Is the limited visibility really a big issue on classic Sonic games or just something people who already disliked Sonic before found to be parrotable after watching that RLM video?
Seriously, I swear literally nobody gave a shit about this "problem" until that video came along, and now suddenly everyone is like "Sonic is unplayable because the camera is zoomed in" or whatever.
I can't speak for anybody else but it's always something i've disliked about the 2d games, and is one of the reasons I like the adventure games more.
Ironically, though, I feel like the "the knuckles/tails stages sucked" and all those complaints for Sa2 didn't come up till egoraptors and somecallmejohnny's videos
Anyways, I love freedom planet more then any pof the 2d sonic games for not having the visbility issue among other things it does really well
>>340288935
It was always an issue.
>>340289539
>I feel like the "the knuckles/tails stages sucked" and all those complaints for Sa2 didn't come up till egoraptors and somecallmejohnny's videos
Holy shit this.
But when it comes to visibility in Sonic I find that as you get better and practice the game the visibility isn't much of a problem.
I know that sounds like trial and error bullshit, but once you get good and can stay fast it feels good.
>>340288935
>Is the limited visibility really a big issue on classic Sonic games or just something people who already disliked Sonic before found to be parrotable after watching that RLM video?
It's not a big deal. The only people who have a problem with it are people who believe sonic is all about going as fast as possible and holding right to win.
>Seriously, I swear literally nobody gave a shit about this "problem" until that video came along, and now suddenly everyone is like "Sonic is unplayable because the camera is zoomed in" or whatever.
Every once in a while some youtubers tries to discredit genesis sonic. It never works.
>>340288935
It was never an issue for people who actually played the games because almost all obstacles and enemies are easily seen and avoided if you're paying attention. It's only an issue if you're a retard who goes into the games with an expectation of "hold right to win" and have the reaction time of a retarded sloth.
>>340288935
what video
It's actually an issue. There are fan games that address the problem and it makes the game more fun. Look up Sonic Megadrive
What did he mean by this?
>>340289539
SA1 and SA2 started to get hate before e-celebs bashed them, when they got re-released on XBLA/PSN and critics gave them low scores because "Sonic's stages are good and the rest sucks" and all. At least the people I know started to say the same thing after those reviews.
>>340289779
>>340289889
I'm saying it because even when I played Sonic for the first time, I never had a hard time because of the the visibility. So when people started to argue that the camera doesn't let you go fast and shit like that, my reaction was pretty much thinking "It does?"
>>340290176
Never stick your dick in crazy.
You cannot argue that adding widescreen to Sonic 1-3 wouldn't make them much better
>>340290176
"You're too slow"
>>340290153
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYDsz1NFBJw
I know about Sonic Mega Drive, and also they re-released the classic games on mobile with widescreen, that should solve the issue.
>>340290259
>You cannot argue that adding widescreen to Sonic 1-3 wouldn't make them much better
It would.
But full screen is not a problem as it is.
I was playing Heroes today and Holy shit I hate the character models
>>340290353
>at least it's not as bad as Crash Bandicoot
That part triggers me every fucking time.
I can't speak for everyone, but I know that I've been saying Sonic games were always shit for a long time. And I know of other people who said the same and/or agreed with me.
Don't know what RLM video you're referring to, but if it says 2D Sonic games suck, then it's correct. Sonic 3 and Knuckles is the only decent Sonic game.
I always thought, "damn I wish I had more screen" but instead of it getting to me i just learned the general layout to the levels.
It turns more into a speedrun type deal where you memorise the best paths and know when to jump, when an enemy is coming, where the bonus zones are etc.
Sonic Advance 1 is my favourite sonic game and one of my favourite platformers. I just learned the whole thing by heart and still have a good time playing it just trying to beat it faster and faster. I guess that's what i thought sonic was about especially with there being a timer and a score system that increases with faster times
>>340288935
Back in the 90s, game devs used to actually play their own games. This sounds crazy to think about today, but back then they would play the games over and over to make sure they got things right. Dedicated testing and QA teams weren't needed because the devs themselves did it. With Sonic 1 it was especially true because Yuji Naka (programmer) and Hirokazu Yasuhara (level designer) spent a large amount of time striking the right balance between speed and platforming. In making the game, they also tested and adjusted the placement of obstacles and enemies, and if the screen size was a problem they would've noticed it or taken it into account when designing the levels.
So basically what I'm trying to say is, if a "critic" finds the game more difficult than the developers themselves do, that "critic" is legitimately mentally retarded and should be ignored.
>>340289539
It became popular to hate SA2 because muh favorite youtuber told me to.
You don't need to go fast to enjoy the games, but if you play them often enough to know the routes you are rewarded by not running into random walls.
SLIDE TO THE LEFT
SLIDE TO THE RIGHT
>>340290690
Trigger Warning
>>340290912
I unironically like the idea of Knux being Sonic's best friend a lot more than Tails.
>>340290552
How so?
Even if the games supposedly don't let you go fast, there's hardly any poorly-designed platforming section. The only genuinely shit stage is Metropolis Zone because the enemy placement is ass, the rest can be easily played both slowly and faster.
I thought it was universally accepted that Sonic stops being fun after the first couple of few because you can't see shit?
>>340290552
Only retards dismiss any criticism because some e-celeb made a video raising the same point, then pretending that's the only reason anyone dislikes the game when in reality the e-celebs are just saying shit that's been out there for a long time.
>>340289539
>Ironically, though, I feel like the "the knuckles/tails stages sucked" and all those complaints for Sa2 didn't come up till egoraptors and somecallmejohnny's videos
E-celebs are the best thing to happen to you people. Now whenever some literally who makes some shit youtube video about a bad sonic game you can just say detractors are blindly following that e-celeb, even though they've been saying this shit for years before said vid was even made.
Too bad spax isn't still alive, I'd like to see people trying to defend Sonic 06 because people obviously just hate it because it has Jason Griffith in it
I said it before and I'll say it again, there's nothing in any Sonic game that says you're supposed to try to go as fast as you possibly can, and I don't care if the game had that GOTTA GO FAST meme as an advertisement. You want to go fast? Well, you can, but that doesn't mean the game isn't going to challenge you into maintaining your speed, much like Mario challenges you to land your jumps on tricky platforming sections.
But Sonic games always offered variety, the levels were designed to be played either slow or fast, so if you like platforming it's there, if you like to explore and find chaos emeralds it's there, if you just like to run past shit it's also there, but like in any other game ever, it's not something you'll be able to do easily.
>>340288935
>Is the limited visibility really a big issue on classic Sonic games
It's not
The visibility is perfectly fine
Try playing any of the game gear games...especially Sonic 2 on the game gear...now that is bad visibility
The only flaws in Sonic 2, for example, are the inability to see much ahead of you, and the general layout of Metropolis zone.
So it is a bit of an issue
>>340289539
Fuck off Adventurefag
It's Adventurefags like you who try their hardest to find the smallest nitpicks just to make the classics look bad
>>340290259
It wouldn't
Sonic 1 and 2 remasters are already in widescreen in mobile and it adds nothing
Some of the boss patterns had to be changed due to this and fuck that shit
There's literally no problem with 4:3 for sonic
The whole e-celeb shit is easily avoided by actually playing the games yourself and seeing what you like and dislike, but this is /v/ so nobody actually plays games.
When I play classic games, not even as a kid, the screen size wasn't an issue. I wasn't thinking about level design or enemy placement; Metropolis Zone was my favorite as a kid because it was hard and challenging, so it felt amazing when I beat it.
Meanwhile when I played SA2 for the first time I didn't like the treasure hunting levels because they felt boring. There was no real challenge, just wandering around until a radar pinged three times. It didn't feel fun. As for the mech levels, there was some fun in blowing up a bunch of enemies, especially in Eggman's levels, but the controls felt like they got in the way and were too clunky. Gamma controlled much better, even if his levels were shorter.
This is why I don't mind SomecallmeJohnny vs. some other shitter like Game Grumps, because, even though I disagree on some points, I can at least respect that Johnny tries actually explaining his criticisms other than "LOOK AT HOW GARBAGE THIS IS, LOL MEMES"
>>340290353
Ughh don't link to that faggot video
>>340288935
>Is the limited visibility really a big issue on classic Sonic games
no, and the people who complain about that shit won't be satisfied until the games look like this
https://youtu.be/HyNnEK2FUfQ?t=122
>>340292092
You can see plenty in Sonic 2
It's never an issue...it's a meme
Metropolis level layout is a whole other can of worms but I still maintain it's not as annoying as Oil Ocean
>>340292092
It's an issue in Sonic 1 and some areas of 2
3&K's level design is stronger though so it doesn't have as many sudden spikes or pitfalls, its smarter with its obstacles. And even then it's not a huge problem, it's more of a nitpick that's not an issue anymore today.
>>340289539
SA1 and 2 have been called out on their issues for years. I remember complaints about the Knuckles stages as far back as when they fucking came out.
E-Celebs just spouted already existing opinions. Saying it's just parroting is like saying nobody thought Simon's Quest was mediocre until AVGN covered it.
>>340292562
Ugh that ruins the game completely
Also really hated the gimmicky zoom in/zoom out camera changing back n forth in Generations...fucking gay
>>340292697
It's literally never an issue
Stop with this bullshit
If you said this about the Game Gear games I'd agree but it's never an issue in the Genesis ones
I think people felt that way they just feared being ostracized or called casuals.
>>340292328
Knuckles killed sa2 which definitely leads to the fact knuckles was never a good character. He never added anything and though he fits with fists its never utilized in any game
So why could this fucker use chaos energy? Was it just because it had access to the master emerald?
>>340293976
Knuckles gave us "Sonic 3 & Knuckles" so you're objectively wrong
>>340293976
Knuckles is good in every 2D game where he's a playable character. Him and Rouge would've been good in the Adventure games if treasure hunting was more like hard mode instead of "run around aimlessly until you get a ping"
>>340294052
Maybe Robotnik programmed him that way
Or maybe...it wassentient
I don't recall having an issue with the visibility, but I can see why some would. A friend of mine was playing Sonic 2 some days ago and while he was doing generally fine, there were times he was surprised by some stuff he was too fast to see coming, like those enemies who come out of the walls in Aquatic Ruin.
It's not a gigantic issue, but it can get annoying.
>>340294052
It's because he's a fusion of metal sonic and a bunch of other eggman robots
>>340289539
>I feel like the "the knuckles/tails stages sucked" and all those complaints for Sa2 didn't come up till egoraptors and somecallmejohnny's videos
You are wrong. That has always been the opinion.
>>340294727
That's why you need to master the d-pad or as some say in here "git gud"
You have to know how much to push the right on the d-pad to go at the correct speed to not get fucked over and when to press the opposite direction to slow yourself down etc.
This is essential even if these games are in widescreen...like in Sonic CD Remastered even though you have more visibility you still need to learn how to play the game
>>340294759
More like he's Silver Sonic 2.0
Name ONE sonic game that was "press right to win."
The only people who complain about it are scrubs with shit reaction time. The best part is, the choice of slowing down is almost always there, so it's you're own fault if you run into something because you were going too fast to react to what's ahead.
You have two options when you're running at full throttle and you see an oncoming threat: roll or jump. If you don't have both of these abilities on a hair trigger and can't decide which one to do before you collide with something or fall in a pit, you're just shit at video games.
>>340295307
Sonic Advance 2.
>>340295307Sonic Rush
>>340295307
Advance 2
Rush
>>340295436
It's not even reaction time
It's people who don't bother learning how to use the D-Pad and just want to go Max Speed all the time while the game plays itself
>>340288935
The game pulls the screen back when you're going fast so it's not really a problem at all.
>>340289889
>It's not a big deal. The only people who have a problem with it are people who believe sonic is all about going as fast as possible and holding right to win.
That's literally the only reason why people play it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cxCinYd5DEA
>>340296162
>using the theme song to the English dub of an anime released 12 years after the original game
>>340290472
>they're fucking floating
How did I not notice this before?Also the PS2 version sucks.
>>340290472
Speaking of Sonic Heroes, that game isn't as bad as I remember it being. Just started playing it again yesterday after like 10 years and I'm actually having fun.
Yes, you fucking tools. Taxman's remakes fixed that.
t. Mega Drive kid
>>340290353
Wow. The very first clip of him playing and constantly running into that bumper...
Is he retarded?
>>340296162
No it fucking isn't you shitter
>>340290472
Honestly that Sonic Model is better than the one nowadays
He's shorter and has shorter quills which resembles his Sonic X design which was probably the best version of Modern Sonic(modern design is still shit but that one was tolerable)
Polycount here is shit but that's about it
you're in for a wild ride, kid!
>>340297653
I like that he looks sharper than the Unleashed model but that lankiness is way too much.
>>340295449
>>340295523
>>340295798
>press right to win
>fall into a bottomless pit instead
wooooooooow
>>340297402
I'm pretty sure that video was just clickbait, there's no way they're actually playing the game like that. Nobody I ever knew played Sonic like that guy did, it's just baffling.
>>340298273
Huh...he looked different in that other shot
>>340296162
No it isn't, fuck off. Literally only faggots who start on Advance or the Adventure games or even worse Heroes or later think this.
If you try that in literally any real Sonic game you get fucked, so why on Earth do you think 'that's literally the only reason why people play it' if it doesn't fucking work and never has?
Sonic CD fixed that problem along with others
Another proof of it being the best game
You can literally roll anytime you want, if you're going fast all you have to do is press down and if you want to stop rolling you can just jump and it will go back to the running animation.
I hate to use this term, but... git gud, goddammit.
>>340300034
I heard Sonic CD had a zoom in/zoom out camera similar to Generations but for the life of me I can't ever remember noticing it
To me it felt the same like 1,2 and 3K
AlsoCD is the worst of the classics by far
>>340292158
uh oh, classicfag has been triggered!
>>340301148
>>340296819
There's such a lack of polish in all the 3D Sonic games until Unleashed or so.
>>340300148
If you're going fast you can always press the opposite direction or just simply let gradually hold the right on the d-pad to slow down
Mastering the nuances of the controls in these games is extremely rewarding
>>340301304
My opinion is better than yours :')
>>340301198
>tfw you like both classic and adventure games
I honestly don't know why people feel the need to pick only one to enjoy.
>>340296819
>Also the PS2 version sucks.
I only played the GC version. Is there removed content or some shit in the PS2 version?
>>340301712
We don't pick anything you dumbass frogposter
Advance 1 has the shitty new design yet most classic fans still like it because of the gameplay
Adventure 1 steered the franchise into the wrong direction in so many ways
I can still play it and enjoy it as a guilty pleasure of sorts but the gameplay is not good and in fact the hub worlds are the most enjoyable part for me which should not be the case in a sonic game
Sonic 1 was the first game I ever played so I feel like I'm a little bias as I can't remember ever not knowing how the levels worked and where the obstacles are.
I never played sonic CD as a child and I've tried a couple of times only to have it feel claustrophobic and closed off, with not much space to enjoy the speed I've built up.
Which seems to be what everyone says about the early sonic games so I dunno, maybe there's something to it.
>>340302062
It runs at 30fps I believe and the graphics are shittier
>>340302509
CD is a very different game from 1,2 and 3K
It's more focused on exploration and the levels are much more vertical
>>340302062
The PS2 was, by any objective measure, the worst console of that generation on a technical level, which meant that any multiplat had to be dumbed down for the console to handle it. The GameCube or XBox version of any multiplat, especially Sonic multiplats, will always be better than the PS2 version. XBox is usually better than GameCube but the difference usually isn't as great as the difference between either and the PS2.
>>340302405
That happened because they decided to go with Adventure and Classic being part of the same universe, it was going to divide fans someday. They should have done something similar to what Capcom did with Megaman and have the Classic and Adventure series being separated entities, except in this case they could be entirely different universes.
If they did that and had one team making Classic Sonic games and other team making Sonic Adventure games, fans would probably have no reason to argue as much as they do now.
>>340288935
No, it's a meme propagated by people who like the modern games and want to trigger classic-only fags by criticizing their so-called 'perfect' game design
I love the classic games, but I can also see their many flaws, and this simply isn't one of them unless you're shit at the game. Taxman's ports having widescreen is a nice bonus but the games worked fine without it.
>>340302976
Not to mention it would've made sense for marketing because people could just look at the box art and see "Classic Sonic = 2D, Modern Sonic = 3D"
>>340288935
>after watching that RLM video?
Literally who? That's always been a complaint. But that's a complaint more for the Sonic Advance series. The Genesis games were better designed to not need to know what is ahead of you.
>>340289539
>I feel like the "the knuckles/tails stages sucked" and all those complaints for Sa2 didn't come up till egoraptors and somecallmejohnny's videos
Go fuck yourself. That was always a complaint. It's only because e-clebs you started paying attention.
>>340302976
I'll take a game that plays like the classics even if it has ugly ass modern sonic in it
Too bad Neo Sonic Team is incompetent and can't program physics or design levels for shit
In other words
Even if they did that Dimps would still ruin Classic Sonic like they fucked it up with Advance 2-onwards
>>340303385
>Even if they did that Dimps would still ruin Classic Sonic like they fucked it up with Advance 2-onwards
Not sure if it's strictly Dimps' fault though. I'm certain they just get hired out by Sonic Team to work as code/asset monkeys, the bulk of the design work in the Dimps titles is still done by Sonic Team staff.
>>340303000
The real issue is that Taxman's ports are mobile only
PC versions when?
>>340288935
>Is the limited visibility really a big issue on classic Sonic games
No but a bit more space is definitely welcome as seen in the taxman remakes.
Sonic Rush double screens also made things better.
>>340304542
No you're wrong
Dimps went solo with Advance 2-onwards
Advance 1 was good because it had some of the old staff including Naka as producer working on it
>>340304817
Probably never, SEGA we heavily restructured in 2013-2014.Taxman never specified what exactly happened but apparently his links with SEGA are shaky as fuck since then, presumably meaning the contacts he had at SEGA were either laid off, moved to different positions, or he got involved in a money dispute of some kind.
It sucks to say it but I'd hazard a guess and say that Taxman's business relationship with SEGA is dead in the water. At this point in time there is nothing to suggest another partnership between the two of them.
>>340305186
Nah
Left is the Sonic Team staff that worked on Advance 1. Right is the Sonic Team staff that worked on Advance 2. Many of them are the exact same people.
>>340305186
Somebody probably told you that non-fact as a comforting way to separate Advance 1 from the others since it IS blatantly better, but that shit just ain't true bro, see >>340305651
>>340303385
>ugly ass modern sonic
welcome back to the internet nicochi!
>>340305651
Now check all 3 games for both Dimps and Sonic Team
Some of the Dimps programmers in 1 aren't in 2 and Sonic Team has a very small role in Advance 3(AKA the worst one in the trilogy)
>>340302405
triggered
>>340307659
literally who
>>340307659
>nicochi
jeezus i haven't heard that name in a long time
his long ass posts in the sega forums used to put me to sleep
>>340307884
>>340302976
ill know, megaman series were everywhere at one point. and they never complained at any halfs of the fanbase for whatever reason. i don't see legends fans getting on classic era fansa asses or classic fans getting on x fans asses. classic sonic fags are just unreasonable and irrational.
>>340308205
>classic sonic fags are just unreasonable and irrational
just as much as adventure and boost fags though
the only true patricians are those among us who enjoy games from every era
>>340308205
Maybe because all of those Megaman subseries are actually good unlike your shitty Modern Sonic games you fucking retard
>>340308319
No the true patricians are the ones who enjoy 1-3K,Pocket Adventure and Advance 1
The rest of the "era's" objectively suck
>>340308205
>i don't see legends fans getting on classic era fansa asses or classic fans getting on x fans asses.
is that a joke
>>340308467
While I do like the classics the best, I have a soft spot for the nostalgia factor of the Adventures, and I unironically enjoy the boost formula and think it has much more substance than the "boost to win" meme gives it credit for. I can't be bothered to debate my opinions on what makes each game good though so I guess we can just leave it at that
>>340292562
kek looks like those old school sonic fangames
>>340308371
Nah, the Classic series except for 8 was horrible. X sucked since 4. Legends ended too early. Batlle Network/Starforce was milked. while Zero was the only one that came too an close, retained some dignity and respect. and came at an good time. and ended at an right time.
i feel like i want another ZX game though.
>>340295449
>>340295798
>press right to win
>pick the sonic game that punished you for it the most
???
In sonic advance 2 there was long stretches of the stage which made the game feel like that. Hot crater is hold right to win though I'll say that though.
It's not a big issue if you aren't shit at vidya.
>>340308467
>the true patricians are the ones who enjoy 1-3K
>objectively suck
Looks like an Special Snowflake has arrived!
>>340301712
>tfw I liked adventure 1 almost as much as I liked S3&K
>>340297653
Sonic X had the absolute worst and most autistic looking designs Sonic has ever had. Looked straight out of Deviantart.
Sonic Heroes is the worst he's ever looked in a game so it's not surprise you like both. That plasticy glossiness is just gross and he has no expressiveness.
>>340309035
>Liking 8 of all Megaman games
>Fucking 8
>Hating the rest
Jesus Christ
did anyone ever realize the whole "sonic was never good" or "rlm was right about classic sonic" is result of retro-sonic fags and cringe-media sonic fagdom not facing any real consequence sooner for acting like the genesis games were all that great and acting like it was fact and treating 3d games as cancer when there not especially when they had merit regardless of denial.
>>340310647
Is this where all of the "classic Sonic was never good" shitposting comes from? Some fucking youtube video by an e-celeb? /v/irgins laud themselves as not being sheep, but they seem to follow every fucking trend. Egoraptor, this asshole, Gamegrumps, every thing under the fucking sun.
I don't know who RLM is, but one of the reasons I dislike Sonic is that I have to memorize the level to go fast. I guess lack of visibility is the reason why.
>but you should be rewarded by putting in more time!
Agreed, but the problem is that the game offers nothing if you're not able to go fast. Why get good at a game that is boring until you've memorized everything?
>>340310647
That was some fucking atrociously long sentence, use some punctuation
As for your question, I'm not fully sure what you're asking
>>340309035
>Nah, the Classic series except for 8 was horrible.
Please next time try more with your b8
>>340310948
You don't really have to memorize everything as most people are saying. I haven't played a Sonic game in several years and I don't remember most of the level layouts, and yet I'm still able to go fast.
It's more like if you have good reaction time, hand-eye coordination, etc. you can go fast. Which, maybe mine was developed after playing Sonic for years and years as a child.
>>340309817
I like the proportions more than the glosiness(which kinda sucks and sucked even more in SADX)
>gotta go fast
>but first
>gotta memorize the level so I don't run into an enemy at 300mph.
>slow down and time my jumps like mario would
>gotta go fast
BLAST PROCESSING~~!!
>>340310647
Nobody gives a shit about what faggot millenials think
The classics will forever be great games
>>340311251
git gud faggot
>>340310948
>>340311251
You don't have to memorize the level. You just have to have good reaction times, and a mind sharp enough to work out the level design grammar of each specific stage
>Come into thread hoping for some nice discussion about Sonic in general
>That one anti-classic fag who always shits up threads is here again
wew lad
>>340310436
>>340311083
he was saying some shit, that x starting sucking at x4. but whats wrong with megaman 8?
>>340311306
millennials were old enough to play Sonic at the time. You don't need to be 40 years old to have enjoyed the games back then.
>>340289539
Classic Sonic games's entire damage system was based around the lack of visibility + his speed. His damaging form is also his fastest when curled. You could take hits and keep going, but your pace would be broken. Imagine if you had health and not rings. You had to fuck up bad to die to damage, usually because of a boss, but you could potentially have an infinite lifeline.The level design made sure there was no extreme prevalence of death pits like in the Advance 2 and 3 games. Consequently it made enemies simple obstacles or annoying as fuck. Plus the bosses never really were that great. Obviously it came down to level design to make sure it wasn't completely unfair.
Freedom Planet took lots of steps to go out of its way to make their game work with this. First, the health system and combat changes the dynamic because the grand majority of enemies don't damage on touch, just on active frames, which is huge. You can't accidentally run into an enemy since it has to be attacking you, and this works against you since you need to overlap enemies while your active attacks are up. Bosses can get more crazy and enemies more challenging, especially with added warning signs indicating where larger and tougher attacks are coming from off screen. Very tiny amounts of pits that are telegraphed as well. As a result Sonic's dull and out of place feeling bosses on in complete contrast with FP's fun and action packed bosses.
>>340311731
I think it's ruggarell. Last night he was calling someone a "white beta" for liking the classics. This is just more bait. This whole fucking board is nothing but bait, there's no one genuine. It's sickening.
>>340310948
The classics were fairly good about not completely fucking you, in contrast with something like the Advanced titles were enemy placement and pits were fucking infuriating, but it did happen.
2D.5 style is a system that would work best for classic Sonic. Generations had a few bits of it but lacked everything important to classic Sonic physics and level design. You can scroll the the screen ahead, tilt forward for an angle, and zoom in and out to expand screen space. Also modern display ratios rather than 4:3 helps too.
>>340311762
>but whats wrong with megaman 8?
re-read his post again
he said 1-7 sucked and that 8 was the only good one
>>340311898
You're an idiot
The visibility was not a problem at all
>Freedom Planet
That game is more like Gunstar Heroes than Sonic,I don't get why you millenialfags bring that shit up it's completely irrelevant
>>340312824
>millenial
Stop using that word, you obviously don't know what it means.
>>340312470
>zoom in and out
worst idea ever
i hate that fucking inconsistent bullshit and it feels so fucking scripted
there was nothing wrong with 4:3 either
people just don't want to spend time to get good at a game anymore and would rather instead be lazy and blame it on the game which is why modern gaming is such casualized dogshit these days
>>340313081
It means "newfag"
Sonic threads
Sonic threads never change.
Hey YouTube, did you ever notice that Space Invaders is really OVERRATED! I mean it says its a space shooter, but with the limited mobility of your ship you can barely shoot anything! Epic fail huh??? Is anyone watching I can be relevant be criticizing classic games too
>>340312824
I feel the same way. Sonic is a simple to play game. There is one button, only one real type of collectable, everything is accomplished by learning the depth of the simple mechanics. Freedom Planet with it's multiple attack combos, meters to keep track up, different types of things to collect feels extremely anti-Sonic to me, even if they use a similar visual style and physics.
>>340308129
le /pol/ boogyman
>>340316221
>le
>>340288935
I was able to beat all but the very last boss in Sonic 2, and all but Labyrinth's boss in Sonic 1, when I was 8 years old.
Some people just really fucking suck at video games.
>>340290912
>Knuckles
>Sonic's best friend
what
>>340311251
Here's the thing, you have to look at the games contextually if you're going to be brining up advertisements. The ads were made in a time where what Sonic was doing (all the shit in the background, his movement speed, loops, etc.) WAS "omg so fast".
If you're using "modern video games" feelings of "goin fast" you're going to have a bad time, because you're applying one set of standards to an entirely different context.
And no, a game requiring you to put time into it so that it becomes rewarding isn't bad because of it. If you don't like having to learn how to play a video game then go play your ADHD smart phone apps.
>>340317454
The critisisms given to the classic Sonic games can apply to pretty much every other platformer ever released, I'd love to see how far you can make it in Super Mario Bros 3 trying to keep max speed at all times.
The only reason Sonic gets flak for it is because people fell for the commercial meme and think that if they don't go fast they're not playing it right. They judge the game based on what they think they're supposed to play like, not from any contextual clues of the game itself.
>>340288935
It's not a legit complaint, since most games used that exact sprite to background ratio. But I won't deny that playing that kind of game is way cooler in a widescreen format.
>>340316684
>Some people just really fucking suck at video games.
this
>>340288935
>Is the limited visibility really a big issue on classic Sonic games
It might be for people who somehow don't know that Sonic can roll.
>>340291137
>>340317382
>two people didn't pick up on the problem in that picture
ignore the best friend comment, the description says knuckles is a fucking mole. we all know he's a delicious meat and tortilla dish
>daily reminder that we don't need Taxman to make sonic 3 remastered because sonic 3 complete is now officially supported on steam
>>340318887
>sonic 3 complete is now officially supported on steam
What?
>>340318887
Sonic 3 Complete isn't widescreen.
>thinking hating on sonic is something new
>didn't grow up during the old console war generation of nintendo vs Sega
>blame all the sonic hate on a younger youtube audience
Are you fags so delusional that you honestly thought everyone liked sonic even in its prime? Sonic was always a shitty game of press right to win, that's why sonic kids were never invited to any birthday parties
>>340319495
>look mom, i'm pretending to be a 90's kid!
Go away underage.
>>340318887
desu fampai the main things I wanted were the revamped 2P stages and Blue Sphere 2. I'd still dip my dick in acid for Sonic 3 as Taxman truly imagined it
>>340319495
>press right to win
To this day this is still the dumbest recurring bait i've ever read
>>340319068
Sega allows modding with Steams new genesis game player. Once you buy the game you can literally download any mod you want for it and the community has already released over 300. Checkpoints in Ecco, non-censored Earthworm Jim, there's even a mod where every time an enemy dies in Streets of Rage they make a Tim Allen scream. Sonic 3 complete also has an official steam release now for use if you buy sonic 3.
>>340319376
There will inevitably be a mod release that puts it in widescreen as well.
>>340319587
Keep on being delusional friend
>>340319816
Call it what you will, the complaint has been made since the days of yore. You can't blame it on some modern trend, the sentiment has always existed. I thought that's what this thread was about? Claiming sonic hate was a modern thing, because it sure as fuck isnt
>>340319680
I'd pay full price for Blue Sphere 2 alone, without the Sonic game. That was my jam as a kid.
>>340288935
Are people really that stupid they dont know how to fucking ROLL in classic sonic games? What The FRICK!
>>340319495
>Sonic was always a shitty game of press right to win
Can you read, anon? These millennials are complaining ad nauseum that the games are specifically NOT like that.
>>340319495
>claims game is press right to win
>gets hit and complains game isn't press right to win
>>340320008
Sonic hate is a real thing and it HAS existed since early days. There are a lot of complaints to be made about Sonic - the camera issue made in the OP, the fact that the games are quite short if you're not shit at them, the varying quality of the Special Stages, that fact that every Sonic game has at LEAST two levels that are just irrefutably dog shit (like Marble Zone and Labyrinth), I could go on
But press right to win is a fucking meme made up by nintendo kids who never actually owned a Genesis. Literally anybody who has played a Sonic game knows it isn't true, the first "press __ to win" game was Sonic Rush and that was released 14 years after Sonic's debut
>>340320369
>>340320416
That sums it all up. That sums up video game culture as a whole, really.
1996: Sonic sucks because you just hold right to win!
2016: Sonic sucks because when you hold right you keep getting hit!
>>340288935
Taxman version is great for this.
Though to be honest, back then all video games were 4:3 and nobody cared.
>>340320491
I can agree with Labyrinth being shit, but why Marble?
If anything, Sonic is "press down on a slope to win". Rolling is OP as fuck and I love it
>>340320903
Marble Zone is really opposed to everything else that defines a Sonic stage. It's linear, has almost no branching paths, and is made out of jagged blocks with slopes only being aboveground where you have no real way to utilize them. I don't think it's a terrible, out of place stage but it's definitely among the worst if I had to rank them
The only Sonic games where visibility was ever a problem for me were some of the Game Gear games, the latter stages of Advance 2, and all of Advance 3.
I never had visibility issues with the Genesis games. Not as a kid and not today. When I get hit in Sonic 2 or 3, it's my fault. I always have ample time to react. That's part of how you git gud at the fucking game. Learn to use your roll properly and master your reaction times.
>>340320491
>every Sonic game has at LEAST two levels that are just irrefutably dog shit (like Marble Zone and Labyrinth)
I'll refute that right now. They're hard to breeze through, but the better you are at the game, the more easily you breeze through them. Turning something difficult into something trivial, by your own skill and technique is satisfying. Precise, blocky platforming is a good challenge for Sonic. He naturally moves pretty fast, so you have to get a good grasp of controlling your movement, in very precise ways. Rewarding in itself. Having to traverse water only adds to the eventual satisfaction of overcoming.
The music of both Zones is fucking 10/10.
The visuals in Labyrinth especially get my dick hard.
The outside sections of Marble Zone have plenty of slopes that you can moon jump off of at the precisely correct moments to skip sections of platforming.
Those secrets in Marble are pretty great too.
These Zones are consistently more enjoyable for me than Spring Yard (music and visuals are shit) or Star Light (music's alright I guess, and bottomless pits are annoying when not in the final zone).
I understand if you disagree, but calling them "irrefutably dogshit" is just wrong.
>>340290912
>Knuckles is a mole
:^)
Most, if not all complaints that are used against Sonic are asinine, inane and FUCKING retarded. That is a undeniable, objective fact. But what's even more fucking stupid is that you idiots are discussing these "complaints" as if they're something to take seriously. Kill yourselves.
>piece of shit idiots think the DURRR GOTTA GO FATS meme translates to the actual game
>>340319842
>non-censored Earthworm Jim
What?
>>340320110
>Are people really that stupid
Always.
>>340292562
>that video
>I wanna be the hedgehog
>>340290353
cring
>>340321371
I really wish Marble Zone had more outside sections.
>>340288935
Meme opinions
>>340289779
>>340289539
As someone who likes the Tails/Knuckles stages, that was a common complaint on day 1. See Penny Arcade for a contemporary example.
>>340290912
>Knuckles is a mole
>>340290472
God even for the time that is disgustingly terrible
I loved Sonic but it was always an issue for me, then again I was 5 years old and horrible at video games.
>>340288935
It's only a problem for complete casuals and hardcore speedrunners trying to find the best routes.
>>340292158
>>340301198
>>340301712
Yeah I don't get it, my favourite sanic games are 2, 3&K, adventure 1&2, and Unleashed.
>>340301712
You can like both while understanding that one has a mountain of flaws that the other doesn't, to the point that it's completely mediocre.
>>340290472
>>340324409
God you idiots are mind-numbingly retarded. How are they so bad? I shall brace myself for the autism incoming
>>340319842
>There will inevitably be a mod release that puts it in widescreen as well.
This is not possible. The "mods" are hacks of Genesis roms, which run on an emulator, and as such are subject to all the limitations of the Genesis. It cannot exceed 4:3 resolution, and even if it did, getting the game to properly load and render things outside the camera bounds would be a nightmare.
>>340325027
this
I actually prefer Adventure and Adventure 2 to Sonic 1 and Sonic 2. CD and 3K are the only games of the classics I really rate, but at the same time every 3D Sonic objectively (and I know that's a meme word) had much more design issues and poorly coded sections, and a general lack of polish in certain areas (the Adventure cutscenes come to mind) even by early 2000s standards.
Adventure is undoubtedly in my top 3 of the Sonic franchise and I rate Colors pretty highly too but people need to remove their childhood biases from the equation and look at the series with a bit more context and thought. Every Sonic thread for the past two months has just been people waving their epenises around to see who's nostalgia is better and who's opinion is edgier.
>>340325656
Sonic Adventure 2 Battle is probably my second favorite Sonic game, but I know it's far from the second best.
>>340289539
"Limited" visibility wasn't an issue of the older games if you had any semblance of skill.
People have been complaining about the Knuckles and Tails (and other characters') stages since the games first released.
Freedom Planet is garbage and nearly as bad as Sonic 4.
It's just a meme some butthurt nintoddlers refuse to let die. A lot of them also say Crash was never good and make up "issues" to try to justify the fact that they're just shit at the game.
>>340288935
the best way to fix it is to have the camera pull forward ahead of the character when they pick up speed so you can see further to avoid cheap hits
>>340325321
Look at that shit, that's a fucking Gamecube/Xbox game and it looks disgusting. There's no real texture, just a flat colour, and for some reason they're shiny as fuck. It looks garish and awful.
Never really bothered me.
If anything, I thought the speed was exaggerated. Though its defiantly more slower in the first game. Other stages in the other 2 have you go slower.
As for Sonic Adventure, I always found the double standard with them very odd. Sonic Adventure has similar flaws with Sonic 06, but no one minds. Sonic Adventure 2 had those shitty digging stages, but no one minded despite never giving the Werehog or any similar idea a chance.
Fucking hated SA2. The game felt like a chore to play and the story was just, odd.
>>340326069
>A lot of them also say Crash was never good and make up "issues" to try to justify the fact that they're just shit at the game
I mean, 3D platforming on a D-pad is pretty cancer, but apart from that Crash 1 and 2 are fucking masterpieces
>>340326440
>the story was just, odd
I feel like the story is betrayed by the dub somewhat. Sonic Adventure 2's story isn't half bad written down (by Sonic standards at least) but those fucking janky mouths and the sheer lack of direction from the voice actors makes the whole thing feel pretty bizarre
>>340326440
Knuckles stages were fun though. Shooting stages were ass.
>>340326380
they're colorful cartoon characters from a game from 2004. the fuck were you expecting dumbass?
>>340326792
not that anon but i don't think you can just get away with ignoring the problems with the model just because "THEYRE CARTOONS LOL". Wind Waker came out a year prior, it was the most cartoony game ever seen and it was fucking beautiful.
But then I feel like you're not actually being legit and you're just baiting people into giving you long winded responses so you can go "wow you care that much about a model? you must be autistic"
>>340326630
It felt like it was trying too hard to be like MGS. The stuff with The Ark felt out of place for a Sonic game.
I mean, I watched horror movies as a kid, and it was pretty rare (at the time) to kill off a child. But they did it in a Sonic game.
>>340326792
Characters that did not shine like plastic, probably. There are no excuses.
>>340327051
that isn't even what I was trying to imply. they're colorful anime characters, how ELSE would they look?
and I'm saying that talking about this is autistic in itself. I'm 100% sure these sort of complaints are exclusive to sonic only
>>340326792
There a lot of graphical problems with the games. The least they could do is attempt to fix some of them. They looked really choppy at times.
>>340326457
The D-Pad thing is less a problem with the games themselves and more the fact that the original PSX controller didn't even have an analog stick.
>>340327540
>I'm 100% sure these sort of complaints are exclusive to sonic only
I think it's fair that Sonic gets more complaints than most other popular series', considering it does more things wrong than most other popular series'
Although for the record, pretty much every vidya mascot that had a major redesign and a decline in game quality get similar complaints. See: Pac-Man, Crash, Spyro, and so on. You just see more of it with Sonic because /v/ has become a hotbed for Sonic autists over the last 3 or 4 months.
>>340288935
Well i know people take youtubers complaints to heart but this has genuinely always been my problem with sonic. There isnt enough screen space to predict whats coming up. The only sonic games I like are the one with boost anyway and move fast. Unleashed and Generations. I hope the new sonic game brings back the boost with Unleashed like level design and story otherwise its back to not caring.
>>340328326
>There isnt enough screen space to predict whats coming up
you don't need space, you can easily predict what's coming up by working out the level design grammar
>>340328486
I dont want to do that. I want to go fast without stopping and getting hit every 5 seconds or coming to hill which simulates walking through syrup. Unleashed and Generations provide this. Old Sonic does not.
>>340328904
>i want speed to be given to me all of the time without working for it
>>340328904
>I want to go fast without stopping and getting hit every 5 seconds or coming to hill which simulates walking through syrup
Then, and I mean this in the least meme way possible, you need to "git gud". Speed in Genesis Sonic is a reward, not a freebie.
>>340329073
Uh yeah because thats all Sonic has going for him? lol. Let me get this straight, youre buttfrustrated because people enjoy watching Sonic go fast? Whatever man
>>340329173
Thats fine, and thats another reason I don't enjoy genesis Sonic. Thank god they reworked the series into 3D and actually made it fast.
>>340288935
>Sonic 4 will never be completed
>Sonic 4 will never be good
While I never found that for any of the Genesis Sonic games, I did find it sorta true for Sonic Generations sometimes.
There are some parts of the levels where, unless you've already memorized that part of the level, you'll run into a wall/enemy at the same time that they actually become visible, making for some fucking terrible momentum stopping.
Maybe it's just that it's been a long time since I played a Sonic game, but Generations' 2D sections feel like they were developed by a third party that'd never worked with Sonic before.
>>340329294
not that anon but holy shit you're a fucking idiot. The genesis games are pseudo action/adventure titles and speed is a reward. Honestly, it's no wonder pieces of shits like you can't enjoy them and make up asinine memes. Kill yourself m8
>>340329813
Generations' Classic Sonic is a fucking disgrace in terms of level design. I honestly hope they just make more boost games. Boost gameplay doesn't hold a candle to the classic gameplay but if you can't do something right, don't do it at all.
>>340329843
don't bother with him, he's one of the few anons who have been saying dumb shit in every Sonic thread for the past two months to rinse free (You)'s out of classicfags
>>340328326
>this has genuinely always been my problem with sonic. There isnt enough screen space to predict whats coming up.
Have you ever tried rolling while going into unexplored territory? The games aren't filled to the brim with bottomless pits like everything starting with Adventure is, so barreling into new territory at high speeds and with added protection (which is what happens when you roll down a hill, into a spring, or into a speed booster) is a viable way to approach unseen stuff.
When I was at least as young as 8 years old I was able to beat essentially all of both Sonic 1 and 2, and rolling didn't even click with me until I was probably 12 or 13. After it clicked, the games became way more fun to explore and boost through.
2 is the most accessible game in the series, so try to get used to rolling there. There are more advanced techniques to learn after that. Understandable if you don't want to put that much time into a game you're already not liking, though.
>>340290564
Absolutely dellusional if you think devs don't QA their own games
>>340329294
>Uh yeah because thats all Sonic has going for him?
Apparently not. If that's "all he has going for him", and his old games apparently never delivered on that, then they wouldn't be very fucking successful, would they?
>>340330537
Im not complaining that theyre hard dumbass. I know a lot about the engine of the game, best times to jump off a slope, jumping then rolling in a loop to go faster etc. Ive been playing games all my life and sonic is one of the simplest series ever. Its just not FUN. Fucking retard. I dont care about exploration or waiting for the right path to open up. I prefer linear games and especially platformers.
>>340330701
Yeah thats why sa2, heroes, unleashed, colors, and generations outsold sonic 3 LMAO. Shit I think even sonic 06 and shadow did too. The whole series has been a success until recently when they went in the nintendo deal, dont start this shit.
>>340330963
>Yeah thats why sa2, heroes, unleashed, colors, and generations outsold sonic 3 LMAO
Different anon, Sonic 3 sold poorly because it was near the end of the Mega Drive's lifecycle. S3 and S&K technically sold well over triple their stated figures on Wikipedia if you actually take digital releases into consideration
>>340327151
>complains about models
>posts SA as a good alternative
my sides
>>340330963
Wow faggot I agree with you then I don't. Your opinons on the classics are retarded and wrong but I agree with the point you're trying to make.
the 3d sonic games leading upto colors were all good and it's what the series fucking is at its core. Colors and onwards.. I don't even fucking what it is or who it's trying to please. It's like Sega stopped making Sonic games.. you know, how they SHOULD be and gave into the asinine criticisms just to please the majority. But those people are fucking idiots who shouldn't be playing Sonic regardless.
>>340330963
>Im not complaining that theyre hard dumbass
>Its just not FUN. Fucking retard.
Oh shit, did my attempt at helpful advice strike a nerve?
>thats why sa2, heroes, unleashed, colors, and generations outsold sonic 3 LMAO.
Pretty much every game starting with Adventure involved desperate attempts to appeal to normies. They literally added multiple gameplay styles in order to draw in non-fans. This also begn a very desperate time for Sega. They were on their last leg as a console developer.
Sonic Heroes was a fucking multiplat, as was everything after, outside of Colors.
The industry and consumer base also got much larger. As a result, you're going have continually more and more people with no taste looking to buy the newest shit that their "brand" churned out.
None of that changes the fact that Sonic most certainly had shit going for him prior to selling out. If they didn't fuck themselves with the 32X and the Saturn, they wouldn't have needed to scrounge for normalfag bucks. If Sonic didn't have shit going for him during he 2D games, ther wouldn't have been a fucking clamor for him to come into 3D. If Sonic 1 was a total bust, then 2, CD, and 3K wouldn't have been made. Clearly, they were doing something right, even if the games weren't actually "about going fast" outside of marketing memes (though, contextually speaking, they were about going fast, relative to video games of the day, outside of just marketing memes).
You can tell how young someone is by how incapable they are of appreciating different contexts.
>>340331615
I didnt know about but then we can also count digital sales for things like sa1, 2, unleashed, and generations which are on psn/xbl/steam and still sell. Of course one has better rep than the others but it doesnt mean they didnt sell good.
>>340331961
Are you saying the games havent felt the same since 2010? Then I would agree with that. I think Colors is terrible, one of the worst in the series. Generations has a few good stages and when theyre good theyre damn good but as a whole its nowhere near as unique or complete as unleashed was. I like the other 3D sonic games too somewhat but the boost style is my favorite.
>>340331812
Looks good? Check.DX a shit.
Doesn't shine like plastic? Check.
Has more polygons than any model on Heroes? Check.
>>340332401
There's also Lost World and Boom. The people behind those games should be shot multiple times in the head
You know, I don't really get the Colors hate meme. I missed out Shadow and 06 so I can't criticize them but I've played a lot of Sonic games and Heroes is the only Sonic game I genuinely thought was shit. Is that just me? I see a lot of anons praising that game here and there but I honestly can't see the appeal at all outside of the dank soundtrack (and nearly every Sonic game has good music, so it doesn't redeem the game)
>>340288935
This is what happens when you listen to retards. Pressing down on the dpad to go into a spinball moves you further to the left of the screen giving you more time to react, and also means you don't get damaged from most sources.
>that one classic sonic shitposter ruins another thread
>I really fucking love the Master System Sonic games
I wish I could fit into a neat classic/adventure/modern clique >:
>>340333484
I'm 99% sure this only happens in Sonic CD
I don't know, I don't watch retard e-celeb videos. I've never had a problem with it.
>>340330963
>sa2, heroes, unleashed, colors, and generations outsold sonic 3
Both Sonic 3 and Sonic & Knuckles were released nearing the end of the Genesis' lifespam and together sold 3.5m copies. SA2 bombed on the Dreamcast under the same circumstances with only 120k copies sold and only got relatively decent sales after it was released on GameCube, but it was still 2.5m, one million less than what Sonic 3&K sold. Colors also didn't outsell it, the sales were up to 3m, still 500k behind.
But Heroes and Unleashed? Of course they would outsell it, both games were released to a fuckton of platforms, even then Unleashed on PS3 and Xbox 360 barely broke the 1m mark, the sales were almost completely held up by the Wii version.
THIS IS IMPORTANT
Play Sonic on a tube TV so you don't have to deal with input lag. There, I "fixed" sonic for you.
>>340334521
is this a melee joke, sonic is nowhere near demanding enough to require CRT. You could play it on a literal toaster and if you fuck up it'd still be your fault not the game or the hardware
>people actually unironically have issues with the original sonic games difficulty, screen size and/or pacing
You're genuinely just bad at game. I can complete the original Mega Drive Sonic games, except for the Labyrinth Zone boss, with my feet. And no, I'm not saying that as an exaggeration of how easy and predictable they are, I can /literally/ complete them, Sonic Mega Collection, with a Gamecube controller and only my feet. If you're running into walls and Motobugs whilst playing the game the way you're supposed to then you're just fucking shit, no two ways about it.
>>340311306
>Nobody gives a shit about what faggot millenials think
Then why does 4chan exist?
You don't seriously think anyone here is under 30?
>>340333614
>ruins
But the thread was shitposting since the OP
CHAOTIX RE-RELEASE WHEN?
>>340337904
Chaotix Taxman remaster when?
No but in all seriousness, has anyone ever tried hacking Chaotix to fix it up? People always scapegoat the physics as a complaint but the physics work fine, even with the rubber band. Most of the game is great. In fact, I'd say it has the best music, visuals and Special Stages of any Sonic game. The problem is simply that the level designs make the game boring as sin, there's never any threat or anything interesting going down.
>>340337904
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F-axPO7pwgg
AWWWW YEAHHHHHHH
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JFC6IDh00gI
daily reminder that Labyrinth Zone's bassline ripped this song off wholesale
>>340337102
You definitely can't complete ristar with just your feet, sorry.
>>340341679
I'm shit at Ristar so I won't even dispute this post
>>340326380
> Gamecube/Xbox game
Name one game during this era that tried "muh realism" and didn't look like complete cancerous shit? Hint: You motherfucking can't. Every game that went "cartoonish" looks 10x better than real shit like GTA and other crap like it. Wind Waker looked great for the time, hell Pikmin 1 and 2 were good looking then and decent now as well, much like Heroes. It's nothing special now to today's Sonic (Boom aside), but if there's one thing I like about Heroes is the aesthetics of it, it's like Sonic 2 but in 3D, to me.
tl;dr; You're a graphics whoring faggot and you should fucking kill yourself.
Speaking of Sonic here's the latest leak >>340341402
>>340288935
>want to go fast
>don't have fast reflexes
Going fast isn't for you pal.
