Age of Sigmar General
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It is apocalypse edition
>The Crypt Flayers and Brutes are actually not Battleline units, unless the whole force has the Flesh-eater Courts and Ironjawz keywords...
So, what do you think? Core tax for cross faction force.
Old thread
>>47869905
first for kroak
Second for this thing.
>>47908380
Start Collecting! Demigryph Knights when? I want to put together a Brotherhood of Knights
>>47908404
>The all Stormfiends list will be legal
Skaven space marines here I come
Taxing cross faction forces is a real shame since some factions are very small
>>47908677
It's less taxing cross faction forces, and more buffing single faction
>>47908677
We'll have to see what these core...er... battleline units are. Apparently they will be listed in the book. I imagine some of the factions may not even have them, in that case what's the ruling on that? Also some may have them, but they are so badass that they won't even seem like a coretax.
Ultimately I am reserving judgement until I see the book. The coretax is something I hated about old warhammer, but this seems like it would be less restrictive, at least from what little we know.
>>47908820
That's kind of the same thing
I like the tree dudes, but they have like three different units
I imagine it will be something like this.
If your entire army contains the faction keyword (not grand alliance mind you) then you can pretty much take whatever you want. There was implied a limit to heroes from another rumor i think, depending on game size and such.
If your army is mixed, then you need X amount of battleline units from each separate faction, depending on the game size.
All in all it's really not too bad. Again we will need to see what these battleline units are.
Luckily for me I have liberators for my stormcasts and lots of warriors for my duardin. So I could still do the gungni/sigmar team bro force combo I have been enjoying.
>>47908946
Hm, would suck for my cross-facton skelehorde.
>>47908827
>I imagine some of the factions may not even have them, in that case what's the ruling on that?
I'm guessing that the only faction restriction will be the four grand alliances, so some of the sub-factions not having battleline units wouldn't matter.
Like, say you want to use White Lions. Their subfaction is Lion Rangers, which currently only has two units, neither of which are likely going to be a battleline unit. If you make your army only out of these two types of units you're fine, since they all have the Lion Rangers keyword, thus ignoring the battleline requirement.
>>47908946
>If your army is mixed, then you need X amount of battleline units from each separate faction, depending on the game size.
That sounds a bit restricting, especially considering how many faction keywords there are. Maybe you just need to have the required amount of battleline units from one faction keyword to be allowed to take other stuff from other factions (in your grand alliance)?
>>47909016
I get that, but the question is what are the restrictions if you have your white lions, and say, order draconis? Order draconis will have a battleline unit, but your white lions wont, so if you do mixed of those 2, the only battleline units you will need are from order draconis, as opposed to doing 2 factions with battleline units, you would be only doing one. So there might be benefits there. You may see a trend in meta that it is recomended that if you do go 2 factions, choose one that has battleline units, and one that doesnt. Or 2 that don't have battleline units.
>yfw most campaigns really will be nagash and mournghouls for the first few months
>>47909092
HE POSTED IT AGAIN THE MADMAN
Not AoS, but still a good sign of the coming times.
>>47909075
I'd say you simply wouldnt be able to combine factions that don't have battleline units, since you don't meet the requirement.
If you want to combine Lion Rangers and Order Draconis, but neither have a battleline unit you need to find a faction that does. So you'd take enough Witch Aelves, High Elf Spearmen, or whatever battelline unit from order you want until you meet the requirement. Then you can spend the rest of your points on as much white lions and order draconis stuff as you want.
Or at least that's how I'd guess it might work, hard to say at this point.
>>47909156
>I'd say you simply wouldnt be able to combine factions that don't have battleline units, since you don't meet the requirement.
I seriously doubt that. That becomes needlessly restrictive, and is terrible for smaller factions with no battlelines because people would be less inclined to take them. White lions would especially suffer because they have no heroes. Heroes seem to be an important part not only in gameplay but in scenarios as well.
>>47909219
Since it's supposed to be for more competitive matches it might be more restrictive. Or they might just give every faction a battleline unit.
>>47909377
This. What would be the mainline troops of a lion ranger army if not lion rangers?
>>47909525
They could always do it by army for unupdated units. Like how would legacy WoC even function since it's just a hodge-podge of old units?
>>47908856
For now...
>>47909147
> Reminder that Blood Bowl failed
> And that was in a world without Guildball
> And without Dreadball
> And when it wasn't competing against it's own directly-ported PC version
> When the company had a better design team
>>47908856
To be fair, they are getting at least 3 more next month. Not even including Alarielle and her giant beetle.
>>47908677
Why would you even need to go cross faction
>>47909525
What about Collegiate Arcane? Or Chaos Gargants? There's some 'factions' that have no units, just heroes and monsters, how woud that work?
>>47909845
They have to use the generic Batteline troops. Sorta like if you didnt run a Crypt Flayer court, you'd be stuck with Skeletons and Zambos
>>47909963
No I think those would be the exceptions to the rules. The factions without battlelines could ally or be run alone unrestricted. Most of the other factions though would have one, and to run those alone would have no restrictions, but to go with another faction you would just need to take however many battleline troops from that faction as required by the game size.
>>47908457
my fav kit. Wish they did more with demigryphs.
Let me give an example how I think it would work. Keep in mind i don't know the numbers so im just pulling these out of my ass just to demonstrate.
Lets say the restrictions are as follows:
500 pt games, 1 battleline troop from each faction, and up to 2 heroes
1000 pts games. 2 battleine troops from each faction, and up to 3 heroes
and so on.
So lets take the stormcast eternals (which we know has a battleline troom of liberators), the devoted of sigmar (who there battleline i am betting are the flagellants) and the lion rangers, but lets assume they don't get a battleline troop.
So if i wanted to run 1000 pts of some combinations of the above
To go stormcasts and devoted, you would need 2 units of liberators and 2 units of flagellants. The rest is up to you.
To go stormcasts and white lions, you would need 2 units of liberators, and the rest is up to you.
To go all 3 you would need 2 units of liberators, 2 units of flagellants, and the rest is up to you
Or you could go all stormcasts, and run whatever you wanted. So you would not need to take liberators. But you could still if you wanted.
But since the while lions don't have battlelines, the advantage to bringing them is you would not need to pay a coretax out of them, just what you need from the faction that does.
Again this is all fun speculation as we don't really know the details until the GW stores get their copies for the campaign and we start seeing page leaks and photos.
>>47911458
That makes no sense, why would you penalize a faction with variety? At that point it would be better if the core units didn't exist.
>>47911573
The difference is those larger factions with battleline troops would have much more variety and options than those without. We're talking the factions with like only 2 warscrolls would be the ones without battlelines.
>>47911668
Then how do you prevent armies from being like 10 celestial hurricanums and mages since they have no battleline?
>>47911458
That would be kinda dumb for a lot of factions though.
I currently play the Daughters of Khaine stuff with a Sorceress, since the DoKs don't have any wizards. If I were to do that according to your example in a 1000 Pts game I would need 2 Units of Witch Elves to get the Daughters of Khaine coretaxe (makes sense) but then I would also need to take 2 units of Dreadspears or Bleakswords simply so I could take the Sorceress. But if I take a Battlemage from the Collegiate Arcane, I get a Wizard without having to pay any additional coretaxe.
In that way it would almost always be better to combine your 'main' force with armies that don't have battleline unit. It would probably be better if you only had to pay the coretax for your main faction and after that you're free to take whatever.
>>47911768
Well that point is moot because as far as we've seen, sticking within a faction has no restrictions anyway.
So going 10 celestial huricanums and mages is possible anyway because of the one faction keyword exception
>>47911837
We wanted a points system and because of that we're getting an army building restriction system. It's what we asked for, and because of that, there will be a meta. There will be a trend of some things working better than others. It's just how it is. Learning to work with it, around it, or against it is going to become part of this game.
We have to keep in mind that there will always be the warscroll battalions. I hear those will be costing points, which is a good thing. Not charging points for 40k formations is one of the reasons I think that game is headed down the shitter. Also with formations and detachments getting way out of hand with special abilities.
>>47911837
>>47911940
The restriction is in place to stop you doing shit like fielding Nagash in a 1000 point game or whatever, if you did you wouldn't have enough points for your require battle lines etc.
>>47912185
If you'd field only Deathlord stuff you could still field Nagash in a 1000 pts game. So if that's what it's supposed to prevent it already failed.
>>47912236
How? It says stuff like Brutes are made Battle lines by being in a keyword linked army, not heroes.
If it requires lets say 4 battle line units and the cheapest battle line we know about is ~150 points that's only 400 points for a hero/monster in a 1000 point game.
>>47912236
There may be other restrictions in place. We may see that nagash is like 800 pts, making it a viability question in a 1000 pt game. Or perhaps what you can summon you have to pay for, reducing his effectiveness in small games.
We don't know much yet really. So it's dumb to say it already failed before we even have photos of it.
What I can say is there will still be imbalance and power meta, as there alway will be with any game.
>>47912328
When your entire army keeps within a faction keyword, you do not need to buy battleline troops for it. Only when your army consists of different faction keywords do you need to buy battleline units. That's all we know though so far. There may be more, though.
>>47912360
You read it wrong.
You do need battle lines regardless, the difference is that if you keep to one key word then larger units are able to be battle lines.
Read it again, Brutes count as battle lines if your army all shares the Ironjawz keyword but don't count as battle lines if they don't.
>>47912328
Then what would be the battleline unit of a deathlords army be? Do you think you'd need to take 4 Morghasts so you can have an army with either Arkhan, Mannfred, Neferata or Nagash? I wouldn't mind that but it would seem pretty strange.
>>47912402
They might not have any, that would mean you would need to take X units of battle line troops from another faction and wouldn't gain the benefit of being able to take stronger battle lines.
That's the trade off.
>>47912360
>What I can say is there will still be imbalance and power meta, as there alway will be with any game.
Sure, but the way >>47911458 thinks it might work would make combining factions with variety a waste of points while combining it with the small old factions would usually be a better option. And that seems silly since GW would obviously prefer if I buy there new shit with variations instead of the old stuff that will likely stop being produced soon.
>>47911940
The problem with gw publishing points as oppose to letting the community come up with it is that if they screw up (which they inevitably will) with the balance, it will be that much harder for me to convice people to play with a fan made comp since its not "official".
Not excited about a rank and file core tax again. Aos is finally letting me play a mixed-faction hyper elite force, inefficent as it might be, i dont want to go back to putting in msu core chaff.
>>47911458
>>47912462
How it will actually work seems fairly simple if this image is anything to go by.
Lets take a death army for example and lets say we're playing 1000 points which requires 4 battle lines (might be a different number)
Skeleton warriors might be a Battle line by default, Grave guard a battle line for a keyword linked Deathrattle army.
We could take 4 units of skeleton warriors to complete out battle line and then add in a hero/monster from another faction of death with out remaining points.
OR
We could take 2 units of skeletons 2 units of Grave guard which completes out battle lines and then add on a wight king and whatever else we can afford.
>>47912558
It was already difficult to get people to play because there was no official points system.
Using fan points or no points just made the victories and defeats feel hollow.
>>47912601
It won't be a problem if you stay within your theme. I for one am happy I won't be seeing the best warmachines/buff units thrown into every army.
>>47912632
The only hollow defeats I've had have been from completely BS scenarios honestly.
>>47912601
Then don't play Matched Play, surely?
>>47912654
The problem will be people treating it as the "official" (read only) way of playing the system. Its a matter of perception.
Points are good - i just dont want gw to do anything with them
>mfw buying sigmar models because the local redshirt is pushing the summer campaign hard and I would feel bad if nobody participated
>>47912836
you dont need to buy sigmar models, bro. they are not the only faction to choose from
>>47912836
>tfw you're a redshirt and all your pushing the campaign has done is make people turn to ebay/forge world//china to buy their favorite OOP armies
>>47912609
That would still be a bit inconvenient for my Daughters of Khaine but if it means I get a point system in which Witch Elves are cheap enough to be worth fielding again I guess that's worth it.
>>47912601
There will probably be an option to turn some certain elite units into Battle lines for extra points or something although might not be a thing at launch.
They could easily say like
"Stormcast paladins have a minimum unit size of 5 and cost 60 points per model
In an army consisting of only models with the Order keyword an additional cost of 15 points per model Stormcast Paladins may be taken as a Battle line unit, this upgrade is free if all units in your army contain the keyword "Stormcast"
>>47912874
true, but from what weve seen, the old factions have been gutted to the point of just being auxilliary forces for the main sigmar forces, so you might as well just get the new stuff.
>>47912720
points are not good....historical works just fine without them, why would aos benefit from them?
The good thing of aos is, if you're playoing battleplans you always have a chance of victory even in the most grim situations.
I played a game today, for example, where i faced with a shitty army made up just from the starter set a fucking army with:
-Archaon
-2 fucking skaven sizzlefizzler(warp lightining cannons)
-a verminlord
Guess what? i lost on the last turn-and only by a minor vicyory. If i rolled a double turn i would have won.
I played a lot of Aos and every game with a battleplan has been fun and balanced, regardless of the army lists.
Having tax units again means every cool fluffy army is again shit and unplayable, and it literally kills the best factors of Aos: beign able to play what you want, how you want to enjoy "your dudes".
No idea why they are listening to fantasyfags again, since they were one of the worse community I EVER saw(only 40k is that bad)and they killed a fucking game.
>>47912914
>Waaah why should there be multiple ways to play, everyone should be forced to play pretend with their toy soldiers like I do waaah
>>47912914
>means every cool fluffy army is again shit and unplayable
Like what? They clearly are saying that there will be way more options for fluffy armies. I'd imagine for slaves to darkness/bloodbound it would be like this:
>slaves to darkness
core battleline: Marauders, marauder horsemen, warriors of chaos, hounds
expanded battleline: chosen, knights, chariots
>bloodbound
core battleline: blood warriors, blood reavers
expanded battleline: bloodcrushers, skullreapers, wrathmongers
Also it makes sense now how my local redshirt insisted on autistically keeping to one keyword with his armies now. I'm just happy that I'll stop seeing a hurricanum+battlewizards with hammerers and irondrakes any more at my shop. Wonder how they'll limit monsters/warmachines/heros though.
>>47912982
>everyone should be forced to play pretend with their toy soldiers
It would've been nice if at least you put the effort to read.
If you ever played warhammer in the last 20 years you would have noticed how the meta game literally killed the whole fucking game, to the point new players were completely absent and only the so called" veterans" kept playing, obviously buying next to zero because they alreafy had their entire list tailored to perfection.
The whole sense of Aos was to get rid of this mentality and bringing the game to a fucking GAME again and not a job where you do must bring certain thing in order to avoid complete annihilation turn 2.
Im not eager to see that happen again, because the other 2 formats are clearly going to become obsolete-people are masturbating about points from weeks and they are not even out.
>>47913051
>Wonder how they'll limit monsters/warmachines/heros though.
% of total points, according to redshirt at warhammer world.
the point is: points were not enough? I run a mixed army of every(not every, but i am working on it)army converted to papa nurgle.
Not to break the game, not to be a shitlord, just because I found the idea cool and gave me passion for the hobby again beign able to acyually play it. It has 0 sinergy by itself but seeign my Plague arakcarok prodly converted with sweat and paint is fun and I loved Aos for pushing that type of play.
of course i saw shitlords playing broken shit like putting chamaleon skins in EVERY list-but its not somethoing impossible to deal with.
With everyone accepting competitive as standard play.and you know it will be-my army is trash, is unplayable and i either have to buy again units i don't fucking want, spend hours I don't have to paint them-fuck, i don't even have time to paint models I like-and then beign crushed from a meta lists because "hey man, its totally fair, you see, points and limitations!"
>>47913051
I could see some of the bigger Monster/hero.warmachines having some sort of battle line cost, like maybe a big strong monster will require you to have an extra 2 battle lines on top of your point level or something.
>>47912914
My nigga.
I love being able to field what I want in themed, fluffy lists, fighting a much more fun variety of opponents, instead of neckbeards who overanalyzed the points cost of every single unit and then maxed their armies out on the "best" shit, leading to constant netlisting.
Fucking grognards can cry all they want about "MAH WHFB AOS IS SHIT" but I for one DO NOT want to go back to being forced to field 250 Slaves/Clanrats just to not get tabled.
I just want to play and have fun. I'd rather lose a close game than LOLTHIRTEENTH ULOSE my opponent in turn 2 - that way we both have fun.
Wish more people thought like this.
>>47913153
sorry to disrupt this little narrative youve created, but the fantasy scene had plenty of new blood, even more so because of end times.
Competetive fantasy wasnt even a fucking thing.
>>47913153
>% of total points, according to redshirt at warhammer world.
any idea on what percentages? I'm working on chaos dorfs, which is basically a ton of warmachines. how SCGT did it seemed fair. Seems weird they'd do units for battleline but points for everything else.
>points were not enough?
I kind of agree, restrictions at the scgt like 5 max warmachines, no more than 2 warmachines, caps on multiple units of the same type, but only infantry scored seemed more than enough. Percentages like fantasy got a little silly and even back then, would removing those percentages really break the game? I'm sure it wouldn't be too hard to allow "unbound" in your area. It's pretty shit for 40k without synergies like AoS has. Hell maybe it's in the game already. Buffs for being bound but no nerfs for playing unbound.
>>47913273
It's points AND battle lines, it's kind of a core tax or not depending on what army you're playing.
>>47913269
>had plenty of new blood
Its so nice when you live in your fantasy world within your head, do you?
I used to travel a lot when fantasy was still alive and the rates of new player dropped down to 0.
every guy that has somehow got convinced to start fantasy dropped it usually not even after gettin 1/3 of the army.
Because NO new player enjoys
-Buying the rulebook
-Buying the army book
-buying 200+ models
-most of them they maybe won't like but have to buy regardless because THEY ARE NEEDED MU CORE TAX
-they have to PAINT THEM ALL in order to play
-you know how much fucking time is needed to paint, expecially when you are at your first step?
I wouldn't have fucking began playing in this conditions.
>>47913273
The point is: points ARE enough.
Most heroes are not good themselves and serve only the purpose to buff your units(unless you go with heroes on monsters).
If you put a high cost on heroes people would get thesmselves troops-because points/value they are cheaper and better-but they need heroes to work.
Thing balances itself.
like, bloodreavers: they are shit by themselves, but with a single bloodsecrator they get huge. Add a lord of khorne and they reroll hits too. They become EXTREMELY good. the bloodsecrator and the lord themselves are not that good when unbuffed-they can deal roughly the same damage of one single bloodreaver when buffed-but they are going to be obviously a LOT more costly.
You see where i'm going? i don't really see the need for battlelines, because they only limit those who want to play all kind of shit. units from different keywords don't buff each other anyway, so in order to be stronger people would get units from the same faction anyway.
But its all speculation to this point. Ill just have fun in the global campaign and wait to see how the general compendium changes the game.
>>47908380
Hey guys. I wanna start with AoS and I'm interested in destruction, iron jawz to be precise. Do the hold up well at they moment?
>>47913273
>any idea on what percentages?
it will probably something like whfb. What was it, 25% each?
>>47913273
>5 max warmachines, no more than 2 warmachines, caps on multiple units of the same type, but only infantry scored seemed more than enough
You didn't really needed that.
Every new unit of aos is either not-ranged or has short-range on missile weapons.
So they just needed to make existing warmachines REALLY costly.
You want to field a wap lighting cannon?
Sure, but now each one costs 3 times my standard unit. And bang, magically its not broken anymore.
>>47913539
yes, they do.
Multiple wounds, they hit hard(expecially when in small units because you can have multiple big weapons on the field), a mage that stomps you to death with his god's foot and a retarded obese wyvern that crushes you under his belly.
Yes, they are.
>>47913447
>points are enough
I agree. In a perfect world where every unit is pointed correctly that works perfectly. I think at most there should be a systemlike SCGT uses.
>min 1 hero
>max 6x minimum unit size of dudes of the same type
>max 3 units of the same thing deployed, 4 if core
>max 30 wounds in a unit, 40 if core
>max 5 warmachines, no more than 2 of the same type
>objectives only scored by non-hero/monster/warmachine or something.
>>47913548
I think it was more for variety than anything. Since warmachine are so point and click, it made it way harder for armies to just pick the most efficient one and slap 6 of them in or something if they needed range.
>>47913568
Nice! Thank you.
>>47913447
I started Skaven during end times
I bought and painted an entire 3000 point army, including 120 clanrats, and learned all the rules before End Times was over
Then the game I had just fallen in love with was killed forever.
A friend is selling his greenskins to me
How is this for a starter army?
>20 Boar Boyz
>20 Black Orcs
>80 Boyz
>Orc Big Boss, on foot and boar
>Black Orc Boss
>Grimgor
>6 River Trolls
>2 shamans
And 2 boxes of the new brutes as well as the megaboss, on sprue still. The rest is on square bases and painted OKish. He wants $250 for the lot of it
>>47914069
For a starter army? Too big; most AOS games don't involve that many models in my experience. But on the other hand it would give you a lot of versatility, you wouldn't be stuck with the same list due to a lack of models to change things round.
>>47914105
How big is a standard Sigmar game anyway?
>>47914121
Although wounds are an inperfect balancing mechanism, 30 wounds is about as low as I see, 100 wounds is around the top limit unless people are playing an especially large game. I guess 70-80 wounds is most common.
But to reiterate, I can only talk about my local scene.
>>47914002
>Then the game I had just fallen in love with was killed forever.
Did GW take away your 8th edition rulebooks?
>>47914069
It's a lot of dudes, far more than most AoS games usually need, but it'd give you a lot of versatility.
Also, the selection of models is pretty good. I'd go for it, assuming the paint is decent enough for your tastes.
>>47914121
2000 pts willprobably be the standard AOS game. if the points trends continue that's probably going to be about 50-80 models depending on army. A Warrior of chaos will likely be 20 points, normal infantry around 10, normal characters from 80-150, we know archaon is 700, gordrak is 700, nagash is 900, and 10 high elf bow dudes are 100.
Lots of options to use different army loadouts, seems cool for the price as long as they're painted to a pretty okay standard.
>>47914201
Until very recently GW dissalowed 8th being played in their stores so...
>>47914201
7th ed*
Skaven never got an 8th ed book
>>47914228
I thought that sort of thing was manager's discretion? Some think non-current games being played helps build a community and boost sales, others think it reduces sales because they only want stuff currently on the shelves to be played.
>>47914228
>Until very recently
wat
Can you play it in stores again?
>>47914069
too big bro
As this anon said >>47914200
70-80 wounds is the standard, 100-120 is a "big"game(can be played within 2 hours tho)and 30-50 is a small game.
>>47914343
New leadership higher up. They're responsable for start collectings, generals handbook, and very likely the attempt to integrate forge world into stores. My redshirt got an email that people can play 8th in-store if they wanted to, and he allows it on weekdays if the tables aren't being used.
Can we talk about Silver Tower please?
>>47914556
What about it do you want to talk about? Give us more than that anon.
>>47914610
Anything really.
Anyone have the painting guides for it? I heard they were in some issues of White Dwarf recently
I'm looking for pictures of Fantasy/Age of Sigmar cultists, preferably made from or featuring heavily bits from the Empire Militia box. Problem is all that comes up is 40k cultists. Any advice? I need non-marauder/warrior inspiration.
I really hope gorebeast chariots are core. Otherwise I'm pretty screwed with my list :( I just wanna see the points so I can know
>>47908380
New ogres when?
>>47916034
It's all Ogor now.
>>47909147
Truly, the great stagnates gave run out of cocaine, or perhaps snorted some more common sense by accident.
Do you guys actually collect the miniatures, paint them, and play the tabletop game?
I'd love to do that but don't have the time, patience, skill, or money.
But I love the lore so far of 40k and was blown-away when last night I saw the sheer amount of Warhammer novels that there are. I'd love to dive into the lore some more.
>>47915401
there's always the cult of the possessed/carnival of chaos to look at for inspiration
>>47916372
>carnival of chaos
Damn I almost forgot about them, that brings me back to when I was trying mordheim. It was such an interesting little bit of fluff. Too bad it doesn't fit intot the current aestetic since it could make a perfect boxed game kind of thing with great models.
I'm starting a Slaaneshi daemons army for the summer campaign. Which is better to lead my host, a daemon prince or keeper of secrets?
I'm new to the game. This is my first AoS army.
>>47916670
Why can't they make a new Keeper of Secrets? Christ all mighty.
>>47916686
Like the Forgeworld one?
>>47916722
Yeah, something along those lines but plastic obviously.
I just ordered:
Silver Tower + Mighty Heroes Expansion
Lord of Plagues (can be used in boardgame)
Skink Starpriest (can be used in boardgame)
AoS Starter Set
Undead Starter Set
Malignant Starter Set
I've never played any Warhammer before, but I've built all of Kingdom Death and it's expansions so apparently the building will be a breeze.
How did I do?
>>47916877
lol'd
i mean, fuck, get the starter set, try it an THEN-just then, start building more
or a SINGLE starter set
You're crazy.
>>47916877
Welcome to the game and hobby. Hope you have a good community in your area. The game will only be getting better near the end of july when the general's compendium comes out and offers players a couple more modes of play.
>>47916911
I love building minis, I'll be done with them all within the month.
Game wise though, are they good choices? I just picked the coolest looking.
>>47916969
Thanks man. I've been having a lot of fun reading all the lore. The Seraphon are pretty badass, I think I'll get s bunch of those next month.
I saw some of thrpe minis are resin only, will they eventually come out in plastic?
>>47916986
I would go crazy with that many minis to paint
Anyway, yes. The game has not a point value, you play like an historuca, just slapping armies on the table one unit each player until it seems fair.
Incredibly, it works.
Games is fairly simple, 4 pages of rules while all the units stats(warscrolls)are free.
Lore is not bad but its delivered really badly.
Game is fun, fast and i honestly had great times with it.
Welcome to the hobby! You will never leave.
>>47916670
Can anyone lend their experience and advice?
Tactics I've seen favor a daemonette-horde army with a herald on foot. But none say which is better, the daemon prince or the keeper of secrets.
>>47908380
For someone who wants to start with dark elves, are better daugthers of khaine or darkling covens?
>>47917285
I'd personally go with a keeper of secrets, the demon prince is incredibly boring
>keeper
+Super fast
+Does more damage
+Is a wizard
+More wounds = harder to kill
+great command ability
+fluffy abilities
-Loses stats because it's a monster
-probably will cost more points
-Old model is old and ugly and newer one is forge world and will be hard to build for a newcomer
>prince
+Can fly
+decently killy
+Plastic model (but not very slanesh looking)
-No command ability
slanesh-focused ability is ok
What's the deal with AoS?
Is it in the same universe that WFB was in? Are all the WFB books "not canon" anymore? Is this worth getting into?
I have an old Empire battalion laying around that I never got to assembling, is it worthless now?
>>47917548
Thanks. Keeper definitely has more pros.
>>47916877
>>47916986
So your thinking about serving lord Nagash, glory to the king of all souls, master of the Mortarchs, supreme Necromancer and king of all shyish?
Now there are a few choices to be made as you begin your service to the lord of undeath: What kind of army will you be playing? Now, this is rather easy to decide, simply by choosing what kind of "core" unit you want to run. You have:
>Zombies
They shamble slowly, can barely hit anything, and have no save. However, they do have one thing going for them: They can be summoned incredibly cheaply, and when massed, they might actually kill things. By choosing Zombies, you'll be dragging along hounds and a Corpse Court and Zombie hounds, so that your units actually pose a threat. However, considering what you bought, id lay off the zombies. You'll need a LOT of zombies, backed up by tons of Necromancers and beasties
>Skeletons
Better by a wide margin than zombies, they can actually pose a threat to infantry. Considering your list, I recommend these guys. When supported by a mortarch, necromancer and a Wight King, these guys can crank out a metric shit ton of attacks that can theoretically kill something. You'll be running Skeletons, Grave Guard, and Hexwraiths/Black Knights. However, Skeketons work great as meatshields, er, boneshields for ghosts.
>Ghouls
Are you planning to run a Flesh Eater Court? If not, skip em. They're a bit faster, but really, they're not as good as skeletons.
Overall, decide whether your going to focus ghosts or skeletons, and depending on that, use Hexwraiths for ghosts, or Black Knights for skeletons. The Black Knight kit can be made into either Knights or Wraiths.
Excuse the terrible copy-paste below, but noone seems to have done this yet. This is what I've been able to glean from the blurry as shit pic we got months ago. Will post a decent screen of the info below.
unit Unit min max points SCGT
Ellerian Reavers 5 20 140 5 for 7 core
Silver Helms 5 20 140 5 for 6 core
Alith Anar, The Shadow King 1 1 110 5
Handmaiden of the Everqueen 1 1 105 4
Lothern Sea Helm 1 1 X 4
Teclis 1 1 300 12
Eltharion on Stormwing 1 1 340 15
Prince Imrik, Dragonlord 1 1 500 21
High elf Archers 10 30 100 10 for 6 core
Dragon Host? * 10 5 formation
>>47917652
AoS is the Sequel/Reboot, it's still new so you can get in on the ground floor.
>>47917652
It's a setting that is continuation of WHFB. Everything that happen in WHFB is canon.
Start reading the stuff in the OP links and download the Empire rules from GW site before making up your mind to enter AoS.
>>47917862
Skellies sound cool to me, I've loved skeletons since I saw Army of Darkness as a kid.
>>47917652
>Is it in the same universe that WFB was in?
Sort of.
The WHFB world was destroyed by a unified chaos army led by Archaon, but there were enough survivors saved by various gods (or mortals that ascended to godhood)
There are 8 Mortal Realms, one for each of the winds of magic. Each realm is unfathomably large, essentially a universe. The survivors populated these realms with aid from the new pantheon of gods (Sigmar, Grimnir, Nagash, Gorkamorka, and a few others)
For a long time everything was going alright in the Age of Myth where civilization flourished and legendary creatures were commonplace. Chaos was around but it wasn't a serious threat because the mortal races were working together to defend themselves and Chaos was constantly infighting.
That all changed when Archaon came back. As the chosen champion of all 5 chaos gods (the great horned rat ascended to join the other 4 gods) he rallied all the chaos clans/factions together and started a genocidal crusade across all the realms. This period was called the Age of Chaos.
7 of the 8 Mortal Realms fell to Chaos.
Sigmar retreated to the final realm Azyr and made the Stormcast. When he unleashed his new army on the realms it heralded the beginning of the Age of Sigmar, a crusade to reclaim the lands and defeat Chaos once and for all.
>Is this worth getting into?
It's more fun than WHFB and way easier to get into. Rules are free, lots of great value boxes.
Empire (called Free People now) are pretty good.
Play some pickup games with your old Empire models to see if you like the new game.
>have to deal with core tax if I want to play Loremasters with my lizardmen dino squad
Life is suffering
>>47916785
Hell they could probably just make that one in plastic. It's less complicated looking that bloody nagash
>sunblood still out of stockI emailed them and they said the sunblood will be back in stock mid July
>>47918055
Trust me, Skellies are fun. Just make sure you have some heavy hitters to up your fight, whether they be Tomb King units or Ghosts. In my personal opinion, Hexwraiths are far better than Black Knights, and they can do decent damage with their scythes and mortal wounds.
>>47918251
Could also get a zombie dragon or terrorgheist since those fuckers are already mostly skeletal
How are vampires and undead? Is there a good starting point for their armies?
>>47918251
So say I bought the skelly start collecting box, if I build the knights as wraiths, how's Arkhan with ghosts backed by rattler infantry?
Next week sometime GW stores will be getting copies of the generals handbook for use in store.
So we should start seeing blurry photos posted online anonymously soon so the manager-bro leaking this stuff to us wont lose his job.
>>47912914
3 ways to play, points is only one way ffs
>>47918548
Reminder that technically points are optional in 40k. How many people do you see playing 40k without points apart from the starter set?
>>47918251
Got it, also I just looked up Lord Nagash and now I've ordered him too. I couldn't resist owning the big boss skelly. I'm thinking I'll use the book and sword.
>>47918276
Zombie dragons turn your vampire from a mixture of Support/Fighty caster into quite the center piece beat stick, that can thrash up with the best of em. Vampires enjoy the benefit of fitting into any army, along with Necromancers. Note though, since its not a full skeleton, it still misses out on the skeletons synergy.
>>47918411
Arkhan excells at summoning butt loads of undead, along with being the best bud of all casters. If your running Arkhan, summoning will be your main focus, but out of the Mortarchs, he is definitively the best for running large armies. He'll provide a good supply of chaff, and help stave off any crippling losses suffered by your ghostd
>>47917450
Thanks for nothing faggots
Did Vlad ever come back, fluffwise? Given Mannfred was vaporized in End Times, it's sort of galling to hear he's 'alive' and well in AoS.
>>47918881
Why did GW go and make some of the named heroes into generic model names? Like Chakax into "Eternity Warden"
>>47918907
Didn't mean to quote, whoops.
>>47918881
We owe you nothing anon, sorry noone gives a fuck about dark elves.
>>47918881
Calm down man. Not always do questions get answered on tg or these threads. Wait some time and ask again or in the next thread. It;s probably very likely nobody on right now plays dark elves.
I've never played them or played against them. So I couldnt tell you.
>>47918887
Nagash brought back Vlad from a piece of Mannfred's flesh in the End Times.
Mannfred was brought back by Nagash in AoS out of spite and desire to torment Mannfred for all eternity by chaining him to his throne.
>>47919022
Amusing.
So are the Mortarchs still a thing in-fluff, or are they just FB legacy models?
>>47914002
If you believe warhammer General this its the thread to talk about end times.. Idk i think new ceo could be pushed into releasing 8th n end times as free pdf ala ravening hordes.. Would take the sails outta 9th age and kings of war
>>47914290
My mordheim force was 40k orks.. I could almost max with a starting warband as Two axes were caf and brutal in mobs
So I've been thinking about playing Age of Sigmar for a while because it seems like it would be a fun game to play casually, but I have absolutely zero clue about this game.
If the rules are free then what the hell are Battletomes/Grand Alliance books? Is that just a GW ploy to make more money?
How many models should I start off with? Should I wait for the points system to come out so I can judge army size off that, or just pick up a hero and a box or two of dudes?
How do Orruks perform? I never see them talked about, and I don't know if if they suck here as much as they do in 40k.
>>47919418
Are they really that butthurt about their setting they won't allow end times to even be discussed? I mean the rules etc kinda sucked but really..
I'm amazed to find I actually rather like Stormcasts. Despite all the Sigmarine jokes they're characterized a lot differently.
>>47919579
See >>47881311
>Thread is for discussion of WHFB, AoS and EndTimes belong in the AoS thread.
>>47919578
First off, make sure there is a community of players locally for this game. If not, it may not be worth getting into. Find out what they are playing and look at options. If so, then read on.
>If the rules are free then what the hell are Battletomes/Grand Alliance books? Is that just a GW ploy to make more money?
The rules are free, you pay for the fluff and art. It's more for a collectors thing. Also the battletomes include batalion rules, which are special rules for when you take certain units grouped together. And there are fluffy narrative scenarios geared toward the army as well. But to just play the game, you only need the free rules.
>How many models should I start off with?
You can technically start playing with just a hero and a couple units of models.
>Should I wait for the points system to come out so I can judge army size off that, or just pick up a hero and a box or two of dudes?
It's up to you, and your local group. Some groups are excited about the points coming, some don't care and stick with open play. You can always get started with your collection by just building and painting your minis before you even play if you want. 90% of this game is just the hobby, the rest is actually playing.
>How do Orruks perform? I never see them talked about, and I don't know if if they suck here as much as they do in 40k.
Orruks are cool. They are a ravening horde of warmongers and play that way. We don;t know how competitive they are yet because we don't have their points. But whats important is they play like you think they should.
>>47919811
Thanks for the advice anon.
Unfortunately for me I only have a small group of friends that would be playing together.
However I'm fine with picking up a couple of boxes and not committing if I don't play the game as much. At least I'd have some cool looking models to show for it.
>>47908380
does anybody know if there are plans to release the tzaangors as a standalone set?
>>47919958
At least that. My experience with old warhammer fantasy battles was just that. Not many players, but I loved the dwarfs so I built up a couple troops an a lord character and painted them. Then I found out I would be needing significantly more to just play a basic game. This after spending a month building and painting those models. the game didnt hold my interest as much naturally. With this game, however it's less of an issue. Ive actually collected enough models now to get to the level of an old game, ironically.
>>47920020
So far the trend has been to release the models that were part of the box set later. They did it for the assassinorum game, and theyre doing it for the deathwatch game. So expect it to happen, but not for a bit.
>>47917548
Are the Forgeworld greater daemons getting rules for AoS?
>>47919172
Mortar ha still exist. Only the main three have shown up in the storyline so far.
>>47920135
They already have, so have quite a few of the other forgeworld models.
>>47918251
Should I go with Skeletons with spears, or with swords?
>>47918587
They they aren't. Don't talk about things you have no idea about. Points havent been 'optional' since rogue trader.
In the rulebook it says agree with your opponent on a points limit. All the unit entries have points. Whats optional is the force organization.
In AoS points are optional because they are not mentioned at all in the core rules and the warscrolls dont have points.
Hey anyone have any hero card pics of the 37 other heroes from Silver Tower
Pic related ? (i don't even know if these are correct rules)
To be honest i cannot be bothered to throw $40 AU at a GW scam to get them
Picked up my first models today, got one done up
>>47920428
Looking good dude.
>>47920301
Spears. Extra range is great. You might want to buff them though, so take some heroes and make the skellies a large unit (like 30+ models).
If you want the unit to be smaller, then swords are alright. Shorter range makes them a little difficult to work with though, so watch out for that. Personally, I'd run spears w/ Necromancer and swords w/ a Wraith or Banshee.
Any advice on starting Stormcasts, and good 'lists'? I know listbuilds don't exist right now in the traditional sense.
>>47920701
Lord celestant on dracoth is the best
retributors are the best of the paladin builds, dont give the starsoul mace to the prime
prosecutors with javelins are great
judicators with bows are the best due to their range
if you do liberators, hammers and shields. give the greathammer or greatsword to the prime because of his extra attack
other great heroes are the lord castellant and the lord relictor
>>47920763
Thanks man
>>47920763
Any opinion on unit sizes? Or in other words, how many dudes should I buy.
>>47920863
just start with a couple heroes, and about 4-5 units. also look at your local meta. Do they play big battles? or do they stick with small skirmishes.
things will change though when the points system is released by the end of july. you can always just start collecting building and painting now to get started. I always say that a majority of this game is the hobby. very little time spent on it is actual playing. painted minis always play better than unpainted ones
>>47920701
The base game has a lot of good stuff to start with and is cheap (assuming you can split the khorne stuff with someone or have some use for it yourself). I'd start with that.
Things to look out for:
Retributors are your best friends. There is no list that would not be improved by taking Retributors.
The Knight-Vexillor loves Retributors and Retributors love him. He's your one-stop-shop to fuck over any army reliant on hero support.
You don't have artillery, but that's okay. The Knight-Venator and the Celestant-Prime are your heavy cannons. Never hold back the Celestant-Prime, it's a trap.
Dual weapons on Liberators: Never fucking ever.
You have a large selection of good to excellent batallions, many of which cancel out the big issue of slow speed by offering teleports. Use them.
Both Lords-Celestant have great Command Abilities, but the enormous bubble of battleshock immunity offered by the mounted version is probably better for a beginner.
You have a wide selection of units, allowing you to radically change your list in a hurry.
Judicators with bows allow you to pressure the enemy at significant range and can dictate the flow of battle. Crossbows are junk outside of one specific setup.
Or you could use Chamber Extremis units, which renders all this moot on account of being astoundingly powerful, blazingly fast, incredibly durable and flexible enough to deal with most threats easily. Because fuck careful planning, sometimes you just want to grind your opponent into paste with the best units in the game.
>>47914802
>>47914610
>>47914556
holy shit it took me half an hour just to assemble that fucking dwarf
eh 7 models cleaned, assembled, and at least partially based, 44 more to go before this weekend
>>47918907
Because most of the named heroes are dead. They turned them into generic heroes so you can still use their model and weapon choice. So you can have a Grot Warboss that uses Skarsniks model and has Skarsniks weapons (the prodder and the squig) but has all the rules of the normal Grot Warboss.
>>47920020
Year of tzeentch is coming or so say the lady
>>47920208
When I clicked on their rules it just showed me the normal greater daemon rules.
>>47920419
http://m.imgur.com/a/mgPZh
>>47920301
I've heard of people doing half and half, with the swords in the front and the spears in the back in order to allow the whole unit to attack at once
>>47921569
Not legal, skeletons can't mix&match their weapons. You could, however, take two different units and brick them up. As long as you don't charge you get the same effect.
>>47920301
Honestly, swords are not that good. I suppose they might be alright on a small summoned flanking unit, but if you want to horde it up the additional range from spears is just plain superior, especially once you start stacking buffs.
>>47916208
>skill
Pretty much everybody's first miniature is shit. You git gud at painting by doing it, basically. Give it a go, you may be surprised how much your neatness improves in just a couple of months.And remember, washes are skill in a bottle.
Yo /aosg/.
If Chaos conquered 7 of the 8 mortal realms in the Age of Chaos, where are all the other armies except the Stormcast coming from? Are there Ogres and Skeletons holed up in Azyr because they lost their homes?
>>47922492
There were enclaves that held out for a *long* time, so not all realms were conquered at all times. Life finds a way.
The dead are plentiful and found everywhere (especially in the ground), so as long as Nagash and his cronies are around, the Death faction is good to go at the drop of a hat.
Most of the Destruction forces are nomadic, so just conquering shit doesn't mean much to them, either. Not to mention the greenskins means of reproduction.
Sylvaneth were just replanted and grown to be ready.
The rest of Order either chilled in Azyr or staffed aforementioned enclaves.
>>47922492
Sigma got together with the big non-chaos dudes, the elven incarnates, Nagash and Gorkamorka to conquer the realm back from chaos. After a lot of victories the alliance started to crumble and now most of the realms have parts contested by mutliple factions.
After Nagash tried to betray Sigmar he's now ruling over most of the realm of Death that seems to be under constant siege by forces of chaos. Gorkamorka got bored so he took all his forces and made a huge WAAAGH! up and down the eight realms until they broke into infighting, so now there are forces of destruction settled in pretty much every realm. The Dark Aelves and the 'Shadowkin' are living in the realm of shadows and are apparently doing a good job keeping the chaos forces of their turf. Alarielle and the Slyvaneth are in the realm of Life trying to wrestle control back from Nurgle. Teclis, Tyrion and whatever the High Aelves seem to have control over the realm of light. Fyreslayers are everywhere looking for Ur-gold. Sigmar is sitting in Azyr and the Seraphon are cruising around in there badass space ships killing chaos scum and ratgarbage wherever they go.
>>47908404
There are two problems.
1. Which one is the "faction keyword"?
2. If I field a Death army and want a necromancer I lose the advantages of a Battleline army?
>>47916877
Holy fuck that's a lot of shit to buy in one go.. enjoy your painting..
>>47922725
We don't know the lists of which units are Battleline units for what factions yet. Wouldn't surprise me if there were multiple options though, with different keywords. For example (and this is conjecture) I could see skeletons, zombies, spirit hosts and crypt ghouls all being Death faction Battleline units, while simultaneously having the Deathrattle, Deadwalker, Malignant and Flesh-Eater faction keywords. So you could take crypt ghoul Battleline units and have your necromancer, but if you wanted crypt horror Battleline units then you'd have to stick to Flesh-Eaters.
>advantages of a Battleline army
It's probably not a bonus like Objective Secured in 40k, it's a legal requirement to play Matched Play. Do remember though, MP is supposed to be only for competitive games, you can do what you like in normal games.
>>47922725
Faction keywords will vary, some death units might count as battle lines in any DEATH army, others in more specific like DEATHRATTLE armies or whatever.
On the necromancer question, if you want to take one you'd lose being able to take stronger guys as your battle line, you might have to take an extra unit or two of skeletons to make that up.
are there any good shooty chaos?other than stormfiends because $$
>>47922933
Chaos dwarfs.
>good
Never mind.
Joking aside, tzeentch daemons can put out a good amount of dakka, with magic on top of that.
>>47916877
YE MEN, WELKOME TO DEM DEAD LOTS M8If you handled KD, this will be easy. Get read to paint that shit though.
>>47922933
>are there any good shooty chaos?
>other than stormfiends because $$
Ungors are actually alright. Tzeentch as other anon said are decent. Soul Grinders and Jezzails are pretty good.
Chaos Hellcannons are alrite too but they are warmachines
>>47917285
Well, Daemonette Herald on a Steed has been a badass hitter in the games my fiance and I play. She is ridiculously fast, very killy, and makes the Daemonette hordes around her nigh-unbeatable when coupled with Fiends.
The Keeper of Secrets is just...holy shit dude, just fucking dirty. My fiance was using it against my Bloodbound, when I was running a horde of 20 Bloodreavers w/ an Aspiring Deathbringer and a Bloodsecreator. It went flying across the board barely hindered. It snipped the 'Secreator apart in a single round, then plunged into the Bloodreavers, killing them all within two rounds with some help from Fiends. It then proceeded to tear apart the Deathbringer and a Skullcannon, essentially cleaning up my entire left flank with only the help of 5 Fiends. I would HIGHLY recommend it.
My fiance likes running the Keeper, a Herald on Steed, 20 Daemonettes, 5 Fiends, 5 Seekers (all we have), and a Daemon Prince.
Also, in a contrary opinion, I actually really like its model when you use the Cthulhu-like head, it was a pleasure to paint and easy to build.
>>47922904
>Do remember though, MP is supposed to be only for competitive games, you can do what you like in normal games.
I still believe that once Matched Play exists, that will be the only way to find a game with a stranger in a store
>>47923318
Who the fuck plays with strangers in stores? How many players frequent at your LGS that you don't know all of them at least to some degree?
>>47923318
I could see it being used as a baseline, but (from what I've seen of how people play AOS) I don't think people will stick to the rules like they're cast in stone when not doing tourney games. I've seen people discuss with opponents whether they can go slightly outside the limits when using scrollbuilder or whatever if they have a cool idea or just feel the system has miscosted something, so could easily see that continuing.
>>47922667
Realm of Death still belongs to Chaos. Nagash failed twice in getting back control of the realm of death from Archaon.
>>47914556
>>47914610
I'm down tohomebrew
>>47920904
>>47921042
Late but thanks guys
Here's an attempt at rules for my stormcast rangers. Name is still up in the air. Opinions?
Vindicators
Move 5"
Wounds 2
Save 4+
Bravery 6
Missile Weapons
Hailstorm Arbalest 6" 1 3+ 4+ - d3
Melee Weapons
Cloudcutter 1" 2 4+ 4+ -2 1
Description
A unit of Vindicators consists of at least three models. Each Vindicator is armed with a long-hafted Cloudcutter and a Hailstorm Arbalest. In addition, they carry a miniscule amount of both Ulgu and Azyr in the reliquaries on their backs, shrouding them in arcane mists.
Abilities
Celestial Precursors: Vindicators lead the way! During your first hero phase you may move a unit with this special rule up to 5" in any direction.
Welkin Nimbus: Cloaked by mystical fog, the Vindicators can skulk in the shadows, hidden from the eyes of their prey. Ranged and melee attacks made against a unit of Vindicators suffer a -1 penalty on rolls to hit.
Are spray paints to base worth the extra money? if they are what are some that you guys would recommend, I'm on a budget and I'd rather shell out £20 for some models rather than a spraypaint.
>>47925046
I've never tried to base coat something white with a brush but i imagine it's worse than doing black which is soul destroying anyway. Just get the spray, it'll save you time and sanity. It's only like 10 quid from GW, cheaper elsewhere, and will last ages.
Is it ever worth taking Ungor Raiders? How do i counteract their piss poor bravery to get the benefit of actually having shooting in a Chaos army?
Out of curiosity, has any faction/army shown itself to be dominant in AoS? I'm not sure if there's really enough competitive play yet to make that sort of call, but thought I'd ask.
>>47925170
Certainly it's worth it. And you don't counteract their Bravery. You give them about 30 models. There's a special Battleshock clause that gives you lower Battleshock results the bigger the unit is. Since so very few people play units bigger than 10, this almost never comes into effect, but it's there. And after that, if someone runs, someone runs. If someone shoots at them, oh well. If someone charges them, they're dead anyway, Battleshock or no Battleshock, and since they're a shooty unit, letting them get charged means you screwed up.
>>47925046
If you're talking about black or white primer, yes, do definitely take them. If you mean one of the spray base paints like brown or blue, only do that if like 90% of those models is that color, otherwise it's a waste of money (for example, if you want golden Stormcasts, use the gold spray; if you want Bloodbound with golden trim and red armor, do not use gold spray)
Is AoS actually worth getting into? I abandoned my fluffy night goblins army after the update dropped and I checked their stats. If so, which faction is the most fun (not nessecerily the "best") currently.
>>47914556
Want some hot off the press Homebrew guys? I haven't had a chance to test these guys out so i'm down for any criticism, I feel like the traits are pretty limiting in what you can do but you also don't want to bloat it with a ton of unique ones plus then we'd have to make new skills.
>>47925317
This one i admit is a bit wordy, also are the Von Carsteins a thing in AoS? I play fantasy but I love me some WHQ, silver tower included.
>>47925313
Like any game, it only is if there's a cool community of players in your area.
We don;t know how good the grots are yet because we dont have the points at least until the end of july when the points system comes out.
ok, I like the look of khorne bloodbound. They seem to be the least 40k-esque of the new factions alongside the fyreslayers
>>47925417
>seraphon, literally no lizards in 40k
>flesh-eaters, no vampire equivalents in 40k
>fyreslayers, literally no dwarfs in 40k
Bloodbound are just khorne berzerkers and cultists from 40k if you're looking at direct comparisons.
>>47925417
>They seem to be the least 40k-esque of the new factions alongside the fyreslayers
>40k CSM players are literally buying Blood Warriors and sticking bolt pistols and marine backpacks to call them Khorne Berserkers
>least 40k-esque faction
ayy
>>47925275
how many models do you think i want to cart around and shuffle about the table?
a mountain of ungors with their couple of support models provides not-terrible-considering-chaos shooting.
sure.
but i'm not gw so don't see any reason to give gw so much moneys. in my shithole of a country they're $48 for ten goats....
and then the cost of a movement tray!
apparently 8d6 averages 28. so a couple of ratling gun teams, risking their lives like a good fundamentalist does...
and for the same cost as 30 ungors i can get five weapons teams
sure they'll die. but eh. 20d6 attacks sounds retarded to me.
alright so maybe not, fyreslayers seem more bad-ass anyway. Afterall, who wouldn't like a orange Mohawked dwarf riding godzilla?
>>47925170
Ungor Raiders are surprisingly not shit. I mean, not good, either, but a positive mediocre. They have an okay ranged attack and their pre-game move let's them extend their threat range.
The Bravery for them at any rate, if anything so much as looks at them they die by the truckload, a few additional Bravery won't change much in the end.
>>47925645
Well, if you just look at the best bang for your buck, nothing can beat Horrors and Flamers. 3 Flamers have 10 attacks with damage D3 and their high flying movement gives them a great threat range as well.
>>47925275
i'll have about 20 which would probably make their bravery 5 if i'm understanding the rules properly.
>Add 1 to the Bravery characteristic being used for every 10 models that are in the unit when the test is taken.
unless of course a miracle happens and none of them die.
>>47925326
I've got 1 more and my skaven assassin that i've posted a few times before if anyone is interested, again I haven't had a chance to fully test these guys out, except the assassin, so any critique would be good
>>47914556
Silver Tower > Wargame.
Just move on to board games guys, it's the future.
>>47926009
This one is super rough, i might just change Storm of Blades into it's own attack with the rule being "Hits all adjacent adversaries" and make the double hit into it's own attack as well giving it it's own rule as "If ____ sucessfully wounds an adversary make another ____ attack against the same adversary" No clue on where to go with the Renown ability so i pretty much took the Darkoath Chieftain's. Anyone awake? I know i woke up early today haha
>>47925223
Ogres are crazy strong. Between their monsters being tough as nails and dishing mortal wounds like it's going out of style, and Ironguts one-shotting entire units in a single round of combat, they're the army to beat in my mind. There are definitely other strong forces though.
So what could I proxy undead Stormcast as in the Undead alliance thingy?
>>47927055
Ogres and Chamber Extremis Stormcast are probably the two hardest fuckers around as a whole.
If we're including Obvious Bullshit, then Nagash-led Undead take the cake. Because anyone that can add another army at the start of each turn is just absurd.
>>47927511
Crypt Horrors would be sorta fitting, I guess?
>>47927511
Prosecutors could be morghasts.
>>47920020
damn those are neat
Are Lizardmen a strong army, or are they good for just looking at. I'm curious about starting, and since tomb kings is hard to acquire I'd prefer going space law lizards
>>47925223
can't rally make that comparison without points imo
>>47927681
Also, could you have a scar veteran on a troglodon, out of curiosity?
>>47927756
Troglodons are only mounts for skinks.
>>47927905
Cool, thanks, was thinking i might be able to have a spitting mount scar veteran
>>47927681
They are pretty strong, with a ton of good options. Some of the best casters in the game, summon shenanigans, very solid infantry, good selection of big shit, not to mention a wonderful theme.
Some real stand-outs are chamo-skinks, ripperdactyls, laserdons and templeguard. And the Slann, obviously.
>>47927939
Cool, so my hero should be a Slann, probably? Or are there non hero fieldable Slanns?
>>47927681
lizards are stronk, engine of the gods is lord so op as balls, and lord craok is anying as all balls to fight. everything else is flaming cheese kinds of good.
do note this is my experience after fighting in an apocalypse sized battle and my ally's engine of the gods triggered us having another turn by literally stopping time itself because of some convoluted combo....
>>47927919
You can convert whatever you want though, don't feel too restricted by what's written if you have cool ideas.
>>47927962
One Slann is practically mandatory, I'd say. Two (i.e. Kroak and a regular) are better.
There are obviously no non-hero slann.
>>47928025
I was under the impression you can only have one hero, though I may have misunderstood.
A little bit for you fellow Anons, straight from Generals Handbook.
I had a chance to take a longer look at matched play section, and even took some photos of it.
So feel free to ask questions. I wont post any photos in coming days just to make sure I'm safe.
I dont have the book on hand so anything outside matched play has to wait.
>>47927570
Yeah I was omitting obvious dickery like Nagash spam.
>>47928183
How boned are skaven?
>>47928183
I expected the second two but the first one is surprising. I expected them to eliminate stacking buffs, not stop repeatedly casting the same spell.
>>47928183
>can only cast daemonic power once per turn
I'm done with this game
>>47928103
No, you must have misunderstood that. It's fairly common houseruled to a maximum of three heroes, but as is you can have as many as you want.
>>47928183
>locks down Mystic Shield shenanigans
>physical immunity is no longer a thing
>infinity attacks got the axe
Solid. Now if they do something about the more absurd aspects of summoning I'd say this is looking *really* good.
>>47928292
There is also a limit to hero models so wizards wont be only type of heroes we see now.
>>47928183
Well, the first one makes the various like-arcane-bolt-but-not magic missiles much more worthwhile. Can't help wondering if not being able to mass cast mystic shield won't have a bigger impact though.
>>47928183
>each spell can only be attempted once per turn
Ehhh, not sure about that one. On the one hand, no more mystic shield stacking bullshit. On the other hand, that makes wizards that can nick spells far less attractive, basically removes any desire to wield any wizard more than once and doesn't do jack about summoning being broken.
The other two are excellent, though.
>>47928360
Somehow I missed the part about summoning while taking photos but as far as I remember it works along the lines:
We play 1000 pts battle
You can decide to spent any of those points on summoning. So lets say you take 700 points on field and 300 points are "held in reserve: as summoning.
You summon any unit within said 300 points limit later in game. Points are used for summon so no recycling.
>>47928183
Wow, i didn't think of doing that in the first. I like it. As another anon said, that makes other arcane bolt-like spells much more worthwhile, and removes shield stack cheese.
So far I am please with the generals handbook. So far.
>>47928386
Ah, true, I didn't consider that. That's actually a really good point.
Also, Lord-Castellant has a non-magic mystic shield that stacks, except better since it heals and autocasts. Sudenly I'm not so down anymore that stormcast don't have any wizards.
>>47928427
>>47928360
So you can summon some serious shit or many crappy units as you see fit according to the flow of battle, as long as you dont exceed points you took as summoning,
>>47928183
>Ripperdactyl
I don't like how they changed every even slightly generic name to ensure MAXIMUM COPYRIGHT.
Especially since it results in shit like "Ripperdactyl" which makes it sound like a Beast Wars: Transformers recolor.
>>47928474
You know they were called that before AOS, right?
>>47928427
...and summoning takes the axe to the face! Ha!
Well, I assume that still allwos Nagash to double up on summons, which means he still brings a strong summoning game. Still, that's really good overall. It opens up tactical flexibility and reactive deploment at the cost of army size at the start. I like it.
Did you see anything about the various pseudo-Deep Strike abilities? There are some pretty brkone combos in there, so I assume those will be adressed as well?
>>47928427
If your description is accurate it really gimps summoning and not in a good way. It basically means I have to deploy only part of my army and try to use spells which can fail to summon the rest later on. The whole point and advantage of summoning is to be able to get MORE than your starting force onto the table or to summon new units to replace losses.
>>47928474
Ripperdactly existed with that name in WHFB.
They're dual-kit with the Teradons.
I don't see what's the problem too, it's not like it's called "Skygnasher" or "Wingmaw" or stupid thing like that. "dactyl" sounds dinosaur-ey enough.
>>47928508
next thing he's going to complain about the names of the mortal realms/winds of magic and how that's aos' fault.
I had that argument with a guy the other day. What cracks me up is he played whfb
>>47928525
Sure that's one advantage, but the other is working like deep strike in 40k without the scatter. There are plenty of advantages to bringing in units much closer to the target or in a better position.
>>47928474
In the grand scheme of things it's fairly inoffensive. I mean, sure, it's a dumb name, but between this and some of the other shit names introduced during 8th, Endtimes and AoS it's downright adorable.
>>47928525
Well, considering that most player made point systems requires you to decide what units you want to summon on deployment step, and you pay for them anyway I say its quite good deal.
Remember that current clean AoS rules are what will be called Open Play so you will have your free summons there. In matched play, lest be honest here, they had to axe it.
>>47928517
Nothing on "deep strikes" so far.
>>47928525
Yes, it nerfs summoning (for which there was a dire need) in terms of shitting more units on the table, but on the other hand you still can pick your units *after* the opponent has deployed and possibly already acted, giving you a ton of reactive flexibility. Not to mention plonking down a unit exactly where needed instead of having it slog across the table.
Also, Nagash probably still doubles summons, so there's that.
>>47928637
Huh, curious. After having been on the recieving end of one Knight-Vexillor-shunted unit of Retributors too many, I was sure they'd put a lid on that.
Still, thanks for that info.
>>47927618
Now I know what my next project is....
>>47928427
>>47928183
So, how does the Battle Line unit business work exactly?
>>47928183
Anything you feel should be mentioned because it came out of the left field for you? Anything unexpected/unusual?
This summoning is the same way it works in 40k, so i don't see the problem. This means they can keep summoning models cheap because they tend to be fragile enough (nagash i know)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1YVrxFmheSc
>>47928183
Okay, thinking this through, I actually like the first rule. No more Mystic Shield-spam till your whole army has a 1+ Save. Each summoning spell can only be attempted once per turn. And it encourages people to use Time of War rules in order to get broader selections of spells. And we'll see more of the barely-better-than-Arcane-Bolt spells being used.
And multiple-spells-per-turn Wizards aren't quite as overpowered that way.
Sure, personally I'm miffed at 1-Daemonic-Power-per-turn limit, but it's alright.
I just think it might not scale well with larger game sizes.
>>47928427
So summoning is literally worse deep-striking now? So much for the Tzeentch-force I was building.
>>47928575
No there aren't. The closest you can get with summoning magic is 9". The only unit that can reliably make that charge are Morghast Harbingers. Almost anything else is better off actually starting on the table. Never mind that some summoning spells have casting values of 10 or 11, which is nowhere near probable.
>>47928577
Or they could have done what some of the fanmade balancing systems did; like in 1000 points if I only field 900 I don't get 100 for summoning, I get 200 to make up for the fact that these spells are unreliable as hell.
And how would things like Blue Horror splitting, Flesh-Eater Courtiers and Daemon Standards work in that anyway? Are they exempt from that limit or do you have to cut into your budget for something that almost never happens?
>>47928916
>this summoning
The new one from the handbook or the baseline one? Because at least with the new version 40k has nothing at all in common.
>>47928946
Didn't Nagash banish Mannfred to one of the shittiest realms possible?
>>47928889
All units have an assigned role.
Leader, Battleline, Behemoth, Artillery, no role.
Depending on points you play you are required/limited on number of units of each type you can take. Lets say we play 1000pts battle.
In that case you are required to take
2+ Battleline units
1-4 Leaders
0-2 Behemoths
0-2 Artillery
Any number of no role units
Some units have both types so they take up both slots at once.
Some units can become battleline if you take specific leader
>>47929000
He escaped and is now plotting to usurp Nagash using a massive undead army created from the titanic monsters and countless dead armies whose bones rest in the field of bone in Ghur.
>>47928977
You can decide what to summon depending on the flow of battle, so your enemy has no idea what kind of shit you can drop. Its not that bad really. Just make sure to keep your wizards alive among all hate.
Now they just need to release a new race that I actually like.
>>47928977
Id rather summon something 9" away from my opponent's gunline than try to footslog them accross the board. There are advantages to summoning other than just bringing more dudes. The summoning nerf needed to happen, and I am ok with it.
>>47929003
>force org chart
The horror...
>>47929039
That's unfortunate. I was hoping that Mannfred would just get utterly destroyed. I think he is played out.
>>47929003
Thanks for the quick answer. 1000pts seems like it'd be the standard, I feel.
Behemoths are Monsters, I assume? Or Monsters with a 'Wounds-Suffered' table?
>Some units can become battleline if you take specific leader
Sweet. That should open up some interesting options.
>>47928903
I didnt expect them to go back to Core/Battleline, Behemoth/Rare unit type ideas.
Armies build entirely of one Alliance are given extra rule. Generals can take 1 extra ability out of 6 predefined ones. Also there are 6 artefacts that can be taken by heroes at no additional cost.
Generally I would say most unexpected thing about this book is that its solid product at first glance and not some shit they used to throw at us
>>47929081
Its a flexible force org, and id rather have this than those dumb percentages from old warhammer.
The more i see about this book the more i am excited about it. As soon as its announced at my lgs, im preordering it.
>>47929052
Like, I field 900 points and get a summoning pool of 100 but can decide mid-game what to do with that pool? Now that actually does sound better. Not good, but better.
>>47929003
So the whole X-becomes-Battleline depends on the Heroes you take? Okay, that sounds a lot better than I thought it would.
>>47929108
Id say monsters with the monster tables. Monsters like khorgoraths wouldnt be behemoths im thinking.
>>47929129
>closed the gates of Azyr and left the rest of the realms to be overrun by Chaos
Take a guess.
>Azyrxit
>>47929003
Is the Chamber Extremis stuff part of the regular stormcast stuff or a seperate force? Dracothian Guard as battleline units seems like it'd be a bit much...
Also, how does the unit restrictions you mentioned play with batallions? If I can't deploy enough, say, Behemoths to satisfy a batallion I probably just can't take it, right?
>>47929112
Is it full color? how much will it retail for? how many pages?
you're a gold mine! ima diggin!
>>47929129
>/pol/
>>47929080
Healing undead units is a different thing than summoning in AoS isn't it? I see no problem then either. Probably the best way to do summoning then.
>>47929112
>artefacts
>additional skills
>anon seems to like it
Well, consider me hyped.
>>47929129
Considering that Azyr is hermetically closed off to protect the pure from the savage corruption of Chaos, I'd say Sigmar is Brexit.
>>47929139
It also requires you to stick to allegiances
Example, Saurus Guard and Saurus Knights are no type units but if you whole army has only "Seraphon" keyword models in it then they automaticly become Battleline.
Phoenx Guards can become Battleline if whole army has Phoenix Temple keyword.
Tomb King Skeleton Archers are battleline if you take Queen Khalida.
>>47929112
Do the summoning restrictions affect all 'call unit X'-type of abilities or are they limited to spells only?
Also, how does it work for abilities that add lost models back to units, like the Flesheater Courts do? I assume those are not affected?
Also, thanks for doing this, anon. Raising my glass to your health.
>>47929236
That makes a surprising amount of sense. Huh.
Sensible design decisions? From my GW?
>>47928183
Actually...meh.
I mean, points were enough.
Stacking mystic shield imho was okay, its only broken when mages are almost free.
but with points, you either get something that costs like a unit but has only EITHER buffing OR missile capability. If you field 5 mages ok, you can make a unit save with 1+, but you wont make a)immune from mortal wounds and b) your opponent can still ignore that unit, snipe easily your mages and then charge your only unit with a fucking whole army.
I think Aos balanced itself pretty great when you put a decent point system into it.
I always played by "1 unit= 1 unit, and since mages were units one mage= standard 10/20 infantry unit and it always worked.
You field a lot of mages? fine, but I can get less buffs and a LOT more thing in the battlefield.
I think playing 1 unitx1 unit like a lot of battleplan asks you to is the best way to play the game. Wound count seems the most popular choice in my area and its TRASH.
>>47929198
A potion that lets you hero strike first in combat no matter whose turn is is.
Alliance bonuses like Death units withing 10" of general on a roll of 6 for each suffered would negate that wound
Chaos units in 8" of general on a roll of 6 have +1 to hit on combat.
Artefact that makes your hero a wizard or adds +1 spell/unbind to a wizard.
Im hyped as fuck. And you fucking CHOOSE it not roll!
>>47929167
15GBP or 25USD. Color about 150 pages
Never thought I'd ask, but...fluff order? recommended books/novels?
>>47928183
Got any point comparison? Just so we can get a feel for how much heroes cost compared to units?
Also, how exactly do the points work? X cost for the number of models mentioned on the warscroll, add X for each time the same number of models is taken?
Do options like weapons or mounts cost extra?
>>47929386
I assume all factions get the same artefacts and skills?
Also, complete list, if you can?
>>47929423
Its really close to SCGT points x20 will post some examples in a moment.
Every unit has a set minimum and maximum number of models.
Point cost stands for minimum number.
If you wish to take more then you pay multiples of minimum number cost.
Say Crypt Ghouls are min 10/ max 40, you pay 100 pts per 10 models. So taking 20 costs you 200. 30 costs 300. You can take uneven numbers like 27 but you still pay price for 30.
No additional point costs for anything.
>>47929507
That makes sense. I like it.
Also, thanks, dude.
>>47929507
>Still pay 30 if you only take 27
How fucking retarded. It better not be like this.
>>47929481
Each alliance has its own set of
1 Battle Trait
6 Command Traits for your general
6 Artefacts that "any (non-unique) hero can be given one..."
Battle traits are
Death: For each wount or mortal wound suffered by DEATH unit within your army that is within 10" of your General or another Hero from your army, roll a die. On a 6 or more the wound is negated.
Destruction: Roll a dice in your hero phase for each unit from your army that is within 6" of General or another Hero from your army. The unit can move a number of inches equal to the dice roll, as if it were movement phase, but cannot run. This does not affect their ability to move again later in the turn.
Rest in new post. Wont post abilities and artefacts as its simply too much writing.
>>47929591
>HMPH
>>47929100
It's nice to have competition.
Where the fuck is Settra, speaking of fucking variety. If Mannfred can escape and plot against Nagash then the Motherfucking Imperishable should be able to.
>>47929591
I dont see how its a problem. If you pay for the 30 why would you take 27? Its the same in warmachine
>>47929626
Thanks for typing all this up, dude.
>>47929591
Makes sense to me. It keeps things simple and eliminates the need to add points for every single model by itself.
Chaos: Roll a dice when you pick a Chaos unit to attack in combat that is within 8" of general or other your hero. On a roll of 6 you can add 1 to all hit rolls for the unit in that phase.
Order: You can re-roll battleshock tests (in battleshock phase) for friendly Order units that are within 12" of general or other hero in your army.
>>47929626
>destruction battle trait
Oh, wow, that might very well be a useful fix for the Ironjaws' notorious speed problems.
>>47929713
>>47929626
Now that i typed it. Order has shit rule, chaos is mildly interesting. For Destruction I already fear Ogres coming close much quicker and Death one is simply broken.
>>47929713
>>47929626
That order battle trait means I can actually run a hero other than the Lord-Celestant on Dracoth? Holy shit, useful for other armies and adressing some issues in stormcast armies. This book is looking better and better.
Also, I like how the chaos one is all about agression and melee.
>>47929626
>>47929713
Yeah, that Death one is pretty crazy. Tzeentch Arcanites have to have a special magic shield to do that, Death armies just have it by default.
>>47929713
So these Battle Traits, do I only get these if I focus on 1 Grand Alliance, do I only get the one from my General's Grand Alliance or do I have to keep to 1 Grand Alliance anyway?
>>47929750
>order has shit rule
Man, don't say that. Stormcast have to take that one hero to counteract their vulnerability to battleshock, humans and elves have mediocre leadership at best and dorfs/lizards with that trait will never fucking ever flee. I like it.
That said, yes, the death one is pretty damn significant.
>>47929775
>>47929779
The Luminar of Hysh gives the same kind of shield as the death trait but for order units. The Archmage gives it to any friendly units in a larger radius as a spell.
Its good but I wouldn't call a 6+ ward save aura simply broken. That destruction thing sounds nasty as hell tho.
>>47929779
Well anon, we all know that Tzaangors are shit in-game. Still playing them cause they look amazing, but they still suck.
>>47928427
Unless the new Sylvaneth units can be summoned, then this makes Branchwraiths summoning spell almost pointless.
Seraphon still have it good though, since they can just summon to cater to their opponent. I can see many people thinking summoning is just an unreliable deep strike instead of an ability to write a part of your army list on the spot.
>>47929785
In Pitched Battles (thats how they call games using points and all) you have to stick to one Grand Alliance. Battle Trait, Command Trait and Artefacts can be used only if your army is pure Order/Chaos/Death/Destruction. If you wish to go deeper and make Ironjawz army then you have to choose if its Ironjawz allegiance and use their tricks like switching unit types or if its Destruction and you are allowed to use Traits
>>47929825
I'd wager the restrictions is only for the spells that are actually called "summon X", so the Branchwraith would still be able to create new Dryads hopefully.
>>47929639
I just think Mannfred's traitor shtick is played out and boring at this point. He should have been left to rot.
>>47929820
How exactly are Stormcasts weak to Battleshock? You have to kill 2 Paladins a turn to force even a chance to fail Battleshock. And even if you kill 2 Paladins/1 Liberator, it's still just a 1/6 chance. Considering Liberators are your bog standard Core unit, you really shouldn't complain when Clanrats have Bravery 4.
Yes, you immediately lose several wounds when one guy runs, but so do Ogors.
And units like the Derpasaurus Guard are usually fielded in units of 1, so they never have to take Battleshock anyway.
Literally the only instance where you NEED Battleshock immunity is when some asshole tosses a Carnosaur your way.
>>47929915
He's still one of the best Vamp Count Representatives. I think Nagash is played out but he's the titular Death Alliance character.
>>47929901
Okay, thanks. Well, that sort of kills my Soulcast Ethereal army, at least for anything approaching competitive play.
>>47929901
>In Pitched Battles (thats how they call games using points and all) you have to stick to one Grand Alliance. Battle Trait, Command Trait and Artefacts can be used only if your army is pure Order/Chaos/Death/Destruction.
Wait, you contradict yourself here. Does an army have to be made up of only a grand alliance or do you only get the battle Trait etc. stuff if it is. Could you still have an Army made up of Destruction and Death units but you wouldn't get the traits and artefacts or can you simply not mix the alliances?
>>47929925
Not the same poster, but anon may have been thinking that, like ogres, when a stormcast runs that's 2 or 3 wounds & 2 or 3 attacks disappearing as opposed to 1 for a weaker unit. Less likely to happen perhaps, but a bigger impact when it does.
tfw
>one spell per army
"ok, so they're pushing using summoning spells since they're different"
>summoning pool that's shitty value
"well ok wizards are way way worse now"
I'm honestly super worried about the ratios here
>>47929003
so in a standard 2k points game, I can only have 4 artillery/4 monsters?
This really sucks for the cheaper artillery. SCGT has it at 5 and that seemed about right, but now I can barely field the chaos dwarf artillery formation. Here's hoping iron demons are only behemoths.
Speaking of which, any info on how the formations work with points and force org?
>>47929821
Sure, but *every* hero gets that auro. That gives you ~4 12" bubbles of not dying when killed, no need to cast it or anything. Not to mention, actually digging a wight king with that aura out of a skeleton blob or grave guard brick isn't going to be fun.
>>47929925
there are a lot of abilities that lowers bravey.
If you get caught unprepared, it can hurt pretty bad.
Like, a single troglodon +any seraphon unit with a stardrake banner will reduce your bravery to a pulp, and point-wise a liberator fleeting will be a LOT worse than a clanrat fleeing.
>>47929956
fuck competitive.
i hope they have made narrative interesting, because that's what im going to push.
>>47930015
>fuck competitive.
Then dont play competitive, lol. Its not mandatory.
>>47929968
Sorry if that looks that way but its really shitty written. Basicly if you use GW points you have to stick to one Grand Alliance, with that you automaticly gain traits and artifacts. You can throw away Traits and Artifacts and make your army more specific, said Destruction > Ironjawz to unlock more units as Battleline.
Hope it makes more sense now?
>>47929988
Oh, I missed the part that all Heroes have the Aura. That is pretty damn fucking good. It's still only a 6+ ward save though. I know what that can do from my Daughters of Khaine, but its still not too crazy.
>>47930035
We all know its going to be the standard way to play in every game store, so yes, fuck it.
>>47930045
>>47929968
Possibly more Traits and Artefacts (or something like that) for more specific armies will be released in future
>>47929983
Honestly, I am not unhappy about wizards being less interesting overall. Maybe people will bring some other heroes now.
As for the artillery, after having had to slog my way through no-man's land against a dorf army with 12 cannons, 4 organ guns, 4 flame cannons, 2 spear throwers and 2 grudge throwers, I lack any sort of empathy for cannon spam.
What sort of Artifacts can Order heroes take?
>>47930045
Ah, alright. I thought maybe the traits would be more of an incentive to stick with one Alliance but they would still allow you to mix them. I was pretty certain they would make the point system at least stick with the Grand Alliances though, so this isn't super disapointing.
Thanks for all the info mate!
>>47929983
>>47930084
Artillery has no place in Aos.
Its just too powerful.
All new minis have medium range at best, judicators having the longest range thus far beign 24".
Hope this kills artillery once and for all.
Im sick of seeign helcannon and skaven warp lighting cannon spammed everywhere.
>>47930084
>12 cannons, 4 organ guns, 4 flame cannons, 2 spear throwers and 2 grudge throwers
Holy fuck you brought that on yourself dude, why'd you play that.
And honestly, for their points costs they aren't that broken. Like this is 100 pool scgt:
Darzhoath
2 Demonsmith
2 Magma Cannons
2 Deathshriekers
1 Iron demon
40 Infernal guard
30 fireglaves
>>47930119
>hellcannon
They're the literal best artillery in the game, if SCGT pools are directly converted, it'll be 360 points. For what it does that cost is about right.
>>47930102
1. Attack in combat before anyone else
2. Improve Rend by 1, not for mounts
3. +1 Damage for one weapon
4. -1 to To Hit for enemies you wounded (for rest of battle)
5. Once per battle -1 to Hit for all enemies agains model with this artefact
6. Heal 1 wound in each of your hero phases.
>>47930171
>1. Attack in combat before anyone else
Here we go again
>>47930194
Haha thats right. Luckily just for 1 unnamed hero model in your whole army.
>>47930171
Any word on how formations work?
>>47930244
You mean Warscroll Battalions?
They simply cost points.
>>47929003
>Depending on points you play you are required/limited on number of units of each type you can take. Lets say we play 1000pts battle.
>In that case you are required to take
>2+ Battleline units
Brilliant, thank the gods.
Now you'll see some actual armies on the field rather than a clusterfuck of monsters, wizards and fast cav. Great news.
>>47930294
>core tax
WHFB pls go.
>>47930284
YES! This is a problem with 40k. Formations became the standard because its stupid not to take them. That and formations and detachments started getting out of hand with the special additions rules, and now free units.
Man, 40k needs the AoS treatment so much.
>>47930119
Honestly, a couple of cannons and shit like that are okay, but once someone starts breaking out the flamecannons it gets absurd.
Also, Thundertusk should be artillery as well.
>>47930169
>why'd you play that
I honestly couldn't say.
>>47930171
Those are all neat. I can especially see use in 1. That's money in the bank.
Or put 4 on the Celestant-Prime to use his enormous blast attack to spread around -1to hit across huge swaths of enemies.
Also, regen on a Stardrake Lord-Celestant. Awesome. Good luck ever getting rid of that one.
Also there are points for new Sylvaneth units, including Alarielle for insane 620pts with Leader/Behemoth type clearly indicating a hero on monster type model
>>47930359
>implying anyone who wants to field infantry is a salty WHFB relic
>>47930294
>implying everyone did that shit
>>47930294
>Now you'll see some actual armies on the field rather than a clusterfuck of monsters, wizards and fast cav. Great news
So far the only time I saw that was at scgt-hich used that shitty fanmade comp.
Eveywhere I played I saw armies made of a mlot of different things-but line infantry has always been there.
>>47930359
Never.
The idea of Battle-line units changing via keyword dedication sounds good. i am all for fluff armies.
Surprised to hear GW may have put some effort into this really
>>47930284
So they still have to fit into the force org chart to be used?
Happen to take pics of any of the point costs?
>>47930284
Significant amounts of points? Like, a basic unit's worth?
>>47930294
My last game was against elves: 2 princes dragons, two mages on dragon, 2 phoenixes, 2 units of 15 reavers. Fun times...
>>47930467
yeah battles aren't as fun when it's not 800 regular dudes providing a scenic background for your heroes to clash onthey'dd better make militia and gunmen battle line or i'm fucked
>>47930393
>Alarielle
>620pts
Oh boy, oh boy. Prepare for Nagash and Archaon to sit somewhere around 1k.
That said, what are the new Sylvaneth unit's names? I assume they are listed?
Since SCGT was mentioned, what do Stormcast lists look like under the comp?
>>47930539
Nagash is 900
Archaon is 700
Unit names are Tree Revenants and one other type of Revenants i cant read my own shit photo 100 pts/5 both
and Kurnoth Hunters (or something like that) 180pts/3
>>47930544
pretty close to chaos warriors. Generally 1 liberator = 1 chaos warrior = 1 pool = 20 pts.
Celestant-prime 16, small drake rifers 6-7 per dude, judicators 5 for 8, liberators 5 for 5, velixor 12, heraldor 7, venator 7, stardrake 28, castellant 5, celestant on foot 5, celestant on drakoth 10, paladins 5 for 9-10 depending on loadout, prosecutors 3 for 4
>>47930524
You are the reason people shit on our threads, you do know that, right?
Or is this some post-ironic meta shitposting?
>>47930544
>Knights-Vexillor with shunt banner
>Retributors with max maces
>Celestant-Prime (great bolts if possible)
Season to taste with bow Judicators.
Or just take Dracothian Guard until you run out of points.
>>47930641
Upload the photo, we might be able to make sense of it.
Also it is nice to have anyway.
I am guessing the Kurnoth Hunters are the tree people with bows that have been in some of the art work though, with the Tree Revenants the spooky treeghosts, and the other one being the half Elf half Tree with melee weapons.
>>47930641
So is it true Greater Daemons and Verminlords are 250?
I wonder how much a Stonehorn or Hellpit would be
>>47930544
>>47930650
Prime 360
Judicators 160pts per 5
Liberators 100pts per 5
vexillor 200pts
heraldor 120pts
venator 120pts
Celestant /on dracoth 100/220
Prosecutors hammers/javelins 100/80pts per 3models
Retributors 220 per 5
Stardrake 500/600pts
Drake cav 240pts per 2 models with concussors as exception at 280
>>47922492
Chaos didn't 100% destroy the realms but they broke the major civilizations and corrupted the land.
There used to be enormous cities like Azyrheim in every realm. These cities were the size of continents, but now only Azyrheim (sigmars city in Azyr) remains.
There are still societies, nations, countries, and kingdoms but nothing on the scale of the great nation cities.
Chaos is in control of all the realms but there are still other powerful forces around.
>>47930641
I assume Revenants are the tree-fused elves and dryads in the pictures.
Kurnoth Hunters are probably the big treekin with bows. Kurnous was the elven god of th hunt, so there might be some connection.
Actually, how many pages does the book have?
Now these leaks sound amazing, however i am gonna play mister down to earth and go take a bath of salt until i actually see more pics. I don't want to die of disappointment if these aren't true.
>>47930757
a bit over 150
>>47930748
Well, my redshirt got the liberators value wrong. That value does look more sensible compared to archaon/nagash though.
>>47930762
name one page of points and I will post it just for you. Im not posting it because being so early before release its possible to track which stores already received their handbooks
>>47930748
>Stardrake 500/600pts
Ouch. I think I'll stick with my infantry bricks.
>>47928183
RIP Mystic Shield stacking
>>47930748
Are forge world units in the books? Very interested on how they'll do roles/points for chaos dwarfs compared to dispossessed.
>>47930804
Chaos dorfs! Because literally noone else cares.
>>47930804
My FLGS will get his probably next tuesday, so you're being sensible in playing it safe.
>>47928183
Welp, ripperdactyls are now garbage tier
>>47930804
I'll bite,
is it possible to see anything for ironjaws? Thinking of playing them instead of bloodbound for campaign
Still in my bath of salt though, so salty
>>47930721
Kairos 300
Lord of Change 260
Great Unclean 240
Skarbrand 400
Bloodthirsters 280-360 depending on version
Verminlord 300
Keeper of Secrets 280
>>47930820
It's honestly pretty fair. The thing has 16 wounds, 3+ save, reroll ones (and do mortals), mortals with rain of stars that's global, mortals with tail, and a decent chunk of normal attacks. Should be equivalent to 25 liberators.
>>47930839
>GW product
>he asks for the page of a FW product
Anon, I...
>>47930839
No forgeworld. I know. It sucks
>>47930876
>>47930889
B-but, they're even in the app, and even OOP models got points...
>>47930861
Note it has only models with Ironjawz keyword.
No more photos after this one.
>>47929003
>limit on monsters
Fuck
This
Book
>>47930864
Fuck me 300 for every Verminlord? Please just be Skreech Verminking.
Why the hell is the Unclean one the cheapest he's the most bullshit GD of them all, so hard to bring down.
>>47930889
everything will get points they said...
Forgeworld is a-ok they said...
Gonna have to dig out that Chaos Troll warscroll then until they allow me to play my Bile Trolls as Bile Trolls again..
>>47930858
>Its not overpowered anymore!
>its garbaaaaaggggeeeeee
typical sera player.
>>47930963
Okay, let me talk a proper shower to get this salt off me... Thank you for this, faith has been restored.
Praise the su- wait wrong game...
WAAAAAGHHHHHH
>>47930963
That's nice and clearly laid out. I like it.
>>47930991
Considering it says Behemoths, not monsters, I imagine not EVERY monster is a behemoth.
>>47930993
Skreech is 340
Warpseer 260
Corruptor 240
Deciever 320
Got it messed up a bit
1x Lord Celestant on Stardrake (1) - 28
1x Lord Celestant on Dracoth (1) - 10
1x Lord Castellant (1) - 5
1x Lord Relictor (1) - 5
1x Knight Vexillor (1) - 8
1x Knight Venator (1) - 7
1x Knight Heraldor (1) - 7
4x Concussors (4) - 28
2x Judicators (10) - 16
3x Liberators (15) - 15
2x Paladin Retributors (10) - 20
Total - 149
Suppose this won't be converting well, lol
>>47930991
behemots are probably just big monsters like dragons, giants and stuff.
Also, all fo this is for COMPETITIVE gameplay.
you can still use normal retsriction for every game you play. You just have to add points if you want.
>>47931046
seems fair.
Corruptor has always been the weakest of em all, seems logic they finally made him cheaper.
>>47929925
>How exactly are Stormcasts weak to Battleshock?
Ever play Stormcast against Seraphon or Tomb Kings?
Stormcast are little scaredy bitches. Unlike the Free People they can't take units of 30+ and losing a model to battleshock means losing 2-5 wounds.
>>47931046
Corrupter cheapest, Deceiver second most expensive. Great, they seem to know their shit, because the Corruptor sucks, 2 spells and great Command notwithstanding.
>>47931046
Do you know the points for the Dwarfs?
I am mostly interested in seeing the point differences between regular Dwarf Warriors and Longbeards compared to Ironbreakers and Hammerers
>>47931104
>>47931088
>Corrupter sucks
DELETE THIS
>>47931088
>behemots are probably just big monsters like dragons, giants and stuff.
Just watch, all the Lizardmen units that actually do something are going to be tagged as Behemoths
>>47931179
>all the Lizardmen units that actually do something are going to be tagged as Behemoths
Stegadons, bastilladons, and carnasaurs should all be behemoths.
>>47931162
100>140>160>200 in order you mentioned them
>>47931004
At best you'll get 6 beak attacks per model now, and that assumes the blot toad is nearby
Terradons already got 4 beak attacks per model and also dropped rocks and had very powerful shooting attacks
There's no reason to bring ripperdactyls any more
If I want to run a Nurgle Army, do i just field all "nurgle units" or can I splash in some normal knights and some of Nurgle's Daemons too?
>>47930924
I'm sure FW will provide (eventually), considering they even have new dawi zharr stuff in the pipeline.
>>47930963
Thanks, mate. Doing god's work here.
Still, looking at those values I find myself with a severe case of meh when it comes to big models, very similarly to WHFB used to be. Whenever I see those costs I think to myself "I could get like three dozen guys and a wizard for that.". Curious.
>>47931201
Carnosaur, yes
Bastiladon with Solar Engine and Engine of the Gods are more like a war machines than your typical monsters
Lizardmen are going to be unfairly punished for having weird hybrid monster/war machines.
>>47931246
Hey, my hybrid warmachine/monsters in the form of iron demons will probably all be classified as warmachines, so join the club. At least most of your stuff is really strong, you have the best magic, and temple guard.
>>47931228
> Whenever I see those costs I think to myself "I could get like three dozen guys and a wizard for that."
Same, thats why i prefer points like SCGT where units are mostly around 4-10pts and monsters 15-20pts it doesnt hurt as much
>>47931046
By the way, are the Silver Tower units in the book?
>>47931175
I love him and he's pretty solid but the other variants are a lot harder to deal with.
>>47931179
That means you can "only" field 4.
THANK GOD. 4 is still TOO MANY
FUCKING BASTILODON
REEEEEEEEE
>>47931289
>hybrid warmachine/monsters
nice fluffy army, but do you understand that from a competitive point of view your army is just a big, fat ball of cheese and deserves to be stopped, right?
>>47931300
You just made me scroll 50+ shit photos, twice.
I cant find it so I would say they are not here.
>>47931227
You either run general Chaos Alliance army or specific small faction like Nurgle Rotbringers (you can find small factions list on website or in GA books)
>>47931289
Lizardmen magic is nothing special, it is really all about summoning; which is still good, but strictly worse than it used to be.
Their unique spells are all support/defensive buffs and other units have better buffs - Daemonic Power and Hand of Glory stick out in my mind.
If you want to see some powerful wizards then look at what Chaos, Death, and High Elves can do.
Temple guard just got nerfed heavily with the Rule of One. Their point cost is also going to be fairly high, if SCGT values are any indication.
AOS 2.0 is shaping up to be a bad time to play Seraphon
>>47931175
10 attacks of 1 damage, means a maximum of 10 damage per round of combat, going up to a theoretical maximum of 20 if you divide your attacks between 10 multi-wound units. But frankly, you have bigger problems than to worry about your maximum damage output if your Corruptor is in melee with 10 multi-wound units or Heroes. Whereas the Warbringer has a maximum damage output of 20 with no strings attached and higher Rend. Also, the Corruptor's unique spell is literally shitty Vermintide with a chance to jump between units.
The Corruptor is literally the squishy Wizard of the bunch, which is kinda sad considering the Warpseer is supposed to be the squishy Wizard. The only thing the Corruptor has going for him is a great Command and two spells a turn (the latter of which is kinda useless as Mystic Shield is wasted on Pestilens).
I stand by that. The Corruptor is objectively the worst Verminlord.
>>47930748
Do we have the battleline requirement for anything smaller than 1000 points?
1000 points seems to go too far with these values, I mean 2x5 liberator fills our your battle line requirement for any Order army with 800 points to spend on your big fellas or whatever, surely the whole point of the battle lines was that your rank and file foot soldiers should be a sizeable part of your army, 1/5th of your guys being normal infantry isn't really much of a thing.
>>47931386
>You just made me scroll 50+ shit photos, twice.
>I cant find it so I would say they are not here.
Sorry, and thanks and well fuck.
>>47931208
Geez, I didn't expect Hammerers to be so expensive.
Thanks for sharing. Looks like I should be able to use a fair few Ironbreakers without to many issues after all.
>>47927511
Grave guard or Ushabti
>>47931449
Well, they said the units are going to have a point cost in the warcsrolls even outside the generals compendium, so its just a matter of waiting a bit more I guess.
>>47931447
Now here is biggest bomb of it all.
Matched play is designed for battles of 1000, 2000 and 2500 points (with 2500 i assume there should be 2500+). No more no less
>>47931449
They are all for 10 models by the way.
>>47931447
1/5 more than people needed to take before. Seems okay to me.
>>47931496
2nd linked post of above should be to this one
>>47931464
Anything new for Slaanesh? Rumor was Slaaneshi armies were getting revamped for the summer campaign.
>>47931496
Well, considering 1000 points is round about 50 points SCGT I think anything smaller wouldn't make sense to play competitively anyway.
>>47931496
>Matched play is designed for battles of 1000, 2000 and 2500 points (with 2500 i assume there should be 2500+). No more no less
Very interesting.
1000 points seems like a small skirmish battle. 2000 seems like you might be able to fit some of the special characters and still have a decent army (not Nagash/Archaon, but the others around 300-400).
Then 2500+ is the apocalypse mode where you just put all your models on the table.
>>47931496
ffffffffffffffffffffffffffffuck that.
1000 points is already bigger than the average game at my local shop by quite a margin..
I'd be happier with a ~750 point bracket with 3 battle lines.
>>47931530
This year is Sylvaneth (summer) then dwarves and tzeentch (fall) and shadowlands/dark elves (winter)
Might see Slaneesh stuff late 2016 but more likely early 2017
>>47931542
>>47931532
>>47931496
Limits are
1000pts 1-4 Leaders 2+ Battleline 0-2 Artillery 0-2 Behemoths any other units
2000pts 1-6 Leaders 3+ Battleline 0-4 Artillery 0-4 Behemoths any other units
2500pts 1-8 Leaders 4+ Battleline 0-5 Artillery 0-5 Behemoths any other units
>>47931552
They had to make it 1000 so people could play Nagash/Archaon in every format
Imagine buying those fucking huge expensive models and then being told you cant play them because your local scene only does 500pt games
>>47931560
So no dual launch of Sylvaneth and Slaanesh? The rumor was they were rivals in the new story. Something about elf gods kidnapping Slaanesh....
>>47931577
>bastiladon probably costs 1 artillery and 1 behemoth
>so does stegadon
>no option to run pure artillery units, have to lose behemoth slots in order to field artillery
FUCK THIS BOOK
>>47931424
Did you forget his plaguemaster thing adding mortal wounds onto damaged units? that's decent as it works off any damaging ability he uses, magic, tail, melee, etc.
And i normally cast shield on himself, i like to have it fight as many units as possible, placing hits on each and of course spreading plague in small areas.
But i can see how he's weaker than a Warbringer and can't skitterleap, etc. never looked at the warbringer until now.
at least he is cheap
>>47931521
Yea, I assumed that. I was hoping that Dwarf Warriors would be for a box of 16, but I always knew that would be far to good to be true, since they are a solid unit in a really sneaky way, but 100 for 10 isn't that bad.
>>47931552
You do realize that if these points are actually SCGT times 20, then 1000 points is like four minimum size units and three monster-less Heroes, right? Like, Start Collecting plus one or two units extra. THAT'S bigger than your average game size?
>>47931602
Nope
Slaneesh's story is tied to the shadowlands, morathi, malekith, tyrion, and teclis. It's all one big glob of story arc.
>>47931606
Only Salamanders and one other small shit is Artillery, big stuff is just Behemoths. rejoice
>>47930804
Dispossessed !
>>47931496
Do Stormcast have any battle line units besides Liberators? Judicators maybe?
Also, how many points are treelords, especially Durthu?
>>47931640
What about Kroxigor?
>>47931643
You are late to the party Anon. Some other day for sure.
>>47931624
I believe you, but what source is this from?
>>47931611
No, not damaged units, damaged MODELS. 1 Wound-unit? Nope, no extra damage. You just killed that Liberator and didn't wound another? No extra damage for those either.
Only one model of any unit can be wounded at any one time, so you get maximum 1 extra mortal wound per unit/Hero you attack and even that's not too likely.
But yeah, casting Mystic Shield on himself actually helps the most, I guess.
>>47931606
I am not the book-anon, but if I am correct in interrupting the rules for summoning he posted earlier, you only have to assign a certain amount of POINTS for summoning, and not unit types.
Which would mean you can summon however many bastilidons and stegadons with the summoning points you allocated yourself, since they would NOT be considered part of your limit.
>>47931606
>reeee-ing over shit that isn't even confirmed
>reeee-ing over the most broken army being taken down a peg
I finally get why people hate Sera-fags.
>>47931352
>but do you understand that from a competitive point of view your army is just a big, fat ball of cheese and deserves to be stopped, right?
Is it really?
>iron demon has 14" 2d6 shots range 4+/3+ rend 1
>skullcracker has no ranged so is effectively a monster
>Mortar is 40" 1 shot 3+/3+ rend 2 d6 damage, can attempt to fire twice if a demonsmith is nearby, effective 1.7 wounds/shooting phase
>deathshrieker is 36" 3 shots 4/3 rend 1 d3 damage, +1 to hit if demonsmith is nearby
>magma cannon on a 3+ deal that many mortal wounds, 24" range if smith is nearby, effective 3 mortal wounds per shooting phase
>Dwarf flame cannon is d6 mortals auto plus d6 more on a 4+ with an engineer at 24" range, effective 5.25 mortals
>hellcannon is 2 shots 3+ to deal d6 mortals at 48", effective 4.5ish plus it can go crazy
lets look at SCGT pools here: iron demon/skullcraker 7, deathshrieker 6, magma 7, mortar is 10 hellcannon is 18, flame cannon is 15.
So with a limit on 4 warmachines, how are chaos dwarfs OP in any way? They have extremely mediocre other units, and I'd really rather be able to run my !monsters as monsters rather than taking up space of shooting that the army needs to actually work.
>>47931662
Liberators and Judicators only
Durthu 400, Ancient 300, Treeman 260
>>47931667
Kroxigors are no type unit, 180 per 3 models
>>47931704
Thats a bit problematic for sure
>>47931667
What about Kroxigor? They sure as fuck aren't artillery or behemoths, and I somehow doubt they'l ever be battleline, either.
>>47931736
You better play some lottery today
>>47931685
That's what i meant, I do get how it works, thanks.
Now we have the summer campaign i plan to amass the Virulent Horde, which gives an aura of 'Your 6's to wound become mortal wounds' so that will help him a little.
>>47931577
How many points are the old models? mainly looking for:
Old archaon on horse
Hellcannon
Old dwarf flame cannon
Varangard or guant summoner because I'm curious
>>47931704
That is interesting.
Bastiladons are definitely the best thing to summon. They are crazy efficient wounds because of their high defenses and deal a ton of damage. With a relatively low casting value of 8, I can see bastiladon summon spam being commonplace.
>summon bastiladon with an Ark of Sotek within 9" of enemy units, near a Stegadon with a Skink Alpha
>use Skink Alpha ability to immediately move the Bastiladon d6 inches closer
>now in range to use Ark of Sotek in combat phase
>maybe also in range to charge
>give bastiladon mystic shield for 2+ saves
>have skink priest nearby for reroll saves/run/charge
huehuheuhuee
>>47931777
Trips of Nurgle for you, oh great Witherer.
Yeah, okay, sorry, it's just so many people get this stupid rule wrong.
Yeah, that will help. And hey, maybe Chaos gets a "+1 to Damage"-artifact too, that'd make him by far the strongest Verminlord.
>>47931782
Flamecannon 200
Varanguard 360per3
Gaunt 120
Old Archaon 320
Hellcannon 300
>>47931746
I bet on Britain remaining today, if that's of any use.
>>47931727
Man, it's a shame there aren't any boni for taking more than minimum battle line units. With Liberators and Judicators both I am running over 50% battle line units with my default army.
>>47931810
Problem is, you need 6 enemy units around the Ark of Sotek for the stupid thing to be at all reliable.
>>47931875
Look at it as dealing an average of 2 mortal wounds to each enemy unit in 8"
Remember that every Hero counts as a single unit
It also activates at the start of every combat phase.
Read that last part again.
The START of EVERY combat phase.
You can whittle down units before any kind of initiative order is picked.
You also deal damage with it in both your own combat phase as well as your opponents combat phase, and again BEFORE they have a chance to react.
The Ark of Sotek is way better than people think. It's tough to get maximum value out of it, but dealing an average of 2 mortal wounds to every unit within 8" every combat phase is bretty gud
>bring out chaos dorfs to fuck with local redshirt who hates fw because he can't sell it
"I won't buy any more until points"
>buy more because excited for muster
>tfw no points in the book
last whine post I swear
>>47931918
Also worth noting that Seraphon have a REALLY hard time dealing mortal wounds to their enemies.
They have generally low Rend values and the only other mortal wound sources are terradon rocks (50% chance, one time use), arcane bolt (only one per turn now), hoping to roll 6s to wound with Saurus Knights on the charge, and Kroak (special character)
>>47931615
Maybe it's because we all play other games like infinity more frequently than AoS and have some sort of preference for having less actual models on the table but most of us play 1 hero, a few units of foot guys depend on the faction and then a rotating final spot for a monster or other hero depending on the scenario we are playing.
Sigmar just seems more fun when you're playing on that small scale with a ton of scenery and objective play.
>>47931918
Certainly. IF you get 6 units and/or Heroes around it, it's absolutely insane, dealing 24 Mortal Wounds each full round. But the Ark has an unfortunate habit of being pretty inaccurate if you have less than 6 enemy units around it.
>>47929938
I was already sick of Mannfred before the End Times. He should have stayed in that swamp.
>>47931964
Ive had great success with it. You can usually get it in range of 3 units at a time, given how heroes, wizards, and priests are all counted as individual units.
It's also a great counter to Chaos Familiar spam
>>47931727
Do you have any pictures of Tomb Kings and Vampire Counts? Quality isn't a huge concern.
>>47931959
yeah okay, but even that much should put you pretty close to 1000. Also, in your gaming group, you can just fuck the Matched Play anyway as it's only for tournaments and playing with strangers.
>>47928946
based
Based points posters: any teases to be given about Ogre point values? Really interested to see how they're balanced given how tough they are.
>>47931496
Hey if you're still there please can you let me know whether gorebeast chariots are battle line?
I know we are about to get points (things are already leaking) but I'm building a nurgle blightkings army and I'm wondering if you guys think a Sorcerer or two for summoning nurgle daemons might be fun. I love the idea of summoning a GUO on someones head.
Seein a lot from this thread around on the net, and ALL OF THEM are claiming the merit of the leaks.
And thank you based leakers. You will be fired, but your sacrifice won't be forgotten.
>>47932049
Very curious to hear how many points the Thundertusk is
>>47930804
treelords, treelord anciente and dryads plz
Also, are old discontinued model in it?
>>47932013
Looking at it as SGCWx20 we seem to average maybe 700-800 points per game depending on what heroes and stuff, my original guess of 750 was pretty close.
While yes we can just say fuck it (Probably gonna try the point values and house rule it at 750 points 3 battle lines or something) having a basic system to say "Okay these armies should be about right for one another and their composition should be reasonably diverse" makes doing things like our campaign nights easier.
>>47932087
>claiming the merit of the leaks
Honestly not sure what you mean by that.
I've personally been bored and have posted it in every channel I frequent.
>>47932053
no type unit, cant change it
>>47932125
Look up earlier posts, Ive mentioned treelords points. All models from Compediums here https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Warhammer-Age-of-Sigmar-Rules have rules
Detailed points will be posted with photos at a later date, I dont want to skim through 50+ photos for just one or two values. Man up and wait a bit.
>>47932197
Hmm ok, I'll have to rethink my list then. Might add some Warhounds and maybe Daemonettes as those are guaranteed battle line
>>47932121
>>47932049
Big models break 300pts mark sometimes even 400
Ogres/Leadbelchers/Ironguts are similar to other line/elite units that is 120 up to 220 pts but per 3 models
Can I get Brettonian points please... if they exist...
>>47932278
yes they do exist
but you will have to wait like others
Errants/Realms are 200/220 per 8
Louen is 400
>>47932278
http://www.heelanhammer.com/SCGTdownloads/SCGT16PoolV2.2.pdf
multiply pools by 20, that will give you ballpark values.
>>47932335
>gw is doing retarded box sizes like 8s and the 3/2s for varanguard/dracoths
Lord Celestant/Dracoth (220 pts)
Lord Castellant (??? pts)
Lord Relictor (??? pts)
Knight Vexillor (200 pts)
Knight Venator (120 pts)
Knight Heraldor (120 pts)
5x Judicators (100 pts)
5x Judicators (100 pts)
5x Liberators (100 pts)
5x Liberators (100 pts)
5x Liberators (100 pts)
5x Paladin Retributors (220 pts)
5x Paladin Retributors (220 pts)
Total: 1600pts (Minimum)
Seems interesting so far. Anyone have thoughts on dropping this to 1000?
>>47932335
Quick question, how does the handbook cover mechanics like "restore killed units"?
Also wondering how they handled balancing the Phoenix with its never-ending 50% chance of just being reborn.
And finally, did they do anything to the Green Knight? He can just keep respawning constantly.
If they are limiting summoning by points then they should definitely do something about the Phoenix and the Green Knight
>>47932448
For the part I saw they didnt touch it. Will check it next time if such time comes.
>>47932439
Heraldor is situational. If your objectives are on terrain then you should absolutely take him
10 Retributors sounds like a lot of fun with Knight Vexillor, but it costs a ton of points. You have to cut some heroes (probably Relictor) or reduce it down to 5 Retributors.
I think this list has more heroes than you are going to be allowed.
Consider swapping some Liberators to Prosecutors with Javelins.
>>47932535
Thanks. It's starting to shape up I think:
Lord Celestant/Dracoth (220 pts)
Lord Castellant (??? pts)
Knight Vexillor (200 pts)
Knight Venator (120 pts)
5x Judicators (100 pts)
5x Judicators (100 pts)
5x Liberators (100 pts)
5x Liberators (100 pts)
5x Paladin Retributors (220 pts)
5x Paladin Retributors (220 pts)
3 x Prosecutors (80 pts)
Total: 1460pts
>>47930748
are the Protectors and Decimators the same points as the Retributors?
>almost 500 points
Shout out to the leaker (leakers?) but also to the cool and dedicated anons that keep these threads going
AOS had a rough start but things are looking right
>>47932335
>>47932351
Thanks guys!
I never played without points really, but now that we are getting points, how are Bretts in Sigmar? Are they worst finishing the painting on and buying the rare boxes that still remain or is it better to just chose a new faction?
What do Priests count as? Lords?
>>47933314
Priests are heroes. There are no lords categories anymore. It's all heroes.
New thread
>>47933417
>>47933417
>>47933417
