Fish, waifus, ban smogon, genbu, high BST curse etc etc.
Last thread: >>24943601
Game download pre-patched and ready to go in english (No expansion, won't be translated for 3-8 months):
http://www.mediafire.com/download/ynnmmo4k9noe0cr/%E5%B9%BB%E6%83%B3%E4%BA%BA%E5%BD%A2%E6%BC%94%E8%88%9E.rar
Expansion downloads (Not translated, japanese only): http://pastebin.com/99HRr1Vt
The game requires japanese language packs and your computer to be in japanese locale or emulated via Locale Emulator provided in the download. If you don't do this, numbers will be bugged or the game won't run at all:
https://mega.nz/#!q0lixKqI!n07oANzavBNSgGwWtm5Ezyuf9B0ifT36yi6Vmyi3kjo
Wiki: http://tpdp.supersanctuary.net/wiki/Main_Page
Puppetdex with a bit more utility than the wiki, have to download it and use a spreadsheet viewer:
http://www.mediafire.com/view/ozuu2sf3ovitzux/tpdp_PuppetDex_1.91.xlsx
FAQ, useful links and additional resources: http://pastebin.com/NyBVqHVy
So this is what we've come to.
Like i was saying to >>24953256
Tojiko is actually making an adorable gift for us.
So jizos turned out to be useless then? Figures.
>>24953292
>stitches
hemo wtf
>>24953292
She accidentally made a gift for us; Seiga actually finished up and prepares the gift iirc.
Well, I now know how Extra Sanae's second ability works. Triple speed and 1.3x damage at low HP. That sounds crazy. You know what's crazier than that? The boost is always active, even if you switch out. Also, you have to be at 1 HP. Not 7 HP, not 10 HP, 1 HP exactly. It's really strict.
>>24953338
Thanks the the boats, we will never see the ending where we are back in the present where tojiko is all happy, futo doesn't remember a shit and became silly, miko doesn't remember a shit and became a girl, then Seija appears and says to Tojiko "hey! remember that girl you killed in a fit of rage?"
>>24953311
>useless
>>24953362We can always pretend, anon.
>>24953362
Seiga, i mean seiga, someone get the contrarian bitch out of my head.
>>24953343
That's a pretty cool ability. If you get rid of priority and status (which isn't very common anyway) you've likely got yourself a sweep.
Also posting in the new thread. New wind move. 95BP, 10% flinch (thanks for the latter info anon)
>>24953371
>スピニングエア
>already in http://pastebin.com/Nstzrrvy
>>24953387
「飛翔乱舞」 is "Soaring Dance."
>>24953371
So far, I feel like her biggest problem is Illusion types. She can Endure/Reversal, but Illusion types crap on both STAB moves. Still, she could be a nice revenge killer even without that. Not like you'll always have a priority user on the field, and she's bulky enough to the point where she isn't forced to Endure at first sight. Gotta watch for Dark moves though.
>>24953343
That's neat, but it also sounds like a pain in the ass.
>Have to breed a Sanae with D- defenses and health.
>>24953419
It kinda is. It's a pain to the point that I don't even know how to EV her. Max attack is obvious, but do you even need to put many EVs into speed when you're getting a 3x speed boost? Her special attack is kinda worthless so putting points in that seems stupid.
Reminder that last thread showed us proof just how insane low BST things can get in this game
Why the fuck haven't we banned these
>>24953458
80 base running at x3 is sure as hell enough to outspeed anything that isn't buffed, but investing into it could act as a handy counter to setup sweepers that have managed to stack up their own speed with some buffs.
I don't think it'd be a good idea to intentionally gimp her defenses though, 90/95/65 is hardly something to scoff at, she can easily take a hit from anything that doesn't hit SE and then pop the endure after that.
I think it'd be pretty justified to do her EVs on focus attack and spread defense and still S out all her IVs. The spread defense will drastically widen her ability to take a hit before resorting to danger mode and that extra turn can be a big deal.
>>24953458
Just do 0/64/0/64/0/0 and have a move slot for HP to deal with physical walls.
>>24953458
>do you even need to put many EVs into speed when you're getting a 3x speed boost?
I've not played competitive in ages, but I would say yes. You don't want to be entirely reliant on her ability. Best treat it as a kick-ass backup strat more than your entire game.
This may help: http://pastebin.com/6sMtxB8G
To illustrate how important investment is: base 40 full investment beats base 80 no investment.
>>24953491
I'm not planning on gimping her defenses, but if she's left at 2 HP, she's kinda screwed. One of her moves will be Endure, so chances are she's gonna be predictable. Still, I can see some sort of mind games played with her.
>>24953499
You don't want to rely entirely on it, but her defenses and typing are respectable outside of the massive Dark weakness. She's going to be taking hits before getting her huge speed boost anyways, so she might not need many.
>>24953499
actually, looking at >>24953491 anon's case I kinda like his idea more. It's essentially two-mode Sanae: FoDef wall -> 300+ speed sweeper.
A compromise might be the best bet. Put in enough speed to outspeed key threats/ensure boosted opponents can't outspeed you. And then pump defense with the rest.
>>24953491
>I don't think it'd be a good idea to intentionally gimp her defenses though, 90/95/65 is hardly something to scoff at, she can easily take a hit from anything that doesn't hit SE and then pop the endure after that.
The problem with that is that plenty of things are going to be outspeeding her before she gets the speed buff. It's dangerous to rely on endure if you're not even sure if she'll have enough time to pull it off.
>>24953531
Oh wait Endure gets Priority, nevermind then.
>>24953531
Endure is +4 priority anon, no need to worry about that.
>>24953536
Don't you just lose to priority at that point?
>>24953545
Absolutely, which is why I think it's crucial to get that extra defense to let her survive a turn or two and get that almost-guaranteed damage in while the endure into danger mode is the backup plan to try and squeeze out as much as you can before something comes in to put her down for good.
>>24953545
That's her thing. Low HP is the murder zone for her, do or die. And the good thing is that you can switch out since she doesn't lose the boost like an Unburden user would. You either live long enough to remove priority and sweep the world or you die trying.
>>24953474
Because Wackysacky can be put down with one solid Poison attack.
>>24953474
>Orange will always be shit despite the power = low cost rule
Extra Sanae's level 70 moves aren't very helpful from what I can see. The only two notable things are the fact that she gets her own priority and this move I've never seen.
So basically the lower your cost, the more likely you are to actually be good?
That seems backwards
>>24953622
520-540 is the sweetspot if you ask me.
>>24953622
More based on BST than cost but basically yeah, higher cost usually means higher BST anyways.
The sweespot is usually in the 480-520 range.
>>24953612
精神歪曲
("Spirit Distortion")/("Spirit Warp")
相手を 暗闇と 混乱状態にする
("Inflicts Darkness and Confusion on the opponent.")
>>24953632
>>24953630
So 520 is the perfect BST then?
Good, just like everything else about her.
>>24953643
Wow, that's sure a quick way to neuter a focus attacker real good.
SanaeE isn't the ideal candidate to have that but I can sure see that being a potent skill.
>>24953650
I admire the dedication to make everything about Raiko, you're doing her proud.
>>24953650
It's the sweetspot of good abilities and well distributed stats. It's got stuff like Aya, Sakuya, Sanae, Seiga and more. Low BST stuff can be really good, but also suffer from being gimmicky at times. High BST stuff have had their problems talked about enough.
>>24953664
Sanae could run it if she wanted to. She's not limited to Final Sweep mode, she has an ability that reduces light and dark damage. I mean, it's not as cool, but it's an option. I get what you mean though, Sanae suffers from serious 4MSS. Endure and Reversal are mandatory on an Utmost Limit build, leaving you with two moves. You have two priority moves in Sneaking and Over Ray if you hate priority users that much, and Sneaking seems really nice since she's walled by Illusion types otherwise, although it's risky. You might want Light STAB, but maybe not since it's a bad attacking type. She gets water Earthquake, Grand Liberate and Dark Arrow for coverage.
>>24953664
Good.
One thing I've noticed is that "sure-fire things" are nowhere near as surefire here; the type resist charms working even on neutral or resisted hits means that an expected OHKO or 2HKO may actually not be the case, and things can easily get enough bulk to survive ridiculous things.
Also in crazy-theory-crafting-land, RaikoP with a Straw Doll can survive a Water Spout from Primal Kyogre and OHKO back with Emperor's Indignity (assuming full HP investment and SpA investment on both ends with boosting nature). Which I guess makes sense, she can handle Waggyswaggy after all with HP Poison.
>>24953770
Speaking of that, all this crazy theorycrafting makes me hope Stealth Steel actually becomes more popular. It's funny because I was terrified of it being good before.
>>24953770
You know, in that hypothetical theorycrafted environment, wouldn't dragons be overpowered as shit since on the puppet side only steel would resist?
ha, kasen is doing placeholder miko duty
>>24953797
Who cares, they'd be patched to have more types resist them quickly anyways.
>>24953819
This is art.
Now that I check, they sure added a lot of stuff with Metallurgy and Spin Smash. Guess they were expecting more hazard usage.
>alternate costume kogasa is pure cute
Is she any good
>>24954095
From what I hear, yes. Speaking of outfits, I want to try to make Meiling work since her alt is so good.
>>24954095
It's Kogasa. It would be surprising for her to be remotely useful
>>24954104
Actually she is.
>>24954475
How is she useful, target practice?
So far, Extra Seiga hasn't been impressing me. Is 120 speed worse than I gave it credit for?
>>24953819
>>24953823
I love Miko Kasen.
>>24954554
Yes, you lose out to AyaP, FutoS, PElly after set-up, and FutoE amongst other things, which is bad when you have a giant glowing 4x weak to wind and are pretty fragile to begin with. FutoE is particularly bad since she's immune to fighting, resists poison, and you don't resist nether.
Higher speeds are much more common in this game than in Pokemon, which is another issue high BSTs have; they tend to get stuck with middling speed stats that aren't high enough to outspeed lots of things even fully invested, let alone if you ignore speed investment. Base 100 is the bare minimum for it to really be worth pushing speed full-bore, and even then there are puppets who would rather not invest in it and just take advantage of being able to outspeed things that do invest in speed while using the EV points to shore up HP or defenses instead.
Like RaikoE.
>>24954588
Even in game I'm kinda bummed out by her. I've been struggling with this last fight since I kinda forgot to stock up on healing items, and she doesn't do anything but die. Stuff like Rin, Sariel, the stupid clown, it's frustrating. Her defense is okay, it's only her spread defense that's really bad.
I'm actually seeing a lot of potential in SanaeE so far. She's got two completely different sets, but both are nice. You could go bulky and just hit things normally while only having a 2x weakness, or go for a set that includes a lot of risky plays. If hazards show up, one of those Metallurgy Smash Spinners could pair really nicely with her.
I am starting to think people care less about how good a given puppet is and more about how cute it is
>>24954714
But almost all of them are cute.My favorites are cuter than your favorites.
>>24954714
Ya think?
>>24954714
Those people are idiots who would rather stare at cute fanart than play the game.
Real men, the ones used to Smogon-style play, know the only puppets worth using are the good ones.
Wait, isn't Smogon's entire metagame a completely unofficial fabrication anyways?
>>24954733
>Literally not having a soul.
>>24954752
Ok I can't even shitpost about being a Smogon fanboy and try to play a straight face anymore.
It's obvious this game is not meant to be played competitively.
>>24954750
It kinda makes sense to apply it to this game, although no one seriously would. Doubles doesn't even exist here.
>>24954765
I'd say the game's competitive nature just resides in using your favorites to beat other people's favorites. Since absolutely everything is viable in some way, and the game has counters to almost everything it can throw at you more or less. There seems to be a rather formidable gathering in the Japanese community, though beyond that I have no clue.
Yeah, I definitely want this on my final team.
>>24954770
How would doubles change the meta?
So is it worth playing the expansion before we have a translation?
I've already cleared the original.
>>24954819
Doubles would be a different meta entirely. If it replaced singles for some reason, just expect that nearly every puppet has the equivalent of Protect on their moveset. Weather would be more powerful by virtue of having two puppets on the field and games would be faster and slightly more read based because of protect shenanigans. More puppets would be "viable", although I don't think there's many that are unviable to begin with.
http://thpp.supersanctuary.net/forum/index.php?topic=446.msg2746#msg2746
1.01 patch for TPDP v1.34 is up. Fixes a bunch of typos and shit
I thought you guys said Reimu didn't like you.
![35uL0LU[1].png](https://i.imgur.com/MJNyiuD.png "35uL0LU[1].png")
Version 1.01 of the base Touhou Puppet Dance Performance patch is up! Go get it here
http://thpp.supersanctuary.net/forum/index.php?topic=446.0
Picture related, it's the entire bug-fix list for 1.00->1.01.
It also uses a new patching system (because again, fuck beat.), and this system will be what we use for the Yume no Kakera translation when we release it. Enjoy folks!
>>24954932
A little technical bump but it's fixed; the link on the forum thread now properly links to the new patch.
>>24954924
It's more she has no opinion of you other than "you're that human that appeared and helped out once".
>>24954932
You can just patch this over a pre-translated version, right? No big deal?
>>24954963
Worth a try, but I don't know. Elyk made the patch while I was asleep and told me to post it, then was asleep before I woke up from my nap. I tested it on a Japanese 1.34 to make sure it worked, and it did. If you wanna enter a brave new frontier, I'd recommend backing it up (I always recommend doing that anyways).
One thing I will say in regards to the patch, it assumes you havent moved the game from the default install directory. If you get issues installing the patch, manually input the directory the folder is into the installer's prompt.
>>24954963
I just tried it an it worked fine for my pre-translated version
Well, RIP my dreams. I don't know what it is, Sanae is immune to something she shouldn't be. It's not a fluke, it happened three times in a row.
>Yukari Extra gets Wisdom Eye
I might end up running her just for that.
Speed Youmu's 70 moves are Last Slash and the 90 BP physical move. Nothing exciting, but it makes it easier to go full physical or special.
Ok, why do you not like Smogon?
I'm fine with you guys having your waifu wars, but what's with the smogon hate? Can't we have our own fun?
>>24955134
>>24955138
Don't be rude
>>24955134
I don't hate smogon at all, just don't try to force your smogon into my puppets.
>>24955141
>>24955152
Thanks
>>24955149
So the Smogon metagame style doesn't fit or something like that?
>>24955154
Pretty much. It's a balanced enough game that we don't need bans or the like. And the meta isn't very large in the west anyway, so there's no real reason to set up a ruleset like smogon has.
>>24955154
More or less, yeah. The game is really intricately balanced out so that everything is viable, and that everything has a really good counter of sorts. If something seems overpowered, there's likely something that exists to shut it down. There are some skills which might be a bit extreme, but there's never really been an absolute need to go and ban things from netplay. There are a few things which are banned by the game by default, such as species clause and the Soul Dew-like item, but beyond that there isn't much else.
>>24955166
>this happened with no bans
What the hell, is GF just shit at balancing?
>>24953458
I think you'll want at least ONE more point of Speed.
Base 80 with no investment hits 100 Speed, which means with the boost you'll be at 300 Speed, and possibly speed tying Good Belt AyaP (10% run her with Good Belt, believe it or not).
Just two PPs in Speed to put you at 101 ensures that won't happen.
>>24955171
Yes. These guys aren't great, but from what it looks like so far, the strongest things all exist around the same power level, although there's obviously weaker stuff. They can get pretty weak too.
>>24955171
GF introduced Mega Rayquaza, I don't think we even need to talk about how bad they are at balancing. You could probably balance better than GF blindfolded and with less game dev experience than a toddler.
>>24955171
I guess one way to put it would be "more smooth"
There's still a few things that are laughably terrible (the equivalents to Regigigas and Slaking, although the former does have a HUGE payoff in the expansion if you actually stall out the 5 turns), and a few things that are pretty nuts (although nowhere near on par with Uber stuff in Pokemon still), but generally the difference between a weak puppet and a strong one is so much less drastic than the difference between a bad Pokemon and a good Pokemon.
Like one area people feel like the balance is off is that the high BST stuff is too WEAK compared to the lower BST stuff. Like BST 580-600 puppets (the absolute top-end) tend to suffer in basically every single regard, while the lower BST puppets can be so minmaxed that it gets kind of ridiculous.
See >>24953474? That's theorycrafting showing how a BST 370 puppet (with an ability that's Pure Power but for ATK AND DEF to be fair) could tear apart the BST 770 puppet, while a BST 480 puppet could set up on and then commence to brutally murder Primal Kyogre. The catch is that both of them have huge blatant weaknesses t (the former dies to special attacks so easily it's incredible, and the latter has a 4x weakness to poison that will wipe her out with remarkable ease and HAS to put up the game's equivalent to Trick Room to become truly terrifying)Fun fact: that reply included in the first post discussing Primal Groudon and SukunaD? That was the only real reply to it; people cared less about the fact that SukunaD was hilariously overpowered and more about the fact that Sukuna was adorable.
>>24955179
Honestly, Mega Rayquaza isn't even that good of an example; regular Rayquaza was already designed to be blatantly overpowered like the other version mascot legendaries, Mega Rayquaza being even more hilariously overpowered than everything else isn't really that crazy.
Mega Salamence would be a better example.
>>24955205
*BST 770 Primal Groudon
This is what I get for staying up too late.
>>24955205
I feel like part of the balance comes from how ridiculous some of these things are. You have priority Topsy Turvy. You have something that's an Unburden boost on top of a Life Orb boost that you can keep through switching. Moody is on stuff with crazy stats. Yet it works partially because a decent number of things are kinda broken. I believe a decent number of these things would be easy Ubers in Pokemon, but aren't here due to different factors.
>>24955205
How much defense does the first puppet have if a 506 ATK Precipice Blades from Primal Groudon can't 1-shot it on a weakness, and what does a Golden Hairpin do? How much bulk and firepower does the BST 480 puppet have to be able to take Primal Kyogre's Thunders and return in kind with what I assume is a BP 75 (with what I hope to god is a STAB boost) move? And what do they look like in-game?
>>24955224
>priority Topsy Turvy
>Unburden + Life Orb that isn't eliminated through switches
>Moody
What.
>>24955238
Kotohime is cool
By the way how is EKotohime?
>>24955238
>priority Topsy Turvy
Phase Inversion, gets good distribution too.
>Unburden + Life Orb that isn't eliminated through switches
Sanae Extra that we were discussing earlier in the thread gets a new ability like that. Oh, and she gets Endure. And there's a Weakness Policy equivalent item in the game.
>Moody
Several good users, but Taunt is a TM and Phase Inversion, like I mentioned, has good distribution.
>>24955224
Honestly Moody is too unreliable and risky in this game. SuwakoS may be BST580 and have the ability, but she misses out on all the stall moves in exchange and so is too RNG to really be able to take advantage of it. Hell, only 20% of KomachiP run Moody, and she actually HAS the movepool to stall.
>>24955266
That's what I'm saying. A lot of these things would sound crazy in Pokemon, but they just work here. One reason might just be because the type chart isn't as extreme, but that's the only other thing I can think of.
>>24955238
Defense Sukuna is the puppet that can tank Groudon. She's a Steel/Earth (basically this game's version of ground, with some elements of rock thrown in) with base 50 defense, and an ability that doubles her "physical" (this game's version of physical attacks are called focus attacks) defense and "physical attack. Golden Hairpin is basically a physical version of Assault Vest. Gif related is what she typically looks like in game, but keep in mind that her Defense version appears tiny in game.
![hqdefault[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/9m8RUNN.jpg "hqdefault[1].jpg")
>>24955298
so smol
>>24955238
To answer your questions:
1. SukunaD's defense when fully invested is on par with a fully invested base 150 Pokemon thanks to Miracle Mallet's doubling it. She only has base 75 HP but her defense is so high that she can dodge the OHKO by the skin of her teeth even without investing in it.
2. The Golden Hairpin is basically equivalent to Pokemon's Assault Vest, except instead of giving a 50% boost to SpDef, it gives the 50% boost to Def instead.
3. WakasagiE's stat spread is 120/40/70/145/70/35. Your assumption on Energy Absorb being a BP 75 move (with STAB) is correct by the way. Kyogre is basically using a non-STAB BP 110 move while she's using a STAB BP 75 move hitting a weakness. Note that WakasagiE learns the game's equivalent to Trick Room and gets an ability that makes her water type moves 50% stronger while it's up.
4. I don't have the sprites on hand, but it is worth noting that SukunaD is significantly smaller than all the other puppets in the game.
>>24955282
Oh yeah that's a pretty big thing too.
Basically the type chart is like this in terms of logic:
Defensively:
No type gets fewer than 2 resistances or more than 5 resistances. No type gets more than one immunity and if it does get an immunity it only gets 3 resistances tops. Furthermore, no type has more than 3 weaknesses.
Offensively, no type is resisted by more than four types or has more than one type immune to it (although there are types that offensively have 3 resists and an immunity to worry about, like electric or fighting).
The big one: No type is resisted by fewer than two types period (so that the game doesn't orient around a single extremely strong attacking type like Gen 5's Dragon type). There used to be one exception to this (Nether being resisted only by Light), but the expansion changed it so that Nether was also resisted by Sound.
Anyone have the expansion type chart on them?
>>24955238
And Wakasagihime Extra is the puppet that can take Kyogre. She has 120/70/70 bulk, a Water/Nature (basically grass) typing, 145 base Sp. Attack, and if that wasn't enough she has an ability that doubles her Sp. Attack while Trick Room is up. Her draining move is called Energy Absorb, and yeah it's a STAB boosted attack with 75 BP. Pic related, it's her.
>>24955312
Only 50% boost to water type moves, she's not completely absurd.
>>24955314
Ah, I wasn't aware of that. Still, it's a pretty powerful ability.
>>24955309
>>24955312
>>24955314
How can something this cute be this powerful?
>>24955309
The expansion chart can be found in the pastebin in the op.
http://i.imgur.com/CyhPbhg.pngI wish Light was a slightly better offensive type. The expansion helped a little bit, but still.
>>24955328
Wait I'm just kidding the expansion didn't help one bit. I keep thinking that Warp is weak to Light for some reason.Why did they have to give Marisa practically no bulk along with a type that's only really good for defense? I mean Speed at least gets electric to counteract this some, but still.
>>24955266
I think the reason Moody sees so little play is because of how fast paced the meta is. Moody only works well if you have time to build up some good stats, in a meta where stall typically sucks.
That, and there are several ways to fuck over Moody, like Phase Inversion and Wisdom Eye.
>>24955309
>no type has more than 5 resistances
No Steel equivalent? How the hell do you wall things or run stall teams?
>>24954524
quiver dance
>>24954781
nice
>>24955387
>stall teams
Don't exist.
>>24955387
With bulky puppets. That said, defense is kind of weak in this game. It's a very offense oriented game.
>>24955387
By not being a stall playing cunt.
>>24955387
>wall things
Run things with good bulk.
>run stall teams
Now see, there's a funny thing about that.
There's a terrain effect (Seiryuu) that while it's up makes all healing turn into damage. No one runs it unless they want an autowin on Stall, but it is a thing.
There's a status condition (Weakness) that stops healing when it's on a puppet. The game's equivalent to Scald inflicts it rather than Burn.
The equivalent to Rapid Spin is a skill card (i.e. TM). It's also BP 50, a special attack, and wind type, if those matter to you
The equivalent to Taunt is a skill card that is learned by almost literally everybody (Upbeat).
Stall just doesn't work. You want to try and win by using entry hazards and all the walls to grind your opponent's team into the dust, you're going to lose.
Bulky offense is perfectly viable however: It turns out the best way to keep damage to your puppets down is to beat the other side's puppets into submission first.
>>24955328
>>24955332
Light is pretty damn good to have on a fast offensive puppet. You get +5 resists and effectively automatically counter weaknesses so long as they don't have Dark Clothing or higher speed.
>>24955419
Resistances don't matter much if your puppet can be ohko'd by a stiff breeze.
>>24955419
Uh, Dark Clothing actually is like Dry Skin from Pokemon.
It makes it WEAKER to Light (25% more damage).
Help
What's the japanese name for Magic Fragments.
>>24955441
it's 魔力の欠片
>>24955430
A 110 cost puppet like Marisa really isn't that flimsy though.
>>24955442
Thanks anon.
So which puppets do you get to transfer from your previous save? Just your starter or all of them?
>>24955507
All of them, but you don't get them back until much much later into the game.
>>24955563
That's okay. I'm just glad I don't have to worry about catching every single puppet again since I already did it in the first game.
So what old puppets will remain good post expansion?
>>24955686
Kosuzu
Make a team gimmick and the next person finds a counter to it:
I'll start: Nether-type Hyper Offense
>>24955968
WakasagihimeE + other genbu monsterstee hee
For fun I've got all of the puppets who learn quiver dance/fairly dance here
>>24955686
Power Lyrica, Assist Kurumi, and Defense Rumia were already great and seem better than ever. Everything else in my battle box took a hit from something new.
>>24955990
Extra Koishi (bulky focused attacker) learning it is super useless.
Now everyone who learns imposing air (dragon dance)
>>24955990
Are any of them actually good
And lastly, Sharp air (+ Sp.Att, + Speed)
>>24955996
KogasaA has proven herself to be a true threat. New meta now, but she actually received a +10 Sp.Att buff so I don't see her going anywhere.
RinE looks interesting. 85/55/50/105/110/105 spread with fairy dance.
>>24955990
>WakasagihimeE + other genbu monsters
Upbeat. Especially Curiosity + Upbeat.
>>24955990
>genbu
>not knowing about Taunt
I recently discovered this game, and I live it to death. I played through it over the course of a couple weeks, and I had a blast with it, but now I'm thinking of trying to make a competitive team, and I have no idea where to start. Which toohoos are some of the better ones? I went through the first time with a team of some of my favorites, and while some of then worked out great, some of then weren't so good. Do you guys have any tips for good team-building? What are some important things to have available/plan for? I'm somewhat familiar with nature's and IVs and such, and I've played enough competitive Pokemon to know how that stuff works (and that this stuff is very different).
>>24956516
Also, pic related, because she's my favorite and I would like to keep her on my team, if possible.
>>24956516
You can check out usage statistics here: http://www.gensou-suwako.com/correct/data_first/URViewer/URrank.php
For teambuilding you might want to check out the excel puppetdex (it comes with a team-builder)
What are your other favorites? If you want them appraised people here are generally familiar with the current meta. Mind you, all of this is going to be thrown out the window when the expansion is translated.Also good taste. Koishi has one of the best sprites in the game
>>24953269
Oh hey, someone used one of my shitty GIFs as an OP image. That's mildly amusing.
And this Raiko doesn't even hate my guts anymore! Things are on the up and up.
>>24956591
Yeah I'm just an english pleb that's waiting on the translation but I still want to show off the neat new YnK stuff so I've been stealing other peoples' pictures for the OPs.
Figured that's better than spamming the same base-game pictures everyone's already seen themselves or bringing in even more shitposting by using 2hu fanart.
ALRIGHT BOYS. We now have usage statistics for the first week. Of course, these will likely change drastically, but at the very least we can see what others have deemed immediately and obviously useful.
1. HecatiaE (keikaku etc)
2. JunkoE
3. HinaE
4. MomijiE
5. SatoriE
6. JunkoS
7. SagumeE
8. ReimuE
9. AyaP
10. SagumeD
11. MedicineE
12. SakuyaE
13. DoremyD
14. KokoroE
15. SagumeP
15. SeijaE
16. LilyE
17. ClownpieceS
18. DoremyE
19. RemiliaE
20. SanaeE
21. ToyohimeE
22. ShinikiE
23. AkyuuE
24. ShizuhaE
25. YoumuE
26. RemiliaP
27. KoishiE
28. CirnoE
28. UtsushoS
29. JunkoP
30. SukunaD
Haha. Did I say this list would be representative of what people have deemed immediately and obviously useful? Nevermind, it's clearly mostly just people screwing around with new forms/puppets with a few tryhard faggots running AyaP in the background.
>>24956650
New meta confirmed: Use nothing but newhus, extra styles and AyaP. Get to work.
No love for FishE though, that's surprising. Seems they aren't as hype about it as we are. HecatiaE sure is universal though.
Loadsa defensive puppets up there which seems to show that they're trying out a slower meta, but that could also be because a fuckload of new stuff happened to be defensive and they just want to do it because it's new.
>>24956650
>no Patchy anywhere
brb killing self
>>24956679
>Not having your top two show up in that list three times
Step up your waifu game anon.
>>24956679
she's 54th. E style.
>>24956650
>3. HinaE
Whoa, my favourite is finally in the spotligt.
Proof that Fire/Poison with Levitate is a fantastic combination (and with 30 speed, possibly indication that Genbu is as good as we think). Mega Weezing when, Gamefreak?
>11. SagumeD
I told you, Sagumeanon. I told you she was good.
>14. KokoroE
>16. LilyE
People predicting these would be frightening were right.
>26. RemiliaP
>30. SukunaD
Now these are surprising. I thought Sukuna would maintain her presence better, and I never dreamed Remilia would be somewhat high thanks to all the other good Wind-types, and the fact Dark-type is pretty bad offensively.
>>24956734
You shouldn't be looking that far into this right now, it really doesn't show off anything other than what people are most interested in trying out, not what's actually good or not.
This is also primetime for there to be a ton of people who couldn't care less about effectiveness and are simply bringing in their waifus just to have some fun.
Now I have TRULY become the NPC.
>>24956567
Oh, hey, thanks. This is pretty helpful.
As for my other favorites, I'm quite partial to Marisa, Mokou, Youmu, and Tenshi. Mokou was on my team for my playthrough, bu I found her to be a little unreliable at times, and overall not quick enough to be an effective sweeper, but not durable enough to tank.
Yuyuko also ended up on my team, and she was awesome. Easily one of my most reliable, and she could damage race a lot of other toohoos, even with no SpAtk investment.
My starter the first time was Miko, and she was okay, but by the end she just didn't perform how I wanted her to. CirnoP was a surprisingly great toohoo, and I wound up keeping her around a lot longer than I expected to. I tried out Remilia, and while she was fine in the damage department, I'm not sure how she stacks up compered to some of the others.
Honestly, there are a lot of toohoos I want to try out, but I'm still trying to even wrap my head around the new type chart.
>>24956771
Not yet, you still need to change your sprite.
>>24956780
I also like Kokoro and Hina a lot, so a team with them on it would also be cool.
>>24956650
You're good now Kokoro! Isn't that great.
>>24956782
Now I am TRULY, TRULY the NPC.
>>24956833
Now you just have to slaughter him and take his place.
>>24956650
Oh neat, KanakoE made it to 47.
>44% of them are using Cross Counter
I know her movepool is barren, but really?
>>24956650
Source? I want to see how Raiko is holding up (obviously not well if everyone is too busy running new stuff rather than older things)
>>24957267
NM, found her at 78 in her P incarnation; still, having a spot on the list at all means she's at least holding up!
>>24956650
>12. SakuyaE
Neat. When is Sakuya available in the base game anyways? It's honestly hard to pick between her and Yukari as my favorites.
>>24957277
How much does it matter anyways? I mean, there's a decent number of puppets in the game. I imagine stuff lower on the list would be around the same level as some of the stuff off of it.
>>24957301
SDM, which isn't too far into the game.
>>24956650
>>24957301
Actually it's SakuyaP.
>>24957307
Not at all; she's going to be used by me anyways, and both of her original stances got some significant buffs; the question is whether or not the 3v3 meta is receptive to them at all.
>>24957316
Is it really 3v3? That partially explains why everything is so offense oriented.
>>24957316
>Actually it's SakuyaP.
Welp I fucked that one up. Sorry mates.
And the direct link for future use: http://gensou-suwako.com/correct/data_append/URViewer/URrank.php
>>24957307
>SDM
Approximate level range?
>>24957316
SakuyaP, SakuyaE, whatever. I just like seeing Sakuya get love.
>>24957349
You can get her at level 22-24, your team will probably be around 28 or so.
>>24957363
Oh good, that sounds like only a couple areas away.
I didn't relalize the meta calls for 3v3 fights. I just assumed it was 6v6 like Pokemon. Who would be some good toohoos to compliment Koishi?
>>24957371
The random matchmaking is 3v3 only so that's definitely gonna be the go-to thing to build around, but the base-game-style specific IP matches can still do all the usual rulesets.
>>24957316
>>24957325
>>24957371
>>24957426
Why the hell is it 3v3 rather than 6v6? Why make it so you're only using half-size teams?
>>24957452
'Cause 3v3 is really popular over there, and works better for randbats since matches are so fast. The game is also clearly balanced for 3v3 and not 6v6, what with Moody and Power Gyokuto existing. Thankfully, Focas-Lens also added an option to arrange matches through their server, so you don't have to mess with port forwarding or Hamachi anymore even if you'd still rather just play 6v6. You'll just have to ask around for someone to fight you manually.
>>24957426
>>24957452
>>24957371
>>24957470
Actually, it's 6v3 for random battles online (i.e. you bring full teams of 6 and then each player picks 3 to actually do battle and leaves the other three on the side as cheerleaders)
So you have the prediction inherent in 6v6 games (since you don't know which 3 were picked and have to plan around the full 6 until the full 3 are known) while keeping the speed of 3v3 games.
>>24956815
KokoroE's untranslated ability might have something to do with that: it removes the drawbacks of Outrage style moves completely in exchange for reducing their strength by 10%.
>>24957482
But you still can't stall for shit unless you can predict which 3 puppets your opponent is using
>>24957470
>you don't have to mess with port forwarding or Hamachi anymore even if you'd still rather just play 6v6. You'll just have to ask around for someone to fight you manually.
That sounds pretty neat. I'm still gonna wait for a translation though, I hate not knowing what most of this crap does.
>>24957493
Stall being dead isn't a problem, it's an upside
If you aren't seeing any of your favorites' attack animations, you are playing the game wrong.
>>24957532
I wouldn't mind stall being alive, purely because Stealth Steel being viable helps me now.
>>24957532
>implying that the deliberate crippling and fucking over of an entire playstyle is a good thing
>>24957611
>implying that anybody wants to play stall or play against stall
>>24957645
Are you implying that stall is boring
>>24957651
Are you implying it isn't? Do you find enjoyment in taking 200 turns to whittle down your opponent's team?
>>24957675
Yes, yes I do. If you thought it wasn't enjoyable, why else would it be so popular on Smogon?
>>24957693
Those are people that enjoy the suffering of others.
Oh god.
Extra Nazrin has Stealth Trap and Mold Breaker. And Decresendo.
WELCOME TO ENTRY HAZARD SETTING GENERAL.
>>24956516
Not to interrupt this exciting stall argument, but does anyone have any suggestions for a solid competitive team, specifically one which includes Koishi and possibly also Kokoro? They're my favorites, and I want to use them.
>>24957938
just use your favorites m8
>>24957933
Oh baby, time for free boosts.
>>24957946
Is it actually that simple? If so, awesome. I just want to make sure that if I'm going to be using a competitive team, it's going to actually be competitive.
Lewd.
God damn I suck at this game, not knowing the types and the strengths and weaknesses sucks.
>>24958022
Don't worry anon. She wants to eat you literally.
How balanced is this compared to Pokemon
>>24957958
"Use your favorites" is generally almost always viable, assuming you build them correctly.
There are a vast wealth of bad styles that can be made even worse by not setting them up properly but there are very very few puppets that don't have access to at least a single worthwhile build if you know what you're doing.
About the only caveat is if you end up having 4+ puppets all being the same type, but that's pretty hard to accomplish unintentionally.
>>24958038
Stall is dead, use your favorites, get gud.
>>24958045
>About the only caveat is if you end up having 4+ puppets all being the same type, but that's pretty hard to accomplish unintentionally
I seem to do that a lot actually. Either they're weak to wind, or weak to steel. Sometimes fire as well.
>>24958036
>Forgetting vore
Still lewd to some
>>24958045
Fair enough. That simplifies things immensely. How would you guys recommend building these six?
Koishi
Kokoro
Tenshi
Youmu
Hina
Marisa
>>24958073
KoishiA
KokoroP
TenshiD
YoumuS
HinaA
MarisaS
Those are all the mostly-objectively-better styles for all of them based off of the top of my head and cross-referencing the base game usage chart.
Most of their other styles aren't bad either though so you should double check to see how they all synergize with each other and make some changes to fill some holes if needed, I'm too lazy to carry you through the entire process.
>>24958036
When you know the true meaning it's creepy.
Out of context it's lewd.
>>24958108
Awesome, thanks. I'll try those out. What's a good post-reincarnation leveling method? Or do I need to just to rub my face all over the grass in each area until I hit 70?
>>24958045
my favorite is rinnosuke
>>24958045
>>24958057
>play with my favorites
>most of my 2hus are weak to the same things which are extremely prevalent
>all battles down to the wire because of it, lots of frustration
>mfw
>>24958073
I would recommend swapping out Kokoro for Defense Mamizou, if only to give yourself a way of combating people who abuse state buffs plus type diversity.
>>24958045
How do I use Sukuna, Yorihime and Momiji on the same team?
>>24958172
Reincarnate as many puppets as you can get away with and then use the remaining high level ones to repeatedly farm Yuki, the first E4 fight in Makai, by beating her up, gapping back to Makai and then facing her again.
>>24958228
Steel is a great type so having three of them is hardly a bad thing, especially when two of them have a secondary type.
SukunaD, YorihimeS and MomijiS will do you fine.
>>24958220
Mamizou is another favorite of mine, so I'll try that.
>>24958229
Cool, thanks. I didn't think of that.
I feel like there is something hidden here, but holy crap this forest is large.
Then again, from what I've heard, this is small time, so I'm unsure how to feel about it.
>>24958258
Make sure to save before reincarnating in case you end up not being able to clear it reliably so you can reload their levels back.
A perfect team for the job can get away with using only 3 or even 2 puppets but odds are you'll want to keep 4 or possibly 5 if you're struggling at high level to use.
>>24958269
So, having just reloaded my save, I apparently reincarnated my entire main team. What do?
>>24958266
Second time there I spent most of my time thinking "where the fuck am I supposed to be going, I just want to go to the next area".
I was horribly disappointed by how small Muenzuka was in comparison to the travel to get there.
>>24958276
Beg to the Hakurei god because you done fucked yourself real good.
>>24958276
Uh, well, pray you have access to some decently leveled puppets in your box and then just start farming grass in the best area you can handle.
Makai and the Hakurei caves have some level 50-60 puppets that start off in normal style and are thus pretty weak shit for their level so you can catch them with pretty much any level 30 style changed puppet and then use the captured puppets to carry the rest of your team into a better area.
>>24957933
Everytime i hear something about Nazrin, my mind goes back to that doujin of her done by the guy that loves to draw heavely detailed motorcicles.
Horrible flashbacks to overpowered Gen 6 Pokemon part 4:
Extra Parsee gets Parental Bond. Except the second hit is 60% strength rather than 50%. And she's part Nether type and learns Starving Spirit. Let this sink in.Just messing with you, she's much slower and has significantly worse bulk, and it's 60% on BOTH hits.
>>24958310
I hope you aren't intending on leaving it just at that, sauce that shit so I can get some context.
>>24958306
It's sounding like starting over m8ght be my best option. I don't like the idea of having to, but I'd rather play through the game again than mindlessly grind. Now that I've got a good idea of who I want to use, it'll probably be quite easy.
Assuming I do, who would you suggest as a good replacement for Marisa? Looking up her abilities, neither of then sounds particularly good. And who's a good starter to carry me through things quickly?
>>24958314
>Parential Bond except stronger
>Starving Spirit with STAB
NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE NOPE
>>24958310
That guy is god tier.
>>24958317
>never saw a panzer doujin
You are losing on some great shit.
>>24958324
>65 base speed
>100 Sp. Atk
It's all gonna be okay.
>>24958314
fuck that shit look at AKasen
>>24958335
What's scary about AKasen, the lectures?
>>24958328
I have acquired context and am enjoying it.
>>24958323
ChenA would be your best bet.
She gets used for speedruns and she's pretty much just straight up better at what Marisa does.
Kind of a waste to choose her as your starter when she can be the first puppet you catch in the game though. MikoS and RemiliaP are also great picks for stomping through the story.
>>24958357
Oh, cool. I'll grab her, then. And I used MikoS as my starter last time, so I'll give Remilia a try. She was awesome even without A in everything, so she should do well here. Thanks.
>>24958340
Only the yama can give scary lectures.
>>24958445
That reminds me, does anyone have the level 70 moves for her? I might just check for myself.
>>24958323
Stick with Marisa, Kleptomania is actually a fantastic ability when paired with an elemental gem. She's meant to be a scout, so typically you lightning speed or changeling out, spending the gem in the process, while stealing an item from your opponent. And ignore >>24958357, ChenA is exclusively good for speed running, she's not actually all that good for netplay.
>>24958499
Nigga what? Double immunity with encourage alongside passive trapping to guarantee maxing out your attack into a free kill followed up by 120 base speed with tripled damage to wreak havoc isn't good in netplay?
She's #28 on the all-time usage for a good reason.
>>24958532
True, butshe's a memehu.
>>24958537
Listen here you little shit,you're right, I'm sorry.
Ignore >>24958499, ChenA is a monster in netplay due to possessing Arena Trap alongside tools Dugtrio could only dream of. She is a lot worse in the expansion, but basically Niche Assist Chen breaks in-game while Adverse Winds Assist Chen breaks netplay.
>>24958532
That reminds me, I wonder how many of the things in the expansion will drop. Some of them seem kinda strange to see.
Why Flandre is so cute when she is so dangerous?
Be honest, who here is a secondary?
Updated the pastebin w/ the link to the YnK Puppets Usage Chart.It feels like as if I've never left at all; why did I even bother trying to?
>>24958620
Please leave.
>>24957525
Will get to translating the webpage for hosting battles and any other descriptions/details for hosting in game.
However, for the time being, please refer to http://fgts.jp/vp/thread/24884448/#q24894340 in order to get a better idea of the new layout for setting up matches w/ others.
>Don't even have 'cut' yet
>Already 31 puppets
Christ, I can't keep myself from scouring the grass of each new area I hit for new stuff.
>>24958620
Don't use that buzzword from /v/
>>24958532
>>24958541
Both are compelling points. >>24958537
has a point, though. I'll have to think on this.
>>24958624
It was just an excuse to dump off thread making duty onto me, you monster. Now I can never leave.
>>24958620
People here get offended by getting called out, please no bully.
Even though Letty was nerfed, I feel pretty good. She's so fun to use that I want to make a double peace sign.
>>24958563
Definitely some of them; I feel like Japan is looking towards the new ones and messing around with them rather than seeing how the old favorites fit in or changed.
Like at any rate the pool of viable 2hus is going to be so large that you can throw any Smogon tiering system out the door because most puppets are going to be viable.I am disappointed there is no statistic on how many puppets use their waifu costume, although I would expect the number of matches involving those to be 95% at minimum
>>24958647
I've seen some people using what said Awakening Sign and some other sign. If those are the super stat boosters that don't work online, I think it's kinda funny.
>>24958638
I'mactually okay with that. I have a feeling I would accidentally use a lewd image for the OP, anyways.
>>24958625
Same here, already have everything up to and including the blazing hells.
Palace of the Earth Spirits was the quickest yet, each of the 4 showed up one after the other. Thought it'd be a 15 minute hunt for Koishi like it is for the other rare ones.
>>24958665
I wish I could just throw cute pictures into the OP and call it a day but these threads already get enough flak as is even when I keep it as game-related as possible.
/vp/ just doesn't appreciate cute things enough, life's hard.
>>24958669
I'm not even sure if I've missed any.
There are just so many.Even worse is that I don't recognize many of them.
>>24958647
Part of the surprise for me is KanakoE. I still think she's rather middling, but she's #47. What strikes me as especially weird is that she performs worse in 3v3 stuff and gets dumped on by HecatiaE, the most common thing online.
Slightly more surprising is that D is at 62 even though she didn't get any major changes. Guess that form is just solid enough to work anyways.
>>24958673
Last four threads haven't really been shat up all that much though.
>>24958676
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ffd2TgJOvvDdikysNcnhCfIDLrwZwIH4Tbpy0PUIYMg/edit
Has each puppet encounter chance for each chronological area
>>24958682
Some naive delusional part of me likes to hope that it's because I've been keeping the OP pictures exclusively as screenshots from the game that show off that it has Pokemon-style gameplay, but it's probably just because they all got bored and gave up.
>>24958673
What? so far these thread have been good, there is a "go back to /jp/!" fag every once in a while, but unlike in /v/, they have no power here and everyone ignores them.
>>24958699
Maybe I'll just toss up a cute 2hu picture next thread and see how it goes.
>>24958693
Yep, missing probably two in the human village so far in addition to that shrine/graveyard I'm at.
>South Forest of Magic (Huge Tree Area) (Level 25-27)
You don't need anything to get here?
>>24958708
It must be the cutest at your disposal.
>>24958620does playing the fangames but not the shmups count as secondary?
>>24958673
>>24958698
>>24958708
You're the new chief now, remember?Use as many qt pictures as you want. Or is this a ploy in order to have me make threads again?
>>24958708
Something like in >>24958665 would be good.
>>24958710
it's connected to the part that requires the boat to reach.
