How can SEGA make Sonic good for his 25th anniversary game in 2016? Lord knows he needs it, considering the last passable Sonic game was Generations in 2011 and they've been pumping out pure unadulterated shit ever since
>>321205218
Take the good aspects from the 3D games and based it off that.too bad its just gonna be generations 2
>>321205418
i'd be fine with generations 2 at this point tbfh
>>321205453
I'm so sick of them banking off nostalgia but I know its going to happen anyway.
>>321205418
>Generations 2
>Lava Reef
>Hang Castle / Mystic Mansion
>Sky Deck
>Final Rush
>Jungle Joyride
Please yes
They were onto a good thing with Unleashed/Colors/Generations, taking a cool but flawed formula and ironing out problems with each game. Why Sonic Team ditched that for Lost World and Boom is fucking beyond me
Fast paced hard as nails platformer.
Rayman had the right idea.
>>321205612
they definitely have the sense of speedy platforming down but a sonic game would need to have much more layered levels
>>321205725
A 2D platformer is pretty much the only way sonic can not be considered a joke in the industry. Something like Dust Force or Super Meat Boy would be a good starting point.
>>321205916
unfortunately the public at large thinks 3D > 2D every time and companies follow the money
Let whoever made the mobile versions of Sonic 1 and 2 make a 2D Sonic game with HD graphics and new stuff to the formula.
>>321205218
Here's how
Take generations' level design, add momentum like adventure, expand on how Sonic controls in Sonic Lost World, throw in some tricks, perfect gameplay.
Fire Pontac and Graff, get better writers (maybe Ian or whoever wrote Sonic Battle).
Add plenty of fan service like returning characters that haven't been around in a while, bonus playable characters, etc.
Battle Race mode like Heroes or Adventure 2.
There, it's perfect.
>>321206121
The new Rayman games were quite successful and well received. Taking a game back to its roots is never a bad thing.
sonic was never good
>>321206274
>le only 2d sonic is good maymay
>>321206378
Fuck you
>>321206396
Go to bed Chris
>>321206396
It's not a meme, 3D Sonic games are fucking terrible, the only half-decent one is Generations.
>>321206325
Dust Force and Meat Boy are not the same as classic Sonic. Even Rayman to an extent.
Tough as nails, trial and error is not what Classic Sonic is about
>>321206593
i still colors had a better 3D running engine then generations
>>321206593
There's nothing objectively wrong with the Sonic segments of the Adventure games besides the fucking camera and the linear level design (Adventure 2). Same can be said about Heroes to an extent, but that game has slippery fucking controls.
>>321206602
Not saying it is, just stating examples of how good 2D platformers can be both enjoyable and respected and saying Sonic should go back to being a good 2D game. Though a fast paced hard as fuck sonic would be great to see.
DONT YOU GET IT? IM NOT MY ORIGINAL CHARACTER BLUCKLES IM THE REAL KNUCKLES TRAPPED IN THE REAL WORLD
>>321205218
Who fucking cares about Sonic when we have Mario?
God.
>>321206813
> IM THE REAL KNUCKLES TRAPPED IN THE REAL WORLD
Thanks for reminding me of this.
>>321206863
Modern Mario games have literally no replay value
>>321206396
Fast, precision platforming just doesn't work in 3D. All of the recent 3D Sonic games have been laced with gimmicks to cover this, with Unleashed going as far as using a separate genre that actually works well with the 3D style.
The best possible outcome I can think of is something similar to Rayman Origins. Colourful, fluid, beautiful 2D animation with extremely tight controls.
>>321207418
>Fast, precision platforming just doesn't work in 3D
Jet Set Radio Future says hi.
Fuck they should just get AM2 to make the next Sonic.
>>321206863
Mario is stale. The only reason why he's not dead is because he's powering the money machine.
>>321207558
JSR is a lot slower than Sonic, though
>>321205218
I don't really care. Every single modern video game (seventh gen and above) is so garbage they aren't even worth using for drink coasters. They'll just fuck it up like Sonic "Boost to Win" Generations casualization or a buggy shit mess like all the other modern Sonic games.
There are other franchises that need saving. They aren't going to be, but we always have the past. The only good games that will ever be made for the rest of time.
>>321207558
>jet set radio
>precise
As much as I love JSR, it's clunky as fuck. Every character feels heavier than they should be, and despite that, they all seem to soar through the air without trouble.
No matter what, even if the gameplay is good and fun, people will bitch about it not being the Genesis games.
>>321205218
Take the Sonic Generations modern gameplay and refine it further. Simplify the buttons so that the control scheme resembles the simplified Colors control scheme, and make it so that the stages are at least 70% 3D sections
From there I guess you'd do the standard Sonic structure: 8-14 zones with 2 acts a piece, a boss at the end of each zone, 7 Special Stages, 2/3+ playable characters and so on. From there, the game could be rounded off with the following
>Time trials with ghost replays, connected to an online leaderboard
>A Sonic Adventure 2 Battle style race mode through any of the single player zones, available local and online
>An unlockable mode that plays like Outrun - you, as Sonic, run through stage segments against a timer, reaching branching paths in the road and trying to replenish the timer by hitting checkpoints, taking advantage of the Drift mechanic
>An unlockable mode that plays like a three-lane infinite runner, taking advantage of the Quick Step mechanic
The Unleashed/Generations 3D engine does play more like a racing/platformer hybrid after all - they might as well go all the way and emphasize the racing aspect of it
And throw in the Chao Garden I guess. Might as well give the autists a bit of fanwank, they've been waiting long enough
>>321207759
Which Sonic? It's faster than Lost World and the Adventure games.
>>321207871
I actually thought JSRF was a bit slippery
>>321205218
Why the fuck do Mii costumes based off of characters always have to have the face open?
Knuckles, Geno, K. Rool, and Chocobo would all look great without the shitty mii face in the middle
at least I can make Bluckles.
>>321208543
So you can see your Mii's face, of course!
:^)
>>321205218
nah lost world wasnt that bad OP
>>321205218
Takes all of the good stuff from Sonic 1, 2, 3 & Knuckles, Unleashed, Colors, and Generations and put it in a game.
Bam done.
>>321205218
Two pronged approach
The first is a game that plays like Generations meets Adventure. Replace the boost with the abusable Adventure spindash, cut out the fat like the drifting, and make the stages nearly completely 3D, with more branching paths than the stages in Generations. Playable Tails and Knuckles would be rad too, if they had different path branches and powers like in Sonic 3 & Knuckles. Make sure the bosses are actually good (Generations had some fucking dire boss battles) and you're pretty much set as far as a 3D Sonic title goes.
Second, just get Taxman and Stealth (the iOS remake guys) to work on a new 2D Sonic game for all platforms, using their current physics engine. Have Richard Jacques (musician of Sonic 3D Blast and Sonic R) on the music side of things and get an artist to make hand-drawn 2D assets that look like the Sonic OVA or the Sonic CD opening sequence.
Between these two, you have arguably the best 3D Sonic outing in a long time, and a 2D outing that at the very least could live up to the originals since Sonic 4 utterly let us down in that regard. What makes it more frustrating is that neither of the options outlined above would even be particularly hard to accomplish - they have all of the components and staff members, they just haven't bothered to try the fucking simple options.
>>321208543
I'm going to buy the costumes to make Blails and Bluckles
>>321210305
>hand-drawn 2D assets that look like the Sonic OVA or the Sonic CD opening sequence
not likely, nobody out there seems to be able to nail the 90s anime aesthetic anymore. sure would be nice tho
>>321205218
To stop hiding within their two-decade shadow and actually find a way to develop a 3D Sanic game that incorporates 2D's pinball physics, momentum, timing, stage design and harder enemies into 3D space with multiple pathways and spread-out speedan sections (so the whole game isn't just that) that reward good timing and input. Also choice in what levels get tackled would be pretty nice to have.
Homing should only be a power-up like the 4 elemental shields and running shoes, Boost should only come from in-game boosters, and characters should be close enough to Sonic while offering a major environmental change. Neutral on there being new characters, depending on how they're handled.
I was hoping we'd have this since S4 was announced, but I guess SEGA is too afraid to leave all the generational bases and easier development they tried to cover.
>>321213095
>a 3D Sanic game that incorporates 2D's pinball physics, momentum, timing, stage design and harder enemies into 3D space with multiple pathways and spread-out speedan sections
I'm skeptical that they can actually pull that off. I'd be all for them trying the Mario 3D World approach (that is, trying to take everything that worked about the popular 2D incarnations and translating it direct to 3D), but there's a lot more hurdles to think about. It'd be interesting as a one-off experimental game though
>Generations
>passable
Last passable game was Sonic Adventure 2. Sonic Battle, for spinoffs.
>>321214245
>Sonic Adventure 2
>Better than Generations
Sonic Generations had cringeworthy cutscenes and shit bosses (although SA2 had shit bosses too), as well as a few awful missions but they're mostly optional anyway. It's by no means perfect, but the treasure hunting and shooting levels in Sonic Adventure 2 were pretty damn unbearable. The good parts of SA2 are completely overshadowed by how much shit you have to play through just to get to them.
I don't think anybody could really argue that one is better than the other, because 3D Sonic as a whole has had nothing but patchy entries. No amount of nostalgia for the Adventure series will change the fact that they're just as flawed as the Unleashed/Colors/Generations string of games
>>321214245
>Sonic Adventure 2
edgy
>>321205218
They said they want to make the 3d games more like the 2d games. At this point Sega is eventually going to get it right unfortunately when they finally do make a good sonic game not many people will be around to appreciate it.
>>321206593
>boost to win flat levels are good
Top kuk when will /v/ stop being so contrarian and admit the best 3D sonic games in terms of gameplay on par to the originals were the Adventures. Sure a lot of the game was shit, but most of the sonic gameplay and shadow gameplay was the best in the series. If 06 weren't such a shit show it would've been decent as well. Adventure 1 and 2 actually had fucking momentum and a decent honing attack. Generation does not.
>>321215180
>SA2 momentum
>Generations what the fuck is momentum boost to win
SA1 and SA2 are way more reflective of the original 2D games and the best attempt at putting it in 3D yet.
>>321217651
Again, momentum is important, but the bad parts of Sonic Adventure 2 are far more invasive and long-winded. If Sonic Adventure 2 had more speed levels and less of everything else, maybe it'd be a different story, but personally I consider a game that's universally average to be better than a game that's 1/3 awesome to every 2/3's complete shit
>>321208543
Because it's a mii costume?
>>321205218
SASRT was pretty fucking stellar, but that was more of a Sega game than a Sonic one.
>>321219479
It makes sense for shit like captain falcon and megaman costumes, but the point of mii fighters was to "make anyone lol", so it's stupid that tails, knuckles, geno, and chocobo costumes focus your shitty OC so prominently
>>321205581
Boom was shat out by a different studio to cash-in on a new cartoon and Sonic Team changed the gameplay in Lost Worlds because the developers said they were sick of making detailed levels that players would ignore and get through as quickly as possible.
>>321220267
>Sonic Team changed the gameplay in Lost Worlds because the developers said they were sick of making detailed levels that players would ignore and get through as quickly as possible.
Well they certainly went about that in the worst fucking way possible. Like, I get it - Sonic being as fast as he is means that they have to design, render and store literally miles of detailed level geometry for each stage, which is a lot of work to make a game that actually ends up being quite short (which is also why they put in so much alternate gameplay styles, filler and the like).
There are a million better ways they could've gone about it though. The simplified art style of Lost World certainly would've lifted the load a lot, and from there all they would've needed to do was make Sonic a tiny bit slower and limit the boost system like Sonic Colors did. Heck, even the gravity gimmick probably could've been pulled off well. With all that being said, the controls were awful, the levels uninspired, the Wisps were fucking stupid (gamepad controls, really?), the "parkour" was clunky and having a button for differing run speeds is about as un-Sonic as it gets. Rationalize it however you like, but Lost World was a step in the wrong direction after Generations.
Take the time and effort to make genesis era Sonic work in 3D. I imagine it'd be like a blend of Marble Blast Ultra, Trackmania, and Super Mario 3D Land with that classic Sonic aesthetic, sorry if that's hard to imagine.
Also, about as much dialogue as a Kirby game. Some exposition near the beginning and end, but otherwise use gestures and such to handle story progression and characterization
>>321205559
Need way more levels than that, senpai.
Generations' problem was that it was way too short. Instead of 3 zones for each age, they should go for 4 or 5 zones.
>>321205218
Why is that SA1, the first 3d sonic is still the one with the best controls for sonic in 3d?
>>321222798
Lost World has better controls. Neither are good, don't get me wrong, but polish the LW control scheme, add momentum to the physics, and make the level design better than Duludubi Star's and you'd have a really good controlling Sonic game.
You know what's the main problem? The 2d games split the gameplay between actual platforming and sections where you go fast but were still mostly platforming sections. The d ones are just fast. Fast all the time. Go in a stright line and sometimes one of those dumb loo de loops that are in every single level for the whole game. At least they're done with their weird period of trying to make sonic games these huge epics with serious, dramatic story telling.
>>321222714
I must admit, I was a little annoyed that Sonic 3 and Knuckles only got one stage. SEGA treats them as two games when it's profitable and one game when it's an excuse to be lazy, which is irritating. Plus Ice Cap would've been perfect in a Classic/Modern crossover game - Classic Sonic would have an Ice Cap inspired by Sonic 3 whilst Modern Sonic would have an Ice Cap inspired by both Sonic 3 and Sonic Adventure
Could've also been cool to see a Sonic 4 stage or a Sonic 3D Blast stage reimagined, but I'm not gonna kid myself into thinking that would ever have had a chance of happening
>>321206325
>Taking a game back to its roots is never a bad thing.
Reminder that this abortion of a game was marketed as "taking Sonic back to his roots".
>get a decent budget
>hire good level designers
>make a game with a hand drawn artstyle like Wario Land Shake It so tiles could easily be put together like the genesis games
>good music
>>321223076
Though now that I think about it, a tiny bit of generations and lost world aren't like that so maybe they're learning.
>>321223031
>Lost World has better controls
Really? Haven't played it but I thought the controls were near-universally agreed to be complete tripe?
>>321223510
Sonic's physics were the main problem for me, although you could call that the controls.
>>321223510
The control scheme is fine, but the physics and level design are complete ass.
>>321223076
3D Sonic did what 2D Sonic couldn't: Fast platforming with a better perspective so you could react to it without previous knowledge of the level. Generations showed some really good progress branching out the Unleashed formula, but then Lost World happened and Sega kept tumbling down.
>>321205218
Transformed 2
Nothing fucking else.
>>321223350
Yeah but if you look at the game that was clearly a lie
>>321223890
I'd rather see Sumo try an actual Sonic game at this rate.
>>321205218
2016 Game of the Year!
>>321224127
Is Roy in it?
>Generations style 3D levels with less (or no) 2D sections and more emphasis on gaining and retaining momentum
>Special Stages are Monkey Ball style boards in which you have to roll around to reach a Chaos Emerald, to keep the physicsfags happy
>Bonus unlockable stages which are 2D
All audiences are happy. Have I missed anything?
