Just finished this.
How fucking good a game can get?
I wan't putting much faith into it, I wanted to like Raiden but it was getting difficult to. Then the ending sequences made up for it.
Now I understand why they say it was a game ahead of its time.
>>322289178
Best MGS game period. It should've been the last game. And now the entire gaming press, SJWs, and anons alike want Kojima's head on a platter.
It's ok desu.
It's great intro philosophy, and a fun game. But it's like the Matrix. A lot of style, sounds profound, is thought provoking, but also very entry level.
The writing is very shoddy, and the themes are litetally spoken out of philosophy books.
GitS does a much better job at handling the same themes. Kojima is just not a good writer. Great director though.
Good game, but overrated as fuck.
MGS3 is better, cause it knows what it is.
>>322289178
D-did you turn the game console off when asked?I did
>>322289178
it really is the weakest of the original MGS games. People just want to see the game to have these mystical "messages" and "predictions" nowadays, while in reality Kojima was already doing what he still does: found an interesting topic of that time, and adapted it into his game. The online forum and chat culture was way ahead of anything available here in the west back in early 2000.
The ending is literally "we don't exactly have anything else than this fancy thing we heard to tell ya...so let's pretend Raiden was your avatar, and you'll now walk your own path!". Besides that, it was literally all about recycling MGS1's plot and design.
The gameplay and map-design is awful for the last 2/3 of the whole game.
>>322289764
I-I'm beta as fuck so I did it.
>>322289790
Even when recycling a lot of stuff I still find their explanations for it a lot enjoyable. I know that a work being "self-aware" doesn't make it automatically good, but it's just that when I compare to so many other games I really appreciate the effort and attention to the details.
>metal gear
>literally 5 are taken down just with a missile launcher
Metal Gear can't into technology balancing, can it? Like when Metal Gear V have more tech stuff than Metal Gear 2.
>>322290630
glad to hear you liked it and all, but I seriously find MGS2 to be a tad overrated nowadays, especially for its implied "postmodern art" things.
Funny thing you mentioned the self-awareness, because the series has always been like that. The "TURN THE GAME SYSTEM OFF" thing was already first used in 1987 original Metal Gear, and the series is known to break the 4th wall and do other re-occuring jokes / references that fans will pick up. The numerous Codec conversations, especially the non-mandatory ones, can be pure comedy gold.
Personally, I find MGS3 the best game in series, and a huge improvement from 2 in numerous ways. Just don't get alarmed by it's relatively low-tech and stealth-focused approach at the beginning tho' (=no more radar & you gotta use camo+environments to blend in).
mgs2 is literally GOTYAYEY but /v/ is too pleb to understand why
i bet these faggots didnt even watch ice cubes melt and shoot sacks of flour
Whenever people criticize the story of MGS I point to "the world is being engulfed by truth". MSG IV and V might be total fucking shit stories but the ending of MGS2 is enough to forgive all of it.
MGS3 is definitely a better video game. But MGS2 is a better entertainment product.
They're both 10/10s imo
>>322291417
it's not even the best nor most TECHNOLOGY filled game in its own series. And definitely not too fun.
>>322291623
which game has more TECHNOLOGY than mgs2
>>322291527
>the ending of MGS2 is enough to forgive all of it.
the whole MGS4 was enough for me to forgive the existence of MGS2 and Raiden.
>>322289178
played it for the first time a couple of months ago
pretty far ahead of its time graphically, voice acting, detail etc but it wasn't great overall
>>322291623
Just because you're shit at the game doesn't mean its not fun.
>>322291714
MGS3.
>>322291726
>le gitgut meme
I finished the game no problems when I was 13, and just recently again on HD Collection. The game's piss easy to be honest, but very poorly designed. It's hard to stay interested in what's going on.
>>322289472
>And now the entire gaming press, SJWs, and anons alike want Kojima's head on a platter.
Do you live in an alternate universe or something?
It's weird to try going back to MGS2 after playing MGS3 recently. It's not worse, just different... although there are some things that are annoying, like those assholes on strut E that always see you on the bridge.
MGS3 has some pretty good "TECHNOLOGY", e.g. if you kill a soldier, let a vulture start eating him, then kill and eat the vulture yourself, the soldier will show up in the Sorrow fight, with the vulture perched on his shoulder, and will exclaim "YOU ATE ME!"
>>322289764
>be teenager
>up way past bedtime on a schoolnight
>have lights off so parents won't know I'm awake
>RAIDEN, TURN OFF YOUR GAME CONSOLE NOW!
Yeah, I did it.
>>322292396
I frequent /v/ the most and I still don't get why we post that fucking brick wall
>>322292396
That wouldn't really be technology, but it's definitely a good thing.
>>322292731
it is TECHNOLOGY, though. The term usually refers to the fact that devs had thought of everything, and went beyond what would've been necessary when creating the game. The sheer amount of TECH in #3 would be enough to fill one thread of its own.
>>322292396
>like those assholes on strut E that always see you on the bridge.
Fuck that guy man, what's worse is I swear he respawns/wakes up way faster than everyone else.
>>322289472
Nope, it's really just a vocal minority on 4chan that wants his head on a platter.
>>322293462
Except what you mentioned isn't really that technologically impressive. I agree what the series is full of TECHNOLOGY, but that moment is just detailed. When I think of TECHNOLOGY I think of the Ice bucket in MGS2 or the way the bandanna flutters with the wind when you open the tanker's doors.
>>322289178
OP, I suggest you ignore /v/'s comments on the series and instead read up on the games.
http://metagearsolid.org/mgs2-articles/
http://www.deltaheadtranslation.com/MGS2/
>playing MGS2 for the first time
>criticise Rose's VA to my friends, specifically saying that she sounds "robotic" and emotionless
>mfw she actually is an AI
years later, I can still feel the ruse, and how amazed I was.
>>322289178
It's unfinished
>>322294473
I beLIEve you.
>>322289472
Making custom hardware is neither convenient nor expedient.
One of the most overrated games of all time
>>322289178
Quite possibly the best game of all time, for sure the best game of its gen.
>>322295073
thats MGS3
>Ahead of its time
How?
>>322295337
Apart from literally predicting the future it's really impressive on a technical level, more so than a lot of 2015 games even.
>>322295497
How did it predict the future? How was it impressive on a technical level?
IT EVEN RAINED THE DAY I WAS BORN
>>322295585
Not that guy but did you play the game?
>>322295780
Yes
>>322295497
>predict the future
why do people say this? the things that the game "predicted" were already happening and had been for a long time
>>322295585
You sound like Snake.
The writing was really bad
The level design was really bad
The characters, dialogue, and codec calls were really bad
Dead Cell was really bad
The backtracking was really bad
Just because Kojima put more effort into making ice cubes melt than writing an actually good story with the entire theme basically being a poor mans Ghost in the Shell doesn't make it the best game ever and qualifies it as a post-modern masterpiece of artistic expression
It's eh at best, MGS is much better when it's just self contained adventures styled after action movies.
>>322295887
"Really bad" doesn't cut it as an argument, you need to have a reasoning. Otherwise people will just ignore your opinion.
>>322289472
Great picture, that thread was golden.
>get to end of game
>story falls apart
what a disappointment, it was good up until after the fight against the metal gears
I haven't played for a really long time, does anybody remember what happed with this pliskin?
>>322296512
No, that is NOT Solid Snake!
>>322296512
he probably died on big shell, after snake showed up he was never seen again
>>322292610
Old meme. CAN'T SEE NOTHING BUT A BRICK WALL. Not a very good meme.
>>322296512
He escaped from New York.
>>322296964
You just fell for it
>>322297036
Fell for what? It's just a brick wall.
>liking the convoluted 2deep4u trainwreck "ending"
I really enjoyed MGS2, but its unique narrative has established an expectation for every MGS game to be some meta-narrative. Like MGS4 being shit because it's supposed to make you feel like shit or MGSV being incomplete to make you feel a phantom pain.
>>322297348
Except MGS4 is shit because Kojima hated making that game. V is a mystery though, no idea why he chose to make it.
>>322297348
I bet they came up with kikongo when he heard his deadline for the game
>>322297627
Uh, money maybe?
>>322297794
Maybe. We'll never know since he said he's under a contract not to talk about what happened. We can only trust and be homo.
>>322289178
"I want my memory, my existence to remain. Unlike an intron of history... I will be remembered as an exon. That will be my legacy, my mark in history. But the Patriots would deny us even that. I will triumph over the Patriots and liberate us all. And we will become-- the "Sons of Liberty"!"
―Solidus Snake
Why is he so fucking based
>>322293873
I'd say it's more paying attention to detail
>>322297991
Jack, it's not power I want. What I want to take back from the Patriots are things like... freedom, civil rights, opportunities. The founding principles of this country. Everything that's about to be wiped out by their digital censorship.
>>322297627
>'Alan Smithee' is a common pseudonym for directors whose film was clearly taken away from her/him and recut heavily against her/his wishes in ways that completely altered the film.
Is this proof Kojima can see into the future?
>>322294473
>Kaz with both legs
>>322298594
I think it's just him disowning MGS4, really. He was probably low on MP after what he pulled with MGS2.
>>322289178
I miss these glory days.
>>322291072
I'm no philanthropist. Arsenal is far from impregnable. It needs other Metal Gears as guards, a huge payload of warheads, and full air, sea, and land support to function efficiently. Against a large attack force without support, Arsenal is nothing more than a gigantic coffin. Seizing Arsenal Gear was never the real objective!
>>322294473
You fucked up m8, Rose is real but the Colonel puts on a stiff tone throughout the game, especially when explaining controls or instructions
>>322297991
He was supposed to give that speech in front of a waving flag, but it got removed because of terrorists.
>>322298987
Wasn't raiden supposed to cut it down on him too or something?
>>322299296
Yeah, Solidus was reaching for the flag as he fell.
We also missed out on Arsenal fucking up Manhattan.
>>322299548
I don't see why it needed to be changed at all, what's the worst that could have happened if it stayed
>>322291560
I disagree. MGS2 has better gameplay in my opinion. The VR Missions in 2 outclass anything in 3. The difficulty is also much higher in 2 on European Extreme. It has nothing to do with the fixed camera either, but the fact that the guards in 2 are far more capable and deadly.
I do agree with you that both games are 10/10 and of course 3 has better bosses.
>>322291072
or like when 3 had flying platforms and how peacewalker had flying AI weapons?
Yet in mgs4, everything was bipedal.
>>322300774
War has changed
>>322299548
>While on a collision course with New York, Arsenal destroyed several United States monuments, including the Statue of Liberty, which was pushed to the front of the Immigration Museum on Ellis Island.
I wish that was left in the game.
>>322294473
Rose wasn't an AI until the end
and Arsenal gear was the worst part of the already sub-par game
>>322296512
He's Snake. Put his name in google and you get Solid Snake.
>>322302095
MGS2 is the best game in the series though?
>>322302143
>MGS2 is the best game in the series though?
I am currently finding it to be on part with 5.
I'm playing 3 right now and have a question, if you kill someone, but then force a game over by killing yourself, does the guy you killed still appear in the sorrow battle?
>>322302095
>He's Snake. Put his name in google and you get Solid Snake.
That's what the Patriots want you to think.
>>322289736
>It's great intro philosophy
Man you sound stupid.
>GitS does a much better job at handling the same themes
The movie, or the show, or the manga?
>>322302334
If you force the game over and then select EXIT instead of continue then your deaths/alerts/kills/whatever do not count in the time before you died.
>>322302262
You're kidding, right?
>>322302349
the Patriots are a bunch of retards, liars, and cheaters.
people take THIS babbling fool seriously:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ul8j9I90ueM
I skipped anything this retard had to say after like 3 conversations
>>322302656
>You're kidding, right?
Nope. Big Shell was badly designed while MGS5 is just a big plain of nothing.
Venom > Raiden
the bosses in MGS2 are unmemorable, MGS5 I have only run into one boss fight so far
MGS5's story is more interesting granted most of the missions is "this might get us close to Cipher" but so far better than the mess known as Arsenal Gear
>>322300096
literal PR mayhem. MGS2 was a system seller when it was announced. It released like two months after 9/11.
If you weren't american during then, then you have to understand that literally everything was being screened and censored to not reference new york being attacked or even terrorism in general. I remember robert ebert freaking out on the powerpuff girls movie for being insensitive a whole year after 9/11 because they showed building getting destroyed.
Having a scene that showed a huge flying object destroying almost a quarter of new york two months after 9/11 would have literally gained more controversy in america than the hot coffee mod.
>>322302915
>he doesnt know yet
so innocent
>>322295887
Try being less of a 12 year old next time you post
>>322296512
Snake helped him escape the Big Shell just before he met up with Raiden
>>322303116
I know of the big twist but I don't mind that I am not Snake in V.
Venom is still better than Raiden even knowing the big twist.
>>32230307
>>322303392
Are you going to list your reasons why or what.
>>322303392
i wasnt talking about the twist
>>322303498
Why should I?
You MGS2 fans would just play the "you don't like Raiden because he's not Snake" card.
>>322303543
Is there any others besides VOCAL CORD PARASITES?
>>322299548
why is it shaped like a horseshoe crab
>>322303603
>Why should I?
>You MGS2 fans would just play the "you don't like Raiden because he's not Snake" card.
Why are you making assumptions about me? I just saw your post and am curious as to why you find Venom better than Raiden. What does "better" even mean? A better character? Does he have a better arc?
>>322302349
>That's what the La-li-lu-le-lo want you to think.
The who?
>>322303752
better character overall.
Raiden's whining and complaining (not to mention they dragged Rose into the mess because of her connection to Raiden) made him unbearable.
>>322303074
>I remember robert ebert freaking out on the powerpuff girls movie for being insensitive a whole year after 9/11 because they showed building getting destroyed.
You can't make this shit up.
>>322303874
>better character overall.
Define "character."
Raiden's got character. He's whiny, a "rookie," caring, naive, etc.
Venom is stoic, now I suppose that's a facet of character, but that's all I got.
>Raiden's whining and complaining (not to mention they dragged Rose into the mess because of her connection to Raiden) made him unbearable.
I mean to each their own man, but if that's ALL you got out of Raiden then I guess we'll just agree to disagree. Hard.
>>322303392
>I am not Snake in V.
You are Snake though, just not the Snake you're originally lead to believe.
>>322303874
>>322303392
>>322302915
All you Raiden haters are literally retared. What do you prefer a empthy lifeless character like Snak? Or an actual human bean with emotions like Raiden?
>>322304340
>but if that's ALL you got out of Raiden then I guess we'll just agree to disagree
that's all I got out of him in 2. 4 He was Emo as fuck, and MGR he was finally decent.
>>322304541
>All you Raiden haters are literally retared.
>haters
they are all one person, me.
>>322304496
I always wondered what would happen if Kevin James didn't get himself injured and Mick Foley got interested in comedic writing. I think things would have turned out better with KJ as a professional wrestler and MF as a comedian, tbqh.
>>322304578
You still haven't defined character.
>that's all I got out of him in 2
Snake : And we're not in this to make a name for ourselves.
Raiden : Then what are you and Otacon fighting for?
Snake : A future.
Snake : You can stop being part of a mistake, starting now.
Raiden : What am I -- what am I supposed to do?
Snake : Find something to believe in. And find it for yourself. And when
you do, pass it on to the future.
Raiden : Believe in what?
Snake : That's your problem.
__
Raiden : No, never heard the name before. I'll pick my own name...and my
own life. I'll find something worth passing on.
????
> 4 He was Emo as fuck
You do realize 4 completely destroys the arc he went through in 2, gives him the exact same ending.
MGR is a good game.
>>322289178
It was just alright defiantly not the best in the series and definitely not the best game ever like /v/ parrots but that dosent mean it was a bad game.
>>322289736
I agree. MGS2 was great but got way too convoluted story wise towards the end. Also the boss fights were disappointing with the exception of fat man. MGS3 and 1 were better.
>>322304971
He had an arc in 2?
He got so annoying I started to tune him out
>>322291072
i think the in-game reason/excuse was that those were mass-produced RAY's
LAUGH AND GROW FAT
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bkhJjbimL5E
>>322305234
You still have not defined character.
Yeah he had in arc in 2. I just posted the main point of it with those excerpts from the script. He was a dude who did nothing but what he was told until Snake told him otherwise.
>He got so annoying I started to tune him out
S'about payoffs man. If you tune shit out you miss out on things.
>>322289178
Raiden was always likeable to me because he's the only character who almost immediately calls villains out on their bullshit philosophies just being retarded.
Does it to Fatman, Solidus, Sundowner, Monsoon, and Armstrong before putting those faggots in their place.
>>322292503
>teenager
>bedtime
>>322289472
>And now the entire gaming press, SJWs, and anons alike want Kojima's head on a platter.
Funny that, considering MGS2 literally predicted what's happening on the internet today.
>>322305519
>f you tune shit out you miss out on things.
it's hard to pay attention when the character you are paying attention to is so damn annoying (like Zelos Wilder). It's worse when that character is the MAIN CHARACTER.
That's why I tune out morons like Trump.
Was gonna make a thread but saw this was up already
I've been marathoning through the Solid series for the first time this week and I just finished 3 tonight, got started on 4 a little bit. My questions are
>Do I need to play Peacewalker before I play 5/at all
>Do I need to play Ground Zeros before playing 5
Also I think 2 has been my favorite so far too. Really liked Raiden and the story in 2. 3 had cool stuff like Ocelot but I missed the map and the whole survival thing didn't do much for me. Also felt removed from the closeness of 1 and 2. I'm not too hot about 4 so far but I only just started.
>>322289472
>>322296050
My fucking niggas.
>>322306124
True, what can you do. I suppose it helps that MGR has the MGS2 theme condensed down and even discussed a little bit more and adds its own twist on shit while having solid gameplay.
Fuck MGR is a good game, sad we'll never get a sequel.
>>322306173
yes and yes.
Hell, Ground Zeroes is basically a prologue of Phantom Pain.
>>322291287
3 is the only of the original MGS games that had to compensate for terrible design by injecting game breaking mechanics in after the fact. A top down camera isn't an inherently poor design choice, it's just that Kojima apparently stopped giving a shit about game balance and level design, everyone hated it, and now we have subsistence. If you aren't referring to the original release of 3, or willing to defend its standard design by playing exclusively in top down mode, then it isn't really the game that you like, it's the casualization of it.
>>322291287
>The "TURN THE GAME SYSTEM OFF" thing was already first used in 1987 original Metal Gear, and the series is known to break the 4th wall and do other re-occuring jokes
If you honestly do not see the difference between a tongue-in-cheek 4th wall breaking moment and what it means in MGS2 I do not know what to say to you.
>>322300651
This anon knows what's up.
Although MGS2 receives way too much hate just because of the 180° it pulled with the plot, muh Snek, and "Raiden is too whiny" comments.
I wish more anons were able to see past those points and appreciate MGS2 for things liike what you mentioned.
>>322306173
The only correct answer is to play on release order.
