is there a reason people say Grand Archives is Duke's Archives? Or is it just because its an archive with books.
Lore? There's no story. There is an intro and an ending. Aside from that you get little idiots saying shit about deliveries and that you have no soul.
No story.
>>336064358
There is a difference between lore and story. Saying it has no lore is retarded. You can call it bad lore though. I'd really rather just have my question answered if anybody even can.
>>336064203
Why the fuck would they say that? Lothric isn't anywhere near that place. People have poop for brains
>>336064203
Lothric High Wall is so far from Anor Londo.
But this archives can be based on Seath Archives.
The Crystal Sage make me thinking about this place anyways
>>336064203
>>336065551
The Grand Archives have their scholars worshiping Seathe so it's not too far a stretch that it might be the place. Plus, the Crystal Sage drops the Crystal scroll there.
so has irithyll always been under anor londo?
Is there anyway to pump a rum in her pickle pee?
>>336064203
The Duke's Archives are still in Anor Londo. You can see the building at the beginning of the webm.
>>336068676
Which one?
>>336069654
The one on the blue-ish cliff after Lothric wall.
I could be wrong though since it doesn't resemble the archives from DaS. After looking at DaS screenshots, I'm not sure anymore.
>Frampt wants you to link the fire
>Kaathe doesn't
>They almost definately share goals and desires and their very nature hints that they may be connected
The biggest Dark Souls mystery for me
>>336070790
have you ever read the Book of Job? It's like that
>>336070949
I know the gist
Satan and God don't have the same motives though do they?
what's happening when you "usurp" the flame?
>>336068028
>so has irithyll always been under anor londo?
No, they've always been the same place; it's just Gwyn is completely gone now, so no sun.
When Gwyn died he took his sunlight radiance with him: Gwyndolin was the only god left behind to pick up the pieces of civilization and rebuild the "Old Royalty" that Gwyn had initially founded.
Gwyndolin is of the moon he's a moon "goddess" and isn't capable of creating the breathtaking iridescents his father could so casually, so instead of constantly living a lie Gwyndolin full on established the aboreal valley and the kingdom of Irithyll as a snowy, constant-cresent-moon-stricken tundra land of ice and snow.
It's all the effects of Gwyndolin's influence and power as a god that causes Anor Londo to go from sunlight to snowy.
>>336071013
no, they don't
but they both act as manipulators, with the Humans caught in the middle like living chesspieces. Neither really cares about the well-being of the pawns, it's all about proving the other wrong
>>336070356
that's the building where you fight the giant tree
>2+ weeks after release
>people still think that the Deep is different from the Abyss
people like this need to take their medications before posting in lore threads
>>336071374
>people like this need to take their medications before posting in lore threads
You're going to have to explain your counter argument/reasoning before you go shit talking, chum.
I'm willing to humor the notion they're different simply on the basis that the abyss is heavily associated with humanity and the dark soul while the Deep is constantly referencing the ocean.
>>336071181
Well, unlike in Souls, God gave Job a lot more wealth than he had previously.
>>336071551
But my mystery is that they're conjoined, and they share interests. Frampt is decieving us into linking the flame, but Kaathe wants you not to. In the dark lord ending, though, loads of sneks worship you.
>>336071374
Also there are both deep gems are dark gems.
>>336071535
>>336071731
Deep gems and Dark gems both infuse weapons with Dark damage
The Deep tome and the Londor tome both illicit the same reaction from Irina -- they are "dark tales of things that lurk deep within the hearts of men"
the sorceries Deep Soul and Great Deep Soul inflict dark damage
>>336071551
>yo senpai I know that you're probably traumatized for life about that whole "your entire family just got murdered before your eyes and all your property was burned," but here, have some cash, that'll make up for it right???? :^)
old testament god was a dick
>>336071117
Based post, no (you)s, why am I surprised? Have mine anon.
>>336065551
>>336066075
>>336064203
I'm not 100% sure if the Grand Archives are the same archives, but it isn't outlandish to think that the Lothric/Grand Archives probably STOLE or otherwise raided/copied a number of the books and texts from Seath's original archives.
>>336071760
>>336071731
It's interesting you bring that up, because consider the following:
If the Deep and The Abyss were the same thing, then what would be the purpose of making the clear distinction between the various elemental gems? Do you follow me?
Ah, wait, here it is actually -thank you- I found the MOST IMPORTANT DEEP QUOTE, okay, so observe this with me:
The Dark Gem has the following quote, "A gem of infused titanite. Born of disembodied humanity." They're Dark Gems, born of disembodied humanity and thus abyss goodness. This is the Abyss Gem.
The DEEP Gem however has this to say, "There is a darkness that lies beyond human ken." It says it's a "Darkness that lies beyond humans" - The Deep is truly the deep, deepest, darkness- the kind that is of stagnation, the bedrock of the earth the Deep soul mentions.
I dunno, I dunno.
I think there's enough to go on to justify the deviation.
>>336072359
ken =/= kin
kin == humanity
ken == human knowledge and understanding
the quote "there is a darkness that lies beyond human ken," translated into more "everyday" speech, is "the truest extent of Darkness goes beyond your wildest dreams." which doesn't support either theory one way or the other, since that's a lore blurb that's been tossed around since DaS1
>>336072560
Fair enough, but you're not acknowledge the big important detail: They made a "distinction".
A distinction has been made- This can't be a simple matter of a translation error.
What's more the DEEP gem and the DARK gem don't even follow the same methidology of infusion in terms of what sort of coal they require to upgrade or alter weapons: The Profaned Coal is used to infuse dark, bleed and hollow gems.
The SAGE'S Coal on the other hand is used for Crystal, Blessed and DEEP Gems.
A line has been drawn in the sand between the deep and the dark. Not a BIG one, but perhaps one that is more in line with the difference between pyromancy and DEMON pryomancy/chaos??
>>336072359
While I think that that is an important quote, I think it's the description on the Soul of Aldrich says even more.
http://darksouls3.wiki.fextralife.com/Soul+of+Aldrich
"Soul of Aldrich,
One of the twisted souls, steeped in strength.
Use to acquire many souls, or transpose to extract its true strength.
When Aldrich ruminated on the fading of the fire, it inspired visions of a coming age of the deep sea.
He knew the path would be arduous, but he had no fear. He would devour the gods himself."
I think the Cathedral of the Deep worship the power of the Abyss in the form of a global, dark ocean.
My theory: Fire is not the only way to spawn life in the world, as we know now that there are entire ecosystems separate from the solar life-cycle on earth in the abyssal plain, maybe the age of deep is an age where life springs from the dark instead.
>>336072883
the Deep is what happens when you take the Abyss, and start doing sciency experiments and shit on it, to try and refine it into something more. Hence why the Deep is lumped in with sorcery and religious infusion -- it's the Abyss, as "refined" and studied by human minds.
Dark infusion is just
>what kind of Abyss you want senpai?
>just humanity my shit up
>say no more, say no more, I gotchu
>>336072897
Yes, Aldritch's soul I completely agree has the most important clue/piece of information: The Deep's association and tie in with the Ocean and it makes me think -and this will sound silly/goofy-
But what if like you said: What if The OCEAN itself or Water is another Elemental- one that has been patiently waiting to drown the world of fire and consume everything? Snakes and all?
>>336073185
>the Deep is what happens when you take the Abyss, and start doing sciency experiments and shit on it, to try and refine it into something more. Hence why the Deep is lumped in with sorcery and religious infusion -- it's the Abyss, as "refined" and studied by human minds.
I don't believe that for a moment simply on the basis of it being described as something beyond "Human Ken" as this kind anon pointed out: >>336072560
The Deep IS a kind of darkness beyond Human understanding, so there's no way The Deep is simply "applied" or "scienced" Abyss- that would be redundant.
The Second thing is: We have Abyssal/Dark Sorceries, Pyromancies and Miracles.
I think Dark souls 2 went to great lengths to demonstrate the lengths of which people went to understand, manipulate and weaponize the abyss as it's own school of magics: Hexes and so forth.
>>336073194
Just another personification of darkness imo. Nothing else in the narrative reinforces water or a different element taking over.
>>336073194
>Dark
darkness
>Deep
this isn't your average, everyday ordinary darkness! This, is ADVANCED darkness!
If the Deep really is the Abyss why didn't the Farron Abyss Watchers fucking destroy the cathedral thats within spitting distance?
Isn't they're entire purpose to find and fuck anything that could be related to the Abyss?
I'm much more inclined to believe that the Deep is horrible under the sea nightmares, Lothric is right next to a giant ocean anyway.
>>336074202
kind of hard to be killing Abyss creatures when
(A) you're lying dead in your graves, on account of becoming a Lord of Cinder
(B) you're consumed with Civil War because half of your members have sided with the Abyss
![tumblr_m814cpC1pe1qb1ou4[1].png](https://i.imgur.com/IbARToc.png "tumblr_m814cpC1pe1qb1ou4[1].png")
>>336074068
>this isn't your average, everyday ordinary darkness! This, is ADVANCED darkness!
A MEME THAT LIVES UNDER THE OCEAN.
YOU HEARD IT HERE FIRST FOLKS.
>>336074202
>If the Deep really is the Abyss why didn't the Farron Abyss Watchers fucking destroy the cathedral thats within spitting distance?
This is also a really good fucking point.
The Abyss watchers had destroyed entire countries before, but the cathedral was left untouched.
>>336074202
Because the Abyss Watchers were from a different time than Aldrich. Keep in mind they all linked the flame and were suddenly brought back, all of them seeming to still be crazy except for Aldrich. The Abyss Watchers were all fucking killing themselves nonstop when you arrive, chances are they linked the flame before Aldrich and have no idea who he is.
>>336074401
They only attack the red eyed corrupted ones. The regular watchers always work together.
>>336075338
that doesn't change either of his points, though
>>336071838
Because it's just fanfiction based on nothing but asspulls.
That's Dark Souls lore in a nutshell I guess, though.
>last souls game
>DLC will explain nothing
>no one will ever know exactly what was going on in these games
>>336075674
>no one will ever know exactly what was going on in these games
You are an undead trying to Link the Fire/trying to end The Curse/Linking the Fire.
>>336075674
None of the games make sense until the DLC. Then they do. 3 will be no different.
>>336075554
The point is that the Abyss Watchers aren't crazy or at least most of them aren't.
>>336075674
>last souls game
>DLC will explain nothing
>no one will ever know exactly what was going on in these games
At this point piecing together what's going on is part of the gameplay in a souls game.
If you can't lore you're bad at dark souls.
>>336076019
the point is that the Abyss Watchers linked the flame before Aldrich even existed, and therefore they would have no knowledge of Deep shenanigans, on account of being dead.
Then, after they were revived, they were too busy fighting each other to bother doing their job, either as Lords of Cinder or as Abyss Watchers
>>336075674
Dark Souls is the story of a person coming into a place where he is not wanted and then mercilessly murdering all of the inhabitants.
>>336076184
>the point is that the Abyss Watchers linked the flame
Different Anon, but I still don't believe: Abyss Watchers & Aldritch a long with Lothric ever linked the flame.
I'm like 90% sure the title of lord of cinder has only to do with your potential or qualifications to link the fire or whatever.
If you've linked the fire before as with the case with Yhorm and Lautric the little lord- you are automatically a lord of cinder, but yeah.
Yeah, no, you get my drift.
>>336076707
anon pls stop this meme
>>336076707
Abyss Watchers probably linked the Fire, because they'd see it and go "Holy shit guys, this is how we stop the Abyss!" but no single one of them had a strong enough soul, so they all did it.
Yhorm did it because he felt it was his duty to do so and all that.
Aldrich is the odd one, but he was probably forced to do it by the Pontiff.
>>336077270
it's not that they didn't individually have strong enough souls, they all share a single, communal soul (like the Deacons)
>>336071838
Because it's bullshit and not true at all.
>>336075674
That's the point anon, you're might to make whatever up in your head with the little story/lore it does give. It's game that likes headcanon. Not that I agree with that, I think it has shit lore/story but that's what it's about.
>>336077453
they all have part of one, all taking part in "the blood of the wolf" be that Artorias or Sif or what the fuck ever. The point is that ALL of them linked the fire and that is wasn't just one of them.
The more I think of the basic story of DS3, the more I'm reminded of Final Fantasy Tactics Advanced.
>Characters like the world they're living in
>main character comes along and decides tough shit for them, he's putting the world back as it was.
Your old life sucked shit and I'm taking you back to it.
>>336076707
>I'm like 90% sure the title of lord of cinder has only to do with your potential or qualifications to link the fire or whatever.
God fuck off with this shit. Literally the only Lord that didn't link the fire is Lothric. What the fuck would "becoming a Lord of Cinder" mean otherwise? Not to mention Aldrich and Yhorm were DEAD from linking the fire at the beginning of the game
WHY IS THERE A PAINTING OF NASHANDRA AND THE IRON KING IN ANOR LONDO/IRYTHILL?
>>336064203
it can't possibly be the actual duke's archives. though it's highly possible it's full of books looted from it.
Geographically it's nowhere near where the Duke's Archives were in relation to Anor Londo, which can be used as an anchoring point for measuring things distance in relation to comparing Dark Souls 3 to Dark Souls.
>>336078241
>WHY IS THERE A PAINTING OF NASHANDRA AND THE IRON KING IN ANOR LONDO/IRYTHILL?
WHERE.
SCREENSHOTS.
NOW.
>>336078260
>it can't possibly be the actual duke's archives
According to what? Anor Londo existing where it does at all plays into their "worlds converging" asspull bullshit so there's no reason that the duke's archives couldn't have moved to where Lothric Castle is
>>336065551
>Seathe has a boner for crystal magic
>A crystal sage literally lives there
They probably just moved the books over to the new archives.
>>336077040
>>336077270
>>336078129
No, fuck you guys- it's a reasonable point of discourse.
The Prince Lothric hadn't linked any fires and in doing so set up a presidence- He planted the seed of fucking doubt with the significance of his inaction.
He still remained a "Lord of Cinder" despite adamantly not linking the fire establishing you can and do remain one regardless of you linking a fire or not.
Only Yhorm and Ludleth are specifically mentioned as linking the fire -the make a point to mention it-
No one else has such a distinction; which has given rise to my SUSPSISIONS, SO UNLESS I SEE OR READ A QUOTE SAYING OTHERWISE.
You're running on "IMPLICATIONS" and "ASSUMPTIONS" and it's already been fucking proven by Lothric you don't need to link a fire to be a fucking lord.
So get off my DICK.
>>336064203
>Big Hat Logan dies in the Dukes Archives.
>Ocerios said to spent a lot of time in Grand Archives
>Knows White Dragon Breath
>Has Logans staff
I dunno how he would have got Logan and Seath referances in some other Archive.
>>336078956
So what's one doing on the Road then?
>>336079135
Teaching Farron sorcerers about magics.
I think the Sage Ring has a good item descript for this
>>336079274
>trying to teach swamp people magic
Crystal Sages were dumb.
>>336078561
https://youtu.be/QwuFL2BKb_w?t=2973
>>336079434
Time stamp pretty please?
It's 3 hours long and I don't want to go fishing around.
>>336079135
It literally says in the Crystal sage soul.
>The twin Crystal Sages once served as spiritual guides to the scholars of the Grand Archives, and one went on to ally with the Undead Legion.
>>336079095
No it isn't. Prince Lothric not linking the fire is the whole conceit of the game - the other Lords have to be resurrected and converge to do what he refused to do, except they all decided to fuck off this time as well. Lothric is a lord of cinder because his bloodline tried to create the perfect child to link the fire. So he was powerful enough to do so but he never did.
Your headcanon makes no sense. What does "becoming a lord of cinder" mean if it doesn't mean linking the fire? Ludleth EXPLICITLY says that linking the fire makes one a lord of cinder, and the game states that Aldrich was forced to do it against his will.
So i'm just asking a question here but i'm curious, the monstrous hand freaks that you find near the Irythill Dungeons in DS3. Do their hand heads match Manus' freakish monster hand?
>>336079536
play the video you dummy
>Kingdom of Lothric and their enemy nation from Boreal Valley are literally just a few miles apart.
This is 2fort tier bullshit.
>>336079601
Weren't dragons the enemy?
>>336079549
>and one went on to ally with the Undead Legion.
For what reason?
>>336079571
Ludleth didn't fuck off.
Ornstein = Nameless king = firstborn of gwyn
cannot disprove
>>336079536
49:35
Heres my awful theory
Das2 takes place in a timeline where Chosen Undead didnt link the fire.
Aldrich speaks of the deep sea in his items. As the souls series goes on, water is progressivly rising, as seen as soon as artorias dlc with Oolacile having jack shit for water even when Darkroot has a huge river and lake.
In Das3, alot of the world is covered by water.
In DaS2, which obviously takes place before DaS3 but at the same time is contradicted, one of the themes is water. The gaints are basically vikings, with huge ships that are built for launching an assualt from the sea. Castles are completely buried in water, and pirates are said to rule the sea. The abyss areas all take place in caves that are filled with water that seems to have no bottom. Underwater cave pockets, perhaps?
The reason why das2 cant exist in the same timeline is because of this. In das2, most of the places like carim, thouroland, vinheim, etc, are long forgotten. No one remembers anything about them. But in DaS3, which takes place after DaS2 would, as refrenced by a dead gilligan/shield of want/etc, all these old places are still around.
Either DaS3 is pulling some "lelele le land is distorted with heroes centerius old phasing in and out :^^^^^^^)" bullshit as Solaire put it, or DaS2 takes place in an alternate timeline where choosen undead didn't link the fire and lordran is all but destroyed from the age of dark.
>>336079571
>Your headcanon makes no sense. What does "becoming a lord of cinder" mean if it doesn't mean linking the fire?
That you have the 'potential' to link the fire- I've said it like a million times dude.
> and the game states that Aldrich was forced to do it against his will.
Can you cite this? I'm not being sassy- I'll gladly accept evidence to counter my thingy.
Are you referring to what the deserter Hawkwood said? Because I don't believe that explicitly stats Aldritch linking the fire:
"A right and proper cleric, only, he developed a habit of devouring men.
He ate so many that he bloated like a drowned pig, then softened into sludge,
so they stuck him in the Cathedral of the Deep.
And they made him a Lord of Cinder. Not for virtue, but for might."
They way he says it, it sounds like they "appointed" aldritch a lord of cinder not because of his actions or personality but because of the splendor of his soul and his power.
>>336079745
Well Seathe hated the abyss or was interested in it so probably something to do with that.
I think it's just the threat of the abyss that makes people hate it.
>>336079781
Besides Ornstein's armor saying Ornstein served Gwyn's firstborn.
>>336079781
Oldstein died in 2.
>>336079745
To train Farron sorcerers
Crystal hail
>In a pact said to have been formed long ago, one of the Sages allied with the Undead Legion in order to train the sorcerers of Farron.
>>336073194
the deep seems associated with the dark, maybe what aldrich saw wasnt the deep sea, but the abyss
>>336079573
And on top of that if it is true would you think of it as the cult trying to recreate Manus in some horrid way?
>>336079903
Not canoncially.
You dont have to fight Old Dragonslayer, who likely isnt even Ornstien
>>336079896
>I think it's just the threat of the abyss that makes people hate it.
True, Manus did fuck up Oolacile and its magics.
>>336079918
I guess they just wanted anyone who could cast.
>>336079902
I remember back when DaS1 was out some fags tried to say Ornstein was the true Fristborn because his broken statue had the dragonslayer spear.
Back then I just mocked them, but hell they where close.
>>336080048
HE DROPS THE OLD LEO RING
STOP TRYING TO DENY FACTS
And even if, nigga was clearly corrupted by the abyss.
He wasn't having anything with the family and vise versa.
>>336075984
tell that to bloodborne
inb4 not a souls game
>>336078561
shit
I dunno, maybe just a reference?
though I doubt it
>>336079902
Then why does the sunlight altar depict ornstein, when gwyn's firstborn is the heir to sunlight?
>>336079095
You mean a precedent? Lothric isn't a Lord of Cinder, he's just a Lord (i.e. a powerful soul). He was destined to a be a Lord of Cinder but never linked the fire, which is why his throne is in Firelink
The Profaned flame is the chaos flame
Anor Londo, Elum Loyce and Irythill are the same place
I don't think it is the same building as Dukes. But I think it contains the same books as Dukes and the curse over the books is because they are moved from their original place.
HOW MUCH LONGER TILL VAATI VIDYA COMES OUT WITH A FUCKING LORE VIDEO
![nashandra-painting[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/SRLrgYg.jpg "nashandra-painting[1].jpg")
>>336078241
>WHY IS THERE A PAINTING OF NASHANDRA AND THE IRON KING IN ANOR LONDO/IRYTHILL?
>>336079434
>https://youtu.be/QwuFL2BKb_w?t=2973 [Embed]
>>336079797
>49:35
Thank you, jeeeez.
I see the painting of Nashandra -which is odd- but I don't see the iron king painting?
Is it true that the 'secret' ending reveals that not lighting the bonfire and letting it disperse and ending the cycle of reigniting the sun/universe, it just means now that eventually, a new fire will appear.
In Dark Souls 1, the old woman tells the story that before the universe/world began, it was a grey place where not much happens, and is full of 'Gigantic Trees and Everlasting Dragons'.
Which never made sense to me.
Why would the 'beginning of the universe' have dragons and trees in it? that is a universe, just a bit of a shit one.
It's because the trees are giants that go into stasis on death (they're everywhere in the last 2 games), and they and the dragons are just two races created by the sudden creation of a new great flame.
Each of them likely discovered how to cycle the fire forever, and eventually one of the chosen undead or embers that rose instinctively to reignite the fire decides enough is enough and ends it, as you do in DS3.
But that doesn't end the world.
It's like a fire in a great forest. It IS a fire in a great forest. When it's lit and roaring, your eyes adjust, making everything darker that isn't near the fire. The grey night with its tiny lights in the sky are so much more visible when the fire fades.
But inevitably the next day, the sun rises again, as it will in the next aeon in Dark Souls.
By ending the cycle, allows the beginning of a new one; like a game set in a Big-Bounce universe.
>>336080194
>tell that to bloodborne
What did you mean by this?
>>336079873
>"A right and proper cleric, only, he developed a habit of devouring men.
He ate so many that he bloated like a drowned pig, then softened into sludge,
so they stuck him in the Cathedral of the Deep.
And they made him a Lord of Cinder. Not for virtue, but for might."
See this is what made no sense to me. Can the Kiln be accessed from any Bonfire? If they locked him away, wouldnt he not he able to access the flame to link it?
>>336080194
That applies to Bloodborne too, my man.
>>336080219
you are joking, its the fuckin firstobrns spear
>>336064203
>people
Retards you mean?
Not everything from DS2 and 3 are the same from DS1.
>>336079896
Seath, as a dragon, was probably neutral to the Abyss. That shit only concerns people who interacted with the First Flame.
>>336080219
Kek this niggers are still alive.
>>336079873
>They way he says it, it sounds like they "appointed" aldritch a lord of cinder
No it doesn't, it sounds like they locked up him and forced him to link the fire. But yea, I suppose it's a total coincidence that he revived along with the other lords that linked the first
>>336080516
>That shit only concerns people who interacted with the First Flame.
Not really.
Abyss is a black hole not stopping until it can't suck up anything else.
>>336080192
The giant on the tower drops the Hawk ring, but he sure as hell ain't Hawkeye Gough.
Rings change hands with apt regularity in the Dark Souls universe.
>>336080238
Why is he needed in the ritual then?
>>336080465
r u sure
>>336080368
We haven't figured out enough of it for him yet.
>>336080382
it's not a picture of him, it's a picture of his throne in the brume tower.
>>336080730
Im sick of seeing this complaint.
If you want someone to credit you, throw on a fucking tripcode.
>>336080812
>>336080708
>dad has a cool weapon
>i want one too
>>A dragon hunting weapon from the age of the gods. The earliest form of the cross spear, serving as both a sword and a spear.
>>Its owner wasthe Nameless King, a deific hunter of dragons. The swordspear is imbued with lightning, of which he was the heir.
>>336080898
Redgrave had a giant essay with his name on it.
>>336080730
I been wonder, which one was the guy who recently was exposed for stealing shit?
Vaati or EpicNameBro?
>>336080194
TOH answered some questions but gave us even more obscure shit, so you're probably right.
>>336080484
Teach me, Loremaster.
I could give a shit if it is or isn't the Duke's Archives, it's Reused Assets: The Game.
>Inafune
>Kamiya
>Miyamoto
>Miyazaki
>Nomura
>Obsidian
>Polacks
I wonder who'll get on the list of one hit wonders next?
>>336080630
But why isn't The Old Dragon Slayer Oldstein then?
Who is he?
It just doesn't make sense to look at it as a new person.
>>336080516
>Seath, as a dragon, was probably neutral to the Abyss.
He stole Manus' pendant, and imprisoned Oocliciale however you spell her name.
I think he had some relation to the abyss.
>>336081029
Vaati, which is why that was said in regards to Vaati.
>>336080986
this is the nameless king's spear
the statue depicts ornstein's spear
unless, of course, you are implying that the nameless king discarded his old dragon hunting gear in favor of his new spear and armor, I don't see your point :DD
>>336064358
>I can't be spoonfed by wiki or Vaati yet so there is no story
>>336068460
we need more lewd pickle pee pump a rum
>>336080685
Because he's a lord. The same reason the player character is needed despite not having previously linked the fire. The chronology, which is clearly stated, is
>lords link the fire in some order (alone), and become kindling as a result - obtaining the title of "Lord of Cinder"
>Lothric is next in line to link the flame, but decides not to
>the Lords of Cinder are awakened to link the fire in his stead, but because their souls have already been used as kindling they are far weaker and therefore the flame requires more than one
>they bail for some reason
>undead are awakened in order to seek out the lords, bring them together and link the fire
Lothric is needed for the ritual because he was specifically engineered to be powerful enough to link the fire, but for some reason was cursed and decided to end the cycle.
Yhorm is the cursed undead.
prove me wrong, protip: you can't.
>>336081241
Yhorm is weak to stormruler
CU isn't
Status: rekt
>>336081067
It's the Dark Souls equivalent of cosplay.
You mean to tell me you've never donned Artorias's gear and pretended to be the legend even once?
>>336081310
savage, man. you didn't even give him a chance
>>336081067
Because the Old Dragonslayers armor is darker and he uses dark instead of lightning.
Hes likely just some Copy cat.
>>336080396
Dark souls 1 makes it relatively clear that the beginning of the universe is more like the beginning of recorded time.
Like how there were 'hollows' already around to harness the first flame. And the world was formed but different.
>>336064203
would anyone gift me a ring of Favor?
>>336081382
THAT'S EVEN LESS LIKELY AND ABSURD
PLEASE TELL ME YOU'RE JUST FUNPOSTING
>>336081478
Why not just kill some crocs, steve.
>>336081478
just get the +1 version, its easier desu
>>336081049
>>336081049
>it's Reused Assets: The Game.
Well, that is true.
But the same can be said about countless others game series. Do you really think they would make the third game of a series and waste time making everything from scratch again?
>>336081230
Are we sure Ashen one isnt a Lord of Cinder?
We too were awoken by the Bell, and we know only Lords of cinder were (Hawkwood was awoken too, but he was an abyss watcher)
It never gives us any insight in our background, but Champs soul says something like he was defeated by a warrior or something.
Dark firelink has a lot of hints at it being in the past, which would make us likely that warrior that beat Champ. Which is also why Iudex Gundyr wouldnt have a soul.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6FsiX_xkjuQ
Who needs Vaati when Killan Experience releases an unexplicably good lore video
>>336078885
That is far less likely than it being the surviving piece of architecture of what was Anor Londo after the last bonfire was lit, by YOU in Dark Souls 1, which is why the Soul of Cinder is wearing a really fucked-up by heat over time of the default Elite Knight armour of the chosen undead from 1, who linked the last fire by killing Gwyn and all the other lords.
In the end, the chosen undead was just a mindless vessel for those lord souls to unite and reignite the fire.
Then the humans, which are now the majority of living creatures in the world, set about building all their various kingdoms and citadels, as they do, and have been doing each cycle, because each one of them holds the Dark Soul still, even though the other 3 lords souls are trapped in one place, being used to provide an endless cycle of fuel for their fire.
It's about humans conquering the world because they don't have a soul that can be captured by killing just one thing like with Gwyn and the others.
Theirs is spread out, everlasting.
>>336079095
>>336079571
>>336079873
>>336080426
Sorry for linking so many comments, but that got me thinking. Lord of cinder could be both a distorted version of the lord souls, but also a sign of how all the souls have sort of merged together. There are fragments of gwyn in each of the lords of cinder now because of how everyone who linked the flame has been using them.
After all, we thought we needed the lord souls to link the first flame, but only one of them ever really did that. We didnt though, we just needed gwyn.The lordvessel bullshit was to make sure we burnt more fuel than what we'd get from gwyns husk.
>>336081890
Not that guy, I honestly don't think it's important that it's the same archives. The important thing is the knowledge was re-assumed.
>>336081345
>>336081310
towards the end of Das2, the CU has the giant's kinship and many giant souls in his possession.
maybe he mutated into a a giant but kept his human skull.
Giants Kinship description:
>Each King has his rightful throne.
>And when he sits upon it, he sees what he chooses to see.
>Or perhaps, it is the throne, which shows the king only what he wants.
>The flames roar, but will soon begin to fade, and only a worthy heir might burnish their light. What is it, truly, a claimant of the throne could desire?
>>336064203
Anor londo is the only place in the game where 'lands converge' is actually the intact land (firelink shrine has been through some shit).
every other place is skewed and twisted through the process.
With the Crystal Sages being the re-embodiment of Logan's thirst for knowledge and his crystal madness, it's safe to assume that the grand archives with the crystal scroll is the converged Duke's Archive.
Just like it's safe to assume that the High Wall is the converged Undead Burg;
-Guarded by a dragon
-high above a lower location with burning pyres
-Has the same feel as a starting location, compared to DaS2's forest area
>>336081067
It's just another undead.
Or if you'd rather go for a more meta but less likely to be true explanation. It's a chosen undead that killed ornstein but never quite moved on to doing the rest of the shit.
>>336080219
It's not Ornstein at all. Ornstein has his spear, yes, possibly given to Ornstein by the person we KNOW is the statue: Gwyn's banished Son; the Nameless heir to Gwyn's kingdom.
>>336081049
>bitter dumb neo/v/ scum: the post
>>336082115
Those are a different type of giant. It's amazing that people still aren't realizing this. Lordran's giants are like Gough, the blacksmith, and Yhorm. They have faces. They're just like large people.
Drangleic's giants are like treants. They have tree hollow faces, and turn into trees when they die.
>>336080048
not this fucking shit again
ornstein died in 1, the one in 2 is also supposed to be the real one, its stupid, but it is what it is
REMINDER THAT WE HAVE NEVER ACTUALLY FOUGHT ORNSTIEN AND HE WOULD PROBABLY WRECK US EASILY
>>336068460
>Crowgirl drawn as a shitty monstergirl musume ripoff
>In a universe where Ornifex exists
Disgusting
>>336081640
>Are we sure Ashen one isnt a Lord of Cinder
No one is sure of anything, but it wouldn't make much sense. Your character is specifically stated to be "unkindled", and the Firekeeper says you are a vessel for souls that must be acquired to link the fire. If you were a lord you would probably just be sitting on the throne with Ludleth
>We too were awoken by the Bell
As an undead; that's what Iudex Gundyr is for. Iudex means judge, and Gundyr's armor says:
>Gundyr, or the Belated Champion, was bested by an unknown warrior. He then became sheath to a coiled sword in the hopes that someday, the first flame would be linked once more
So it follows that he's the gatekeeper for undead to see if they are powerful enough to link the fire (or in this case, to see the lords that are required to link the fire).
>>336082227
Dude shut the fuck up. Yhorm is clearly supposed to be a DS2 Giant. Him having a face is an oversight.
>>336082268
Ornstien never died in 1. It literally says in Smoughs armor that he left before CU showed up.
Ornstien in 1 was a Gwyn illusion.
>>336082182
>a person with
>the same title
>same ring
>same body but larger
>same moveset
>same weapon
>in a place very similar to AL
>>Nah can't be him
>It's a cosplayer
>it's a copy-cat
>It's a CU that killed him but for some mysterious reason just stopped his journey
alright /v/ you win.
>>336082227
>Lordran's giants are like Gough, the blacksmith, and Yhorm. They have faces.
Do they though? As far as I remember only Yhorm does not wear a mask.
>>336082345
>i have never seen a chain coif in my life
You see his face light up during the Siegward cutscene, and his skull has a face. It's not an oversight. Especially when both types of giants are in DaS3.
>>336082371
Or he died and came back like every other character does.
>>336082268
>ornstein died in 1
lol
>>336081640
Ashen one is't a lord of cinder, they're unkindled and they can't lit the fire by themselves, that's why we go around getting those cinders from those who can.
>>336081912
You needed more than Gwyn. Think about an actual fire and how it works. You can burn the kindling, which turns into charcoal. You can burn the charcoal, but then you're left with dust. Gwyn's soul was mostly consumed when he linked the fire, but the souls of Seath/4Kings/Nito/Witch were not. So they were needed to link the fire.
Same thing in DaS3 really, although the game suggests that the cycle is recurring more often and that linking the first is having less and less effect than it once did.
>>336081912
>After all, we thought we needed the lord souls to link the first flame, but only one of them ever really did that. We didnt though, we just needed gwyn.The lordvessel bullshit was to make sure we burnt more fuel than what we'd get from gwyns husk.
It's sort of stated on and off in the souls series, but sufficiently grand individuals can have their souls emulate their persona and personality and so forth making unique souls specific to them.
The Lord souls weren't special in that you need them because they were the "Lord Souls"- you needed them because like you said: they were the biggest souls currently KNOWN around at the time and therefor the most convenient to use.
They WANT the Lord souls again like you mention so that they may extend the age of fire even further since the more souls/humanity/whatever you have to burn in the flame the longer the age lasts.
Gwyn burned himself and only himself and his age of flame barely any time at all.
>>336081640
If we go by the linking the fire definition. Any character you finish the game with is a lord of cinder.Not sure about the different endings
If we go by potential to link the flame, you are a potential lord of cinder until you possess the souls of the other lords. At which point you are also a lord of cinder.
>>336082416
Why does he have dark magics?
I've always wondered that.
>>336082371
It doesn't "literally" say anything like that.
>>336082451
Gough was blinded, which should mean he has a face. Even if not, they're clearly different types of giants.
>>336081180
probably that, or gwyn took it when he banished him. there is not enough info but eh it sounds plausible. i doubt ornstein was a lord. why would he be the captain of the first borns
his armor even mentions :
>Golden (piece name) associated with Dragonslayer Ornstein, from the age of gods, and imbued with the strength of lightning.
In the dragonless age, this knight, who long guarded the ruined cathedral, left the land in search oftheir nameless king.
also :
considering Miyazaki also confimed that the God of War did not make an appearance in Dark Souls I.
He could very well be the first Knight of the Sun, and the Nameless King's favorite disciple. It does say on the Sunlight Medal description in DS that Gwyn's firstborn keeps a close eye on his Sunlight Warriors.
>>336081180
It wasn't Ornstein's spear first.
It was given to him.
He was a servant of the king, after all, and a friend to his son.
When banished, he left it with him to side with the dragons, and when he did, he got a new spear altogether. One that wasn't given to him by his father; a reminder of the man who banished him and cast down every image of him.
>>336064203
Need some help with Dragonslayers armor, anyone up?
Pass is RAGE
>>336082672
PLATFORM, LEVEL?
>>336082508
So why doesnt Ludleth just rekindle the fire? He is for it, knowing he will die again in the ritual.
I think all of the Lords of cinder needed the other 4.
>>336082774
Level doesn't matter if you're using a password.
>>336082609
Sidenote the nameless king is Faram from Das2
>The Nameless King, Gwyn's Firstborn, is Faraam, the god of war from Forossa, and the lion people from the Shaded Woods in DS2 worship him to Also, the Lion Knights of Forossa may have been Sunbros, and they built the Sunlight Altar you find in Harvest Valley while they were fighting for Drangleic.
Speaking of lore, I want dark drift so I'm continuing Yuria's quest but at the same time I don't like the hollowed look, is there a way to make me look human without healing the dark sigil?
>>336082791
Because he already did it once and his soul isn't strong enough anymore
>>336082560
Well actually, we never Link the flame. We try to and cant, hense why the moon stays a Darksign.
>>336082839
Buy the ring Yuria sells.
>>336082839
Yuria sells a ring that makes you look normal.
>>336082774
just outside of his door
>>336065551
>>336064203
both are literally right up the hill from Anor Londo
not sure how it doesn't stand to reason that Lothric could be where the Duke's was
>>336082464
I'm telling you if he had a face he wouldn't explicitly be called a giant. DS1 Giants don't have faces either, ever notice how they all have masks?
>>336082574
His body is larger too.
My best guess is either he tried to take on the Abyss and suffered the same fate as Arty. And then went to a place similar to AL to die.
Or some nefarious person brought him back to serve a purpose and again he wandered back to a familiar place.
>>336082791
Have you seen the state Ludleth is in? The guy can't even walk
>>336082870
Thats what I mean, all of them have done it, and likely dont have the strength to do it again. They all needed the other 4 to light it.
is it true that dark firelink is in the past?
I read that if you don't ever talk to the handmaiden in the normal shrine and you talk to the one in dark firelink the normal one will recognize you when you talk to her.
>>336082839
Buy the ring OR buy a purging stone
>>336083000
Its not like you cant force someone to link itAldrich
Or are you saying some of the LoC didnt link it?
>>336082961
And what about Hawkeye Gough, who has fucking eyes?
And why can Lordran giants speak, but Drangleic giants just fucking howl?
And why do Drangleic giants turn into trees when they die, but Lordran giants don't?
Because they're not the same kind of giants you dense motherfucker.
>>336082774
>>336082672
im on PC btw
>>336083071
Yeah, she gets a unique dialogue line if you do that.
>>336083103
Aldrich certainly didn't link it, Hawkwood says that he got the title by right and not by "virtue of linking the flame"
Unless Pontiff Sulyvahn forced him to do it, the absolute madman
>>336082672
God, I helped so many people fight that guy by now.
He is nice to farm some souls and its a fun boss battle.
>>336083328
>Hawkwood says that he got the title by right and not by "virtue of linking the flame"
He literally does not say that.
>>336083328
*by might
>>336083108
THEN WHY DID THEY MAKE IT A POINT TO CLARIFY HIM AS OLD.
BESIDES HIM AND GWYN THEY NEVER TOUCHED ON ORNSTEINS DRAGON SLAYER BUDDIES.
SO DID THE ABYSS JUST REANIMATE HIS ARMOR OR SOMETHING?
>>336083108
>And what about Hawkeye Gough, who has fucking eyes?
>And why can Lordran giants speak, but Drangleic giants just fucking howl?
>And why do Drangleic giants turn into trees when they die, but Lordran giants don't?
>Because they're not the same kind of giants you dense motherfucker.
Drangleic are "Hollowed" Giants- it's just how they go through hollowing.
They develop the darksign on their face, they become twisted and emaciated and eventually they truly for reals die and turn into trees.
Giants are descended from the huge fucking elder trees that support the world of dark souls and existed since the time of dragons and grey.
Humans came from the Pygmy.
Giants came from the trees.
>>336082416
>That guy in the dragonslayers armor who also has his ring because he killed him.
>Same moveset is because same weapon.
The similarity in locations isn't very strong either. But then we get to see so little of it.
But well, you could be right. At first I thought it was him, and I might as well just be wrong and not see it because of all the other people.
There's just one issue I have with that theory. The dark instead of lightning on his attacks.
We know that the knights of gwyn were of the gods. But gods weren't imbued with fragments of the dark soul.
If there's anything wrong in that assumption, then its probably ornstein reincarnated or something.
>>336083440
I meant to quote this guy, sorry >>336082950
>>336064203
>trailer for Das 3 says all will be revealed
What was exactly revealed in 3 that wasn't in 1?
If anything it added more unanswered questions like Ornstein apparently not dying from Chosen Undead and Smough being an honorary knight.
who convinced the princes to not link the fire?
The serpents or Aldia?or both?
Assuming untended graves is the future without the flame... What is the best ending -- link the fire or usurp the flame?
>>336083570
The Serpents, Aldia is nowhere to be seen in the story
>>336083412
He literally does say that he got the title soley by might.
>>336081701
he doesn't know why the Abyss watchers were killing each other.
They vowed to pledge their soul; the cinder soul split amongst them from drinking wolf's blood.
Essentially Sif's soul feels it's his duty to be cinder for the fire, he is Artorias' wolf and it's clear from Dark Souls 1 it's a dutiful beast.
So they're killing each other to pile the many fragment's of Sif's cinder-worthy soul into one place, then have it fight anyone who comes in to claim it - the best deciding mechanism anyone in Dark Souls has made to see if someone's worthy of actually -having- the soul to reignite the fire.
>>336083536
>Hollows have the mental capacity to sail to another country for revenge and wage organized warfare
Okay buddy
>>336083638
Aldia is mentioned by name in the Japanese version
>>336083328
Hawkwood meant that Aldrich didn't have to go on a little lord slaying adventure to link a fire, he was already a giant fucking soul bank from eating all those people.
>>336083582
Lord of Hollows
>>336083582
Untended Graves is the distant past.
But the best ending is the Usurpation of Fire, linking it you are probably giving the world a few centuries more at best, it's clear that the Flame can't go on much longer.
>>336083648
Yea, as opposed to doing it for the good of the world, he was either forced to do it because he was powerful, or did it because he thought it would make him more powerful.
Not sure how the fuck you got "he certainly didn't link it" out of that line
>>336082878
Now that's hilarious.
>>336064203
Can undead become pregnant?
They still bleed and there's lot of dung in the game
>>336082672
Anyone?
>>336083638
the game says that a SCHOLAR convinced them tho.
>>336083908
They're still dead m8, not sure how they can create life
>>336075674
Miyazaki created the souls games based off of his experience as a non-native english speaker reading english choose your own adventure books and not understanding half of what was going on.
There will never be an explanation.
>>336084012
>they are dead
Yes but their organs still seem to function and they still die from massive trauma
>>336083731
>Hollows have the mental capacity to sail to another country for revenge and wage organized warfare
>Okay buddy
Giant's have horrifically indomitable wills; it was even clearly stated by one npc in a Giant's memory that they had fought the giants for over 4 generations because they simply would not give up.
Giants don't lose their sanity or sense of purpose when they hollow because they don't fucking hollow the same way people do.
When they've finally had enough they truly "die" and turn into trees.
>>336083793
Well the fact they say they locked him in a room and made him a Lord of Cinder.
Who locked him in the room? Worshippers of the deep? Pontiff?
Anyone close to Aldrich DID NOT WANT THE FIRE LINKED. They wanted what Aldrich saw in his prophetic dreams, the Age of the Deep sea, which they thought followed the Age of fire.
How exactly did Aldrich link a fire when he was locked up? Thats like saying we could Link the fire from Undead Asylum in DS1
>>336083542
>then its probably ornstein reincarnated or something.
I could settle on that as I said earlier.
I think it's just too clear which is unusual for Souls which I can kind of see people assuming absurd before logical first.
Or even simpler could have just been fan-service.
Who fucking knows with FROM.
>>336084178
>Giants don't lose their sanity or sense of purpose when they hollow because they don't fucking hollow the same way people do.
>When they've finally had enough they truly "die" and turn into trees.
All this headcanon when it just makes more sense that there's more than one race called giants because they both happen to be huge as fuck.
>>336084187
>Well the fact they say they locked him in a room
They never say that either. Hawkwood only says that they "stuck" him in the cathedral
>>336084338
Either way, the point is why would Aldrich link the fire when his Dreams came before He was made a Lord of Cinder? He wanted the age of dark, just like Lothric did.
>>336084450
He was forced to link it
>>336084193
As long as it doesn't blatantly contradict anything, I don't think it really matters what you prefer to think of something as. It's equally valid as any of the other shit.
If your version is less retarded, it just makes a better story than what the other guy is telling.
>>336082182
It's Ornstein on his way from Anor Londo to go seek the Nameless King, and before you mention Archdrake's peak being just a hop and a skip from "Anor Londo" remember that the orientation and layout of Lothric is nothing like it's original state and is a result of the world converging on it.
>>336064203
>is there a reason people say Grand Archives is Duke's Archives?
yeah, coz Anor Londo is Anor Londo and Ithryall Dungeon is Latria and Firelink is Firelink is Nexus and skelly rolly ball is Sen's Fortress and Patches is Patches and blacksmith is blacksmith and ass-fucking bosses with toothpicks is ass-fucking bosses with toothpicks and intangible level geometry for enemies is intangible level geometry for enemies and Magneto attack tracking for enemies is Magneto attack tracking for enemies and...
Why were the Basilisks in Farron's Keep pushed off to one tiny corner?
Did they get bullied by the Bloodborne crew or something?
Or did FS just have a bigger plan for them and forget to follow through?
>>336084495
By who? Who forced him to link it? Pontiff and them are still alive.
Also where does it say they forced him to link it?
>>336084450
Because he either was forced to or because he thought it would make him more powerful
>>336071257
No it's not. You can't see Irithyll from Undead Settlement because it's underground.
>>336084506
How does dranglaic even fit into dark souls 3?
Geographically speaking.
There's mentions of some of the dark souls 2 stuff but most of the locations and cultures just seem like more from dark souls 1.
>>336084625
He's a lord of cinder, which means he linked it. It doesn't say that he was forced to, but considering you just said he didn't do it on his own volition that's the only logical conclusion
>>336084632
Literally every description about the Deep is the opposite of this statement.
Aldrich believed he would be a god, similer to gwyn if the fire went out. He would offer protecton to any of his worshippers.
>>336084785
Then he was forced to do it. Are you intentionally being retarded?
>>336084582
I figured they just liked living in the bumfuck slowest segment of the swamp.
Now why they're in that one corridor in the demon ruins is a fucking mystery.
Maybe they're just dark souls version of pests.
>>336084741
Is there an actual description that says a Lord of Cinder is someone who linked the fire or is this just some agreed upon assumption?
Because a lot of what is said about these Lords of cinders contridicts everything we known befor3 about Linking the fire.
![maxresdefault[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/Fsf2yTH.jpg "maxresdefault[1].jpg")
>>336084327
>All this headcanon when it just makes more sense that there's more than one race called giants because they both happen to be huge as fuck.
They went to a lot of trouble to make Yhorm look the way he does.
They could have done a million fucking things with him, but they purposefully made his head/face sunken into his chain-cowl, etc.. thingy.
Yes. I fucking know he still has his face- you can clearly see it in there; the point is though it's so dark, hidden and in his trailer and statue/figurine it looks very much like it's sunken in.
I dunno what the fuck to tell you.
It's an obvious tie in.
>>336084854
Again, by who?
Anyone close to Aldrich wanted the deep too.
And the fact Pontiff and the Archdeacons are all still alive tells me anyone who put up a fight, ended up dying.
![vjaFKLr[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/hLZqNym.jpg "vjaFKLr[1].jpg")
>>336080708
>>336081180
Sunlight Alter depicts a spear unlike Nameless King's or Ornstein's actually. Someone re-meshed the broken statue from Dark Souls, doesn't look like either.
not lore related but
>crystal sage
>every fucking summon is some fucking retard archer who literally sits there as a giant fucking soul spear sodomizes his tight boypussy
granted I'm not good enough to just do the fight myself but come the fuck on
>>336084908
>The cockroaches of DS
It fits, yeah I'll go with that.
>>336075674
which is completely intentional and supposed to add to the mysticism
>>336084909
Ludleth says it, and the entire game is predicated on the Lords of Cinder having previously linked the fire with the exception of Lothric. I'd recommend reading the fucking thread because this was discussed already and I doubt anyone feels like repeating themselves.
>contridicts everything we known befor3 about Linking the fire
It doesn't contradict shit. Lords are needed to link the fire. Lords who link the fire are known as Lords of Cinder. Same shit as in DaS minus the title
I just noticed that Lothric's throne in firelink shrine is literally the throne of want from DS2.
>>336084909
It's a title. Most people favor it as being someone who can and has linked the fire. Lothic being the exception.
Might just be a ceremonial title for those that possess fragments of the soul of gwyn, since it is his title.Same as how abyss watchers all also have a fragment of artorias in them.
pic related was just added to dlc as a dark spirit npc invader
give him a name and what does he drop?
>>336084625
Let's go by Hawkwood dialogue line by line
>A right and proper cleric, only, he developed a habit of devouring men.
>He ate so many that he bloated like a drowned pig, then softened into sludge,
It's clear here he got his form before becoming a LoC.
>so they stuck him in the Cathedral of the Deep.
>And they made him a Lord of Cinder. Not for virtue, but for might.
Now this part is where it gets complicated, it could have been the other clerics inside the cathedral(back when it was normal) who made him LoC in some attempt to kill Aldrich before he grew too powerful or his own followers made him do it so he could achieve "proper" godhood.
In some way or another he did link it, of all 5 Lords in the game only Lothric was the one who didn't link it.
>>336065551
>DS1
>Can see Duke's estate from Anor Londo
>DS3
>End up in Anor Londo
>Can see Lothic Castle
>King of said castle went crazy with crystal dragon research
Probably completely unrelated. Pontiff moved Anor Londo with his third eye that we'll get in the DLC
So they probably just moved the whole Londo city then.
>>336084854
>>336084632
Different Anon, but the idea that Aldritch was forced or tricked into linking the flame is pathetically fucking stupid:
-Don't you think something important like forcing a lord of cinder to light a flame would be documented? Some Stories? Maybe someone telling how difficult it was to do? There's no mention of it- none.
-How even would he do it for that matter? He has no fucking limbs.
Aldritch didn't link a fire.
He's selfish, he eats people, he wallows in the suffering of others- he was going to eat the gods, the very people who want most the cycle of fire to continue.
>>336085156
He doesn't say it. Nobody says it.
the lore master has spoken
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nz8KJYpRh28
