>"open world game"
>cant kill quest based characters
The amount of times I tried to kill this bitch.
Just another reason why New Vegas is superior.
>>321983332
Yeah NV and morrowind got it right.
"open world" doesnt mean "total freedom"
>>321983032
>advertised as an RPG
>it's not an RPG
>>321983032
>click
>setessential 0
:)
>>321983410
>>321983332
They're all pieces of shit, especially New Vegas.
I spent 40 hours trying to have fun in Fallout 4, but I failed
>>321983032
When was killing quest characters a requisite for an open world game, you fucking retard?
>>321983847
Have you tried giving the return of the enclave mode authors money to work faster?
>>321983463
It doesn't, but that's only because people don't understand open world game philosophy. If you're going to restrict how the players interact with the world then don't make it open world. Open world works best when it gives players not only freedom of movement but freedom of choice as well. If you want to restrict the players to linear gameplay, then don't make the open. Well designed levels, hubs, or even overworlds are better than a poorly designed open world.
what was actually wrong with this game?
>>321983463
then why do they advertise it as such???
99% of this shit game's problems can be traced back to the retarded 4 dialogue consolefaggotry
>>321983847
i have 200 hours into it but thats because i fell asleep while playing it
>>321983849
>Not being allowed to play however you want and do whatever you want in an open world game
>thinking that limiting our ability to role play is good
>>321984119
this is true i mean the game is built around that shitty diolauge system its one reason that most of those cool locations like that raceing one are just fucking killing fields
>>321983463
>>321983849
Every Fallout except Fallout 3 and 4 let you just just about every character.
>>321984341
kill*
>>321984341
So the children and the finish the game if you killed everyone else bot?
All you do in this game is just kill loot rinse and repeat - so shit
>>321984457
Yes
>>321984461
I still like it more than fo3 because the gunplay and power armor are pretty gud
I was surprised you could kill Danse, I killed that faggot as soon as I met him at the police station.
>>321984650
Racist
>tfw Obsidian and Avellone are too busy developing shovelware to save this trashheap with a sequel
>>321983032
>Bethesda from 2005 onwards
Well there's your problem.
>>321984341
>post proof New Vegas is shit as well
You fucked up.
>>321983032
Why do they keep getting away with this shit
>>321983996
Nothing. It's just Obsidifags thinking their "GOLDEN AGE" bullshit devs still exist when they've been dead for 10 years, most of the good staff left after FNV and if they did make another game it'd be complete trash, as seen by every game produced after KOTOR 2.
>>321983996
Fallout 4 is not an RPG
>>321984341
nigga wat? i firt played ther game on360and you could kill all of those. even yes man goes down
>roll charisma guy
>get to diamond city
>see guy pointing gun at his bro
>i got this
>use pacify on guy holding gun
>success!
>all of diamond city turns hostile and guns me down
what the fuck man
>>321984813
You can't kill children in a game published by Bethesda. You can, however, kill everyone else in a game not developed by Bethesda.
>>321985007
'cept kids of course
>>321985038
>think of the children
Yeh nah. Game's not true open world.
THEY DONT EVEN GIVE YOU A FUCKING KEYCHAIN
>>321985149
Bethesda's fault.
>>321985149
nothing to do with open world, fucktard. they just don't let you kill children. it sucks, we all know it, but it does not not make it open world
>>321984341
Where is the fallout 4 list, I couldnt even kill some random farmer in Warwick.
>>321985294
>can't do everything you want
It's not true open world. Stop defending a shit game.
>>321985335
the funny thing is about that list... what the fuck is so "essesntial" about most of the npcs? the game would work fine without.
>>321985384
>can't do everything you want
in just cause or GTA you can't even choose which faction you work for. are they not open world either? this shit has nothing to do with OW or not, but you won't get it, so don't bother
>>321985384
Jesus christ you are stupid.
So what is your definition of an open world game?
I think you're confusing sandbox with open world.
>>321985597
>I think you're confusing sandbox with open world.
Fallout is a sandbox.
>>321985649
not anymore
>>321985384
>there are people THIS FUCKING RETARDED on this board right now
>>321985649
And?
You're claiming open world games allow you to do anything, which is incorrect because that is not what an open world game is.
>>321985007
If I recall perfectly, once you do their quest they are set as un-essential and you can kill them
>>321985671
>not anymore
>literally adding in more features to make it a sandbox
>literally KING OF THE CASTLE
Yeah, it is. It's never really been "open world" because it's always been in a small section of either a city or state. There's nothing wordly about it and all the games contain you within inivisble walls and boundaries.
>>321985738
I'm not that guy, I was just saying that Fallout is a sandbox.
Most open-world games do let you do anything though. GTAV is a pretty good example. Or the Witcher.
>open world game
>can't jump into space and swallow the sun
Reddit will defend this.
>>321985893
>sandbox game
>can't build a castle
>no ocean
>no spade
>not even a bucket to use to dig up sand
fucking thanks anita
>>321985821
>I'm not that guy
My bad.
I agree a lot of open world games do let you do anything but there are plenty that are "restricted" like burnout paradise or really any open world racing game.
>>321984119
>>321984027
>>321985821
In Witcher you can't really do much, shut the fuck up. In GTA, even less.
>>321985997
Didn't mean to quote first two.
Tbh ladz
I played nv twice and once more with all the dlc and I only played f3 once with no dlc
Should I play the f3 dlc?
>>321985997
this. fallout (non beth ones) let you do much more than those games. witcher probably has the least amount of things to do in its oh so nessercary open world
>>321986063
Only the alien one.. the rest are shit..
>>321986063
if you can stand f3 after playing new vegas, go for it. be sure tho leave out mothership zeta
>>321985997
>>321986115
You can do a lot more than any of the Fallout games in a much bigger space. There are games now that are literally fucking "PROCEDURALLY GENERATED UNIVERSES" and all that shit if you want real "open world". Witcher might have been a bad example, but still, there's more variety than "Pick up item" or "Kill target X".
>>321986115
i miss morrowind
>>321984650
>can't kill piper
>can't kill garvey
>can't kill a random fuckass out in the wastes i met
>can kill maxson on site
fuck quest-essential NPCs
bethesdefenders need to stop justifying flawed and lazy mechanics
>>321986128
Wtf thats the worst.
>>321986063
Play point lookout its only reason to even play fallout 3
>>321983615
Example game?
>>321986208
>there's more variety than "Pick up item" or "Kill target X".
that's why i said, "the non beth ones". also your definiton of certain things of a bit off. open world /= huge world
>>321986063
Point Lookout's the only one that's worth it. Couldn't even be bothered with finishing the base game after I completed that DLC.
>>321984906
The go it alone part kills me
Thete is literally no way to finish the main quest independently. You have to allign with someone its bullshit.
>>321986308
>the non beth ones
>entire games dedicated to literal fetch quests
ah yes, the golden age of gaming where story wasn't needed.
Then please, what is an "open world game", because apparently they don't and have never existed according to people in this thread.
>>321986274
>"you can even shoot 'em in the face if you want"
Well... I can, but they won't die.
Thanks Todd.
>>321983032
>>321986569
>bombs drop anyway and you get thrown back to the start
okay.
>>321986659
Nothing happens, I tried it. Not 2 hours but I waited for a long time and nothing happens. Your wife just keeps repeating the same thing and tells you to answer the door.maybe I didn't wait long enough and the bomb still drops.
>>321983032
>If you walk the wrong way bombs explode instantly and you die
>still can't kill the children
TOOOODDDDDDDDDDDDDDD
>>321986786
It's like an hour or two I think, it happens regardless.
If you open the door it happens faster, I left the game open on launch to take a shit and go to the store, came back and it asked me to load while my corpse was melting over shaun.
>>321986480
>Illusion of choice.
Nuff said.
>>321986873
Interesting,
I know if you don't go the right direction when running to the vault it goes off almost instantly.
>>321986786
Nah its scripted you need to open the door to play fallout
One of the many, many, things I hate about FO4 is how when you use a PS3 controller on the PC once, ONLY ONCE, the game was made in a way that you CAN'T PLAY WITH A KB+M ANYMORE since it automatically assumes you will play it with a PS3 controller. For life. I had to change the settings just to get KB+M to work, and I have to change it regularly when I plug my PS3 controller in.
Yeah, you were right. This "dialogue wheel" is terrible. You can only choose from 4 things to talk about, AND they don't elaborate on what you say. It's just as bad as /v/ makes it out to be.
The story isn't bad, I'm sort of interested with this synth shit and the Institute, but it upsets me that you get the power armor immediately near sanctuary. And the thing is, it's based on shitty fusion cores, a terrible idea. I'm in Diamond City already and not once have I thought of using it again after that mission.
The worst thing about this game is how it's TERRIBLE SOUNDTRACK. I mean, jesus christ, over half of it was rehashed from FO3, and a lot of the new songs are classical. I mean, who the fuck puts classical music for a Fallout game?
At least making settlements is kind of fun. I barely use mods, but overall, customization is a good thing. I like the lockpick minigame, but the fucking hacking minigame overall just feels like a hassle, you just click random words until you get the correct word to unlock PCs. If you fail, rinse and repeat. Until today I still don't get how this "LIKELINESS" shit works. It's different from FO3.
Characters are uninteresting, to say the least. I hate Dogmeat so far. Fucking shitty dog shit dog. Partially because he charges on enemies giving me no time to prepare for them. Fucking AI, fucking dog.
All in all, I think Bethesda has failed in making a Fallout game feel like a Fallout game. It's not a shit game, but a incredibly disappointing game, even with low standards. Howard should be ashamed of himself.
>>321987020
Yeah, same thing happens with that. If you sit around the town, you die either way.
>>321983032
>>"open world game"
>Shits shoe-horned down your throat.Need knowledge of the Elder Scroll?
Better be a mage wanting to join the college or no dice.
>>321987057
>playing Fallout with a controller
>>321987057
didn't read lol
>doing paladin danse's quest where you have to find the missing recon team
>do this, do that, etc etc
>get sick of hunting and listening to a stupid radio beacon so i go out and do Nick's quests for a bit
>go outside with nick
>oh shit neat big ass blimp in the sky appears and goes off in the horizon
>finally go back and do Danse's quest
>"return to Danse" oh thank god, that quest is finally over
>go back to Danse
>ay kid, we gotta go on the ship, follow me
>w-wait but what about the quest you made me...
>board pryden
>etc etc etc etc
>Paladin Danse is now your comanion
>ok cool
>talk to Danse
>can only either say trade, dismiss, lets go, or talk
>no option to turn in the previous quest
>forever locked out of that stupid quest that i just spent 2 hours doing
>quest is literally broken/unable to be turned in
TOODDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD
>>321986239
>piper
is there a mod for that shit yet?
All I wanna do is show her how hard my power armor can punch is all :3 she's so cute I really wanna fist her
>>321987057
Yeah agree they fucked this Fallout in the ass. To this day I still play FNV and FO3 modded to shit. And still havent finished all the vanilla quests
Why can't I be evil in fallout 4? I can act like a dick but I'm still forced into being a Good Samaritan.
>>321983332
because NPC's don't have a schedule therefore they can't be killed by the environment?
>>321987357
If you dismiss Danse then talk to him you can turn in the quest
>>321987190
Mfw you're forced to join the thieves guild because Beth made a unique animation for it in a quest but you're not forced to join the dark brotherhood because its only dialogue
>>321983032
>attack merchant until it has 0 hp
>gets knocked unconscious
>>321987206
I play other games with a controller, not FO4. Okay, I tried it once.
I think it's heresy, outright wrong, to play it with a controller.
>>321987509
Already did everything possible with danse. Only options I ever get is Talk/Trade/Lets Go/Nothing, even while he's Dismissed and the Talk section is just Thoughts/Relationship/Nothing
shit is fucking broken
>>321987443
There's this trader lady you can force into giving you her money and its SO out of place I actually cringed at the way the MC delivered his lines
So yeah, the reason you cant be evil is because VA
>>321987510
you're not forced to join any guild, you don't even have to join the blades to "beat" the game
>>321987443
Because Fallout 4 is a story-based FPS with RPG elements and not a true roleplaying game.
>>321987510
>mfw I'm forced to play two hand touch football with Brynyolf(I dont remember how to spell his shit name) and juke him every time I needed to do something in the city.
Also what unique animation?
>>321987357
The dialogue choice is there but the four brackets are covering it up
>>321987057
>I mean, who the fuck puts classical music for a Fallout game?
Are you new to Fallout? Play the 1st game and then come back to me
F04 also used several tracks from the original Fallout, this series clearly isn't for you buddy
>>321987417
FO4 is better than FO3
>>321987681
And that's why its the best bethesda game since morrowind
>>321987621
I had the same problem as you mate. I dismissed him and let him go do his things in the airport and when I talked to him I could turn the quest in.
Try having another companion when you talk with him
>>321987673
HEY LAD WANNA MAKE SOME MONEY
>>321987693
The one where the faggot plucks the falmers eye
Sorry can't spoil on phone
>>321987673
uh like hello? hello? are you even aware of the game we are talking about? no?
do play it, its called skyrim, in this main quest thing you like? have to join this like, mages guild thing, y'know?
>>321987057
What is KB+M? Google only returns adresses from some businesses
>>321987889
Oh that, I barely remember that worthless fight.
"ooo I'm invisible! Cant touch me!"
Okay, don't mind me wailing on this cloud of waving air that seems to spew blood when I hit it.
The memory den. A novel idea from fallout 3 completely shat on for the sake of story. This could have been so much more interesting than it actually is.
>>321987989
Mages guild quests are not required to beat the shit out of Alduin mate
>>321988107
but you still have to join them or they wont help you, which is why its stupid, because you're forced to join them as a warrior class
not that it matters, content in skyrim is -RIPE- shite, you just mod it into a survival sim and enjoy the world
my main problem with Fallout is that the world is just so completely devoid of people.
Diamond City is a fucking ghost town, the only houses belong to the shopkeeps. where the fuck does everyone else sleep?
how is it that fucking oblivion had better communities/towns than fallout 4.
>>321988187
>you just mod it into a survival sim and enjoy the world
Exactly what I did.
I feared freezing to death more than I did dragons.
>>321987889
>>321987693
Thieves Guild questline when Mercer Frey takes the giant eye jewel out of the big falmer statue.
>>321988203
>>321988203
fo4 world is still better than everything since morrowind tho, the settlements themselves are boring but this time around the world isn't just randomly generated with a mountain placed in the middle
>>321988258
well duh, I tried for like 40 hours to find something good to do in the game and when it all failed I just decided to mod the fuck out of it
>>321988187
I don't recall going to the Winterhold College apart for becoming the Headmaster
>>321987997
Keyboard and mouse
>>321987989
SKYRIM
>>321988417
Just think how OK fallout 4 will be when the geck comes out
>>321987743
I played FO1 a long time ago you faggot and FO4's classical radio is terrible. I do not remember any of it being in the original Fallout.
In fact, I think you are lying to me, taking advantage of the fact I haven't played the game in a long time.
Prove it to me.
>>321986480
And that is why you never bother with the main quests in those games. Just enjoy the world and the setting, ignore everything else.
>>321988495
tbqh i'm actually impressed with the mods we're getting
GECK isn't even out and there are already some must-have mods out there
>>321988439
Ow I feel dumb now. I thought it was some sort of controller I've never heard of before.
>>321988495
FO4 I actually had fun playing vanilla so I doubt I'll care for mods
>In morrowind I can kill a fucking God.
>In fo4 I can't kill my fucking dog.
gg Bethesda
>>321986893
All games with choice systems are just an illusion. It all hangs on whether the writing is done in a way that makes the player feel satisfied.
Fallout 4 is full of so many arbitrary plot lines and justifications that are based on fucking nothing that almost every decision made makes little to no sense.
>>321988596
The G.E.C.K. is not out but TESVEdit is compatible so it helps
>>321987989
You can do nothing but the main questline in Skyrim. Even the shitty Civil War questline has a way to set it aside to continue the main story.
>>321988573
>ignore the world created by retards populated by retarded characters written by retards
nah man i can't do it
>>321988719
Some players complained that in Skyrim you could kill your companion by mistake so they set them to essential
>>321988596
Same when skyrim's creation kit wasn't out all we got were nudie mods
>>321988573
I usually can, because they usually have fun side quests and quirky characters.
F4 had none, zip, nada.
Unless you count Proffessor Goodfeels and the robot who will not comply.
>>321988786
but the main questline STILL forces you to join the mages guild. it doesn't matter if you have to do their quests or suck their dick, but you DO have to join them, in fact, the only other way to do it is to noclip through the gates
>>321988850
>kill your companion by mistake
Well that's their fucking fault, deal with the consequences.
>>321988980
bethesda quirky shit is retarded
and fo4 is still better than fo3
>>321989149
You're objectively incorrect.
>>321984341
For Fallout 4 it'd just be easier making a list of who you actually can kill
>
>>321989149
Everything is better than fo3
>>321989149
Gameplay wise? Ofc story wise? Nah
Help a brotha out someone post the water purifier in f3/4 compression
>>321989179
Not at all, the ''whacky huh?'' is the most retarded shit this side of gaming since anthony burch, and fallout 3 was a horrible, horrible game with a few good quests here and there
>>321989197
Well duh
>>321983987
Why the fuck not make it open world, exactly? If you don't like it, don't play it, but don't say it's like dragging food in the dirt and then saying it's cooked, it's still a playable game, it's just not made according to your "philosophy". No one gives a shit about your views, and your views are not law.
Who the fuck thought it would be a fun idea to add "radiant" quests fucking everywhere? Is there anyone who actually enjoys them besides the people with 6000 hours in unmodded Skyrim?
>>321986274
99% of so-called "RPGs" to be quite honest with you familia.
Every game nowadays is called an "RPG" just because they have some mechanic that RPGs have, but don't actually have any role-playing in them. And every single one these games' genre can be renamed without actually using the words "role-playing" (most of them are action, or any action subgenre, or tactics games).
>>321989310
>story wise
>bethesda
Lol, they're all shit, I'm telling you FO4 is a better game than FO3 though
>>321989072
have you played fo4? if they werent essential theyd die falling off a building 5 seconds after you met them
>>321989507
Good. I would want them dead.
>>321987997
Keyboard plus Mouse.
>>321987057
This may be the first time I unironically agree with everything a namefag said.
>>321989507
>mfw following the group from concord to sanctuary
At first I thought they said fuck it and didn't bother with the pathing because they didn't expect anyone to go alongside them, but then I got my first companion
>>321987758
>FO4 is better than FO3
In gameplay, yes. Other than that, if you still think 4 is better than 3, then I will assume that 4 was your first fallout game.
>>321989690
But half the shit he spouts is inane retarded bullcrap present in most bethesda game or otherwise very inconsequential and he loves fo3 while hating fo4 which is the borderline definition of hypocrisy
>>321989817
And I will assume 3 was your first RPG, as is the case with its defense force
>>321988541
I did a little skimming through the OST, can't hear any, neither in 2 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vGyB093QOIo&ab_channel=F4m1LyGuy10
>>321989962
retard or troll?
>>321990030
hm? I'm just saying that there are no classical songs in Fo1 (and 2)
>>321989962
Then that settles that, anon.
Thank you for the information.
>>321989880
>But half the shit he spouts is inane retarded bullcrap present in most bethesda game
Like? I mentioned dialogue wheels, and FO3 was not like that, I mentioned Power Armor being used early in game, FO3 was not like that, I said AI was bad, okay that was in FO3, I said the soundtrack was terrible precisely because most of it was rehashed, and so on.
What else?
>>321987621
Talk to the captain aboard the Prydwen
>>321990282
i said inconsequential for a reason, dialogue wheel might be shit but the dialogue itself was inherently HORRIBLE, DISASTROUSLY HORRIBLE in fallout 3 so the simple fact that there's less of it in fo4 makes it better
everything else I'm too lazy to explain it to you, but fo4 was designed for people like you who think fo3 is teh epitome of gaming so shut the fuck up and go back to wanking to piper instead of trying to fit in here
>>321983332
Ave, true to Caesar
>>321990509
You think fo4 is better because there's less diolouge options?
>>321989880
>And I will assume 3 was your first RPG
1- No it wasn't.
2 - I never said that Fo3 was a good RPG, but even with the RPG elements it has, it is still better than 4s'. Mind telling me why you think 4 is better than 3?
For those who haven't seen it yet:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A34poZ6paGs
>>321990801
well I guess you answered it in >>321990509
but then why do you play Fallout at all? it is a story game, and taking that away makes that a better game?
>>321990906
Hey, thanks anon, will save this for later.
>>321990779
you think its not? I mean fuck, you actually ENJOYED being stuffed up to the potato faces while they spouted bethesda tier writing at you? filtering through the horrible shite that counted as replies?
I mean fuck, fo4 dialogue wheel IS HANDS DOWN the worst executed dialogue system of -ALL TIME-, but its still better because there's not much talking, just shooting, which is good, teh shooting is fun
>>321990801
Its got better gameplay, an the RPG elements are shite in both, it doesn't matter which is worse, only thing FO3 does better is some quest depth, and the karma system
>>321990916
Why would you play a story game with shitty story? That being said, all of the fallout games are inherently fun in themselves, even playing a retardedly evil character in 3 was kinda fun even though the game itself is the absolutely worst game I played all time.
>>321991051
>321990801 (You)
>321990916 (You)
Both me, by the by.
The main problem I think I am trying to communicate is that it really isn't a fallout game. You could easily take the Fallout title away and it really would not add much or any the the overall lore to fallout (That is what I was trying to say with the >it's a story game)
>But half the shit he spouts is inane retarded bullcrap present in most bethesda game
Oh god there are people who actually think like this.
You do realize there was at least more freedom of choice in what to say in FO3 than FO4, right?
You are literally supporting limited speech options. In fact, it's a miracle I'm replying to you seeing that you look like you're trying to bait people.
>>321991435
neither was 3, doesn't really matter, 4 is better as a game and I'm trying to say most of its issues are inconsequential when compared to 3
>>321985023
It's meant to play out, the guy holding the gun is suppose to get killed by guards. It's to show you as to why there is all the fear about synths. Pacifying skill is an attack and since he is a citizen, you used an attack and they all turned on you.
Don't get me wrong though, I don't agree with the fact that there's jack all you can do for the situation. Open world my ass. Even more annoying that you thought up a solution using your skills that the game doesn't recognize as so.
>>321987057
I agree for the most part. I really hate how companions are right the fuck behind you ALL THE TIME. If you walk through a doorway, and trigger a mine, you have no chance of backing up.
Also, the lockpick/computer hacking is exactly the same as it was in the past, except now I don't think you can get permanently locked out. It works like this, you select a word, and it will give you the number of letters that are in the same position in the correct word. So if the actual password is 'WORD' and you select 'CODE' as a guess, it will return 1... The letter O was in the right position. If you guess 'FORD' it will return 3. The easiest way to solve them is look for words that have similarities, then use a process of elimination to find the correct password. Words that end in ES/ER/ED/ING are common so start there.
>>321991458
Well its a miracle I havent filtered you yet seeing as how any differing opinion is automatically bait and somehow you praise fo3 yet hate 4
Finally, more DOES NOT automatically equate BETTER
>>321986848
Which is a step up from invisible walls or people blocking your road that you could easily walk past normally. That is one part I actually liked.
>>321991780
But I'd rather have choice than four diolouge options that all lead to an eventual "yes".
>>321991923
So would I but bethesda dialogue is inherently horrible so the less they attempt to push it in a game the better.
Only part that felt like a downgrade was no more evil character
>>321991659
Fair enough, I agree with you on that. But on the one hand, I think that Fallout 3 is a fallout game, but Fallout 4 can be shrugged under the blanket for all I care. However, gameplay wise, F4 is superior, no doubt.
And for the record, F3 was just an example, if you are wondering, I do vastly prefer New Vegas.
>>321992036
Its the same shit m8, fallout always had great world building, neither 3 nor 4 does that very well, but at least 4 is fun to play. The gunplay is genuinely addicting
>>321986569
> Play as guy
> keep telling this guy to fuck off, I won't fill his shit out
> Wife says do it or else
> character is a beta and does it
> Play as girl
> Tell vault tech guy to fuck off
> Husband finally says, "fine, it's OK I'll fill out the forms for you"
> Play as guy, you are beta, don't play as guy, you married a beta LMAO
> Game forces the player to still "fill out the form"
>>321991780
Now that's just stupid. If you think somehow limiting choices in dialogue makes ANYTHING better, in fact is not automatically bad, you are terribly mistaken. It doesn't matter what game it is.
>>321991721
>same position
OHHHH. That's how LIKELINESS works. My bad then. I forgot that's how it worked in FO3.
>>321992161
Is it that hard to understand?
If you are able to choose between
>5 pieces of no fun, 1 piece of fun
and
>2 pieces of no fun, 4 pieces of fun
Why would you ever pick the first one? Like I said, more does not equate better and it applies very well to bethesda dialogue and writing. Same with RPG '''''''''''''elements'''''''''''' really
>>321992157
That is true, but I guess we find entertainment in different places. You seems to find enjoyment in gameplay, but I find it in roleplaying, being a part of the Fallout universe. I miss that feeling completely in F4.
Morrowind did it right. Fuck up and you have to load a previous save or continue playing and deal with it.
But Bethesda had to make their games retard proof so retards wouldn't flood their forums asking why they couldn't complete the game.
>>321992693
Define roleplaying
Also some of my favourite games are gothic 1-2 and Risen 1 which are inherently poorly paced with loads of dialogue between action scenes, Risen 1 literally has an 8 hour scene where you only talk to people and barely fight anything. I'm just saying that aspect of FO3 wasn't very good though
At least to me anyway, so w/e
>>321992730
I find that really odd. In a game of "Choice and Consequences", why is failure not a option?
>>321992730
>But Bethesda had to make their games retard proof so retards wouldn't flood their forums asking why they couldn't complete the game.
That is not true at all, they did it because no one appreciates depth, not in certifiable quantities that sells billions. And when no depth sells just as well as depth why would they bother putting the effort into it?
>>321992852
Role playing for me is that you play a role or character in the fallout setting. Call it immersion gaming if you will. Hardcore mode is a must for me in NV because it let's me be in that world, have a feel at what it is like to be there and let the lore seduce me with scenarios.
I can't say that I have had that feeling as much in 3 as I have had in NV, but I can't say that for 4. It all feels so forced with my character in 4. I wanted to be a badass, when people saw me, they would get afraid. That is why I pre-planned to have 10 in Charisma so I could get the intimidation perk. But as I found out, the game really doesn't want you to be who you want to be, just the wife or husband with some different lines per playthough.
>>321993118
That too obviously. It's not a coincidence that their games got more and more simple when they started being console first
>>321992339
How terribly wrong you are.
Limiting dialogue options is always wrong.
You are limiting yourself to only 4 options. That is always bad.
I think you're trying to tell me that because it only leads to one conclusion, it's perfectly okay to limit the dialogue. Then you are naive in saying that.
Talking to Eden, for example. You can use Science to argue that his thinking is fallacious. You can use Speech to convince him some shit I forgot, I think it was self desruct. You can ask about himself. You can disagree, or agree to his offer if you don't have speech, or science.
Does it all boil down to the questline? Yes it does. But we're not talking about the storyline here. The fact that you can use other ways other than speech to get something you want or need is something worth mentioning.
It disappears with "dialog wheels". At most you can only use one which is probably only charisma since one is already for questioning, one is for accepting, and one is for rejecting.
>>321993465
I can understand that
>>321993478
I still think most of their shit sells on PC, I'm just saying that even if they added a lot of depth only a few 'spergs' on the internet would care so they don't bother
>>321993815
Limiting can be good, if I don't enjoy the dialogue because of the way its delivered or written it is literally better for me for it to be over quickly so I can go back to things I enjoy doing
That being said I already referred to limited choicse with my karma point in one of the above points
Why are hipsters attacking Fallout 4 because it's not like Fallout 1 or 2? Both of them are dated and fucking horrible. There's nothing really wrong with Fallout 4.
>>321993815
Don't be fucking stupid. Just try imagining a game with unlimited dialogue options. You can't because it can't exist. You can have the illusion of choice like Fallout 3 gave or you can have the same amount of choice in Fallout 4 without all of the extra dialogue that didn't change anything either. There's nothing wrong with condensing options.
>>321988024
Don't worry they will probably do some DLC with some war in Canada or something that you remember.
>>321992693
To be completely honest, I have never felt like I was roleplaying in any Bethesda game besides the role that was set for me from the start. This isn't really a horrible thing until you finish the game since the way there is enjoyable. Besides Morrowind, Morrowind is a piece of shit.
All of these games end in 1 or 2 places with minor details changing. I've never felt like I was roleplaying until mods came in like Live Another Life.
>>321984919
In your eyes when did Fallout New Vegas come out? Cuz here is a hint....it was after KOTOR 2
>>321994286
>There's nothing really wrong with Fallout 4.
- the main quest is completely idiotic past a certain point
- the game railroads you to no end and forcibly prevents you from taking alternative paths, because doing anything except the exact thing the writers have set out would lead to the whole plot unraveling
- example: when you meet Virgil, a man with intimate knowledge of the institute, you cannot tell him about Shaun or ask a single thing about him, since it would completely demolish the forced twist they have set up for later
- another example: you cannot ask any of the NPCs in Diamond City, or anywhere else, about anyone matching Kellogg's description, so that you would always be forced to go to Diamond City and always be forced to do the Nick Valentine sub-plot
- you cannot ask Kellogg anything about your son and you cannot avoid fighting him, because your character will always attack him
And this is just the story and (lack of) RPG elements.
- dialogue choices might as well not exist, since they are only cosmetic variations of "Yes"
- retarded retcons or oversights by the writers in regards to the established setting
- no variety in enemy factions, Gunners are just raiders with a military theme
- base-building is half-assed and buggy as hell, many wall-pieces have no matching corner-pieces, cannot align anything except walls and building corners requires placing and then deleting floor-pieces
- completely removed all character stats and any kind of depth they might have given to your character
- SPECIAL stats now all start at 1 and you can max all of the out in a normal playthrough
- consequently there are no consequences pertaining to any of your SPECIAL stats, no low-int dialogue, no high-strength options etc.
I could go on for hours.
When you compare a game like this to Dark Souls it is truly amazing.
Appealing to the lowest common denominator is how to make money in the vidya industry and we just have to suck it up.
>>321983032
>Four factions to ally with
>Only one of them is even remotely good and not retarded
INSTITUTE FOR LIFE
CURIE FOR LIFE
>>321995272
Don't forget that they completely eliminated the ability to specialize a character early on in the build.
>decide to make stealth ninja melee character
>TOO FUCKIN BAD
>YOUR SNEAK WON'T BE GOOD UNTIL LV.34
>AND YOUR MELEE WILL SUCK UNTIL LEVEL 40
>Gothic 1
Main faction leaders and important quest givers completely immortal.
>Gothic 2
Handful of super important characters immortal
>Gothic 3
Kill whoever you want like we give a fuck
>>321995481
>institute
You mean the faction that had the government of the Commonwealth assassinated for giggles, created sentient, feeling machines and then used them for slave-labour, denying that they have free will. The faction that claims to be science-driven and high-tech but has invented nothing besides the Synths and cannot even get their own reactor to work, relying on syphoning energy from other people topside?
Face it, the institute is all smoke and mirrors. They've built a facade of being advanced and clean, but it all depends on a near endless supply of slave-labour to sweep the floors and polish the glass-staircases.
>Curie
Brainless waifu-bait, created and focus-group tested to appeal to ronery-fag neckbeards.
>>321983032
I still can't believe this pile of shit was nominated for goty.
>>321994729
And that is why Main Quests are usually something I do when I feel like I am reaching my limit with the game. Free roam and side quests are my jam (unless they are only so-so in terms of quality, which F4 is a bit hit and miss for me).
Also, yeah it's pretty hard to be the character you want in Beth games. That is why (again) I think NV does this best (and it is not made by Bethesda, hurray) since you are just the mailman. The rest of your character is up to you.
And the best mod for Skyrim was Live another life because of my niche gamestyle.
>>321995272
>The main quest is completely idiotic past a certain point.
Ok, I agree but I can't think of any recent games that have a story that holds together well.
>The game railroads you to no end and forcibly prevents you from taking alternative paths, because doing anything except the exact thing the writers have set out would lead to the whole plot unraveling
How is this a problem? You read a book from cover to cover right? Fallout 4 is not an RPG.
>Example: when you meet Virgil, a man with intimate knowledge of the institute, you cannot tell him about Shaun...
Yes you can and you do. There's also no evidence that Virgil would know that Shaun is Father.
>You cannot ask any of the NPCs in Diamond City, or anywhere else, about anyone matching Kellogg's description, so that you would always be forced to go to Diamond City and always be forced to do the Nick Valentine sub-plot
This doesn't matter because you would end up in the same place with or without Nick. Would you honestly prefer to walk up to 10 NPCs and question them about Kellogg and Shaun and have them tell you about his house and then you would have needed to steal the key or pick the lock anyway? I don't think this makes much of a difference.
>You cannot ask Kellogg anything about your son and you cannot avoid fighting him, because your character will always attack him.
You do talk to him about Shaun. The entire main storyline is about finding Shaun. So obviously, you wouldn't have a cup of tea with the man who stole your baby and killed your wife.
>>321995481
BoS and Piper is a more betterest choice senpai.
Seeing her play with the controls when they wake up liberty prime is 10/10
>>321995974
A shame that the institute is still probably the best choice for the commonwealth. Railroad doesn't give a shit outside of protecting synths, minutemen have no resources, Brotherhood is equally retarded in their "SYNTHS ARE EBUL" way.
And then there's Curie. I really liked her and her story until I realized they wanted to make her a romantic companion. I just felt like I was taking advantage of a child at that point
>>321996272
>Brotherhood is equally retarded in their "SYNTHS ARE EBUL" way.
.....what?
>>321983032
Fallout 4 is fun if you pretend it's just an open world first-person shooter where you can only kill the people Bethesda allow you to. Also just ignore the story and skip all the dialogue. Also don't do too many quests because they're pretty repetitive and boring. You're better off just ignoring everything except exploring and shooting. I had a lot of fun approaching the game this way. Obviously doesn't fix its faults which are all unacceptable. I'm glad I didn't buy the game.
>>321996430
They sound like people whining about homosexuals. What does it matter if a synth roams around, it's not like they can reproduce anyway so they'll never really threaten humanity. The real evil is the people who made the synths
>>321996430
Killing Danse?
Destroying the only true hope for humanity because "lol science has gone too far!"?
They are clearly opposed to Syths. And Ghouls. And mutants. And people who aren't a part of their boy scout troop.
>>321995272
I don't mean to damn you for wanting freedom in Fallout 4. But I don't think you're being fair to the game at all.
>dialogue choices might as well not exist, since they are only cosmetic variations of "Yes"
I felt this in Fallout 3 and NV.
>retarded retcons or oversights by the writers in regards to the established setting
I agree with this.
>no variety in enemy factions, Gunners are just raiders with a military theme
How is this a problem? How many types of hostile enemies that want to shoot you on sight do you need? Honestly think about the amount of different interests there would be post-nuclear apocalypse. There would be everything in Fallout 4 and more obviously but having Raiders, Gunners, BoS, Minuteman and the institute is probably the bare minimum you would see and that's pretty good.
>-base-building is half-assed and buggy as hell, many wall-pieces have no matching corner-pieces, cannot align anything except walls and building corners requires placing and then deleting floor-pieces.
It is, it took me hours just to build the teleporter because it clipped into the ground automatically.
>SPECIAL stats now all start at 1 and you can max all of the out in a normal playthrough
I think this is just different than any Fallout game and you're upset about it. I know that having 10 in any SPECIAL is supposed to mean that you're superhuman but unless you were aiming to max all of them out and not really add points into perks, I don't think you would be able to do this since a normal playthrough would stop after the main story ends.
>consequently there are no consequences pertaining to any of your SPECIAL stats, no low-int dialogue, no high-strength options etc
Old mechanic, it changed. Get over it. Honestly.
>>321983996
HATE NEWSPAPERS
>>321996048
>Fallout 4 is not an RPG.
According to every advertisement and statement by Todd, it is.
>How is this a problem?
Being able to find alternative solutions is one of the staples of every Fallout game.
>Yes you can and you do.
No you can't. You can only talk to him about the teleporter.
>There's also no evidence that Virgil would know that Shaun is Father.
'Baby from a vault, kidnapped by Kellog.' You can't tell me this wouldn't immediately ring a bell. All the people in the institute you talk to know where Father is from.
>This doesn't matter because you would end up in the same place with or without Nick.
But you don't even get the choice. You are railroaded to find out about Kellogg only one way, even though there should be dozens of other people who would definitely know about him.
>Would you honestly prefer to walk up to 10 NPCs and question them about Kellogg and Shaun and have them tell you about his house and then you would have needed to steal the key or pick the lock anyway?
YES! This is what these games are about! There used to be a time where you didn't even have quest-markers and you'd have to find NPCs from descriptions alone.
>The entire main storyline is about finding Shaun. So obviously, you wouldn't have a cup of tea with the man who stole your baby and killed your wife.
That is for the player to decide.
>>321988573
>"yeah bethesda is shit, b-b-but their w-world building!!!"
Or, just don't fucking play their shit games at all.
>>321996841
Then why are they calling it a Fallout game? Just give the IP to Obsidian and let them make something worthwhile. Bethesda can shit out their own stagnant "everything stuck at 2-weeks-after-the-bombs-dropped" post-apocalyptic fps.
>>321996770
>>321996813
>What does it matter if a synth roams around, it's not like they can reproduce anyway so they'll never really threaten humanity.
Unless, you know, they get hacked or reprogrammed or something, as proven to be possible by Valentine being implemented with Kellogg's memories and his personality literally comes through Nick, right in your face. Did you forget about that part?
Did you forget about the part where humans make Coursers into killing machines?
Are you just pretending that it couldn't happen again?
>The real evil is the people who made the synths
Newsflash retard, humans still exist.
>>321996813
They are opposed to synths, ghouls and mutants with good reason dude. Tried, tested and true, proven beyond a shadow of a doubt, sound reason. There are outliers, sure, but outliers don't fucking matter in a state of emergency. The common good is what matters in chaotic times.
>>321995725
Yeah, I find this fucking retarded. I have no idea how anyone pick pockets any enemies as you're forced to wait for certain levels of sneak.... Or maybe survival gives everyone a better chance of detecting? idk.
>>321996841
Stop being an apologist for shit game design.
>>321997341
Literally every single build grows from being shitty at everything, to being a little bit good at everything, to being mediocre at everything, to being good at everything.
If you neglect base building, you can literally grow evenly in literally every aspect of the game. The sacrifices that must be made to have "a build" are few and far between, I'm not sure why more people don't outright hate it.
In the past, you could start a melee build, and dump points into melee and have strong melee weapons near the start of the game. That entire concept is out the fucking window, for no reason at all.
>>321997314
Synths can be just as good or bad as humans, same with ghouls and even one or two super mutants. Just instantly reacting with "they are evil and must die" is stupid
>>321996941
It just sounds like you want choices that can bypass any writing the writers had intended the player to experience.
Being able to find alternative solutions was hardly a staple after Fallout 2. Fallout 3 and NV just gave the illusion of freedom of choice.
I definitely remember talking to Virgil about Shaun the first time you meet him. I don't understand why you would want to interrogate NPCs just because you can.
>The entire main storyline is about finding Shaun. So obviously, you wouldn't have a cup of tea with the man who stole your baby and killed your wife.
>That is for the player to decide.
This is where you fail to understand everything. The player is at the writer's mercy at the end of the day. That is how it is. Fallout 4 is not a "Pick your own adventure book" unfortunately and if you can't enjoy the story that the writers wrote, I don't know what to tell you. The game isn't perfect.
>>321997570
>I agree with 2 negatives and wasn't surprised by Bethesda's shit game design
>Being an apologist
If you want to actually give a rebuttal, I'll wait but that's not an argument desu senpai.
>>321997913
You literally ignored every single point that I made, presumably because you're stupid
>>321997636
I didn't feel this at all. Even so, if you can grow evenly in literally every aspect doesn't this mean that you have the choice to not? If you have done this yourself and you knew that you wouldn't like it then why did you do it? You could have just built to your build.
>>321988573
That's funny because I did exactly that and got bored within a few hours. All the loot is randomized AND totally shit since weapon mods exist so there's no fun in finding carefully guarded or planned anything. Also, the shit writing extends to the locations as every story that's told by them is lame and uninteresting. How many times can you read this before getting bored? 1 we have a normal pseudo50s life 2 oh my god the noise and light was so bad!!! 3 I am now scared and dying, find my body for a slightly better loot table
>>321998002
Alright, I'll adress them specifically. Kellog talking through Nick happens once, and only once and is never spoken of again. Being reprogrammed can happen with people as well but we call it brainwashing.
Humans making synths into coursers is not a reason why every single synth is evil and must die.
There are plenty of good synths and ghouls out there. Ferals and 99,999% of super mutants I'm fine with them killing though because Bethesda have only managed to write two or three non-asshole super mutants over the course of two games.
>>321998153
>You could have just built to your build.
No, you fucking can't. You can't make your melee strong early or mid game. You can't have good sneak early to mid game. You can't have strong pistols, or strong explosives, early to mid game.
They literally destroyed the entire notion of what a build even is. People are forced to go "well, what I really want is a stronger melee weapon, but I can't invest in any more melee related perks for the next 12 fucking levels, so I guess I'll put a point here instead, because it's less-shitty than the alternatives" which is retarded.
If I want to make a melee build, I should be able to make a fucking melee build. There is absolutely no reason to cap me at 40% more melee damage until I'm in the high 20's or 30's, level-wise.
>>321983770
Who hurt you anon?
>>321997925
>It just sounds like you want choices that can bypass any writing the writers had intended the player to experience.
I want choices that lead to other writing by the writers, according to that choice. And don't tell me that's impossiblem. 1 or 2 alternatives would've hardly meant the world and other games manage to have much more elaborate branching paths, yet in Fallout 4, despite all its supposed budget, you have one way only to do things. No shortcuts, no alternatives.
Consider all the ways you can resolve the confrontation with Benny in New Vegas, or all the other quests involving the families on the strip. The end-result doesn't lead to an entirely different outcome, but it allows the player to do something that fits their character, and that is one of the corner-stones of the RPG genre.
If Bethesda had simply made a non-Fallout game about shooting and exploring, this wouldn't have been such an issue, disregarding the many, many bugs the game has. But calling this piece of garbage "Fallout" is a complete violation of everything the series has been about so far.
>>321998564
>literally perks that add extra damage via percentage.
>You can't make your melee strong early.
By level 9, you can easily have 65% increased melee damage and more. I don't understand what you're talking about. I guess what you're trying to say is that the perks are underwhelming and I'll agree with that but that doesn't change the fact that you can still make a build. What do you want super early? To be able to punch a deathclaw or radscorpion to death at level 5?
>>321998536
>Kellog talking through Nick happens once, and only once and is never spoken of again
So you agree that is indeed possible and that literally every single synth is a walking killing machine that is a threat to humanity. Good.
>Being reprogrammed can happen with people as well but we call it brainwashing.
So?
>Humans making synths into coursers is not a reason why every single synth is evil and must die.
We've already settled this. Synths being able to be reprogrammed into walking killing machine slaves that do your bidding is why they need to be exterminated. They aren't human and they were designed as weapons of war or mechanical slaves to be used by humans, period. Make an argument as to why it's a good idea to keep synths around.
also
>why every single synth is evil and must die.
I literally did not even imply that every single synth is evil, you literally just fucking made that up on your own.
>There are plenty of good synths and ghouls out there.
That's relative to what you think is "good". It sounds to me like what you're actually saying is "well, all ghouls aren't fucking animalistic abominations, and all synths aren't killing machines". You're still not making an argument as to why exterminating all of them isn't for the GREATER GOOD, a point that you've conveniently left out of your post that claims to "address all my points specifically".
Ree-tod.
>>321999024
He wants to be able to focus his skill-points on a certain path, not be forced to dump them in completely pointless traits he doesn't want, just because the game puts arbitrary level-limitations on your ability to advance your skills in a given direction.
In previous games you could always upgrade your stats, no matter what level, allowing you to max out for example stealth, before investing in anything else.
Now you are forced to wait and/or waste your points on other stuff, because the game won't let you get better at your chosen specialization until you reach a certain level.
>>321998564
Thankfully for PC there's http://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/136/?
I am really considering using this mod. but overall the point is, they switched to this no skills system and you can't actually build up your character in any way as you're forced to wait for levels to catch up.
So taking sneak as the example, up until level 12 you can be 40% harder to detect, then suddly you have to wait another 11 levels for 23 to hit to get to 50% better. Level 38 is something different. And in the mean while, there's books out there are improve your sneak, but good luck to finding all of them in any real proper time.
>>321999024
>By level 9, you can easily have 65% increased melee damage and more.
What?
60% melee damage is locked until level 15, and at that point, you're not gaining any more melee damage until level 27. If the very most basic aspect of your build was that you wanted to have good melee damage and good sneak, you can't do that until you're near level 30, in a game where most people complete the main quest around level 45.
That is absolutely retarded. I'm not even saying that I want to be able to get the best weapons and smash everything early, I'm saying I want to have the feeling that my character is growing in my primary choice of skillsets more than once every fucking 15 levels, that's super lazy design for an RPG.
>>321999024
>>321999383
This, what part of this do you not understand? I personally never dumped straight up, but at least I could build up my character to a certain competent level. Not it's like, save your perk points or dump them into shit you might not want or need later or better plan out your build 100% before spending points or you'll be screwed later.
>>321998640
Would it make you feel better if Fallout stopped at Fallout 2 or Fallout Tactics? Probably. You want everything and I still don't think that's fair.
You want a game that has the best gunplay in the entire series, the best writing and the same amount of mix-and-match problem solving as the older games. You want it all but you don't want to compromise at all. This is why mods save Bethesda games because mods make that possible.
>>321999383
>In previous games you could always upgrade your stats, no matter what level, allowing you to max out for example stealth, before investing in anything else.
Isn't that what made people make mods that nerfed stats so you weren't a broken piece of shit ridiculously early in comparison?
>>321999590
Iron Fist rank 2 and Rooted rank 1. 65% melee damage.
>>321999052
>being reprogrammed into a walking killing machine
Did this ever even happen with any of the non institute synths? Does it never happen to humans? By that logic, all humans are evil to and have to be put down. Synths were not made as war machines, they were made to infiltrate human settlements and to be servants. A few of them were specifically made for combat, yes but not every synth is a courser.
>>321999423
>and you can't actually build up your character in any way as you're forced to wait for levels to catch up.
Exactly, it removes the aspect of character growth, which is a primary fundamental of RPG games.There are many, many times where you will level up in Fallout 4 and feel as though you have gained absolutely nothing. By the time you are level 40, you will have reluctantly put points into just about every "build" and you'll suddenly be pretty good at everything. It's very, very poor design, it induces horrible pacing, and it leaves the player thinking "who gives a flying fuck" the majority of the time when they level up.
I'm fine with locking, say, new abilities behind level locks. Like if jumping melee attacks turned into a downward crushing blow at level 25, sure, it's something to work towards. But it's outright fucking lazy to make the damage percentages of EVERYTHING go up every 15 levels.
>itt
>people who have played fallout 4 for over 400 hours and still bitch about how crappy it is
Get a life.
>>321999920
>Iron Fist
>LITERALLY built for melee
Ha, that's funny.
>>322000235
How dare I criticize a game!! The cheek!
>>322000009
>By that logic, all humans are evil to and have to be put down.
You are hopelessly dumb if you believe that.
The difference being, humans are human, and synths are machines. You fucking numbskull lol
>nuclear weapons have the potential to destroy humanity and should be destroyed
>YEAH WELL SO DO HUMANS SO I GUESS WE SHOULD KILL ALL HUMANS TOO RIGHT
Um no? Are you an actual retard?
>Did this ever even happen with any of the non institute synths?
Non-institute synths? Are you talking about escaped synths? Or are you actually referencing the synths that murdered the person that they were meant to replace, and you're actually arguing that those aren't walking killing machines?
>Synths were not made as war machines, they were made to infiltrate human settlements
and, you know, murder people. Before they settled. Totally cool though, totally not designed for malicious purposes at all, just murder, no big deal.
>A few of them were specifically made for combat, yes but not every synth is a courser.
Some synths are coursers. Some synths were designed for murder. It is implied that synths can be reprogrammed, and that murderous intent can literally be implemented into a synth that is otherwise lacking that programming. You have not refuted any of these points. You are merely arguing that outliers are important, which is wrong. The greater good is what is important.
>>322000456
You people shat on it before it was even out.
You people still bought the game.
You people still played it when all you were able to think was how crappy the game is.
And now you people make the same shitty thread every day and circle jerk around on your own comments how crappy it is.
Get a life.
>>321983229
>killing best girl
Go away
>>321997314
>They are opposed to synths, ghouls and mutants with good reason dude. Tried, tested and true, proven beyond a shadow of a doubt, sound reason. There are outliers, sure, but outliers don't fucking matter in a state of emergency. The common good is what matters in chaotic times.
By this reasoning they might as well start killing off humanity, because of all the threats in the waste, they are the biggest.
>>322000672
>"Get a life," he posted on /v/, condescending tone ringing clear through the plain words of text.
>>322000672
This guy's not wrong.
Why do people keep making these threads to whine about the game? It's ok that it's not exactly what you hoped it would be.
>>322000590
>humans are human, and synths are machines
Did you miss the entire game's point of the line between humanity and AI being blurred?
>Non-institute synths? Are you talking about escaped synths? Or are you actually referencing the synths that murdered the person that they were meant to replace, and you're actually arguing that those aren't walking killing machines?
Of course the institute synths follow orders, they were programmed to. The escaped ones have had pretty much all their old programming wiped, but according to you they are still too dangerous and have to be put down despite showing that they are very human time and again.
>Some synths are coursers. Some synths were designed for murder
From what I read in the institute terminal about the Mayor of Diamond City, turning a regular synth into a courser doesn't seem as easy as changing their programming. Coursers are way more durable than your average synth. Besides, every single robot in Fallout seems to be reprogrammable yet the brotherhood has no issues employing an assaultron that they themselves just reprogrammed in their favor despite the possibility that someone might turn it against them at a later date
>>322000672
>>322000837
I didn't shit on the game prior to release.
My expectations were that it would improve on fallout 3's faults. And my hopes were that it would learn from NV.
It didn't. Now I'm shitting on the game.
>>322000701
>>322000837
I merely join these discussions. My main issue is how much potential this game had, 4 years of work, and this is the shit that was put out and called a triple A title.
>>322001397
>Of course the institute synths follow orders, they were programmed to. The escaped ones have had pretty much all their old programming wiped, but according to you they are still too dangerous and have to be put down despite showing that they are very human time and again.
They can literally be programmed to kill on command. They are not human. They are robots designed to be used by humans with specific commands.
>Did you miss the entire game's point of the line between humanity and AI being blurred?
No, I entirely understood the notion of the SJW political agenda of "everyone belongs, nothing resembling a human can ever be flawed" being shoved down my godamn throat. Synths are not human. They can be shut down and reprogrammed into an entirely different personality. You are literally pretending that they are human and are willing to grant them basic human rights because of your own pretending. It's sad.
You're hopeless. I was intrigued at the idea of an actual discussion but you're clearly incapable of it, so I'll take my hopes elsewhere.
>>322002253
>They can literally be programmed to kill on command
Just like robots, yet the brotherhood are fine with those. Also, synths can only be reprogrammed by the Institute. Get rid of them, and all you can do to them is wipe their memories and give them a new start. Problem solved.
>SJW BOOGIE MAN
Fuck off. What if you found out you were actually AI, would you just say "welp, I guess I can be reprogrammed into a killing machine, might as well kill myself"?
>>322002592
>Just like robots, yet the brotherhood are fine with those
That's because they don't resemble humans and go undetected by other humans you fucking numbskull.
An assaultron does not look or sound human, it doesn't act human. Synths were DESIGNED to REPLACE humans. You are creating an argument that is easier to attack and then proceeding to argue against that argument, instead of the one that I have presented you.
If only there was a word for that?
>>322003007
>Synths were DESIGNED to REPLACE humans
Way to ignore 90% of my post, but sure. Does it matter if you get killed by a rampaging synth or a rampaging assaultron? You'll be just as dead. I'm not saying they should spare institute synths, just the ones who've been mind-wiped. Those pose no thread whatsoever and will not go berserk unless the Institute gets its hands back on them which they won't, because you end up wiping them out. Without the institute, synths are no longer a danger. Even with the institute around, mind-wiped synths aren't easy to find and if they find them they'll have to loudly extract them which eliminates the point of that synth suddenly going rogue that you are so afraid of
>>322002592
>Also, synths can only be reprogrammed by the Institute.
that's not true
>Get rid of them, and all you can do to them is wipe their memories and give them a new start.
this doesn't make sense as a result
>Problem solved.
this isn't true as a result
>I'm not saying they should spare institute synths, just the ones who've been mind-wiped. Those pose no thread whatsoever and will not go berserk unless the Institute gets its hands back on them
this is also not true as a result
>Without the institute, synths are no longer a danger.
this is also not true as a result
>Even with the institute around, mind-wiped synths aren't easy to find and if they find them they'll have to loudly extract them
this is also not true
>>322003618
>that's not true
Then please tell me who else in the wasteland is capable of reprogramming synths into killing machines and not just wiping their memory
>>321999052
>We've already settled this. Synths being able to be reprogrammed into walking killing machine slaves that do your bidding is why they need to be exterminated. They aren't human and they were designed as weapons of war or mechanical slaves to be used by humans, period. Make an argument as to why it's a good idea to keep synths around.
Not that guy but coursers weren't programmed they were selected because they had an aptitude for combat and then trained for the role. It makes you wonder why the even make synths.
>>322003745
doctor amari, for one
>>322003972
She can create and wipe memories. Nobody is it said this only works on synthetic beings and if it doesn't, humans can be "reprogrammed" as well.
>>322003893
>Not that guy but coursers weren't programmed they were selected because they had an aptitude for combat and then trained for the role
Literally every synth has the potential to be a courser.
>>322004379
> you can take a courser personality and implant it into any synth and that synth will become a killing machine that perfectly represents the courser's personality to the fullest
>humans can be "reprogrammed" as well.
No, they can't. Wow there goes your entire argument.
>She can create and wipe memories.
She literally took the personality and intent of one synth and implanted it into another on her very first try using damaged parts.
