What would the stats be for the Kirkhammer in your favorite setting?
Unusable/10
>>47336794
Regular longsword stats, with a decent-sized damage boost but an accuracy penalty when in hammer form (because you can't convince me that that wouldn't be unwieldy as fuck)
>>47336794
Swing TN 15
Thrust TN 20
DTN 20
Swing DR +4 (Bludgeoning)
Thrust DR +2 (Bludgeoning)
AP1 and Shock 1 on swings
Proficiency: Mass Weapon and Shield
>>47336794
Wait, how does that thing work?
>>47336974
The hammer is the sheath and the sword just acts as the extra length of the shaft.
If that blows your immersion then I suppose I couldn't sell you on a staff that turns into a buzzsaw wheel on a stick.
>>47336974
The sword locks in somehow (I think you twist it) and functions as the handle for the hammer part.
>>47337000
Or the sword that turns into a bow.
Or arm mounted pneumatic spike.
>all that mass at the very end
>handle requires hands to be close together
No way you would be able to swing that motherfucker without hurting yourself. If you could choke up and swing it like a regular hammer it would be fine, but the hilt is going to fuck your hand motion hard.
>>47337000
Yeah, Bloodborne's weapons are neat-looking but impractical as hell for the most part.
>>47337000
>>47337001
Oh alright, that explains it pretty well. Was mostly confounded how the "hammer-sheath" could possibly remain attached to the sword, but i soppose that has some sense to it. Implausible, but i'd work with it for sure.
Vid of it being used in game
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YeSoLQvdJjU
>>47337016
Or a fucking cannon.
>>47337016
Or the still living arm of a eldritch abomination
>>47337032
What are you talking about? BB's weapons are practical for what they have to deal with which is Lovecraftian werewolves and other such monsters.
The system I'm most familiar with is pathfinder and this reminds me of a concept I came up with before: certain weapons grant feats. Bloodborne weapons just grant different feats as they transform.
>>47337000
But how the hell does the sword stay in there?I'm fine with it if the explanation is just "magic"
>>47337167
It locks if you twist it to the side. You can see that the handle is a few degrees off if you check the image.
>>47337167
Complex egineering and special metals that can withstand the stresses of acting as a fulcrum for a fuck huge hammer
plus >>47337213
>>47336794
Since none of them are magical nor have power fields or whatever, I have to go for:
Choose profile at the start each assault phase.
S:user AP-
Or
S:+1 AP- unwieldy, concussive
Rather shitty weapon.
>>47336945
But it also does Righteous damage
>>47337032
That's the entire point. They're used by people who are superhuman against things that are superhuman at best and eldritch horrors the rest of the time. There's also prestige and an attitude of "difficulty to use = badassness of user" among hunters.
>>47337300
>>47337032
Plus the entire point of the kirkhammer is to be symbolic
>>47337032
Didn't Man at Arms build the foldable cleaver thing with their main problem being that it was heavy as all fuck, not that it didn't work?
>>47337250
>Since none of them are magical
Stop right there.
They each have slots for bloodgems which enhance them with magical properties. Also, I'm pretty sure there's some holy scripture on the hammer part.
>>47337646
Hammer does do Righteous(Holy) damage as well. This only works on Cainhurst people but still
>>47337448
We never saw the locking mechanism in action IIRC. I think they probably made it too fiddly and it would not hold up in practice because of the weight of the thing (which they overshot by a lot I think, I would have preferred a smaller but working type).
>>47337663
Are you sure you don't mean the wheel? I know the saw cleaver does bonus damage to beast but I didn't think the hammer was specific to cainhurst peeps.
>>47337897
All church weapons plus the cane do extra damage against cainhurst
>>47337897
Wheel, Kirkhammer, and I think Ludwig's all deal extra Righteous damage to the enemies in Cainhurst. All serrated weapons (saws, pizza cutter, i think the cane as a whip?) deal extra damage to beasts.
I probably missed some weapons.
>>47337955
Cane is actually unique in that it has both righteous and serrated
>>47337955
Makes sense, and also sense it's been brought up I wish there were more faction specific weapons or, at the very least, the vilebloods had more weapons from their ranks.
>>47337983
I didn't know that, interesting. Makes sense since it was a church weapon though.
Do Bloodlickers take extra damage from both serrated and righteous weapons?
>>47337986
Vilebloods got four weapons that's a pretty good number
>>47338026
I'm pretty sure but it has been a long time since I experimented with them
>>47337986
But powder kegs had all the good stuff
>>47337300
>and an attitude of "difficulty to use = badassness of user"
The powder keg hunters were looked down on iirc and their coolest weapon is also by far the worst one in the game.
What would be the stats for the US navies railgun in your favorite setting?
>>47337053
>spams charged r2
never uses the follow-up r2
Weak.
>>47338112
Powder Kegs were not just looked down upon they were considered heretics
>>47337250
>Since none of them are magical
The Kirkhammer has a holy damage modifier.
>>47337032
I bet you're all kinds of fun when it comes to fantasy settings.
>>47338114
50 peasants
>>47337897
Wheel and Ludwig's deal righteous in both forms. Cane does righteous in sword form, as does Kirkhammer. Righteous damage deals extra against Cainhurst enemies.
Saw and Pick deal serrated in both forms. Cleaver does serrated in short form, and Cane does serrated in whip form. Serrated deals extra damage to the werewolf motherfuckers and a bunch of bosses.
>>47338114
5 Castle Walls of damage.
>>47338114
Peasant railgun. Look it up.
>>47338204
>okay everyone just stand in a straight line so we can use this weapon
Ineffective in a war setting, but probably OP as a siege/counter-siege weapon. Imagine either side having this shit at Minas Tirith.
>>47336794
>no blood/10
>no guiding moonlight/10
>no ayyy/10
>no pimpcane/10
>>47338311
>no ayy/10
Which one? The noodle arm on a drum stick or Great Milf One's parasite?
>>47338371
Ayy is always cauliflower.
>>47338406
I thought it was broccoli.
>>47338421
Broccoli is a big burly man with gold hair.
>>47337250
Burial Blade and Blade's of Mercy are arguably magical. They're made of space metal, scale in Arcane by default and can't have fire or bolt paper used on them
>>47338406
Well you still need the Kos parasite to go full cauliflower though.
>>47338421
Broccli is a stuttering mess of a man who's always sick with something and is afraid to use the teleporter.
>>47338442
They supposably stay sharp no matter what you do to them too.
>1d8 slashing versatile (1d10)
>1d8 bludgeoning versatile (1d10)
Easy
>>47336794
Counts as poorly made Improvised Weapon
HUGE penalty to hit
Only average improvised damage, due to lack of a shaped head
Why do people keep posting weapons with NO effort done to make a good striking surface and then asking what the stats should be?
I don't care if its a special material, you could make the fucking special material having a focused head for striking too!
![barclay%20monarch[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/1FCRENb.jpg "barclay%20monarch[1].jpg")
>>47338448
>and is afraid to use the teleporter
He's right to be, too.
>>47338503
The hammerhead isn't even a special material it's just stone. The kirkhammer was meant to be a symbolic weapon while Ludwigs holy blade was for actual hunting
>>47338172
Hey, I never said they were BAD, just that they'd be difficult to use effectively. I'd have no issue whatsoever with including trick weapons in a fantasy campaign (hell, some of 'em would even work in 40k)
>>47338503
This thing isn't for piercing armor, it's for bludgeoning huge beasts to death with a minimum of spilled blood, which eventually causes hunters a psychosis known as blood drunkenness.
>>47338534
That's fine then.
Yeah, improvised weapon sounds good, a la swinging a table or a chair.
>>47338503
Cheer up
>Oh is this some cool-ass weapon where you say the command words and it turns in to a gritty maul?
>Oh no, it's a scabbard
Not nearly as cool as I first thought.
>>47338503
>No striking surface
>No shaped head
It's basically a maul.
>>47338532
I suppose there is also the fact that you are killed and your copy carries on doing whatever you were suppose to do
>>47338503
Mr. Killjoy here everyone.
>>47338549
>This thing isn't for piercing armor,
I know, but if you want to use it for anything whatsoever than being a paperweight you still want to focus the impact onto a smaller area.
>it's for bludgeoning huge beasts to death
SPREADING THE IMPACT OVER A LARGER AREA means you are merely reducing the damage. The whole point of a "bulletproof vest" is that it spreads the ultrathin impact of a bullet across as wide an area as possible.
Especially trying to fight "huge beasts" (where you're already at a massive disadvantage) using a weapon with a huge impact area (which further reduces the damage) is stupid as hell.
I assume the warriors have some sort of super power, right? Yet, who the fuck cares? Anything with a smaller head would work better. Just use a metal-shod quarterstaff if spilling blood is so awful. Yes, being super-strong can ameliorate the disadvantages of using a retard's weapon, but if you can survive using a weapon designed for rule of stupid, you can survive ten times as well using a weapon that mildly takes the rules of physics into account.
>with a minimum of spilled blood
If spilling blood is awful, use a quarterstaff or something and jab them in the brain.
And before someone goes "lol autism" or so forth, the whole purpose of the thread is to analyze *the weapon* and stat it.
So, best case scenario: improvised blunt weapon.
>>47338621
The whole point of the thread was to subject the weapon to critique, actually. Read the thread.
>>47338558
I get good cheer from ragging on weapons with terrible striking surfaces, because the topic reminds me of mutilating gobbos in Dwarf Fortress.
>>47336794
Never liked the Kirkhammer.
Stat me the BEAST CUTTER.
>>47338631
I'd like to add that hammer in game is rarely more useful than just using the sword inside of it, in some cases it is actually much worse. So this anon has a point
>>47338566
Look up the Amygdalan Arm, Kos Parasite, Holy Moonlight Blade, Beast Claw, Logarius Wheel, and Bloodletter.
>>47338659
Heretic
hammer is best weaponfu
>>47338665
The charge R2 follow-up is amazing for PVP thought.
>>47338665
The Sword isn't symbolic, therefore it's objectively worse even if it's objectively better
Learn your hunting.
>>47338659
Like a lightsaber; awesome, but you're about as likely to cut your dick off as you are to hurt the guy you're fighting.
>>47338631
A metal-shod quarterstaff doesn't have nearly as much mass behind it. The whole point behind the Kirkhammer is "massive good, blood bad."
>>47338672
My guiding moonlight!
>>47338631
We're talking semi-undead beasts larger than elephants. If you came at it with a realistically sized hammer, it would be like attacking a human with a letter opener.
That said, the entire setting is entirely unrealistic. Common weapons include serrated sawblades, guns that shoot Mercury, and a cane that's also an elastic metal whip.
Less common are a giant buzzsaw on a stick, living arms of ancient evils, and katana that you stab yourself with to light on fire.
>>47338723
Only if you are a normie shit instead of someone hopped up on blood.
>>47338631
>you can survive ten times as well using a weapon that mildly takes the rules of physics into account.
But anon most of the bosses are eldritch monsters whose powers cancel the laws of physics. In fact, bloodborne has a stat called insight - basically the more insane you are the more powerful you hit things.
>>47338701
But I'm not some pussy ass church hunter I want my weapons to look awesome while still being dead killy
>>47338742
Best boss in the entire soulsborne series
>>47338750
Since you can refill Quicksilver by drawing blood from yourself I don't think it's just mercury.
>>47338765
>basically the more insane you are the more powerful you hit things.
But that's wrong
>>47338814
You use quicksilver bullets infused with your own blood, but in a pinch you can just use bullets made entirely out of blood.
>>47338812
Since DeS and BB were the best Miyazaki games I look forward to the next two games he's contractually obligated to direct for Sony.
>>47338814
True, it's supposed to be quicksilver cut with blood. That's why the blood drawn stuff doesn't carry over. You're just diluting your reserves to make it last longer.
The bullets aren't for hurting people though, they're for staggering somehow.
>>47338777
>>47338814
the bullets are infused with your own blood, then you use pure blood bullets as a last resort
>>47338814
Your body is filled with mercury from taking all that blood
>>47338840
He's said pretty explicitly he's currently working on a new IP. So we have to look forward to.
>>47338848
Tell that to that fucker in the church with the katana.
>>47338726
>A metal-shod quarterstaff doesn't have nearly as much mass behind it.
Hm? It has as much mass as the weaponsmith wants, and you can always increase the amount of mass desired. The important element is that its focusing the mass on a single impact point.
Remember, *anything* is better than purposefully widening the head for the randumbz. All you're doing is reducing the amount of damage dealt. Think of something like OP's design as a weapon that gives the enemy needless amounts of free armor. If you're a super duper fancy demigod, yes, you can use it and be effective. Guess what you could do just as well? Use a non-retarded design.
>The whole point behind the Kirkhammer is "massive good,
So make a weapon that focuses the mass in a useful direction. A quarterstaff can be built for *any level of strength imaginable*.
And again I'll point out, the purpose of the thread was to *stat and analyze the weapon.*
>>47338875
Ah yes Crowsteel the headghog a fight more difficult than most bosses
>>47338875
Crowsteel? He's supposed to be the toughest living Hunter besides yourself, so it's a little forgive able.
>>47338879
Alright, but tell me how your precious quarterstaff will deal with this.
>>47338893
>>47338899
>>47338750
>We're talking semi-undead beasts larger than elephants.
Literally all the more reason to use a smart weapon design than a stupid weapon design. Why would you prefer a weapon that will *weaken your hits*, against enemies already larger than you? You'd want every advantage possible, instead of designing weapons that will purposefully make you weaker.
>If you came at it with a realistically sized hammer, it would be like attacking a human with a letter opener.
On the contrary, against a foe bigger and tougher than you, you absolutely need a weapon that will focus your force onto a smaller area.
And a letter opener is relatively close to the weapon you want to kill armored humans with (an armpit shank).
>>4733876
>But anon most of the bosses are eldritch monsters whose powers cancel the laws of physics.
Evidently they still apply if winning involves applying kinetic force via leverage.
>>47338927
Exactly the same way the goofy rock rectangle weapon will do it (by caving in its skull or shattering its joints), only VASTLY more efficiently.
If you are facing enemies stronger than you, you want to use weapon designs that strengthen your hits, instead of weakening them
>>47338941
No, the idea is that a human being is basically incapable of hurting it with any conventional weapon because they're just not strong enough. They have to leverage the weight of the hammer to actually hurt the thing, because they on their own can't produce enough force.
>>47338765
>In fact, bloodborne has a stat called insight - basically the more insane you are the more powerful you hit things.
You could not be more wrong, I have no idea where you got this information
>>47339092
Yeah, having more insight actually makes the game harder. Though it also reveals secrets.
>>47339066
Conventional weapons work because they're better. If a human being cannot defeat them by using their swings to inflict more focused hits, then a weapon that will weaken their attacks isn't going to help.
>because they on their own can't produce enough force.
Exactly why they should use weapons that work instead of ones that don't.
When you're outmatched, you don't use weapons that soften your blows, you use weapons that strengthen and focus them. The bigger and stronger the enemy, the more you need to leverage the limited resources you do have.
>>47339031
So why so you use a hammer to build things and not a weighted stick?
>>47339066
>They have to leverage the weight of the hammer to actually hurt the thing, because they on their own can't produce enough force.
His point isn't that the weight is impractical, but that the shape is, you dimwit. Even just attaching a stone cone or pyramid (think the Church Pick) to one side of the hammer would already make it a lot more efficient since it'd focus all the force of the impact on the point.
>>47339150
It's not about swinging the hammer. It's about lifting it and then dropping it. Because you're never going to swing a weapon hard enough to hit them.
>>47339184
They got the heaviest material they can find, and attached the most of it in the most efficient way they could. shaping it a different way would either make it lighter or even more awkward to use.
>>47339168
The hammer focuses the impact onto the smallest area possible, retaining a bit of wideness to make sure it can still hit the nail comfortably (or whatever its trying to strike). It goes without saying that a warhammer is superior to a derphammer in this case. I generally advocate a quarterstaff though, since its a lot more versatile and better for people who don't plan on being able to take a lot of hits up close.
>>47339185
And lifting, then dropping a hammer with a focused point is more effective than lifting and dropping a hammer that presents a wide area of impact.
>>47339185
If you can lift it enough to drop it in the first place, then you can use a weapon that focuses said force in a more efficient way.
>>47339168
Because the hammer is trying to drive the nail in. Note how nails come to a point on the side that gets driven into the material.
Compare what happens if you hit a nail (Point down, head up) into a piece of wood and a brick (Flat side down) into a piece of wood, both with a claw hammer. Assuming you don't just shatter the brick, it's not going to sink very deep (Probably not at all) into the wood.
>>47339184
>effectiveness
Irrelevant.
Everyone arguing that the weapon is actually super reasonable for the task at hand is retarded. It's not true and nobody in-universe has any illusions that it's true.
The kirkhammer is a giant slab of a hammer because it's a metaphor in weapon form. That's it. Its quality as a weapon, in the eyes of Church Hunters, has more to do with its symbolic qualities than with martial effectiveness. That's why they also beat people to death with wagon wheels.
It's a weapon that works well enough, and acts as a symbolic representation of sin. Therefore more poetically minded Hunters use it. They could use a more effective weapon, but that isn't as poetic. The ones that care more about how effective it is have the Church Pick or Ludwig's Sword.
>>47339204
>and attached the most of it in the most efficient way they could
No they didn't, because the hammer is primarily a symbolic weapon, not a practical one. Changing the sides of the hammer to be pyramid/cone-shaped (the protrusion doesn't even have to be long) wouldn't have made it any more awkward or less heavy than it is. It's made the way it is because it's a symbolic weapon of the Church is meant more to convey a message through its design than be an absolutely practical weapon.
>>47339281
Everything you said is irrelevant to the argument, because it being a symbolic weapon was already clarified a long-ass time ago. The only reason people are arguing is because one guy is desperately trying to prove that it WAS an effective weapon in the context of the setting, when it isn't one even in it.
>>47339168
That's literally what a hammer is.
>>47339337
It's certainly effective enough, just not as effective as it could be.
>>47339356
I think he means just a heavy bar, where as a hammer has the weight at one end to increase momentum.
>>47339382
This-ish.
You could have a sharper profile, but the point of having a large head is that you got more leverage to move that weight around and that should meant it hits harder than all that weight spread evenly over a staff.
Which is why we hit nails with hammers instead of just heavy sticks.
>>47336794
15 dmg (sharp)
crit dmg (hp) x 3
str requirement 6
max str bonus +20
reach +1m
weight 1.5 kg
balance: grip
150 dmg (blunt)
crit dmg (hp) x 1.33
str requirement 50
max str bonus 300
reach + 1
weight 20
balance: front
>>47339635
The guy is right that making the face of the hammerhead even slightly pyramidal would dramatically increase performance, but if the Church did that it wouldn't look like a tombstone.
>>47336794
Just use stats for gada.
