Eternal Masters spoilers when? I want to see what my friend and I are getting into when we agreed to split a box.
>>46921284
I will never afford Dat FoW
Long term loss of money, trust me.
A lot of nice stuff is going to get reprinted, except for Tutors, Top, Mana Crypt, Liliana of the Veil, etc.
Basically the stuff that really needs reprinting won't be in the set.
>>46921284
MM2 set a bad precedent.
If you want to make your money back, at $250 a pop, you have to open a foil Wasteland or FoW. As far as the rest of the set, if you think WotC is going to put anything else of real value in EM, you are deluding yourself.
>>46921564
This.
Also get ready for epic draft archetypes like...
>Aggro
And
>Aggro
And
>Delver aggro (delver is however at uncommon :v)
>>46921564
This.
It's going to be a really expensive draft set that demand is going to be driven way up for because everyone wants the one in a million foil FoW. 98% of the cards will be unplayable in any constructed format. Hope you like gray ogres.
>>46921409
A friend said to buy them and hold them. Said to sell the packs back at 15 a pop to make a tidy profit.
I mean they should have learned from MM2
I mean, they must have..
right guys?
guys, please, tell me I didn't waste 250shekels for nothing
pleasehelp me
>>46921284
When does it come out?
>>46922028
Hahahahaha
DUMB
FILTHY
RETARDED
GOY
HAHAHAHAHA
>>46921409
>>A lot of nice stuff is going to get reprinted
No, it won't. Anything that sees even marginal play in Legacy and Vintage is at least a couple bucks. Do you seriously think they are going to print a set where you open a pack like this: Lightning Bolt, Ponder, Counterspell, Delver, Hymn to Tourach, Baleful Strix, Gitaxian Probe, Lotus Petal, Swords to Plowshares, Spell Pierce, Fireblast, Shardless Agent, Show and Tell, and a foil Duress?
Get ready for a steaming pile of shit set, with FoW and Wasteland propped on top, all in the name of "sealed game balance and those lovely fellas who play EDH"
>>46922158
>"sealed game balance and those lovely fellas who play EDH"
THIS
H
I
S
And a side of "Collectors interest!
>>46922158
But I want these packs for EDH...
Wizards has been channeling Games Workshop for a while now. They are not in the gaming business, but rather in the collectible business. If people want to play with the cards, that's fine. The only advantage they have over WH, is that Magic is actually a good game.
>>46922347
Then you should be the most pissed, since they are making you pay though the nose to play a casual format
>>46922158
The simple fact that they shifted an Uncommon to fucking MYTHIC should tell you that it's going to be shit.
>>46922365
Which makes us rightfully wrathful
>>46922028
You don't get it. They learned from MM1 that if they put too much value in the limited print run sets, stores will just open the boxes and sell the singles for profit. Or they'll sell the packs for more than MSRP. Wizards really got burned by MM1 so they aren't going to put a lot of value in the boxes. At least the drafting will probably be fun, they'll probably have cool archetypes like storm and astral slide be playable. I expect the money mythics to be something like...
>FoW
>Jace The Wallet Sculptor
>Inkmoth Nexus
>Sneak Attack
>Demonic Tutor
>Dark Depths
>Jitte
>Rishadan Port
>Time Spiral
>Ensnaring Bridge
And even that is pushing it for value. Everything else will be shitty edh generals and limited bombs. Rares will all be worth less than 30 bucks, with most of them being trash. I expect shitty upgrades to rare of cards like...
>Top
>Cabal Therapy
>Nimble Mongoose
>Tendrils of Agony
and a bunch of other semi playables like Aluren, Grindstone, and Smokestack. This guy at my LGS keeps trying to get people to go in on a case with him and people actually buy his bullshit when he says he knows FOR SURE that each box will be covered by the wastelands and FoW's alone and that there's no way Imperial Recruiter doesn't get reprinted.
>>46922472
How much are Tendrils of Agony each in America?
>>46922472
>stores will just open the boxes and sell the singles for profit
Stores will do this anyway. Stores will ALWAYS do this. WotC needs to come to terms with the fact that most stores are run by relentless scumbags.
I remember, way way back, when FtV Exiled was released, there were three LGSs in my city.
One had 35 preorders, one hat 81 and one had 20.
The one with 35 preorders received three boxes and gave them to the first three people that preordered. The one that had 20 didn't get one.
And the one with 81 preorders received 85 and not even a single one of these was handed to customers. They all were either sold on ebay, or broken up and sold as singles.
By now this is the only LGS still selling Magic and it also has a 33% markup on every single booster. MM2 was sold for nearly fourteen bucks a piece.
>>46922567
Like a dollar. They'll make it rare for "limited balance" and have shit like brain freeze and empty the warrens be uncommons. They're really just doing it to bring down the value of the rares.
>>46922590
I would fucking torch that place
>>46922590
Are you in straya or what? For me there wasn't near as much scalping of MM2 as there was for MM1. Hell I can still buy a MM2 booster for like 15 bucks.
>>46922472
You can count on at least 3 or 4 absolute pieces of shit mythics, in the Comet Storm, Tezzeret range in MM2, and at least 4 or 5 that are meh mythics - Elesh Norn, Kiki Jiki, Primeval Titan from MM2.
Considering the amounts of pure shit they have to choose from, I expect at least 1 mega shitty multi-colored legends from Legends, and at least a crappy mythic you need a playset of, like maybe Cursed Scroll.
And they will definitely reprint StP, just so they can write a whole piece on how it is way better than Path, and that you should be glad they put it in at rare.
>>46922607
A dollar? Really? Here in europe they are 5-10ยข each, and Storm upped to rare for "limited" is stupid, Storm requires commitment you can't usually get in limited
They'll do it, though
>>46922640
>and at least a crappy mythic you need a playset of
Like Force of Will. Which has the double-insult of an uncommon up-rarity to a mythic.
>>46922742
That's really fucked up, all thanks to the second market
>>46922764
We have to insure existance for the collectionits and a future for draft format
>>46922742
At least, you can sell the FoW and make some money back. What about a common upped to rare, that does fuck-all as a 1-of? Chain Lightning, anyone?
>>46921887
Delver is complete shit in limited, even in limited.
>>46922963
*even at common, rather
>>46922963
Without proper commitment, it's shit, but a 1 cmc clock can be pretty effective
Looking at MM2 there were like 6 rares with a price tag from 20-40 bucks before reprints were announced. I predict money rares to be...
>Wasteland
>Jitte
>Stoneforge Mystic (With an equipment draft subtheme)
> maybe (hopefully) Snapcaster Mage
>Vampiric Tutor
>Sylvan Library
>Time Warp
>>46922820
>Why'd you do that?
>We must secure the existence of our limited and a future for collectionists value
>>46923012
>predict money mythics
no money rares you dumb goy
>>46922996
The problem is that you just can't get the kind of critical mass of spells you need to reliably flip him in a good limited deck. If he flips, sure, a flying 3/2 for one mana is great. He's only going to flip a small percentage of the time, though, and a 1/1 for 1 isn't a real card on its own.
>>46923066
Absolutely true
Time for a boycott.
>>46922650
They won't do it for limited balance, it's nigh impossible to get enough cards to make a storm deck even when there's all of the pieces laying there to be taken advantage of (rituals are the key to storm, card draw being secondary)
They'll make the storm spells rare (if they're printed at all - very doubtful) because playing storm isn't playing magic according to wotc.
>>46923012
No fucking way that they reprint Jitte as anything other than a mythic.
And as far as Snapcaster, it is not as popular in Legacy and Vintage, outside of Miracles and a couple of other decks. And even then, they seldom show up as a 4-of. If they put it in EM, that is proof that this is nothing but a money grab.
(As if there is any doubt. I felt stupid even writing that sentence)
>>46923135
Damn, that's harsh, did they say that about Storm?
Mythics are about 1 in 8 packs
Most cards that need reprinting will be at mythic, upgraded or naturally at Mythic to begin with.
We won't see any noticable drops in prices. 95% will be Draft Chaff because Wizards honestly pretends this is a drafting set when Conspiracy exists.
>>46923178
It is their pinnacle of a mechanic they think is "problematic". Their scale for mechanics being bad is even called the "storm scale"
>>46923268
Reminder dredge is 14.88 in the scale!
>>46923247
I hate wizards pushing limited all the time. it's literally worst format ever. this year commander product will be a limitedset if they follow that path
>>46923779
Being "designed for limited" isn't even a problem, its when they "design a set for limited" and then have a low-power garbage set that nobody wants to draft.
>>46923779
They are not pushing limited. Limited is the excuse that they give us in order to justify having only 3 or 4 playable cards per expansion. A fully powered cube is just as fun as one of these supposedly balanced sets Wizards comes up with.
Wizards sells collectibles, not a game.
>>46923812
Exactly. Conspiracy was made for limited, but it is still fun to draft to this day. Modern Masters 1 and 2 were both garbage draft environmemts. Vintage Masters was actually good though.
It just sucks when they use limited as an excuse to make awful sets.
>>46923860
I drafted MM1 once and it was fucking awesome.
>>46923860
whoa buddy, modern masters 1 was a fantastic draft set
mm2015 was a complete 100% failure in every measurable way
>>46923860
>Vintage Masters was actually good though.
ULTRA
MYTHIC
EXTRA
RARE
>>46924108
Yes, and? that's like getting mad at Zendikar for having Hidden Treasures. They would make the draft worse if they were even at mythic.
>>46924345
ULTRA
MYTHIC
EXTRA
RARE
>>46923455
dredge.dec is much the same, like storm or oops all spells. You're playing at the outer fringes of magic, to where you're not even really playing the actual game.
>>46921284
This entire set seems pointless when they still refuse to print 99% of the cards that need reprinting because "muh agreements from 20 years ago"
>>46922590
This. It's why I have absolutely no fucking respect or sympathy for LGS' that focus on magic. Every last one of them are scamming scumbags who sell their singles at 30% more than even SCG and shit like selling items at double to quadruple MSRP
>>46923860
Fuck you, Modern Masters 1 was great. MM2 was shit, though, I'll give you that.
>>46922640
>Thinking comet storm is a shit mythic
Ishygddt
>>46925043
>playing the game in a certain way isn't playing the game
Sure.
>>46922764
Collectors come before players to wizards. What >>46922365 said was very true. Wizards is in the business of producing collectibles. They really don't care much about the actual game aspect these days
>>46925424
>They really don't care much about the actual game aspect these days
Why do people keep repeating this dumb shit? Wizards cares a lot about Limited and Standard, because those formats drive product. Just because they don't really give a shit anymore about the secondary market driven formats like Memedern and Legacy.
>>46925600
Because they do a fucking awful job if they do care about those formats considering they're terrible right now and standard last format was the worst in its history
>>46925656
Mirrodin and Urza's Saga Standard would like to have a word with you. Siege Rhino was obnoxious, but it didn't almost kill the goddamn game.
>>46925692
Higher prices than any standard before it.
100 dollar staples
The game is legit unplayable for the average person these days
>>46925717
and yet the game is more popular than it's ever been, and is turning record profits year over year.
>>46923779
The problem is not limited it's the fact that they balance for limited and standard which is hard to do.Standard is the problem.
>>46925656
No more dumb than swallowing that company line that only crappy cards make for good limited environments. If this were the case, a fully-powered cube would be atrocious to play, and it is not
>>46925361
Look here kiddo.
If you don't
>Play creatures for their CMC
>Tap them in combat fase
>Have your only wincon be creature damage
>Use buff spells
You're NOT playing mtg.
>>46926495
Kek
>>46921409
So long as it has Ichorid, Nether Shadow, Contagion, Cabal Therapy, Chain Lightning, Pyrostatic Pillar, Price of Progress, Cephalid Colisseum and Gemstone Mine I'll be happy.
I want my decks to be all non-foil modern border already.
>>46921311
You don't have $70? This printing will probably even be $50.
Jesus fucking christ. Poor fags are the worst.
>>46922028
They learned, they learned you will spend $250 on Gohei.
>>46926951
You'll be lucky if you get two of those.
>>46926985
Actually, you can find them on ebay for less than $60. My guess is they will be around $50 by the time EM comes out, and they might drop to around $40. Which is still expensive, considering you need a playset, but it is not outrageous for a 20 year old staple.
>>46922028
You done got Cucked hard bruv. Good job buying into Wizard's hype marketing. Next time be a little more careful, yeah?
>>46926951
Not there, evil card, not there evil card, rare, evil card not there, rare (collections dude), rare, mythic, rare and uncommon.
>>46928020
Fuck you MaRo.
>>46927103
>Thinking "I'd buy what's missing from Oloro and be a faggot with $40 FoWs"
>Realizing I'm missing 3 duals and 5 fetchlands anyway.
At least I reconsidered before taking out my credit card but why does this happen? "Oh this stupid expensive thing is now not so expensive, means I can buy all the other stupid expensive things that have gotten more expensive now". What fucking kike game are we part of?
>>46921284
Wait Force of Will has been bumped up to mythic? A card that's absolute fucking trash outside of matchups with combo decks is suddenly a fucking mythic in a set that's apparently being designed for draft purposes? This is so Beanie Babies it hurts to even watch.
>>46928674
Oy veeeey you dumb goy, it cannot be uncommon, it a bad pick!!
heheheh
>>46921284
This is the best time to get judge foil Force of Wills.
Managed to grab one for $300 (Cash) and trade another for $400 (Cards).
Reminder that the price of legacy will only go up with this. Modern Masters never brought Goyf's price down, so it's naive to think that Eternal Masters will bring the price of Force of Will down.
>>46928935
MM1 and MM2 in fact made it drop a little. Right after MM1, the price of the Future Sight actually increased in price--not completely unexpected. But as far as the other versions, it has been pretty stable at 150.
I think, and this is just me speculating, that the price of Goyf is artificially inflated. It is kept as a sort of Golden Idol of the Secondary Market, a reminder of what the first C in CCG stands for. The price of FoW seems more realistic. When it was announced that it was going to be released in EA, it dropped from 100 to 80 in 2 weeks. And it looks like it keeps going down. It is now at around 60 on ebay. For some reason, people expect FoW to be readily available after EA. Or maybe SSG and all the other big sharks are just buying a lot, knowing the price will spike back to 100 territory in July.
Just a quick reminder that since Snappy got a judge foil printing it probably won't be in Eternal Masters. I can't remember the source but iirc WOTC set a precedent of not immediately reprinting judge foils to maintain the pricetag for the sake of judges.
>>46925755
Because casuals love buying fat packs. But if you want to believe 1000 dollar decks that rotate every 6 months is a feasible business plan despite history proving otherwise, go ahead. I'll buy your FoW's for a quarter after the game finally kowtows to hearthstone (which took only 2 years to make more money anually than Magic has in 20 years)
>>46929323
The prices of modern rose after MM.
>Increase demand by publicizing a big set you intend to make so it's easier to get into modern
>don't reprint necessary cards
>make the set super limited edition print run so almost no new copies actually make it into circulation
>but since this set was popular and advterised, lots of people wanted into modern
>demand now increases heavily thus actually RAISING prices because the mass amount of demand utterly overshadows what small amount of reprints went into circulation
These sets will never EVER work as long as they keep trying to obey the collectors market. Wizards REALLY needs to pick a side. Either go balls deep on collectors and just make the actual game a side thing or actually make the game accessible and stop kowtowing to every fat 40 year old engineer who whines about his card collection devaluing.
Honestly at this rate I expect Magic to eventually die off due to the changing markets and WOTC's inability to adapt to the changing market because they were so used to being the top dog for ages
>>46923066
>implying blue won't have instants and sorceries up the whazoo
I think Wizards didn't see much return from FTVs and Duel Decks, as the card pool was perfectly known by the players and the two of three chase cards they had in each wouldn't drop in price, but the other chaff would plummet.
If they tried to make a set without caring about draft I think they could cram better average value in each booster, and make people interested in playing a $10 Slot Machine happier.
>>46930042
>Uncommon ponder
>Rare bstorm
doubt.png
>>46921284
Mythics:
Force of Will
Liliana of the Veil
Jace, the Mind Sculptor
Stoneforge Mystic
Snapcaster Mage
Show and Tell
Sneak Attack
Umezawa's Jitte
Kaalia of the Vast
Mana Drain
Karakas
Grim Tutor
Mana Crypt
Batterskull
Dark Depths
Rares:
Sensei's Divining Top
Wasteland
Verdant Catacombs
Scalding Tarn
Marsh Flats
Misty Rainforest
Arid Mesa
Rishadan Port
Vampiric Tutor
Necropotence
Phyrexian Altar
Scroll Rack
Damnation
Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
Gifts Ungiven
Life From the Loam
Wrath of God
Exploration
True-Name Nemesis
Jevela, Nephalia's Scourge
Karona, False God
Psychatog
Maro
Gamble
Hymn to Tourach
Lin-Sivvi, Defiant Rebel
Counterbalance
Land Tax
Sylvan Library
Mindslicer
Ichorid
Flusterstorm
Goblin Recruiter
Hermit Druid
Birthing Pod
Doubling Season
Cursed Scroll
Upheal
Golgari-Grave Troll
AEther Vial
Green Sun's Zenith
Teferi, Temporal Achmage
Zur the Enchanter
Jace's Archivist
Windfall
Oath of Druids
Ancient Tomb
Lotus Petal
Cabal Therapy
Terminus
Past in Flames
Glimpse of Nature
Cavern of Souls
You're welcome, faggot.
>>46932220
I can't find the source for this on imgur like people suggested it was, was that post deleted?
>Hymn to Tourach upped to rare from common
I don't get it, although I haven't played in years. Why can only rare cards be good?
>>46932220
>Sensei's Divining Top
>Stoneforge Mystic
>Snapcaster Mage
>Show and Tell
>Sneak Attack
>Batterskull
>Kaalia
>Mana Drain
>Karona, False God
>Golgari-Grave Troll
>Mindslicer
>Lotus petal
>Cabal therapy
>Hermit druid
>Vial
>Grave troll
Bonus track
>Mana Drain and Cursed Scroll
>Not on the list
Doublebonus track of hatred
>MaRo
>>46932220
>My dad works for WOTC.
>>46932463
Eternal semite.
Not even /pol/ son, you just gotta learn 'bout them kikery in mtg.
>Expensive card
Rare!
>Very expensive
Mythic!
>Good card AKA """Complicated"""
Rare or higher
>Accidentally good card at common
Banned ;)
>>46932463
That's NWO for you
>Hurr Durr NWO only affects common
Where the fuck do you think all those effects go?
>>46932463
I imagine that hymn at common would just trash the limited format.
>>46933221
Yes, and?
There is still uncommon.
Also POWERED formats are FUN.
SPECIALLY WHEN I'M PAYING X2 AND UP TO X10 THE STANDARD FUCKING PRICE.
>>46933221
If everything in limited is on a similar power level it would be as glorious. It would also mean that the contents of the packs were worth the high price tag
>>46929323
I've been bulking up on force of wills, fully anticipating another tarmogoyph. It's in my best interest that they get cheap now.
God help everyone who didn't get them if the make Eternal a format.
>>46932220
FUCK OFF
CURSED SCROLL IS RESERVED LIST
>>46922472
>>46926951
I just hope there will be a Elves archetype in draft. Need my little green men in foil.
I think I've come to a realization.
If WotC won't abolish the Reserved List because collectors would whine, we just have to destroy the collectors, or their collections.
>>46932220
>Oath of Druids at rare
Know how I know you've never played Vintage?
>>46936107
would eternal be legacy without reserved list then? Sounds like burn would be king
>>46936174
They aren't going to make a new format named Eternal.
The cards being defended as "collector's items" is fucking retarded anyway. The demand for duals is so people can actually play competitively, not so they can admire how old they are.
>>46936107
If I ever won the lottery I would spend the money buying every Underground Sea and Volcanic Island and removing them from the market, vaulting them and making them permanently unavaliable until the RL is abolished.
>>46936388
I would burn them and send the videos to WotC. One at a time.
>>46936388
>>46936414
Actually, if I had enough money, I would just work on making fakes. Flood the market with tons and tons of fakes. Help Chinaman take over the world.
>>46932220
>Cursed Scroll
>No Rishadan Port
Pffft yeah ri-
>Kaalia of the Vast and Karakas at Mythic
>Golgari Gravetroll and Maro at rare
FML this is definitely the real thing
>>46922472
>Aluren
Not even anon, it's reserved.
>>46936470
You do know chinese bootlegs are a stereotype because they do it on purpose, don't you?
That little bit of error that makes shit noticeably fake is one of the many things that makes suing them hard as fuck.
>>46935625
>What is Tempest Remastered
>>46938553
>Online
>Counting for the list
how to spot a retard 101
>>46936470
And remember son, you're a soldier of the free market
>Make demand
>Then promise to never satisfy demand
>Cry when you get free market'd
Fuck the rares and mythics. All I really care about is common reprints for my paper pauper decks. I'm fine with some being shifted to uncs even. I wanna see shit like
Oubliette
Cuombajj Witches
Chain Lightning
Chainer's Edict
Quirion Ranger
Vault Skirge
Ichor Wellspring
Mutagenic Growth
Gitaxian Probe
Counterspell
Delver of Secrets
Relic of Progenitus
Flayer Husk
Crop Rotation
I won't be interested unless some of this is in the set.
>>46938913
>counterspell
It wont be reprinted, its been attached to a standard lore character and it wont be reprinted in standard. Enjoy your promo art high tide with the modern boarder plus foil mark.
Can't wait to see the draft archetypes. Hopefully we get Rebels as one
>>46939296
>Enjoy your promo art high tide with the modern boarder plus foil mark.
I won't really. I've never liked foils ever since they started with that dumb shit back in Urza Block. It makes the cards more difficult to see/read when on the table and they curve up something fierce after a few years. I've been throwing my foils at everybody and their mom for almost 2 decades now.
>>46939951
no no sorry, i mean the foil mark that verifys it a real magic card. That little sticker circle on the bottoms of rares.
>>46940440
>That little sticker circle on the bottoms of rares.
Oh that, Don't mind those. But yeah, if they bump stuff like FoW up to mythic (which is another dumb ass introduction to the game) then it wouldn't surprise me if they bump commons up to rare.
I just don't get it sometimes. I mean, if wizards only makes money from selling packs and products wouldn't it make sense to reprint good commons and uncs in a set like this. I mean, they want people to buy their cards form them right? Not from the secondary market.
>>46921284
I play mostly legacy (I have duals, FoWs, other staples already) so I'm hyped about this. I probably won't buy anything since I already have pretty much all the staples, but it's nice that they drop in price so more people can get into the format.
>>46940609
I doubt we'll see many good reprints. These sets are created for drafts so you'll see many rares for the different draft archetypes. The fact that some of the rares are good for constructed is just a nice bonus
>>46940609
duals already spiked again when it was spoiled, +$100 for the blue ones. i would expect revised blue duals to hit $500 when the set actually releases.
we aren't getting any new blood into the format, bro.
>>46940564
The idea is that you buy a box, get the one of 5 mythics that are good and hope its the gangbuster of the set or the #2. Thats how it looks like to me anyways.
>>46940609
This is for edh players like me to get us buying packs because standard is so weak.
Why not make this set MTGO only like vintage masters? Eternal formats are dead in paper, no one is gonna start paper legacy because of this set
>>46940769
Probably for that reason: In hopes that people get more involved in eternal formats with a slightly-more-readily available supply of legacy staples.also probably for draft value
>>46940769
actually legacy is pretty alive.
the lgs i attend puts 40 people each week, everyone with high-end decks
>>46936174
Burn doesn't get appreciably better than it was. There are still turn 1 combo kills and miracles loses practically nothing. The amount of decks that dont care about shocks damage or can mitigate it with Jitte or Batterskull is very high.
>>46940829
>miracles loses practically nothing
Actually miracles only loses Karakas and duals (but they don't care for duals that much, you can comfortably play miracles with 1-2 tundras)
>>46940609
>but it's nice that they drop in price so more people can get into the format.
I really doubt that cards like FoW will drop in price. We've seem how great that worked for Tarmogoyf.
I'd really like this set to be gud but let's face it, it'll be crap.
>>46940809
How long will that last? Duals are so expensive now that only rich folks can afford getting started today. This set won't bring in any new players. If anything, it'll only make legacy more expensive. I'd rather have another MM set for paper
>>46940870
You don't lose karakas its not on the reserved list. The deck also already functions perfectly fine fetching basics most of the time to hedge around blood moon.
> mfw I know a place I can get these at msrp
>>46941167
>mfw you brag about it like an ass of actually telling everyone instead
>>46941167
>tfw only lgs in town always has at least 50% higher prices than msrp
Modern masters sold for around $20/booster. I doubt I'll even crack some
>>46940961
Oh shit, right.
Yeah they don't lose anything.
>>46941227
Hot damn! My lgs's owner is all about the profit but hes not that kind of asshole who charges more then msrp and he doesn't crack stuff meant for preorders. Those stores sound so sucky and horrible.
>>46941575
They're real jews honestly. It's cheaper to buy online and pay shipping than go to their store. They're probably taking advantage of being in a small town with no competition
>>46925212
Wow, I feel pretty bad for you bro. I live in Indianapolis and there's so many gaming shops that all focus on MTG, meaning the second you try to screw over your customers everyone will leave because there's another place less than 10 miles down the road. None of them can afford to be dicks like that.
>>46921284
..for some reason i don't like that this Force of will art implies magic instead of.. well.. Force of will.
>>46929435
It was the RPTQ promo, not a judge promo. You're probably right, but for the wrong reasons.
>>46936107
WotC has made it clear that it's Hasbro's legal team calling the shots on the reserved list, and even if they tried ignoring it they'd be shut down from printing it by every big name in the business, unless they're given recompense that hasbro isn't willing to shell out.
>>46941770
Why does Hasbro care so much? What do they gain from the RL?
>>46936174
A lot of the combo loses superfast mana, goodbye LED.
Brainstorm gets quite a bit worse when you need to pay two life if you want to get 2 colors.
Price of Progress is really brutal.
Fair three color decks get muscled out of the format, delver too
Death and Taxes loses nothing, its worst matchup, Elves is hit really hard, and wasteland gets a lot better.
>>46940609
I just have DnT, and I think its great that they are gonna reprint my entire deck, but I really would like if they devalued other decks at the same time, so i'm not locked into it for eternity.
>>46940829
Are you serious? Every Delver becomes unplayable when one has to shock themselves for 3-8 every game without duals.
>fetch shock play delver untapped shock bolt your SFM umm ill daze that pick up shock play it untapped it next turn because you need keep counter mana up/dig with brainstorm up gg g2?
>>46941787
The RL is good for business. Imagine a best-case scenario where they come up with a From the Vault that contains a playset of all the RL cards, with new art and all that jazz. It is widely distributed, and it costs $600. That is a pretty steep price, but it automatically allows you to play Vintage and Legacy. That will make those formats increase dramatically in number of players. Some people will probably stop playing Standard and sealed altogether.
If you are one of those people, how many cards will you need to buy from then on? 1 or 2 playsets a year, maybe? On some years, none at all. You are not cracking packs, Wizards makes no money off you.
Remember, in their view they are selling collectibles that people can game with, not the other way around.
>>46942113
>The RL is good for business
No.
it's not.
Selling 600 cookies at 1 euro is better than selling 1 cookie at 600 euros.
Because you can get reliable income with millions upon millions of cheap cookies vs one expensive cookie.
>>46942328
You are actually making my case for me. If people were sold the nice, expensive cookie, they might not buy any more cookies. If you have no choice, you will keep buying the crappy, cheap cookies forever.
In the long run, adhering to the RL is good for business.
>>46942450
>In the long run, adhering to the RL is good for business.
You cannot read it seems.
RL is AWFUL for business, just ask SCG.
>>46942551
It seems you are the one with cognitive issues. WotC does not sell singles. They only care about their price inasmuch as it affects sales of their products. Massive reprint of old staples would result in a quick influx of cash--which they don't need at the moment--and a loss of potential clients, which is actually a bad thing for business.
How the RL affects companies like SCG is a different issue altogether. Try to keep up.
>>46942724
>WotC does not sell singles
I have a question: Where you think singles come?
>>46942775
From a magical place called GetAClueLand.
>>46942724
>RL is no more
>I can sell duals at 50 dollars
>Hence I buy many duals
>Hence everyone buys duals
>Demand goes up
>Store buys more boxes to unpack duals
>?????
>More packs are sold
Whew, thank god I'm a doctorate in economics.
>>46942851
>>Everybody has every card they need.
>>Nobody buys more cards.
It might still not be too late to get your tuition money back, doctor
>>46942929
>everyone has to buy cards to get everything they need
>cards are only available in packs
>new cards come out so more packs need to be bought
Maybe you should get ahold of your handler again, she's probably worried
>>46942929
>Thinking human greed has any stop
>Thinking cheaper prices won't bring more and more people and hence keep the game "alive"
>Thinking people won't draft anymore with the highly powered sets
>Thinking packs are an infinite timeless supply
>Thinking satisfying the demand is at any level bad
I see, it's another "/tg/ is populated by SJW and women's study college students episode", I guess the little baby thinks proxies are meany and evil too, don't he? Go donate more for bernie bernout.
>>46942982
He's a retarded that doesn't understand free market, even wotc knows the RL is bad for business(in the selling packs side) but good for the confidence side(however this will kill the game in the long run)
>>46925600
>memedern
I don't really understand why people call Modern this. Is it just that fucked right now?
I mean, if I'd started any time after Mirrodin, which I did, and I hate the money to afford good cards instead of the cards that I have and like, I'd love to play in a format where I could actually use them.
>>46943030
Always was, it was like a meme.
It went stale and people keep forcing it.
>>46942983
>[Unsolicited Opinions on Liberals??]
You sure hate Sanders a lot for somebody who thinks that SJWs are just muh boogeywomyn.
>>46943077
>thinks like a liberal
>Acts like a liberal
>Knows economy as good as a liberal
guess how it goes son.
>>46925717
>100 dollar staples
I wonder what would happen if all cards over 6 CMC were rare, all cards over 4 CMC were uncommon, and all cards 3 or less were common.
>>46943129
Does this mean lands are common since they have no CMC (hence CMC=0)?
If so, the game would be extremely "competitive" oriented and casual stuff like EDH would get shafted.
>>46943161
Probably on both counts, but according to this thread EDH is getting shafted anyway, so what's the big deal?
>>46941799
I think the problem is that, once the format realizes they can't just walk into price of progress and wasteland, it adjusts easily. Two color decks are perfectly viable, Miracles already does it. PoP and Wasteland are only good if the meta allows them to be, and since the meta loses the tools that allow them to be, they won't actually be as good.
>>46942051
Since when was delver the only deck in the format?
>>46942983
Wait now I'm confused... you're anti-Bernie but pro-proxy, cheapening the price of goods, etc?
I mean I know Trump fans are third position Nazis more than liberal democrats but I didn't think you'd be so blatantly left leaning whilst condemning the other guy. And I'm saying that as a left leaning guy who would say to let Chinaman flood the market with counterfeit goods, forcing wizards to cheapen the price of Magic all together, and maybe even giveup rareity entirely and just make all cards common and thereby equally viable to pull randomly. (Which draft players would love and let's face it... limited format is the only REAL format. Legacy doesn't actually exist nor would we want it too, and Type 2 is the most money intensive.)
>>46943489
It wasn't or isn't, but its variations compose a shitload of the meta.
>>46943564
Proxies are the natural evolution of the free market you mogrel.
>Make demand
>Never satisfy demand
>Someone else does
>Roads as a service
This is free market.
>Make demand
>Never satisfy demand
>Ban people from satisfying demand
>Roads made by the big gov
This is not free market
>>46943603
So wait... you're saying wizards themselves is big government?
Cause you know God damn well wizards is going to try and prevent proxies from making it pass round one of any tournament scene. The only time you could get away with proxies is locals which would be akin to your libertarian utopia of some hick town in the boonies where your loving wife of ten years is Cousin Sara.
But at the same time you're judggling cognitive dissonance justifying a private institution being the cause of your problems. It's almost like how you libertarians don't have an answer for why you hate the federal reserve, yet love natural formation of monopolies. The government doesn't prop up the fed, the fed basically owns the government because it got there on it's own accord. If we were a state first and capitalism second, they never would've let that happen.
Not trying to go off the rails into some argument about banking cartels or socialism versus capitalism but I'm just taking your own words to the end result. WOTC is the bad guy here by your own logic.
>>46943728
>>46943564
Didn't you use to post the naruto guy?
>>46943728
>>prevent proxies from making it pass round one of any tournament
I know a couple of guys that play in all kinds of pro tournaments that use proxies. And they have gotten their decks checked a few times. I think we are rapidly approaching the point where checking for proxies is so time consuming that it is not feasible in large tournaments
>>46943572
>The amount of decks that dont care about shocks damage or can mitigate it with Jitte or Batterskull is very high.
Does there being a lot of delver decks somehow disqualify this statement? Or are you saying that burn becomes better than delver? In which case, are you neglecting UR Delver?
>>46943834
Proxy checking in a big tournament is never worth it time-wise.
Big tournament as in 20+ people, at least even our 8 man legacy tourneys in shop tend to last 5~h or so (at about 1h:15 per round tops), if you have like 50% of people saying "poxy check judge pls", shit gets time-consuming as fuck.
>>46925330
It is a shit mythic. It only existed at that rarity for limited purposes, because it's really strong there. It's Tibalt-tier.
>>46943129
>using cards over 5 CMC
There would be no purpose for printing rares.
>>46937014
The reason nobody sues the chinks is because it would do literally nothing. China has no copyright laws.
The biggest Chinese game companies make pure ripoffs of western games, down to using the actual art and assets from them.
>>46944292
Precisely.
>>46941217
It's unlikely any of you would be able to make use of my knowledge. Its a small record store in my relatively remote area that also stocks some nerd supplies, magic booster and the most popular comic books etc. They just dont know fuckall about what theyre selling, jut sell the most recent set. I actually got mm1 packs there for a bit under msrp
>>46942113
This is implying that because I can't buy Legacy staples that I'm going to buy their next shitty set. Not satisfying my demand to play Legacy doesn't make me want to play Standard.
I think there are plenty of people simply not buying cards right now because of the Reserved List.
>>46944276
Comet Storm is glorious in EDH.
>>46944606
The reserve list has been around for 20 years. If you have not bought cards in that period of time, and Magic is doing fine, I don't see how Wizards cares about you as a potential client.
Not saying it is not a valid reason not to buy new cards. But it is time to face reality. Short of a cataclysmic event, the RL is here to stay
>>46932463
>Why can only rare cards be good?
Because WotC has gone full jewmode long ago, and has been richly rewarded for doing so.
It's hilarious how well the Duels rule of card limits being tiered by rarity (only 1 of any mythic allowed in a deck, only 2 of any rare, etc.) fits the game, even though Maro swears up and down that they don't "use rarity as a balancing mechanism". Somehow, for some crazy reason, all the objectively most powerful cards end up being rare and mythic anyway. Must be a coincidence.
>inb4 lighting bolt
If Lightning Bolt was printed today for the first time, you know it would be at least a rare.
>>46925755
If you want to make the "they're making a lot of profit so everything's going great" argument, I guess Hearthstone is objectively the best card game in the world then. After all, it makes the most money.
>>46925600
>Just because they don't really give a shit anymore about the secondary market driven formats like Memedern and Legacy.
Only reason those are secondary market driven in the first place is because Wizards DOESN'T FUCKING SELL PRODUCT FOR THEM.
>>46922365
>The only advantage they have over WH, is that Magic is actually a good game.
I wish Magic was bad. If it was genuinely bad as a game, I could just ignore it. But it has to be a good game that's impossible for anyone without a CF sponsorship to afford to play in any serious capacity.
splinter twin and deceiver exarch confirmed
>>46926985
I remember when I bought my playset of them for 60. Back when it was $15 because people hadn't quite caught on to it's value.
>>46922028
Enjoy your mythic Tendrils of Agony!
>>46932463
What are you talking about? Commons are as good as mythic, otherwise no one would use them and we sure don't want to print useless cards!
>>46926985
>You don't have $70?
Paying 70 dollars for a single card in a single card game is insanity. Normally you get the whole game for less than that. 70 dollars is what a box that has a playset of every Magic card would be approximately worth.
TCGs are only possible because people have an insanely bad sense of value.
>>46947982
>70 dollars is what a box that has a playset of every Magic card would be approximately worth
How are you arriving at this figure? How do you know what every magic card is worth? Are you just talking about the cardboard that they're printed on?
Magic cards are not precious metals or petroleum, they don't have intrinsic value. They're worth whatever people are willing to pay.
>>46948122
>How are you arriving at this figure?
Because when you look at the price tags of various computer games, board games and (non-collectible) card games, you'll see that most of them are under that amount; as in, you get a complete game for that amount of money. It follows from that directly that the most you should ever pay for any game is about 60-70 bucks.
A "complete Magic game" would be a box that has a playset of every card.
>>46948122
>They're worth whatever people are willing to pay.
That is not true and has never been true, for anything. The worth of a thing is what you SHOULD pay for it. It is entirely divorced from what some stupid asshole is willing to pay for it.
>>46948180
Apples and oranges. Paying 60 for a computer game gives you the complete game because it's all one discrete package. Magic, as a game, is not a discrete package, it's a conglomeration of rules that are represented by and interacted with via cards. Saying that Magic, as a game, should have a defined price tag is a meaningless statement.
I'm not disagreeing that 70 is a stupid price for a single card, I'm just saying there's no real way to regulate it unless Wizards themselves decides to start selling cards directly, which won't happen.
>>46940769
paper vintage is very alive in Europe. Legacy is alive even in poor Europe countries like Poland and Baltic ones.
Especially Germany, Italy, Switz, etc
>>46948205
What are you talking about? Except for things that have intrinsic value like natural resources (wood, metal, oil), the price of literally any market good is decided by supply and demand.
>casually watching netflix and eating an eclaire
>this spongebob episode called "The Card" comes on
>spongebob is a casual playing with pre-made decks and having fun
>suddenly the store owner flaunts some gloss and shows him a mythic rare that's unbuyable out of his private collection
>spongebob proceeds to raid the store, opening every single pack but one, hoping to crack something awesome
>has absolutely no luck
>patrick opens a single pack, snipes it
>spongebob proceeds to beg and embarrass himself to try and get it, while patrick has no idea about the cards value
>patrick laughs, eventually gives it to him
>the story ends with both friends in the same card store, patrick buys some packs and cracks 4 more
This is a perfect analog for how eternal masters is going to work.
>>46948334
This is how the entire game works.
As a drafter exclusively, I don't understand why they can't just print mid-to-high power cards across all rarities, all the time.
Tireless Tracker shouldn't be rare. You need 4, it's not going to win games all by itself. It's an element of a type of deck, even if it's an important one. It should not be the same rarity as Thing in the Ice, a card sporting much more raw power, and one that you really should be building around to get the most out of it.
>>46940769
Saturday legacy routinely fires with 30+ people here, and Thursday usually has at least 12. Different groups too. It does help that all the old dudes lend out decks though.
>>46949030
>>Tireless Tracker shouldn't be rare.
These are the fail-safes that they have installed in the game. In the event of investigate-based decks becoming tier1, Tracker is probably going to be a key element. If a significant number of players want to play that deck, they need these 4 rares to make it work. Price goes up, more packs need to be open.
I think that UG Madness was probably the last time that a deck with essentially no rares could dominate standard. Even Affinity needed the rare Ravagers. These two decks are not good for business in general. Decks chock full of rares, specially if they also need lots of rares for their manabase, are Wizard's objective.
>>46949324
I understand that, but to be honest, it shouldn't be.
>>46949343
Wizards treat Magic as a collectible first, game second.
Otherwise, the game would probably end up as a LCG. Which would be fine by me. Hasbro brass surely disagrees.
>>46949485
I kinda feel that LCGs are objectively better, but I do like the random aspect of the game.
The deck that I have was built because those were the cards that I played with and liked, and on some faggoty level, my deck is special to me. It probably wouldn't have happened if I'd had access to all the cards at once.
At the same time, collectors should be shot if they're going to get in the way of fun. The RL should be dumped at the side of the road like a hitchhiking hooker.
>>46949533
I'm curious, which LCGs do you play?
I play LotRs and Netrunner. These have a sufficiently large card pool already that it is really hard to run into the same decks over and over again, like in Magic. Specially in LotR, where the missions are so diverse that it is impossible to beat them all with just one deck.
>>46949615
Honestly, my experience with actual LCGs is limited, as I've played Netrunner a little bit, liked it well enough, but never really got attached to own anything of my own. I really started realizing the philosophy of LCGs from Guild Wars 1 PvP, which I found gave me a very similar methodology of figuring out skills, builds, and research on the metas. The only difference is that you can't patch a card game.
>>46936109
>oath of druids busted in limited
>oath of druids needs a reprint
The set has those two standards for reprinting cards and oath, if printed, would sit fine at rare. Its not like vintage when you just turn 2 oops out an emrakul reliably
>>46950296
Oath is also symmetrical, so if you are up a critter, your opponent gets to oath. It is actually a pretty crappy limited card.
>>46950296
>oath
>in vintage
>to emrakul
Not only you never played Vintage, you don't even know the top decks... Why do you then talk about Vintage at all?
>>46952680
???
Oath is definitely a thing in vintage
I think most people use griselbrand rather than emrakul tho
>>46952787
Yes, it's a thing. It used to top tournaments very very consistently and still does to extent.
It was never used for Emrakul in Vintage.
>>46947982
>TCGs are only possible because people have an insanely bad sense of value.
THIS.
Mostly 'mericans.
>Pre SCG kikeing
Duals at <40 euros each, except underground (lol reanimator)
>Post SCG kikeing
100+ cheapest one is 40+
>>46948205
>what some stupid asshole is willing to pay for it
I think this is the key point of your statement.
The game is infested with stupid assholes. Enough of them who are willing to pay ridiculous prices for things. While I condemn the prices in this game I accept the reality because that's who your audience is - and one thing I've learned is that you can't change people no matter how hard you try.
The problem isn't that there are people willing to exploit retards. The real problem is that the general community is so fucking hug-box that the person who stands up and says, "These prices are fucking bullshit" is ridiculed rather than acknowledged for saying something perfectly reasonable.
Everyone has access to the Chinese proxies, yet they don't use them. There is absolutely no fucking way to tell the fakes from the real ones - at least the ones I got; the fucking Tundras are actually identical because I own an actual Tundra to compare. And yet, nobody uses them; the practical substitute. Because we're all fucking stupid retards.
Don't feel too bad. Every community is actually mostly idiots. Sports, athletics, book clubs, you name it. Even organizations like Mensa or Toastmasters or charities dedicated to doing good are full of idiots.
>>46949030
Tireless Tracker should be rare. It's card advantage can easily win you the game in limited.
Declaration in Stone shouldn't be rare and Dual lands that don't enter the battlefield tapped shouldn't be rare.
>>46952892
>It was never used for Emrakul in Vintage.
doubt.jpg.
I know it's not in flavour anymore, but you have to proof there never was a Oath deck with Emrakul as a finisher.
>>46957203
Those chinese duals are the best proxies I got. Mainly because the old cards were kinda crappy in the first place. How do you make them look more ragged though? Mint duals are suspicious as fuck.
im more worried about the limited design.
what will be different after VMA?
we will have to see storm or some kind of combo
elves will be in
black will have discard and reanimation
red will have burn
what is 'eternal' in white?
>>46922418
An uncommon printed over 20 years ago that's one of the most powerful and sought after cards in its format? Imagine that.
>>46922764
Pretty sure an unconditional counterspell that can be played for a no-mana alternate cost would at least be printed at rare if it came out today.
>>46923834
What would Magic look like if it were a game?
>>46958719
>>46958650
The only reason this is mythic is to limit the number of new copies in circulation even further. Nothing about a good counterspell feels mythic at all. It should have been a rare at most.
>>46953959
Gotta love that creditcard economy. Thankfully prices over here aren't as nutterbutters.
... yet.
>proceeds to nervously check MCM
>>46958785
In an extreme case, a LCG. In a less extreme one, smaller sets where pretty much every card has a deck where it can be used.
Unfortunately, collectibles are a much bigger cash cow than LCGs. Magic these days resembles in some aspects the comic book industry of the 90s - perceived value and speculation over substance.
>>46957694
This is why there's the good old saying "/tg/ is bad at magic".
I'm sure you'll find some random net-deck with Emrakul and oath in it.
However, it was never used as a finisher in an oath deck that was attending any tourney. Oath decks simply had much better choices and almost always will as far as Vintage goes.
Emrakul does pretty much nothing for you in Vintage, it achieves nothing, it's just a useless beat-stick.
It's strange I even have to discuss Emrakul in terms of vintage, the card is absolute garbage in Vintage - always was.
>>46962131
>Emrakul does pretty much nothing for you in Vintage, it achieves nothing, it's just a useless beat-stick.
This.
>Cheat emrakul vs dredge
Get hit in the face with zombies and ichorids and die like a bitch
>Cheat emrakul vs gush
Combo'd and dead
>Cheat emrakul vs control
Jace unsummon
>B-b-but you kinda win vs workshops!
>>46923178
>>46923268
It's about the likelihood of being brought back for new cards - nothing more, nothing less. Banding is an 11, for example, just because it's barely fits on cards.
>>46932220
>he still thinks the fake leaked list is real
>>46962316
I wish it was fake though.
>>46962378
Do you mean you wish it were real? Because the fact that cursed scroll is on the list confirms that it's fake.
>>46962174
>>46962131
Emmy acruelly did see some tournament play in oath decks when the card was first released, because people can't resist the big meat bat. But then it was dropped because we got better options. But griz didn't come along until a when after emmy. Until gris some people still played golden gun oath. Gris was a game changer for oath
>>46963247
*acruelly = actually what the fuck phone
>>46963258
In fact that was such an abominable mess of spelling and grammar that you should all just disregard my statement.
>>46963247
Fuck you are talking about? Before eldrazi, they used tidespout tyrant, after eldrazi came out, they started using Iona and 1-2 other creatures, depending on build.
No one who can afford a competitive vintage deck would have ever considered Emrakul as a playable card in Vintage...... Just stop, this is getting annoying.
The card is bad in every-way as far as Vintage goes.
>>46963302
you presume to speak for all of us? just get out, holy shit.
>>46922472
Man i cant wait for that bridge reprint
>>46932495
>>46932494
Hymn at common would be fucking stupid. It would probably be fine at an uncommon in an excessively powerful format; but unless I see a sol ring/power 9, I'm probably first picking Hymn in just about whatever limited format I play.
>>46945649
They've explicitly said that rarity is used as a balancing mechanism for limited.
>objectively most powerful cards end up being rare and mythic.
Yeah, Archangel's Light, Tree of Redemption, Tibalt, Behold the Beyond, and Goldknight Castigator are all way too strong. Shitty commons and uncommons like Delver of Secrets, Mana Leak, Heir of Falkenrath, Skin Invasion, Duskwatch Recruiter, Lightning Bolt, Forbidden Alchemy, and Treasure Cruise just can't compare.There are good cards and bad cards at all rarities. Rares/Mythics are just flashier
>>46965310
>Delver of Secrets, Mana Leak, Lightning Bolt, Treasure Cruise
Mistake, mistake, mistake, mistake^3
>Heir of Falkenrath, Skin Invasion, Duskwatch Recruiter, Forbidden Alchemy
>Any of these
>Good in eternal
hahahahaha
Fucking limitards.
>>46953959
>Mostly 'mericans.
I'm european and i have also a bad sense of value (and I'm pretty socialist ! What a twist !)
> the amount of preemptive butthurt ITT
>>46964869
I speak for all who are responsible for improving the deck over the years and playing it in actual tournaments.
If you think Emrakul is oath-playable, let alone Vintage-playable, you shouldn't even be allowed to discuss Vintage.
>>46945649
They've said players complained about mythic rare cards not being powerful enough. That's why they started printing more powerful mythic rares in Fate Reforged. Turns out players are now excited to actually open a mythic rare card again.
>>46921318
Tell that to a foil Tarmogoyf.
>>46947982
lol, Poor kid. Check this out.
I know the deck is shit tier, but that card value. Also, they are all foil.
>>46967064
lol
>>46967064
>>46967099
Lol, check out my #swag scrubo~
>>46967126
That's cute.
>>46967147
Still gotta one-up my gold collection cuckboy.
>Mfw poorshits try to oneup
>>46967218
The funny thing is, I got into MtG in '97 and it cost me around $60 to put together my power nine deck.
But, back in '97 we didn't have sleeves and the cards are probably not even in grade 7 shape.
But, people on here still give me shit for double sleeving my power nine cards and putting them in ultra pro sleeves.
>>46967126
> chink gold
>>46967336
I played in 97 black bordered lotus were around 250 at the time.
>>46968366
No they weren't. They just under $200. Probably right around $175. But, I personally bought a collection off a guy back in the day and built the deck.
Side note, even back then four playsets weren't tournament legal.
>>46957804
Let them age for 20 years.
>>46952680
I made a post last night and your autism missed the point entirely. They arnt bumping it up to mythic. In a limited environment it goes from game breaking to merely interesting.
Also http://mtgtop8.com/event?e=11976&d=268620&f=VI. I also found lists with other dumbass beatsticks like blightsteel and an outlier with rune scarred demon. But you or whoever said it later was right. Most had griseldaddy
>>46926000
A fully powered cube reduces the skill gap between bad players and good players, and also reduces the range of viable mana costs.
