Charizard's on its way back to NU. How does this make you feel?
>>24767469
I guess they started differentiating from Megas and non-Megas.
It will be interesting to see whether people will go for Moltres or Charizard since both are available for use now.
What the fuck? New power creep?
>>24767516
New policy.
Megas are tiered separately from the base forms now.
>>24767469
>tiering megas and non-mega forms separately
When did this happen? Either way, I love it! non-mega metagross will be a lot of fun in UU, and I look forward to having Blastoise in RU where is can be bulky and use rapid spin. Lower tiers could always use more spinners.
>>24767525
Ah. Nice.
So these Pokemon are now allowed in lower tiers?
>>24767525
This is the first time in quite a while that I've actually seen smogon do something good.
>>24767525
About fucking time.
>>24767525
How does it work?
>>24767798
Simple
You can use regular Charizard in UU, but not the Megas
>>24767469
>Diancie moved to UU
>Sableye moved to UU
As an UU player, I'm excited about these.
>>24767469
>Metagross moved to UU
Something tells me they're going to regret that.
>>24767944
why?
>>24767944
Salamence, Hydreigon, and Goodra are down there too
Metagross'll be fine in UU
>>24767944
Zapdos says hi.
Suicune says hi
Krookodile says hi
Swampert says hi
Doublade says hi
Mandibuzz says hi
Dude, like, half the tier can check it, and it only has 70 speed if you aren't running Agility. It only really shits on obnoxious fairies like Florges and Slurpuff.
>>24767469
I am okay with this.
I can use him in more places.
>>24767944
Metagross was already in UU for most of XY and it wasn't even that good. It only moved up because of its mega.
>charizard
>NU last gen
>moved to UU
>>24767944
metagross is absolute shit. Might as well put his mega down there too.
>>24767525
Took them long enough to those retards
>>24768468
>Might as well put his mega down there too.
confirmed for 1100 shitter
>>24767525
>Megas are tiered separately from the base forms now.
fuck smogon
>>24768522
more like 1961 atm brah.
>>24767798
Ban the mega stones from a tier rather than the pokemon's base form
>>24767525
I thought this already happened a long time ago?
>>24768532
But this is a good thing.
>>24768610
For some reason, only a few got this treatment.
>>24768610
No, what happened is that the Mega Stones got banned.
>>24768634
Isn't that exactly the same thing?
>| 68 | Gyarados | 1.904% |
>| 69 | Gyarados-Mega | 1.900% |
Missed the quick drop cut off but if this keeps up both Gyarados are going to UU in the next tier update.
>>24768647
No, banning megastones was just deciding that mega was too good for the tier and either banning the stone or bumping up the Pokemon itself. Now Megas and base forms without the mega stone are being judged separately by default. So there's an actual guideline to the process so all mega/non-mega tier shifts will be consistent.
so what is the cut-off for being in OU again?
>>24768861
Ah cotcha
>>24768931
3.4% usage
When a Pokemon drops below that, they drop to UU
When a Pokemon from a lower tier gets above 3.4% usage in OU, it's moved to OU and is no longer usable in that tier
I wonder could garchomp be OU while megachomp is UUBL
>>24768791
They'll fall to BL at worst.
>>24769065
If Salamence can hack it in UU, Gyarados is going to be just fine there.
But wait a second, if a mega ends up in a lower tier than their standard form, how are they going to deal with those people that don't megaevolve immediately their mon?
>>24769084
Man the meta truly has changed.
>>24769085
>if a mega ends up in a lower tier than their standard form
This can't happen.
A Mega can be a higher tier than its base form, but not a lower one.
>>24769096
Lucky break for Mega Latios, then.
>>24769096
Well actually there are really no cases where an itemless mon is better than its mega so I don't think that would have been a problem.
Is there a thread for this?
>>24769151
You mean the Smogon thread?
http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/smogon-usage-based-tier-update-december-2015-read-the-op.3557847/
Amazing. It will make interesting following the meta again.
>>24767469
>meme formats
I could care less.
>>24770048
>meme
>Coined by Richard Dawkins in his book The Selfish Gene (1976). Shortened (after gene) from mimeme, from Ancient Greek μίμημα (mímēma, “imitation, copy”).
>Any unit of cultural information, such as a practice or idea, that is transmitted verbally or by repeated action from one mind to another in a comparable way to the transmission of genes.
>>24767525
ABOUT
FUCKING
TIME
Standard Blaziken in OU when? I think he'll fit right in.
>>24767525
The fact that it wasnt like this from the beginning is hilariously stupid.
>>24770597
>Standard Blaziken in OU when
If by standard you mean non-Speed Boost, it's absolute shit without Speed Boost and inferior in every way to Infernape
>>24770597
>OU
Blaze Blaziken would be RU at best.
>>24770597
Not anytime soon, sadly. I asked Smogon about it a while back and they said not much can wall it since it gets Knock Off, and hits like a truck. Speed Boost makes it really hard to revenge kill too. They gave me a bunch of calcs about how it OHKO's Slowbro or something.
Personally, I don't agree with it, I think Blaziken would do fine if Ou, but they call the shots, not me.
>>24770597
>OU
sorry but your bro is shit
>Blaziken hasn't been unbanned yet
>>24769095
Gen 6 UU will be basically Gen 5 OU but with less weather (Mega swmapert means some Rain Teams will persist, so it didn't go away completely). Watch it happen.
>>24768075
>[Pokemon name] says hi
autism says hi
Regular Audino in PU will be everywhere.
>>24770711
What's like Gen 5 UU then? 5's OU sucked.
>>24768468
Remember when they suspected Megagross?
This thread needs more Verlisify sets for abusing the new metas.
Milo (Venusaur) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Overgrow
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 4 Spe
Calm Nature
- Knock Off
- Earthquake
- Giga Drain
- Sludge Bomb
PrplPplEtr (Sharpedo) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Speed Boost
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dark Pulse
- Surf
- Ice Beam
- Destiny Bond
Tonguesten @ Choice Band
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Earthquake
- Gyro Ball
- Dragon Tail
- Flail
>>24771106
derp.
Tonguesten (Steelix) @ Choice Band
>>24771106
>Verlis strats
>not having non-attacking moves on your Venusaur
>>24771106
As someone who doesn't follow the meta as closely as I used to, these ones aren't as bad as some of his others I've seen.
I am, at least, not immediately repulsed by it, unlike some of his other shit, such as >>24771151. Of course, I'm assuming the Steelix is meant for a Trick Room team. Knowing Verlisify, it's probably his secret anti-Trick Room tech.
Biggest concern of mine is special attacking Sharpedo, but it's physical pool isn't that great. No Knock Off, so something like
>Crunch
>Waterfall
>Icy Fang/Protect/Ice Beam
>Destiny Bond
Only reason I mention Icy Fang is in case it outdamages an unspec'd Beam. Also has an extra chance to cause flinch, which is relevant with Speed Boost.
>>24771151
Rampharos (Ampharos) (M) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Static
EVs: 56 HP / 200 SpA / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Volt Switch
- Heal Bell
- Signal Beam
- Reflect
Better?
>>24771218
>See a Sharpedo
>Assume it's physical and that it's gonna use protect
>Switch to a bulky pivot like Amoongus or whatever
>Take a fully invested Ice Beam to the Face.
For a while I was thinking of going total troll in running specs instead..
>>24771106
Ultaria (Altaria) @ Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 56 HP / 252 Atk / 48 Def / 152 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Earthquake
- Dragon Claw
- Rest
Week 1 It will make PU into its bitch.
Week 2 it will make NU into its bitch.
Week 3 until forever it will rot in BL3.
>>24771106
Absol
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Will-O-Wisp
- Body Slam
- Play Rough
- Pursuit
This Absol is designed to stop Knock Off spam, particularly from Sneasel and Scrafty. It outspeeds Scarf Scrafty, and can tank a +2 Knock Off since it has no item while OHKO-ing it back with Play Rough. Justified is so the Knock Off makes you stronger and harder to stop. Both threats can be crippled with Body Slam's paralysis or Will-o-wisp, depending on what situation your'e in. Pursuit is so it can act as a trapper and trap Knock Off users for the kill.
Am I Verlis yet?
>>24771542
Damn son, that's amazing.
Welcome back, wolfpack.
>>24768958
No, stones can't fall below their base form.
This is all interesting, but how can they justify distinct tiers based on usage if you can't use the pokemon if you are using its mega? Just because Metagross isn't being overused because everyone uses its Mega form? The two are not exclusive.
Also, only using metagross as an example. My question applies to all Mega/nonMega pairs
| 49 | Charizard-Mega-Y | 3.882% |
I hope it drops just to see how it'll do in UU.
Makes sense. No use in a Pokemon being OU when the only reason it's OU is because it's got a nice mega. Why prevent a shit Pokemon from being usable in lower tiers as long as it doesn't mega evolve?
>>24768559
Wow that actually makes sense and is what many people said they should do in the first place.
Good job Smogon, only took you 2 years.
>>24772596
They had done that for Ubers, that's why non-mega Mawile and Gengar are not Uber. I don't know why they didn't do it for the rest of the tiers until now.
>>24770597
>Standard
lol you mean Mega
>>24767798
You can bring Charizard to an RU match but cannot bring its mega stone.
>>24767469
>Sableye moved from OU to UU
Good. I never really understood this when he had prankster in BW and he was still UU. UNLESS of course Smogon is so afraid of le sneaky pebble that even the mere presence of a regular Sableye is enough to deter it.
>>24768075
Pretty much this. UU is much stronger than the UU of DP.
>>24772596
>>24768559
They already did that though.
The difference is that now they use separate usage stats for a Pokemon and Pokemon+Stone.
Example: Let's say all forms of Aerodactyl get 6% usage in OU this month. 99% of those Aerodactyl were carrying Aerodactylite.
With the old system, Aerodactyl as a whole becomes OU. With the new system, Aerodactylite becomes OU while Aerodactyl doesn't.
So Charizard might be the 1st pokemon in 3 different tiers.
X - OU
Y - UU/BL (it's better in doubles)
Base - RU/NU
>>24768075
UU confirmed for friendliest of tiers.
>>24767525
This is fucking retarded. Megas dont start out as megas in battles. They start out in their base forms. Both have to be used. Both would end up having the exact same usage stats, so it would end up in the same tier. Is this just smogon trying to appease the hipster crowd?
Holy shit
>one Pokemon in 2 tiers
>>24768542
>claiming to be 1961 when the current highest is 1712
confirmed low ladder shitter that uses the strongest mons with no skill, strategy or idea of how to play properly
>>24772596
The reasoning for this was just that it adds complexity to the tiering system with little reward. After the release of a lot more megas in ORAS, I think they realised that it was too much and that they would have to make the change.
>>24772727
Because of this post I feel like I might as well bring this up since I don't think anyone else in the thread has.
This is all Zarel's (PS owner) doing. He wanted this tiering change, asked about it on Smogon, and in the middle of the discussion he implemented this tiering process on PS by adding extra "BL" tiers for mega base forms. Smogon pretty much was forced to modify their rules because the way Zarel was doing it was confusing and stupid as shit, and he was NOT going back on putting, say, Charizard back into OU.
For anyone who likes the change, thank Zarel, not Smogon. For anyone who hates the change, blame Zarel, not Smogon.
>>24772727
>>24772596
I mean do you faggots realize how fucking dumb you are? Everyone rips into [insert governing body here] for fucking everything.
>>24772727
>one pokemon in two tiers
You realize that was already fucking happening, right? Gengar/Kanga/Mawile/etc. aside, look at shit like Pinsir and Absol. They were OU for a time, they fell to UU where their stones were banned, and with that their usage plummeted. You had normal Pinsir and Absol in NU or whatever, while their Megas were OU-only. One Pokemon. Two tiers.
Meanwhile, normal Medicham, Lopunny, Charizard, and other shit-tier stuff were stuck in OU because people wouldn't stop fapping to their Megas long enough for their usage to dip. That was fucking stupid.
Now, it's at least consistently stupid.
>>24767469
Deserving of it, imo.
>>24772727
If it's holding the mega stone, the usage goes towards that mega stone instead of the base Pokemon. This s why Charizardite is still OU while the base form is starting to drop.
It's the solution to mega formes keeping weak base Pokemon in high tiers.
>>24771242
Much
I really hope they move my newest bro Hoopa-Unbound to UU or RU soon, I would've loved to use it in the lower tiers but stupid smogon went and banned my bro from them for no reason without even trying it out.
Hoopa-Unbound isn't even that good. Hyperspace Fury only does the same thing that Infiltrator and Phantom Force already do (and nobody uses Phantom Force LOL). It also has really low defenses, you can just revenge kill it.
>>24774462
Just send Hoopa to ubers and be done with it, legendaryfags are the worst
