A DM needs you opinion
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I have a player who believes thinks that a Bard and/or Cleric can't be in a low to no magic campaign. He has a habit if being a rule Nazi. He also gets on /tg/ all the time so maybe he'll listen to you guys
>>46826797
What system?
>>46826797
Literally the definition of up to the GM. But if I was running the campaign I would agree with the guy unless you had a homebrew low magic version of those classes.
>>46826797
Kick the guy, get somebody new instead.
Players are dime a dozen, DM is in the right to cull the chucklefucks as necessary.
>>46826836
Are bards a very magical class?I don't know since I usually play Hackmaster 4E
>>46826797
Just change it to cleric having annointed bandages and salves, made more like a combat medic.
Bards songs etc. power the party up by raising morale/demoralizing the enemy.
Easy enough to work around, you just need to do some brainstorming.
Ya we are using homebrew
>>46826874
They have spellcasting, and while its not as powerful as a wizard its a pretty big component.
>>46826797
Were this a D&D 3.5e environment, I would take away the Bard's spells and punt the Cleric's progression into the Adept column, then let them loose.
>>46826797
I mean, Clerics rely very clearly on divine favor. If you aren't handing them some sort of magic they're just religious fighters and it removes the point of them having their own class.
>>46826886
Then it depends completely on how Clerics and Bards work in your homebrew. This should be obvious.
If they use magic, don't include them in a low-to-no-magic game.
>>46826797
Assuming you're playing some variant of 3.5e or pathfinder I'm inclined to agree with your player simply because "low to no magic" while allowing casters is basically just denying magic items to martials, who are weaker on the whole after about level 7 anyway. Allowing full or partial casters all their tricks while denying the basic bonuses enchanted equipment gives martials makes them fall even farther behind.
Bard is probably okay. I'm sure there's some cheesy stuff, but as long as you stay low level it should mainly be mild utility. Clerics are ridiculously strong pretty much all the way through their levelling process, and definitely need some sort of rule adjustment for a low magic campaign.
Neither of these classes belongs in a no magic campaign without stripping their spells and supernatural abilities and redesigning them from the ground up.
D&D is a terrible game to play for low magic. Unfortunately I can't really offer too much in the way of alternatives, because I don't really like low magic to begin with.
