why are Pokemon OCs looked down on and called autistic? Is it just residue from autistic self-inserts in other fandoms? Is it the insert-into-the-world-and-story part of it? escapism?
The games are made so that the MC is you, the PKMN team you train is yours and "your friends," "your journey." It's only natural to create a little closer avatar to yourself. Personally I love well-done drawings of a trainer and their team.
Oh boy, autism central incoming.
gonna post some comfy images also ITT
>>25877336
The self-insert part yes.
Mostly, OCs are looked down upon because people tend to buff up their personalities and such to make them "unique." You might ask, "who wouldn't?" More than plenty of times, people give these characters shitty and unnecessary qualities such as the ability to talk to Pokemon, and it makes it look like cringe.
I do know that there does exist well-made OCs with non-Mary Sue qualities and they are usually very good ones. But, the vast majority and the biggest stereotypes against OCs is that they're Mary Sues. This goes for any fandom.
>>25877336
>why are Pokemon OCs looked down on and called autistic?
If done right its tolerable.
Of course we all know where it leads... xxx
>>25877375
Basically this, also most pokemon-related OCs that people see are usually in poorly-written fangames and ROM hacks like Reborn or Dark Rising.
>>25877336
I don't have a problem with OCs. In fact, I'd actually approve of them whenever they're not
>DURR, ITS SHINY AND HAS GOOD/EVIL MORALS.
>>25877379
99% of the time is gets nowhere near XXX
pokefags are the most disgusting and unfathomable subgenre of furries
>>25877389
what about when people draw OCs in the threads here that are literally just "my character and my pokemon?"
>>25877406
They usually associate those with the afore-mentioned Mary Sues in shitty fangames or stupid shit that they've seen on Deviantart/Tumblr/etc. It's a losing battle for anybody that actually makes decent OCs.
last one
>>25877430
I guess, but I think the stigma makes it seem like there's way less decent OCs than there actually are. Like any fandom, if you sort through the shit there's some great stuff that makes you think, what an interesting concept, I can see this guy as an NPC... but it doesn't seem like a topic even open for discussion bc when you post here it's an automatic shitfest
>>25877406
>threads that are literally just "my character and my pokemon"
I'd say thats fine, its just a blank slate at that point. Its when you start doing too detailed of headcanons or make it too in your face like most OC tend to, that it becomes a problem.
E.g, simple drawing of you and your pokemon is fine, maybe make a bit of a silly one.
If you take it too seriously, make your characters over the top design wise and do shit like make headcanons, things like "my alakazam only has one eye from fighting a horde of weavile" or claim you can talk to pokemon like a special snowflake, that'll just make you look bad.
>>25877542
eh... I agree with you there
>>25877363
I wanna fuck that girl. I bet she has decent tastes.
I just hate how every fucking faggot needs to insert as the qt loli girl. if you're that insecure about your real life self, just draw your character not fat.
The major issue is when people Mary Sue the fuck out of their character.
Friends with or captured a legendary/mythical pokemon.
Shinies.
Custom shiny.
Talks to pokemon.
Over powered everything.
Generic character.
Overly lewd/straight up porn OCs
Etc.
The /vp/oc threads from a while back used to be fun. It sucks the drawfriends were chased off for drawing for people who couldn't.
Look at the trainer sheet thread. Anyone who posts something remotely edgy gets shit. Same for people who have legends or shiny pokemon on their team.
I think the OCs can have a place on the board. It just shouldn't be something that is front and center all the time.
>>25877645
>>25877640
this, really. People making OCs don't understand how to balance them. somehow "super special unique traits" = interesting, and the character is devoid of life otherwise.
maybe every once and a while vp should have showdown tournaments where participants can draw themselves with their pkmn or something. Then teams have to be a little bit realistic.
>>25877686
I don't wanna shit talk the people on this board because, most of the time, it is pretty fun here. But, there was a time where I considered joining the /vp/oc collection/fiction group. After reading their catalog of "playable" characters I decided the group wasn't for me.
There was a centuries old witch.
Tons of people with Shiny Pokemon. I know they exist in the Anime and games but having a team full of them is overkill.
One who could talk to Pokemon.
Etc.
Like you said, there should be a trait that sets someone apart but not at the expense of making the character ridiculous.
In the trainer sheet thread there was someone who posted their sheet/oc and it was clear they were super into the Sinnoh underground. That's pretty cool.
Most people get afraid to say anything about goals too. If you say you want to be part of the evil team you get called an edge lord.
There needs to be some trade off. If you have a group of people that role play or whatever you are going to need an antagonist. That said, a person can play an antagonist and not be a hot topic angst-filled teen. I think the people who do OCs poorly don't understand character writing or development.
Whatever. It's what it is.
The idea of an OC tourney would be neat though. I'd watch it unfold if I didn't participate.
>>25877585
I'll admit, i've made OC and roleplayed to my shame years ago, but I never did anything to make him some hero or magical man because thats no fun. If anything he was weird for collecting random shit calling it valuable.
Most others had things like "all guys would fall in love with her" and "could summon giratina" which was horrendous, not to mention 'valuable' mons like eeveelutions, shinies, starters, etc.
Meanwhile I was with a damn Torkoal just out to make money.
>>25877765
sounds like the right way to RP though. Even if you feel embarrassed afterward, at least you played someone who was fun but also believable
when people have super hero magical bullshit going on, I assume they're either 12-14, or incredibly immature and looking for attention. Either way not exactly someone to take seriously.
>>25877765
This is usually more fun than having a team full of shiny starters.
Good example of how to get into it without being a Mary Sue.
See one problem with OCs are that they don't understand how things relate to the Pokemon world. It really goes back to the Syndrome Syndrome- "If everyone's super, no one will be." Shines, legends, or even strong evolutions are not really special anymore if you can get them off the bat. People who rp or OC also lack understanding of rarity. Like I can understand if it's lucky you find a Pikachu, which is considered a rare species, but if you honestly expect to catch a Feebas today without trying, a Porygon tomorrow without trying, and a Zapdos the day after, that is not a very compelling journey.
>>25877897
Failure can also be a great way to develop a character too. If your OC wins all the damn time Superman Syndrome quickly sets in.
>>>25877795
Yeah its hard to find a group that does it "maturely", I use the term lightly because as we said people need to be the big cheese straight away, rather than a trainer with character and snowballing it.
>>25877812
Honestly I just selected 4 already owned mons I liked and called it a day, e.g. Golduck, not rare or that special or anything, just from a psyduck found at a lake
I'm kind of feeling encouraged by this thread to do a trainer and team drawing. Not for RP use or a backstory or anything. Just a pic.
>>25877977
Everytime I swear.Perhaps I should do one for shits and giggles
>Pokemon OC
That happens to all OCs no matter the franchise friend.
They are disliked, as many have said already, because people don't make tasteful characters, only special snowflakes 95% of the time so they can self-insert in a power-trip.
Mind you, there's nothing wrong with self-inserting or creating a character to personify you but when your OC has a team of 6 shinies, can talk with pokemon, control the aura better than Riley and is also the choosen one whose parents were the best pokemon master and coordinator in all history, etc then there's a problem with your character and even you you for creating such a cringey abomination with a straight face.
>>25877977
Go for it. Make sure it's a diverse team unless it's a gym leader or local person.
>>25877736
>I know they exist in the Anime and games but having a team full of them is overkill.
I once had an OC with a shiny Galvantula and Garchompand probably others, I can't remember.
The joke was he had no idea his Pokemon were shiny and didn't understand what people were talking about when they said his looked different. Yay or nay?
>>25878024
was he colorblind?
>>25877645
What's the black thing in the corner supposed to be?
>>25878031
Maybe he had never seen normal Garchomps or Galvantulas.
Honestly, I've always been baffled at the massive lack of knowledge people who live in the Pokemon world have throughout all the media.
>>25877645
>>25878044
truly and absolutely disgusting furshit
>>25878044
The furry OC trainer. He's holding the pokeball.
>>25878024
>>25878058
Ehh. You're really straddling the line there. One of them I could see, maybe. It could be a little reoccurring gag that comes up that brings out the OC's idiosyncrasies. It's ultimately your OC but I think more than one shiny is overkill--even for the OC's "color blind"/lack of knowledge gimmick.
>>25878044
that's his fursona
>>25878031
>>25878058
Galvantula and Garchomp shinies are just darker versions of their normal counterparts. I at least can't tell the difference if I don't have them side by side.
>>25878087
I see. If you had to choose one, which would you go with? Shiny spider or landshark?
>>25878216
shiny spider! shiny spider! Galvantula is just a cool mon in general
>>25878237
The best! One of my top favorites. Too bad I can't make it good competitively...
>>25878059
:^)
I used to run a blog where I would review shit characters, I made them myself so I figured I could talk from experience.
The pokemon OC community, is probably the best when it comes to non autistic shit show teams.
The worst you will get is people who can talk to pokemon.
But that's not exactly new.
You got auras, psychic types, psychic people and pokemon that can train to talk.
So the whole idea doesn't bother me. It's how they use it.
I played a dude that ran a daycare/pokemon shelter.
>>25877686tfw my OC is actually from PMDverse because it's easier to think up of shit for it
>>25877912
>Superman Syndrome
The difference between Superman and these types of OCs is that Superman at least goes through a ton of strife, hardship and character exploration. He may always win but its rarely easy.
OCs usually just fulfil fantasies of effortlessly defeating highschool bullies. They make themselves out to be "just you average teen/young adult" from modest backgrounds but then have special powers with everyone fearing them or eventually doing so.
Could the whole talking to pokemon schtick be acceptable if the trainer was a Psychic? They exist in the games, so its not -that- mary-sue.Could this also be allowed for "Fairy tale" trainers?
>>25877336
Pretty sure it's been said tons of times in the thread, but it's the execution that's -often- autistic, not the idea itself.
>>25881627
Probably. A lot of times, like >>25881647 says, its the delivery of the concept that inspires eye rolling.
I would stray away from being able to pokemon personally though. A) Its done to death as far as OCs and self inserts go and B) Its apparently a pretty big deal as far as the games and anime etc go.
>>25880470
>meme game
>>25878216
Spider.
>>25881603
Superman Syndrome refers to a specific era of Superman where even if he got his ass kicked by the end of an issue or arc he would overcome and things would be peachy. The stakes would go away at the end of each issue and his losses would mean nothing.
>>25881627
Talking to pokemon is always pretty bad. A good trainer should be able to understand their pokemon through body language and expression. People who feel the need to be able to understand their pokemon's vocalizations as English or whatever language the trainer speaks. Psychic powers are Mary Sue. Adding talking to pokemon is just icing on the cake.
>>25881627
I'd stay away from speaking to pokemon aside from specific and interesting explanations. I'll give a mary-sueish concept a try and not make it shit. Whether I succeed or not is up to you.
Perhaps a trainer painstakingly taught his pokemon to speak English, much like Team Rocket's Meowth taught himself to so he can communicate more complex battle strategies to give him an edge over other trainers, and for the pokemon to give feedback and share their opinions on that sort of stuff to hone in on a method that suits each of them individually. A downside to this could be that he spent so much time with this that more regular battle training suffered, and as a result, he usually has to win by having him and his team outsmart the opponents, since the opponents pokemon will be tougher on average since they spent more time with conventional training.
>>25881664
>>25881706
This is based solely on the logic presented by the Anime so take it with a grain of salt.
Does the pokemon that was taught to speak know more than 2 moves? Has/can it still evolve? If yes to either of those... it's Mary Sue. Meowth is the obvious benchmark for talking pokemon. In his origin episode he explains that learning to speak and stand upright all the time had a detrimental effect on his battle potential. As a result he only has 2 "move slots" and cannot evolve.
The lack of traditional battle strategy is a weak trade off to have a pokemon talk.
>>25881706
>>25881748
I'm sorry I totally misread what you posted. You basically said the same thing.
>>25881748
I thought Meowth didn't evolve because he despised Persian, not because he couldn't.
>>25881841
That's part of it. Paraphrasing but hee says even if he could evolve (meaning he cant) he wouldn't want to because his issues with Persians.
rate my autism level
my OC wanders around the wilderness hunting rare treasure items, and selling/trading them back in towns.
no shinies or legends, but one starter and one eeveelution.
probably the bad part is that i'd like her to have vague friendship/acquaintances to my favorite gym leaders/league members, ie maybe she delivers rare items to them sometimes and they get a cup of coffee.
>>25882134
Nah, that all seems pretty reasonable stuff.
Once made an oc that had a team of the mythical tiny legendaries, i.e. Mew, celebi, jirachi, etc.
She never battled and just thought they were her forest friends or something and just tagged along with the group because she was a little sister of a trainer who couldn't catch shit but the rodents. It was a gag that if he was proud to catch a sentret, she would meet celebi at the same time. Only thing I can think of that is over the line.
>>25882134
Mostly reasonable. Some might nitpipck over the eeveelution and a starter. I wouldn't worry too much about it.
As far as the gym leaders go, it would be a non-issue as long as they don't contribute too much to the overall end game for your OC.
The traveling merchant thing is pretty neat.
>why are Pokemon OCs looked down on and called autistic?
>>25882265
this HAS to be satire, that's clearly a dick next to jirachi's face
So for OC, what is the general rules regarding teams? I know legendaries are a huge no and shinies need to be very careful, but what else like common/rarity of mons, quantity of how many you have and if they're all fully evolved go as? Say for example I wanted to have a Darmanitan for my character, would that be too much or could it be balanced out if any other team member was a bit more common and NFE like Corphish?
>>25882291
I wish it was anon, I wish it was.
>>25882334
>>25882321
If your character is supposed t be a trainer then having all the pokémon fully evolved is completely fine. The rarity isn't a big deal usually, with a few exceptions like several pseudos being looked down on, you have to be very careful with several starters too.
>>25882334
Jesus christ this cant be legal
>>25882353
I think the bottom line is to just put thought into the character. In the context you want to put him/her in, do they make sense... if you existed in the Pokeworld, would you really have been able to gather and train and become the BEST, without game mechanics having handed the adventure to you? Although that might be being overly-realistic.
I'm Japanese.
I was play this game 15years ago.
Brings back memories.
>>25882334
>Metagross
>Magnemite and Magnezone
A line has been crossed...
>>25882321
Most pokemon are fair game if your character is a trainer. Or, to a lesser extent breeder or coordinator.
Pseudos and starters is where the grey area starts.
Pokemon with stigma attached to them are tricky because of said stigma. Lucario, Gardevoir, Pikachu, etc.
Sometimes, not all the time though, out of pokeball pokemon can be looked down on. "Whoa there, Ashy boy" is a common reply to that. I have never been a big fan of following pokemon so I don't use them but if someone wants a shoulder bro, I don't see why they can't.
>>25882134
i dont get why starters would be a negative, most people would get them wouldn't they? i do get worried about knowing gym leaders, but id say as long as they dont fall in love with her, or give her special treatment/gifts its fine
>>25882589
Someone had to get them before good old Ash showed up late to the party and grabbed Pikachu, after all.
And presumably they weren't the first group of kids to ever begin their journey.
Feels like starters would be exactly that. Starters. Maybe trainers who couldn't hack it or didn't like it would return their starters to the regional breeders or whatever to make more starters for the next generation of trainers.
>>25882589
I think the issue with starters how rare they are presented to be in the games and even anime. If they were abundant in their region then I don't think people would have as much of an issue with it.
>>25882589
Most people theoretically would, considering starters are a right of passage to being a trainer as we've been told, but you pretty much NEVER see trainers actually have a "starter pokemon" that we get even in the games because they're deemed as rare, so it just kind of makes it an awkward area. For a world of trainers and being pretty much the only one in the whole region to own a Squirtle or at least make it apparent, just seems strange.
I like trainers that look like they could be actual trainers in the games.
This girl for example has hair that is just the right amount of stupid to be feasible in a pokemon game.
>>25882649
>THICK
>>25882641
It's almost like a starter is actually a "loaner" to help you get through the first few pokemon captures.
At some point, maybe you're expected to return your loaner now that you've gotten your own friends, not just a friend that was given to you.
>>25882321
The only thing that bothers me on that front is when someone has literally dozens of pokemon to choose from, fully evolved pseudo legendaries, maybe a mega or two, and yet their end goal is "See the world and meet people" or something like that. The character sheet thread is rife with that.
If you're a full fledged high tier trainer or professor, maybe, but going by the anime and games most people have only a few pokemon at their beck and call, even trainers.
>>25882672
The artist has a fondness for thick.
>>25882649
she got nice thighs
>>25882692
"see the world" is so over done. I made a trainer sheet for the next time the thread rolls around where in my OC is a villain. No one does it because
>so much edge!!11!
But c'mon. At least it's different.
>>25882589
>>25882621
My idea is that starters aren't necessarily the well known elemental trios, those just happen to be the starters available when you start your particular journey. Other people get other starters, mostly more common ones; the Joeys and Rattattas of the world.
>>25882713
My OC trainer (which is literally just the custom XY trainer because I'm lazy) travelled to Hoenn to partake in the Contest Spectaculars when ORAS came out, and now she's off to Ferrum to try out the Ferrum battles for Pokken.
I'll send her off to whatever region SuMo has in store for us to do whatever that region's gimmick is too.
>>25882692
If an OC's goal is to just see the world and go on a journey, they should be crushed by dedicated professional trainers.
>>25882725
No reason the class system and privileges of the wealthy wouldn't apply to the pokemon world just as it does in ours.
Got connections? Got money? Your grandfather knew Professor __________ back in the day? Your uncle runs a Pokemon Nursery?
You're in like flynn, kid. Enjoy fucking up everyone else's Pidgey with your Master Race Mon.
>>25882713
You do have a point regarding /vp/, but everywhere else having the OC be a member or former member of an evil team is just as overdone, especially if said team is Rocket.
>>25882764
Exactly. Your average wandering traveller my have one or two pokemon at their side, maybe even a couple more if they're really gregarious, but unless they're actively pursuing battling (or contests or research or something like that) there's no real reason they'd have more.
>>25882774
Which is odd since the team rocket RP thread was one of the oldest, longest running general threads on the board. Rocket gets a bad rep but I think what makes them appealing I'd they're simply criminals. No world altering goals.
>>25882811
Now that you mention that, I think a cop-show style fanfic for pokemon with Rocket members as the criminals the police have to catch might be a pretty fun idea.
Trainers as OCs are alright, but when people decide to be a Pokemon, that's when shit gets to the next level of special snowflake mary sue autism
>>25882854
What aboutGijinkas? I kid, I know its still autism
>>25882884
Dressing up like a Pokemon is fine.Just don't do the Ash Greninja shit.
>>25882821
I like it.
>>25881651
This is part of the reason the term "Mary sue" gets used to death. Due to the internet, there are a lot more young/untalented writers and drawers that start setting the "norm" for character building and story telling. Unless you can separate from what they've ruined, you get automatically put in the same category, even if your story has perfectly reasonable explanations or you don't actually make a Mary sue character (as in, good at everything so has no real personality).
The truth is, more than likely you won't write or draw something unique. Concepts that makes the story more interesting will be used often. For example, many drawn nuzlockes have talking pokemon because otherwise you'd only have the one human character getting real development. And it's not so farfetched when in game, N is able to do it...why can't anyone?
When you write or draw you are creating your own universe. Even when you are borrowing from a series, you can still do what you want (unless you borrow exact characters...then you have to stay true to the character). I've read quite a few great AU fanfictions.
There's a reason so many people enjoy dull characters as well. Look at Kirito. Dumb character, adored by a ton of people because he's perfect at everything and many people desperately want to relate to that.
>>25877375
This is the best explanation. Most people making an OC think
> "I don't want to be a random pokemon trainer, that's boring"
so they turn into an all-powerful edgelord who has a team of shiny legendaries and they can shapeshift into pokemon at will. There are of course ways of making your character interesting, like you research legendaries or you are an aspiring Gym leader, but there are limits.
>>25877336
If you self inset yourself, be sure to insert your own flaws and not just make it a better version of yourself
>>25882987
But anon, autists can't go outside on their own. They'd never even make it into the tall grass.
>>25877897
>Shines, legends, or even strong evolutions are not really special anymore if you can get them off the bat
Exactly, maybe one of your pokemon is shiny or you had an encounter with a legendary but usually owning a legendary is immediate overkill. Maybe if you have some kind of relationship with a legendary like Noland and Articuno in the Battle Frontier anime you can make that work though.
>>25882942
>I've read quite a few great AU fanfictions.
Could you tell me which ones? I'd like to give them a try if they are as you say and are actually good.
>>25882942
N is the most Mary Sue antagonist in the series.
>>25877336
Self-insertion is autistic.
>>25877375
Whenever I do anything with the "OC" of myself, I don't change anything about myself. I'd consider it pretty plain but I like it that way. I personally don't have any qualities that I want to change about myself. I'm not fat, I'm tall, I am reasonably attractive from my standards, the only thing I change is my hair, because I used to be blonde and I like it better than my now jet black hair.
