This has the best dungeons and combat in the series.
And no, TP did not have better dungeons.
>>333434104
But OoT certainly did.
TP had better dungeons
I loved the dungeons and most of the bosses in SS. Waggle combat sucks many a dick tho.
>>333434104
The Ancient Cistern and the 2 Desert temples were good, but the rest were pretty average. Twilight Princess has consistently great dungeons like Goron Mines, Snowpeak Ruins and Arbiter's Grounds. Even OoT has better dungeons once you become Adult Link.
As for combat, maybe. 3D Zelda games have never had particularly good combat. OoT and MM combat was rough around the edges. Wind Waker might be the most smooth and satisfying, but it is very simplistic. Twilight Princess COULD'VE been the best, but it makes most of the moves optional, so the game can never assume you have any techniques outside of the basic ones you start the game with. Skyward Sword feels good most of the time, but enemies have the uncanny ability to predict where you sword is going to go which feels cheap.
>>333434104
>best dungeons
Literally 20 minute linear dungeons for pre schoolers
>>333434104
best overworld: Wind Waker
best dungeon: TP
best items: TP
best combat: zelda has shitty combat
>>333435456
I'd say TP wins the most items contest, but not the best. I feel like you'd pick up something like the spinner and use it for one dungeon, then never think about it again.
>>333434104
Truth be told, all the best dungeons come from the 2D games. Because of the multi floor designs.
Twilight Princess is the worst video game ever made.
>>333434104
It had like 2 or 3 good dungeons
TP had like 2 or 3 good dungeons
They're pretty even in that regard
>>333434104
Epick bread newfriend.
>>333436056
TP had good nothing.
Two dungeons. It had two dungeons that were salvaged entirely by a single neat gimmick that both happened to share. That's all it had. Ancient Cistern was not that good of a dungeon, it just had nice visuals.
>>333435456
> best overworld: Wind Waker
> shitty ocean filled with next to nothing
Opinion discarded.
>>333435456
Best overworld would have to go to one of the 2D games. They're the ones with the best size-to-content ratios and actually succeed at feeling explorable.
>>333434104
I agree on combat. Dunno about dungeons though, TP's were pretty darn good.
I'm sad we probably won't have motion sword combat for Zelda U.
I'm going to make a chart to show you how wrong I feel you are.
>>333434104
>This has the best dungeons and combat in the series.
No it doesn't. All the dungeons were fucking garbage.
>>333435456
>best overworld: Wind Waker
>>333440080
Nah.
>liking baby mode linear trash
>liking waiting simulators: combat edition
>>333435456
>best dungeons: TP
>take the same structure and reskin it eight times senpai
>These are the three best overworld maps in the Legend of Zelda series
>>333434104
It was better than Twilight Princess in every way. But that doesn't mean it was the best in the series. I'd rather play any of the 2D Zeldas over this.
>>333434104
only the last 3 dungeons were good
>>333440584
Sorry, but no overworld from a 3D Zelda is comparable to those from 2D Zeldas. ALTTP/ALBW and LA have the best overworlds by a mile.
>>333440824
So why is it acceptable to say things like Skyward Sword has the best dungeon design and combat when games like this exist?
>>333441145
Just a random tour through the temple? Could have spend more bytes for better quality.
>>333441145
Because the Zelda fanbase is equivalent to Final Fantasy. And their first game is their favorite.
I genuinely have trouble thinking of a single thing SS does that another Zelda hasn't done better.
>>333441145
>OoT
>better combat than SS
At least say MM if you really want to argue the N64 Zeldas had the best combat despite the clunkiness of their controls relative to later 3D Zeldas. WW and TP were similar but a lot more fluids and with cool additions (even if all of TP's techniques were pretty much pointless), while SS required precision and timing instead of the strafing and button mashing fest it had been until then.
>>333441637
Yeah but the puzzles were mindless and often discouraging.
Are you forgetting Ancient Cistern and Lanaryu Temple?
>>333434998
>ss
>waggle combat
>many a dick
Indeed, good sir!
>>333434104
Wow! You sure convinced me with those hot opinons!
>>333441637
SS combat feels like it fell into the same hole TP's did: There was potential that Nintendo simply wasn't willing to tap because they wanted to keep the game as simple as possible.
Most enemies could just be easily dispatched with parrying because the window on it lasts a goddamn century, and it even nullifies shield damage to boot.
>>333441761
I don't get what you mean. I never felt any puzzle in SS was discouraging, especially since they got rid of enemy kill room locks (except for a few instances) and block pushing/torch lighting puzzles (entirely). Now those were mindless.
>>333441997
It did to a degree, but at least you couldn't get through 90% of the fights by walking up to the enemy and hacking away with impunity like in TP. Parrying took a modicum of timing and had negative consequences for failing, while in TP the shield was always up while L-targeting.
>>333434104
TP was better, but TP was also shit. Not as shit as SS, but still pretty bad
>>333435456
>best overworld: Wind Waker
>making a category not count rather than admit SS did something well
You can be as butthurt as you want about TP's dungeons being better than SS's but that doesn't make it any less true.
>>333442027
Yeah they were discouraging all the time. From the Ancient Cistern to the Forest Temple, all the way down to the Triforce Trials, none of the puzzles actually challenged you to think or solve anything critical. The whole thing was laid out for you like a box of megablocks, and all the player had to do was listen to the prompts.
At least in Majora's Mask, the puzzles are fun, they require some insight, some ability to reason and an awareness of the infrastructure. In Wind Waker they double up on that, no experience is as rewarding as Dragon Roost Island or Earth/Wind Temple.
But in Skyward Sword, it's like they just added a lot of dungeons gutted the whole thing dry of any substance.
If I could emulate the game with any success I'd be showing all my problems with the dungeon design. The combat is great though, 1:1 controls were definitely fun to use,
>>333440359
>liking waiting simulators: combat edition
Stop posting Arin, you're drunk.
>>333441521
-Link can run.
-The beetle makes boomerangs obsolete. It's far more versatile, and expands the scope of potential dungeon designs.
-Falling with the sailcloth opens more potential.
-Rolling bombs opens more potential.
-Upgrading your items and expanding equipment slots was a nice little addition.
-Potions requiring upgrade to enhance their usefulness.
-Both the potion and item upgrades gave purpose to collecting trinkets.(the problem was that some items were too abundant.)
-Fully orchestrated music.
-Character expressions were better animated.
And that's all I can't think of at the moment.
>>333442425
>BETTER WALK DOWN THE MOUNTAIN TO THE FOREST BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW HOW TO GET BOMBS OFF THE WALLS GUIZ.
>>333442482
Critically, we endured 25 years of Zelda for features that could have had foundation in a handheld title, or even worse, at an earlier time.
>>333435456
OoT had better dungeons because most items, not all, had their use in dungeons afterwards instead of just having use in one dungeon.
>>333434104
>And combat
>Can't even move forward while swinging
HAHAHAHAHA
>>333442361
I don't get it, but okay, I respect your opinion. I do agree that MM's dungeons require more complex thinking, but not really WW's. Those were pretty simple, even with the ability to switch control to a second character (especially the Wind Temple since Makar was captive for 80% of the dungeon).
>>333440584
I think you meant to post Link to the Past, Link's Awakening and Oracles.
>>333442482
Too bad all that was ruined by Aonuma making the game focus on 10 hours of dialogue and cutscenes.
>>333442178
I suppose. I still don't think it says much that the combat is better than TP when TP's combat was already some of the most mindless in the series. Better than terrible isn't really good.
And honestly I think TP had more potential with its numerous combat techniques. If it had actually forced you to utilize those and change things up, TP's combat would have been far and away the best in the whole series. Attacking from many directions seems neat but I think just having a bunch of techniques could have more applications.
>>333442663
Much like everything else that Twilight Princess did with combat, it was all fucking useless. Moving will slashing was good for...cutting grass?
>>333442723
In the Wind Temple, you use altitude and reasoning to get past most of the puzzles. Earth Temple gives you the mirror shield and you do far more light bending than you ever would in Majora's Mask.
>people forcing the SS was good meme just so the zelda cicle can be true
>>333442482
Good list and a lot of those are why I like as SS as much as I do, but the Deku Leaf was better than the Sailcloth. Though I guess having to account for the player being able to glide everywhere could be tedious to design, especially with the overworld how it is in SS.
>>333443038
They're all still pretty meager compared to OoT and MM, but at least it did some things right. We can't be unfair in judging content.
Shield Mechanics?
>>333442482
I think the potential on most of these squandered, though. Upgrading items could have been great if the items ever needed any upgrading. The only upgrade I was happy to get was the one that made the beetle move faster than a snail.
>>333443197
In Twilight Princess, Wind Waker and lots of 2D iterations.
>>333442640
Hm? Pretty sure half of the things I listed would only work in 3D.
As far as when features could have possibly been implemented: I think the series started stagnating right around Wind Waker. Maybe close to Twilight Princess.
>>333443060
>but the Deku Leaf was better than the Sailcloth.
Yeah, I just remembered that after I posted. Yo're right.
Skyward Sword's overworld should have been 1:1 connected to the skyworld. They dropped the ball on that one.
>>333442898
Moving while slashing was also actively hindered by the game since as soon as you hit an enemy once with a running slash, Link would stop and force you into regular slashes.
>>333443291
If it was a WiiU game, it probably would have been.
Skyward Sword's surface (Faron Woods, Eldin Volcano, Lanayru Desert) makes up some of the best overworlds in 3D Zelda.
However, the sky is Skyward Sword is what prevents the overworld from being great. Instead of having tons of massive islands with dungeons or other towns like Skyloft, you have tiny rocks with treasure chests on them. And only a few interesting islands.
Twilight Princess and Majora's Mask have the best dungeons in 3D Zelda.
Skyward Sword and Wind Waker have the worst.
>>333443291
That's bad bait. A lot of those features aren't predicated by 3 dimensional gameplay.
>>333443291
>>but the Deku Leaf was better than the Sailcloth.
>Yeah, I just remembered that after I posted. Yo're right.
Zelda U's sailcloth looks like it works similar to the Deku Leaf but without wind/magic (although that was alpha footage from a year and a half ago, so who knows how it works now?). I wonder if they'll take full advantage of it and create hidden places in the world you can only reach by gliding from a nearby higher altitude.
>>333442482
The problem with the Beetle is it's too damn slow. With a boomerang, you target the thing you want to hit or get and it comes back in a couple of seconds.
The sailcloth is literally just a downgraded Deku Leaf. I'm glad Zelda U is actually letting us move with it.
Other than those points, Skyward Sword had a lot of good stuff. Dashing, real-time potion drinking, and upgrades are great, limiting the items to 8 let them get used a lot more.
And there were little things, like Link FINALLY dies in the position he lands when you run out of hearts. There are unique death animations for when a strong attack knocks you forward or on your back, unlike every other game where he picks himself off the ground and then realizes he died.
I hope Zelda U will keep most of those improvements.
>>333443221
an upgraded bow can do some serious damage. And an upgraded goddess shield is almost like having the Hylian shield. And an upgraded quiver makes sure you don't run out of arrows quickly. I agree, upgrading could be more useful though. Perhaps if they made hero mode's carrying items cut in half, then the player would direly need to upgrade.
Why do people praise this game so much?
>>333443468
>implying the Ancient Cistern and Lanayru Mining Facility aren't amazing dungeons
>>333443291
>Skyward Sword's overworld should have been 1:1 connected to the skyworld. They dropped the ball on that one.
Yeah but that's 100% the hardware, and on top of that it'd be an area much larger than any of the previous 3D 'rooms' that make up your fields, forests, etc. I don't think that's really a realistic expectation give how big a jump it would have been from the capabilities of previous games. WW made sailing slow as shit to accommodate something like that and I'd never want travel that slow ever again.
>>333443636
It fixed all the most blatant problems with the original that wouldn't require adding a significant amount of content to the game.
>>333443636
The HD port or Wind Waker itself? The HD port made plenty quality-of-life changes that gave you a better experience.
>>333443518
Technically, all those things could "work" in 2D. But would they work "well", in 2D. That's what I'm basing my opinion on. I don't think the beetle and bomb rolling and sailcloth falling, and character expressions work in 2D.
Especially considering what games these features could have been feature in, in the past. I don't think you could have featured fully orchestrated music in the handheld games, until perhaps the DS, or 3DS. And the resolution on those games are so small, that you can't capture the expression on character's faces very well.
>>333443567
>With a boomerang, you target the thing you want to hit or get and it comes back in a couple of seconds.
That's what the hookshot is good for.
>The sailcloth is literally just a downgraded Deku Leaf. I'm glad Zelda U is actually letting us move with it.
Yes, I realized that only after posting.
>>333443468
>Skyward Sword's surface (Faron Woods, Eldin Volcano, Lanayru Desert) makes up some of the best overworlds in 3D Zelda.
No, Lanayru is great for how much new content it has, but Faron Woods and Eldin Volcano drag the game's environments as a whole down into a pit of tedium. They're fine on your first go-through, but the game reuses them so many times, and Eldin Volcano especially is such a slog to move around in, they I actively started despising the game when they made me go back to it for a third plot reason.
Why do people praise this game so much?
>>333443197
SS did so much right with shields.
Them degrading, the upgrading, how your 1st shield was useful again after you got the 2nd, improved bashing/parry mechanics, and how the shield was more like a stance you change into than a quick interchange with the sword were all great additions to Zelda.
>>333444168
Parry mechanics were overpowered and rendered the rest of the shield mechanics moot, though. Feels like they understood there was a problem with people sitting behind shields all the time and tried to fix it but just wound up creating a whole new problem.
Yes it did
>>333435785
On the other hand the bow, wind boomerang, claw shot, and iron boots almost never stop seeing use. The spinner and dominion rod were sadly short lobes. The dominion rod had 3 dungeons left and a very particular feature but I agree that the spinner could've seen more use. But only the spinner seemed neglected beyond reason. With that in mind like you said the game gave us a shit ton of items. Its not so unreasonable that one got the short end of the stick. Just aicks it was one of the new, cool items
>>333444106
I haven't seen as much praise for TPHD as there was for WWHD. The graphical update is much less noticeable and they didn't fix as many issues. I don't get why they fuck they didn't add a way to change the time of the day since it's vital for most Poe souls and the day-night cycle lasts a long time compared to previous games (barring MM). They didn't even need to add a new item for it, just make it like SS where sleeping in a bed (or sitting on a bench since there aren't nearly as many beds in TP) changes the time from day to night and viceversa.
>>333443840
>It fixed all the most blatant problems with the original
The HD remake didn't fix the slow dialogue, bad dungeons and having to take pictures to get trophies made.
>>333443991
>Technically, all those things could "work" in 2D. But would they work "well",
yeah they would. If you remember Skyward Sword was an homage to the last 25 years of Zelda history, and it failed to bring anything reasonably new to the table because it was paying so many old games respect.
>>333444437
*short lives*
I should try not to post from my phone
>>333444364
Overpowered how? It really only contributes to insta-death for bokoblins and lizolfos and those are always easy enemies to kill in Zelda.
>>333444437
The Slingshot too somehow became useless immediately after the first dungeon before you even got the bow in the second.
>>333443751
>Yeah but that's 100% the hardware
That's not true at all. There are tricks to disguise loading. Other games featured large maps with seamless loading on lesser hardware.
One way to hide loading, would be to make the clouds an ambiguous zone. So when you're sailing down, you can see nothing but clods, for as long as it's required for the map to load. Then of course, when the lower map is loaded, the clouds disappear, except for the layer in the sky that blocks out the view of the upper skyworld. And then of course as you make your dissent, all of the thick cloud cover slowly disappears into the normal sky.
If the game doesn't want you landing anywhere that would put you out of zones, then they could use wind to push you out of zones.
And if you try to be cheeky by strategically removing the sail cloth at a certain height, then the game insta "kills" you. penalizing you with one heart, and hard loading you back up to the point you emerged from the clouds, with sail cloth in hand.
Of course, once you've found a bird statue, then you could use that to fast travel to that drop point.
>>333444597
>slow dialogue
Okay, though I never found it that slow.
>bad dungeons
I said "problems that wouldn't require adding significant amount of content to the game". Changing level design is adding lots of content.
>and having to take pictures to get trophies made.
Did you want them handed to you for cash like in MC? Increasing the limit to 12, giving you the Deluxe Pictograph immediately, letting you give all your pictures at the same time and getting them developed in a single day were all the improvements the sidequest needed.
>>333444664
Timing on it is incredibly lenient so it takes next to no skill to use, deals zero damage to the shield, and gives you a free kill on whatever enemy you just used it on. It's basically always preferable over a standard block.
>>333434253
/thread
>>333444997
Oh, and the most important one along with the increased photo limit, letting you know if a photo will be accepted the moment you take it.
>>333445096
QFT and SIGNED
>>333444604
What does the mechanics of the beetle in 3D, versus the mechanics of the beetle in 2D have anything to do with SS "pay homage"?
Also, SS tried to do a lot of new stuff. Much of which I've already listed.
>>333438417
I've played and actually enjoyed SS multiple times despite its flaws.
Anyway I haven't the foggiest what you're talking about.
>>333444091
Faron Woods and Eldin Volcano both have new accessible areas when you revisit them. The backtracking and revisiting is mostly a game design problem. Not a level/overworld design problem.
>>333444106
>>333444582
Wind Waker HD had so many more improvements it's not even funny.
You were able to walk with the left stick and aim with the right or gyroscope, which you can't do in TPHD.
If you were changing your items in real time in WWHD, you could look back up at the action as soon as you started to drag the item you wanted, because it would show the item your dragging as a cursor and the three buttons you could drop it in. This wasn't present in TPHD.
I don't know if WWHD allowed this, but if you're pausing the game to change items in TPHD, and you're playing with the Gamepad, you HAVE to use the touch screen. You can't just select them with the D-Pad or left stick.
>>333445143
A namefag's signature holds no weight on 4chan unless it's used to tell him he's cancer.
>>333444981
Your solution is to dive to the 3 big columns of light, then instead of just picking a statue to use you want a whole other flying section just to pick the landing zone and hide a loading screen by forcing you to load another intermediate area.
I'd rather they focus on making the sword work and dungeons enjoyable. You realize how much work and how many game mechanics you just added in to achieve the same thing they already did?
>>333445210
>"pay homage"
>please describe in extended detail what homage means without using the word or its contexts to delineate how a title can enumerate its content through scenes and mechanics of prior games
>>333444997
After having done the photo method in the original GC game, yes. I would prefer the Minish Cap system for trophies. And they didn't just give them to you. You had a percentage for getting a new one.
In Wind Waker, you not only have to take a perfect picture of an enemy, but also warp back to him each time. Even if you took all perfect pictures (which almost no one does), that's still something like 100 trips back to the trophy maker. And if you mess up one boss, the mother fairy or a few others, you have to reload the game or play a second game to get them.
Its just a really bad system. On paper it sounds neat. But in practice, its more tedious than crafting in an MMO.
The only things I actually enjoyed in Skyward Sword were the Ghirahim fights. They used the sword fighting mechanics in such a way that taught you how to properly play.
Everything else was fairly mediocre. I had to force myself to keep playing through it because I thought it would get better. It never really did.
Best dungeon: OoT
Best Link: MM
Best Zelda: SS hands down.Best girl was midna though
Best world: WW
Best bosses: OoT
Worst water dungeon: _________
Best ost: _________
Help me out here /v/
>>333445286
The time shift stones, dude. AKA the best part of the whole game.
>>333445524
>And they didn't just give them to you. You had a percentage for getting a new one.
Couldn't you pay more shells to increase the odds or am I misremembering?
>>333445524
>And if you mess up one boss, the mother fairy or a few others, you have to reload the game or play a second game to get them.
Not in WWHD (which is the version we were talking about) since you instantly know if a picture is good or not through a stamp appearing on it.
>>333445675
Best Link and best Zelda are both in Hyrule Warriors, though.
I'd also give best ost to Majora's Mask. Astral Observatory is fucking brilliant.
>>333445675
Worst Water Dungeon: MM
Best ost: OoT
>>333445675
>Best ost
Wind Waker
>>333445675
Worst water dungeon is Jabu Jabu's bellyfrom Oracle of Ages
FUCK I hate that level so much.
>>333445675
>Worst water dungeon
I don't know. I'm tempted to say Lakebed Temple since it simply doesn't have much going on and it's pretty straightforward while the Water Temple and the Great Bay Temple are more intricate, but I guess others might see it the opposite way.
>Best OST
The Wind Waker.
>>333445646
Literally the worst part. Even worse than the three Demise fights.
And Demise at the end was the biggest boss letdown in recent memory. It was shit. Even shittier than Ganondorf-on-horseback TP shit.
And thats coming from a guy who thinks SS is better than TP
>>333445749
Oh. Yeah. I guess I didn't think it very exclusive since it encompasses such a large part of the game, not "just" dungeons.
But yeah, shit was tits
>>333434104
Is there a way to play this without all the wagglin?
>>333445023
The only issue is the leniency, the rest is by design anon. Again though, what enemies does it ruin? Because it isn't all or even most of them.
Bokoblins, who are grunts anyway, and Lizalfos. When have lizalfos ever been hard to beat? Enemies like Stalfos practically require the parry to beat them fast enough when there's more than one enemy. And that's the real thing of it too in SS, you're rarely fighting one enemy at a time unless they're showcasing a new enemy type.
It's still way better than TP's system of using the shield bash whenever you wanted to induce the stun state, and better than the shield mechanics in any previous 3D Zelda game for that matter.
>>333435950
DELETE THIS
>>333446208
Yes, by actually learning the controls.
>>333446262
Point is I went practically the whole game without my shield ever taking damage because parrying was so damn easy. What's even the point of giving the shields health if the only reason to even bother using a shield is to parry?
>>333445443
Nah, my solution wouldn't have the 3 pillars of light. Those are stupid. They're the problem with the game. Because it reduces the exploration of the world, into a Mario 64-esque level select.
The flying sections would appear to be seamless to the player.
Imagine: You're on the bird. But the bird can't go through the clouds. So you make the drop. When you enter the clouds, your view is shrouded by it's thick cover. During this time, the game removes the skyworld from memory, and loads the ground. The cloud shrouds your view for as long as it takes the ground to load.
As soon as the ground is loaded, the cover of the clouds disappears, and you're seeing the overworld.
It's not that hard of a system. They already built the overworld. They already build the skyworld. They already built the cloud cover. All it would take, is a little bit of ingenuity to trick the player into a seamless transition.
Did you know, that TP's canyons where just clever loading zones? The game would bottleneck you into this thin corridors, so it could load hyrule field in real time.
It's kind of like that.
>>333446208
dank post, but SS doesn't have waggle
TP is waggle combat
>>333441474
Wrong faggot. The first one was the first Zelda I played, and TP is my favorite because of the dungeons. It has the best dungeons besides A Link to the past
>>333444997
They also made it so you can get pictures from bottles, so if you missed one, it's not the end of the world.
>>333441474
My first game was Majora's Mask, and that might be the reason that I prefer it over OoT, but Twilight Princess still became my favorite.
But I don't dislike any one game in series.
>This has the best dungeons and combat in the series.
So you're saying that Skyward Sword is the only Zelda you've ever played.
>>333435456
Best Overworld: The Legend of Zelda
Best Dungeons: The Legend of Zelda
Best Items: The Legend of Zelda
Best Combat: Zelda II: The Adventure of Link
>>333447576
Dude I'm fucking in my 30s. It was quite literally the first video game I ever played and even I think you're just acting like a contrarian age-addled nostalgia-blinded grandfather.
>>333447576
Nigga Zelda II is better in every aspect mentioned there
>>333447576
>Best Items: The Legend of Zelda
No, most of them were fucking useless.
Go play ALTTP gramps
>>333447576
>Best Combat: Zelda II: The Adventure of Link
You know what, I can't help but agree. Having to pay attention to high and low attacks alone made the combat more involved than most other Zelda games.
As for the rest I think I'd sooner list any of the Gameboy Zeldas for all those categories.
>>333446680
I already agreed parrying is too easy. Don't act like a cunt and pretend not to know why shields have a meter. I already explained how you usually fight more than one enemy, you might want a shield up for that. It's not like every single time you go into combat you need to take damage to the shield to make that mechanic a worthwhile inclusion to the game. At some point Zelda combat isn't difficult in any 3D game, and I don't think SS's shield bash parry is so broken compared other 3D Zelda titles.
>>333446767
>The flying sections would appear to be seamless to the player.
You can explain how you'd do it all you want, I'm doubting you're a game programmer and know anything about what's possible to pull off.
You realize this "seamless transition" is definitely something they would have tried to do and there has to be a reason why it isn't as simple as you, in all your programming experience, think it is.
You might as well be suggesting the Wind Waker island just be closer together because they've already got all of them programmed already. It's a hardware limitation.
I haven't played TP in a while, but I at least know you're right about combat.
>>333446048
>Literally the worst part.
>Ghirahim
Shit taste.
>Even worse than the three Demise fights.
What do people find so tedious about the Imprisoned? The third fight is only one thing with launching Link on its head and the other two take less than 5 minutes combined. You didn't attack the toes, did you?
>>333447576
>Best Combat: Zelda II: The Adventure of Link
Actually correct.
>>333448628
Because it wasn't a very entertaining boss in any of it's three versions.
>>333448865
I liked the concept of having to stop a boss from reaching a certain place and getting to control the Groosenator in the latter two battles was pretty fun. My only gripe is that it didn't have a better character design.
>>333448628
>You didn't attack the toes, did you?
Given how every other boss in the game and most Zelda games in general are just "attack the obvious weak point" or "toss the item you just got in the dungeon at it until it's dead" with no other tactics involved, I think it's fair to not immediately realize that there's a more convenient way of fighting the boss.
>>333448165
>I'm doubting you're a game programmer and know anything about what's possible to pull off.
It's true, I'm not a programmer. But I doubt you are either. The fact that the game doesn't have a feature, doesn't mean the feature is impossible. Supposing that much is more foolish than my supposing it is possible. Because I can look at other games that have done it. On the same hardware. By the same company. Within the same series. Like already mentioned, Twilight Princess was able to seamlessly load areas. using a very similar technique: limiting the player's range of view, and creating a long enough travel distance, so that the next area can load in real time.
Now, I'm aware it would be slightly different when falling form the sky. But remember that the Wii isn't the Gamecube. The GAMECUBE failed to load a certain amount of objects in time. But that doesn't mean the wii would fail a similar task.
Also, the sail cloth speed is fairly slow. Much more slow than the boat. So once the player emerges from the clouds, they wouldn't be able to move horizontally at any great speed.
>You might as well be suggesting the Wind Waker island just be closer together because they've already got all of them programmed already.
Well the Wii U version allows you to sail more quickly. So in a sense, you could say they are closer together.
>>333448865
But having different ways to kill it was cool. It wasn't like it was a boss at the end of a dungeon, I can see how that'd be disappointing. For a thing you fight for a couple minutes it was interesting since it had a larger area to fight in and it moved around a lot. I thought having a fight that included the sky diving mechanic neat. I really liked how the last 'fight' showed you how you should have been fighting it all along if you hadn't figured out the shortcut yet.
>>333449313
None of the ways to kill it were very entertaining.
>>333449141
I don't understand, are you blaming the game for giving you more options and not hand holding or the series for not being like this until now and holding that against SS?
It's not like you didn't have to jump down in there and jump past all those air vents to fight it in the first place. The big air vent you seal it back into even triggers the sky dive mechanic.
>>333449171
>Supposing that much is more foolish than my supposing it is possible.
You're an idiot. My assumption isn't just that it's impossible because it didn't happen, it's that I really doubt Nintendo didn't try to make the sky a seamless transition. You're saying they never tried because it isn't in the game. That's foolish. You need to learn how assumptions and reason work anon, at least before you start calling people foolish.
>Because I can look at other games that have done it. On the same hardware. By the same company. Within the same series. Like already mentioned, Twilight Princess was able to seamlessly load areas.
First off TP is not seamless, there are white screen transitions. Everything you say about TP and 'real time' is bullshit because there are screen transitions that are loading screens. To not make those screens longer when riding Epona, if you're right, they needed to use narrow canyons so you're actually pointing out how much the Wii chugs on loading shit.
>The GAMECUBE failed to load a certain amount of objects in time. But that doesn't mean the wii would fail a similar task.
Holy shit balls the precedent is right there. I never said WW was proof of the Wii's limitations, because of course that makes no sense to do. It's a conceptual metaphor for you to understand how things have happened and could be happening in SS, an explanatory analogy.
But really it's the arrogance of your thinking that really gets me, and that's where our positions truly differ. You just assume it can be done without knowing anything. I don't assume it's impossible, I assume Nintendo tried.
>>333434104
Enough with the shilling
>>333442482
The thing is that a couple of these things had some annoying faults in them.
>-Link can run.
But his stamina is so small that you can barely run up half of a circle in the Sacred Grounds for example, and rolling took up like a fourth of your bar. I get the reason behind it is to limit you spamming spins, but it makes getting around a pain since you have to stop like every three or four seconds to just walk. I am amazed there was no stamina medal or some way to increase it through a side quest.
>-Potions requiring upgrade to enhance their usefulness.
While the idea behind it is good, the execution of it was garbage since once you upgraded the potion it was specifically only for that potion, not the whole batch permanently, and the items needed to upgrade them were pretty annoying to get.
>Upgrading your items and expanding equipment slots was a nice little addition.
It ended up with you never using any of the satchel/quiver/bomb bag upgrades though. You'd just always use medals since they increase your damage, HP, and drops while still giving you room for two fairies. It was great for the dungeon items though, upgrading them and gaining new abilities is great, it's what I loved about ALBW as well.
Shield parrying and bomb storing were also nice additions I though, especially bomb storing since it meant you could keep anything from a bomb flower and they were pretty plentiful.
>>333450424
Relative to other 3D Zelda bosses? It's not below average.
>>333450681
I really just have an issue with the greater problem of this game and a lot of the series in general not doing enough to encourage experimentation. That fight just points a magnifying glass on it by suddenly having a situation in which you can but likely won't because the player is probably already conditioned to assume not to. Even worse is that the obvious path in that situation is one that makes the whole thing infinitely more tedious and boring.
>>333450935
So why repeat a "just average" boss fight three times?
>>333450765
>On today's episode of Words Anon Doesn't Understand
>>333450681
>I really doubt Nintendo didn't try to make the sky a seamless transition. You're saying they never tried because it isn't in the game.
No, I'm not saying they didn't try. Whether they tried or not is irrelevant to me, and the issue. Because even if they did try, they could have failed through no fault of the hardware. But regular old incompetence/inability. Or perhaps, they succeeded, but decided that that kind of transition didn't fit their design after all, so they cut it.
In any case, you can't assume that just because the feature is absent, that it's impossible.
>First off TP is not seamless, there are white screen transitions.
My mistake. I forgot about those. It's practically seamless though. Because those white screens only last for a split second.
> they needed to use narrow canyons so you're actually pointing out how much the Wii chugs on loading shit.
Remember that TP was developed with Gamecube hardware in mind. Besides, tat doesn't prove that the Wii couldn't handle loading the ground in real time. It only proves that it needs a transition to hide the loading. Which the clouds would be.
>It's a conceptual metaphor for you to understand how things have happened and could be happening in SS
I understood what you were getting at. But when you look at the specifics, what you're saying doesn't hold as truth. The Wii's hardware isn't the gamecube hardware. So you can't assume that the Wii would have the problem the gamecube had.
>>333450917
Link's normal walking speed is still faster than the other Zeldas, so being left with only that for a few seconds is still fine. It's not like you didn't have stamina fruit everywhere the game wanted/forced you to run. I really think the entire point of the stamina gauge was to get you to stop rolling everywhere, so it's only natural the roll would be taxing.
And you can just take a stamina potion with you, not like you need anything in those bottles the first play through and even on hero mode one health potion will do ya. Bring a stamina potion and let the spin attacks fly.
The potions not being kept unlocks was a good thing, not like the game needed to be any easier with permanently upgraded potions. But I can see how you might be lazy about catching bugs. But when you go onto say the item upgrade materials were also tedious, I just wonder how lazy you're being by expecting these extra upgrades to come easily during normal play with zero extra effort.
You don't get to complain about finding treasure and bugs only to then complain how you only carried your medals around instead of ammo bags. And there's no medal that increases your damage. The life medals add a single heart each and I'd rather have 20 extra arrows or 10 more bombs than a single heart. It's not like you have all 8 pouches from the get go either.
But since you just need to carry those medals and hate running, why not get a stamina potion with the potion medal and not complain about the stamina meter? Are you really running around with the potions medal but not using any potions, let alone the time based air and stamina ones?
All your complaints involve solutions to your other complaints.
> People debating about Zelda games.
Kill yourselves.
Why do we have to have daily threads about this?
Can't we all just agree with Dunky that Ocarina of Time has been, is, and for the long foreseeable future will remain the best game of all time; and stop the posturing around the real issue that we don't have more games like it?
Or what? Do you all have some hypochondriac-esque aversion to sharing someone else's opinion that you have to carve out your own special hole for yourself?
Look, I get it. Arguing with people is a fun past-time and /v/ is the only place you can do that because normals look down on us...
BUT OY! Enough is enough guys! Time to come to a truce or at least cease-fire until Zelda U comes out.
Doncha' think?
>>333451731
Well I wouldn't put it as "just average" but that's besides the point. People knocking the Imprisoned love to bring up that it's repeated three times, like you're fighting Goht or Moldorm three times. The Imprisoned is not this big long tedious fight that gets repeated three times a full boss fight length.
Putting those three segments together is about the length of a dungeon boss, if even. This is especially true given how the third fight is just the catapult sequence and you can easily beat the first fight in under a minute.
>>333452193
>In any case, you can't assume that just because the feature is absent, that it's impossible.
I never said impossible. You said I said impossible, multiple times now. You're having the argument you want to instead of the one we're really having. Do I know for sure it was the hardware? No, I don't. But it annoys me that you'd come in and just go "oh they could have simple done this and it'd work." That's arrogant of you when you admit you don't shit about what's possible, are ignoring WW, and what you said about TP was flat out incorrect.
>I understood what you were getting at. But when you look at the specifics, what you're saying doesn't hold as truth. The Wii's hardware isn't the gamecube hardware. So you can't assume that the Wii would have the problem the gamecube had.
Well I'm glad you ignored everything I had explained about this while still reading it and replying, somehow. I'm not assuming the Wii couldn't because the Gamecube couldn't, stop forcing positions down my throat that I don't hold.
And after all this it doesn't even sound like you're talking about anything different than where you fall in the sky. Like instead of the pillar of light you just fall down in the clouds and instead of picking what statue you need to have been over that section already, with a cloud transition. Either you're arrogant for suggesting that flying to the ground would be so easy or stupid for thinking having the bird statue selection just be done with your body instead of a menu is some revolutionary idea that'd make the game better instead of more tedious to travel through.
>>333445754
did the guy your replying to get recked and stop posting?
>>333434104
Agreed.
>>333452606
>I really think the entire point of the stamina gauge was to get you to stop rolling everywhere,
But why? Rolling doesn't provide any advantage in evading anything and it's just barely faster than running. If anything it makes sense to limit your spins since they do more damage, hit a huge range, and are almost instant to use.
>But when you go onto say the item upgrade materials were also tedious, I just wonder how lazy you're being by expecting these extra upgrades to come easily during normal play with zero extra effort.
See, I have no problem grabbing stuff, it's just that stuff like the purple Amber Relics, the Monster Horns(Though I know you can just Clawshot them out of Bokoblin's hands once you find one that has them), Eldin Ores, and Tumbleweed are a pain to grab. Getting some of the rarer items are also annoying(Specifically the Golden Skull and the Goddess Plume), though they did give you a good amount just from chests in dungeons.
>And there's no medal that increases your damage.
That's my bad, thought the cursed one gave damage as well.
>and I'd rather have 20 extra arrows or 10 more bombs than a single heart.
But why? The arrows are only really useful on Bokoblins that die in a hit anyway, and bomb flowers are everywhere while also barely needing to be used.
I also don't use potions in general, I usually just have a bottle or two of fairies in case I mess up since that's pretty much all you need outside of Hero Mode.
>>333454207
I'm not any of those anons but you know not every gap of silence is someone being mad and giving up, right? Assumptions like that just make for more 'u mad' tier shitposting.
Zelda doesn't have great dungeons. They're good but not challenging enough.
>>333454573
>But why?
Because Nintendo doesn't want you to play their Zelda games rolling (, backflipping, or sidehopping) the main character around everywhere, yelling their heads off. I thought that one would be pretty obvious anon.
>it's just that stuff like the purple Amber Relics, the Monster Horns(Though I know you can just Clawshot them out of Bokoblin's hands once you find one that has them), Eldin Ores, and Tumbleweed are a pain to grab.
It sounds like you mean physically obtain those. Eldin Ore, really? Tumbleweeds are bugs that can't get scared of you. Amber Relics are everywhere, did you mean Dusk? Replaying the Silent Realm sections with Lanayru gets you infinite of those. At some point the rare things are supposed to be rare, and that's also what the treasure medal is for. Or you can just buy those materials, they cost a lot but it's an option. You're supposed to gradually build up reserves as you play, if you stop everything just to farm I can see how they might seem tedious but then that's really on the player for farming. And once you can dowse it all gets even easier.
>But why? The arrows are only really useful on Bokoblins that die in a hit anyway, and bomb flowers are everywhere while also barely needing to be used.
Arrows kill almost everything and a bomb bag is so I don't have to stand at a flower picking 10 in a row. You know bombs are useful in combat, right? Why have one more heart especially if, like you say, you're rolling around with a heart medal and keep fairies on you?
>I also don't use potions in general, I usually just have a bottle or two of fairies
Holy fuck then don't bitch about the stamina gauge if you refuse to use stamina potions. And a 20 rupee unupgraded potion heals you more than a fairy anyway, even if you have Goddess Walls available to you. Hero Mode has taught me this.
I will say thank you though, because I didn't know you can clawshot horns from the bokoblin's hands and apparently the whip does that too. Neat.
>>333455118
I played Darksiders II, after a game like that you realize how relatively good Zelda puzzle dungeons are. Which makes me sad.
>>333456336
Also helps you realize how much better Zelda could be with more tense combat
Zelda and God of War is a great combination
>>333456680
Zelda's simple combat makes it more fun for most, myself included. If by tense you mean more challenging, even then I don't really agree, the combat is fine as it is in that respect, kind if in the middle.
>>333456212
>Eldin Ore, really?
Yep, I get one like every ten or so holes at best, sometimes even more. It also means you need to sit there digging upwards of five times a hole hoping for one. Even with the treasure medal this isn't really high either.
>Tumbleweeds are bugs that can't get scared of you
While this is true, if they ever hit any sand or anything at all they immediately break, they spawn not only sporadically but can sometimes be faster than you can run, and it's quite annoying to actually collect them. I remember having to do it for like 12 of them I think? It took nearly 45 minutes since I had almost none of them appearing, half of them were Sonic levels of fast, and some loved to just spawn out of the corner of my eye and make it into a wall before I could run to it.
The nice thing is you get more or less all the rare stuff you need for equips, I'm just speaking from a potion perspective for the most part since the upgrades usually require some of the more annoying things to collect. Dung Beetles are also a bit annoying.
>You know bombs are useful in combat, right?
Enemies tend to run from them and unless you score a direct hit the damage isn't exactly amazing.
>then don't bitch about the stamina gauge if you refuse to use stamina potions
I'm just complaining because it means I have to waste a slot just for a single drink of a stamina potion(Or waste a bunch of materials for an upgraded drink) that doesn't last that long when I could have any other potion
>>333456680
Actually I disagree here because the beat em up combat usually means you can jump around and have a decent amount of control in the air, suddenly the puzzles have to accommodate this. While it could be done well, Darksiders II is definitely an example of it hurting the dungeon design.
I liked the loot and 'items' though. Got bored of playing it around 35-40 hours, like I do most games. I'll probably go back to it after I finish this SS hero mode run.
>>333456929
and of course now that I mention the Eldin Ore I get like 7 in a row. It was rarer than diamonds for me for hours and all of a sudden it's not.
>>333434104
The game had some good dungeons and some bad ones. Twilight Princess also had some good dungeons, although I probably preferred OoT Master Quest overall.
Combat sucked because of the spotty motion controls and that they were required for some enemies. Wind Waker had far more enjoyable combat overall.
>>333434104
Best final boss too
>>333434104
TP had better dungeons AND better combat.
>>333456929
Pyrups drop Eldin Ore, it's not just digging. Even still you only need 7 in the entire game, and 5 of those are for the Iron Shield (2 and 3). They're only tedious if you're trying to farm all 7 all at once, you're definitely going to get at least 2 that first visit to Eldin. You're going for a 100% run you just need two more by the time you're upgrading the bow, hours and multiple trips to Eldin later.
Tumbleweeds are a bit annoying and it's 16 even but what exactly took you 45 minutes? To get two or three or were you farming nearly all of them at once? You can't blame the game for that tedium when you're the one choosing to farm.
>I'm just speaking from a potion perspective for the most part
>I also don't use potions in general, I usually just have a bottle or two of fairies
So you're finding shit to complain about that you didn't personally find to be problematic?
Bugs have guaranteed spawns and are easy to catch. The bug medal even shows you them on the map. Glittering spores attract bugs and keep them from running away if you have issues.
http://zeldawiki.org/Upgrades#Item_Upgrades Look at that and tell me what you use so often that you're farming bugs.
I really think you're creating issues by only remembering rarity and not how often you actually need them, same with treasures.
To use bombs in combat you light them first and throw as they explode. Great for groups of bokoblins.
Potions don't take this huge number of bugs like you imply and they aren't wasted if you use them to upgrade something, obviously. You could have any other potion besides the stamina, but you're bitching about stamina. You aren't bitching about how hard the game is, so leave a medal or potion behind. You're complaining about things that only happen when you choose to farm or min/max in a game where it's hardly necessary. Bring what you need for convenience, stamina potion or quiver. It's not always about how much health you can carry, this is 3D Zelda for fuck's sake.
>>333459081
>AND better combat.
Show your work anon.
>>333457580
>I probably preferred OoT Master Quest overall.
MQOoT is best Zelda. Cow switches are best switches.
>>333445330
>I don't know if WWHD allowed this, but if you're pausing the game to change items in TPHD, and you're playing with the Gamepad, you HAVE to use the touch screen. You can't just select them with the D-Pad or left stick.
You certainly could.
>>333434104
Everything TP did, SS did better. You know except dungeons and the companion. I like Fi and think Midna is mostly annoying tsundere shit, but you can't deny Midna has the most interesting role in the story out of any Zelda companion.
Shit I even liked tear collecting in SS, probably because of how much better the sprint mechanic was than being a wolf.
>>333460042
>I really think you're creating issues by only remembering rarity and not how often you actually need them, same with treasures.
This is really probably it, and it's my bad that I kept harping on it so much.
>Great for groups of bokoblins.
They die in two random slashes though, so it's really up to you if you want to use it though.
>>333461263
>Shit I even liked tear collecting in SS, probably because of how much better the sprint mechanic was than being a wolf.
The night areas and avoiding the guards also helps in making it way more enjoyable. In TP it was kinda just wandering around looking for some that you could use whereas in SS it's going through the same area as before but with more stuff to worry about and on a timer.
I just wish the controls for flying the Loftwing didn't require you to waggle to gain height, that's something that SS did way wrong, it's just annoying to keep flapping so you have enough speed to keep flying.
>>333455118
>only challenging = good
le hardcode gamers, everybody
>>333461263
TP also had the better overworld and a more consistent art style and a better atmosphere overall.
And ultimately there are a lot of places where TP fucked things up in such a way that being better is hardly a noteworthy achievement. SS combat is better than TP's but that doesn't make SS's combat good. You want to do something impressive? Find a place where SS is better than Majora's Mask, or Ocarina of Time, or most of the early handheld Zelda games.
>>333445931
AHHHHHHHHHHHH
>>333445931
>>333462193
>Extremely easy to get confused in the place when it comes to which floor needs the water for your to proceed.
>You have to use Mermaid Tail for the entire duration which requires you to mash a direction on the D-Pad.
>>333434104
Goron mine in TP is the best dungegon in the franchise
>>333461467
>They die in two random slashes though
Just like you did with the 8 pocket pouch earlier, you're applying end-game equipment to playing the entire game. First you said one, now you say two, but bokoblins take 4 hits to die with the base sword and like I said, groups.
Why bother fighting 4 of them when one bomb kills them all, especially if some horn asshole is calling in more than one group? Or situations where you're on a ledge above them but multiple are waiting for you to come down, so instead of jumping over them and getting into a fight backwards you can just use a single bomb. Now this is more for hero mode, but still. It's not faster to fight them individually, reguardless of how many slashes because of killing multiple at once.
And what do you mean by "random" slashes? I really hate when people use the word 'random' to make something seem more trivial or inconsequential.
>I just wish the controls for flying the Loftwing didn't require you to waggle
The only time you waggle in SS is to break free from the jelly things. You can still find the motion annoying, but it's a small flick of the wrist like you're snapping reins or casting a fishing line. And you can use some speed you gain when flying down to recover some altitude, like in Super Mario World. I forget if the A boost gains much altitude but I seem to remember it not, or not keeping much speed or something.
I'm sorry to harp on you so much but I feel like SS gets a lot of shit about things that actually are user error, like choosing to farm or using more motion than the controls require and calling the controls bad for it. I honestly had one anon bitch about re-calibrating only to find out they weren't using a sensor bar and didn't know how to recenter the sword with slashes.
>>333462823
>but bokoblins take 4 hits to die with the base sword and like I said, groups.
Again, completely right, I forgot that earlier on it takes a while to kill stuff. Still, I never found it really beneficial to try and bomb the guys because of risk of backfire more than anything else. I'm sure you can use it in battle, I just never bothered since most enemies went down easily.
I say "random slashes" because you can just slash in any direction and get a hit on them. The only ones you can't really do it on is the guys in Lanryu who have the electric swords.
>I forget if the A boost gains much altitude but I seem to remember it not, or not keeping much speed or something.
It can gain altitude but it's short-lived compared to simply doing a flap. It also is just irritating to have to keep flapping over and over to just get anywhere when you have a perfectly fine stick not being used at all. Having A be the flaps and the flick be the speed would have been better I think.
I myself have tons of problems with the sword controls though, and I do use a sensor bar on top of constantly recalibrating the thing. Stabs almost never register, for some reason it occasionally decides to shield bash despite not moving the Nunchuk at all(Could just be my Nunchuk) the beetle feels way more to the right than the center when you take it out(Though this could just be the perspective throwing me off), bomb rolling doesn't always work, and diagonals sometimes just turn into sideways slashes.
>>333461942
I disagree. I liked SS's more puzzle-type landscape that even TP was moving towards. I also prefer the Sky to TP's Hyrule Field though I see how probably most wouldn't agree with me. Really though I just prefered Skyloft so much to all the towns combined in TP. Castle Town wasn't great and Kakariko might as well not have existed and been a bomb stand in Castle Town.
If you don't want to call SS's combat good, then are you saying any 3D Zelda has good combat? I always try to keep the statements about quality relative to other Zelda games and in that respect I'd say SS's combat is at least good or even great.
I agree TP is more consistent in artstyle and I like its surreal, not straight grimdark, atmosphere. Though I don't hate the SS artstyle, I think it serves in gameplay, tone, and timeline placement. It's a fairy tale, well most Zeldas are but I think you know what I mean.
>Find a place where SS is better than Majora's Mask
Dungeons.
>or Ocarina of Time
Combat.
>or most of the early handheld Zelda games
Really for these I'm not gonna say something like combat obviously, it's always a bit harder to cross compare over the 2D-3D border. I still haven't gotten to the Oracle games, or played LA in probably close to decade so I dunno. Better waifus?
>>333463620
Just to add on, while I hate Fi's interruptions during the early game they do ease up once you get to the second third of the game, Skyloft is actually very comfortable and enjoyable to run around in, when the sword controls do want to work it's great, bow and arrow usage is great with the C button being an instant pull back, dungeons have all been the highlight for me, the art style and music are both top notch, character design for Link is especially cool with the chainmail and dark green, parrying is fun, and Faron Woods is one of my favorite areas in the game.
I know people always say Lanryu, but I really enjoy traversing that first area, and then you were able to swim into the tree and it was even cooler.
>>333463706
>If you don't want to call SS's combat good, then are you saying any 3D Zelda has good combat?
Zelda's always had serviceable combat, and while I appreciate SS's attempts at making it more involved, I don't think it really did enough. Honestly I think the problem lies more with the enemy design than the combat itself. TP had some wonderful combat mechanics that probably could have made for the best combat in the whole series, it was just ruined because the enemies were all pushovers. SS enemies are mostly pushovers, too, but I guess at least occasionally you have to change what direction you swing, so that's more than I can say for TP.
>>333462494
That's the worst one in the game. The puzzles with falling into magnetic beams and the magnetic cranes were really cool, the actual walking on ceilings and walls was not.
>>333463620
>I say "random slashes" because you can just slash in any direction and get a hit on them.
They still block, even if they aren't electrified. Now you can hold your sword to one direction and jerk the wiimote over to cause an instant attack opposite their defense, but that's hardly random.
I agree about your flaps and boosts though. Still those rock portal boost things do form a pretty nice highway around the Sky. If you jump off Skyloft close to one of them you can get to most islands without too many or any flaps.
Long bit of controller help incoming too.
>>333463620
>>333465548
Lets troubleshoot this. Got good batteries? Motion plus attachment or built in? Your nunchuk does sound fucked, it's definitely not the game randomly throwing out shield bashes. Do you have any other IR emitters around your sensor bar, maybe from a sound system? A tip I got from anon while playing the Prime Trilogy is to leave the sensor bar below the TV but set it to "Above" in the wii menu, some couch/tv set ups make the natural middle in too weird of a spot for your arm. Stabs are easy to trigger if you end the forward thrust with a little jerk back to really emphasize the motion to the accelerometer. A lot of projectile weapons use this combination of motion aiming and relative position to the sensor bar, so that sensor bar trick might help this too. But if you recenter with the d-pad it should save that so further fuck ups might be the perspective like you say.
Rolling sometimes doesn't work if you move the wiimote up too much, it thinks you're just raising your arm. You need to do like a reverse flick, actually rolling bombs is a lot like flapping the bird wings but in reverse and with the wiimote pointing down. The game is looking for a flick motion more than an arm movement. Diagonals fucking up are usually two things, one is needing to recalibrate but don't use the pause menu. Just do a few exaggerated top slashes so the game can hit a few easy pitches to get its confidence back up. The sword tutor says this but it's never mentioned again and it's a really handy soft reset if it's just the sword swings messing up. Or you might have your wrist tilted meaning your arm moves diagonally but the wiimote is lined up to only move on its x or y axis.
>>333465626
>>333465548
>>333463620
I won't say the controls are 100%, but with this many issues it seems to be a combination of sensor bar set up and not knowing what specific motions trigger what movements. The biggest issue with the controls is that they work really well when you know what triggers them but can seem finicky if you're using just a motion you might assume to be the natural way to stab a sword or roll a ball. The real issue is that Nintendo only explains them as that simple "oh just roll a ball like real life!" when really the game works much better thinking of different flicks as button analogues. Kind of like how you can play Wii sports with more life-accurate movements but tennis and bowling get a lot easier when you just flick your wrist instead of swinging your arm.
>>333453104
The basic Idea of arugmebting Is proving out why your opinion Is superior to someone else's tho.
I actually liked the dungeons in SS.
I actually liked the controls too.
What let me down was the world. It felt empty and uninhabited. There was a whole new world to explore beneath the clouds and there wasn't much there.
Fuck, above the clouds there wasn't anything to explore either. A few places with one thing on them. Like WW but worse.
>>333463860
I was blown away when the woods flooded, no area in a 3D Zelda has seen that kind of change even if it was just enabling a sort of flight mode around the area for the tadtone hunt. It just seemed so drastic a change, especially compared to Twilight areas or OoT's time change. Even before that all the little shortcuts and just how vertically layered it was felt really refreshing in a 3D Zelda.
This Is an unbiased opinion
OoT and MM fans:
>Daring warriors who are not afraid of getting out of confort
>Can handle stress very well
>they either do not fear or fight their fears head on
>They will travel In 9 feet of pure shit and blood deepness for the good of most
>When life goes to shit,you'll want to look up to them
WW fans:
>Abuses the word 'comfy',Is not willing to admit It being a buzzword
>Hates games that have difficulty curves
>Is a little too much childish,refuses to put a little water in their wine
>Probably owns a safespace
>Safespace probably contains WW
>>333465909
The sky wasn't for exploring like you explore the map in ALttP for examples. People usually complain about how empty the sky is but it's not trying to be this dense area with tons of secrets, it's a Hyrule Field. In that respect I like it more than any other Zelda's hub area, especially compared to WW just for how much smaller it is and faster to move through. And when you're comparing to WW you still have all the land in SS too.
I always hated the idea that the exploration in Zelda came from going anywhere, anytime with some non-linear sandbox. To me the exploration in Zelda is about having a set destination but finding treasures and secrets in the nooks and crannies along the way. I think that's true all the way from ALttP to SS.
>>333465626
Just put in new batteries a couple hours ago, Motion Plus is the attachment, Nunchuk works just fine in every other game but in SS it loves shield bashing at complete random, no IR emitters anywhere around the sensor bar and the sensor bar has never given me problems.
Rolling has always worked for me no matter what, but aiming the bombs to roll is a bit of a mess. Thanks for the tip on stabbing though, pulling back seems to have made it much easier to do the stab,
>>333467212
>Nunchuk works just fine in every other game but in SS it loves shield bashing at complete random
Games with nunchuk shaking? I mean I've heard people say SS doesn't weird shit but random shield bashes is just straight up not the game's fault.
Anyway, just in general try to think more about it all with flicks as button inputs and not as arm motions with 1:1 interaction with the world. A lot of the hiccups seem to go away.
You might wanna try the sensor bar 'above' trick if you have issues or not. For me it made even just using the menus in games feel more natural, like I had a better sense of where I was pointing from my arm position. Actually if your sword feels fucked up, try pointing at the sensor bar. Sometimes you'll even see the sword 'jump' to a recentered position when it finds the sensor bar. And don't forget a few overhand slashes will also help recenter the swings if your diagonals get fucked again.
Good luck, we're all counting on you.
>>333434104
this game was garbage and the last truly good console Legend of Zelda game was Wind Waker
