Isometric > all else
True
Why is this so grainy?
>>334536783
>what's behind this wall?
>oh well can't see anything
>do I press right to go down, or down to go left?
there's validity to this. if dev companies weren't so focused on making the latest, sleekest, sexiest graphics we might actually have some fun games.
isometric graphics does not kill immersion.
Mm hm.
>>334536783
Fucking hate people like you.
All those old games I used to love are shit now. Isometric isn't cool, it's fucking 2D.
>>334536783
There hasn't been a good isometric game in over 15 years.
full 3D camera>cuck view decied by cuck artist
Memes appart iso was good at the time but nowadays there is no reason to unless you're some sort of indie cuck feel the bern ebin retro gamer guy.
>>334536783
Is that desperados? I love that game
>tfw I used to draw ismetric ww2 pictures
Fun as fuck
>>334537008
2000 game, low res
Fine. But isometric racing games are a joke.
>>334537053
Provided you use the work hours saved to make a good game and not just deliver a visual novel with crappy interface and awful, awful combat stitched on.
Isometric is garbage and it's a blessing that technology advanced so that this deprecated perspective could die.
>>334537738
this x1000000000
Megaman Battle Network was the best isometric game.
>>334537738
>implying games that used to be isometric that are now 3rd or 1st person view are somehow better i.e. fallout and warcraft.
Surely you jest.
>>334537961
I didn't say anything like that, and I espeicially didn't say Warcraft was isometric because that's never been true.
>>334537961
They sure as hell weren't better because of the 1990s graphical limitations.
ASCII > All else
>>334537208
That Metro-Fallout ripoff is pretty damn good. I forgot it's name though.
>>334538131
Did you really say that war craft isn't isometric? Are you having a stroke?
>>334538272
>graphics make a game
Wanna know how I know you're under 30?
>>334538549
Warcraft 3 and FT are the best ones so it doesn't really matter.
Fallout is debatable.
>>334538549
Har har, you trick me, I respond, many laughs had
>>334538709
That's not what he's saying dumbshit
Retro 2D Games>3D Games>Isometric games>Indie 2D Games>3D MMO Games
Why is 90s sim city so comfy bros?
That isn't isometric you fuck.
As much hate as Diablo 3 gets, I give them credit for leaving it isometric and not selling out to the man.
>>334539157
>tfw Sim City and most 90s Sims was actually babies first modding
My how those comfy times has long past for PC gaming.
>>334539252
Certified auto CAD designer here. Yes it is.
>>334539320
does it really count if it's 3d with perspective?
>>334539252
explain
>>334539593
>>334538549
The fuck are you on about
>>334538532
underrail
>>334539702
Should have known not to try to debate with autism. You're arguing semantics.
>>334539702
"Isometric projection is a method for visually representing three-dimensional objects in two dimensions in technical and engineering drawings"
R U OKAY?
>>334536783
agreed
first 2 SWAT games are isometric GOAT
As shitty as isometric graphics were to non-RPGs, they did make MMOs 10x better.
What's the point of top-notch graphics if the gameplay you're going to invest months into is utter dogshit?
![armymen1_screenshot2[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/P8PpAz3.jpg "armymen1_screenshot2[1].jpg")
Don't mind me, just posting the best every Army Men game.
>tfw iso games are literally in line for extinction
How do you cope bros?
>>334539621
I don't know, it's as close to isometric as it gets these days I guess. You could argue it's top down perspective, but it makes me nostalgic for the old days.
>>334539987
>Proved wrong
>Y-you are autistic
Your tears are delicious
>>334541382
>5° makes me right and him wrong.
Angle tolerances depend on the artist. Most prints have a +or - tolerance of give or take 5 to 10 degrees. If you want to be a smart ass, I'll treat you like one. OPs pic is 100% acceptable as an isometric view.
>>334542052
The difference between isometric and trimetric is not 10 degrees
Why does Isometric tirgger casual normies and underage so much? Is it because it's not "immersive" enough?
>not liking the experience of exploring the world in First Person Perspective
why do you hate immersion and detail so much, OP?
>>334544085
>Is it because it's not "immersive" enough?
Pretty much see >>334544131 and other faggots like him
Wasn't Final Fantasy VII isometric?
>>334544191
First Person is more immersive than isometric
Third Person is better for quick action games with colorful moves
Isometric Perspective is for construction and the military
>>334544131
>Not wanting to try something that ISN'T first-person for the first time in your currently short life
>>334544280
I think the perspective changed based on what map you were on. But it's been a very fucking long time since I've played that game.
>>334544384
>MUH IMMURSHUN
Gameplay > immersion
Also a game doesn't HAVE to be first-person to be immersive, there's a thing called 'subtlety'.
>>334537208
Transistor was fun.
>>334536783
Are all of you fucking retarded? OP's picture isn't an isometric game.
>>334544395
I have played some "old" isometric games like Baldur Gate, Torment, Commandos, Jagged Alliance 2, XCOM, etc
dude, old games (before 2000 and 2001-2005) suffered from horrible controls. the standardization of controls and better ergonomics makes modern games more playable
I like games like Skyrim more nowadays, because I feel they are more immersive. I am still waiting for my Baldur Gate 3 with Skyrim style and graphics
>>334544775
Burn in hell. Heretek
>>334544775
>I like games like Skyrim more nowadays, because I feel they are more immersive
But the gameplay is absolute shit.
>>334544475
I said more immersive, not that isometric wasn't immersive
it's easier to give more emotion and the act of desperation when an enemy is hitting you with an axe in first person than in a isometric view
>>334544775
Now you're just baiting.
>>334544904
Gameplay > immersion
>>334544887
nope, controls are fine, intuitive and easy to grasp.
try to play Wizardry 8, or Heretic/Hexen 1, or even Daggerfall, THAT is awful control
but at that time, developers didn't give a shit about it because the industry was new and growing. Now they have realize that controls and ergonomics are important part of a game (for some people it could break the full experience)
>>334545136
>nope, controls are fine, intuitive and easy to grasp.
Controls aren't gameplay. It doesn't matter how well a game control is the GAMEPLAY is shit.
>>334536783
Trimetric is superior. It is much clearer which direction is "up" and which is "side" on a trimetric grid, and with trimetric objects. The difficulty is that every object needs to be drawn twice as many times as with an isometric or dimetric vantage point, since a left-facing object is no longer a mirror image of a right-facing one.
>>334544953
>makes a different opinion
>must be trolling
typical /v/. With that logic, Souls series should be the best games in the world
>>334544775
>I am still waiting for my Baldur Gate 3 with Skyrim style and graphics
BG2 was an anomaly even at the time. There was no other game even on the same scale of varied content at the time it came out. There will never be another, let alone one in first person.
>>334545295
wat
>>334544981
gameplay AND immersion >>>>>>>> gameplay alone
but tell me, what do you think is gameplay? give me your definition (not wikipedia please)
>>334545234
tell me about a game with great, perfect controls and shitty gameplay
>>334545539
Your example was Skyrim, but that doesn't work anyway because controls and gameplay were both shit.
>perfect controls and shitty gameplay
Overwatch. Feels great to play, I really like the movement, but the gameplay is shallow as a puddle of piss.
>>334540998
Playing the few ones that still get made.
>>334536783
Depends on the genre, execution,etc.
I like isometric, but I don't want a VTMB sequel to be isometric.
Hng.
>>334546034
>>334546119
Okay, you have my interest. What kind of game is this?
>Fallout will never have as much freedom in it's role-playing mechanics as 1 and 2 again
>>334546212
I envy the person who will play this series for the first time.
>>334546034
>>334546119
>>334546285
Man, you brought back so many memories. One of my favorites games ever. Shit, look at those designs. Does the game run on Windows 7, are there mods or something?
>>334546212
Commandos 2
>>334546285
>>334546749
So, real time team based, what, strategy? Stealth? Action?
Looks fascinating though. I'll probably pick up the first game.
1. Third person - you can see your body and move around objects in 360 degree circle
2. First person - you can see some parts of your body at best and move around objects in 360 degree circle
3. Isometric - you can't move around objects and you can't see walls opposing slope of the screen
4. Overhead - you can't move around objects and you can't see their sides
5. 2D - you can only see a shallow relief of reality
nah, I like turning the camera around
>>334546934
Simplistic stealth game
Think of MGS Virtual Ops but without movesets or meaningful AI.
Isometric might look nice at first but then you realize it's all brown and boring medieval western shit devoid of color and trying too hard to be realistic in an entirely unrealistic camera angle that also hinders and limits gameplay
>>334536783
Come on OP, isometric view is fine for a lot of things. But I wouldn't play an isometric racing or fighting game. Not only those genres, but I find that action adventure games such as Dark Souls and Dragon's Dogma benefit from the third person camera, as do games like Metal Gear Rising. I'm not saying that an isometric Dark Souls game wouldn't be great, as long as they kept in all the great animations and the large moveset variety, but I don't believe there would be anything the isometric view would add to make me enjoy the game more. If anything, it would ruin surprises and make stealth in multi-player useless.
>>334546749
It's on steam, and yeah it works fine even on win 10
>>334546984
What about an isometric view with a rotatable camera? It's 2016 after all.
>>334547437
If you've ever played NWN2 you'd know that causes as many problems as it solves. You end up needing to constantly turn the camera to interact with things that are hidden from one viewpoint. The only time it works well is when in very open areas, which are where your viewpoint doesn't matter anyway.
Alright tier
>everything not detailed below
Come on son tier
>near perspective camera (first person, over the shoulder) with <90 fov
>far away perspective camera (faux isometric, faux top down) with >15 fov
Shit tier
>oblique - military (ultima online)
>oblique - topdown (tibia)
>Pre-rendered art
Not as impressive as dynamic isometric graphics
>>334549362
(You)
>>334539987
>You're arguing semantics.
yes he's arguing about the meaning of isometric because that's what the argument was about
>>334549436
Why type (You) when replying to me already gives me a (You)? That's redundant.
>>334539310
I fucking hate plebians
I can't help but feel that isometric graphics were just something that was needed for a time when hardware simply couldn't render 3D properly, along with things such as prerendered backgrounds. Now that even cellphones can easily render 3D worlds, there's no need to use isometric perspective, the lack of camera control and loss of vertical space aren't worth it.
Strategy and Builder games such as The Sims and Roller Coaster Tycoon do this Genre well, and Hack-N-Slashes like Bastion do too. Adventure games that are not turned based do not fit isometric well.
>>334549579
It's a meme, you dip.
>Isometric game
>You can rotate the camera around
>No pre-rendered backgrounds
What's the fucking point, then?
>>334537418
Are you me? My school books were full of them, across multiple pages.
I love the Isometric building/environments, but I can't stand the often flat looking units. Any games that mix the best of Isometric and 3d?
>>334539702
there's always an autist that posts this on every single isometric discussion
how pathetic it is to feel good about correcting people over this meaningless technicality
>>334539310
i threw up a little
>>334545695
is flame in the flood good?
>>334550080
doesn't make it any less retarded.
>>334544085
-Walls covering up details, enemies, items
-The general ugliness of any tall objects in the game world; either they take up huge areas, or get cut down and thus aren't depicted correctly
-Many times without careful design, areas are visual clusterfucks where most of the screen is useless cosmetics with small areas of usability
-Absolutely awful in any sort of real-time game; especially any platforming or multi-level action; it's very difficult to make vertical levels clear in isometic
>>334539786
Brilliant.
after reading this thread I'm really becoming convinced isometric is the way to indie dev NEETbuck happiness.
how about this: the camera is generally more zoomed in then normal, giving your character and the immediate surroundings more detail. narrow "roads" or paths between large buildings are limited so you rarely get lost, and if when you are behind a building you can see your character Left4Dead style as a blue highlight.
Does /v/ think isometrics could have a little comeback?
I could really go for a new Robin Hood game, or Commandoes in general.
Dumb question, but are all RTS games isometric or top down?
>>334556926
most of them zoom in and have a movable camera so prob top-down
>>334556375
Indies already can't be arsed to do proper art for their game, so how would an isometric view fix that?
>>334556375
no because >>334549918
Unlike 2D, where there's a gameplay difference compared to 3D, isometric games were 2D games trying to pass as 3D, and were used due to technical limitations of their time
One of my favorite games, Little Big Adventure 2 used isometric indoors and outdoors it's a full 3D rendered environment. it's way easier to aim and do stuff in it when outdoors than isometric. If there's ever a 3rd game, it should go full 3D no doubts about it, isometric has drawbacks.
>>334539252
do you even know what isometric is?
>>334557408
I'm guessing that since isometric graphics had some pretty cool looking stuff back in 2000 it's just a lot easier to do. making complex and good looking 3d models and animations is super time consuming.
>>334557453
of course it has drawbacks but clearly some strengths in easiness to obtain good and clean looking graphics. its clearly an upgrade from pixelated sprite bullshit.
>>334557852
they don't create pixelated bullshit because they like it, it's because they lack talent/manpower to do something pretty, so you can't just say "now make an isometric game", that's not what happens
>>334538532
Wasteland 2?
>>334558004
UnderRail, and its actually really good
>>334536783
We need more game like this.
>>334557989
People really underestimate the amount of man hours that goes into the art side of proper game development, especially AAA games.
>>334558291
Game? I just build my 1st gaming PC and im building a list of isometric games, i just love them so much
>>334557453
There are isometric games still being made. The idea that the perspective was only used because of technical limitations is idiotic.
>>334546034
>>334558397
Okay, for any kind of real time game yes it was due to technical limitations, while it's acceptable for turn based stuff
>isometric game with platforming elements
>floating blocks
>>334558946
I never realized arcanum was made the way it was due to technical limitations
![pax2015_minibooth_brigador06[1].png](https://i.imgur.com/1hfcezp.jpg "pax2015_minibooth_brigador06[1].png")
Did you guys not hear about Brigador?
>>334559030
Might see a return of isometric viewpoints with VR gaming since it solves all of those problems, plus freedom of looking around.
Hey guys whats the difference between isometric and top down games. Stupid question i know, but :p
>>334560727
perspective
>>334560884
thats just what you think
>>334537418
Care to share any?
>>334556375
You could just make a small bubble of transparency around the character, as such.
https://youtu.be/NLeYTPUesnM?t=10m8s
>>334559030
>Isometric game with platforming elements
>There's one scripted moment in the game to find a secret, and if you miss the jump, your game is forever incomplete.
Guess the game.
>>334536783
is this loss
>>334546934
Commandos? Holy shit are you in for a treat.
>>334546934
Keep in mind Commandos 1 is a bit aged (possibly has issues on modern OS?), and the sequel greatly improved upon it.
>>334537026
>>what's behind this wall?
>>oh well can't see anything
Good isometric games have all four perspectives.
RH: Legends of Sherwood, Commandos,...
>>334563915
but what's the advantage of that over a 3D rendered environment?
>>334564128
As mentioned up awhile ago, processing requirements back in the days of vid cards not having more than 32mb of vram.
It would have been faster to have done it all in 3d though if the hardware at the time was feasible, since they had to model out the environment in 3d regardless to lay collision boundaries and pathfinding.
>>334564128
Infinite possible detail.
Arguably, it scales rather logarithmically in terms of computer power. but back in the days of 400 MHz Pentiums?
No contest.
>>334564269
>>334564291
so what's the advantage of still doing it today?
>>334565162
Nostalgia.
>>334565162
Depends on the genre, but in general it's either a budget thing (3d is more expensive in general) or targeted platform. Isometric 2d still does well on handheld devices.
>>334565926
>Isometric 2d still does well on handheld devices.
but then that's again because of the ancient hardware that they have that limits what devs can do
>>334556926
Most 3D RTS games are perspective.
2D is a mix of top down and isometric. For example, StarCraft is mechanically top down but the graphics are isometric.
