>>25960349
Whining about Kangaskhan just proves the point that smogonbabies can't into metagame development, it's great but eventually became very predictable and not difficult to deal with
>>25960145
>he doesnt know about Cloud, bayonetta and Corrin
anon....
>>25960278
This. Mega Sableye needs to fuck off. Its litteraly the only mon that makes stall so annoying and hard to counter. Prevents hazards, knocks off all your items and burns what it can. If something threatens him, switch to an unaware wall. Use Chansey in case it gets burned. Repeat for 100+ turns.
>>25960145
>I don't know shit about the Smash 4 meta: the post
>>25960426
The funny thing is that Mega Sableye, on of the cancermons litteraly shits on Mega Kangaskhan, so they could unban it. But they wont because Sableye is its only counter. On the other hand, Clefable being the only Mega Sableye counter, is ignored by Smogon.
Serves you fags right. Doubles/VGC is the way the game is meant to be played, not your stalling 6-mon Singles shitfest.
>>25960443
Agreed.
If Smogon wants stall gone(and I hope they do) they need to ban M-Sableye.
smogon ou needs to be purged
Ever wonder what it would feel like to have your arms disconnected like that?
>>25960552
They aren't disconnected. They are going through portals
>>25960552
Awesome because you could fist yourself 24/7 365
>there is a 60% of positive votes to ban
what
with 200 voters and only a 60%? it should be a 70% at least
OU no stall when
no evs on defenses and stall fixed
>>25959260
You're right, Mega-Salamence would be balanced if Smogon didn't ban Mega-Rayquaza. Stupid smogon! >:(
>>25959814
ironic that you say that when the top of the ladder of literally every tier is dominated by a stallfag
>>25960644
>useless analogy
Rayquaza was never allowed anywhere to begin with
>>25960642
It needed 60% to get banned. The result is 61.24% so they probably added 2% so that it got a ban :)
>>25958965
It's their fault for allowing legendaries outside of Ubers. Just because the legendary birds and the 600-bst mythicals and Kyurem-B work in OU doesn't mean they should let their metagame be fucked for MONTHS only to change the rule when they realize it's almost-inevitably overpowered every goddamn time a new legendary is released. They had to ban Mega-Fug from Ubers ffs.
Just ban the goddamn legends already!
tfw you nearly saved Hoopa-U but the pro-ban bandwagon was too strong
>>25958660
is half the roster banned at this point?
I understand why banning was helpful back in the days when their were 1 or 2 OP pokes and how if everyone used them it would make the game stale... but now there's literally hundreds of banned moves, abilities, items, and mons- and the concept of banning them to maintain the relevance of the "traditional" strategies seems silly at this point.
http://www.smogon.com/bw/banlist/
Seriously look at all these shitty restrictions- if they allowed moves like double-team and baton pass their wouldn't be any need to put Pokemon into all these different tiers and ban so much.
I think Gamefreak is hoping Smogon will just give up trying to cripple their game with rules. Eventually the meta will be fixed from within due to the sheer amount of options.
Is Hoopa U even good in Uber?
>>25960819
If gen 6 had kept up the legend spam from gen 3-5, Ubers would have enough mons to become the new OU. Hell, Gen 5 Ubers was actually incredibly balanced and only became JUST tier with Xerneas and Mega-Ray.
>>25960833
No
>>25960819
Here's the gen 6 tiers actually anon:
http://www.smogon.com/xyhub/tiers
They made Ubers an official tier (not just an OU banlist) since they had to ban Mega-Fug.
Double Team is absolute unabashed cancer and I wouldn't play against any opponent who uses it online or irl.
>>25959350
>mfw I stall people with my Leafeon and they never see it coming until they realize their running out of PP and I'm not interested in attacking.
>>25960500
The problem is, the people who bother to make reqs and vote are mostly high-ladder players, lots of whom use stall. So something that's a bit of a problem for stall will get banned pretty easily, whereas something that's a problem for balance or offense is allowed because the stall players want to keep using it.
>>25960819
>literally hundreds
Dumb trumpposter.
Sun and Moon should remove PP Ups from the game. Any Pokémon transfered to it will have their PP Ups removed.
>>25960906
if anything, that would only make stall stronger since their moves naturally have more pp
>>25960819
6v6 singles becomes more of a joke each gen. I don't know whether to laugh or be sad at them desperately trying to make it relevant. It's only going to get worse too
>I think Gamefreak is hoping Smogon will just give up trying to cripple their game with rules
Japan are 100% dedicated to official rules so unfortunately I don't think they're aware of how cancerous Smogon is in the west. Otherwise showdown would have been shut down
>>25959260
This has happened every gen.
After all of the obviously broken shit gets banned we usually have a stable metagame for a few months. Then a few people get pissed at something again and it starts this process.....I honestly think they just feel like they have to regularly run a suspect ladder and look for reasons to hate things once all of the obvious offenders are gone.
>>25960917
to be desu, there's a few moves that are far stronger than they should be because of PP-Ups.
You shouldn't be able to spam the living dick out of hydro pump
>>25960862
>legalize baton pass, sleeping, and evasion stat hikes
>combined with evolite
>suddenly 95% of the roster is competitive and a much wider movepool is available to you.
I think the creator of Smogon got his Blaziken destroyed by a team of Oddish and it traumatized him so bad he made all these rules.
>>25960819
>Seriously look at all these shitty restrictions- if they allowed moves like double-team and baton pass their wouldn't be any need to put Pokemon into all these different tiers and ban so much.
I can understand disliking Smogon, but why would you suck GF's cock so much? Do you really think GameFreak's system is better?
Your post screams "I don't know what I'm talking about" anyway, so I shouldn't expect any less, but still.
>>25960931
What happens every gen is something gets periodically until the next gen comes out and people move on and repeat the process. Mons were being banned right until the end of Gen 4 and 5. Nothing stops the banning except a new game.
>>25960349
Except that it didn't dominate 2015. The only people who complain about it being too broken and overcentralizing in that season are people who didn't actually play or follow the tournaments, and just saw the snapshot of top 8 at worlds and assumed that was the entire season. Yes, Kangaskhan is extremely strong in that format. But a large part of why it did so well at worlds is that it *hadn't* been doing that well earlier in the season. Only one Kangaskhan made top 8 at US nationals, but there were two Gardevoir (the finalists), two Charizard, and three Salamence. Players weren't that concerned about countering Kangaskhan at worlds, so it did well there. In the post-worlds tournaments that still used the same format, people were particularly focused on countering CHALK because it was so prominent at worlds, so it didn't perform as well.
>>25960964
What's wrong with this? It's cool that pokemon like smeargle and liligant get a chance to shine.
>>25960862
I absolutely love the term fug. It makes me giggle like a bitch every time I hear it.
>>25960932
Using Hydro Pump at all is a gamble by itself. No need to take such a risk when you have more reliable yet still decently powerful Water attack in Scald with added bonus of haxing people with burns. The only Pokemon that use Hydro Pump in Smogon are LO Starmie because it badly needs that extra power and Choice locked Keldeo with both Water STABs that only clicks it when it absolutely needs to OHKO something.
It's a very bad example. Not that I can think of a single low-PP (5 by default) move that becomes more spammable because of PP ups.
>>25960894
>Smogon's policy FAQ
>ctrl+F "banned"
>354 results
Get a job, Ahmed Burgerstein.
>>25960964
>Your post screams "I don't know what I'm talking about" anyway
Oh the irony.
>>25960964
Can you stop being a faggot and actually look at more that one single event? VA was the very first US regional of the 2016 format. Most of the strong players who went brought big 6 because it doesn't make sense to build an anti-meta team before you have any idea what the meta is. In every US regional since then, big 6 has been getting counterteamed to hell.
>>25960964
Yes the official system is better, VGC is not the only official format and the stupid 2016 ruleset is just a one off yesar
>>25960998
Close Combat. Roost
rate my old team
Suicide Azelf (lead)
Agilisub petaya Empoleon
NP Ape
Specs Jolt
Gengar (no mega)
Banded Dugtrio
>>25961013
The 2016 ruleset is honestly pretty good. The only real problem with it is Smeargle. Dark Void is bad, but Dark Void + Moody is just silly. With bad RNG, Smeargle becomes an absolute waste of a team slot. With good RNG (evasion and speed boosts) it's practically impossible to counter.
>>25958860
>poor defenses
Please go fuck yourself in the mouth and jump of a bridge into a pit of spikes you fuckface
>>25960964
>tryhards copy each other tho!
this always happens, and banning stuff only reinforces the issue.
Also this tournament wasn't rule-less as you want it to appear. You could only choose from a limited pool of ubers. So naturally everyone went with the most powerful of the unrestricted mons.
Pokédex # Species Pokédex # Species Pokédex # Species
151 Mew 490 Manaphy 647 Keldeo
251 Celebi 491 Darkrai 648 Meloetta
385 Jirachi 492 Shaymin 649 Genesect
386 Deoxys 493 Arceus 719 Diancie
489 Phione 494 Victini 720 Hoopa
o Teams may have no more than two of the following Pokémon in the Battle Box:
Pokédex # Species Pokédex # Species Pokédex # Species
150 Mewtwo 384 Rayquaza 644 Zekrom
249 Lugia 483 Dialga 646 Kyurem
250 Ho-Oh 484 Palkia 716 Xerneas
382 Kyogre 487 Giratina 717 Yveltal
383 Groudon 643 Reshiram 718 Zygarde
>>25961058
It's shit.
>>25961106
Thanks bro
>>25961087
Smeargle is only a problem because of the meta being so focused on primals and Xerneas though, it was barely even used in 2014 or 2015
>>25958660
this is why I don't bother with smogay.
>>25961115
Smeargle is ass-broken without a lot of the rules Smogon has. Baton Pass= Smeargle is broken. Moddy = Smeargle is broken. Sleep Clause - Smeargle is broken.
rate my team https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/oususpecttest-352374798
>>25961158
im the one using ariados in OU
>>25960964
Keep in mind this was before they discovered V-Create Spinda.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nEdV49998-M
>>25961115
Definitely true. It was a lot harder to abuse the free turns granted by dark void and it's other support moves in 2015. The raw power of the restricted Pokemon, especially with their spread moves, makes it almost impossible to simply sit back and take a couple turns of sleep. That doesn't change the fact that Smeargle is broken in this format though.
>>25961138
>opponent as a set-up team
>use roar or dragon tail
>set up destroyed
>you win.
>>25960964
>>25961189
>yfw I use ingrain Smeargle
>>25961158
Munchlax best babby.
>>25961158
LMFAO i would be so salty if i got wiped out by a munchlax
>>25960960
>suddenly 95% of the roster is competitive
How? People will just be using the Pokemon who are the best at abusing those strategies.
>>25961240
And those that are best at countering them. If you want to see what a meta without bans looks like, check out the usage stats for Anything Goes.
>>25961158
>SKCT's rating: 1060 → 1040
Just to save everyone else from clicking on it
>>25961275
whats a good rating?
>>25961298
Typically at 1400+ you stop facing pure retards like the one in that replay. At 1600+ you have officially gotten gud.
>>25960999
>best pokemon in the game stat-wise is megamewtwo
>nobody uses him
>>25961322
>him
>>25961322
>him
>>25958660
Muh stall
>>25959899
Melee is not just hyperoffense. You can win with Jiggs, Sheik, or campy fox or peach with a very defensive play style.
>>25960964
>posts image of the French regionals
>literally the only regionals in the world that has happened
Well meme'd
>>25961192
>>25960964
>top teams
French frogs please go.
>>25961368
>french
>literally says Virginia
Off you'reself bud.
>>25961397
Yeah, I looked at the shitty cherrypicking now. He should have posted the french one since that's the one people always cherry pick on.
Does it matter in the end? If you're cherrypicking a single event without having any idea what has happened in any other then you've already lost the argument.
>>25958790
If you don't know what stall is you were never in the competitive loop you fucking mong
>>25961368
>>25961387
>when you can't read and samefag at the same time
>>25961423
>moving goalposts
>>25961423
>talking about 2 events
>call it a single event
fucking psychopath
>>25961435
Not that guy, but see what I said in >>25961010 to explain the VA regionals. The French regional is the other one that people always point to, but it's also not representative of the overall meta because it was quite small and didn't have a lot of notable players in attendance. So the few good players who went weren't expecting to get counterteamed, and just brought the team that is best at curbstomping randos.
>>25961192
>no clefairy
you tried
>people can't handle shall
>>25958790
The honest answer (besides from all these "lol stall" ones) is that CSpecs Hoopa-U had no checks. Nothing could switch into the guy and survive two hits of its attacks, and it's relative diversity and Trick meant that defensive Pokés like Chansey and Mandibuzz (who otherwise can survive) were crippled by the sneak-Trick.
Unless you had a strong Pursuit user it was very hard to get rid of this guy.
That said, I wouldn't have banned it. I'd rather see Scald banned than Hoopa-U.
>>25958790
Hoops couldn't be checked by anything - as in, nothing could switch in, reliably take a hit, and either counter back or force a switch. Not Clefairy, not Ferrothorn, not Chansey, just nothing could weather two or three blows from it.
While people like to whine it's the stallfags, it's really just a particularly violent shift in the already mutable community. Two months ago this wouldn't fly because the metagame was dominated by hyper offense, and Hoops couldn't do much due to poor defenses and the fact it's worn down really easily. Now, with a resurgence of popularity in Manaphy and Sableye, we see a return in more bulky offense and balance teams, which Hoops crushes.
Essentially, the mob mentality was strong enough to ban Hoopa this month - I guarantee you if they ran the suspect test a month or two ago it would have stayed, and the backlash would assure Hoopa would stay in OU. But because the community is really shitty and doesn't have any idea of context or time, they just flail around and get mad just for the sake of rioting.
Sounds like Stallfags were shitty crybabies who couldn't git gud against Hoopa-U, and cried for Hoopa-U to be banned because they're shitters.
>>25961830
>I'd rather see Scald banned than Hoopa-U.
should we ban knockoff while we are at it?
>>25962782
>higher chance to burn than majority of Fire moves (with the exception of Sacred Fire and Lava Plume)
>ridiculous distribution
>There's nothing (aside from M-Charizard X) without Water Absorb/Storm Drain that can resist both its primary damage and secondary side-effect. All Fire types get wrecked by the 80BP water attack, all other things don't appreciate the Burn.
>>25963446
wouldn't really be a problem is burn wasn't a 50% cut to attack
>everyone ignoring the fact that Shadow Tag was banned for its stallfaggotry
>>25962782
yes
>>25962216
>Hoops couldn't be checked by anything - as in, nothing could switch in, reliably take a hit, and either counter back or force a switch. Not Clefairy, not Ferrothorn, not Chansey, just nothing could weather two or three blows from it.
Mandibuzz was the only thing, maybe Umbreon. It was still bullshit.
>>25963714
I'm surprised Mandibuzz isn't used more. Any time I use it, it's always incredibly useful
>>25964676
It's one of those more niche stallmons that work well if used well, like Quagsire, Amoonguss, Suicune, Jellicent and Tangrowth etc that can hold their own well in OU if you have a good stallfag team.
>>25965168
That's the thing. I've used it on balance and offense and it still does amazingly. It just tanks so much shit it has no right to tank
