Good evening boys and girls, and welcome back to AAJ! How was everyone's Saturday? I was out of town running a PPTQ, and it went alright!
>>47979912
What's the most ridiculous possible way to use Coax from the Blind Eternities
>>47980050
I mean, there's nothing too absurd. In a sanctioned match it'll only ever get things from your sideboard (or things that got exiled, which is a neat throwback to how Wishes used to work). In non-sanctioned, I guess you could theoretically use it to find a Spawnsire of Ulamog, or put it into a blue Commander deck and find off-color Eldrazi with Devoid.
>>47979912
How the hell does double strike actually work? I understand that it does damage in the first strike damage phase and the normal damage phase. What happens if the first strike is enough to kill the assigned blockers? Does the normal strike "trample" over?
>>47980146
Not by itself, no. Let's say I have a 3/3 Double Strike guy and you block it with your own 3/3.
In the First Strike damage step, mine'll do 3 to yours, killing it. Come the normal damage step, there's no longer a blocker... but my guy doesn't have trample. It'd be no different from using Doom Blade on a blocker during normal combat, before damage- my creature simply doesn't do ANY damage to ANYTHING. So if it had Lifelink, I'd only gain 3 life from the damage it dealt to your blocker.
If it has trample, and kills all the blockers in the first hit, it'll trample over for the second, but only if it actually HAS trample.
Were there other questions about Double Strike you had that you wanted answered?
>>47979912
What the fucking fuck is up with meld.
>>47980353
Dunno. If it's real, we'll know when they explain it or when we get the FAQ for the set. If it's fake, then don't worry about it.
Personally I hope it's not real, because I'm pretty sure they've experimented with "Cards that need specific other cards" before (like with the Witch/Newt/Cauldron stuff) and it doesn't go over well, so I'd be very surprised if they made that the mechanic of an entire set.
>>47980404
You remember AVR Limited? There was one archetype that was viable, and draft was miserable because all 8 players are fighting over it. Black cards were wholly worthless, and the entire thing was generally a luck-sacking affair.
If this is real, it's going to be even MORE luck-dependant.
>>47980478
Like, it's entirely possible that they make the cards at least Limited playable without the Meld, and if you get matching Meld cards that's just gravy (and it might open up Meld-counterpicking if you know you passed one half of a Meld pairing already)... but I just really feel like this isn't likely.
Then again, I was hoping it wouldn't be "lol Emrakul" because that felt way too obvious and lazy, yet here we are.
>>47980518
"LOL Emrakul" was a given once we knew that BFZ was going to be a 2-set block, to be honest.
>>47980518
Honestly my expectation was that it wasn't going to be a major theme, just something thrown in to complement actually relevant keywords and shit. It's got the Meld word on the card and all, but I don't know how many of those you could actually put in without it just making the set heavy with them. Two sets of two? Three?
hey there judge. im thinking of returning in a casual style for the moment, but i want to know about the modern style. is it fun? most of what i have is older to ancient with G/W ravinca decks being my favorites, only second to infect.
can the two be meshed well, or is it too many style competing for dominance?
>>47980612
"Meld" would have to be one of the mechanics of the set, which means it'd have a decent presence in the set. They wouldn't design a keyword and then put it on 4 or 6 cards.
I'm also not sure how much design space there is for "These 2 things become 1 thing".
>>47980625
Personally I can't stand Modern, but to each their own.
>>47980742
It's just so card disadvantageous, it feels like it'd be guaranteed to be one of the gimmickier bits like, uh, Abberant Researcher, or Skin Invasion. Or Neglected Heirloom.
It's possible that Meld is a keyword but it's usually "Melds with a werewolf" or even "Melds with a creature with Power <2" or shit like that, and it's just this card that calls out specific names. Something like that. It just strikes me as the kind of thing that Maro has leaned towards doing once or twice, rather than basing a set around.
>>47980808
You're not understanding what I'm saying.
Meld, as it exists on the supposed spoiler, is a mechanic. It's not just a 'thematic' thing like Skin Invasion flipping from a non-creature to a creature, it's an entire ability that does not currently exist that they would have to write rules for. They don't do that to put a half-dozen cards in a set.
>>47980856
Keep in mind Tribute had 11 cards with that mechanic, Cipher had 13. If they do this, it'll be on 5 or 6 pairs of cards.
>>47981103
Still feels like a waste. I dunno. There's enough that's got me giving this the side-eye that I'd be legitimately surprised if they went with Meld. Especially with how big of a deal Limited is for WotCaHS, putting a dozen cards that require a specific other card in the set seems weird. It also damn near precludes there from being a Rare thing with Meld unless it's bonkers without its other half.
>>47981150
>WotCaHS
What did he mean by this?
>>47981173
Wizards of the Coast (a Hasbro Subsidiary).
>>47981186
Are you now contractually obligated to say that part?
>>47981281
Nah, I just feel like taking the piss every now and then.
if an [artifact - equipment] becomes an [artifact creature - equipment] and a creature with soulbound attaches with it, is that creature influenced by the equipment?
>>47981309
a creature can never be attached to anything. It'll either be illegal to attach, or if it was attached when it was animated it falls off as an SBA.
>>47981309
Creatures can't be attached to stuff.
If you animated an Equipment and then Soulbonded it to something, all that happens is whatever normally happens with the Soulbond. If you're asking "do the effects of an Equipment that's a creature transfer to the creature I soulbond it with", no.
>>47981351
I got a bit confused on the terminology.
Yeah, that makes sense. Thanks.
what happens when a creature has flying and horsemanship?
can it still be blocked by fliers?
>>47982906
It can only be blocked by other creatures with both Flying and Horsemanship.
>>47983734
gA, a couple of questions about how to resolve things when judging at FNM (in all cases, I investigated and determined that no foul play was intended, just honest mistakes).
1) Player A controls a Nimble Mongoose. At some point they enchant it with an aura. A few turns later, player B notices that Mongoose shouldn't be enchanted. What do?
2) Player A resolves Time Spiral. Player B neglects to shuffle his graveyard into his library. This isn't caught until player A has already resolved a Ponder and now has a Snap on the stack targeting player B's Insectile Aberration. What do?
3) Player A controls a Thalia, Guardian of Thraben and an Aether Vial (untapped, two counters). Player B Krosan Grips it on end step, but neither player notices yet that B only paid three mana and could not have paid four. Grip resolves, they move to B's turn. B has drawn a card, goes to cast a Gamble, and only then do the players notice that Grip shouldn't have been cast.
For 1) I had A return the enchantment to hand, and had the players proceed. For 2) I had B shuffle hand and graveyard into library and re-draw seven - they hadn't played any cards since the Spiral resolved. For 3) I just left things because it didn't seem like there was a great fix.
I don't feel particularly confident in any of these rulings, but it's tough for me to gauge what's the "right" fix at Regular.
>>47984070
1) Shrug it off and move on. When you notice something illegal happened, you have two options: Rewind, or leave it as is. You should use your judgement to determine which of the two is the least disruptive, and do that. For something caught maybe as far forward as the opponent's next turn? Go ahead and back it up, depending on what all happened. Several turns later? No way in hell am I rewinding that far. Correct anything that's currently illegal (like if the Mongoose had protection from Enchantments rather than shroud) and otherwise just remind them to be more careful.
2) Same situation. Determine what's least harmful to the game state: Leaving things as-is, or rewinding through the currently-on-the-cast Snap and the resolved Ponder. Generally rewinding through draws is fucky- rewinding through a PONDER is even fuckier. I'm likely to leave this alone and remind them to be more careful.
3) Same deal. For this, I'm okay with rewinding through just the turn-based draw of B's turn, because that's fairly easy to do.
So, yeah. You shouldn't try to "fix" things the way you did- outside of correcting currently-illegal gamestates, your options are "rewind to immediately before they broke the rule" or "leave it alone". Don't try to administer partial fixes to try to 'put it right' after the fact, it can just lead to more problems.
>>47984284
Yeah, I figured as much. Thanks for confirming. I'll know better in the future.
I was probably being overly zealous because my tendency would be to leave it unless the current gamestate is illegal, and I wasn't sure if that was okay at Regular.
At Competitive, do you just issue warnings and leave things as they are in those situations? The first one I'd definitely do some more serious investigating, because a player at Competitive should really know how their cards work.
>>47984330
Competitive is the same as Regular, except you also give out an actual penalty. Determine if it's less harmful to rewind or to leave it as-is, and then enact whichever choice you made. This is for GRVs specifically, mind you.
Also, the IPG has a handful of "default fixes" that you apply automatically in certain situations, but outside of those it's just "rewind it or leave it alone".
>>47984330
As for as actual penalties go, last time I checked the standard policy is the player that made the mistake gets a Warning - GRV (GPE, or Game Play Error) and his opponent gets a Warning - GRV (Failure to Maintain Proper Game State).
Neither of these warnings are worth upgrading to game loss unless it's the exact same GPE that's occured several times in a row, and you never upgrade Failure to Maintain.
>>47984568
That part I was aware of, thanks.
>>47984568
You've got it a little backwards.
It's Game Play Error - Game Rule Violation (GPE - GRV) to the offending party, and Game Play Error - Failure to Maintain Game State (GPE - FTMGS) for the opponent.
You list the 'class' of error first (GPE, TE, USC) and then the specific infraction.
>>47984590
Alright. I just got it scrambled.
Out of curiosity, do you Cube, gA?
>>47984658
I don't, but not out of any dislike of Cube or anything. Nobody in my area has a cube, and I don't really feel like building one because I'm fuck-awful at Limited so I wouldn't be the best guy to put in charge of building a Cube.
Also, I only have about 3 friends I'd trust with anything more expensive than a Pauper cube, and I already play tons of EDH, so that's where I'm at. If someone HAS a cube at a GP or something I'll sit down for a cube draft all day, but it's not really a 'thing' in my area.
>>47984689
Alright kids, I need to get some sleep. If the thread's still up when I get to the office tomorrow I'll begin answering questions again- if it slips off the last page while I sleep, I'll just make a new one!
Honestly, the Meld cards strongly remind me of Conspiracy drafts where you benefited by picking Hidden Agenda Conspiracies plus several copies of the same common. If you only have one Lizard Warrior, it gets a boost from your Conspiracy, so it's not completely useless, but if you get five of them, it gets crazy.
Similarly, if you get one Meld card, it's still usable on its own, but if you get both, you get more value.
>>47986959
It's something that has popped up from time to time, although i personally dislike the idea of doing it with DFCs.
My opponent has a Body Double targeting a Progenitor Mimic targeting a Mulldrifter in play.
If I play a Phyrexian Metamorph targeting this amalgamtion of his, will mine also inherit the Progenitor Mimics upkeep trigger or will it just be a regular old Mulldrifter?
>>47988217
Body Double doesn't target. Neither does Progenitor Mimic. Neither does Phyrexian Metamorph.
Anyway, copy effects pick up copy effects, so your Phyrexian Mimic Doubledrifter will be an Artifact Creature - Elemental with Flying, "When ~ enters the battlefield, draw two cards", Evoke 2U, and "At the beginning of your upkeep, if this creature isn't a token, put a token onto the battlefield that's a copy of this creature."
tl;dr you get a Mimicfish every turn yes.
>>47988573
Alright, back in the office.
If I play a Maelstrom Wanderer and the first cascade pulls a Worldly Tutor does that resolve first allowing me to stack the top card or does the second cascade go off then I do both?
>>47989049
You'll start to resolve the topmost Cascade, and hit the Tutor, which you then cast. The Tutor is the top object on the stack, so it has to resolve before your second Cascade, so as long as you tutor up something that costs 7 or less, that's what your next Cascade will hit.
>>47989069
Also, just to confirm, does the wanderer resolve last?
>>47989082
It does.
You cast Wanderer, and put it on top of the stack (which is probably empty, but hey, maybe you gave it Flash somehow). Then Cascade triggers, so you have two Cascade triggers ABOVE that.
First one resolves, finds a spell, casts it, now that spell is on top of the stack. Spell resolves. Second Cascade resolves, finds a spell, casts it. Now that spell is on top of the stack. It resolves. Now, after all that, Wanderer can resolve.
From Gather Specimens Gatherer entry:
"1. 10. 2008 - If two or more players have each cast Gather Specimens during the same turn and a creature would enter the battlefield, the creature’s would-be controller (the controller of the creature spell, for example) chooses one of the applicable Gather Specimens to apply. Then the new would-be controller of the creature repeats this process among the remaining Gather Specimens, and so on, until there are no more possible Gather Specimens effects to apply."
Why is this so? I thought that the affected creature spell's controller is still the player who cast it, even after applying the first replacement effect, so he should be the one choosing the order of all the other effects. What am I missing?
>>47989128
Because it's not affecting a creature spell, it's affecting the creature PERMANENT that's trying to enter the battlefield. At the time that the event of "This here fucker entering the battlefield" is happening, the would-be controller is the person who did cast it. Once they apply a Specimens, the would-be controller is the player whose control it's 'going to' enter under now, not the person who cast it.
>>47989147
Oh, thanks, it makes sense to me now.
The rules are very good at hiding the special zone between the stack and the battlefield. (Half-joking here)
>>47989187
I'd say it's more that people think there's a weird zone between them, when there isn't.
>>47988573
>>47989032
Cool, thanks for the clarification!
What happens if you have a Godhead of Awe on the field and a creature with Evolve?
Let's say there's Godhead of Awe and Gyre sage on the board. Does a creature that is normally 2/2 triggers the Evolve even if Godhead of Awe makes it a 1/1 ?
>>47989625
The creature comes in as a 1/1. There is never a moment where the base P/T is not 1/1 while it's on the field- it doesn't enter as a 2/2 and then shift down.
So, to Evolve your Sage in that situation you'd need something that enters with counters beyond the base P/T.
How can I play Odric, Master tactician without hating myself for using him?
>>47989777
Beer
>>47989777
Why would you hate yourself? For being evil during combat?
>>47989777
I feel the same way whenever I play my Gwafa Hazid deck
For the new meld angels, if one of them is your commander and you combine them, does the combined form still deal commander damage?
Can you explain how priority works? It's the one part I find extremely confusing
An example that I have trouble understanding:
Say you play a planewalker with a base of 3 loyalty counter and a player lightning bolts it. Can you do one of your planeswalker's + abilities to keep him alive?
Are planeswalker abilities considered like instant or Sorceries?
>>47989954
Prioirity is essentially "whose turn is it to try casting stuff" during a turn.
You can't respond to your opponent bolting your walker, but you can say "I'm going to play this 3-loyalty walker, and then I'm going to use his + ability" by retaining priority, not giving your opponent a chance to bolt him until you've already added more loyalty counters (since that's a cost!)
>>47989894
I honestly have no clue. That's absolutely something that we'll have to wait for confirmation on, because I don't know if they're considered the same card.
>>47989954
Priority is the system of "who can do stuff, and when they can do it" in Magic. It's why you can't just windmill slam a spell, attack someone, and say "end my turn" in one sentence and deprive them of a response. There's very few actions you can take without priority, and casting a spell is not one of them.
For your planeswalker example, you can't + in response because the Planeswalker abilities can't be used with anything on the stack. The stack must be empty. That said, it depends on how they're trying to do it. If you play a Planeswalker that comes down with 3, your opponent can't just insta-bolt it, they have to wait for priority, and you have to hand it to them. Or, you can activate the + ability to put it out of Bolt range first.
If it's something you've HAD on board, they could just Bolt it during your upkeep or such.
>>47989954
>>47990056
>cont.
Whenever it's your turn, each time a new phase or step starts, you gain priority. You can use that to do things like play lands, cast spells, or activate abilities. Whenever you do any of these things, you still have priority to do other things, until you're done - then your opponent gains priority to do what they want. If they do anything then they keep priority to add things on the stack until THEY are done, at which point you get priority again.
Once both of you give up priority back to back, whatever is the topmost object on the stack resolves. If the stack is empty it moves to the next phase or step.
I have a Kor spirit dancer on the battlefield. I attempt to cast an Aura to attach to it but an opponent counters the aura
Does Kor spiritdancer's draw ability triggers? Are counterspelled spells you play considered ''cast''?
>>47990293
Yep! Stuff like Spiritdancer cares that you CAST a spell, not that it RESOLVED. In fact, the trigger has to resolve before the spell ever has a chance to, so it has absolutely no way to check whether or not it resolved anyway.
>>47990293
Yep! You cast the spell, and that's what spiritdancer checks. Whether or not it RESOLVES doesn't matter.
>>47979912
I asked it yesterday on the commander thread because there wasn't an AAJ thread up, and while I got a response, a RL friend of mine said that I'd best get a judge's opinion to be sure:
I'm working on a brion Stoutarm deck, and I'm wondering about the effects of Gift of Immortality.
If I attach it to a creature, I sac it, it instantly returns but GoI doesn't until the end of turn. If I then sac it again and get it back onto the battlefield again before GoI triggers and comes back, does GoI still re-attach without issue?
I' think it wouldn't because it counts as if the original target of the effect (the creature just returned with the initial GoI proc) is removed, making the effect fizzle. Then again, it's still that same creature, so it might also not matter how many times it's been removed, as long as it's back at the end of turn when the recursion effect triggers.
>>47990579
Gift will only be able to 'track' the creature it brings back the first time. If you throw the Gifted creature at someone, then let it come back and throw it again, then get it back via say, Karmic Guide, your Gift will try to come back attached to 'that creature' (meaning the exact object it put onto the battlefield), but it won't find it because that object no longer exists.
Any time cards move between zones, they become new objects with no memory of (or relation to) previous "versions" of themselves.
>>47990072
A bit more on priority, if I cast a creature, it resolves and it's now on the battlefield.
Priority is mine at this point but I'm thinking about my next move. Can my opponents cast an instant while I still have priority to kill it?
>>47990884
Nope, because they can't cast a spell without priority. Until you pass priority over to them (either by explicitly doing so, or by casting a spell), they can't respond.
>>47990624
Thanks. I thought this was the case, but wasn't entirely sure.
So you think meld + soul forge will work the same way as soul forge + strionic resonator? (Yes, no guarantees before rules are out, I know)
>>47991250
I'm not really sure what you mean by soul forge.
Also, gotta pop into town to buy lunch, back in a flash and a half.
What usually gives priority to other players during your turn?
Is there a place where you can see each time the other players can get priority on your turn?
>>47991335
MTGO.
And you give other players priority on your turn. When you have priority, at any time, your options are to take a legal game action (cast a spell, activate an ability, etc.) or to pass priority. You can't just sit there, hold priority, and do nothing. In order for the game to advance to the next step/phase, both players have to pass priority over an empty stack. In order for an object on the stack to resolve, both players have to pass priority when it's the topmost object. You can cast a spell/activate an ability and retain priority, but you must explicitly state that you are doing so. Otherwise, you're implicitly passing priority to your opponent. The active player (player whose turn it is) gets priority whenever an object on the stack resolves, so they get the chance to do things first.
Really, though, you should find the comprehensive rules and read the section on priority. It's fairly well-explained and straightforward, and you can come back here afterwards and ask any questions you might still have.
>>47991335
>What usually gives priority to other players during your turn?
You passing priority to them. That's it. Of course until you pass priority so they can pass it back, nothing will ever leave the stack - so you have to do it eventually
![246[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/fQmAruE.jpg "246[1].jpg")
>>47991307
ah meant soul foundry (pic related)
>>47991335
At the start of each step and phase, the player whose turn it is gets priority, they get priority,
if they want to cast a spell, activate an ability they are the first who can do so, then priority gets passed like this:
1. A player casts spells/activates abilities until they chose to stop , then passes priority
2. Then each other player gets priority and may choose to cast spells/activate abilities, then, if a player does goto 1, (otherwise they pass priority as normal).
3. Resolve the top most element of the stack (the most recent spell/ability), then goto 2, starting with the player whose turn it is (as he/she is the one to receive priority after something reslolved).
The same goes for moving to a next phase, there is also a priority pass then.
>>47989894
I can now confirm that according to Tabak, yes. If Bruna or Gisela are your commander and get merged into Brisela, then Brisela deals Commander damage.
>>47993099
So, Soul Foundry + Resonator just lets you Imprint two things, and pay X as the sum of their costs to get two tokens at a time.
Meld + Soul Forge is a non-thing, since all 6 of the Melders meld from the field, and Foundry eats things from your hand.
>>47989093
>>47989069
ok, last question about this.
So if the first card cascaded is a creature and the second is a board wipe the first creature is killed but the Wanderer itself is not, correct?
>>47993519
Right. You'd cast your guy, then your board wipe, then Wanderer resolves.
>>47993537
Great, hopefully that covers all possible scenarios with Cascade shenanigans
>>47993560
Hopefully! If not, please feel free to ask any other questions you think up. I'm more than happy to help.
>>47993575
Actually, one more.
If The first card pulled is a counter that counters my Wanderer do I still cascade the second time?
>>47993618
Yep! The Cascade triggers are 100% independent of Wanderer the second they hit the stack. You can also just choose not to cast the counterspell if you don't want to, and that stops the cascade but keeps your Wanderer.
That said, Remand is a popular choice for Wanderer decks because it counters Wanderer into your hand so you can Cascade again next turn without eating the tax.
This probably sounds really stupid and probably would be broken as fuck but fun to build around. What kind of rules nightmare would a card have it is said something along the lines of "Your life becomes 1. Prevent all damage dealt by a soucre and opponent controls to you while CARDNAME remains on the field".
I could think of some really fun build arounds, any cards that have fateful hour or death's shadow type shenanigans.
>>47996132
gA refuses to deal with hypothetical cards. I'm not gA
Lich and its variants are close, and they're pretty well covered as far as rules are concerned.
Worship prevents all damage that would put you less than 1 life as long as you control a creature, although it doesn't set your life total to anything.
Form of the dragon sets your life total to 5 each turn, but that's because "fuck you imma dragon"
>>47996285
Misspoke a bit there about worship. It prevents you from taking damage that would put you to 1 life so that you end up at 1 life - but it doesn't prevent ALL the damage if it'd be lethal.
>>47996285
Posting my hypothetical was a thinly veiled attempt at finding out more about rulings to be honest. To see if there were any weird or obscure clauses to where that wouldnt be allowed. Thank you though, ive been curious about similar style cards for a while, I feel like fateful hour has a lot more potential with the right build around.
>>47996355
Forest, Channel for 17, darksteel forge, platinum emperion.
Have fun.
>>47996394
Not that guy, but you'd need two forests.
>>47996394
Thats actually really cool, thanks for the suggestions man. I was under the assumption that Channel only worked when you were like paying for an X casting cost ability, I didn't know you could cast shit with it.
>someone looking to get into playing physical MTG
>severe social anxiety and have no friends who want to play it with me
wat do
>>47996708
Its mtg man, a fuckton of people have severe social anxiety. Go to an fnm or prerelease. Depending on your location, FNMs can be pretty competitive. I was always worried that my decks would be shit and I'd waste everyone's time. But really if you tell them youre new, people are typically chill and willing to help you build a deck or just make sure you have a decent time. Plus, if you don't like it, you can leave at any time man. I've got a pretty small local shop, and a bigger one a little further away. The smaller one is more close-knit and the owner is always down to play with new people if the store isnt busy. Pretty much everyone there will want more people to show up. There will be assholes and exception to that rule anywhere, but the more people who use the shop, the better the shop and the community does.
>>47996708
Watch people play on YouTube like the rest of us...
>>47996132
I only deal with the rules as they pertain to existing cards, sorry!
Munda, Ambush Leader triggers. Its controller looks at the top four cards, puts three on the top, one on the bottom. He is about to attack, when his opponent points out he never revealed the cards. You respond to the judge call.
What is the infraction and the remedy here?
>>47997128
Also, let's say you rule out cheating.
If i use a blink effect like Cloudshift on a permanent with an ability that says "activate this ability once each turn" (for example Patron of the Orochi), do i get a second chance to activate the ability (besides the need of haste to tap)?
>>47997128
...also, it's CompREL.
What else did I forget to mention?
>>47997128
Infraction is easy- Game Play Error - Hidden Card Error. Active player didn't reveal cards he was supposed to reveal. If both players can agree on exactly how many cards are on top/bottom (IE, both tell me that there's one on bottom and three on top) then we'll just reconstruct that 'set' of four cards and resolve the trigger properly.
If the players can't agree on how many went where, I'm going to investigate to find out how many I (personally) think went on top, and I'm likely to side with the Munda player because he was the one handling the cards and he stands to lose the most from lying to me here. We reveal that set, and if that set is all Allies, then gravy- no harm, no foul. Issue the Warning but not the 'fix' because there's nothing to fix and move on. If they don't match up, and I don't suspect Cheating, then we'll just shuffle away the 'excess' (the cards that are not Allies, and thus should not be in the set of 'allies I put back) away, then put the Allies on top of the shuffled deck.
>>47997145
Yep, because it becomes a new object with no memory of or relation to its previous self.
What happens when I use Dragonlord Silumgar to take Dragonlord Silumgar that is controlling my Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet?
does my opponent get zombies?
>>47997554
So, step one is you steal his Dragonlord Slugmar. Literally the second that control-changing effect begins, you get your Kalitas back because the duration of 'for as long as you control D-Lord Sliggles" has ended for your opponent. Then, State-Based Actions are checked and you pick one or the other Dragonlord to keep. If you keep your original, then you'll put the other one into your opponent's graveyard, because it isn't "a nontoken creature an opponent controls", so Kalitas won't eat it and you get no Zombie.
If you put YOURS in the graveyard, then the control effect from yours immediately ends and they get THEIR Slugmug back, leaving you with a Kalitas, no dragon, and no Zombie.
tl;dr you get your Dragon and your Kalitas and kill their Dragon but no Zombie if you're smart.
What decides the order that "at the beginning of X step" abilities enter the stack, if they're controlled by multiple players?
>>47997609
>slugmug
cute thx, byy
>>47997770
To make the situation more clear with an example, i start my turn with 1 life, enchanted with Curse of the Pierced Heart and with Honden of Cleansing Fire in play. Can i decide to make the life gain effect resolve first so that i survive?
>>47997770
>>47997866
Whoevers turn it is puts all of their triggers on the stack. Then each player in turn order puts THEIR triggers on the stack. The stack resolves backwards.
In this scenario, you'll lose 1 life from the curse (and lose the game) before you could gain life from the honden.
>>47997770
>>47997866
All of the Active Player's triggers go on the stack in the order of their choosing first, then the Non-Active Player puts their triggers on the stack in the order of THEIR choosing.
In your example, your Honden would trigger, then the Curse would go above that, poking you down to 0 and killing you before you gain life from Honden.
>>47998123
What's the weirdest reason for a penalty you've had to give, from warning to DQ?
>>47999847
Only DQs I've personally given weren't weird, they were pretty straightforward USC Cheating.
"Weirdest" penalty I've ever given was when I gave a USC - Major to someone for trash.
>>47999919
>USC - Major for trash
There has to be a story behind this.
>>47997437
What changed my mind about the Munda situation was that the legality of the resolution was verifiable, because they are in the set of three cards that were supposed to be revealed. I think the top three is "the smallest set possible" we can apply the fix to. The fourth card on the bottom is irrelevant and is there 100% legally even if it's an ally. The opponent will be then chosing three cards from the set of three, which, if they are all allies, will be put on the top of the library by their owner. If any of them are not allies, they are excess cards and therefore shuffled away (keeping the one on the bottom and the rest on the top).
>>47999945
There is!
GP... Houston or Salt Lake City, I'm not sure which. I was just patrolling the tables during one of the later rounds, keeping chairs pushed in, clearing minor trash, responding to calls, watching games, the usual. I come across a couple of people playing at a fairly isolated table, but with a match slip nearby, so they're in the main event. Next to one of them is a heap, I shit you not, at least four inches high, of wadded up tissues, all covered in snot and blood.
I just stop and gawk at it for a second, watch one of the players pull a tissue from a box in his bag, blow his nose, and put the tissue on top of the pile. I take another couple steps, and confirm: "Is this your pile of tissues?". He answers in the affirmative. I gesture to the trash can nearby, and let him know I'd be happy to bring it closer if he needs me to, but I need him to dispose of his trash because it is in what will soon be a play area (and also it's disgusting). He sneers at me, smirks, and says "Isn't that your job? You throw it away."
So, I decide to give him one last chance. Even though "Excessive Trash" was a thing we could technically penalize, I'd never seen it DONE. So I dropped the 'would you mind' and the friendliness and said "Let me rephrase that. I am giving you a direct instruction to remove your biohazard form my table." He told me to go to hell.
And then he got a Game Loss for USC - Major. Specifically, disregarding a direct instruction from a tournament official.
>>48000256
Given his attitude I'm surprised he didn't take a swing at you.
>>47980742
They said 3 meld pairings.
>>48000487
Nah, he was just being a dick. He didn't seem to realize that I could penalize him for that.
Sup guys, newbie here, got a question about a deck I'm building:
So i just started playing Magic and I built a Hardened Scales deck (basically the same as the one here, except without the planeswalkers or manabase because i'm on a budget: http://www.channelfireball.com/articles/deck-of-the-day-hardened-scales/)
However when I showed up to my local FNM, I found out Hardened Scales was no longer Standard.
Whatever, fuck standard i guess
So, How do I change the deck to make it competitively viable for the Modern format? I was thinking changing it to mono-green and throwing in Kalonian Hydra, Primordial Hydra and ramping with Arbor Elf and Overgrowth. Basically the strategy of the deck is to ramp up the 1/1 counters on the hydras and snowball them to ridiculous power after a turn or two... Does this seem like a good idea? Any recommendations related to the deck or the modern format?
>>48000547
I'm not a very good player, but I don't think you can really make it "competitively viable" for Modern.
>>48000547
You'll have a bit better luck asking the modern thread, but with as little I know about the format it doesn't sound like a HORRIBLE idea?
>>48000542
Yeah, I just figured he'd just go all sperg rage about it. I've actually seen someone do that.
Turned out the owner was on VERY friendly terms with the local PD.
>>48000690
i dont plan on placing at GP's or anything, i just don't wnna go 0-2 at my locals
>>48000724
That'd really depend on your local meta. They might be running nothing but top-tier competitive decks that you'll have trouble with, they might be running top-tier decks that this is posed well against, it might be a really casual area with goofy fun brews.
I couldn't really tell you whether or not it's viable for that. I'm also not really the guy to ask for deckbuilding advice, considering my strategic knowledge begins and ends with "attack your opponent until they die"
>>48000547
maybe play pauper instead if you're on a budget
>>48000747
Dear GA
Have you ever heard of a creative or elegant idea for EDH self-policing? A lot of groups seem to have point system gimmicks, but that doesn't seem creative or elegant to me.
>>48001344
Honestly the only self-policing that really works for non-event situations is "don't play with people who want different things than you do". The only way to 'enforce' social contracts is to just elect not to play with the people who make the game unfun for you, and possibly talk to them about why you don't enjoy X.
>>48002011
And it is now bedtime. More thread when I get to the office tomorrow morning.
>>48002205
sleep tight judger
I control a Jori En Ruin Diver and 3 other irrelevant creatures. I then cast Zada, Hedron Grinder. I then cast Titan's Strength onto Zada, Hedron Grinder.
Do I have control of the order Harness the Storm and Jori En, Ruin Diver's triggers go on the stack (so I can cast a second Titan's Strength from my graveyard and Scry 1 5 times before before drawing)?
>>48002205
When you wake up tell me if this would work. Any ideas on taking out Ema with G/R werewolves?
>>48002927
Yes, you have the choice of ordering those three triggers on the stack, as they trigger at the same time. You can make it so that you scry 1 eight times before drawing if you target Zada with the harnessed Titan's Strength.
>>48003279
This works. Good luck executing it. Also, your opponent will gain 9 life.
>use Necropotence 8 times
>hand be above 7 cards when the cards enter my hand
Do I still discard (exile) down to 7 during the End Step?
>>48005784
Yes. You put them into your hand during your end step, then after that you discard (exile) down to 7 during your cleanup step.
Here's one; I'm running a mill deck using Undead Alchemist, my friend has an emblem in play that reduces each source of damage done to him down to one point. Undead Alchemist's effect states that the defending player removes cards from the top of their deck and places them in the graveyard equal to the attacking creature's power instead of taking combat damage. (Providing the attack connects of course) My question is this; if my Alchemist's attack hits him does my opponent remove the four cards from the top of his deck or is it reduced to one?
>>48006098
>If a Zombie you control would deal combat damage to a player, instead that player puts that many cards from the top of his or her library into his or her graveyard.
I don't see mention of the attacking creature's power in the card.
>>48002927
Jori and Harness both trigger from the same event, and both of them are your triggers, so you may put them onto the stack in the order of your choosing. Harness does need a target right away, but if you already have a second Titan's Strength you're fine. So you can throw out the second Strength from your bin to give your team +3/+1 and scry 1 5 times, then draw from Jori, then give your team +3/+1 and scry 1 5 times again.
>>48005784
Yes. You get the cards from Necro during your End Step, which is immediately before the Cleanup Step (the step in which you discard to your maximum hand size).
>>48006098
So, Ajani Steadfast's Emblem and your Undead Alchemist are both trying to modify the damage being dealt by your Zombie. Your opponent is the one getting domed, so he chooses the order in which to apply the replacement and prevention effects relevant to that damage. He COULD apply the Alchemist first and replace "take N damage from Zombie" with "Put top N cards of library into graveyard", which renders the Emblem a moot point since there's no longer a damage event for it to apply to.
OOOOOR he can apply the Emblem first and prevent all but 1 damage, and then apply the Alchemist's replacement effect on that 1 damage and just mill 1. He's gonna pick that one.
Sorry, I'm a relative newcomer to the game and this keeps popping up, my friend is arguing that the emblem he gained from Ajani Steadfast means thst the effect of Undead Alchemist is reduced to him graveyarding one card rather than the amount determined by the attacking zombie's power. My argument being that he's not taking damage, he's losing cards, so the emblem's effect doesnt trigger
>>48006507
Oops, saw this just after I posted
>>48006523
Ignore my previous post and thankyou for clearing that up for me
>>48006523
>Sorry
Don't be! Everyone starts somewhere, and the whole reason I run these threads is to help people understand things they currently do not.
>Your actual question
Is answered above! The emblem doesn't ever trigger, because it doesn't HAVE a trigger. Triggers will always include the words "When", "Whenever", or "At". The Emblem has what we call a prevention effect; they work very similarly to replacement effects. In fact they work so similarly that you treat them exactly like one when it comes to their interaction with replacement effects. For full details on how that actually works, see above.
>>48006537
Fantastic, thanks for the clarification chummer, guess I'll have to keep a mana leak handy in future
You are a hero, senpai.
>>48006660
Nah, I just do this for grins.
>>48006537
Just to be clear, damage replacement effects aren't triggered so they don't use the stack (just like combat damage) and so i can't counter them with Stifle right?
>>48006931
Right.
Triggers will always, always, ALWAYS say "When", "Whenever", or "At". Always. Those are the three words to look for. An activated ability will always be worded as [COST] : [EFFECT]. Look for the colon!
Replacement effects frequently say "If THING, instead OTHER THING", but some don't; notably, the replacement effects that modify how things enter the battlefield, like Clone entering as a copy of something, or Hangarback Walker entering with counters. But generally it's easy to puzzle out by asking yourself if this ability is replacing one event with another.
Player A casts Minds Aglow with 2 cards in his library, player B has 7 cards in his library, and player C has 12. The Join Forces totals to 20, so everyone attempts to draw that many cards. What happens? When we were playing yesterday we played it as whoever had the most cards in their library wins since they lose 'last'. But I'm not sure if state based effects are checked during a spell resolution
>>48007777
Every player will try to draw 20 cards, and run out well before then. Nobody loses yet, because SBAs aren't checked in the middle of a spell or ability resolving. After Minds Aglow fully resolves, SBAs are checked, and see that all three players attempted to draw a card from an empty library since SBAs were last checked, and makes all three players lose, ending the game in a draw.
>>48007846
Thanks gA
>>48007846
>Nobody loses yet, because SBAs aren't checked in the middle of a spell or ability resolving.
>After Minds Aglow fully resolves, SBAs are checked, and see that all three players attempted to draw a card from an empty library since SBAs were last checked, and makes all three players lose, ending the game in a draw.
I learned something new today
>>48008389
That little "Huh. Neat." moment is one of the reasons I became a Judge, and five years later THAT MOMENT STILL HAPPENS.
Less frequently than it used to, but still!
Let's say I have triskaidekaphobia on the field as well as Magus of the Mirror. At the begining of my upkeep I have 13 life and my opponent has 20. I assume because triskaidekaphobia happens at the begining of my upkeep I can't tap Magus of the mirror for his effect before triskaidekaphobia goes off, but can I respond to it with Magus's tap effect? If I did would my opponent lose the game or would certain triggers not happen in time?
>>48008586
You are correct that you can't use Magus 'before' Triskaidekaphobia triggers, but you can use it in response to the trigger. You'll swap life totals with your opponent, then the phobia trigger resolves and kills him because at the time the trigger resolves he has 13 life.
This might seem like a troll question, but how do Humility and Opalescence interact? I've heard that this was a major issue among judges back in the day.
>>48008746
It was, mostly because the way the rules were written it didn't make any sense how they'd interact. Opalescence would animate Humility, which would turn off the ability, and without that ability there's no ability turning off the ability so it turns back and which turns it off, etc, etc, logic bomb.
How it works with just those two is that in layer 4, Humility becomes a Creature thanks to the type-changing effect of Opalescence. In layer 6, Humility loses all abilities because it is a creature, and thus is subject to its own ability, but that ability stays 'turned on' because layers are weird, so all other creatures will ALSO lose their abilities and become 1/1. Then in layer 7b, Humility is either a 4/4 or a 1/1, depending on if you played Humility or Opalescence first.
What's really fucky is when you animate the Opalescence with a Humility out.
>>48008645
Great, thanks! Had a fun idea for a casual deck with those and Tree of Redemption.
>>48008895
When is Purphoros not a 4/4 when you have him and Opalescence out?
>>47980856
>They don't do that to put half a dozen cards in a set.
Fucking lol.
>>48008946
Sure, that'd work. In response to the Triskaidekaphobia trigger, tap your Tree to make your life total 13. After that resolves, pop your Magus to swap your 13 with them, then they die.
>>48008953
When you played Purphoros after Opalescence and your devotion is less than 5. In that instance, he's not a creature at all.
>>48008977
Egg on my face, right?
I have Gitgud Frog out and 8 cards in hand. I discard a land during cleanup. Do I have to discard again down to 7?
>>48009896
Yep! Normally nobody gets priority during the Cleanup Step, but it IS possible- mostly from something triggering off a discard, as you did there. When that happens, players get priority to do stuff, resolve triggers, yadda yadda, and then the game creates a NEW cleanup step after that one. It'll keep doing that until one happens properly, so with enough lands you could theoretically just mill through your whole deck by drawing a land, discarding it, drawing another, repeat.
Fellow judge here. Wanted your thoughts on a commander deck idea I had. Would be aptly named JUDGE.dec and would basically be a deck of questions or "complex" calls. Some things that you can do with the game that may seem unintuitive from perhaps a flavor or layman standpoint but work nevertheless. Example could be like the Lich's Mirror being donated to someone and then having that person get 10 poison counters. I'd like to abstain from the obvious humility + opalescence nonsense if able, though. Don't want to pay for a humility.
>>48010036
I would recommend instead that you put that effort into building a Judge's Tower.
>>48010036
>don't want to pay for a humility
If you can't spend $10 on a card, you shouldn't try to build a deck around rule-fuckery.
>>48010065
Last I checked it was around $30 which initially put me off.
>>48010057
I've never heard of a judge's tower before. What is it?
>>48010333
Each player shares a 250 card library, and a graveyard. You start with no cards in hand, and you have infinite life and infinite mana. You must play any card in your hand as soon as legally possible. All optional modes are mandatory. You must activate every activated ability of permanents you control once per turn per legal target, as soon as you legally can. You always start from the bottom up (so a Mosswort Bridge's Hideaway would be activated at the first opportunity in a turn, rather than the mana ability)
If a spell or ability has X, X is always 5.
You must attack with all legal attackers and block with all legal blockers.
You lose as soon as you commit a Game Rule Violation.
>>48010036
Sounds like you're describing my Zedruu deck. I often joke that it's a deck only a judge could play.
>>48010333
Judge Tower, or "As Soon As", is the greatest and most insane of formats.
Last stupid Maelstrom Wanderer question.
If The Wanderer gets countered by an opponent the Cascade doesn't happen, correct?
>>48011382
Yes it does, cascade triggers on cast and not on entering the battlefield. In fact, the cascaded cards enter the stack after the Wanderer and resolve earlier.
>>47979912
With Meld, is someone plays Ixidor, do my melded creatures flip over and become their original card forms?
>>47980103
So, Coax can put Eldrazi creatures outside of your commander's identity colors into your hand and you actually be able to cast them?
Also, In a sanctioned standard tournament, you can't have non-standard Eldrazi in your sideboard, can you?
>>48011405
wait, so if a card has an ability that say "When X is cast...." even if you counter it the ability still happens?
>>48011489
Yes. For example if you counter Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger the opponent can still exile two permanents.
These effects enter the stack as triggered abilities and can be countered using some specific cards (Stifle, Trickbind and Voidslime).
>>48003279
>>48005741
You also need Geier Reach Bandit on the board before Brisela is on the board. Otherwise you won't be able to cast Geier Reach.
>>48011551
welp, I've been playing Magic wrong for 10 years.
>>48011570
You'd be surprised what people have not noticed.
Like Oblivion Ring can exile Emrakul, the Aeons Torn.
>>48011382
Incorrect! It does happen. The Cascade triggers on cast, not on resolution, and they exist independent of the spell that spawned them.
>>48011411
Good question. I have no idea. I'll see if I can get an answer out of the Friendly Rules Giant.
>>48011458
I don't see why not, as long as you're using things like City of Brass that can generate whatever color you need.
And no- your sideboard's contents still need to be legal for the format.
>>48011489
Yep.
>>48011570
To be fair, outside of Storm the 'when you cast' triggers are fairly new.
>>48012003
I actually went and looked into that.
Replicate was a "when you cast" trigger in 2005, as was Ripple in 2006. PLC had a vertical cycle of black cards with various "when you cast this, if something happens coutner it" effects.
From there nothing until cascade in...2009, I think?
>>47996813
Do you mean watching competitive magic, because that looks like a clusterfuckand Ihave no idea what's going on there. What kind of videos are you talking about?
>>48011617
Yeah. I did not notice that Confusion tn the Ranks exchanges itself when it ETBs for like a year.
