This game is just too long for its own good.
No anon
You're long
>>337371139
The Sonic 3 half is the best part. Sonic and Knuckles has good levels like Mushroom Hill or Sky Sanctuary but levels like Flying Battery and Sandopoils drag on forever.
>>337373619
Flying Battery was GOAT and had great music but I completely agree with Sandopolis. It's the only level I'm not fond of replaying.
>>337373619
Death Egg was disgustingly slowpaced and long.
>>337373619
I actually prefer the &K part of the game.
Marble Garden and Carnival Night are complete dog shit.
>>337373619
Lava Reef and Flying Battery are the tits man
>>337371139
>>337373619
The main problem is that combining the games meant completely fucking up the pacing since it had to restart at Mushroom Hill instead of progressing naturally.
>>337375740
And Sandopolis and Lava Reef aren't?
Hell, Lava Reef is Marble Garden with a red coat of paint.
>>337376228
And yet if it had progressed naturally, we'd be complaining about it like we do Sonic 2. Especially like Mystic Cave, Oil Ocean, Metropolis, and Wing Fortress Zone.
>>337376418
Only scrubs complain about Sonic 2. The endgame was great: Metropolis was close to the end so it made sense to be difficult, then you had a short breather to recover (Sky Chase), then a bunch of tricky technical platforming (Wing Fortress) and then the final boss.
>we will never hear Michael Jackson's high fidelity demos
>>337376934
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H2OWC5Hosv8
>>337377147
That was one of Jackson's producers. Not a Jackson song.
>there are still people who say S3K is too long
Y'ever have someone say to you "Keep telling yourself that, maybe one day you'll believe it"? They were being sarcastic.
>>337371139
So is my penis hehehaha
>>337376240
Lava Reef was great though. At the very least the music and stage aesthetics were.
>>337379169
The boss battle was shit
>>337379293
I personally loved the fight the first time but on repeat playthroughs it's a bit of a chore.
>>337376934
We need to Raid SoJ and steal the demo's for ourselvs
So its come to this. People hate on the best Sonic, Sonic Unleashed, and now they go for Sonic 3 and Knuckles too. Were fucked lads
>>337380889
And also get the clean vocal for Supporting Me while we're at it
When sonic dies, who becomes the new Sega mascot?
>>337381442
Sega as a company will die before Sonic.
>>337376934
I wonder if they still have them somewhere.
>>337381442
Adam
>>337381442
What do they even have that's still alive and people still like, Kazuma Kiryu or Football Manager?
Then they'll probably put Iizuka in charge of that series and the cycle will begin anew.
The music honestly sucks ass in s3k outside of a few songs. All the other classic sonic games have much better sound tracks
>>337371139
I hate how this game has so many fucking gimmicks everywhere.
>Angel Island
Water.
>Hydrocity
Water.
>Marble Garden
Tops.
>Carnival Night
Barrels, water.
>Ice Cap
Slippery controls.
>Launch Base
Elevators, water.
>Mushroom Hill
Pulleys.
>Flying Battery
Surprisingly no annoying gimmicks.
>Sandopolis
Everything in Act 2.
>Lava Reef
Those things you had to spindash on.
>Death Egg
Anti-gravity.
>>337381442
Alex Kidd will be Rebooted
>>337377147
HARD TIMES
>>337382031
Flying battery has those shitty magnetic platforms that stop you from spindashing ahead, the spinning part at the top with the pole, breaking the ship open with the bombs, and going underneath through the tube in act 2 (or maybe it was 1)
No level in this game is safe from retarded gimmicks. Fuck it. Sonic 2 was way better
>>337382095
Nobody likes that ugly manlet.
If anyone should be SEGA's mascot, it should be Joe Fucking Musashi.
>>337382031
>water is a gimmick
>ice in an ice level is a gimmick
>>337382251
They're making a Shinobi movie, so they'll probably make a Shinobi game too.
>God tier
Angel Island
Hydrocity
Ice Cap
Sky Sanctuary
Hidden Palace if it counts.
>Good tier
Carnival Night
Mushroom Hill
>Meh tier
Launch Base
Lava reef
Flying Battery
>Most of the reason why this game isn't better than Sonic 2 tier
Marble Garden
Sandopolis
Death Egg
Elder God Tier:
Sonic the Hedgehog
High Tier:
Sonic 2
Mid Tier:
Sonic CD
Low Tier:
Sonic 3 & Knuckles
Shit Tier:
Knuckles Chaotix
Knuckles used to be the cool rival to Sonic. Like Shadow only not as tryhard or edgy. Now he's just a dumb, buff meathead.
>>337382453
>Lava Reef
>not god tier
>>337382453
Id bump carnival night and mushroom hill down to meh, and put launch base and lava reef in shit tier. Otherwise not to bad. Sonic and knuckles is a pretty terrible game.
>>337382618
Shadow wasnt edgy from the start. He was more of an anti hero who wanted to find the truth for his existence and why his friend was killed. It wasnt till shadow (the game) where he went edgy and that was his biggest appearance of it. Even in sonic 06, he was pretty friendly with sonic, and even saved him from silver kicking his ass.
So you can take your reddit youtube tier epic le shadow is edgy comments elsewhere, fuckhead.
Both games have some standouts and stinkers, but the highlights in Sonic & Knuckles stood out to me more than Sonic 3's better zones besides Ice Cap. Sonic 3 is more frontloaded too.
Individually I'd say each one is worse than Sonic 2 but as a whole package they offer so much quality content that it beats Sonic 2 out, even though nothing in Sonic 2 is as bad as Marble Garden or Sandopolis Act 2.
Also the Sonic 3 Complete hack with Flying Battery moved to post-Casino Night is the best way to play the game.
>>337371139
I was thinking of Streaming this today to speedrun it in under 2 Hours as Sonic.
Would anyone be interested? I will be doing some Humble Bundle Giveaways during.
Also >Sonic 3 Complete mod.
>>337371139
>2 hours is too long for a video game
>>337382920
>if i smash 2 shit games together, it magically turns into quality content!
Let me guess, you shit on the adventure or unleashed games for having meh side levels but praise the garbage levels in Sonic 3 just because of your bias. Sonic fans are truly fucking autistic
>>337382031
Holy shit, do you like anything?
>>337379169
Oh hey, no question there. It's exemplary.
Stage layout is absolutely trash, though.
Who made a fool out of who?
>>337384354
>if i smash 2 shit games together
More like throwing the best parts of two very good and solid platformers into a single package.
Sonic 3 and Sonic & Knuckles are both shorter than Sonic 2 on average so putting them together nails you a perfect length Sonic platformer where 3/4ths of the game are the best the series has ever been with a lot of cool bonuses and three playable characters who all function well. Stages like Marble Garden and Sandopolis are less than stellar but they're still perfectly playable, don't make up a majority of the game at all and are far from the worst zones in the series.
I have no nostalgia for these games at all. I grew up with Sonic 1 and later the Adventure series because I never personally owned a Genesis or Saturn, and only finally got around to playing Sonic 2 and 3 all the way through last year.
>you shit on the adventure or unleashed games for having meh side levels
I shit on the Adventure games for a lot of reasons, let alone the fact that calling 2/3rds of the game "side levels" is ridiculous.
Unleashed is a perfectly fine game. It has a lot of problems that got ironed out in Colors and Generations that make it by far the weakest of the three boost games but the core gameplay is still solid. It's just a shame the Werehog had to exist at all.
>Sonic fans are truly fucking autistic
The last thing I would call myself is a Sonic fan.
>>337382031
What is wrong with you?
Though I agree, Sandopolis Act 2 is too stressful to be fun
>>337371139
This game has the worst chaos emerald stages.
>>337371139
Sonic 3 & Leddit is utter dog shit.
sonic 2 was much better.
*puts up flame shield*
>>337385517
Sonic 2's are worse. Because of the turns and because of Tails
>>337385705
*throws water*
>>337385517
You kidding? The spheres are one of the better types.
All of the "Collect the Rings" Special Stages are all trial and error.
Sonic 1 is decent.
Sonic CD EARNS A SPECIAL PLACE IN HELL FOR ITS DEPTH PERCEPTION ISSUES AND TINY HITBOXES ON GIANT UFO'S
>>337385517
nah blue sphere is great
>>337385826
agreed sonic 3's blue sphere is much better than 2
>>337385941
Sonic CD's special stages are unbelievably fun in the Taxman version. I don't know if they're any good in the SCD version though, because I've never played that one.
>>337385461
Not really, because those shit tier stages make up a majority of the game. And sonic 3 and sonic and knuckles are loaded with them. One could argue sonic 2 gets rough at the end, but it could also be a poorly placed difficulty curve. Either way, the game getting harder at the end is nothing unusual and makes perfect sense.
Tell the truth, Id replay any random given tails or knuckles level in SA over sandopolis, marble garden, death egg, carnival night, lava reef and so on ever again. Unleashed is the best of the boost games, which I notice got gradually worse over time. Unleashed > colors > generations
>>337385826
>>337385941
>>337385948
I didn't grow up with the sonic series, so you guys are probably used to them. But I always get fucking lost of where to go in the bonus stage around chaos emerald number 4 or 5. It's also nauseating when it gets fast.
>>337386260
Huh. Come to think of it, I wonder if those were tweaked? I played both. I don't think they're that much different, but then again, they did seem slightly easier to hit.
>>337382241
Oh yeah, I forgot about the magnets. Fuck that part.
>>337386645
>It's also nauseating when it gets fast.
DAMN. IT. ALL. TO. HELL.
Now I have to advocate something other than the S3&K Special Stages.
Can we all at least agree that the Giant Rings were the best entry method?
Pronounce this
> Sonic fans
> Want Sonic all the time
> Complain when a game is too long
topkek
>>337371139
I usually have Super Sonic by the end of Hydrocity and Hyper Sonic by the middle of Sandopolis, so it's not bad
>>337385705
There was no flame shield in sonic 2
>>337382453
>S3K
>not better than S2
do you really think anyone will take you seriously?
>>337387052
hi-dross-it-e
its obviously not a city so its not the other pronunciation.
Favorite zone from each game, /v/?
Sonic 1: Spring Yard
Sonic 2: Casino Night
Sonic 3: Launch Base
Sonic & Knuckles: Flying Battery
Sonic CD: Wacky Workbench
Knuckles Chaotix: Speed Slider
>>337371139
Why do you think it has a save system?
>>337387052
Hydro
City
Hydro-city
>filename
sometimes I say that if I'm feeling retarded
>>337387052
HI-DRO SIT-E
>>337387331
Speed Highway
Green Forest
Lost Jungle
Crisis City
Jungle Joyride
Asteroid Coaster
>>337387052
High-DRAW-sih-tee
>>337387109
It's better when short, like Star Fox.
Besides, Sonic Team's definition of long is shit like Carnival Night or Sandopolis or Wacky Workbench or Metropolis.
>>337387169
Lol'd
>>337387474
>3D Sonic
>>337387052
Highdrawsitty.
It's obviously a pun on Hydro + Velocity.
>>337387689
He gets it.
And if it were HIGH-jro, they would have split it into two words, Hydro City (like Angel Island, Marble Garden, every other fucking zone pretty much except Sandopolis).
>that star level from the first game
Damn if that level didn't make me feel good and peaceful inside.
>>337387331
Sonic 1: Green Hill
Sonic 2: Mystic Cave
Sonic 3: Hydrocity
S & K: Flying Battery
Sonic CD: Stardust Speedway
>>337387689
It's been confirmed its actually Hydro City not Highdrawsitty.
>Sauce?
Offical Sonic 3 manual
>>337387052
Hydro City. "Hydrocity" isn't a fucking word, and "Hydro City" is a prime example of a typical name for a Sonic level, following the "fitting adjective describing a noun that's a metaphor for what the level physically is" trope. It just happens to be a compound word instead of two separate ones.
>>337387569
>Autism
>>337387569
>believing the "3D sonic is bad" meme
>>337388554
Shh, reddit is still behind on the meme opinion
>>337387485
>It's better when short, like Star Fox.
And yet everyone complains that Star Fox Zero is too short.
>>337382031
>Ice Cap
>Slippery controls.
Ice Cap has no ice physics, what the fuck are you talking about?
>>337388851
Surprise: gaymers dont know what they want. What once worked in the 90s as a kid wont fly today. You want to make a game with 2-3 hours of content? No problem, but games like that are relegated to a 15-$20 download on a digital store now. This is ultimately the problem with sonic colors and generations. Theyre uninteresting, theyre short, theyre way to easy, and can be beaten in an afternoon. And yet those were the last highly rated games and were given free passes for sega to further lower the budget and length of sonic games (notably seen in generations, lost world).
>>337387331
>Wacky Workbench
FINALLY, SOMEONE WHO UNDERSTANDS. The level in Sonic CD that I don't like is Stardust Speedway, which everyone else loves.
Anyway,
>Green Hill Zone
>I suck at Sonic 2 too much to have experienced opinions on its levels
>Collision Chaos tied with Metallic Madness
>Sonic 3 is the same deal as Sonic 2
>so is Sonic & Knuckles
>Red Mountain
>a huge fucking tie between City Escape, Radical Highway, White Jungle, and Pyramid Cave
>Secret base from Advance 1
>Egg Utopia from Advance 2
>>337388876
Yeah it does. If you walk into a pile of snow it slows you down.
Is there a mod to play with that fan made ost?
Hydrocity song is fucking goat
>>337387052
f-fagabeefe?
>>337387012
S1 Giant Rings (get to the end with 50 or more rings) or S3K Giant Rings (they're hidden and you have to find them)?
>>337388554
>thinking people haven't concluded for themselves that 3D Sonics are bad because they are
>thus because most people agree that they're bad, it must be a meme, that'll invalidate em!
>>337389353
One: How the fuck is that "slippery" controls?
Two: Those snow piles were retarded, but they were rare and easy to avoid.
>>337381212
This isn't new. Sonic 2 fags have always shit on 3 and Knuckles out of jealousy.
Anybody tried this mod out yet?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FRg3tX8Xs4s
>>337381212
>People hate on the best Sonic,
But nobody hates Sonic 2 and Sonic Generations.
>>337390754
>>337390357
Half of sonic generations sucks, and the other half is mixed bag. Production values, graphics, and music are all worse than previous games. Its a pretty meh game, probably only loved so much because it was the first boost game that pcucks got to play
>>337381212
>People hate on the best Sonic, Sonic Unleashed
There's plenty of legitimate reason for this. It is not "best Sonic". Werehog, padding, and extremely on rails shallow gameplay make sure of that.
The S3&K hate is just shitposting.
>>337388283
English or Jap?
>>337388851
Because it tried to be a full game like Assault or Command, instead of a rail shooter like SNES or 64.
>>337390058
S3&K. Encourages exploration.
>>337390754
I hate Sonic 2.
It shat on the original dreamy artstyle and started the speed gimmick.
It introduced nothing of value and the level design goes down the shitter after casino night zone.
>>337390890
>Generations
>Production values, graphics, and music are all worse than previous games.
>>337390890
I'll take 50% boostshit/50% mixed bag over 50% boostshit/50% werehogshit.
>>337390976
But Hill Top Zone is the best stage in the game.
>>337391405
Said no one ever
>>337385517
The chaos emerald stages are pretty easy. FUCK the Super Emerald stages.
>>337387331
Star Light
Chemical Plant
Stardust Speedway
Ice Cap
Lava Reef
>>337391073
Unleashed has the highest production of any sonic game. ever. this isnt up for debate. You can hate the game all you want but hate and memes arent reality. Same goes for graphics. Unleashed on console looks, almost magically, better than generations on pc. This is in part to the advanced lighting and shadows, as well as a much better art direction. Again, your memes and hate arent reality.
Music is debatable, but looking at unleashed and colors, which have rich soundtracks that are totally new and fit every area in the game, compared to generations which is just a remaster/rerecording, yes the music can be seen as meh. Even some new remixes, like modern city escape or open your heart are worse than the originals.
>>337391314
The boostshit of generations isnt as good as the boostshit of unleashed. Opinions will vary, but I had more fun with the werehog, his main acts, side acts, and DLC acts, than I ever did with anything classic sonic related in generations.
>>337374274
Death Egg had great music.
>>337392613
Yeah I agree with everything here.
Except the boost thing sorta.
>>337392613
>it's an Unleashedfag episode again
So what if it had the highest production value? The gameplay was still ass. That's all you Unleashedfags care about, muh graphics, muh story.
Generations improved the boost formula so much. Tighter controls, better drifting, better levels with more platforming. Only thing Unleashed has over it is that it has more thrills. But that's all it is, a thrill ride. Generations levels actually feel like fucking levels.
Sonic the Hedgehog 2 and Sonic CD were both better than Sonic 3.
The shields and other auxillary mechanics don't make up for the sheer level design and aesthetic superiority of Sonic 2 and CD.
Sandopolis, Marble Garden and Carnival Night a shit
>>337386260
Did we ever get a Taxman version of S3K?
>>337392613
>anything I disagree with is hate/memes
Can we stop this shit? There have been at least two anons I've argued with in these Sonic threads where I give long, thorough technical explanations about the issues in modern Sonic games, and they still keep falling back on "you're just hating on them because your favorite youtube reviewer hated on them" or "you're just blinded by nostalgia". For fucks sake even if you give substantial legitimate arguments about the Sonic games you still have retards resorting to these non-arguments because it's all they have.
>>337394613
You forgot Labyrinth and Oil Ocean.
>>337394214
I didnt even bring up story, but unleashed has one of the best stories, balancing between stakes and lightheartedness very well with a silly cast. So thanks for reminding me of that too.
The physics in generations are very rigid. The engine in general isnt suited for low speed sections and what does generations do? Cut the speed down considerably. Youd replace the frantic thrills and excitement of unleashed for cut down levels with reduced speed, and more generic 2D platforming that consisted of the majority of generations levels? Please go through city escape or speed highway again and tell me how fun that "platforming" really is. The only generations "fixed" was the drift and made it more usable for when the game recommended to use it. I say "fixed" you know why? Because drifting in unleashed could be used as a tool to rack up even more speed and once you knew how to tame it, could send you absolutely flying through the 3D heavy levels. It was a delight to master the incredible speeds that the boost + drift (+ other things like quick step slide if you could master that) and unleashed provided. Nah man. Generations is the worst of the boost games because its an awkward fusion of unleashed (pure speed) and colors (pure platforming) rather than choosing to focus on one. The level designs and physics are off anyway, so rather than make cheap 2D heavy slow paced levels, they should go crazy with the speed and thrills, which unleashed smartly did. Colors played it more safe and had to be dumbed down to accommodate for the wii, and that was fine too because of the sheer creativity it brought.
Generations is a weak game and cant stand up to the adrenaline filled unleashed stages or pure platforming with bouts of speed and gimmicks here and there from colors stages.
>>337395242
Have you even watched a Generations speedrun? You can still use drifting to gain speed in that same exact way. And yes, I do think the platforming adds more fun in Generations. The turning platforms in Dragon Road were great but that's only one of the few parts in Unleashed where you're expected to make tight, well placed jumps. Generations has at least one of those types of parts in each level. It's more satisfying than just sitting through a roller coaster ride.
>>337390976
>It shat on the original dreamy artstyle
They have the exact same art-style, moron. Sonic 2 just has more detail in a lot of areas.
>and started the speed gimmick
Your post is a fucking joke. Sonic was literally conceived as a result of Yuji Naka speed-running Super Mario and wanting to create a fast-paced platformer. His name is fucking SONIC, for shit's sake. The physics engine is built entirely around the concept of utilizing terrain to GAIN SPEED. His full-speed movement animation is a slogging fucking run with a damn whirl effect on his lower body solely to emphasize the fact that he's a fast motherfucker. He wears running shoes and can get a power-up that makes him run faster than he already does. It's possible to run so fast that you go PAST the fucking camera. And before you pull some shit about, "B-B-BUT HE'S ONLY SUPPOSED TO GO FAST IN CERTAIN LEVELS!" allow me to inform you that the only reason stages like Labyrinth Zone even exist is because not only had Sonic Team not gotten the hang of creating levels for the series yet, but they also wanted to see if people would even like the fast-paced gameplay or not, and decided to make half the levels more akin to the slower platformers that everyone was used to.
![maxresdefault[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/PNA8H3E.jpg "maxresdefault[1].jpg")
I wish sky sanctuary was a real level. The music and aesthetic are amazing but the actual level itself is a cakewalk.
>>337395668
>The exact same artstyle
Check your eyes anon
>autistic wall of text
kys, sonic is about momentum, not speed.
>>337381647
liam pls
>>337394887
Nope, people are still begging for it though
if Taxman ever got the chance to touch S3&K and it sold well enough I'd see no reason in letting him design new games. It's a great template.
>>337382453
>Ice Cap
I'll never get why this Zone gets so much love.
>>337396664
Entirely the music. The level design is garbage.
>>337396664
What's wrong with Ice Cap?
>>337373619
I like them all except Sandopolis Act 2.
>>337371139
Last great Sonic game.
>>337387331
Scrap Brain
Chemical Plant
Hydrocity
Lava Reef
>>337396829
Nothing. It's a fine zone. I just think it's overrated as fuck (especially the music)
>>337376228
S&K is considerably harder than Sonic 3, so it feels pretty natural.
>>337397231
>not liking the Michael Jackson tracks
https://youtube.com/watch?v=41Y3PKkkePk
>>337397390
>Ice Cap
>a Michael Jackson song
>>337396664
Lots of Gimmicks, speed, tall jumping devices, good music, generally cool atmosphere:^)and ski intro. What's not to like?
>>337396664
It's hard not to like it after two hours stuck in Carnival Night.
>>337397851
>two hours stuck in Carnival Night.
How bad are you?
>>337396082
>Check your eyes
Are you serious? If I had never played a Sonic, I wouldn't even know pic related consisted of screenshots from two different games.
>Sonic is about momentum, not speed
And there it is again. How the fuck was Sonic not intended to be about speed? Just because it's heavily based on momentum doesn't mean it's not also heavily based on speed for the half of the game that Sonic Team would have designed the WHOLE game like if they had known that people would dig that kind of level-design beforehand.
Also,
>UR AUTISTIC
Stop.
>>337397593
According to the internet legend it is.
>>337395668
>>337397969
You got the Yuji Naka story half-right. Yes he wanted to create a paltformer that gave a sense of speed, but he still wanted that speed to be a reward for good play, combined with an arcade-style gameplay that encouraged the player to play the game multiple times and get better (and therefore faster) each time. Speed as a reward, not speed unto itself.
>>337397949
I was just a kid.
>>337397969
>If I had never played a Sonic, I wouldn't even know pic related consisted of screenshots from two different games.
Not him but
>different hud
>sonic is a different shade of blue
>obviously different walk animation
>two pictures set in the same level trope but with different graphics
You must be very dumb.
>>337395564
Its reduced completely, the drift. Dragon road from unleashed is one of the few areas that stops you completely but thanks to the games better momentum, it allows you to jump past it pretty quickly.
A growing sentiment is that unleashed project is better than the base game of generations itself. Its fine to like generations, but Unleashed has a much stronger core and better presentation at the heart of it all while generations is middling, never sure if it wants to be super speed (green hill, rooftop run) or janky platforming in 2D (planet wisp, crisis city, city escape)
>>337387331
Spring Yard
Aquatic Ruins
Angel Island
Carnival Night
Tidal Tempest
>>337398269
The best way to tell who's a casual is when they shit on Planet Wisp Modern.
Get fucking good.
>>337397949
WHO'S BAD
>>337398398
I can do planet wisp modern in 4:3x~. Doesnt make it a fun level though. And as a final level? Just terrible
The original trilogy is boring as fuck and the later games probably are too but I never played those.
>>337397969
The point is that momentum gave context to the speed. Without that, the speed is meaningless. It's for more engaging and satisfying to build up speed to clear a ramp you found that you deduced might lead to an area above with enough speed, rather than holding boost and letting the game do it for you on an automated ramp event on the one contrived path in the level.
>>337398719
You are boring, anon.
>>337398807
Shut the fuck up bitch.
>>337398483
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Gk4cIt0HBs
I love this game.
good thing it has a fucking save feature then
>>337373619
the volcano level was goat
>>337398247
>different HUD
>sonic is a different shade of blue
>obviously-different walk animation
>these are all part somehow part of the art-style
>two pictures set in the same level trope but with different graphics
I did that to make the image incredibly simple to understand. Is this better?
>>337398163
>speed as a reward, not speed unto itself
I already know that. But the thing with Sonic 1 is that you CAN'T go fast in levels like Marble Zone and Labyrinth Zone no matter how good your skills are.
>>337399221
>these are all part somehow part of the art-style
Shit.
*these are all somehow part of the art-style
>>337399221
>>337399475
>these are all somehow part of the art-style
This isn't that discussion, anon. I'm arguing a hypothetical non-Sonic-player must have to be pretty dimwitted to not realize that the screenshots on the right are from a different game than the screenshots on the left. There are enough differences to come to that conclusion.
>>337398781
>it's far more engaging and satisfying to build up speed to clear a ramp you found that you deduced might lead to an area above with enough speed
How does Sonic 2 not have a colossal plethora of situations exactly like that in its levels?
>Boost games
Nobody in this discussion is talking about Boost except you.
>>337399563
>I'm arguing a hypothetical non-Sonic-player must have to be pretty dimwitted to not realize that the screenshots on the right are from a different game than the screenshots on the left.
Come on, smartass. Do you really think I was including shit like the HUD that has absolutely nothing to do with the actual art-style?
>>337400019
>How does Sonic 2 not have a colossal plethora of situations exactly like that in its levels?
I'm saying that it does. I'm saying that's how the classics worked. That speed is pointless as a concept by itself. They were driven by momentum first, speed second.
>>337400494
Those screenshots are all from the same game right?
â–²
â–² â–²
>>337400494
>b-b-b-but muh artstyle
I'm not talking about the art-style you fucking fairy, this is a separate conversation.
>>337371139
It has a fucking save system.
>>337382031
Man, Sonic 2 sucks. It's filled with fucking gimmicks!
>Emerald Hill
Mobius strips.
>Chemical Plant
Water.
>Aquatic Ruin
Water. Again.
>Casino Night
Fucking pinball.
>Hill Top
Lava, and those cable cars
>Mystic Cave
Those spike tipped blocks everywhere
>Oil Ocean
Oil
>Metropolis
Shitty enemy placement might as well be a gimmick. Also those fucking corkscrews
>Sky Chase
Autoscrolling
>Wing Fortress
Bottomless pits
>Death Egg
No rings.
Bunch of shitty fucking gimmicks.
>>337401216
And yet theyre all better than the garbage sonic 3 and sonic and knuckles throws at you, in addition to overdrawn, long levels that drag on
>>337399221
>But the thing with Sonic 1 is that you CAN'T go fast in levels like Marble Zone and Labyrinth Zone no matter how good your skills are.
Yes you can. Knowing where the high path is and knowing how to get to it involves quick reflexes and technical platforming. You have to be fast to be able to even do it.
>>337401443
>water is better than water
You don't even know what you're complaining about.
>>337400548
>speed is pointless as a concept by itself
When did I ever say it was, unless you're just trying to add to the fact that momentum was important to the Classic games and not actually arguing with me?
>>337400736
When I said I wouldn't have known the screenshots were from different games, I was PURELY talking in terms of art-style. I didn't even have shit like the HUD or Sonic's slightly-different hue on mind. In fact, I was barely even aware of those differences to begin with.
>>337371139
said noone ever
>>337401443
It's all the same shit. You keep clinging to the gimmicks for no reason.
Long levels aren't bad if you aren't fatigues easily. If you are fatigued easily, maybe you should be playing a shorter game or using the built in save feature. It's not the game's fault you don't realize that these things exist.
>>337375740
>Marble Garden and Carnival Night are complete dog shit.
Kill yourself nigger
>>337373619
Stop fucking separating the game you fucking nigger it's one game...so fucking annoying
>>337401717
I'm sorry for your complete shit taste
>>337381212
>best Sonic
>Sonic Unleashed
Here's your (You)
Now go kill yourself
>>337379169
>At the very least the music and stage aesthetics were.
And so were Marble Garden's and Carnival Night's you double nigger
Go fuck yourself
>>337401216
>only 2 water
sonic 2 wins
get fucked 3kfags
>>337401216
>Fucking pinball.
OPINION DISCARDED.
Pinball is fucking awesome.
>>337382453
>Marble Garden
>Not the best zone in the damn series and in a video game ever
You just lost all credibility and should never post here again
>>337388283
fuck you. if it was Hydro City it would have a space in it.
>>337401443
Yes, waiting out those long cannon sequences in Oil Ocean and being forced to hold right for long periods of time on those finicky screws in Metropolis are so much better than any of Sonic 3K's shit.
>>337386260
They're harder in the remaster because of 60fps
They're easier in the original because they're much slower because of 30fps
>>337387331
Labyrinth(Fuck you it's comfy as fuck)
Casino Night
Marble Garden
Mushroom Hill
Palmtree Panic
>>337390976
I don't hate Sonic 2
I fucking hate Nostalgiafags who got a Genesis with it in Christmas of '92 and overrate the fuck out of it when it's the weakest of the Genesis games by far
>>337381647
That's not the best character in that series.
>>337392613
>Unleashed has the highest production of any sonic game. ever.
Nobody gives a shit you autist
The game is just an expensive version of Temple Run...it's nothing but trash
>>337402392
Never thought I'd live long enough to see such shit taste, this is the stuff spoken of only in legends. My time has come, I can die knowing I've seen all the world has to offer now. Komm, süsser Tod take me away.
>>337398163
Reminder that if it wasn't for Hirokazu Yasuhara Sonic would have been nothing but a speedy mario game(as in...linear as fuck)
Beating both games back to back shouldn't take more than 3 hours max, should it? It's probably a lot less than that.
>>337402882
>three grass stages and a water level
your taste sucks
>>337399221
>you CAN'T go fast in levels like Marble Zone
Spoken like a true shitter
You can definitely go fast in Marble Zone if you actually don't suck
There's very few mandatory waiting sections in Marble Zone and most of them are skippable with well timed jumps
>>337387331
1: Labyrinth
2. Mystic Cave
3K: Sandopolis-Lava Reef-Hidden Palace is the best stretch in any Sonic game
CD: Not sure
Chaotix: Couldn't get into it
>>337403206
Overrate maybe, but it's objectively better than Sonic 1. There's no denying that.
>>337403206
It's better than every classic era game.
>inb4 S3&K babbies have to put 2 games together to make a better one
>>337403732
Give him a break anon, he doesn't actually try things on his own or experiment in games. He just does whatever is the most blatantly obvious thing is visible. This is typical modernbabby behavior. All they know how to do is follow rails and button prompts.
>>337387331
Sonic 1: Marble Zone
Sonic 2: Aquatic Ruins
Sonic 3: Hydrocity
Sonic & Knuckles: Flying Battery
Sonic CD: Stardust Speeway
>>337401863
Shut the fuck up bitch boy
You wouldn't know a well designed level if it slapped you in the face
>>337403823
>X is OBJECTIVELY better than Y because my opinions are fucking facts and your personal preferences are inferior to mine
Great job on being a cancerous heap of shit.
>>337404143
Take your shitty opinion and blow it out your ass
>>337403308
Name me one zone with more replayability than Marble Garden you Shallow FUCKTARD
YOU FUCKING CANT BECAUSE IT'S THE PERFECT MIX OF SPEED,PLATFORMING AND EXPLORATION(AND EVERYTIME YOU REPLAY THAT ZONE YOU FIND SOMETHING NEW) AND NOTHING COMES EVEN CLOSE YOU FUCKING RETARDED FUCKNUT
FUCK YOU
TIRED OF YOU MOTHERFUCKERS BASHING GENIUS LEVEL DESIGN LIKE THIS
>>337403661
>what is level layout?
>>337404414
>giant shitty maze with tons of stupid paths that lead to a box of rings
>HOLY FUCK GUYS IM PLATFORMING AND EXPLORING SO HARD!!! THIS 10 PACK OF RINGS...WOW THIS IS GENIUS DESIGN! BEST GAME EVA!
>>337404152
No, it's objectively better because everything about it, from mechanics to level design, is cleaner, more expansive, even graphics are improved.
>>337403995
This is why this series sucks nowadays
These fucking casuals ruin everything
These fucking faggots who prefer to pretend they're smart and blame the level design when in fact they suck dick at the game hard and just want to hold right non-stop
>>337404564
>Massive Level
>Very open
>Tons of branching paths
>Good speed
>Spinning Top gimmick which allows you to explore the zone in a unique way
>Good Platforming
>Tons of secrets
Marble Garden Zone is the perfect Sonic zone and this is 100% Factual whether you like it or not
DEAL WITH IT
>>337404972
oh god
youre an open world world faggot. theres no getting through an open world faggot
>>337404972
>Marble Garden Zone is the perfect Sonic zone
That's not Flying Battery.
>>337403823
>Better than Sonic 1
No it fucking isn't
It's way worse
It's a lot more buggy and the level design is very dumbed down
Art style and Graphics are also worse
>>337403973
3&K is one Game you retarded fucktard
They split it into 2 parts because it was too big
But even Sonic 3 alone shits all over Sonic 2
Heck even Sonic 1 destroys the fuck out of Sonic 2
>>337405218
>But even Sonic 3 alone shits all over Sonic 2
lol
>Heck even Sonic 1 destroys the fuck out of Sonic 2
LOL
>>337403995
My favorite game ever made is Sonic CD, Senor Strawman. Also, I'm not sure why I made the shitty decision of listing Marble Zone as an example of not being able to go fast in a level, but it's still designed in a way that's very "restrictive". It's hard to describe.
>>337404584
Please look up the definition of the word "objectivity".
>>337404972
It's very annoying, but I like the flying boss fight.
>>337405152
>Open World
>In 2D
Pick one and only one retard
>>337405196
>Bottomless pits
I don't think so
It's a good zone but it ain't touching Marble Garden
>>337404972
If the music and the art were better, you'd definitely have a point.
>>337405330
I swear, sonic 3 and sonic and knuckles faggots are the biggest deluded retards in the series. There are so many garbage levels in both of those games. And they say "B-BUT ITS BETTER TOGETHER!" like that saves it. Its smashing 2 turds together, who gives a fuck? the end result is still a shitty game
>>337371139
you may have been right if S&K didn't add the save feature, but it did and you're not
>>337405471
Go back to your Metroidvanias, IGAbabby.
>>337405330
This is fact not opinion
Sonic 2 is literally "Sonic for Dummies"
One only need to play Green Hill and then play Emerald Hill to realize just how dumbed down Sonic 2 is
>>337405505
how the fuck are they garbage?
They're long? There's more content? Wow, what a shitty fucking game!
>>337405505
No
Listen up you little shit and listen good
Sonic 3 even without S&K SHITS ALL OVER SONIC 2
SHITS
ALL
OVER
SONIC 2
THIS IS NOT UP FOR DEBATE
THE DIFFERENCE IN QUALITY IS SO BIG THEY'RE NOT EVEN IN THE SAME STRATOSPHERE PERIOD
>>337404972
>>337405196
>>337405471
You guys are wrong.
Sandopolis, Lava Reef, and Hidden Palace are jointly the best fucking part of any Sonic game. They flow into one another. Sandopolis has you make your way underground, and Hidden Palace has you return to the surface. It's like pottery.
It's also the most challenging, which is especially notable in a fucking Sonic game.
>>337405618
If 2 is "Sanic for Dummies", why is the only zone that baddies complain about from the Mega Drive era Metropolis?
>>337405620
>more content means its le good meme
Ok then, skyrim is the greatest game of all time since it has infinite content and shits all over sonic 3 and sonic knuckles, both average, extremely overrated platformers
>>337405779
Sonic 3 is decent and much better stand alone. Sonic and knuckles drags whatever quality sonic 3 has right into the garbage. Alone or together, theyre both worse than sonic 2
>>337405584
>Metroidvania
There's nothing Metroidvania about Marble Garden you retard
You don't need to figure out shit
Each path you take takes you to the finish line
But because Marble Garden is so big it has longevity and lends itself very well to replayability
You know what i like about Sonic 1 to S3&K? You can argue gimmicks, you can argue level design, you can argue characters and a lot more things
But to me these games are not badly designed. They have no alternate gameplays styles. No Big, no Gamma, no Amy, no Werehog, no Mechs, no Treasure Hunting, no Wii controls, no masking 3D with 2D, no Gyro controlls, no reboots, no Slow characters, no having to play the game multiple times to unlock the end, no overly complicated storyline, no slowing down other characters to make Sonic stick out, no isometric view, no bad voice acting, no snarky Sonic comments about everything, no need to make Knuckles an idiot, no Amy pantyshots, not needing to make Tails the "i can invent everything the plot needs" guy in order to make him seem important, etc.
It's just Sonic, Tails and Knuckles vs. Eggman and his creations. (Also i woudn't have minded keeping CD Amy around)
Generations was the first game after a while that had just good Sonic gameplay, i can't believe they took so long to go back to the formula they had back in the day, the control could've been refined a bit more but it was good enough regardless
I know a lot of people like to say "SA1 was great, shut up!" or "Heroes was amazing, you are wrong!" The thing is that even if the games have parts of good gameplay and they at least get Sonic right, they still put you through bullshit that no one asked for and that's bad design that just can't be defended
>>337373619
Hydrocity is the best
Angel Island is great too
Third Level too
Ice cap is awesome
Launch Base not bad, not bad
But fuck the carnaval shit
>>337405884
>why is the only zone that baddies complain about from the Mega Drive era Metropolis?
It's not.
You're forgetting:
>Marble
>Labyrinth
>Marble Garden
>Sandopolis Act 2
>every level in CD, but mostly Wacky Workbench
The fact that people only complain about ONE zone in the game shows how fucking easy it is.
>>337405959
What about Colors?
>>337405923
>Sonic 3 is decent and much better stand alone.
No
This is where I disagree
Sonic 3&K is one massive game and it's best played that way(especially with the Sonic 3 complete hack)
I wish it was released as one game originally so we wouldn't have these retarded arguments
>>337406102
>every level in CD
How
This game was beyond easy, it was ridiculous
Seriously I remember nothing from CD other than straight lines. I think there was this one gimmicky level where you could be little but thats it.
>>337405923
>if I point out that one long game is bad, then that will sure show that every long game is bad!
>>337406102
People hate Marble because you have to wait a lot, not because it's too hard.
>>337405884
Everybody always complains about Water Levels(Labyrinth namely) and Marble which is annoying as fuck
Metropolis complaints are valid because of the retarded badnik placement(making it that zone you love to hate)
It's still not as bad as Oil Ocean tho I'll give it that
>those flying caps everywhere placed very awkwardly
>those fucking horse badniks blindsighting you
>>337406168
>Not masking 3D with 2D
Colors was considered good beacuse it came out right on the heels of terrible Sonic games and the Werehog, but to be honest that game was advertised as a 3D Sonic game with barely any 3D (Most of it was automated) and the platforming felt like it belonged in a Mario game, it was incredibly blocky
I had fun, but when i took a step back i realised that i was giving it way more credit that what it diserved
>>337406254
This must be literally your first conversation online about Sonic CD.
>>337406374
You don't have to wait nearly as long as shitters think you do.
FORGET ABOUT THIS SISSY LEVEL DESIGN TALK
LETS TALK ABOUT THE REAL REASON WHY S3K IS THE GOAT SONIC
>>337405218
>It's a lot more buggy
It is literally Sonic 1's engine but slightly improved, with the spindash added. This has been confirmed by hackers and speedrunners alike. You're a fucking moron.
>Art style and Graphics are also worse
You need your eyes checked.
>>337405806
>Sandopolis, Lava Reef, and Hidden Palace are jointly the best fucking part of any Sonic game. They flow into one another
That doesn't make them the best just because they have some smooth-ass cinematic transitions(which is at the end of the game so you would expect the best transitions to happen there anyways)
Hidden Palace is not much a zone
Sandopolis Act 2 while I like it it's definitely kind of a chore to play
Lava Reef is very claustrophobic which annoys me(gets better in Act 2 tho)
>>337405806
>Sandopolis
Holy shit it must be a full moon the retards are going full retard
>>337406374
Because shitters like you don't have the guts to make tricky jumps
There's very few waiting sections you can't skip in Marble Zone
>>337405806
>It's like pottery.
>>337406664
>It is literally Sonic 1's engine
Except it isn't
It's a different engine
Also Stealth and Taxman confirmed that Sonic 2 was the buggiest by far when they remastered it
Which is also why Naka requested to work primarily with the Japanese staff of STI because of Communication Problems between the Japanese and American Teams they had with Sonic 2
http://info.sonicretro.org/Game_Development:Sonic_the_Hedgehog_3#Game_Development
>You need your eyes checked
Maybe you fucking need yours checked son?
There's no way you can tell me that Emerald Hill looks better than Green Hill when the latter has far more detail to it
>>337387052
Spanish is my native language, so I say:HIDRO-CIUDAD
Just kidding, I say:HIDROCIDAD
Truth is:I mostly never "pronounce in my head" when I'm writing/reading English, and I've never found myself in a position where I had to actually say it.
>>337406671
Disagree.
Sandopolis is one of those places that is more and more satisfying to go through the more gud you git.
Lava Reef's chock full of nooks and crannies to explore. Finally getting the most out of that Fire Shield is dope, and there's good parts for the Lightning Shield too. Not quite as difficult as Sandopolis Act 2, so you get to relax a bit more. At the same time though, if you're stupid, you'll lose those shields, and then it will become a lot more tense.
Hidden Palace acts as a bigger breather after that fucking gauntlet, right before the big finale.You also finally get to give Knuckles a beat down for being a gigantic cunt.
Also, the music is solid as fuck for this entire stretch.
The great debate.
>>337407391
smb3 is better than world though
>>337407391
Mario World is too long, i never complete it in one sitting before getting tired of it
At least if i play S3&K competently i can clear most zones under 5 minutes
>>337407391
The great debate.
>>337407535
>both fruit
>can compare to see what is the better fruit
>>337407391
Shouldnt it be Sonic 1 vs Mario World since they came out same time?
>>337407280
Sandopolis Act 2 is literally push switches,pull switches,beware the ghosts zone
It's just a tedious level...Act 1 is pretty good tho
Lava Reef Act 1 has these narrow parts everywhere where the ceiling is too freaking low which just annoys the crap out of me
Hidden Palace is basically a cutscene zone come on...might as well just say Sky Sanctuary and Death Egg instead
>Music is solid as fuck
Music is fantastic throughout the entire game so this is not really a point but ok
>>337407391
>Sonic 3, you have to earn easy mode (Super Sonic)
>SMW, the game hands you easy mode (Cape, Yoshi)
I'll take Sanic 3, thanks.
>>337407846
tbf tails is easy mode
3K > 2
>but i got sonic 2 for christmas in 1992!!
fuck off
>>337405806
>liking sandopolis
What the fuck is wrong with you?
>>337408408
this
I like 1, 2 and 3 and Knuckles. They're all good if you ask me.
>>337387331
Sonic 1: Starlight City
Sonic 2: Chemical Plants
Sonic 3: Hydrocity
Sonic & Knuckles: Mushroom Forest
Sonic CD: This game is shit
Knuckles Chaotix: Didn't play it
>>337408429
Sandopolis isn't a bad zone
Act 2 drags on a bit but Act 1 is pretty solid
