Looks like we may get an answer to the poise question soon.
https://mobile.twitter.com/JKartje/status/727205465852006400
>>336469349
I doubt it's turned off by accident, that would make the company look really incompetent.
#sadhavelthrrock
>>336469680
Then why have it at all?
Whats it do again?
>>336469803
Good question.
Maybe because they forgot to finish it or something.
>>336469856
x value before getting staggered
>>336469349
My guess is they realized it was OP and disabled it instead of trying to balance it.
Did Bloodborne have poise?
>>336469856
Basically allows you to take a certain amount of damage before staggering.
If you've seen that can't_stop_the_rock gif, that's pretty much what it's SUPPOSED to do.
In DS3 however it doesn't work like that, and rats can stagger you even if you're wearing full Havel with Wolf Ring+2
>>336469803
Obviously they realized late in development that it made the game shit and disabled it. Unfortunately they were too lazy to remove the wolf ring etc.
>>336469959
Thanks for replying but i still dont understand, can you give an example of a scenario affected by poise? Im guessing the higher value of poise, the harder it is to stagger?
I can't go back to Dark Souls 3 after Nioh, it's just too damn slow and the weapon movesets are so bland.
>>336470265
exactly. higher poise means it'll take more hits before you stagger. iirc it works like an invisible stamina bar, like if you have 80 poise, and an attack drains x of your poise, you'll stagger once it runs out
So fuck no. Leave that shit off. I don't want PvP to restricted to just STR weapons again like fucking 1.
>>336470121
LOL? You didn't play it?
>>336470330
Take it to a Nioh thread then. Or did you just come here to fish for (You)s?
>>336470216
How hard is it to delete a few items and stat text?
>>336470121
Dunno about Bloodborne but I heard Demon's Souls didn't have poise, so that could have been the main influence, considering the mana bar is also from DeS
>>336470397
Kick the shield you faggot
Stacked havels coming back
Fuck poise since it'll go back to giant dad meta. You fags asked for it.
bring back poise, I'm sick of r1 spammers. It's bullshit that heavy weapons and armor are fucking useless compared to light armor and weapons because of infinite stagger
>straight up config saying poise has been toggled to off
>BRO ITS A BUG BRING IT BACK
you fucks seem to think they did less testing with this than the community did
>>336470628
every weapon has a maximum stagger of two hits and heavy weapons have hyper armor
what the fuck is your point here
>>336469680
Leaving a useless stat in the game is pretty incompetent. Especially when said stat is the whole reason to wear heavy armor in a god damn medieval fantasy game.
>>336470172
Poise depends also entirely on what weapon you're using. Don't expect to get poise with a straight sword, or even two handing a dark sword. Testing it out, it usually only worked with big weapons like the great machetes, ultra greatswords and hammers.
>>336469349
>mobile
hang yourself
>>336470172
>>336470342
Now i understand. Yea, that seems a little odd that they would make it irrelevant in this game. Maybe they are studying the online PvP and fine tuning it (poise) for a bit longer to try and prevent abuse. I feel like making PvP enjoyable and competetive, while also keeping the main game from being too easy or manipulated isnt a walk in the park.
>>336469349
bringing poise in could potentially make the game super easy, but at the same time no poise is so limiting that everyone learned to just use a fast weapon since all you need to do is hit first to win.
Also they need to fix fists reach that shit is abysmal
>>336470404
>LOL?
>>336470676
>you fucks seem to think they did less testing with this than the community did
A large community of people can OBJECTIVELY do more testing than a small group of people.
Regardless they left the stat on the stat screen and a bunch of items that do nothing but raise poise, if they wanted it removed it's supremely sloppy to leave all of that in.
>>336469803
Because it affects stagger during roll recovery frames, and might have an interaction with the perseverance ability.
I've said this a million times.
>>336470430
No joke, that shit is almost composed as if by a marketer.
>>336470454
A lot of the heavier weapons had "Super Armor" built into them, though. Something that's still present in all the games, but was more pronounced in Demon's Souls.
>>336470938
but the community can do close to zero testing, since the cheat engine toggle of poise is singleplayer only and clearly broken, since your poise jumps back to 100% after the first break
all you're doing is making speculations based on the shit in dark souls 1, which was a complete clusterfuck
>>336470807
Well pretty much all the Dark Souls have lacked polish in one area or another.
DS1 was basically unfinished after Anor Londo
DS2 was a mess in a lot of regards.
DS3 magic is nigh useless, poise is fucked up and probably other problems I can't remember right now
>>336470953
Even with it's value set to 0 in the code?
>>336470753
A dagger shouldn't stagger someone wearing havel's armour
>>336470851
Make me.
why does it seem like i only really see mobile posts when im on mobile myself?
>>336471232
why, because that's how it was in dark souls 1?
>>336471105
>DS3
>everything DS2 did right DS3 fucked up
Ds2 fucked up a bunch but I hate how they fucked up things that were perfectly fine in previous games.
>>336471239
Anon you should ask someone to assist you in suicide. That being said there are hotlines if youneedhelp
>>336469680
>lost izalyth
>all of ds2 except majula
>that wall in the swamp you can pass through
From Software are low-medium class developers. Bloodborne and Demon's Souls came out allright because they had help.
>>336470837
Hyper armour and poise are two different things
>>336471413
yes
>>336471431
Like what anon?
I haven't played DS2 since launch, haven't played the DLCs so my memory is a bit fuzzy.
I can't really recall anything from DS2 that I liked that much. I hear people praising powerstancing but I don't ever remember using that.
>All these naive scrublords who think Fromsoft is gonna bring poise backl
IT. WAS. TOGGLED. OFF. ON. PURPOSE.
>>336469680
>that would make the company look really incompetent
we wouldn't want that, now would we
Hyper armor is great for heavy weapons, gives them slightly more viability than just having to hope your opponent is shit at spacing
what really brings down heavy weapons is the ridiculous iframes on rolls and low stamina consumption
like 28 frames a roll, what the fuck is that shit
>>336471735
At 30fps or 60?
>>336469349
i have no idea why they turned it off, it's fucking ridiculous
I'm doing a full Havel + greatshield run and it's pretty much impossible to take on any more than 1v1, because I get stun locked to death and I have 0 i frames to roll away from danger with. It makes wearing armour absolutely pointless. I've gone from full Smough to full Havel and even still, I can be staggered by a fist. An unarmed fucking fist.
You don't even get the benefits of "extra armour" anyway, because I still get 1-shot by hornet ring parries, and by normal shield breaks if the enemy is using anything a greatsword or anything larger. I have almost 40 vig, this shit shouldn't be happening.
"lmao dont fatroll then faggot"
It's not possible to wear full havel's / smough's and midroll without an insane amount of vit.
The downside of fatrolling should be a consequence of massive poise, otherwise what's the point.
>>336471161
It's value is not set to zero. A flip that makes poise prevent attacks from staggering you is turned off.
>>336471603
What do you mean "non purchasable"?
As in you find it in the world or from monsters?
>>336471735
Hyper Armor only works in games with good netcode. Netcode in Dark Souls is abysmal and plagued with Brazillians playing on toasters, so Hyper Armor is useless, whereas poise would actually be beneficial
>>336471603
Biased shit list
>>336471921
60
but that's still a good half a second of iframes, you barely need timing with that sort of thing
>>336471995
What else do you think it could mean?
>>336471603
Isn't this missing Deserter Set? Completely disregarded.
>>336472112you
lol wut?
>>336472005
You are aware you can turn off cross region play yes
>>336471935
>i have no idea why they turned it off, it's fucking ridiculous
GAME. BALANCE.
Poise fucking trivialized DaS1 PvE and was a blight on DaS1 PvP.
>The downside of fatrolling should be a consequence of massive poise, otherwise what's the point.
To have a game that isn't hugely imbalanced. The point of high defense armor is to take less damage. Not to ignore everything that's happening while you slam down your stupid heavy weapon without a thought or care in the world.
Poise is super strong as far as mechanics go. I'd much rather it be gone than have it ruin the meta AGAIN.
>>336472162
I asked because I thought you needed to go to Lost Ruin to get the Iron & Sun set but then I remembered you could just kill Solaire after Taurus and get it. My bad
What exactly is the purpose of heavy armor without poise?
>>336472207
It's also leaving out the Lothric Sword and Spear
>>336472207
I think that's missing because it's not a full set. Just like the hollow soldier armor from DS1.
>>336469349
>mobile
Get raped and never recover.
>>336472242
>I'd much rather it be gone than have it ruin the meta AGAIN.
>HUE HUE GET FUCKED! MUH META IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN BUILD DIVERSITY AND OPTIONS!
If you want to play a fast character with a toothpick weapon, maybe try learning how to parry or something instead of mashing R1 on peoples faces
>>336472341
grayrat sells them
>>336470837
You are talking about hyper armor.
Big weapons have the same amount of hyper armor regardless of poise.
There are poise videos showing how it would work, which doesn't require attacking. The player standing there would not flinch at all
>>336472327
cosmetics?
oh wait, what about literally all the other stats?
>>336471603
That is just another way of saying that Dark Souls 1 has interconnected vast world, while DS 3 took more linear approach.
And sure, I loved that in Dark Souls 1 even when I got totally lost into Blighttown, it was cool.
But somehow being like Dark Souls 3 is shit because it doesn't have that, is taking things a bit too far.
>>336472417
Do you really think diversity is going to increase when people start picking armor based on poise caps and spamming their straight sword knowing that now they can't be interrupted
>>336472242
Let me guess.You use a short sword in pvp?
>>336472327
None. That's why it's so stupid to have it off.
>>336469803
>>336469680
i think they found out during gameplay test 100% of tester use cazual Max poise built.
shit is OP as fuck if you are Dex build or magic user
you can spam R1 right now without poise for win, imagine if you have it
we know for a fact that some enemies have the same poise stat (enabled) that the players have (disabled). it may simply be intended for use on those enemies, but not players. although if that were the case why is poise displayed as a stat in the loadout menus?
I really hope this was just massive fuck up and gets fixed.
>>336472407
Make me.
>>336472417
>No actual rebuttal or argument
>Just some idiotic commentary about fast characters.
Poise is too good. Fuckin' deal with it. You think R1 spam is bad now? Wait until people can do that while wearing Havel's. It'll wreck PVP and PVE all at the same time. You do remember how every single DaS1 boss could be trivialized with poise stacking right? Same thing's gonna happen here.
>>336472557
>More deflections that don't relate to my arguments
Shut your mouth you stupid shitter.
>>336472445
Not until he loots Irithyll.
All these R1 spammers are scared of poise being turned on because they'd get their shit wrecked.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A7R9yXZI32Q
>people still don't realize how much poise HELPS r1 spamming niggers with longswords and katanas
If you faggots seriously want to see a return of katana shitters who aren't stunned by a glaive swing or ugs smash just fucking die already.
>>336472535
Yes. Because that guy is going to get a face full of some great hammers R2 because he just tried mashing R1
Reminder Poise is working as intended.
>>336470953
I doesnt.
>>336472657
>Poise is too good.
And being able to stunlock people to death with a straight sword or rapier isn't?
>>336472671It helps R1 spammers, not hurts them.Poise lets them blow through an attack and break someone else's poise easily
>>336472557
but poise is going to benefit light weapons you dumb FUCK
>>336472616
At least there would be more variety.
>>336470953
both have been proven to be false you dumb redditor
it's just a leftover from the old engine they didn't bother hiding
>>336472535
You can't R1 spam with the same Poise. With poise heavy weapons > R1 spam. And those heavy weapon users in turn have to worry about fast rollers who chip them down with faster attacks or Sorcerers simply kiting them. Stamina and Equip weight are not the same stat in 3. To get good poise and spam R1 for days with a heavy weapon simply isn't possible without gimping yourself in some other way.
Why did DS3 even have Havel's armor?
Why not come up with something new?
>>336472774
Yeah, and its going to benefit heavy weapons a fuck of a lot more.
You know those big strong weapons that are damn near fucking useless because a fart in the breeze stops their attack animations?
Well that won't fucking happen now.
That R1 spamming faggot in Havels with a broadsword is going to be flattened.
Poise will stop the R1 spam from being effective.
Sounds to me like you disagree because you don't want you fuccboi dark sword to stop being overpowered as fuck
>>336472657
>More deflections that don't relate to my arguments
It's a simple question Doctor a yes or no and we can all more on with our live.
>>336472769
>I can't block or roll or use a shield or observe proper spacing!
>Why can't I stack a really overpowered stat and mindlessly trash anybody who challenges me?
>Poise would NEVER make R1 spamming rapiers and straight swords way way stronger.
>>336472557
Poise gives more power to small weapons than it does big weapons.
Big weapons already have hyper armor that lets them eat through and punish people aggressive with weaker weapons.
>>336472629
The way poise works now is that it gives you hyper armor. No one has done tests beyond this yet because the community is reddit tier and wont go any futher than "BAH IT DOESNT DO WHAT IT USED TO SO IT DOESNT EXIST AT ALL!!!"
https://youtu.be/6dpbRQi9JiM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h3elfWA41FQ
>>336472657
Baby dark sword user confirmed. Here's your (You), little one.
>>336472769
there is no stunlock in this game though. You can always roll out of any non-weapon art combo after 2 hits.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h3elfWA41FQ
>>336472671
Stop desecrating the holy image of second best girl with your retarded opinions, every weapon that needs poise has hyperarmour frames instead.
>>336472912
>You know those big strong weapons that are damn near fucking useless because a fart in the breeze stops their attack animations?
No, I don't know that because I actually time my attacks instead of being a fucking baddie.
>a fart in the breeze stops their attack animations?
WAAAH IM REVVING UP MY SWING RIGHT INFRONT OF MY OPPONENT WHY CANT IT HIT
Not to mention the generous hyper armor on all fucking two handed great weapon swings, you're genuinely just bad and you can't handle that
>>336472915
>It's a simple question
With no relevance whatsoever to the discussion at hand.
>>336472912
>Yeah, and its going to benefit heavy weapons a fuck of a lot more.
No it's not. Heavy weapons already have hyper/super armor on tons of their attacks in addition to other attacks being LITERALLY unparriable.
>You know those big strong weapons that are damn near fucking useless because a fart in the breeze stops their attack animations?
No, because I'm not bad at the game and can into spacing, timing and hyperarmor.
>>336472926
I'm actually tempted to do a ridiculous SL100 STR weapon poisetank now to test shit.
>>336472919
Damn, you really got your autism triggered.
Rapiers are OP as fuck. You get hit once and they'll stun you to death with the good old R1 > Step Forward > R1 > Step Forward >R1 > Step Forward >R1 > Step Forward >R1 > Step Forward >R1 > Step Forward >R1 > Step Forward >R1 > Step Forward >R1 > Step Forward >R1 > Step Forward >R1 > Step Forward >R1 > Step Forward >R1 > Step Forward >R1 > Step Forward >R1 > Step Forward >R1 > Step Forward >R1 > Step Forward >R1 > Step Forward >R1 > Step Forward >
>>336473003
meant to post this video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpQRlXJyPoA
>>336473053
>With no relevance whatsoever to the discussion at hand
Well I'm just curious like a cat. A lot of people call me whiskers.
>>336472531
I don't know about you but for me the most fun in repeated playthroughs is not doing the exact same thing I did last time or the run before that, but something different. Mixing up the order, taking creative approaches, or handling a bigger challenge. Giving a lot of opportunities for this is a good thing, making a basic railroad is not. They've pretty much castrated the early game even compared to shitty DS2 and taken the fun out of the first hour or two of any replay. For a game of this nature, that's incompetence.
>>336472242
>To have a game that isn't hugely imbalanced. The point of high defense armor is to take less damage. Not to ignore everything that's happening while you slam down your stupid heavy weapon without a thought or care in the world.
Armor doesn't reduce the damage by enough to be worth the stat investment, so even if the point of armor was damage reduction, it would still need a huge buff in that department. Any player would be better served increasing vigor for more HP, which already trivializes the PvE. 30+ VIG might not let you take hits without staggering, but you can just take a hit to the face and then use one of your many flasks to almost immediately restore all of your health.
>>336473117
Look at the post above you. If you just take a step forward you can hit them again without going over the two hit limit
>>336471593
>haven't played the DLCs
you really should
>>336473082
>You get hit once and they'll stun you to death
Only if you're bad.
I'm sorry you're so amazingly shitty at the game anon. Must suck to be unable to roll out of the way or parry an extremely predictable behavior.
>>336473017
Using strong attack on heavy weapons in its current state is a waste of time. And don't give me that half charged bullshit. I wanna flatten people.
>>336473053
>Heavy weapons already have hyper/super armor on tons of their attacks
Hyperarmour ONLY applies on the followthrough of an attack. It does not apply on the startup, which makes it effectively impossible to trade against Estoc spammers, and SS fags (to a lesser extent). Poise allows a Greatsword to tank through the initial interrupt and trade. Whereas right now the only way to come out ahead as a great weapon user against Estoc R1 spam is to be fighting someone retarded.
>>336472657
People will always find the best way to trivialize the game. Regardless of the implementation of poise.
>>336473160
so instead of arguing for heavy armor to increase damage absorption, you're arguing for an overpowered stat to be reimplemented and tweaked to death so its not as cancerous as it was in dark souls 1?
Fucking japs cant make games. Just bumb poise to the level that I can take atleast one hit from the weakest enemy in the game without staggering like a retard.
>>336473207
That's funny
I pretty regularly hit people for 1.3k with fully charged Astora Greatsword R2s
>>336473140
>Well I'm just curious like a cat
Well I don't fucking care. Cats are garbage pets.
>Armor doesn't reduce the damage by enough to be worth the stat investment
So don't play a heavy armored build.
>Any player would be better served increasing vigor for more HP, which already trivializes the PvE. 30+ VIG might not let you take hits without staggering, but you can just take a hit to the face and then use one of your many flasks to almost immediately restore all of your health.
Exactly. So just stack your Vig and accept that you can't become some sort of ungodly tank build. M'k?
>>336473181
Maybe, but I wasn't really satisfied with DS2even bought the Collector's Editionand Scholar of the First Sin left a bad taste in my mouth.
More likely than not the developers intended to have a robust poise system and weapons degradation and repair system.
There is repair powder scattered throughout the game and a repair mechanic at the blacksmith that is never used because it is completely superfluous when your weapons will only break after 5000000 strikes
As a rule of thumb if something looks like it was changed at the last minute in a video game, it was the producer's decision
>>336472450
>implying defence does jack shit
>>336473073
Also, Vit gives lots of passive defense, but only if you level vigor to at least 27 first. If you want to truly tank, get vigor to 27, pump vit to at least 40, then dump the rest into stamina and strength. Wear the heaviest armor you are able to without going over 70. Use rings that boost HP, defense. You are now the fucking wall.
Shit in PVP and PVE takes twice as many hits to kill me now.
>>336473160
>Armor doesn't reduce the damage by enough to be worth the stat investment
It absolutely does. Heavy armour in DaS3 is upwards of 50% damage reduction. It simply isn't worth it without Poise. With poise, heavy armour is completely legit.
>>336473207
Well you have to fucking work to flatten people, stop asking for handouts
>>336473354
suuuure.
Playing against retards?
>>336473354
Grats
>>336473190
>Only if you're bad.
HAHAHAHA
HE DID IT AGIAN!
OooooH WHAT A GOOD MEME!
Guys did you see this!?
He disregarded problems with the game by sayning I just need to git gud xD Fucking classic!
Someone should upload this to Encyclopedia Dramatica so that it can be remembered forever! Wew, we should just tell everyone that we ever disagree with to just git gud!
Thanks anon, thats a good meme! I like it! Great Job!
>>336473254
>Hyperarmour ONLY applies on the followthrough of an attack.
Which is why I kill people in a three hit combo with my Executioner GS.
>It does not apply on the startup
So git gud and observe spacing and timing.
>which makes it effectively impossible to trade against Estoc spammers
No, it's perfectly easy to trade with estoc spam. If you're not garbage.
Stop blaming the game for your shortcoming you gigantic fucking baby.
>>336473007
>every weapon that needs poise has hyperarmour frames instead.
You say that like the window of time that you get hyper armor is even useful against players. They can still just mash R1 and get you before it activates, or right after it's done activating, both of which can occur before your attack connects. Of course, it'd be less of an issue if their fucking netcode worked, but hyper armor is still not a reliable replacement for poise.
>>336473082
Rapiers don't have any kind of stunlocks you fucking shitter, they factually only combo for two hits like the majority of weapons in the game.
Only paired curved swords, curved greatswords and halberds have multiple hit combos that actually DO keep you in place for more than 2 hits.
>>336473254
>It does not apply on the startup,
Why should it? So you could 100% safely outtrade anyone, turning the fight into a onesided dancefest ith your opponent trying to cheese you between openings in your attacks?
>which makes it effectively impossible to trade against Estoc spammers, and SS fags (to a lesser extent
Again, timing is the key.
Ultraweapons are perfectly manageable.
>>336473254
Hyperarmor starts generally as soon as your weapon starts moving forwards. If you're getting beaten out of attack animations you need to hit R1 sooner.
>>336473358
>Well I don't fucking care. Cats are garbage pets
Alright Doctor we'll just move onto the next question. If the moon was made of barbecue spare ribs would you eat it?
>>336473180
that is more likely to get patched out than poise getting patched in.
>>336473358
>cats are garbage pets
Your opinions are garbage
>>336473437
but thinking poise is anything more than a crutch for people without timing and spacing is delusional at best
just because "git gud" is often used as a throw away insult doesn't mean that's the case here
>>336473437
>He disregarded problems with the game by sayning I just need to git gud
There's no other response anon. You're the retard who thinks being poked once by an estoc means you're fucked with no way out.
I was winning fightclubs with greatswords before they even fucking buffed them. You're bad at games anon.
>>336473392
>upwards of 50% damage reduction
Bullshit. Full Smough is maybe 30-35% and requires an asston of VIT
>>336473153
You get plenty of differences in builds, use different weapons, magics, appraches, shield, no-shield, no leveling, no shield and heavy armor.
Plenty of things to do differently.
>All """"""""pros"""""""""" using weapons with hyperarmor cos this shit game doesnt have poise.
>everybody repeating the same shit about poise doing nothing for hyper armored heavy weapons and benefitting light weapons too much
>nobody taking medium weapons like spears and greatswords into consideration
>>336473373
enemies reacted to torches, making whole areas much easier, not to mention NPCs and even covenants ffs
all miyazaki knows is level design and lore
>>336473639
>30-35
yes, on TOP of the bonus you get in DS3 for even having something equipped in the slot in the first place.
>>336471603
>non-purchaseable
Why is this even a criterion? The weapons are still available to you. Souls 3 gives vendors more emphasis. That other guy is right, biased list.
>>336473432
99% of the people playing this game are retards. If you're having serious trouble in pvp and aren't using something completely trash like fists or scythes or non-pyromancer's locks whips then the only possibility is that you're even more retarded.
>>336473478
The more poise you have in this game, the more hyper armor you get on your swings. Poise up bitch.
>>336473720
spears already completely obliterate heavy weapons poise would not help them in that regard
>>336473390
Can you theoretically reach the same damage absorption as Havel invader in dragoncock peak?
Because if you can, you don't fucking need poise.
>>336473676
Uh huh, it's just that "plenty" happens to be a laughable fraction of what they offered before.
>>336473763
Except you don't need heavy armor to get that.
The absorption difference between knight and smough sets is nowhere near significant enough to warrant the extra 40 or so VIT needed to wear it
>>336472774
I stated no opinion on poise all I did was ask a question lol
>>336473547
>but thinking poise is anything more than a crutch for people without timing and spacing is delusional at best
Its not fucking Street Fighter, its Dark Souls.
Maybe I WANT to play as a tanky mother fucker. Maybe I don't want to spin around in circles fishing for parries or backstabs with a katana or rapier.
I know all about spacing and timing, I spend more time playing fighting games then anything else.
But that doesn't mean that the only viable build in Dark Souls 3 should be "twinky little faggot with a spammable short sword of some sort"
Magic got fucked because anything stops them form casting, and heavy weapons got fucked because anything stops them from attacking.
Poise is important. It doesn't need to be Dark Souls 1 levels of good, but removing it entirely is fucking retarded and turns this game into a boring Bloodborne style fagfest.
Maybe YOU should get good and learn how to deal with someone that has poise instead of just spamming R1 with a Dark Sword, BroadSword or Rapier like 99% of the online players that follow "the meta"
Also, what kind of literal faggot actually cares about the meta and doesn't just do a few fun gimmicky builds? Do you actually take Souls PVP seriously?
I just want to enjoy being a fucking heavily armoured knight with a big weapon, but its just fucking annoying because all enemies roam in packs and the PvP "meta" is all about abusing the lack of poise.
Putting poise back in wouldn't ruin PvP, it would just change it to not be fucking annoying and stupid and it would allow some build variety.
>>336473519
I know I would. Heck I'd come back for seconds.
>>336471935
>It's not possible to wear full havel's / smough's and midroll without an insane amount of vit.
Vit gives more defense than the armor does, but with high vit stacked with good armor, your defensive ability is significantly improved.
Just dont neglect vigor- get vigor to at least 27 first.
>>336474087
Underage detected he didn'twash it down with a nice tall Budweiser
>>336474048
>Maybe I WANT to play as a tanky mother fucker.
Stack Vit and Vigor, and wear good armor. Have enough strength and endurance to use a greatshield. Congrats, now you can block almost everything without consequence. Congrats, when you do get hit, you are taking about 1/4th of the damage that hit would take from the average PVPer. Congrats, you are now a tanky mother fucker.
>>336473783
You're right, I think the list would be way more fucking skewed in favor of DS1 if purchasable shit was in it too. You have the stuff from Shiva, Rickert, Vamos, Andre, both male and female Undead Merchants, Griggs, Dusk and Petrus as opposed to just the Handmaiden and Greirat, both of whose inventory is very limited early on.
Clearly some DS3 favoritism is going on.
>>336473685
>huge weapon have the benefit of being unstoppable the moment they gain momentum on their swings
>smaller weapons are fast but their balance is easier to disturb
Name a single legit reason you need poise in this game.
I am not going to deny that heavy armour is underpowered, but the better way of buffing it would be just increasing the defence values and damage absorbing capabilities, because that's what armour is for.
>>336473815
spears have about the same reach as the heavy weapons, attack almost as slowly, and do half the damage. not being able to trade or poke properly is an issue.
on the opposite spectrum of going against light weapons the spear is slower, not that much more range, similar or slightly lower damage. again making trades and poking exttemely difficult to pull off.
>>336474253
Congrats, you got your shield kicked and took a crit
Congrats, you can't attack back unless you're using a broadsword because they'll just stun you out of your attack animation
>>336469349
How is it "off" when clearly poise works, but only in extreme cases. When you use a weapon art or have the fattest armor. I've had many duels where the opponent just stacked the heaviest armor and I couldn't break his guard with my lucerne.
>>336474021
>the extra 40 or so VIT needed to wear it
So we're going to ignore the +60 physical resistance you get for having 40 more Vit than someone without it?
>>336474236
Untold amounts of shitposting later he finally gets his answer
>>336474048
>bro who gives a shit about any balance just have FUN
its all I'm getting out of your dumb wall of text, and for the record I haven't used a straight sword in pvp for 100 hours of playtime, and poise would benefit them a fuckton more than heavy weapons
>>336474293
>because that's what armour is for.
Not really.
You know what would happen if you tried to attack a dude in fuckhuge massive armor with a dagger or a broadsword?
Unless you aimed for an opening in the armor like his armpits, your weapon would bounce the fuck off of him and he wouldn't feel a god damn thing
In DaS its like all armor is just cardboard and styrofoam costumes and everyone is just larping.
>>336474048
>Its not fucking Street Fighter
You can "Poise" through shit with many characters in Street Fighter though.
>>336474247
What's your favorite planet, Doctor? Mine's the sun. It's sort of like the king of the planets.
>>336471603
>hey lets compare these 2 completely structured games
its almost like comparing racing to fps, I like the way 1 is made more, but suck dick, 3 still has many more advantages over 1, like a proper tutorial and explanation menu
>>336474357
That's not poise, it's shield stability.
>>336474350
have you even played pvp in this game? it takes at least 3 kicks to break a greatshield
>>336474367
These 40 points will have to come from somewhere
Unless we're talking sl200 "builds" you'll pay for it by having less health, less damage, less endurance. You'd be tankier if you put these points into useful stats instead
>>336474320
>half the damage
You clearly don't know how spears work. It says it even in the tip. You need to attack during their attack or right after.
How hard is it to just copy DS1?
but nooooooooooooooooo we gotta have invincible roll mash to get away, phantom range on everything, and 3v1 every invasion
>>336473519
only if its pork
>>336474565
this is good bait, someone will fall for it
>>336474643
What game are you playing where people walk into your 2 second windup spear pokes?
>>336474503
Not only is Zangief my main, but he is bottom tier and thats his special ability.
I
Fucking
Wish
he could super armour through more shit
>>336474438
>bro who gives a shit about any balance just have FUN
>Dark Souls 3
>Balanced
>Magic, Heavy Armour, Heavy Weapons, and Vit as a stat are completely fucking pointless outside of gimmick builds
Also 100 hours isn't much, I haven't even played this game in like a week or so because there is no point in doing a different build in NG+ when there is only one or two viable types of builds now
Poise tanking is the new meta
except the new poise has nothing to do with your stats or armor
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VrEmDgHLTqY
>>336474350
>shield kick
This has been tested, even with a horse hoove ring kicks dont do SHIT to a proper tank build- Video evidence- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n09xmhsvIuU&feature=youtu.be
You dont even need a weapon if you want to show off- a greatshield is enough.
>Congrats, you can't attack back unless you're using a broadsword because they'll just stun you out of your attack animation
Hyper armor bitch. Or just use the Greatshield weapon art that keeps block frames up and attacks at the same time- lets you damage them a tiny bit, but more importantly stuns them for a follow up hit with your big ass strength weapon. Or just use a small weapon like a straight sword- you are already the fucking wall, you are going to win trades.
alternatively, just time your swings with a big ass heavy weapon for the hyper armor and trade favorably. The more poise you have gives you more hyper armor, meaning your hyper armor will be easier to take advantage of if you are a tanky heavy armor character.
>>336474568
I meant didn't "stun" him with a regular attack. He just tanked it and kept attacking.
>>336474503
That's not poise, it's closer to hyperarmor.
>>336474643
>That feel when using Leo Ring with thrust attacks on Ultra Greatswords
>>336474048
Magic is shit because all the spells are boring and so easy to dodge you could do it in your sleep. Even if they had infinite poise it would still suck.
Poise advantages people with light fast weapons more than large weapons, because they have more weight free to dedicate to armor and now have a hugely forgiving buffer on their r1spam, because they can hit you in the startup of your attack, hit you as you hit them and then hit you in the recovery of your attack and you get staggered instead of them.
Not to mention that there's enough recovery on greatweapons even in 3 that with poise you could strafe behind them, tank 1 attack and get a free backstab. The backstab delay mostly prevents rollbackstabs, but poisebackstabs are quick enough that they'll hit pretty reliably.
If you want to be a tanky mother fucker in 3, all you have to do is have a lot of health and wield a big weapon with decent timing. When someone is about to try to attack you with a sword, you press R1, ignore their swing and hit them twice for 4x as much damage.
This is easily the best that huge weapons have been since DeS
>>336474816
>forcing longsword babies to trade against leo ring red hilted halberd
>>336474320
spears have a substantially slower rev time than any heavy weapon and are suppose to used to punish bad swings with counter damage, especially with the leo ring
obviously if you trade damage for damage you're a retard, but spears aren't suppose to be played like that
>being a poor little red guy
>3v1 rapefest all spam r1
>fiftyfifty if i survive just one fight
>then they rekt me at the end.
plz turn poise on. Looking at the stats its not as strong as in das1. If it were on, that is.
>>336474571
>>336474793
>have you even played pvp in this game? it takes at least 3 kicks to break a greatshield
Thats kind of cool, but I gave up on my tank build when I got to Nameless King, so I guess I never got to test this.
I got up to 50ish Vit, and still couldn't use full Havel set with his weapon and shield without being over 100%, thats with FAP ring and Havels ring.
So I just went without the shield for the most part, which didn't make it any more fun since even rats and basic bitch undead in the first areas could knock me around still
>>336474641
I can see what you're saying at this point but now we're gonna have to sit down and crunch some actual numbers or it's just theorycrafting.
Plus then we gotta bring up about things like rings and such if we're gonna talk about build potential
Thanks for actually having a real discussion though
>>336474641
>Being tankier and more points invested into defense should not come at the cost of being weaker offensively to compensate.
You dont want balance. You dont want build variety. You just want to be OP. You want to be tanky AND have DPS as good as a non tank. Are you stupid?
>>336474806
It was hyper armor on his weapon then. Nothing to do with Poise. It would work if he was naked too.
>>336474990
>You want to be tanky AND have DPS as good as a non tank. Are you stupid?
Someone at his same level could easily invest his points in different areas and create a completely different and viable build.
>>336474816
How does Leo Ring work exactly? It doesn't boost the attack of my Chaos Blade riposte or backstab, when it's clearly a thrust move. Chaos blade is normal/thrust or some shit.
I assume "critical hits" are ripostes and backstabs?
>>336475008
Actually if your poise is pure 0 you get knocked during hyper armor.
Dont know why.
>>336475102
No, they're like counter hits in street fighter, where you hit them during their attack animation.
>>336474093
My vigor is 35. My Vit is 55, because even with havel's ring, ring of favour AND prisoner's chain, I only just manage to stay under 100% equip.
>>336474253
No.
unless you two-hand the havel's greatshield, you're going to get shield broken very quickly. And even if you don't you won't have enough stamina to hit them back.
>>336474838
Shut the fuck up faggot you don't know shit about shit everything you just said is pleb shit
>>336474641
>These 40 points will have to come from somewhere
Yea, that's the fucking point, to make you pay for damage reduction. Literally all they did was redistribute some of the base defensive value from heavy armor to the VIT stat. So players who choose to level up VIT and keep their equip load low, or use the equip on heavy weapons instead, will still gain defense.
It's really nothing to bitch about. The reason everyone hates the souls fanbase is that no matter what From changes game-to-game, even if it improves the game, people will cry like little faggots
>>336474486
Are you an idiot? There is a reason why blunt weaponry was considered the armor destroyer in the dark ages- its why maces were so damn popular. Also, thrusting weapons penetrate armor quite easily as well. Which is part of why spears and arrows remained widely used. Shit never just "Bounced off" getting hit still knocked you around, it just kept you a bit safer inside that shell of protection- but getting knocked hard from the side with any thing would still knock you off balance- maybe even more so due to the weight and heft of the armor.
>>336474990
retard...
>>336475102
No critical hits are hits you land when your opponent is also swinging
that's why spears are so good against heavy weapons, they can land critical hits all day without being in range
>>336475143
Hyper Armor probably has a poise multiplier in there that nullifies the entire situation when it's 0.
>Full Havels with Havels Greatshield and Dragon tooth
>54 vitality, havels ring and FaP at 99.6% equip load
>get stunned by one handed rapier r1s
Some of the weapons and shields give you poise bonuses but the stat doesn't even exist at the moment, there is no way it was intentional to leave it off.
>>336474641
Pure dex or str builds can easily drop 40+ points in both vig and vit.
I have like 1900HP, 175absorption, and 40% mitigation with all my rings.
>>336475170
REALLY? Fuck you just blew my mind anon. Back to Lucerne with hornet/leo it is. During the animation or does short after work too?
>>336474838
>best heavy weapons in 3
>3 person zweihander stunlocks in DS1
SHUT THE FUCK UP
>>336474367
Where did you pull that number from?
>>336475307
They should buff stuff like the havels ring and FaP ring to not make heavy armor use so abysmal
in your specific situation you can neither parry nor roll away, so you're fucked
>>336474961
I could compare say, two 40/40 characters using the same weapon and see if heavy armor is better defensively but the sheer number of possible builds makes reaching a conclusion really hard
>>336475374
1.5 phys defense per 1 point of Vit.
There's also other defenses and resistances you get per point but we we're just talking armor and it's merits so it's all I mentioned
>>336474959
So you didn't even actually try the thing that you're bitching is unviable?
You couldn't fastroll with Havels Shield, weapon and armor in 1 at all, and only even midrolled at 65 END.
>>336469349
Roll roll attack
>>336474959
>since even rats and basic bitch undead in the first areas could knock me around still
Poise doesn't work how it used to. It gives hyper armor now. It does not stop you from staggering when doing nothing. You still have to be an active defender.
>>336474838
I don't know who you've been playing against but I've had my ass handed to me by plenty of magic users
>>336475226
>Also, thrusting weapons penetrate armor quite easily as well. Which is part of why spears and arrows remained widely used.
That's pretty misleading. There is considerably more force behind an arrow than a spear; spears penetrating armor was definitely not something that would occur with any regularity.
>>336475497
Look at the moron comparing 66 endurance in DS1 to having 60+ vit in 3
kill ya self retard
>>336475081
and that build wouldn't be a tank, now would it? If you want to be DPS, spec for that. If you want to be a tank, spec for that. Stop expecting to be able to have the best of both worlds, because that is not balanced.
>>336471105
DS1 had Resistance and Bloodborne had armor stats.
>>336475613
>Stop expecting to be able to have the best of both worlds, because that is not balanced.
Well, in DaS3 its only possible to have the best of one world since the other world is turned off in the games code
>>336475497
you know Endurance gave stamina so everyone leveled it anyway, right?
>>336472242
Look at the fucking poise of Havel's set dumbass
The poise is 37.2 in DS3
In DS1, the poise is 121.0
Havel has been greatly nerfed
>DeS
>practically no poise
>heavy weapons are decent, DBS is one of the most powerful weapons in the series
>DaS1
>busted poise
>meta revolves around stacking heavy armour and using fast weapons
>heavy weapons are used mainly for bsfishing and trying to use them as intended will just get you bs'd most of the times
>DaS2
>poise is bad, pretty much irrelevant and only buffs your ability to hyperarmour through shit
>meta revolves around fast weapons, but heavier weapons are very much usable and even were close to top tier during certain patches
>BB
>poise simply is not a thing
>heavy weapons have a bunch of hyperarmour and deal a fuckton of damage, only ever so slightly underpowered compared to shit like rakuyo, chikage, saw weapons and bom
>DaS3
>poise only compliments hyperarmour
>greatweapons are viable
>but apparently it's not working as intended and DaS1 was the only game that got it right, even if it was an exception and greatweapons there were just sightparry bait/bs bait
You're killing me, /v/.
>>336475363
Fun against scrubs but so is everything. You get roll backstabbed or parried instantly if you try to press r1 against anyone who knows what they're doing
>>336470330
I liked Dark Souls 3, but after this, I'm not sure that game will ever recover. Now I'm a #niohmissile
>>336475743
>I'm a moron
For all you know, 37.2 is the same as 121.1 since the value of an individual point of poise isn't a predefined thing.
>not using firekeeper set with gundyr's halberd
you are all shitters
>>336475743
why the fuck would the poise values be anywhere close to representing the same thing
>>336471554
DS2 wasn't made by the same people who made DS1 or DS3. It was their B-Team, hence why it was bad.
>>336475746
>implying people who are bitching even remember DaS
Some guy was arguing in another thread about how the Emerald Herald talks too much before she levels you up, and mentioned how he liked that the Maiden in Black from DeS didn't do that. My point being that no one knows what the fuck they're talking about, half the people arguing probably never even played the other games in the series. DaS PvP was trash and anyone who played would know that
>>336475968
>still believing this
lol
>>336475746
Poise doesn't effect hyper armor at all, other than just enabling it by being above 0. After that it's all the same.
>>336471603
>sequence breaking with master key gets you more loot!
wew lad
>>336475878
I use firekeeper chest, black iron gloves/legs, thief mask, and lothric long spear. get on my fashion level, scrub.
>>336475182
Fuck havels armor then. It is only slightly better than other heavy sets but has way more weight to it. You need around 90 Vit + Havels Ring + Ring of Favor to use it anyway.
As far as blocking with the shield, I dont know what you are doing wrong- I can soak up straight sword hits with it all day. If you are trying to block ultra weaponry though, then I think i found your problem.
>>336475968
>this meme again
Literally only the director changed, and as DaS3 has shown Miyazaki is a fucking hack anyways
>>336476045
"believing" would imply it's debateable, retard. it's not.
>>336475746
Souls fans are the worst group ever. Worst fanbase on /v/ by far. And I say this as a MASSIVE soulsfag.
>>336476016
>Some guy was arguing in another thread about how the Emerald Herald talks too much before she levels you up, and mentioned how he liked that the Maiden in Black from DeS didn't do that
DaS2 haters have said some of silliest things.
>>336471603
A Halberd drops from the big executioner-like guys a minute's walk from the entry into High Wall of Lothric.
>>336475746
This. Anybody who bitches at poise in DaS3 has never played PvP in another Souls game
>>336475341
>During the animation or does short after work too?
Both, but it only works if the specific attack you are using deals "thrust" damage.
>>336476115
Uh, no? DS2 is the only subpar entry in the series, saying otherwise is just wanting to have an epic contrarian opinion to everyone else.
>>336471413
Probably because you're wearing 1000 pounds of what appears to be stone.
>there are people on /v/ that unironically think das2 was better than das3
>>336471603
Wow, you have to kill an entire ONE BOSS after the tutorial to access a huge open chunk of the game. So fucking linear and restrictive.
>everyone complaining about r1 spamming
It's super easy to parry r1 spam, especially with straight swords
>>336472242
Not to mention having poise instead of super armor like we have now hugely nerfs the slower heavy weapons since those now have a fuckload higher equipload requirement to work like they do now.
>>336476016
>the Emerald Herald talks too much before she levels you up, and mentioned how he liked that the Maiden in Black from DeS didn't do that
Pretty sure that's a meme complaint from that matthewmatosis video. He somehow managed to forget the "SEEKETH SOUL POWER DOST THOU NOT?" when he was compiling his list of petty bullshit to whine about
>>336472417
>If you want to play a fast character with a toothpick weapon, maybe try learning how to parry or something instead of mashing R1 on peoples faces
so much this
>>336476224
"muh realism"
>>336471554
>lost izalyth
Not their fault. They had much better plans for it, but Namco rushed them.
Which sucks, because Bed of Chaos is the worst thing in any Souls game.
>>336475575
Spears could literally penetrate anything that wasn't full platemail.
Poise was a garbage mechanic. I'm glad it's gone.
>>336470837
That's hyper armor bud, you can wearing nothing and still hyper armor through attack if you swing correctly.
>>336475746
Another moron greentexting a retard's treatise on the retarded shit going on in his empty brain cavity
>>336475746
But why not have it in this game?
Most armor with decent poise is extremely heavy and would take a LOT of points on Vit for you to be able to mid roll while wearing them, even with FaP and Havel ring, like 30+ Vit in a game people are currently leaving Vit on its base value.
As long as Poise isn't as strong as it was in DaS and actually takes some meaningful stat investment, then I don't see the issue, it would increase the build diversity too, because as it is now, you get more effective HP from pumping VIG than you do from stacking VIT and wearing heavy armor.
>>336476289
parrying needs a nerf, it's too easy to do.
>>336476332
>not their fault
funny how every problem with DaS is written off as "hurr publisher deadlines, reality of game design, nothing they could do, technical problems etc..." fuck off with this shit. EVERY game deals with deadlines, they're not supposed to end up half finished as a result
>there are still people 5 games into a series that dont understand the difference between poise and hyperarmor
>>336475968
Look at how good their DaS1 PC port was.
Pretty competent people in their A-team.
