>b-but muh Zelda Cycle!
Mark my words, 5-10 years from now this game will still be just as ridiculed as it is today. It'll forever be remembered as the ugly duckling of the mainline console titles and no amount of bitching will ever change that.
But it is better than both wind waker and twilight princess
>>332558021
Both Wind Waker and Twilight Princess at their absolute worst are better than Skyward Sword at its absolute best.
>>332557908
Remember when it first came out and everyone was saying it was better than Ocarina of Time?
>>332557908
I thought it was pretty good.
>>332558141
Ehh. WW is my absolute favorite Zelda and top 5 comfiest games. TP I felt was too similar to OoT, but still decent.
Whatever "Zelda cycle" there is was broken by SS. Even after 5 years it is still regarded as one of the weakest titles in the franchise.
>>332558358
The only people I recall saying that were the journoshills.
>>332558527
It also broke the "Zelda cycle" because it didn't stop Twilight Princess from being shit.
>>332558358
>Remember when it first came out and everyone was saying it was better than Ocarina of Time?
You're joking, right? Because I remember the exact opposite.
The truth?
Most all Legend of Zelda games are very good. Wind Waker, Twilight Princess, Link to the Past, Majora's Mask, Ocarina of Time, etc. There's very few Zelda titles that are not highly entertaining.
Skyward Sword is the weakest entry in the series. Not just because of motion controls, but because of bland design.
>>332558712
>Twilight Princess from being shit
Skyward Sword is awesome, except for that monsters inc boss, what the fuck, I almost quit the second I saw it.
>>332558358
Those were the paid reviewers and shills.
>but those don't exist ecks dee
>>332557908
I agree, unless of course Zelda Wii U/NX somehow ends up being just irredeemably awful. If that happens SS will probably be remembered more fondly, even if it's only because "Well it wasn't great but at least it was as bad the fucking NX one".
I really quite enjoyed playing it.
I enjoyed it for a bit. But then the gimmicks got old and I started wanting the game to be over asap.
Same shit with TP on the Wii.
Don't hold your breath. There's been a poster here who has been arguing up and down that SS has the best overworld of the 3D Zeldas. It's only gonna get worse.
>>332557908
>b-but muh Zelda Cycle!
I haven't seen a single person use this as a defense for SS.
>>332557908
For every one person who says he liked this game (both when it was released and/or now) there is going to be 10 people who look at that post and shitpost about MUH ZELDA CYCLE
Reminds me of how people dont actually know what the fuck the Sonic cycle was (because it hasnt been a thing since fucking black knight/unleashed)
>>332564854
That poster is fucking retarded. Nobody likes corridors and hallways and empty hubs.
>>332557908
I love Skyward Sword, you colossal faggot.
>>332558141
I'm a TPfag but the Tears of Light quests and Dominion Rod subquests are absolutely not better than the whole of Lanayru Desert.
>>332564854
That's very clearly shitposting, but people liked Skyward Sword when it came out. They hated it too. Skyward Sword's divisive, it's always been divisive.
>>332557908
I get legitimately upset when I remember Skyward Sword.
>>332557908
After playing Twilight Princess HD, TPHD is absolutely weaker than Skyward Sword.
Also, if you can't get the motion controls to work in SS, you are a fundamentally broken human being.
>>332557908
I loved the game. I thought WW was crap and never played TP.
It's not a bad game though
Controls are great unless your pretending you have carpel tunnel
The only real flaws are the handholding and the linearity due to the sky's Map, otherwise the areas themselves are very explorable
>>332565670
Probably because you have autism.
>>332565816
I can get the controls right, I just don't like the motion controls in general.
>>332565236
>>332565524
I liked SS too but it's abundantly clear that they tried to blend fields and dungeons to the great detriment of general exploration. It's different but that overworld was NOT better unless you liked being railroaded harder than Spirit Tracks, and that game had trains as its central gimmick.
>>332557908
No way. Skyward Sword wasn't very good, but it was way better than Twilight Princess. The only reason that over done piece of shit gets all the recognition is because it was a lot of underage twats first Zelda game and girl gamers like it.
>>332566190
Oh, by overworld you meant the fields outside of the dungeons? Those were pretty fun. I thought you meant the sky, the sky sucked terribly.
Reminder that the only reason people like WW is because of its art style and nostalgia
>>332566979
I consider "not dungeons" to be the general overworld, and SS's wasn't awful on the whole but it's pretty unbalanced in favor of linear puzzle progression.
>>332557908
Ridiculed? By who?
/v/?
fucking Arin "cuck" Hanson?
The real world loves this game, and rightfully so. It's a good game.
>>332568247
>The real world loves this game
I know a ton of people that played this game IRL and they all range from "meh" to "I hated it".
Your precious hallway simulator is shit, get over it.
>>332568247
>The real world loves this game
Most gamers I talk with say they hate it...
>>332557908
I still don't like SS, TP or WW.
>>332557908
I know is a bad Zelda, but I like it and enjoyed it. I don't give a shit about others opinions.
Does anyone still have the SS "what I expected / what I got" image?
Whatever happened to the Zelda Valley of the flood game that was coming out?
Or gates of the realm?
Fuck that 3D noise, what does /v/ think the best top-down Zelda is? ALBW master race. It brought variety back into Zelda that will hopefully carry into Zelda U/NX/Whatever the next fucking one is.
>>332569806
Majora's Mask and Oracle of Seasons + Ages are the best Zelda games. It's that easy.
I liked it. The art style is easy on the eyes, the controls were actually good, despite the meming about it.
I'll rate it a solid 7/10
i want to fuck a fish
>>332569954
The Oracles were very good, forgot about those. Most people do. I would settle for a ALBW-ish remake of both, maybe with Links Awakening too.
>>332570162
forgot my pic
>>332557908
It'll probably get a better rep than it has now as people start to feel nostalgic for it, especially since it'll likely be a one off experiment in the long run now that Nintendo's moved away from motion, but I don't really see it getting the same cult following MM, WW and TP got.
The Wii's motion controls already show their age and make the game pretty inaccessible to most people since you're required to use the motion plus peripheral to play it.
>>332569806
Link's Awakening was the most fun on a first playthrough but I find Link to the Past infinitely more replayable since the dungeon order is pretty nonlinear and the overworlds way less labyrinthine.
>>332568247
Hahaha arin is a cuckold.
>>332569787
That was just a shitty troll image that got spammed over /v/.
If you seriously want a steam punk Zelda then just go ahead and kill yourself
>>332557908
Skyward Sword was the first Zelda game I've played and it's not so bad to be honest. I've never finished any Zelda game since, though.
>>332570932
It's a great game. Looks gorgeous when emulated, some of the best dungeon design in the series, excellent music and a lot of very clever things done with the controls.
But most people here are mongoloids who don't understand game design and want Zelda to be Dark Souls or Skyrim or some shit. They'll criticize it with a lot of meaningless buzzwords in order to sound smart without actually saying anything.
The only thing that bothers me about this game is that there really isn't an overworld at all, even the "outside" areas are basically just puzzles. Oh, and the controls are far from perfect. They did cool things with them, but the controller just does not work the way it needs to.
>>332565476
I understand why someone would dislike the Tears of Light quests, but the Dominion Rod quest seems fine to me. What's so bad about it?
>>332557908
I liked it the day it came out
>>332557908
>no amount of bitching will ever change that.
But ZeldaNXbeing somehow even worse could.
>>332571185
>some of the best dungeon design in the series
I actually thought it had the worst dungeons out of all the 3D games. The only two that stood out were the Ancient Cistern and Sandship, with the rest being totally forgettable or over in a flash. Even Wind Wakers left a bigger lasting impression and while I'm a fan of that game its dungeons are not its strong suit.
The Lanayru sections were well done and the music is good like you'd usually expect from Zelda, but the Wii didn't really take advantage of the games aesthetic at all and the rest of it was repetitive fetch quests and simon says combat.
I don't really think it deserves hate the same way games like Sticker Star and Other M get so much negative feedback, its not really offensive. It's just fucking boring as hell.
>>332568247
>>332569261
>>332569326
>>332557908
It was okay for a video game, average for a Zelda game, which is why it gets all the hate.
Everyone remembers the shitty parts, but this game still had redeeming segments.
The sand ocean was fucking awesome.
Groose being a dick, but then turns out to be the best bro you ever had.
>>332558021
came here to post this
>>332557908
SS is better than TP and WW in terms of dungeons, artstyle, combat, supporting characters, andoverworld.
I bet you attacked The Imprisoned's toes.
>>332557908
I've got a lot more respect for it than something like Twilight Princess. It actually brought a lot of new, good ideas to the table, ideas I'd like to see revisited and improved in future Zelda games. Twilight Princess, while enjoyable, brought nothing to the series. Compared to a lot of series, despite criticisms to the contrary, Zelda actually does make an effort to switch things up and keep the experience fresh. Twilight Princess didn't make that effort, Skyward Sword did.
>>332572119
>and overworld
How
The surface sections are functionally mini-dungeons. The actual overworld is the sky which is an empty void with one town and a bunch of treasure chests.
>>332562092
Monsters Inc. describes at least 3 of the bosses.
>lizafos battles with the wiimote
I just slashed like crazy and hoped for the best
>>332571185
>But most people here are mongoloids who don't understand game design and want Zelda to be Dark Souls or Skyrim or some shit. They'll criticize it with a lot of meaningless buzzwords in order to sound smart without actually saying anything.
Oh please. Dark Souls and Skyrim are nothing fucking alike. Regardless of what you otherwise think of the game, modern Zelda wishes it returned to the kind of progression that Dark Souls hadbut holy shit who's idea was it to only have the guy in red give you the key to drain the place after you get the Lordvessle? That's just fucking stupid.
>>332565860
This.
Take off these two things you mentioned and then you have a game that's better than TP and WW.
>>332572367
Nah, only the Kraken was bad, the others go from acceptable to great.
BOMB BOWLING
O
M
B
B
O
W
L
I
N
G
I dunno, I liked it
>>332573218
I like the boss battles. I'm just saying that in addition to Tantalus, Scaldera and Bilocyte also look like Monsters Inc characters. Scaldera is red mike and Bilocyte is mike's girlfriend with webbing, whatever her name is.
>>332572280
>The surface sections are functionally mini-dungeons.
Yes, this is much better than a Zora's Domain or Dragon Roost Island prefacing a dungeon.
>The actual overworld is the sky which is an empty void with one town and a bunch of treasure chests.
The Sky is much better than OoT's, MM's, or TP's empty fields and it's better than the Great Sea just by virtue of how much faster it is to move through. Plus you have the actual 'provinces' when you compared it to WW and that game's shitty islands. Goddess chests at least have free quivers or bomb bags. WW is full of heart containers you don't need. I liked that all my shops and most of the side quests were in the same one town. I was way more likely to do them that way compared to someone needing help in a town I'll visit twice or less.
I liked it
It established a ton of lore and had a pretty tight end boss, not to mention made canon that link and zelda fucked like rabbits on the surface
it had a lot of likable characters but absolutely denied any sort of replay when it stops you in your tracks every 5 minutes to explain something
>>332573707
>The Sky is much better than OoT's, MM's, or TP's empty fields
Opinion invalidated, fuck off.
>>332573660
This and pocketing bomb flowers were great additions.
>>332571491
Not that anon but
>go to ilia in kakariko
>smell the medicine in hyrule castle town
>fight the skeleton dogs that only appear at night
>get the idol and take it to ilia in kakariko
>go to hidden village and get horse call
this is the worst possible scenario (everyone's first time)
>go back to ilia at kakariko
>go back to hidden village to get the book
>go back to kakariko to shad
>make a nice big lap around all the hyrule field sections
Shit was tedious even if you show Impaz the rod on your first visit.
>>332574218
Great argument.
>>332573707
>empty
That word doesn't mean what you think it means.
WW's Great Sea actually contained a ton of different collectible shit even if a lot of it was not very useful, and I don't know why you're whining about the travel time when that was fixed in HD.
SS's sky in comparison is significantly emptier. There was no reason for it to lack THAT much content considering that the main island and Pumpkin Landing were the only two locations in the entire map that weren't just floating rocks. At least many of WW's islands had a puzzle or two to solve.
>>332574878
No, You're a great argument.
>>332557908
I really liked the combat and the first time I played SS was 3 months ago.
>>332573707
>Yes, this is much better than a Zora's Domain or Dragon Roost Island prefacing a dungeon.
Maybe the Lanayru sections.
Faron Woods and Eldin Volcano had a terrible habit of repeating the same shit over and over again. You climb Eldin on the same route three different times, once as an escort mission and once as a stealth mission. You do a fetch quest in the same Faron Woods location three times, with the audacity of making you redo a dungeon and forcing swimming controls into one of them.
It's like an entire game built from the padding segments of Twilight Princess. I have no fucking idea why they designed the overworlds around linear dungeon gameplay then had you trek through them four different times over the course of the game. By the time you were getting the song I was exhausted with them.
>The Sky is much better than OoT's, MM's, or TP's empty fields and it's better than the Great Sea just by virtue of how much faster it is to move through.
How the fuck do you call Hyrule, Termina and the Great Sea empty and then praise the Sky?
It takes even longer to traverse the sky and it has a fraction of the amount of things to do in it. If you replaced the entire thing with fucking Mario 64 paintings the game would be outright better for it because recycling the island system without any of the things that made the Great Sea work was such a waste of time.
It also controlled like complete ass.
>>332567406
It sure as fuck wasn't the dungeons.
>>332573707
>just by virtue of how much faster it is to move through
It actually takes quite a bit of time to move from one side of the sky to the other, and unlike the games before it, it was actually LITERALLY empty.
>>332558141
Sorry man, but the dungeons in SS were qual-ee-tee.
But man, that overworld was easily the weakest of the three.WW the best, if you like sailing.
>>332576618
It also never added a quicker mode of transporation.
OoT, MM, WW and TP give you thinks like Epona, the swift sail and warp points by the time you'll be doing a lot of backtracking around the overworld to speed up the process of getting around on the field.
Skyward Sword has the bird statues on the surface when you're using the level select columns but you never get something like a faster loftwing for maneuvering around the sky itself.
>>332557908
But I've always liked it.
>>332575539
>even if a lot of it was not very useful
When I replayed WW(HD) for the first time in years I had stopped going to the extraneous islands and exploring because the rewards weren't worth it.
You're even making the mistake I already talked about, which is comparing only the Sky to the Sea when SS also has areas you can land in that are much better than any island in WW.
Plus the Great Sea is tedious to transverse until you get the warp. This isn't just plain and simple fixed in HD, you have to deal with the auction minigame. Is really is this such a great fix just that it's faster? It's still empty as fuck because the rewards for exploring are useless and therefore the islands containing them are useless. It's not like the "use the hookshot" or "press the switch" puzzles are exactly worth mentioning in WW. Goddess Cubes and the occasional puzzle island are about the same thing as those.
The Sky doesn't need to have as much shit in it as the Great Sea because it's a smaller percentage of SS than the Sea is of WW.
>>332557908
>Mark my words, 5-10 years from now this game will still be just as ridiculed as it is today. It'll forever be remembered as the ugly duckling of the mainline console titles and no amount of bitching will ever change that.
Honestly that depends.
If we get a console Zelda that's even worse than Skward Sword, then you can expect it to be replaced as the black sheep of the franchise. And considering how bad Nintendo's track record is now, I would be surprised if Zelda U turns out to be another steaming pile of dog shit.
>>332558358
Nope. Only (paid or balless) reviewers. They probably didn't want the TP 8.0 scenario happening to them.
>>332558527
There is no cycle. There never was.
It's all just a combination of new fans with their babby's first Zelda game + the series getting consistently shittier over time.
>>332575759
>Faron Woods and Eldin Volcano had a terrible habit of repeating the same shit over and over again.
Yeah, when in a Zelda game have you ever needed to go to the same area again once it's changed somehow? Definitely never happened in ALttP, OoT, MM, or TP. And I love that you call it the "audacity" of revisiting a dungeon while you try to paint is as if you are literally playing the dungeon in the same way again. I thought it was actually cool to revisit a dungeon, that doesn't really happen in Zelda games. You know except for Phantom Hourglass and that was terrible.
>then had you trek through them four different times over the course of the game. By the time you were getting the song I was exhausted with them.
Don't tell me you actually moved through those areas the same way as you did the first time you visited them. The shortcuts you enable and having the clawshot changes that shit up. It's not like the flooded woods behaves anything like it did unflooded.
>How the fuck do you call Hyrule, Termina and the Great Sea empty and then praise the Sky?
Because the OoT field is empty, Termina is tiny, TP is big and somewhat empty (oh boy another 50 rupees that won't fit in my wallet). The Great Sea is slow, tedious, and not worth exploring because the last thing you need in WW is another heart piece. The Sky is fast to travel unless you're an idiot that doesn't use the multiple boost rocks that even make paths around the islands you'd want to visit like the Lumpy Pumpkin. It takes all of 10 seconds to reach the Eldin point from Skyloft unless you try to make it take longer. I think it's laughable you think the Great Sea "worked." At least Goddess chests have quivers and medals.
>It also controlled like complete ass.
If you're an invalid maybe. I bet you didn't use a sensor bar or know how to reset your sword with vertical slashes instead of the calibration screen in the menu.
>>332577283
>When I replayed WW(HD) for the first time in years I had stopped going to the extraneous islands and exploring because the rewards weren't worth it.
Because you already know what those rewards do and how to solve all the puzzles on the islands. I don't personally give a shit, I'm just grateful that there's something THERE (unlike Skyward Sword) and I just like fucking around and collecting everything.
>You're even making the mistake I already talked about, which is comparing only the Sky to the Sea when SS also has areas you can land in that are much better than any island in WW
The surface areas aren't better than anything in OoT, MM, WW or TP though. The layout of everything in Faron and Eldin is a chore to navigate through, not to mention that the activities you're forced to do in both of those provinces somehow manage to be even more mindless and tedious than TP's filler segments.
>It's still empty as fuck because the rewards for exploring are useless and therefore the islands containing them are useless
Again, you don't actually understand the definition of "empty". Whether an overworld has content has absolutely nothing to do with the utility (or lack thereof) of its collectibles; saying "I don't like these rewards, therefore it's empty waaaah" is not an argument, it's just you being overly petulant.
If anything, WW's Great Sea by definition has the most cluttered overworld of all the 3D Zeldas.
>It's not like the "use the hookshot" or "press the switch" puzzles are exactly worth mentioning in WW. Goddess Cubes and the occasional puzzle island are about the same thing as those.
Not when you oversimplify them like that. And no, they're not.
>The Sky doesn't need to have as much shit in it as the Great Sea because it's a smaller percentage of SS than the Sea is of WW.
Weak argument, because the amount of empty space in the sky in proportion to actual content is far, FAR wider of a gap in SS than it is in WW.
Don't be retarded.
>>332577283
>which is comparing only the Sky to the Sea when SS also has areas you can land in that are much better than any island in WW.
There's exactly two things in the sky ever worth visiting. Skyloft and the pumpkin farm.
There's no reason for the rest of it to even be there. The treasure chests might as well be on the surface itself since the Goddess Cubes act as keys for them and are all on the surface already. They're only there to hide how there's literally nothing to do in the sky.
Its a glorified level select.
>>332578682
You are an idiot. Ah ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha haaaaa
>>332576618
>It actually takes quite a bit of time to move from one side of the sky to the other,
Not if you use the boost rocks anon.
>and unlike the games before it, it was actually LITERALLY empty.
So your big thing is that it was "sky" painted instead of green and brown? Just like the Great Sea you have random rupees appearing, some enemies like MM, WW, and TP had, and goddess chests.
>>332578874
No, I'm not talking about the fact that it was a sky. I mean it was literally empty in almost every conceivable way. Previous games had a variety of collectibles, SS just had goddess chests and there weren't many of them either.
Also, boost rocks don't shave that much time for the amount of boring bullshit you have to wade through up there.
>>332578682
>Because you already know what those rewards do and how to solve all the puzzles on the islands.
No, because I don't need heart pieces in one of the easiest Zelda games. There is no reward to WW's extra smaller islands, they're shit. I love how fags like you just keep insisting SS has nothing in the Sky at all when that's demonstrably wrong.
>The surface areas aren't better than anything in OoT, MM, WW or TP though.
But they are. Those games you mentioned are linear as fuck when it comes to a specific area, as is SS so that's a wash. SS however changes when you revisit areas, either by changing the landscape or by the items you have. Lanayru desert, where the tear segment is, is a very different path when you have the clawshot for example.
>Again, you don't actually understand the definition of "empty".
Oh you.
>saying "I don't like these rewards, therefore it's empty waaaah" is not an argument, it's just you being overly petulant.
Sorry I don't explore just for exploration's sake, I need a reason. WW's reason was mostly heart pieces which are completely unnecessary in that game.
>WW's Great Sea by definition has the most cluttered overworld of all the 3D Zeldas.
I don't know what you think you're saying by this, but it's becoming very clear you're a WWfag.
>Weak argument
Actually it's a pretty steadfast argument. The Sky doesn't have to have as much content as the Sea because it's less of the game. And again, you've managed to ignore the land sections in SS and are only taking the content in the Sky vs it's size as if that's all there is to SS. There is much more to SS than just the Sky.
Don't be so smug.
>>332579734
Nigga pls.
>>332578459
>Yeah, when in a Zelda game have you ever needed to go to the same area again once it's changed somehow? Definitely never happened in ALttP, OoT, MM, or TP.
In those games the regions aren't designed linearly into rooms broken up by small puzzles. That's the difference.
Skyward Swords design philosophy would have worked if it kept introducing new things throughout the whole game like Lanayru did. Instead it blows its load in the first third, realizes there's nothing left and keeps tacking on increasingly obnoxious filler missions like tears of light to stretch out the game.
>Don't tell me you actually moved through those areas the same way as you did the first time you visited them. The shortcuts you enable and having the clawshot changes that shit up.
These changes were even more minimal than the changes to the Ocean King Temple in Phantom Hourglass when you revisited them.
It's still the same area and play the same way.
>Because the OoT field is empty, Termina is tiny
Both of these are much faster to traverse all the way across than the sky and have far more shit to explore in them.
And in all four of those games you get warp systems to easily get to the major areas instantly when you want to, so even if you just care about faster travel Skyward Sword is worse. If you want to get from Eldin to Lanayru the only way to do it is to find a bird statue, warp back up to the sky hub, fly to the area manually and enter its light column.
Its easily the worst Zelda overworld to date regardless of whether you care about just getting to dungeons as quickly as possible or spending time exploring.
>At least Goddess chests have quivers and medals.
The only goddess cube medal that was worth using was the treasure one to speed up the upgrading process.
>>332578746
>Its a glorified level select.
Yeah, by design anon. You aren't saying anything that the devs haven't. The fact of the goddess cubes is that the chests are in the sky and therefore you have more than just Skyloft and the Lumpy Pumpkin to visit.
>Also, boost rocks don't shave that much time for the amount of boring bullshit you have to wade through up there.
Yes, yes they do. Especially when you find the paths that use multiple of them. Those boost rocks are why you can get to the Pumpkin or Eldin so fast.
All 3D Zelda is shit. ALTTP is the last good game in the series.
>>332580664
FUCK YOU
>>332580664
Links Awakening and the Oracles came out after LttP though
>>332580664
faggot
>>332580790
did she stutter?
>>332579734
>I love how fags like you just keep insisting SS has nothing in the Sky at all when that's demonstrably wrong.
Okay, it has next-to-nothing in the sky at all. Happy?
>SS however changes when you revisit areas, either by changing the landscape or by the items you have. Lanayru desert, where the tear segment is, is a very different path when you have the clawshot for example.
It doesn't change when you revisit areas just because there's a couple of new shortcuts introduced when you revisit, that's the most retarded logic I've ever heard. The vast majority of the time you're still trecking through the EXACT same paths you did when you first played through those areas.
And why are you even mentioning Lanayru? That was like the only surface area in SS that was actually pretty decent.
>Sorry I don't explore just for exploration's sake, I need a reason. WW's reason was mostly heart pieces which are completely unnecessary in that game.
That's fine, I'm not saying you have to like WW. My point was that you saying it's "empty" is objectively wrong by definition. There's no way around that.
>I don't know what you think you're saying by this, but it's becoming very clear you're a WWfag.
You realize that "cluttered" has a negative connotation, right?
But since you inquired, I'm actually an MMfag.
>And again, you've managed to ignore the land sections in SS and are only taking the content in the Sky vs it's size as if that's all there is to SS. There is much more to SS than just the Sky.
Except there isn't for reasons I and others have already explained. Nice try though.
>>332580620
>Liking fourth edition
>>332580664
>not Minish Cap
>>332557908
But it's fine. It's pretty, great soundtrack, interesting art style and unorthodox but surprisingly accurate motion controls that are actually fun to use.
Solid 8/10, great Zelda game. Fuck the cycle.
>>332557908
Like it or not, the cycle still applies. Shits are coming out of the woodwork and defending Skyward Sword and I HATE them.
Fi has the best theme music of all Links companions.
>>332582342
Fi was such a disappointment.
I loved her theme, design, concept and dances but holy shit she was insufferable.
>>332580227
>In those games the regions aren't designed linearly into rooms broken up by small puzzles.
You're right, they're linear sections without small puzzles. Name any area in OoT or TP that isn't linear. You seem to acknowledge Lanayru was pretty good so I'll drop that area, but even if you didn't like the flooded woods you can't deny how radically different that visit is. Nothing changes that much in 3D Zelda except probably Snowhead.
>filler missions like tears of light
See I enjoyed those four little diversions, because they changed the gameplay and didn't take up too much time. But this isn't really something to argue, if you didn't like them then that's that.
>It's still the same area and play the same way.
A flooded woods that means you literally don't set foot on the same ground you did the first time and an item-focused stealth area with no sword are just nothing to you? It blows my mind that you can honestly say those sections play the same as the first visits.
>Both of these are much faster to traverse all the way across than the sky
I said Termina is tiny and we all know OoT field is nothing when you have Epona. You can't tell me those first 2 or 3 trips as Child Link aren't annoying though. At least with the Sky you don't have to listen to the rolling noise over and over.
>And in all four of those games you get warp systems to easily get to the major areas instantly
And in SS you can pick where in an area you land instead of just one warp per area. I'm not saying SS is better here, but it's not like it has nothing in this category. And don't act like finding a bird statue is exactly hard because they're common as shit.
>Its easily the worst Zelda overworld to date
I think you're losing sight of what it's compared to. SS has a better overworld than OoT by virtue of it changing along. I mean OoT has non-linear dungeon order, but those areas themselves are extremely linear so at least SS's gives you new linear paths to take when you revisit.
>>332581459
>SS is empty because I don't care about the shit in it!
>WW isn't empty, even if you don't care about the shit in it!
You know, whatever man.
>>332584179
You should just admit you're illiterate at this point.
The sky having a teensy little bit of content in the sky doesn't change the fact that it still pales in number compared to its predecessors.
>>332557908
But people love Skyward Sword
http://www.metacritic.com/game/wii/the-legend-of-zelda-skyward-sword
The Zelda cycle is real, and it's not gonna stop for Skyward Sword. Anyone who disagrees only disagrees because they are guilty of the Zelda cycle themselves. If you weren't, you'd notice that other people do this.
>>332557908
People said the same exact thing about The Wind Waker and Twilight Princess, by the way. Even fewer people remember that Majora's Mask was absolutely hated by a large base of people who hated the timed system and were put off by the dark atmosphere.
>>332584550
>The sky having a teensy little bit of content in the sky doesn't change the fact that it still pales in number compared to its predecessors.
>its predecessors
Yeah there's just so much to do in OoT's Hyrule Field man. Termina manages to have more enemies and a spot to play songs for rupees. TP's fields are empty as fuck unless more money is your thing, or stamps in HD.
You can not like SS's Sky, but don't pretend like it's the worst Hyrule Field we've had.
>>332584835
I only played SS 3 months ago and I'll forever be branded as part of the cycle.
>games keep getting worse
>people blame zelda cycle
Even Aonuma invoked it, he's a fucking hack.
I've liked pretty much every Zelda ever released, barring the CDI games since I never played em.
I don't think any of them are inherently bad.
>>332585271
Yeah, worst empty overworlds in worst to best is probably TP field, SS sky, OoT field, WW ocean, and I even hate the WW's ocean.
I at least like that all of the important shit in OoT's field was smartly placed to avoid mindless endless travel. Sure there was nothing to do in it, but at least kakariko, zora river, hyrule castle, and the lost woods are all kind of on one side of the map in their own corner, so the beginning of the game you're just kind of swapping from kakariko to hyrule castle a few times which are right next to each other. The entrance of Lon Lon ranch faces hyrule castle/kakariko so it's not too bad of a walk, and gerudo desert requires a horse anyway as it's the only out of the way place.
>>332585428
But SS>TP>WW.I like dungeons though.
>>332585271
>Termina
Stopped reading there. It's obvious you've never played MM.
>>332564854
Of the 3D Zeldas? Sure. If you're counting the actual overworld as in the outside-of-the-dungeons surface world, that's fantastic. If you're counting the Sky, it's pointless but entirely painless and fast.
Beats big and empty time wasters (like TP/WW) and is a bit more pretty and interesting conceptually than the Hyrule Field/Termina Field of OoT/MM while being something you spend no time in whatsoever just like those.
Zelda cycle doesn't exist, it's just some peoples' opinions become louder and more visible than others'
That and simplistic rating of a game on a scale from "it's a piece of shit" to "it's GOAT". Instead of admitting they liked some part of the game and hated others.
The one thing I'll never get about Skyward Sword praise is how some people praise it for superior combat.
Like, even disregarding the control scheme its slow and almost feels turn based. Your range of abilities is limited compared to the previous 3D Zelda's with less sword techniques to play with and cumbersome items that aren't very useful in regular combat and nearly every enemy in the game uses the same directional shield blocking technique.
It felt so repetitive and mindless.
>>332563874
>TP
>on the wii
Found the problem
>>332585271
None of the other fields forced you to use motion controls to get around, though, and they typically, at the very least, served the purpose of making the world feel big and interconnected. The sky just hammered home the fact that the areas are disjointed as fuck.
I mean, I won't be defending the overworlds of previous Zeldas, they all had problems too. SS just happens to continue the proud tradition of 3D Zeldas having shitty empty fields that serve little purpose, in addition to all of its other flaws.
>>332586790
But the Wii version was the best. Widescreen support alone makes it better.
I didn't really get into MM, how was its hyrule field?
Even if it was empty, at least they kind of smartly put the four main locations across the 4 exits of clock town.
Anyways, if zelda u doesn't have as easy and convenient fast travel as xenoblade x, I already won't enjoy it. I've been so spoiled by xenoblade x, where all you do is touch the screen a few times and you instantly fast travel. If I have to make sure I'm outside, and then equip a certain item, and then memorize a specific song, and then it goes "do you want to fast travel?" and then there's 3 minutes of loading, and then I have to recall my horse with another song because it didn't travel with me, and there's only like 6 fast travel points designated on the map, it's shit
>>332557908
But Wind Waker has and always will be the ugly duckling
>>332586932
Its just a small ring around Clock Town.
There's some hidden items, npcs and songs in it but its mostly just a way to transition from the town to the cardinal direction regions.
>>332568069
But that's pretty fun, though. You could tell the same guy who made the Oracle games was behind it, because SS and the Oracle games both had the kind of progression where you had actual obstacles outside of dungeons in very distinct zones that you had to go through to reach those dungeons.
>>332558358
No, but I do remember dumbasses buying the game only to emulate it using dolphin WITH the disc.
I still don't fucking understand why ANYONE would do that.
>>332587049
Wind Waker is one of the most praised and popular games in the series these days.
The Zelda cycle term was coined after its popularity spiked post-TP.
>>332587049
WW may be the ugly duckling, but SS will be the ugly unwanted Cuckoo we were tricked into, and it becomes more and more of a disgusting burden.
>>332586912
Here's a (you)
>>332586221
WW is a bit hard to compare because the Sea is the focus of the game much more than Hyrule Field is in OoT for example. Content that'd normally be in other areas is instead in the Sea, that's why I get so hung up on people calling the Sky empty in comparison to the Sea when SS has the land to put content in too. It's not that the comparison is wrong, it just ignores the different natures of the Sky and Sea. I still want to say the Sky is better than OoT's Hyrule Field.
And then you go on that OoT's field is empty, but at least all the good stuff is centralized. You know what other Zelda game has a fairly sparse area with all the important shit centrally located?Skyward Sword.
>The entrance of Lon Lon ranch faces hyrule castle/kakariko so it's not too bad of a walk
From the forest it is.
In Skyward Sword, I feel like traveling the sky is a bit tedious when you keep returning to the song island in the thunderhead. I can admit that. However, most of the time I think those boost rocks and the paths you can create out of them are pretty fast, especially if you're just going from a province to Skyloft or vice versa. I think its travel lengths have been embellished by time's passing.
>>332587049
Low quality b8.
>>332587731
>muh left hand
>muh waggle
>>332586637
It's like a bad, less thought out version of punch out.
>>332586637
See, that complaint confuses me even more. Zelda's combat has never been particularly great, and it's always been a lock-on, button-mashing affair with an overly safe shield on top of that.
Skyward Sword let you attack from range with Skyward Strikes, you could fake out enemies to change where they blocked and then hit in a different direction, and in general it turned even smaller encounters into a game of Punch-Out. The fact you could react to everything strictly with the control you had with your sword and at no point had to rely on your shield (even if it was an option) was fantastic. Just everything about it was more satisfying and offered more control.
>>332587773
>From the forest it is.
It's been a while, but are you supposed to go there from the forest? I mean, I guess you can make it your first destination as soon as you enter hyrule field, but even then it's on the way to the castle. Once you visit hyrule castle, all you're doing for a while is visiting hyrule castle to kakariko a few times, which the ranch is staring you in the face to visit it any time, and then you can go to zora river eventually.
>>332557908
It has good dungeons, so that automatically makes it better than Wind Waker.
>>332586637
Ehh, I can't agree with that.
I mean I dislike SS too, mainly because I'm not crazy about the overworld, but the combat is fucking stellar and was the main reason I decided to stick around until the very end.
I have a Wii-U code to give out for the Hyrule Legends characters but there's no active thread to be found on /vg/ or /v/. Should i wait till tomorrow or make a new thread? I wanted to play a little game to make it fun but I don't think the mods would appreciate me making a whole new thread just to give a code away.
SS had fun combat. Everything else in the game was shit. It's just a bad game.
>>332588721
You should just give it to me to be honest
>>332586452
But I have. N64 cart is around here somewhere too.
>>332586883
>None of the other fields forced you to use motion controls to get around
What are you gonna argue that SS has shit dungeons regardless of their design because they make you use motion controls to play them too? It's not worth going into it with you if you're just gonna cry motion controls.SS controls fine, stop fucking up.
>>332589264
SS's controls are garbage, even if they "work"
>>332586637
>almost feels turn based
>items that aren't very useful in regular combat
Sounds like OoT's sequelitis all over again.
>>332586912
Aiming wasn't worth the waggle sword.Mirrored world triggered my tisms too.
>>332589264
There's a difference between "use motion controls to interact with things" and "you HAVE to use motion controls the entire time simply to move"
Same reason everyone hated all the underwater segments.
>>332576964
Who the fuck thinks SS dungeons were good? They're average at best. They rely heavily on mechanical elements like swimming, running and combat, and have absolute garbage puzzles and boring, linear layouts.
I think the only one that made me rub two brain cells together was the pirate ship for some of the parts where you had to use the time switch.
>>332588305
Forest to Hyrule Castle is what I'm saying is a long walk, I wasn't that clear though.
>>332590561
Ancient Cistern and Sandship were some of the best 3D Zelda dungeons.
>>332590561
some had some good ideas, but yeah they were completely ruined by being too easy, or having the game constantly hold your hand, and most of the new items were pretty shit which made some of the dungeon obstacles seem stupid and arbitrary like "blow on a pinwheel to open the door!" or "use a whip to activate this switch that's just randomly on the wall"
>>332583670
>I mean OoT has non-linear dungeon order, but those areas themselves are extremely linear
No. There's generally a specific entrance that you need to get to in order to progress to the next area of a given part, but the game allows and encourages you to freely explore the areas you do have access to in ways that SS does not. SS's world is much more segmented in every meaningful way.
>>332588790
>SS had fun combat. Everything else in the game was shit. It's just a bad game.
Dungeons too anon.
>>332589886
>Same reason everyone hated all the underwater segments.
You mean because they're too stupid to work motion controls?
>>332589623
Top lel.
>>332590561
Time switch puzzles were the best, but SS dungeons were weak overall. I think people confuse neat aesthetics with good design. Ancient Cistern has a really cool theme but if you strip away the graphics it's nothing special. Then you've got a boring generic forest temple and TWO boring generic lava temples. The ship is really the only one that manages to be interesting to play and have an interesting theme, and it also happens to have the worst boss.
>>332580664
ALTTP is the first mediocre game in the series. I'm glad things picked back up after it.
>>332591071
>but the game allows and encourages you to freely explore the areas you do have access to
Yeah, remember all that exploration in Death Mountain, Zora's River/Domain, Lake Hylia, Gerudo's Canyon/Desert, and getting into the Shadow Temple? Me neither.
>>332591169
top lel isn't a counterargument. Mass Effect 3 is a working game, doesn't stop it from being garbage. Amiibo festival is a perfectly functional party game, it's garbage though.
I don't have that many complaints about the motion controls being broken, but they're such a tiresome burden.Even the few times I do think the controls are legit broken, I won't mention it, because the game has much greater flaws, but Stupid SS babbies will ignore all of my other criticisms and immediately start attacking me with "HURRR ITS UR FAULT THE CONTROLS DON'T WORK, YOU RETARDED APE, THEY WORK PERFECTLY FINE!"
>>332591619
>top lel isn't a counterargument.
No shit, I never said it was. You didn't make an argument to counter. The entire rest of your post is useless because you're having a conversation about something I'm not saying. And that spoiler that goes straight to labeling your opposition, 'I could bring up this thing that proves my point but I won't,' playing the victim, AND strawmanning my position. Fuck off. If you have an argument, make it instead of hiding behind all this shit.
>>332591169
>If you don't like it, it's because you're too stupid
>There is literally no other reason to dislike this thing
SSfags are so obnoxious.
>>332592193
>The entire rest of your post is useless because you're having a conversation about something I'm not saying
>it's okay for my posts to be useless though TOP LEL
>>332591619
You don't have an argument in the first place. The controls work, and it seems stupid to be complaining about them given you can perfectly control it with just wrist movements, and you don't even have to point it at the TV or anything because of the motion plus and instant resetting with down on the dpad.
>>332557908
It feels like this is copypastad from one of all these threads shitting on Twilight Princess, but with Skyward Sword slapped as the image instead.That being said, the copypasta is way more true for SS than TP.
>>332586912
You do realize that the Wii can't do true widescreen, right? The resolution is still 640x480 in 16x9, so you'll have lower clarity from stretched pixels.
4:3 480p GCN TP on GameCube or 16:9 1080p TPHD on Wii U.
>>332592349
You didn't say you didn't like it, you said "...everyone hated all the underwater segments." And you weren't even talking about quality of the controls, just that having to use them to move is inherently bad and ruins those sections. How the fuck to you want me to respond to that? You're just like the other anon, you get what you give.
>>332592383
>doesn't make an argument
>expects others to make a counter argumenttop lel
You see the Zycle has gotten redefined so many times that it's honestly fucking stupid to cling to any version of it as fact
>ALBW broke the cycle because people liked it
>nope, Zycle only matters with console zeldas
>People liked Zelda 1, Alttp, and OoT on release
>nope, Zycle only applies to 3D games after OoT
>plenty of people still hated TP up until it got a re-release, and some still hate it
So really, it's pointless. What are you even trying to prove by saying the Zycle is in effect? Wanna prove the Zelda fanbase is shit? Well no shit! Everyone knows this already, so there's no point to acknowledging this dumb theory about the reception of future games.
That said Zelda U is gonna be a disappointment, some retards will defend SS, other retards will shout Zelda Cycle, and the remainder of the fandom will actually try to see it for what it is and keep thinking poorly of SS
>>332592735
>guys look it worked for 30 seconds these controls are perfect
webm is old, nobody falls for it anymore
>>332592735
>You don't have an argument in the first place
The person I replied to implied that another anon hated the controls because they were broken. My post stated that even if something works doesn't automatically make it good. Your post also missed this point. That was my argument.
Also
>bit block nintendo defense force with his own isolated context example means the controls are perfect.
I'm sure you could also record thousands of examples of fucked up controls. But like I said, I don't want to go too deep into calling the controls broken, because annoying SS faggots like you get tunnel vision and immediately start defending the controls and implying that broken controls are the only reason that game anyone could possibly think this game is shit
>>332588305
>and then you can go to zora river eventually
I do regret that they added the rocks to block you. It's something that ideally could have changed in the remake. Otherwise, I'd agree that the intelligent placement of things around the field is yet another aspect of OoT which deserve praise.
>>332592735
>perfectly control it with wrist movements
>post an example where he waves his entire arm/arms/torso to get working controls
Fuck off Skyward Shill
Honestly, I love every Zelda game. And I think Skyward Sword is the weakest 3D Zelda.
http://strawpoll.me/7234235
>>332593272
here's my argument here though, anon>>332593530
Not even with me, that post made had zero quality substance even to other posters. "You mean because they're too stupid to work motion controls?" is a useless statement as well
>>332593792
You don't have to move your entire arm to get "working controls". A simple wrist if just as effective, if not more effective.
>>332557908
SO YOU HATU SKYWARD SWORDU BUT YOU RIKU TWIRIGHT PRINCESS NOW!?
>>332557908
The Zelda Cycle is just an observation of changing age demographics on /v/
The younger you were when you first played a game, the less critical you were and the more likely you'll hold fond memories. Every year we get new posters on /v/ while the older ones fall off. It wouldn't surprise me if there are people on here right now who first played TP when they were 8 or 9.
By 2018-2020 we'll see an influx of people who really enjoyed SS. Its just common sense.
I fucking hate this game.
Did you know that?
>>332592735
>even under zero stress in ideal conditions one of his horizontal slashes registers as an over-head swing.
how did nintendo release this turd?
>>332593873
Where's the option for none you shit lord.
>>332594121
Then post an example where someone gets consistent perfect controls without rotating their entire torso. Maybe also post one where you're actually in combat. Or maybe post one of the thousands of examples on youtube of the harp fucking up.
>>332557908
It was good when it came out.
It's still good now.
Sorry bout your troll thread
>>332594330
I played TP when I was 15 and I think its the best 3D Zelda aside from OoT and maybe MM.
>>332594371
I do too, anon. It's literally my most hated game. I know it's irrational, but just thinking about SS makes me so fucking mad, my blood pressure is raising just being in this thread, but I can't help but take advantage of an opportunity to shit on this pile of shit
>>332594567
Not answering the poll because the poll exists to gauge the reception of each console 3D Zelda in the eyes of Zelda fans
If you wouldn't rate any of them highly you are not in the statistic I'm looking for.
>>332593530
Because that argument is just kinda shitty. There's no reason to it, just being upset about motion controls existing or being used in a system where the controller you're using has built-in motion controls. It's no more arbitrary than pushing a button.
>>332594623
I played it when I was 16 and I thought it was trash
Nobody is trying to tell you that your individual opinion is wrong. It just explains the broad, shifting trends that we see on the internet.
It makes a hell of a lot more sense than "everybody keeps magically changing their opinion"
With the exception of Zelda II and the CD-i games, I strongly believe that there is no bad Zelda game.
Some Zelda games may not perform as well as others, but even then they're still better than a lot of shit on the market these days.
Twilight Princess and Skyward Sword not good enough for you? Okay, that's cool, but they're fucking gold compared to the shit you see on other systems.
>>332594567
Good thing its not there since that isn't the case
>>332594742
It's altogether the worst Zelda experience I can think of. I don't care if it's ridiculed now or later, it's just plain bad.
>>332594989
>I strongly believe that there is no bad Zelda game.
Spirit Tracks.
>>332594921
Yeah, true. The Zelda cycle refers to the changing age demographic of players, not the change of individual opinions.
Well, I'm almost 25 and still like it just as much as I did when I was 15 in 2006. I first played Wind Waker when I was 12 and don't think its better than TP at anything.
I loved Skyward Sword when it came out, but now I'm starting to like it less and less.
>>332594989
>but they're fucking gold compared to the shit you see on other systems.
are you for real
TP was pretty mediocre compared to similar games releasing at the same time. Look at Okami or Shadow of the Colossus.
>>332594895
>It's no more arbitrary than pushing a button.
Yes it fucking is. Pushing a button is simpler, faster, and more accurate than flicking your wrist. There were so many times where they forced you to use motion controls to balance/swim/fly when the control stick was literally unused, and would have also been objectively more accurate. They could have even used the control stick to move, and the motion controls to control the camera, but they fucked up.
There is NO REASON they couldn't have made the motion controls optional (except for maybe the swordplay). But they didn't. That's the definition of arbitrary.
>>332595253
Is this a meme? ST was 10 times better than Phantom Hourglass
Honestly, I had more fun with it than TP. Probably the best 2D dungeon design since Link's Awakening.
>>332595253
Spirit Tracks and Phantom Hourglass aren't bad Zelda games. They just deviate in overworld mechanics.
>>332595415
>TP was pretty mediocre compared to similar games releasing at the same time
Not really
>>332595647
ST was great, PH was garbage
>shit music
>shit dungeons
>shit final boss
And at least with the Train there was some shit to do. Like play Where's Waldo with the rabbits.
>>332593272
Maybe you could have responded with something that wouldn't make you look like an enormous chode, like "I didn't mind them"
Instead you went straight to "NOPE EVERYONE BUT ME IS STUPID, MOTION CONTROLS ARE GREAT"
The only bad Zelda games:
Zelda II: The Adventure of Link
Wand of Gamelon
Faces of Evil
Zelda's Adventure
Four Swords [Adventures] / Anniversary Edition
>>332595850
TP had a couple great dungeons, but there were some elements that were just shockingly bad
Compare the wolf controls and the "living world" to Okami
Compare the overworld and the bossfights to SotC
Compare the music in TP to either of those games
TP really wasn't a very good game.
>>332596291
Sorry, I forgot Skyward Sword.
>>332592735
Is your argument seriously just that it works so you aren't allowed to hate it?
Aside from the fact that many people did encounter very real issues with the system, even if it worked flawlessly, that doesn't make it good, that just makes it functional. Functional isn't good, it's the bare minimum of what a game should be.
>>332595871
>PH was garbage
No it wasn't.
>shit final boss
This is the only remotely valid complaint you have, and that's being generous.
>>332596291
You don't know shit about NES games if you think Zelda II is bad.
>>332596291
>Zelda II: The Adventure of Link
Oh, so you're one of THOSE people.
>>332596681
LOP LEL :3
>>332596681
>Is your argument seriously just that it works so you aren't allowed to hate it?
Nah
Is you argument seriously just that you don't like it so nobody is allowed to like it?
>>332596775
oh by all means, post those classic PH trackshard mode: anything that isn't Lineback's theme
>>332596791
>>332596780
>le Zelda 2 isn't a clunky, grindy piece of shit meme
classic
>>332596392
TP blows Okami and SotC out the water. Sorry to shatter your delusions.
The wolf controls are tight and responsive, and the twilight segments as a wolf are very fleshed out and add variety
>>332593460
>for 30 seconds
I don't recall the performance of the motion controls varying with time when I played.
>>332596865
>Nah
Then what is your argument?
>Is you argument seriously just that you don't like it so nobody is allowed to like it?
Of course not, you can like it if you want. Seems the majority of people here don't, though.
>>332596865
Not him, but this whole little mini debate started because someone said they didn't like the controls, then someone replied with "the controls are good, stop fucking up" then I said, just because they might be functional doesn't mean they are good, then the world's biggest faggot came in and started shitposting with top lels and bit block webms.
Just saying.
>>332597147
Gotta disagree with you, but I'm glad you enjoyed it so much
>>332597227
>Then what is your argument?
I don't have an argument
I'm just here to shout my opinions at other people, because I feel validated when people agree with me.
>>332594495
When? I mean, there's a swing 7 or 8 seconds in that looks like he meant it to be horizontal, but the initial movement is clearly more vertical, and then he sort of curves horizontally.
>>332594495
>even under zero stress
at what point do you ever feel stressed in a Zelda game?
>>332592735
If the controls didn't work for you, it's because you didn't have it set up well or your remote/bar is faulty. I literally had ZERO problems playing the game. It has plenty of glaring faults, but the controls aren't among them.
>>332597147
>and the twilight segments as a wolf are very fleshed out and add variety
It's been a while, but really? All I remember was "we threw some bugs in this giant open area to pad out the game length" or "he use your smellovision so we can make the wolf seem useful"
>>332597878
You know, having to have a correctly set up gyroscope/bar before the controls work ARE AN INHERENT PROBLEM WITH THE CONTROLS.
If this shit was mapped to buttons there would be no issue, they would be objectively more accurate. This is what I wish Skyward Shills would get through their heads. Having to recalibrate, even if you don't mind it, makes the controls objectively less accurate. Saying it was a faulty motion plus excuses the motion plus itself, and while I know you could also have a faulty button, that's less likely and more easily diagnosed.
ALL THEY FUCKING HAD TO DO WAS MAKE THE MOTION CONTROLS OPTIONAL, THAT'S ALL THEY HAD TO FUCKING SHITTING DO. I'M LEGITIMATELY MAD, THERE IS NOOOOOOOO DEFENDING THIS. YOU DON'T MIND THEM? THAT'S FINE, BUT YOU HAVE ZERO GROUND TO STAND ON WHEN SAYING THAT THEY COULDN'T HAVE JUST MADE EVERYONE HAPPY WITH A TRADITIONAL CONTROL SCHEME
>>332598769
>having to have a correctly set up gyroscope/bar before the controls work ARE AN INHERENT PROBLEM WITH THE CONTROLS
What?
>>332592735
Every fucking time.
Of those 30 or so attacks, about three of them are clearly misread. You see a few lunges that are late and several slashes that are at the wrong angle.
>>332597878
It worked most of the time for me but for some reason stabbing was always tricky and had a higher tendency of fucking up than anything else. Other than that, they were okay. Not as effective as buttons but they worked about as well as anticipated.
It really is the rest of the design that fucks the game over. The motion controls just happen to be the first and most readily noticeable thing about the game so it's the part that always gets brought up the most.
>>332599030
>about three
Specify which ones.
>>332599318
I can't waste my time on that. I'm right.
>>332599456
Okay :^)
>>332557908
I loved it day 1. Actually,like day -11 since it was leaked online about a week early and I pirated it
>>332598918
yes. Buttons aren't subject to faulty sensor bars, or inaccurate gyroscopes, or misinterpretations by the player. That means buttons are objectively more accurate than motion controls.
Or when the game simply says "swing the wii remote from side to side" there are so many ways to interpret that. You can hold the wii remote vertically as you do it, or you can swing the remote quickly or slowly, or only for one foot, or for 3 feet, etc. Buttons aren't subject to those kinds of interpretations, all you do is press and release.
This is why it pisses me off when people say "THEY WORKED FOR ME, SO THEY MUST BE PERFECT, ITS YOUR FAULT!" because maybe one person had a faulty sensor bar, or one person swung it too far of a distance. they are problems inherent to motion controls, that could have all been avoided with buttons
>>332558021
Bullshit
>>332599624
They could also be avoided by you setting it up properly though.
>>332592735
Now use a shield bash. Make sure it's perfectly timed, or else that beemos is going to stun you long enough for that electric bokoblin to stun you again while that second electric bokoblin shoves his fist up your ass.
Shit on TP all you want, but it was better than Wind Waker.
>>332599786
but setting shit up properly is an inherent problem that buttons aren't face with. Read please.
>>332600261
Do you complain about delicious dishes because you can't just shove them in the microwave? Setting up shit so that the controls is a one-time thing that takes like a minute. I wasn't having to constantly recalibrate shit when I played through he game, it just fucking worked. You're making up shit to compensate for the fact that you were too goddamn stupid to put the bar in the right place and close the fucking curtains. Set up is not a "problem", this applies to most things.
>>332600682
*so that the controls work
>>332600682
Buttons work with the curtains open. You are not addressing this. Buttons are objectively more accurate. Sorry.
>>332601232
But the motion controls are sufficiently accurate to read your movements correctly. You're not addressing his, your complaining about having to do something once. Sorry.
Since every 3D Zelda besides SS has gotten a remake, it stands to reason that they'll probably remake this, will they essentially remake it like WW/OoT/MM and introduce a normal control scheme, or will it be low effort and just a HD facelift like TP was?
>>332557908
In 5-10 years I won't be able to play it without digging out my Wii, a CRT and getting a shitload of batteries. What the fuck where they thinking by defining a Zelda game of all things by a controller?
>>332601492
*addressing this
*you're
Goddamn I'm dropping the ball today.
>>332595557
not that anon but
>doesn't see the reason behind it
>therefore there is no reason
or
>using dictionary definitions
>in non-literal, hyperbolic usage
I don't know which more accurately describes you, did motion controls touch you as a child?
>>332599318
Attack 4: Link attacks well after the player has slashed down.
Attack 8: The player swings the wiimote and nunchuck down, Link spin attacks upwards.
Attack 10: Player slashes near horizontally, Link attacks at a steep angle.
Attack 11/12/13: Link stabs slightly late (Link only starts stabbing when the players arm is already at full extension)
Attack 14: Link stabs extremely late (The player has already retracted his arm before Link even starts moving).
Attack 15/16/19/20/21/22/23: Same as 11/12/13. Link stabs late. 17 and 18 seem a bit better.
Most of these are just serious input lag on the thrust attack, but attack 8 is a total misread. Link literally attacks in the opposite direction from the direction the player moved the remote.
You'll be proven wrong when the next Zelda game gets released and it turns out to be so bad it makes SS look good in comparison.
>>332601668
I should note, the real problem with the SS motion controls is that they operate on an acceleration threshold approach. Most of his motions are entirely meaningless, and in particular the reason his thrusts are so slow is that he only actually reaches the required acceleration for a thrust to be registers when he jerks at the end of pushing out his arm. Some of the attacks seem to move at the wrong angle because his arm is moving in one direction when the wiimote reaches critical accel but then changes direction as the attack animation is playing.
>>332601668
>Attack 4
There is no additional delay, he winds up rather than doing a solid swift movement like the previous ones so it doesn't register until he's moving it fast.
>Attack 8
I guess I'll give you that, I seem to remember there being two variations on the spin but it's been a while.
>Attack 10
See >>332597598
>Attacks 11/12/13
Literally the same as the delays before. Again, consider when his arm has reached a good speed. Also consider the different nature altogether of the movement in the first place.
>Attack 14
I'll give you that one too.
>Attack 15/16/19/20/21/22/23
Same as two points ago.
Within actual gameplay, the delays are largely negligible since it's not fast-paced combat and you get punished for the wrong move rather than not being reaction-speed, so misreads are the bigger menace and they are few and far between, and when it's like attack 8 and it's just along the same axis but oppositely, it's USUALLY benign anyway. The game was perfectly playable.
>>332603025
I think one of the reasons so many people have issues, aside from not knowing the recalibration tips or using sensor bars, is that they assume whatever motion they think should trigger the attack actually does. SS's controls are a lot more responsive when you know exactly what triggers them, and it isn't always the exact same way you think to move like you just pointed out. The game in this way is less or even almost completely non-intuitive like they wanted. Once you start thinking of it as specific inputs like a jerk or a twist instead of "oh I'll just do what I want with my arm" I think most of the control issues really disappear.
>>332594582
>Then post an example where someone gets consistent perfect controls without rotating their entire torso.
>>332598769
they weren't replacing button presses, this isn't an issue like waggle to run in DKCR or the sword combat in TP
The SS combat was built from the start around motion controls, it would have been a completely different experience with traditional controls. The sword controls aren't perfect, but that's part of the immersion and the fun. Ninty went out of their way to do something that you could only do with the Wiimote, and in this case I appreciated it.
Its too bad that the game makes you this angry, but you're not really looking at the whole picture if you think the game needed traditional controls. Its the same for a game like DDR or Donkey Kong Jungle Beat.
>>332599456
>I can't waste my time on that
said anon as he argued about 5 year old video game on 4chan
>>332565524
It's pretty and all but it's a fucking chore to play.
>>332565816
It's not that they don't work, it's that spinning your arm around to hit a switch is not a fun thing to do. Maybe if SS had come out when motion controls were new it would have been acceptable but everyone stopped caring about "1:1" movement well before SS came out.
Every aspect the motion controls touched were weakened because of it. It's not that the controls were shit, it's that they were the focus of nearly every moment of gameplay. It felt like Link's Crossbow Training 2.
>>332603689
>>332603025
As far as I'm concerned, this is the most damning thing about SS controls. The game actually lies to you. The way it shows your sword being held like you hold your remote makes you think that you should use the wiimote like a sword, but that's the single worst think you can do.
The SS controls are based on small, directional flicks. You don't need to care about positioning, or power or reach, all that matters is that you make a short flick in the right direction. The animations hide this. The tutorials and the manual hide this. The marketing materials more than hide this, they keep pushing that you use the wiimote like a sword.
>>332569806
ALBW is the worst zelda game made by nintendo.
>>332605358
You don't use "flicks", that's what you did in Wii Sports and it's ilk. SS controls are more akin to using a wand or something.
