>Pokemon gets a signature move
>It's shit
What's their name?
>>24827911
exeggutor and kadabra
Octillery
>Pokemon gets a signature move
>it's distributed to already better mons and are now more closely attributed to the usurpers
>>24827911
What is Zygarde?
Latios and Latias
>>24827980
>pokemon gets a signature move
>identical to a pre existing move but the original wouldn't fit thematically
>>24827911
Delphox
Along with other issues, GF clearly doesn't like the Delphox line.
Genesect.
>Literally just a shitty version of Judgment
>Doesn't even have STAB
>>24828036
Luster Purge and Mist Ball either needed a higher base power or a 100% chance of second effect activation.
Chesnaught and Delphox lost their signature moves in OR/AS, but Greninja is still the only Pokémon that can learn Mat Block.
Frog favoritism persists.
>>24828078
Greninja got two signature moves to begin with.
>>24828079
And the best HA
>>24828078
>>24828079
>>24828117
This is because water starters are objectively better.
>>24828169
>samurott
>better than anything
god no, more like they wanted to redeem the water starters because samurott is a complete fucking disaster
>>24828187
We don't talk about Gen 5 starters.
>>24828169
>worst gen 1 starter
>gen 2 starters are all equally shit
>worst gen 3 starter
>gen 4 starters are all equally great
>worst gen 5 starter
The only reason Greninja is good is because he doesn't need to be a crummy Water-type.
>>24828230
>worst gen III starter
Swampert was significantly better in game, competitive, and more popular than sceptile and blaziken at release. Sceptile and Blaziken's popularity is relatively newfound, and Swampert can owe his own dip in popularity to his shit mega. Even then, that merely makes him the worst, but still good in his own right, gen III starters blow gen II, V, and two thirds of VI out of the fucking water.
>>24828257
>Swampert was significantly better in game
of course it was better in game because all you do in hoenn is fucking surf
>>24828230
Feraligatr is the best out the the three Gen 2 starters. Typhlosion is a one trick pony and Meganium doesn't do shit.
>Electric types as a whole aren't that good besides Thunder guys, what should we do?
>Let's give them a new move! Electric type Double Edge! That'll really help the physical side.
>I'm glad we could fix this problem for only Pikachu so easily and no other Pokemon. At all.
>>24828276
screens, swords dance sweeper
other things just do these better
>>24828169
Give me one good fucking reason that a xXxLOnE_wOlFxXx Ninja mon got a move that protects its entire team over the Knight mon from the same fucking starter group.
>>24828315
mat block is fucking shit anyway
>no priority
>only works once
>no secondary effect
>doesn't protect from status
spiky shield is wayy more useful
>>24828329
That's true. It doesn't excuse greninja getting two moves, though.
And yes, water shuriken is trash, but whatever.
Literally all GF had to do was make Chesnaught Grass/Steel or something and give delphox sheer force and they could compete with the frog, but no, the 10 year olds are more important than actually cool choices for teams
>>24827911
Smelling salts and makuhita. Like, why? Why would it ever use that?
Noble roar on pyroar. Pyroar should be great - good design, great speed, good power, good stabs, but it has a shitty movepool. How does gf fix it? Give it a useless debuff move.
Delibird should be obvious. I really don't know why GF will never bother to update gen 2 mons. Most are utter abominations. Guess the kids need their super kewl ninja frogs, scurry dragons and mewtwos.
Based Victini gets all the best Signature moves.
>>24828423
>Makuhita
>Smelling Salts
>Implying fat men in a ring don't get chaffed skin after pushing people out of the circle all day
>Noble Roar
>Lions made of fire
>When a lion roars, the desert stops
>Nobility due to the fact that Kalos puts them on a hidden pedestal, at least in the pet market anyway
>Delibird
>A retardedly cute Santa analogue
>Implying giving stuff to your enemies doesn't match Santa's personalitySanta is fucking brutal to his enemies, and to rub it in, he gives them presents after a fight or skirmish.
>>24828508
I should've added that Makuhita uses epsom salts for his baths, but I hope you all get the idea.
>>24828508
honestly they should make it so Present always heals allies and always damages opponents.
>>24828289
SD is a gimmick at best, as a Screener its shit - even fucking eviolite Bayleef does a better job
>>24828481
Victini doesn't have King's Shield
>>24828272
>all you do in hoenn is fucking surf
>>24828230
>Not knowing that in FRLG Charmander was basically Hard Mode since it's not great in game and dies to the first 2 gyms
>Feraligatr
>Shit
>Swampert worse than Sceptile, one of the most underwhelming megas and garbage special movepool. Swampert was also godly in-game.
You have no idea what you're talking about.
>>24828078
Speakng of that, why doesn't Ferrothorn get Spiky Shield when it quite literally is a Spiky Shield?
>>24827911
Technician Hitmontop wrecks with Triple Kick.
>>24828257
No, Swampert's dip in popularity came with a certain Grass and Steel type's introduction. Way before a Mega was even conceived.
>>24828036
Literally a shittier version of Psychic, which you can TM onto them right away. Feels bad man.
>>24828329
Mat Block's made for Triples. It used to be rampant in the format. Sometimes you'd even see people running Scarf Greninja just to get that guaranteed first turn setup.
>>24828761
I use Mat block to setup for a Shuckle Sweep in Triples.
T1: Shuckle is in the center. Greninja uses Mat Block, Shuckle uses Power Trick, Aromatisse uses Trick Room.
Spend the rest of the game keeping TR up while Shuckle rapes everyone with Rock Slide. It's a lot of fun. I also use Slowking for setting the Trick Room as backup in case aromtisse dies, and for Heal Pulse.
Jirachi
Took 3 generations to make Doom Desire work as intended, and even then its outclassed by Iron Head due to Serene Grace.
>>24828050
>every pokemon learn judgment
>every pokemon must be as strong as Arceus
>>24828230
>blastoise
>bad
It's a tortoise with fucking cannons. The other choices are a fake dragon and a fat, ugly piece of shit.
>>24828770
I can't imagine Rock Slide one-shotting most things, however, Power Trick or no Power Trick.
>>24828230
>likes empolishit
>hates dankgatr
Damn I never knew someone could have THAT horrible of taste
>>24827973
>thinking octazooka is bad
>>24828719
bothering with that shit on a mon with mach punch, close combat and high jump kick
???
Blaziken.
Blaze Kick sucked ass.
>>24829282
>Blaze kick sucked ass
Sure thing, cuckboy
>>24829282
No but muddy water and Leaf Blade did.
>giving a sp atk to a physical attacker and a physical attack to a special attacker
>>24829298
The physical special split didn't exist in gen 3 so leaf blade was great on sceptile
>>24828423
>Delibird should be obvious
It's a joke mon. It's supposed to be shitty. It makes using it much more worthwhile when it actually manages do something.
Some pokémon are designed to be shit. Just accept that and move on. There is no problem with Delibird, the problem is with you.
>>24828605
Congratulations, you have just made the entire premise of the move pointless. Good job anon.
>>24828719
Doesn't max power Triple Kick literally have 5 BP more than HJK without STAB?
Don't forget that Triple Kick needs to roll for accuracy for each and every hit because fuck you.
If your luck sucks you have a 10 BP move that gets STAB and Technician. Yay.
It's worse than Double Kick in every possible way. And sadly Top doesn't even get Double Kick.
Just use HJK, CC, or even Mach Punch.
>>24829407
HJK is 130.
Triple kick WITH TECHNICIAN is 90.
>>24829454
Yeah, but Triple Kick is only on Hitmontop (and Smeargle), so you'd get STAB on it. Which would put it at 135, 5 points higher than HJK without STAB.
Obviously for Top you'd have to take STAB into account for HJK, but I thought it would make a decent attempt at showing how horribly outclassed Triple Kick is.
Saying it "wrecks" feels sorta implausible to me, no matter the circumstance.
>>24828050
It'd be nice to have it on Adaptability Porygon-Z though, even almost fits the theme.
>>24828661
I think it should get it sooner or later
>>24828050
at least the base power is high now, it was pathetic in gen V
>>24829480
>Gen V Technoblast has 85 BP
What the fuck?
What's even the point of it when Genesect can get Flamethrower, Ice Beam and Thunderbolt already?
Having a Water move with 85 BP that requires you to hold a specific item to take on Fire types or something?
>>24829468
In Japan spiky shield is needle guard. It's very specifically for needled plants like cacti and chestnuts. Thorns are exempt.
>>24829492
Needle Guard Beedrill when?
>>24829489
Technoblast is a thematic move not really meant to be used, it's significant similarities to judgement are meant to illustrate Plasma's failure to create something to rival Arceus.
>>24828958
Why does a wishing star desire doom, anyway?
>>24829495
That...actually makes sense.
Sorta works with how Genesect doesn't get STAB with it either.
>>24829497
Don't most wishes in stories tend to backfire horribly?
Especially big wishes.
>>24829489
100 AC 85 BP Special Rock move on a special Attacker. Only Genesect could pull this off.
Today we have Ancient Power Diancie.
>>24829514
>Rock
Anon, please share your Stone Drive with the rest of the world.
>>24828230
>>24828423
The kids = The money, stop beng a faggot
>>24829495
Nice headcanon
>>24828230
Go away with your shit tasteI agree tho, Gen 4 starters are great.
>>24828257
pretty sure he was talking about sceptile line anon
>>24828078
Which doesn't even make sense as a signature move. You'd think Dewott/Samurott and Farfetch'd would have it too if nothing else.
>>24828230
>worst gen 1 starter
>best gen 2 starter
>gen 3 starters are all equally shit
>gen 4 starters are all equally great
>gen 5 starters are all equally shit
>gen 6 starters are all equally shit
ftfy
>>24829019
>shitty power
>shitty accuracy
yep
>>24829492
And in Japan, Beedrill is Waspear but it still gets Drill Run.
>>24830868
>shitty power
Lolno
>shitty accuracy
Even if that was the case there's a reason lock on exists
>>24830882
>65 base power
85% accuracy
Just use hydro pump or scald.
>>24828481
Daily reminder Nips can have a legal, legitimate Fug with V-Create and Dragon Ascent
>>24827980
>new gen introduces a new move
>it's a clone of a move thats been around for 4 years
>the gen 3 move is considered a "Gen 5 move clone"
>>24830877
it's Spear, not Waspear. But yeah it still gets DrillLiner
>>24829495
>it's significant similarities to judgement are meant to illustrate Plasma's failure to create something to rival Arceus.
Its just a laser beam. A really shitty laser beam.
>>24830904
Que?
>>24830904
Scald and lava plume? Or was plume gen IV?
objective truth
>>24831026
You could argue Powder was designed just to fuck with you during Viola's gym battle, though. It's not reliable in link battles obviously but as a move for boss design it does have a purpose ingame.
Gourgeist with Trick or Treat. Has anyone found a worthy niche for it in either Smogon or VGC?
Only thing I can think of is ToT/WoW/Shadow Sneak/Leech Seed Gourgeist XL paired with a good Sucker Punch user like Bisharp to take advantage of the forced Ghost typing on the opposing pokemon. Any ideas?
>>24831026
>fell stinger
It's the signature move of fucking Beedrill Gamefreak, you could've given it an actually usable base power like 80.
>>24828169
>doomed to be HM slaves, especially in gens 3 and 4
>>24831055
I think he meant Twineedle.
>>24828423
Smelling salts is a sumo thing that's why it gets it
>>24831318
technically the actual name of the move has nothing to do with smelling salts, that was an american fuck up. the salts used in sumo are ceremonial, it's a shinto thing about purification, they aren't smelling salts.
>>24827980
rip extremespeed arcanine
>>24831026
since when does galvantula have a signature move?
>>24831468
electroweb?
>>24831468
It (and Joltik) are the only pokes who learn Electroweb by level up.
Apparently that's the definition of a signature move.
>>24830847
This
>>24831026
>wrecking battle spot m-blazikens with Powder Vivillion
The day one XY meta truly was a great time to be alive
>>24827911
Being regular Kyurem is suffering.
>>24831026
>water shuriken
>literally perfect
can smeargle have multiple instances of sketch in his moveset at once or does he need to actually use up the first one before he can learn another copy of sketch
for shitty sig moves, luster purge and mist ball are pretty shit.
>>24831675
Almost certain you need to use one up before you can learn it again.
>>24830904
Volt Tackle?
>>24831675
Gen 1 Mimic is the only time you can have two of the same moves on a mon's moveslot so Smeargle has to use Sketch at least once before learning it again.
>>24829298
Nigger leaf blade was the best grass type attack in gen 3
>>24827911
>Noivern
>No Aerialate Boomburst
>likely lost out to being the pseudo to Goodra
My bro doesn't deserve this.
>In Gen 4, Hitmontop gets Technician so it can have a 90BP STAB move that breaks through Substitutes
>that same gen gives out so many obscenely powerful Fighting type moves that 90BP isn't a big deal
>>24831026
Palkia and Chatot should be higher up. Spacial Rend's always been a solid move and Chatter was buffed to the point where PU banned it. Lugia might deserve to go down because nobody runs offensive Lugia.
>>24831026
Exploud?
>>24830882
>65 power
>85% accuracy
>"lolno"
You might as well just use Scald.
>lock-on
Opinion discarded.
>>24828286
Buffing wild charge to 120
And making Volt tackle having 140 damage with life orb recoil is a far more smart idea while keeping signature move
>>24831026
>implying Klingklang's signatures aren't good
Klingklang has really good signature moves. It's just that klingklang is shit.
santabird
>>24828657
>FRLG Charmander was basically Hard Mode since it's not great in game and dies to the first 2 gyms
what is metalclaw at level 13
what is oddish AND bellsprout on route 25, and pikachu in viridian forest
it was hardmode in RB, maybe.
It was not hardmode in FRLG
>>24828508
>lion
>desert
lolwut?
>smelling salts
>SMELLING salts
>chaffed
>lolwutx2
>>24828423
Makuhita has Smelling Salts and Wake-Up Slap
Force Palm + Smelling Slats is actually a nice combo, btw.
60 damage STAB + 30% paralysis.
140 damage STAB when paralyzed.
rinse and repeat.
>>24828508
smelling salt's jap name is Resuscitation. it has nothing to actually do with salts. its just slapping the paralysis off of them, same reason it also gets wakeup slap.
>>24832829
smelling salts is normal type
>>24832770
>it was hardmode in RB, maybe
Not even! Ember combined with Onix and Geodude's shit Special stat made that battle a cakewalk
>>24832887
yeah, but its having to plow through double NVE for a mere quarter damage.
>>24833105
Ground doesn't resist Fire m8
>>24831578
Freeze Shock and Freeze Burn aren't much better than Glaciate. Kyurem gets 3 signature moves, and all 3 are ass.
>>24833116
how does that make sense?
>>24831664
Mat Block
>destroying Doubles and Triples Maison on the back of this move andAron
>>24831047
it would have been useful in gen 2 with curselax dominating
>>24830812
>Farfetch'd
>Not Sawk/Throh the fucking Judo pokemon
Als, I wouldn't mind it if Frogadier learned Mat Block too.
>>24827986
What what move does it have....?
>>24833435
If only we were on the internet so we could search this.
Oh well...
>>24830913
Actually plume might have been IV but yes those two
>>24831026
Bonemerang is a perfectly great move. A better Earthquake in Singles, its actually stronger in Multis and bypasses Subs
Sky Attack (Moltres) is a weird one, since it has like 50 fucking overpowered effects AND a ridiculous BP surpassing even Dragon Ascent .. but its still shit.
>Sacred Fire could be worse
Switch Ho-Oh and Rayquaza please, Dragon Ascent is meh its just on a horrendously unbalanced 'mon.
Doom Desire is Trolling tier.
Which move are you counting for Victini because youd have to be retarded to think V-Create is "Could be Worse...." while Searing Shot is "... wait Victini has another Sig?" tier.
Literally what is Slaking's Sig? Scizors? and dont say Bullet Punch ...
>Volt tackle
>anything but godly
>>24833435
Land's Wrath. It's a 90 Power Earthquake that doesnt hit allies.
Thousand Waves, most likely the signature of Zygarde-X assuming there will be 2 formes, is also complete ass as its no different from the former, except it prevents switching which actually has pretty cool usage
but the real kicker, is Thousand Arrows. Same power and everything, but it hits Flying types and removes Ground-immunities similar to Knock Down. Definitely worth the loss in power.
252+ Atk Soft Sand Zygarde Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 186-218 (55.6 - 65.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Soft Sand to simulate an increased Attack from its Perfect form since we obviously dont know actual stats. Just a rough estimate, still 45.5% damage to maximum physical bulk Skarm in its current status
>>24829298
You know, running a Physical sceptile with leafblade, eq, swords dance and substitute really caughts niggers off guard, specially the fukken EQ and the LB with STAB+ OVERGROW+ATT.UP BERRY+ SWORDS DANCE x 1.
I mean, it's not better than special but is a nice unexpected piece of shit that has wrecked some fire types.
>>24829495
they should make it a 110/90 acc move with a secondary effect that changes based on the equipped drive
>shock
chance to paralyze
>burn
chance to burn
>chill
chance to freeze
>douse
chance to reduce speed, or retcon it to a toxic drive and give it a chance to inflict toxic poison
>>24833432
The whole kicking up a tatami mat from the floor to block an attacker is an old chanbara film thing. Usually done by samurai rather than ninjas. Sawk and Throh don't have anything to do with that.
>>24833794
>Literally what is Slaking's Sig?
Slack Off
>Scizors?
Metal Claw
He's just going by this chart
http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Signature_move
>>24828050
>Gen 5 Techno Blast
>waste your item slot to get a move that's a worse version of some other move it can learn anyway
Is this the biggest what the fuck where they thinking moment in the entire franchise?
>>24835224
You can get an 85 BP Water move to deal with Fire types?
It sounds feeble, even to myself.
>>24831681
>>24831675
>>24831760
What if you Sketch another Smeargle's Sketch?
>>24828257
Literally the only reason mudkip was the favored starter was because
>it was super effective against the first gym
And
>that retarded meme
How would you fix these signature moves anons?
>>24837910
You'd still have one Sketch?
The Sketched move replaces the original Sketch, so new Sketch would replace the old one, taking you back to square one.
>>24827911
Light of Ruin
Takes a shit load of damage
>Triple Kick buffed to 20 > 40 > 60 BP (or 15 > 30 > 45)
>Twineedle buffed to 40 BP, same as Dual chop or X-Scissor
>Kinesis changed to 90%, raises user's Sp. Atack 2 stages if it hits
>Barrage becomes a special multi-hit psychic-type move
>Crush Claw calculates damage as if the target's Def is half of what it actually is, (like Explosion), nerfed to 55 BP since it now has an effective BP of 110, higher than Return
>Beat Up now returns to doing typeless damage
>Poison Tail buffed to 70 BP and has a 10% chance to inflict toxic
>Parabolic Charge changed to 75 BP and does increased damage and restores more HP if used in sunlight
>Octazooka's accuracy is nerfed to 80%, but its BP is buffed to 80 and is now affected by mega Launcher
>Aromatic Mist isremoved from the game along with Aromatisse
>>24838057
Mudkip was favored because
>Sceptile had 5 weaknesses, Blaziken 4 and Swampert a grand total of one, which isn't used by any of the Gym Leaders, evil teams or E4
>STAB Earthquake
>Biggest movepool in Ruby/Sapphire, with Water, Ground and Ice. Sceptile had to be bred with Crunch or it's only options were Grass and Dragon. Blaziken's movepool is comparable with Fire, Fighting and Ground-type moves
>ability to use surf, dive, strength and water if you so chose
maybe some other stuff but it's been over 10 years so idr
>>24843220
>nerfed to 80%
>>24830882
>lock on
>wasting a turn and moveslot just to be able to hit a 65BP move.
Anon plis. At least give it 100% chance to reduce accuracy for max keks. Now Octillery can at least annoy your opponents a little, since he's shit at everything else. Set up some toxic spikes/spikes/rocks and watch opponents suffer as they try to switch out.
Offtopic but closest thread to it.
>tfw Cacturne is better than Maractus in every way except bug/fighting weaknesses
>get hyped when Maractus finally got Spiky Shield "At least its got something Cac--"
>get disappointed as fuck when they both got it, but goddamn is Cacturne a beast between that and STAB Sucker Punch coming off 115 attack or something
>>24844499
Maractus really needs a niche so it's not just a worse Cacturne.
>>24828423
I was suprised Noble Roar has no priority.
That would be amazing as Ability though!
>>24833794
>better in singles
>miss chance
if only it was 100% accurate, for what purpose does it have a miss chance
>>24828286
Volt Tackle itself isn't really bad, and it's really cool as a move. It's just the fact that only one fucking evolutionary line gets it.return to the anime with Thunder when
did you know klefki gets 2 signature moves?
yeah, neither did i
>>24830909>Judgment description: The user releases countless shots of light at the target.
>Techno Blast description: The user fires a beam of light at its target.
Ghetsis explored and deciphered the ruins with the Plates long before the protag. He also had the Creation Trio's orbs.
>>24829282
We need Elemental Kicks.
>>24847043
Then we need some kicking pokes that correspond to those elements.
>>24828049
>100% chance to lower SpAtk
Why couldn't it have been a 20-30% chance to raise your own or something! With that 65 base power too bleh.
>>24827911
Man, to hell with trying to get Hitmontop.
>>24828079
I think Accelgor can learn Water Shuriken too.
>>24850289
I really wanted Cloyster to learn Water Shuriken. That would have been amazing.
>>24831026
Why is Zygarde's good? It just looks like a worse Earthquake to me.
>>24850579
Earthquake hits your partner in doubles, Land's Wrath doesn't
>>24850599
Zygarde itself isn't eligible for VGC though.
>>24850253
Just use vitamins to get the lagging defense up to the level where it's high enough and later use berries to lower it again if it's not needed.
Unless you're talking about breeding something that's male only and you don't have a hacked Ditto. Because that is indeed sorta shitty.
Ditto
