Warhammer 40k General
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Smashf**ker General Edition
>Rules databases
https://mega.co.nz/#F!pFgm0RKR!J06C1gVYcjzNGsF8YNLsjQ
https://kat.cr/warhammer-40k-pdf-library-t9575373.html
>FAQs
http://www.games-workshop.com/en-GB/Rules-Errata
>40k 7th edition quick reference sheet(s)
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/4104995/Games/7edRef_V7.pdf
>Forgeworld Book index
http://www.dakkadakka.com/wiki/en/Forge_World_and_Apocalypse_Rules_Index
Iron hands best hands sub edition
Were where you when Iron hands could take Cataphractii terminators with a 5+ FNP as part of their sons of the gorgon detachment? Plus Contemptor dreads and Cataphractii termi HQ with reroll invul saves of a 1?
Best way to beat Necrons with IG?
>Ork Whining General
>>46637995
What kind of units are you having trouble with?
As a Necron player I think the pie plates IG can lay down mess me up pretty well but I play infantry heavy.
>>46637979
Not him, but why not? Unless you play Orks or DEldar, you have no excuse not to.
>>46637987
I doubt it's better than 500+ points in free Razorbacks.
im taking the new broken as fuck SM powers with CSM and none of you faggot nerds can stop me.
ill even ally them in with KDK if i want to. deal with it
>>46637987
I really like Iron Hands. If I hadn't gone with Imperial Guard they would have been my Chapter of Choice.
Saw a player at my shop with them and it was really cool.
He wasnt using 30k stuff though.
>>46638043
Ok, but I won't play any games with you.
Got two boxes of Dark Angels veterans. Made an Int chaplain with MoR and plasma pistol, two lib's with plasma pistols, a lib with bolt pistol and a command squad with two flamer/stormshields, two plasma guns and a plasma gun, power fist and banner dude. Throwing Ezekial in for a conclave and all the bunch in a drop pod.
Who cares about points anyways?
>>46638020
Two warlord traits
Get POTMS on all vehicles within 12 of any IC
Skyhammer is part of their detachment
New vehicle boosting psy powers mean that land raider is AV 15, also haywire everywhere
Your tiny metal boxes are as large as your faith in them, weakling.
>>46637967
>>46637911
>>46637831
So what you're saying is.
He is a really shitty, expensive lone wulfen?
>>46638043
I sure am glad I don't have to cheat to not be shit.
>>46638056
>im taking my riptidewingdar + supersmashfriends and going home
k fuccboi
>>46638098
Except wulfen have way better weapons.
>>46638019
Tomblades, Praetorians and Warrior spam.
He has formations to give them 4+ RP, re-rolling 1s?
>>46638043
Just use them using all SM rules.
So the SM new psychic powers have leaked? And what's the opinion on the Anniversary Imperial Space Marine?
>>46638176
>mfw ill just play my world eaters as iron hands since we're tougher than those robotic closet cases anyway
good idea friend
>>46638207
replaces a tac marine
has a S5 Ap2 Rapidfire D gun
cost Z E R O pts
Any questions?
>>46638207
>And what's the opinion on the Anniversary Imperial Space Marine?
Follow the last thread>>46632971
>>46638227
Still not as broken as smashfucker, tau or eldar.
>>46638020
>>46638155
>No excuse
Other than you're breaking the rules? I mean, hey, if you're not playing by the rules why don't I?
I think I can make much more fun ways to break the rules like making tactical terminators flying monstrous creatures so I can zoom them through the air.
Maybe if you asked nicely rather than opening with "and there's nothing you can do about it!" I would agree to let you break the rules.
>>46638237
Smashfucker can now have 2+/2++/2+++, giving him the potential to be by far the most broken thing in the game.
>>46638243
One cannot break what is clearly broken
>>46638237
>Broken
Fucking what. It's a free special weapon guy with a S5 AP2 ID gun. It won't wound most things it'll be used against.
It's not nearly as bad as other "free" units.
>>46638256
Oh yeah, and re-rollable.
What are some good Imperial Knight proxies ? Leviathans look cool but they only come in Warhound or Dreadknight size, no Imperial Knights.
I know you will be able to get 2 GW Knights cheap soon but if I'm to field an army of just three models I want each of them to be unique.
>>46638243
too bad, your chance at fighting a less broken CSM force have passed. all 20 of my cataphractii just became an iron hands founding chapter that looks suspiciously just like preheresy WE now.
smashes will be fucked
>>46638243
I'm not that guy, Mr. Pissypants, I'm just curious why you wouldn't want to play against them. I can see that it's just asspain from how he worded his post now.
>>46638268
>it's only a free gun capable of wounding almost anything in the game and causes Instant death with no armor saves
>that's not broken
>>46638286
>maybe this general will be the one I get answered in
if you did any research I am confident you could have found a sufficient proxy right now. That said they aren't expensive models and are fairly customizable and have forgeworld variants.
Find their height and type that + robot + model and you will get there.
>>46638321
Anon don't forget that it's actually not a combi weapon and can be fired as many times as you'd like, in addition to the pistol version that can be fired prior to assault and gives him an additional attack.
Nope, not broken.
>>46638345
cant to technically take a whole army of them too?
good game design
>>46638363
No he's infantry (unique) and you can only grab one. But being able to do so at no additional points cost makes it blatant pay to win.
>>46638363
>cant to technically take a whole army of them too?
not if you actually no how to read retardo.
>>46638287
Feel No Pain and rules that make vehicles worthwhile make me want to go Iron Hands with my pre-heresy Thousand Sons, but the Super Chaos Familiar relic from the Fists is also mighty appealing.
>>46638237
>Tau
If you play marines and still have problems with Tau, then you are so hillariously shit at this game that you would fuck up with Eldar against Orks.
There is no hope for you, so I hope you aren't here for the gaming aspect of the hobby.
>>46638398
>retardo.
>no
Let's brainstorm DoW stronghold missions for each chapter/legion/subfaction
>>46638399
its funny because my spartan (i still need to get the 2nd one) + 20 cataphractii preheresy WE list can give them all a 4+ FNP anyway.... and i wanted to run a forgelord as my HQ choice anyway...
i guess in 40k they are loyalists now :^).
>>46638437
I'm done for that. How about Orks/Eldar/Imperials forcing Nids down a line to making Tau run out of ammo to krump them once the Nids are gone?
>>46638221
Dumb frogposter
>>46638287
Fine by me friend.
>>46638298
Sorry you stupid horse fucker. I didn't realize from your incomprehensible gibbering that being rude was a new meme.
>>46638414
Please enlighten us, anon. I'm a non marine player btw.
What is the use of marines supposed to be? Is it something simple like grav centurions or grav bikes or something?
Because I genuinely don't see WTF the point of muhrenes are besides those two units.
>>46638323
I checked and found nothing good. Did you ?
>>46638414
What makes muhreens have such an overwhelming advantage over tau?
>>46638553
Or I guess I do see what seems to be the point (that T4 3+ should make them durable) but they don't seem to be particularly durable on a per-point basis.
>mfw im going to use angron as cataphractti smashfucker
>mfw smashfucker is more survivable than angron actually is
Post your predictions for the next chaos codex.
>baleflamer becomes ap4
>plague marines get a point cost increase
>bikers get a point cost increase
>bikers can no longer take mark of nugle
>obliterators no longer choose their weapons, and instead generate them randomly from a d6 table every turn
>mutilators get the same thing
>warp talons 5 points cheaper
>CSM now equal cost as loyalists
>may no longer put characters in a spawn unit
>spawn get a point increase
>spawn become t3
>cultists get a point increase
>>46638602
Thats probably because ap3 templates exist
nth for Necrons
>>46638610
Now anon, theyre not orks. They wouldnt make them shit stats AND over cost them
>>46638399
Just play blood ravens.
They're loyalist thousand sons, and they can take any chapter tactics you want, as they are of unknown founding. That way you can be the successor of whatever chapter you want, the change what chapter you are succesors for if you decide you want to take a different first founding decurion and still be fluffy.
It's what I do.
>>46638547
>incomprehensible
If you're going to insult me, at least have the courtesy to use accurate slurs. Nothing about my posts has been difficult to comprehend.
>>46638610
>MoN gives (6+)fnp instead of +1T
>>46638606
Nobody cares, now stop shitting up the thread by posting frog pictures every 3 minutes
>>46638635
>Wouldn't give them shit stats and overcost them
>warp talons, possessed, cultists, mutilators and forgefiends don't exist
Any suggestions on how to counter Khorne Daemonkin with Skitarii? My opponent just keeps summoning more and more bloodletters that deep strike precisely where he wants them to with no scatter and even if I kill them, he'll just kep summoning them back.
>>46638636
Obviously I'll be calling them Blood Ravens, but I'll need to decide on a goal list so I know what stuff needs painted first and which of my Black Legion models to repaint.
>>46638651
>doesn't stack with FNP banner
>>46638671
Actually keep track of his Blood Tithe points. There's no way he's summoning that many new units.
>>46638671
SHOW ME WHAT YOU GOT
... Your list, I mean. Ballpark is fine.
>>46638711
>Thinking MoN units can get a FnP banner
ho ho ho
nurgle obviously means fear
this and soulblaze are useful usrs
>>46638668
What about
Defiler, Thousand Sons, Berserkers, CSM Land Raider?
>>46638610
>Helbrutes still 2 attacks base
>Raptors still 17 ppm
>Still must pay for mandatory champions
>Still no ground based AA unit
>Icon of Excess now gives defensive grenades
>Warpsmiths and Dark Apostles unchanged
>Daemon Prince price increase
>Black Mace price increase
>Baleflamer points increase
>Daemon prince can no longer take spell familiars
>Chaos Terminator minimum unit size increased to 5
>>46638711
No, it does.
>the banner is also 6+. you get "real" Fnp if you have both.
Really not sure in which squad to put this guy, to be honest.
At first I've been thinking about adding it to one of the dev squads in a skyhammer annihilation force, to either give one of the bolter combat squads more bite or to up the killing power of the grav-cannon combat squads even more.
Bot that'd probably be overkill, the grav squad will probably kill its target anyway and the bolter squad is only really meant to shell units to force GtG or set up a charge for the assault squads.
>>46638586
Here you go, big boy.
>>46638657
stay assravaged
>mfw i can fit double spartan + 20 cataphractii +smashfucker in 1850
probably wont even be that broken 2bh
>>46638752
>CSM
>getting anything nice
Stop wishlisting.
>>46638758
Tactical squad with grav-gun, combi-grav and drop pod. Drop them next to some MC you want dead.
>>46638788
Anon, I play blood ravens, necrons, chaos daemons (and lizardmen in the now dead WHFB). I play three top tier armies, I'm not butthurt, I can win without having to abandon my codex.
It's just that there are a finite number of posts before a thread hits bump limit and they shouldn't be wasted on you spamming posts for no good reason.
>>46638751
>>Still no ground based AA unit
Hey hey, we have these 25pts missile launchers.
> Helbrutes will shoot / charge nearest model
> Marks will be mandatory if you take a lord with one
> demonic steeds will vanish as no models exist
> doom siren gives +1 to combat resolution
> warp perils have the change to summon demons which attack the nearest model
> demon weapons cause a wound with no saves allowed if the additional attack roll is 1
> models with opposite marks (Nurgle - Tzeentch; Khorne -Slaanesh) count as one-eye open
>>46638614
You don't need AP3 weapons to kill muhrenes at all. Kroot and cultists for example outshoot marines on a per point basis, and kroot are going to be significantly more durable as well (+2 to their cover saves, iirc).
The only army marines seem designed to fight are orks (grav bikes and grav centurion aside) and I have no idea what that guy meant when he said they should easily beat tau.
>>46638869
> without having to abandon my codex.
I never understood this stance. Codexes are a means to an end. If a codex does a pisspoor job of emulating your desired army in a satisfactory way, it's only logical to use a more apt alternative.
>>46638610
>Post your predictions for the next chaos codex
There will never be a new codex.I actually believe GW doesn't want to update Codices. Just supplements and then who knows.
>>46638890
>demonic steeds will vanish as no models exist
Hey, it's no fun if you post things that will actually happen.
>Chaos cucks still paying for 3.5
good times
>>46637898
If my buddy wants to start collecting Necrons, is this a good learning list at 500 points?
Lord +Resurrection Orb
Triarch Stalker
10 Warriors
10 Immortals
>>46638890
>> demonic steeds will vanish as no models exist
This is sadly very possible.
>>46638869
>I can win without having to abandon my codex.
but i have a codex, its codex : smashfucker.
my loyalist pre-heresy WE use IF rules because they are pretending to be a successor chapter. im sorry if that angers you :^)
>>46638639
So you wouldn't consider being called a "stupid horse fucker" inaccurate?
>>46638930
Have they not paid enough already? Were the sins of the Iron Warriors and Word Bearers worth this much suffering?
>>46638960
*IH rules
flesh for the flesh god is weak for the weak throne :^)
>>46638900
Top tier marine lists beat Tau. Mediocre marine lists get wrekt.
Tau's real strength is that they're easy mode. The difference between a mediocre Tau army and a top tier Tau army is much, much smaller than the difference for any other nonEldar codex. That said, they still have weaknesses that can be exploited.
>>46638960
>my loyalist pre-heresy WE use IF rules because they are pretending to be a successor chapter. im sorry if that angers you :
I did something like that once. A chapter made from WE geneseed pretending to be IF successors.
>>46638981
No the arch traitor' must pay a thousand generations
Stay spiked fagots
>>46638949
>Lord+Res Orb
If you like throwing points away, sure.
Cryptek will do it cheaper and better. Remember: They have the real res orbs now, the things Lords carry are hot garbage.
>>46638963
Hey, any port in a storm.
>>46638949
Just tell him to get the start collecting necrons box, the formation it comes with is great and you save a fair bit of money.
>>46639005
>Top tier marine lists beat Tau
Okay, HOW? Is it just "grav bikes and centurions are really good" or what?
>Tau's real strength is that they're easy mode.
That's the only advantage (besides grav centurions and bikes) I've ever heard given to marines either.
>>46639025
Thanks Bud!
>>46638926
>>46638952
Chosen, Lords/Sorcerers on Bikes, non-cult units with marks, daemon princes with weapon upgrades, the burning brand, daemon steed and non-possessed vehicles all don't have models.
hope you're ready to lose them all
>>46639005
That still doesnt fall in line with what the other anon said. That marines had such an overwhelming advantage against tau that he couldnt beat orks with eldar
>>46638890
> Marks will be mandatory if you take a lord with one
But I do this anyway!
> Marks will be mandatory if you take a lord with one
Eh, I dunno. They've been making models of Chaos Lords on Juggernauts for AoS, so those models still technically kind-of exist. I wouldn't be shocked if they got rid of it, but I wouldn't expect it to go either.
>doom siren gives +1 to combat resolution
TRIGGERED
>warp perils have the change to summon demons which attack the nearest modelthat is pretty fluffy.
>models with opposite marks (Nurgle - Tzeentch; Khorne -Slaanesh) count as one-eye open
I wouldn't be surprised if they're Allies of Convenience, but even then it is somewhat in line with their fluff. I'd be upset about it, but I can see the logic.
>>46639016
But what about Tau and Eldar then? When will they pay for their sins?
>>46638925
If they'd made that decision before they nerfed the fuck out of the Dark Eldar codex, I would be a lot less upset.
>>46638900
Have you literally seen none of the shit we got lately? Deep strike turn one charges after firing a ton of twinlinked shit at them. If they have any markerlights left after that, you fucked up.
Cant even intercept properly, since you are aiming to drop pod right next to a unit. Tau dont like S8 AP2 either. And their interceptor is 25 points per model.
Or you could swarm them with tons of marines in free vehicles.
Or run them down with 2+ rerollable cover, after taking out their primary marker sources.
Stop complaining about them being OP, and you might just start getting better at the game. Especially with all the new shit we just got, you have no excuse for calling Tau OP or bullshit. Stick to calling them xeno scum, because we have far more bullshit than they do.
>>46639071
>When will they pay for their sins?
when my 'iron hands' smashfuck them :^)
>>46639102
But that's just going to stir them up more. Remove Riptide, remove Wraith everything. There. Proper punished.
>>46638610
>>46638751
>>46638890
You guys are still being to kind.
Here's what the next CSM codex will be: a picture of the CEO's middle finger, and a bit of fluff saying "tzeentch sent all the CSM to another universe". The CSM are then squatted.
Years later, they are given a new rule set, one which is perfectly balanced internally and externally, able to be a top tier army and still play good fluffy lists without curb stomping the other armies. This ruleset will be amaizong, have rules for the daemon primarchs, tons of customization choices, and will be regarded as the greatest ruleset ever written, ushering GW into a new golden age.the catch is that the CSM are released as an army for Age of Sigmar only, which is still shit at that time.
Playing my first 2v2 match and I will be playing my Steel Confessors (Iron Hand tactics) with my friends Ad Mech Army.
I can only field 1500 pts so we are doing 3000 pts a side. Our opponents are Daemons and Chaos Space Marines.
My friend has been playing for a long time but I just recently got up to 1500 points and I think my clumsy knowledge of the rules is going to really slow down the table. Apparently the Chaos Marine Player is also fairly new but is only bringing 1000 pts to 2000pts of Daemons.
I have to type out my list but I plan on taking an Armoured task force with my Predator, 2 whirl winds and a thunderfire Cannon with the Tech Marine leader on a bike.
I will also put a command squad on bikes for the tech marine and either a chaplin or a librarian with them all.
I also have two units of Tactical Marines in and 2 rhinos and 6 Devastator Centurions in a Land Raider. I don't know if I will fit all of that at 1500 but it is what I plan On bringing.
My collection also has two drop pods, two dread naughts (one venerable) and ten scouts.
Where is that template I have seen for posting your list?
>>46639045
>non-cult units with marks
I'm ok with this.
You either do them right or you just erase from the game.
Since GW seems incapable of understanding how CSM should work, i'm fine with the latter.
Give us a balanced codex, just the basic Cult units, and let formations do the flavour.
>>46639123
i wish theyd just squat tau and replace them with roided up kroot
kroot are far more interesting
>>46639131
>template
Just tell us what you're taking, what options it has, and how much it costs. Don't format it like a complete retard.
>>46639091
>Stop complaining about them being OP,
I already said I knew nothing of muhrenes.
>>46639248
speaking of op, are wulfen considered to be complete op cheese now adays
>>46639245
>Don't format it like a complete retard.
Challenge accepted. Not going to attempt it on my phone right now.
>>46639321
apparently they are 'slow and fragile' according to the geniuses here
>>46639321
Considering theyre choppier than death company i wouldnt be surprised
>>46639337
Dont they have rules to make them scour the board super fast? Like charging after running or something?
>>46639357
>Dont they have rules to make them scour the board super fast? Like charging after running or something?
trust me like 2 days ago i said they were strong and i had braindead waacfags srceaming at me for hours about how they are slow and fragile
apparently they are slow and fragile
Really generic question, but N+ is an armour save, N++ is an invulnerable save, and I had assumed N+++ was cover save - but I think people were using it to describe FNP when talking about Smashfucker.
Is N+++ referring to a cover save or FNP?
>>46639321
My store's manager finds them very binary- either they are answered and become irrelevant, or they kill fucking everything.
>>46639376
A cover save is just an invuln and you cant take 2 invuln saves the same way you cant make an armour and an invuln save. +++ is referring to FNP because its not counted as a save and thus can be taken with armour or invuln
>>46639371
slow and fragile. Thats like saying that blood angels are slow and blue.
If I wanted Tau with converted cobbled together looking stuff, and using rust paint on the metallics, how could I justify this in lore?
Are there any examples of tau infantry using anything other than pulse weaponry?
>>46638256
T6 too, so he's getting that FNP unless he receives the D
>>46639396
I see. So when someone mentions 4++, they could be referring to a cover or an invuln save?
>>46639433
He can FNP even when hit with D
D is just str 10
>>46639449
yes, like a jink save for example.
+++ is FNP
>mfw everyone sperging out in the last thread over the anniversary marine and refusing to play against it or saying it should cost 50 points
Really? I can see why it's just salt in the wound if Skyhammer or Battle Company or Gravstar took one, but I have no formations, no fortifications, no allies, no flyers, no psykers, NO TRANSPORTS, and my army is like 5 shooting Terminators, 5 LC Terminators, 40 tactical marines, and a Dreadnought.
And you would be upset if I got a single 18" AP2 Instant Death gun for free?
You would refuse to play my fully painted, non-recast, 100% customized, every single model has at least one or more FW pieces on it, super fluffy, non-cheesy army that auto-loses to pretty much every army in the game including Orks, CSM, and Tyranids, because of this model?
I'm a cheeselord loyalist faggot because I planned on buying this model for the looks weeks ago before it even had rules, and it was the first thing I was able to look forward to since the Leviathan Dreadnought because my chapter isn't compatible with 30k?
>>46638768
If you got nothing then you don't need to post.
>>46639452
It really would make more sense if FNP and Reanimation worked on non-6 rolls on the D table. After all, it counts as S10 for ID purposes.
But nope, specifically disallows both no matter what.
D rules are one of those bits of the game that don't really work.
>>46639371
You're still wrong. Your argument revolved around:
-You didn't play 40k, only 30k because you aren't a poorfag.
-They need a flying transport
-A T4 3++ is tough to kill
I think you also shouted a lot about a re-rollable save without realizing that anything approaching a psychic deathstar is going to get shut down before it starts.
>>46639091
>Or you could swarm them with tons of marines in free vehicles.
Battle Company is basically "slowly be tabled" vs. Tau. The only reason you win is because the Tau player is retarded and took too many MCs to gather VP.
You can't rape Tau as marines unless you take Invisible Gravstars/rainbow MEQ 5 detachment friends star or Skyhammer.
I highly doubt the terrible players on /tg/ who whine all day have a good chance of beating Tau players who will generally take at least 1 Riptide.
>>46639488
>auto-loses to pretty much every army in the game including Orks, CSM, and Tyranids
You're either a lier, a retard, or both.
Just pay some points for it, you stupid motherfucker.
>>46639518
>slow and fragile
>3++ rerollable is fragile
>'nuh uh your wrong im not retarded'
sure thing faggot
>>46639505
Where does it say D disallowes both?
You obviously cant FNP instant death but if D is just STR10 then why couldnt they FNP?
>>46639488
>it should cost 50 points because 14 point marine and 36 points of wargear
>on top of the 14 points you already pay for the marine you're swapping out
/tg/ can't into math.
Charging 15 points for pistols and doing something like that will just make it yet another unplayable marine model that nobody takes. Nobody takes plasma or grav pistols for a reason. 15 points is not a proper cost.
>>46639533
That's an interesting view point given how well Battle Company does in large tournaments compared to Tau.
>>46639541
The re-roll is never going to function. You do understand that correct?
And the tears made a stir in the Warp. The crying and lamenting of the pussies and man-children began to take shape. A swirl of tears and vaginal fluids solidifies into form. The being awakens finding sentience in it's new body. It's body weak, small unimportant. It's mental capacity not beyond that of an infant. Lost and Alone it lets out a wail heard through the entire universe. Behold the birth of the newest Chaos god. WABAAC the Whine god. Immediately he finds many followers though none are knowing. His name stands for his worship Whine and Bitch at any cost....
>>46639536
>tactical marine spam on foot
>not in a formation
Literally autoloses to Heldrakes.
>>46639554
>That's an interesting view point given how well Battle Company does in large tournaments compared to Tau.
> The only reason you win is because the Tau player is retarded and took too many MCs to gather VP.
Let me guess, you don't even know how tournament missions work. Don't quote GT results if you don't even know anything about GT play. And Eldar is by far the most populous and dominant force, not marines.
>>46639554
>The re-roll is never going to function. You do understand that correct?
>psychic powers never work
>invisibility deathstars arent everywhere
keep being retarded you stupid faggot
>>46639548
under the feel no pain rules, page 164.
>>46639536
Nice reading comprehension. And how many points should we pay for it? 50, like you fucking retards who don't know how to play think it should cost?
You're literally better off with a 15 point grav gun.
>>46639548
In the fucking definition of the FNP rule.
>Feel No Pain saves may not be taken against Destroyer attacks or against unsaved Wounds that have the Instant Death special rule.
>>46639567
Kek.
>>46639488
Are you surprised that /40kg/ is full of whiny spergs who don't even play, or what? Just do what you fucking want, man. Taudarcronaemons aren't going to complain either way. Orks, Tyranids, and CSM will always bitch, no matter what you do. DEldar are all masochists so they'll probably appreciate it. :^)
In all honesty I don't think the rage-fag shitposters even play.
>>46639613
Then stick to your grav guns and fuck off, pig.
>>46639613
30 points. Instant Death is serious business. I'd be amenable to haggling.
>>46639596
Do you know what a Culexus does? Invisibility deathstars are pretty well dead - by and large. At least in significant tournament play.
The fact that you don't play much 40k shows because you're pretty well stuck in previous era of play. The wide spread availability of the culexus shut down most invis stars. If you look at the Eldar armies that are massively successful as well as Marine armies you're largely looking at large amounts of strong ObSec or things like Spyder/Bike spam which use very little in the way of psykers.
>>46639591
Marine Battle Company is still very well represented and finishes very well in many tournaments. Having 22+ ObSec units on the table is a very effective build. They don't have the same firepower as Tau but a good Battle Company player will have a good success rate against most armies it faces including Tau. The issue is Tau that take enough ObSec can actually get out shot/out fought by a Battle Company. You need the dual Stormsurge/Riptide Wing to generate the bullets to remove that many ObSec options in a game.
>>46639687
slow and fragile
>>46639687
>Marine Battle Company is still very well represented and finishes very well in many tournaments.
Try actually looking at the Adepticon top lists before assuming that. Like 6 Eldar and 1 BC.
>>46639677
>whining about official releases and rules
Maybe you're the one who should fuck off instead of crying over your shitty codex you're too terrible to win with, unlike other people who are topping with Orks, Tyranids, and CSM.
Crying over a single 18" S5 gun in C:SM is hilarious. Even going so far as to refusing games against that model even when put into COMPLETELY SHIT LISTS.
>>46639571
Spotted the retard that hasn't played since 5e and can't into spreading out.
>>46639725
If he played in 5E he'd have tons of Rhinos. If Orks, Tyranids, and CSM cannot beat an army filled with just tactical marines and terminators, you have no space to be calling people bad.
>>46639687
>Having 22+ ObSec units on the table is a very effective build.
Its basically the same idea as IG, you cant kill that many units. Marines are just fodder that you have to manage to survive in order to win.
>>46639337
>'slow and fragile'
>T4
>4+ save
>FNP
>Run and charge stock
>Rerolls all charges
>"Slow and fragile"
Oh those poor, poor spoiled Space Marine players. They've lost all perspective on what 'slow and fragile' really means.
>>46639723
>it's official, therefore it can't be a retarded, cancerous decision
Posts like these are cool, because they tell you that the poster is a moron that can and should be ignored. Making a limited edition model a free and fairly significant upgrade is pay-to-win horseshit of the highest magnitude. I'm not playing that shit. If you want to bring it, awesome, let's figure out a pricing.
>>46639693
They are fragile yes. T4 is fragile in a game where S6 is unbelievably available is fragile. I mean 3 Scatbikes does 1 wound a turn and you'll never touch the scat bikes the entire game.
Slow is fairly irrelevant given then fragility of the unit.
>>46639704
LVO had a strong showing of BC as well. We've yet to see BAO or NOVA. Either way - your assertion that BC should lose to Tau frequently is disproved given the number of Tau finishes compared to BC finishes. Or are you telling me there are literally no good Tau players and only great BC players? Otherwise those Marine players have to be beating Tau somewhere in their line up to make their finishes.
I'm not suggesting Tau are bad or BC is unbeatable but your assertion that a good Tau player will always win out is not grounded in the reality of the game.
I play Carcharodons. Can I replace my Red Brethren with Cataphractii, or does that not work because CAD detachments don't actually list "Terminators" in their rules?
Also I have a lot of mixed armor from before we had rules for Cataphractii and Tartaros. So if my squad has 1 or 2 Cataphractii and other marines have a few pieces of Cataphractii armor on them but aren't 100% Cataphractii, what should I do?
Just ignore the Cataphractii stuff? Or would it be a faggot move to try to claim them as battle-repaired Cataphractii for the 4++?
>>46639725
Spotted the retard who doesn't know how to double space.
>>46639803
>the only idiot in here who can't press enter twice
Posts like these are cool, because they tell you that the poster is a moron that can and should be ignored.
You realize all marine players can use this model as counts-as by simply modeling a special pistol and combi bolter right?
>>46639803
>I'm not playing that shit. If you want to bring it, awesome, let's figure out a pricing.
You're a retard, not because of your stance, but because you decided to haggle over points for a free marine, yet you don't haggle over War Convocation, Battle Company, or the Tyranid/Tau respawning unit formations which give you way more free shit.
>>46639806
>LVO had a strong showing of BC as well.
Because LVO allowed Tau to take more Stormsurges. Thus
>The only reason you win is because the Tau player is retarded and took too many MCs to gather VP.
How many times you gonna make me repeat myself?
> Either way - your assertion that BC should lose to Tau frequently is disproved given the number of Tau finishes compared to BC finishes.
Because Battle Company is far older than the current Tau book, moron.
And GT missions favor scoring points over killing things.
>>46639750
I never said they can't beat it, but it's not going to auto-lose. Just because captain retard takes a shit list it doesn't magically fix the massive issues inherent to the Ork, CSM, and Tyranid codexes.
>>46639827
>Poorfags think they gonna use these rules because they cut up some shitty looking plasma/bolter hybrid
shameful and deluded
>>46639806
>Slow is fairly irrelevant given then fragility of the unit.
and yet in your infinite wisdom you had to accentuate that only were they fragile, but also slow.
nice work :^)
>>46639863
So what is your position?
A Tau army with less MCs and more infantry will beat Battle Company consistently?
>>46639867
And the point was if he takes a shit list why are you complaining about his one anniversary marine? Those codexes aren't THAT bad that they struggle against tactical marines ON FOOT and a couple terminators.
He doesn't have flyers, allies, psykers, etc. If you can't beat a fucking starter box army of tactical marines with CSM or Orks or Tyranids you're terrible. Full stop. One or two MCs in Tyranids, some psykers or FMCs or even fucking cult units and Oblits/Spawn and ANY good Ork list will easily beat tacticals.
Unless this guy was running bikes or Battle Company or something I don't see why you're so upset.
>>46639796
You forgot the 2 wounds
>>46639803
>a single fucking model with an S5 plasma gun he can shoot all game
>acting like that snowflake asshole and the squad he's in won't get vaporized by turn 2 from a demolisher cannon
whatevs
So I'm not sure if this has been suggested yet, but here goes.
Take the new SnP termite captain. Stick him in a gravcannon devastator squad. You've now got 20 grav shots walking around, plus however many spare bodies you want. They can snag a drop pod more easily than grab cents, and will largely be cheaper.
Thoughts?
>>46639905
My position is that you shouldn't talk about tournaments when you don't know anything about tournament play, and can't even bother to look up the most recent tournament results or form simple conclusions like "marines have more wins because they are more popular and older than Tau". You realize at one point Eldar and Tau had ZERO wins because they JUST CAME OUT. Does that make them inferior armies? Because that's your logic.
>>46639941
>>a single fucking model with an S5 plasma gun he can shoot all game
>18"
>S5 plasma
Literally worse than a regular plasma.
>b-but muh gets hot
Getting hot just makes games even more entertaining. I bet you casuals don't even play Russian Roulette.
>>46639843
What makes you think I don't haggle over those? Are you a wizard?
At least with the other things you listed, they're benefits for taking specific combinations of units. This is literally just "Pay $30 and get a free in-game reward.". Honestly, I'm amazed that people here actually expected people to be willing to deal with that.
>>46639827
>implying double spacing is universal or even all that common
Do you really want to play in am environment where every single SM army has a free Disintegrator gun?
>>46639942
>They can snag a drop pod more easily than grab cents
What are you using all those Fast Attack slots on? The only time this would be an issue is grav Battle Company in which case, you don't even need to try to find weird and innovative ways to cheese.
>>46639977
>At least with the other things you listed, they're benefits for taking specific combinations of units. This is literally just "Pay $30 and get a free in-game reward.".
It's the benefit to playing space marines :^)
I love how you crybabies were all like "hurr GW pretending it's the 30th anniversary of space marines and not 40k" when it literally is the 30th anniversary of power armor. It's only the 23rd anniversary of 40k and the 29th anniversary of RT.
>>46639944
The Tau book has been out long enough to see performance at major events.
Or are you suggesting that in the absence of objective based gaming Tau beats BC? Because that is ignorant of the way tournaments play. I'm not sure how suggesting BC finishes at major tournaments don't mean it is a better list. That is the closest to objective data we have.
You are stating that Tau will beat BC consistently in some readily common scenario. What is that scenario?
>>46639977
>>implying double spacing is universal or even all that common
Literally look in any thread. The vast majority of users double space after quoting or greentexting because that's simply been the trend for 4chan.
I don't know why this is even relevant. As long as someone is posting with proper capitalization and punctuation it doesn't really matter. Even phones auto-capitalize for you, so the fucking retards who almost always shitpost or post textual diarrhea and fail to capitalize or punctuate have zero excuse.
>>46639977
>Do you really want to play in am environment where every single SM army has a free Disintegrator gun?
One extra 18" S5 AP2 ID is barely relevant, especially when put in something like a tactical squad which is most likely.
IG get triple specials, SW get way more specials, most armies spam tons of specials and heavies.
And if you're playing a marine build that really spams special weapons, one 18" S5 AP2 doesn't really matter. You were going to lose either way, and if not, it's not going to tip the balance over to their side.
Question about allies: can I take multiple different allied detachments from the same faction? The rulebook (the mini one from dark vengeance) says that it only has to be different from the Primary Detachment, but I've seen people say that it's only one detachment per faction.
New Idea for a 2000 pt Chaos list
HQ
>Warlord: Chaos Sorceror, Mark of Tzeench, Terminator armor, psyker mastery 3
>Chaos Lord, Mark of Khorne, Power Sword, Aura of Dark Glory
Troops
>5 Thousand Sons, no upgrades
>5 Thousand Sons, no upgrades
>20 Berzerkers, Icon of Wrath, Melta bombs
>5 Chaos Space Marines, Mark of Khorne, Close Combat Weapons all around, Icon of Wrath, melta bombs
Elites
>5 Chosen, Mark of Khorne, Icon of Wrath, Melta bombs, replace boltguns with Combi-bolters
>5 Terminators, Mark of Nurgle, Reaper Autocannon,2 powerfists 3 power axes
>5 Terminators, Mark of Nurgle, Reaper Autocannon, 2 powerfists, 3 power axes
Fast Attack
>Heldrake with Hades Autocannon
>Heldrake with Hades Autocannon
When I calculated it, this list came out to exactly 2000 points. Would be a Word Bearers army.
>>46639962
Call me crazy, but I'm 78% positive the disintegrators also Gets Hot. It's a strict downgrade from plasma in all regards except that it can be chosen to fire as a bolter instead.
>>46640013
Tau and BC had the same number of tops in Adepticon you moron. And this is in an event where Tau are at a handicap.
>>46640037
Looking in this thread, there are at least several other posters not double-spacing. I agree on this being a retarded point of discussion.
>>46640005
I have literally never seen anyone whining about that.
>>46640111
>I have literally never seen anyone whining about that.
Previous thread I think, but it was just a single butthurt smugpost, probably from some random xenos player
>>46640100
it is gets hot, but its also instant death
>>46640103
Please state your scenario in which Tau will regularly beat BC.
Also Tau did not make top 10 - Battle Company did. Additionally in the top 25 cut Tau have 2 representatives 3 SM lists.
Also how were Tau at a disadvantage at Adepticon? Full Strength D, no limits on force org, etc.
But really more importantly - in what scenario will Tau win against BC?
>>46640100
Are you forgetting Insant Death? The ability to one-shots Riptides and Daemon Princes and Carnifexes is a big deal.
>>46640077
How do you plan on getting into close combat? You need rides or alternate deployment options for your infantry, and you desperately need more dudes. Always buy a Spell Familiar. Always.
Hey guys, my rules for the Imperial Space Marine doesn't say unique or limit one per army.
Can I replace all my tacticals with them?
>>46640128
>>46640173
Right, I forgot that part.
Speaking of though, why doesn't my disintegrator gun get instant death? :^( Deldar tech is supposed to be the most superior in the galaxy, far beyond even the craftworlders, and instead it's like they stuck training wheels on it for safety.
>>46639429
concept for tau army, from someone who has never played Tau
>tau colony ship carrying all four castes is attacked and forced to make an emergency landing on an Imperial trash world
>further attacks permanently destroy the ship and kill the ethereal.
>The Tau are enraged and willing to fight to the end
>Imperium realizes that digging through the trash world to hunt down every super aggressive Tau would be a waste of time.
>"The Tau belong in the trash anyway."
>The Administorum issues instructions that the trash world is now OK for dumping hazardous materials.
>about 150 years later
>most drones are older than the tau. The Earth caste presence understands how they work and can build new ones, but the supplies to build the anti-grav modules are hard to come by.
>Tau use more bullet, rail, and ion weapons as munitions for pulse and plasma weapons run low.
>Finally meet back up with the main Tau force
>who are these plebs living in squalor with rusted drones and using stone age projectile weapons?
>The tau keep their trash world brethren at an arm's length.
I was originally think a very drone heavy tau force. I still like drones, but aside from MSU and markerlight spam I'm told they don't do very much.
>>46640201
Post pics or bullshit.
>>46640203
Because Instant Death is a toxic USR that needs to be deleted.
>>46640201
But that's exactly what it says.
>One space marine in your army may be replaced
>>46640221
>Because Instant Death is a toxic USR that needs to be deleted.
Found the Taufags.
>>46640173
>Are you forgetting Insant Death? The ability to one-shots Riptides and Daemon Princes and Carnifexes is a big deal.
Do the math on that. They aren't even going to take a wound for a single weapon at BS4. And this is before overcharging or FnP.
>>46640173
Pretty new and still learning the rules. The rides thing is a really good point, but I'm kind of sour on Rhinos since they always seem to get shredded before they take my boys anywhere. I've considered the land raider but that's like 250 points I could spend on another Heldrake.
Maybe if I cut that Zerker squad down so I could afford Rhinos, but I have a hard time seeing how I could get more models on the board.
So, having just caught up and seen the new formations, I'm somewhat cross. Could someone sell me on the Imperial Fists detachment? Specifically in a meta with a lot of other space marine players and nobody using buildings?
>>46640203
>Deldar get instant death guns
I hope they do next update, also something actually useful with power from pain.
>>46640221
>Because Instant Death is a toxic USR that needs to be deleted.
cry harder taufag
>but 10 man tac squad
>put them in drop pod
>replace all of them with IDraygun marines
>repeat
cant intercept them all
>>46640221
On one hand, I love the fact that I can do whatever I want with my deldar without having to worry if a unit is "too good" for its pts, or if my opponents might refuse to play with me. On the other, just a small handful of goodies might be nice. Like a wychcult formation. Or letting our troops have haywire grenades again. Or even just a formation that gave them haywire grenades. That would be nice.
>>46640245
>getting within 18" of a Tau MC
>>46640245
>FnP
You can't FnP instant death, fail your save and you die (unless EW or GC).
Has anything been said about updating Kastorel-Novem yet?
>>46640282
Fucking Necron faglords and their RP.
>>46640238
Chaos and Nids, but nice try. ID needs replaced with Multiple Wounds (x) with the most common being x=D3. Still one-shots demi-heros most of the time, has a decent shot at killing most characters, and is dangerous to bigger stuff.
>>46640271
>cant intercept them all
Don't tempt GW.
>>46640238
Not that poster, why does it automatically point them out as a Taufag? Lots of points in solo units that are hard to kill without instant death rules?
So my friend who insists CSM need an update to be viable has suggested I cannot field a CSM list that can beat a War Convocation. At 1850-2000 points what can I put on the table to beat him savagely?
>>46639020
Well, to get the most out of him you have to use the new iron hands decurion, so I mathed out exactly how much the new SUPER-GIGA-MEGAULTRA APOCALYPTIC SMASHFUCKER SSG10.
This is a some what min list, which means that SMASHFUCKER, his command squad and the libraius conclave that will be supporting him are mostly maxed out, but every other tax is reduced to the least amount possible at least as far as I can tell. If SMASHFUCKER can be made more OP or everything that isn't him, the command squad and libby conclave can be reduced further, someone please let me know.
So here it is:
Stormlance battle demi-company- [700pts]:
SMASHFUCKER- cataphrachtii armor, bike with betrayer's bane (yes, RAW-wise the armor and bike can be taken together can be taken together), Gorgon's chain, Iron halo, Digital Weapons, thunderhammer, lightning claw, melta bombs [340pts]
Command squad [140pts]:
>4 veterans on bikes
>1 apothecary on bike
Tactical squad [70pts]
>1 space marine sergeant
>3 space marines
>1 Imperial space marine
Tactical squad [70pts]
>1 space marine sergeant
>4 space marines
Tactical squad [70pts]
>1 space marine sergeant
>4 space marines
attack bike- [40pts]
Librarian conclave-[320pts total]:
Librarian- mastery level 1, bike, ironstone, tempered helm [150pts]
Librarian-mastery level one, bike [85pts]
Librarian-mastery level one, bike [85pts]
Honored ancients [100 pts total]:
Dreadnought [100pts]
That's 1120 points total, so in a standard tournament game of 1850 points you have 730 points left over.
Simply put SMASHFUCKER in the command squad, have the Librarian with the helm and ironstone be within 6" of him, have the other two join SMASHFUCKER's squad, and have all of the Libraians roll on the lnew librarius discipline to get veil of time, and boom, a deathstar that can beat any unit in the game with a 2+/2++/2+++ all of which are rerollable, whose unit can reroll ones in shooting phase, and who regains a wound with IWND on a 4+.
>>46640306
And 6+ on the damage table needs to be changed to D3 hullpoints, losing all of them causes the vehicle to explode.
>>46640271
>>46640314
Don't even need to deepstrike, with the new lighting powers for librarians you can cross the battle field at LIGHTING speeds!
>>46640329
The CSM book is four fucking years old.
It needs an update regardless of your shitfit with your friend
>>46640267
Our dis cannons used to be the upgrade from dark lances. Now the dark lances are the upgrades. I would like to go back to dark lance stock with some instant death disintegrator upgrades.
>>46640327
Tau are one of the boogie men here at /tg/ because they're able to field really overpowered lists consisting of nothing but giant monsters.
>>46640348
It isn't that it doesn't need an update. I'd love one. But he's says you cannot win against top tier lists with CSM at all.
>>46640329
A sorcerer, two cultists squads and then ally in chaos daemons for the rest of your points.
>>46640329
Maulerfiends out the ass, also heldrakes because its a footsloggin' list, add cultists to cap objectives and anything thats fast to tie their shit up and deny shooting phases as soon as possible.
>>46640271
>replace all of them with a one per army unit
I mean, I could do some cool stuff with an all-Cypher army too, anon, but what does that have to do with anything?
>>46638671
Adeptus mechanicus war convocation
Is he rolling for his deepstrike or is he just placing them? Because he should be rolling unless he has something that says otherwise
>>46640330
Jesus christ, thanks for detailing that for me.
>>46640254
Dreadclaws are the only good option. Rhino spam is the poorfag alternative but it's shit. CSM, as in actual Space Marines that are Chaos-affiliated, are shit. The two exceptions are juggerlords and sorcerers. MSU Noise Marines are a slightly less pungent and offensive brand of shit.
>>46640279
Our day in the sun will come, my NPC cousin.
>>46640382
That defeats the purpose of the argument.
>>46640383
My only concern is the mass grav. It only takes 1 6 to render a maulerfiend worthless.
>>46640367
Anything can happen given the dice
One time i charged a company commander with two squads of orks.
70 dice later, 8 of which being power klaws he took one wound and sent one unit of boys running.
He didnt even have a storm shield or termie armour
>>46640340
>Don't even need to deepstrike, with the new lighting powers for librarians you can cross the battle field at LIGHTING speeds!
>Iron Hands lightning based successor
>>46638758
>free s5 ap2 instant death
FCK NO NO NO
>>46640327
Because you'd expect them to raise against anything that'd threaten their suits.
Eldar wraithknights are gargantuan creatures, so they're protected, and nids and chaos has so many problems ID shouldn't be the top one.
I'm not trying to start anything but I'm confused on GW's decisions. They're willing to make skitari and cult AdMech codices, they're willing to make Marines/Eldar/Tau OP but why the lack of love for Orks and Chaos Space Marines? I can understand them wanting to say "hey the Chaos Gods want to keep your edgelords dependent on them so use cultists and daemons, folks" but why not just merge the Daemon and CSM codices together then? And why the horrid Ork dex?
>>46639376
Don't listen to the other guy
+ is an armor save
++ is an invuln saves
+++ is a cover save
Fnp doesn't count as a save and cover isn't just an invuln save because there are weapons that negate it
>>46640329
CSM need an update but they still have one or two very unflexible builds that help them be viable. You won't be able to handily beat him but you can at least stand a good chance with the list.
It's typically just Sorcerer for psychic access, and then cultists in reserve to minimize points wasted on shit units. Then take a superheavy and Belakor or other non shitty units like the ones from FW.
Daemon allies also help a lot.
>>46640426
Sure but I don't think that's a reasonably viable strategy.
>>46640329
What's he run in the War Convo usually?
>>46640367
he is correct.
source: I play CSM
>>46640385
where does it say hes 1 per army?
>>46640367
>But he's says you cannot win against top tier lists with CSM at all.
There's like 1 or 2 CSM that have made the tops of LVO/BAO.
It can be done. But the thing is you don't know which armies they fought against during the tournament.
>>46638758
You couldn't stick this fellow in a Sternguard squad could you?
>>46639803
The first sentence could tell you that much. "Your codex is bad and restraining therefore you are bad." What kind of logic is that?
The "don't play 40k" kind? Because that's the only sort of message you're putting out.
>>46640484
The bolded line at the top, above the statline. It's also Infantry (Unique).
Did you even read the rules?
>>46640497
A Sternguard isn't a Space Marine, in terms of rules language. Stupid, I know.
Same way Space Marine Sergeant cannot take a grav gun, because only Space Marines in a Tactical Squad can take them.
>>46640329
Pure WarConvo with no allies versus pure CSM? Good fucking luck.
>>46638758
DECLINE GAMES AGAINST ANYONE USING THIS BULLSHIT
>>46640479
His is:
10x Vanguard - 3 plasma, stuff on the champ (haywire pistol and the mace thing)
5x Ranger - 2 of the long rifles
5x Infiltrators - shock prods
5x Ruststalkers
1x Lascannon Walker
1x Anti Air Onager
Tech Priest - fully upgraded with all kinds of weird shit
2 units of 3 Kataphrons with Grav and the flamer
Knight with the Gattling Cannon and Rapid Fire Battle Cannon (and missile pod)
Sang. Priest
5x Scouts
3x Drop Pods
Culexus Assassin
>>46640330
>A terminator captain in the heavier cataphractii terminator armor does not count as wearing terminator armor
I can see where you're coming from, but that's "my formation says I can take 3 knights at this point limit" levels of unsavory if you actually try to push that angle.
>>46633812
Well that's pointless
>>46640484
See
>>46638758
>One Space Marine in your army can be replaced
>One Space Marine
That's the same language used for heavy weapons squads etc, so unless you somehow think "I can run a squad of eg. Fire Dragons consisting solely of Exarchs" that pretty clearly means one guy can be upgraded.
>"May upgrade one Fire Dragon to a Fire Dragon Exarch"
>yeah I can just do that 10 times per squad right?
>>46638173
>decurion with RP bonuses
The little shit. Use the Emperor's Wrath formation. Manticores, basilisks and wyverns eat necron blobs alive. Wish him luck rolling his RP vs S9/10 attacks, or if you're using the wyverns, rolling it over and over and over again.
Necrons are tough as nails, but they have lousy range. Use this to your advantage and grind them into dust from across the map.
>>46640399
Welcome.
And yeah, it's extremely broken, and with 730 points left, this already amazing list can also take the skyhammer anhilation force with grav spam and still have 70 points leftover, so you can make 2 libby mastery level 2 and still have 20 points leftover. And skyhammer would also be part of the decurion.
Also I forgot to mention that in the decurion, SMASHFUCKER gets 2 warlord traits, one of which has to be from the decurion, so there's that.
Can anyone think of anyways to make this any more powerful?
>>46640554
Absolute statements lead to absolute retards. Usually.
If you were already declining games against cheesy armies, this unit changes nothing.
Therefore, you only play non-cheesy armies, in which case this unit wouldn't be a gamebreaker as it's just a single 18" BS4 S5 marine.
This is literally Tau carbine/breacher level.
>>46640484
Right above Infantry (Unique), it says "One Space Marine can be replaced..."
>>46640397
If they deepstrike with 12" if an icon, held by another squad of bloodletters, they don't scatter.
At least I think it works the same way as the daemons book.
>>46640555
>Culexus Assassin
Well, fuck. It sounds like he has assault and psychic covered. Maybe you can outshoot him? I'm not super familiar with the CSM Codex. If you have pie plate options that might help too? It looks like he only has 2 AA options too.
>>46640329
Important question: do you have a Greater Brass Scorpion of Khorne?
>>46640570
Of course I would do it in a casual game with friends, but a tournament or anyother type of game where the goal is to win, not matter how chessey, which is what you would field SMASHFUCKER in, then it would make sense to rules lawyer that in, because your already going full WAAC
>>46640593
breachers don't have rapid fire instant death
>lol your 250 point t5 monsterous creature got splattered by a FREE marine in a drop pod before it even got to act
at least that guy doesn't innately have ignores cover
>>46640621
No but I can order one. Fortunately disposable income is something I've got plenty of.
>>46640608
Air is about his only weakness but most of the time all it takes is him popping a flier with one grav cent and I get stuck in vector lock.
I can't outshoot him that I've found. I haven't played him with CSM but with the drop pods bringing in Kataphron, Vanguard, and Knights he pours of a TON of dice. Not
>>46640555
That LVO Scorpion list could probably take that list in a straight fight. He only has a handful of units that can even hurt it, and you should be able to get to his AA before he can paste the Helblades.
>>46640452
>but why the lack of love for Orks and Chaos Space Marines?
Scrapbuilding. Too many players of those factions love making their own shit and using unofficial bits. Nobody who does Tau or Eldar go outside Tau or Eldar boxes, and very few who do Marines are willing to grab some of the million of counts-as space marines out there. And Skitarii and CultMech have been something people have been wanting for literally more than a decade. Why bother making good kits and good rules for people who aren't your customers in the first place?
>>46640684
Where are the rules for that fella found?
Since some people are still talking about SMASHFUCKER, I have to ask: this new warlord trait for the iron hands grants +1 to his feel no pain.
I checked the basic rulebook, and under the feel no pain part, it doesn't say it can't be improved to be more than 2+++.
So does that mean in terms of RAW that smahsfucker can be given a 1+ feel no pain, or is there another part of the rulebook that forbids that?
>>46640654
If you have the brain damage neccessary, then do it. You'll get one win, then he'll retool with more Haywire and maybe a D-sword on the Titan and go back to pushig your shit in.
>>46640721
Nothing forbids it, and because it's not a to-hit, to-wound, or saving throw, a roll of 1 doesn't automatically fail.
>>46640694
our only kits are this shitty ten year old kits, of COURSE we go outside our kits
we'd buy kits if there were kits to buy
>>46640720
IA13, with all the other good CSM units.
>>46640570
To be honest, I would love it if my opponent when to the trouble of converting and painting a cataphractii captain on a bike.
>>46640737
No, you wouldn't, because you didn't ten years ago when the kits were new. Everyone wanted to scrapbuild their own super-stompa or make their own looted wagon out of some other faction's kit, and now you're reaping the rewards.
>>46640721
>So does that mean in terms of RAW that smahsfucker can be given a 1+ feel no pain, or is there another part of the rulebook that forbids that?
yes and its retarded. also its not a new trait its just from clan rauakakakaaan
>>46640694
Just got my Khopeshes from Kromlech today in the mail. Fifteenth Legion here I come.
>>46640743
Gotcha, downloading now.
>>46640722
He doesn't really tailor by and large so it may be a decent option.
>>46640753
>No, you wouldn't, because you didn't ten years ago when the kits were new.
I did. I still have 50 berserkers and some 30 other csm infantry, four rhinos, two land raiders, six bikes, a metal dread, and a metal daemonprince.
>>46640736
>>46640762
So SMASHFUCKER has a chance to become litteraly unkillable?
What the flying fuck, that's just an auto-win if you field it.
>>46640782
His list is weak to super heavies in general. It's not list-tailoring to adjust your list to fit the meta.
>>46640639
>breachers don't have rapid fire instant death
The point is how they're considered a shit unit despite increased S and AP due to their range. Or are you saying a squad of cheap S6 AP3 is shit?
>>46640794
>unkillable?
S:D and instant death would ignore FNP and invulns, he isnt unkillable.
>>46640721
>Narthecium
>4+ FNP
>IH Tactics
>3+ FNP
>AFIW
>2+ FNP
>Gorgon's Chain
>1+ FNP
Hello darkness my old friend.
>>46640794
Weapons with Strength D or instant death (like that new Imperial Marine) skip FNP rolls. Other than that, yes.
>>46640794
What if I just tarpit him with my respawning Possessed? Not so tough now, huh?
>>46640794
yeah pretty much. gw is great at writing rules, incase tau/eldar werent already a dead giveaway of their skill at creating game mechanics.
>>46640793
>I did.
Boohoo for you. Some people actually bought WHFB models too but that still didn't change the fact that the majority of you are self entitled poorfags.
>>46640814
Roll of 1 still fails, right?
>>46640838
No. See >>46640736.
>>46640806
Tau don't have Drop Pods. If Fire Warriors could pay 35 points to facefuck the enemy in his deploment zone nearly risk-free, you can bet your britches that we'd see more Breachers.
>>46640810
>>46640814
He still has a Re-rollable 2+ Invulnerable, meaning D hits are still extremely unlikely to kill him. Only a roll of a 6 on the table will bring him down. Nothing else in the entire game can kill SUPER-GIGA-MEGAULTRA APOCALYPTIC SMASHFUCKER SSG10
>>46640836
lately I've been buying and converting other GW models for my CSM because their official CSM line is so shit
>tfw starting to finally win 40k games for the first time.
>>46640810
>>46640814
Gorgons chain give eternal warrior as long you have all your wounds. IIRC, eternal warrior negates that part of strength D and instant death
>>46640861
Having missed the last thread, I'm still not entirely certain how he's both on a bike and in terminator armour, since the Terminator Captain can't take a bike, and I thought the Cataphractii would be him copy-pasted.
>>46640861
Kill him? He has Eternal Warrior. Going to need 4 of those to kill him, and hope that IWND doesn't boot him back to full first.
>>46640881
>IIRC, eternal warrior negates that part of strength D and instant death
All Eternal Warrior does is change what Instant Death means from "You instantly die" to "You take one wound". It still keeps the tag on attacks.
>>46640886
Because of the last little paragraph of pic related
>>46640886
Cataphracti Armour is a replacement for terminator armour. However the rules for Cataphracti Armour state that "Cataphracti Armour counts as Terminator Armour for the purposes of Transports and Formations".
RAW wise, it doesn't count as terminator armour for the purposes of wargear, only for transports and formations. So you could therefore take it on a bike.
I'm just waiting now for someone to show up on a WIP thread with a brand new Cataphracti Smashfucker on a bike.
>>46640886
Termy Captain can take C:SM Special Issue Wargear. The bike is special issue war gear. Bikes also only prevent "Terminator Armour" and not "Cataphractii Terminator Armour." It's kinda balls, as I said in >>46640570, but technically legal.
>>46640804
Not the poster you're responding to but I don't think the Brass Scorpion is a good option against him. Grav with the TL canticle do 3 HPs a turn. Then he charges with Infiltrators and the +3 S canticle and finishes it off.
>>46640920
And I forgot the picture.
Please pardon my retardation
>>46640814
I thought Narthecium's are FNP +5?
>>46640737
I remember when our two ork plays were discussing getting mek guns due to the newest kit coming out.
Store owner asked them if they were going to buy it.
Nope, bought two trukks to convert in to gunz instead.at £31 a gun can you blame them?
>>46640858
You can drop way worse things than one S5 AP2 ID. It also has full scatter.
>>46640879
It is a good feel when you earn it.
>>46640950
Fuck, yeah, you're right. No one else noticed though, haha.
>>46640874
>tfw you're buying marines from FW/30k/GW to build CSM
"Oh I guess these are popular we should make more instead of updating CSM" - GW
>yfw
>>46638437
>Alpha Legion
You have to assault and destroy 3 Chaos Strongholds, each containing an Alpha Legion Commander. The objective is to eliminate Alpharius, who is one of the three commanders, but you don't know which.
Upon destroying the third and final stronghold, you learn that none of the commanders were actually Alpharius, and the mission can no longer be completed.
>>46640861
How would he fare against himself?
>>46640939
>>46640924
If you look at the rules for bikes it says terminator armor can't take them. Cataphractii counts as terminator armor.
>>46640753
>scrapbuild their own super-stompa
The Super-Stompa isn't a unit. There are no rules for it in the current iteration of the game.
>>46640968
he gets +1 FNP from the new detachment thing if hes within 12" of another IC from the same detachment. so he can still get 1+
such poorly written shit
>>46640994
Not for the purposes of wargear.
>>46640555
He is running an illegal war convo
For the admech formation you need two troop choices and he is only taking one
>mfw you faggots don't even read your rulebooks
No wonder you tried to argue with me that Smashfucker isn't a waste of points and Stormsurges don't instantly die to tank shocks.
You're just literally blind and are randomly stringing together letters on your keyboard to form coherent posts by pure chance! I should have known!
>>46640994
It only says for the purposes of embarking on transports, teleport homers, and formation restrictions. If they wanted it to count for wargear as well, it should have been stated. Or they could have just kept it simple and stated Cataphracti Armour counts as Terminator Armour.
>>46640950
He has a 6+\+1 to start with for being iron hands
>>46641013
What? No. You only need one unit of Vanguard and one unit of Rangers, both of which are troops.
Unless you mean the Cult Mechanicus, at which point he said he has "2 units of 3 kataphrons".
>>46641011
>Not for the purposes of wargear.
Why don't you try LOOKING AT THE RULES FOR BIKES you dumb faggot.
Are Heavy Bolter devastators good at killing horde armies? I feel like they would be.
>>46641013
Not that guy, but is
>2 units of 3 kataphrons
not 2 units of troops?
>>46641013
You don't need 2 troops first and foremost. You need a War Maniple. Second he has 2 troops, Vanguard are a troop and so are rangers.
A maniple is composed of -
1 unit of rangers
1 unit of vanguard
1 unit of ruststalkers
1 unit of infiltrators
1 walker (shooty OR CC)
1 Onager
His list is fully legal.
>>46640794
Jesus Christ.
We need a drawfag to draw a picture of SMASHFUCKER yelling "I AM INVINCIBLE" while standing atop a pile of the dead bodies of the best melee units and the most chessey units in the game.
>>46641024
Ah, but he doesn't have Terminator Armour. He has Cataphractii Terminator Armour, which has a different name and different set of rules. It counts as terminator armour for certain things, but that isn't one of them.
>>46641037
But it's not terminator armour. It's Cataphracti Armour.
>>46641025
>If they wanted it to count for wargear as well, it should have been stated.
>mfw theres people out there that will abuse this.
For what purpose.
>>46641013
He has 2 troops - 2 units of 3 kataphron is 2 troops.
>>46641065
To get +1T of course.
There's no reason not to take bikes if you can. Blame GW.
>>46641037
I have. And why don't you try looking at the rules for cataphrachtii armor, where it clearly does not say that it counts as terminator armor for the purposes of wargear.
Ergo, RAW he can take a bike as well.
>>46641054
>the most chessey units in the game.
So he'll be in the pile too?
>>46641024
When you replace your Terminator armour with Cataphractii Terminator armour, you are no longer wearing Terminator armour, friendo.
That is also why they specify where "Cataphractii Terminator armour counts as" in the rules of it. Notice it does not say counts as for wargear or bikes and that bikes are not transports.But keep raging about other people spewing ignorant shit, you oblivious mongol.
>>46641024
Cataphractii terminator armour is not terminator armour.
It only counts as terminator armour for the purpose a of transports and teleporter homers.
>>46641061
>>46641056
The RAI is so clear that it's pointless to try to RAW rules lawyer this, as the game doesn't even work RAW. Certain interactions can be deliberately caused that send the game into a freeze state, RAW.
Marines can't even take transports because they don't have chapter tactics and marine armies "must all have the same chapter tactic".
>>46641024
Cataphract TDA is a different piece of wargear to regular TDA.
>just bought more IG.
>Decide to read up on SM chapters.
>Find out about the Iron Hands.
>PrettyCoolFluffThere.jpg
>Apparently they've some sort of OP build?
>mfw I learn about Smash
>what IS this!?
I didn't even know about them until now, I just liked their fluff a lot, and wanted to play them or a sucessor.
>>46641042
Only if you're imperial fists.
bikes are gay away, they dont fit inside spartans. :^)
>>46641081
No, he wpuld be battling himself, and both would be yelling it, as the only thing that can stop a SMASHFUCKER is another, higher tier SMASHFUCKER, or if it's MEGAULTRA APOCALYPTIC SMASHFUCKER SSG10, the onyl thing that can garuntee tarpit him forever is another MEGAULTRA APOCALYPTIC SMASHFUCKER SSG10.
It's like M.A.D.
>>46641117
Yeah they do. They're just not allowed to go inside.
>>46641117
SMASHFUCKER could find away to make it work, I'm sure.
No tournament or opponent with a brain will allow you to use this RAW interpretation except for shits and giggles.
It's not even worth abusing since it's a waste of points you could be spending on more Skyhammer detachments or grav guns.
>>46641086
It's not bait, that statement is 100% true. Learn to read, motherfucker.
>>46640939
>actual S&P, not the FW not-S&P
>S&P is conferred to the unit
>S&P gives Relentless
So, what sort of unit should we put him into to give them Relentless? Grav-cannon devastators?
>>46641109
I'm considering doing fluffy IH now that Imperial Fists have gotten updated and gotten next to nothing. I had such high hopes for the Sternhammer, and instead I got Stubborn on ATSKNF marines and a boost to my buildings in a list without a Fortification slot. Time to mechanize, I guess.
>>46641149
>It's not even worth abusing since it's a waste of points you could be spending on more Skyhammer detachments or grav guns.
As this anon points out
>>46640590
You can do both.
>>46641095
I don't see any contridiction with what you have said. A single detachment must have the SAME chapter tactics, transports have no chapter tactics so they are unable to take a different set of chapter tactics regardless.
>>46641170
No, he's best left in his command squad.
But you have 730 points left over for a min MEGAULTRA APOCALYPTIC SMASHFUCKER SSG10, so you can get another captain with cataphrachtii armor and do that as well.
>>46641116
Good thing I am.
>>46641032
>>46641045
>>46641047
>>46641071
Shit my bad, I'm blind as fuck
I read that as he only had one unit of 3 kataphrons
>>46641173
All your bolters are twin linked.
>>46641193
>No, he's best left in his command squad.
Command squad can't have heavy weapons, so what's the point?
>>46641193
You can't get another due to him being made of lots of unique relics.
>whines about single shitty anniversary marine upgrade
>tries to cheese terminators onto bikes
Make up your minds.
>>46641213
Whoop de shit, they're still bolters in a game with centurion devs and Smashfucker.
So with the new Iron Hands bullshit every vehicle within 12'' of an IC gets power of the machine spirit.
Does that mean that I can move a vindicator 12'' and still fire the cannon? Furthermore, if I have a squadron, can I have all three fire their cannons AT DIFFERENT TARGETS?
>>46641222
No, not another SMASHFUCKER, another captain in cataphrachtii.
You don't need the rest, only the armor for S&P
>>46641230
Building a broken list for fun =/= playing said broken list.
So how long will it take for people to complain on other sites about the newly coined SUPER-GIGA MEGAULTRA APOCALYPTIC SMASHFRAKER?
>>46641264
I think one of the 1d4chan editors already put him down as "SMASHFUCKER PRIME" in his equipment set. That might be easier to say in conversations than SUPER-GIGA MEGAULTRA APOCALYPTIC SMASHFUCKER"
>>46641264
Forgot about the SSG10.
>>46641247
I would venture to say that the sternhammer options for the decurion are objectively the best. You can take dev squads out the ying yang.
>>46641149
No tournament or opponent with a brain would allow eldar or tau to get away with the shit they do but that is not the case.
"If GW wanted to keep him off a bike they would have simply stated that it counts as terminator armour for all purposes rather than being so specific"
>>46640939
Is that the only book where that cataphractii rule is mentioned?
>>46641311
For 40k, yes. It's the one we've all been waiting for.
>>46641277
It's easier to say but there's something about the longer name that I love. How would Ferrus react to this update?
>mfw all these idiots are falling for the IH decurion noobtrap
>mfw the real way to run this shit is straight CAD double spartan 20 cataphractii cataphractii smashfucker and sheild eternal oldschool chaptermaster smashfucker with allied ether sang priests/libby conclave/whatever
heh
>>46641311
Seeing as it was just added into 40k with that book....
>>46641309
>"If GW wanted to keep him off a bike they would have simply stated that it counts as terminator armour for all purposes rather than being so specific"
You sure about that? Look at the Start Collecting Necrons rules language.
GW could easily have left it out or confused bikes with transports. You couldn't even buy special weapons on a command squad until it was FAQ'd.
>>46641299
> Devs and Centurions as a solo choice
Well fuck me running. I stand corrected and take back everything I said bad about the Fists. Still a little pissy they don't have a Fortification slot and 2/3 of their command benefits are shit, though.
>>46641262
>anniversary marine is broken
Stay bad.
It's not a force multiplier, and as a single model. it's not even that good.
>>46641277
1d4chan is calling him MEGAULTRA APOCALYPTIC SMASHFUCKER SSG10.
Though in their article they fail to mention he has a 1+ Feel no pain, they still have it down as a 2+++
Iron Knights.Imperial Fists sucessor with a cool shield on their shouder.
>>46641277
I'm fine with smashfucker prime
>>46641321
Then he doesn't get +1 to his feel no pain from the decurion and two warlord traits.
Do you not want a totally legal 100% RAW 1 up feel no pain? Why do you want him to die
>>46641336
I don't even care about the Imperial marine. My only point in that post is that the people talking about smash on a bike are building the list for fun. No one is going to painstakingly model this for a rule slip that will be FAQ'd in a few weeks anyways. So saying, "I can't believe you'd do this while bitching about the imperial marine" is a false comparison, because people aren't doing it.
>>46641368
>Why do you want him to die
because im bringing 2 of them instead ;^)
>>46641346
They also forgot about the Libraians getting the power with rerolling all saves, and that he has 2 warlord traits.
Though this should be fixed soon, I'm betting
>>46641369
>implying they'll fix this
>implying some of Anons aren't mad enough to model that
>implying you wouldn't want to see the SSG10 in his full glory for one mock battle
>>46641325
Look, we all know GW hires lobomized chimps to write their rules but people like to follow rules to the letter as we can never be 100% sure what they were intended to allow.
I agree that this is probably a mistake but what if I made a really cool model of a cataphractii captain riding a huge bike. Would you allow me to use him, please?
>>46641369
>this getting FAQ'd out anytime soon.
Lol. This will be this way for a quite a while, given how long GW takes to release a FAQ
>>46641394
Rerolling ALL saves is totally redundant when he already has it from Cataphracti Armour. Cataphracti gives him re-rolling 1s on his Invulnerable save. And then you need a librarian rolling Sanctic to give him a +1 invuln to get a re-rollable 2++, that's what's listed in the post.
>>46641398
Well, with that new "ask us your rule questions and we'll answer" thing, I actually built a small, fragile, tiny morsel of hope in GW. Just enough that it'll hurt when they trample over it, but it's still flickering there dimly.I'd love to see one on tabletop. I'd lose, but I play Deldar, so what's the worse that can happen? A freaking space marine gets a free, better disintegrator gun than my disintegrator cannons.I really just hope that means the next deldar update will have new dinintegrators, so I'm pretty excited, honestly.
Wait, so what exactly are Imperial Fists getting?
Should I buy the supplement as an Imperial Fists player?
>>46641454
It needs to be FAQ'd, but not before a mockup battle is done first. We have to see this update in its true cheesy glory.
>>46641427
thats why the double smashfucker spartan cataphractii star is superior is supreme
you have a 2++ 3++(reroll 1's) 2+++FNP cataphractii fucker in one and the other star has the other libbys in it with the 4W chaptermaster old school fucker and thats the one that gets the reroll bullshit.
2>1
>>46641427
>Rerolling ALL saves is totally redundant when he already has it from Cataphracti Armour. Cataphracti gives him re-rolling 1s on his Invulnerable save.
True I guess, though the min formation requires 3 Libraians, one of which gives him a 4+ It Will Not Die (another thing the article forgot to mention) and rerolling ones in the shooting phase (again, not mentioned). And you can take the min list, a grave spam skyhammer and have enough left over for 2 Libraians to be mastery level 2.
With 5 psyic powers in the army I'm sure you can get santic and the rerolling all saves, so that not only does MEGAULTRA APOCALYPTIC SMASHFUCKER SSG10 reroll his saves, but the ablative wounds of the command squad do as well, giving him another layer of protection.
>>46641479
Stop me if you've heard any of this before.
>>46641501
> Implying Smashfucker Prime needs his command squad to ablate wounds for him
> Implying Smashfucker Prime couldn't just stand in front of his squad and laugh at anyone that wants to kill him
> Implying he doesn't need his squad alive as an insurance against tarpits
>>46641494
You can't have double MEGAULTRA APOCALYPTIC SMASHFUCKER SSG10. Many of the things that make him OP can only be taken once per army.
You can have MEGAULTRA APOCALYPTIC SMASHFUCKER SSG10 and regular old MEGA-SMASHFUCKER in the decurion though.
>>46641551
>>46641541
> Implying anything S10 ap2 doesn't rip right through him
You still don't get FnP against Instant Death if you have Eternal Warrior, you know.
>>46641551
>Centurions as heavy support
Holy shit my group is going to be so fucking mad.
>>46641533
>Skyhammer is in there
Oh baby I'm so buying this.
>>46641488
What's the practical difference between cataphractii armour and artificer armour on a bike in this case anyway?
The only difference seems to be cataphractii smashfucker can reroll invulnerables if 1 without psyker fuckery but can't over watch or sweep anyone.
>>46641591
>What's the practical difference between cataphractii armour and artificer armour on a bike in this case anyway?
>The only difference seems to be cataphractii smashfucker can reroll invulnerables if 1 without psyker fuckery but can't over watch or sweep anyone.
Because it gives him a rerollable 2++ invulnerable save.
>All the shit going on in this thread
Why dont you guys play a GOOD game like killteam?
>>46641550
>Many of the things that make him OP can only be taken once per army.
you put the chain on the cataphractii one, the other one takes shield eternal. ctaphractii one if the warlord so he gets the 3++ with reroll and 2+++. the other one is the oldschool shield eternal fucker so you give him the libby support since the other one doesnt need it. and both of the deathstars are huge 10man cataphractii units with a mix of claws inside spartans that are IH so they dont die so good.
shits disgusting and with some fuckery can fit in 1850
>>46641576
> Implying Smashfucker Prime is scared of S10 AP2 when he already has a Rerollable 2++.
>>46641576
> Implying anything S10 ap2 doesn't rip right through him
>rerollable 2++
He's going to be loving every laugh.
>>46641610
>>46641621
I play several of them. 40k works rather well as a beer and pretzels game, with the sort of person that doesn't start a new game because they've played 40k for a decade or more.
>>46641624
>>46641628
How are you guaranteeing Sanctuary and the Warlord Trait, by the way? Because you're talking like he'll have it every time.
Is somebody mathhammering out MEGAULTRA APOCALYPTIC SMASHFUCKER SSG10 vs. all the primarchs? Because somebody really should.
Also, on a less serious note, could MEGAULTRA APOCALYPTIC SMASHFUCKER SSG10 beat one punch man, or have we still not reached that level of power yet?
>>46641621
>kill team is no longer a squad vs. brutes stronghold infiltration game
>it's just regular warham with low points and some funny rules
No, that's okay.
>>46641651
Minimum of 3 Librarians in a Librarius Conclave sitting around with him?
He also has the 2+ Feel No Pain without the warlord trait. It's just that the Warlord Trait gives him a 1+ Feel No Pain.
>>46641664
One Punch Man has Strength D+5, so that the minimum number he can roll on the D table is a 6. Sadly, Smashfucker Prime can't actually beat One Punch Man, as he doesn't have enough wounds, and/or the multiple overlapping re-rollable IWND needed to tank several D hits.
>>46641651
He doesn't need the warlord trait to get the 1+ feel no pain, and with enough points to get 2 MEGAULTRA APOCALYPTIC SMASHFUCKER SSG10 and 5 mastery level 2 Libraians on bikes in the conclave, one of which gives both MEGAULTRA APOCALYPTIC SMASHFUCKER SSG10 a 4+ It Will Not Die, it's practically guaranteed that even strength D or instant death won't kill him.
I have one question, does D weapons have instant dead as part of their rules? That guy was using D flamers on my wracks and when I attempt to use FNP he told me I couldn't because the D flamers had instant dead, I told him that they were only strength 4 and normal D only causes ID according to the strength value, this case 4, but he said that all D weapons have ID, is he right? Because I always assume all Craftworld eldar players are cheaters.
>>46641696
>multiple overlapping re-rollable IWND needed to tank several D hits.
Does his 4+ It will not die not do enough? Is there a way to get it to 3+ IWND or even 2 or 1+?
>>46641685
Thats what HoR is for
>>46641621
>killteam
Kill Team's good but Strike Forces (FW's version of it) is much better, you make the army on a model by model basis isntead of full squads.
>>46641700
>He doesn't need the warlord trait to get the 1+ feel no pain
> Narthecium
5+
> IH
4+
> Decurion
3+
> Gorgon's Chain
2+
> ?????
1+????
>>46641729
I started going through the rules for that the other day. So far it seems like_fun.
>not taking double cataphractii smashfuckers, one with chain, one with sheidl eternal, both have rerollable 3++, 20 cataphractii in 2 spartans AND allying in lysander
heh
>>46641719
You need to be able to roll 30 or so 2+ IWND a turn in order to actually tank your way through Saitama's D attacks.
> Iron hands have +1 FnP while in their detachment
Wait, so their detachment is literally the Decurion? But better?
>>46641741
Oh shoot, you're right.
Are there no powers that give a +1 to feel no pain?
Still, 2+/2++/2+++/2++++ with a 4+ it will not die re-rolling all saves is practically the same as a 1+++.
Don't know the exact chance off the top of my head, but 1d4chan figured out it takes 7776 conscripts to wound him, so theres that.
>>46641750
Im playing a campaign of it right now. It is very fun.
Ive got a sanguinary priest with a 3+ FNP which is absolutely savage when plasma is rare and heavy weapons are almost unheard of(and very easy to get around with the high number of LOS blocking and cover)
>>46641758
We get it, your so smart.
Now would you please stop spamming?
>>46641831
>spamming
i dont think you know what that word means.
fuck libbys cataphractii smash doesnt even need them
So, are Space Marines now more broken than Eldar and Tau, or just on-par with them?
>>46641729
What HoR?Am new to 40k, plz no bully.
>>46641850
They can be more broken, but on average no.
>>46641845
2+++>3+++, that's a fact.
Though you used to play CSM, right, so I doubt you can into mathhammer.
>>46641709
tell your friend to read the rules, destroyer only has instant death on 6 to wound. d-scythes have -1 to destroyer table so they can only do multi wounds. still a few d templates is enough to wipe out just about everything
>>46641812
>plasma is rare
The hell kind of Kill Teams are you playing? The first week at my LGS we had a guy with three Thunderwolves including his Leader, me with a five-man tactical squad with a plasmagun, a Necron player with wraiths, two Chaos players - one with nurgle bikers with a plasmagun in them and one with Raptors with a plasmagun in THEM, and a Guard player with a plasma or melta in each vet squad.
>>46638173
Good fucking luck. Necrons and Guard are 2 completely different levels in terms of codex power. You will lose almost every time. Ask your opponent to tone down his list so you guys can have a fun, even game.
>>46641862
https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Kill_Team
>>46641883
>destroyer only has instant death on 6 to wound
D weapons count as Strength 10 for the purposes of Instant Death.
>>46641862
HoR is Herald of Ruins. It's a group that publishes a better version of killteam
>>46641909
> Haven't updated since early 2014
> using the present tense
>>46641880
>2+++>3+++
psychers dont even work you fucking idiot, ever heard a culexus assassin? you are so fucking bad at this game.
2 smashfuckers + lysander + culexus +20 cataphractii > 1 smashfucker + worthless libby. git gud retard
>>46641884
Relatively i mean. You obviously squeeze as much plasma as you can but at 200 points thats only going to be 2 guns or so.
Even then, plasma doesnt mean dick to a 3+ FNP 3 wound model. its the rockets that suck ass but thankfully are either heavy weapons or orks
>>46641709
He's right in that your wracks would die to Instant Death, but not for those reasons. D weapons count as having S10. Wracks have T4. Because the weapon strength is twice or more than your toughness, they die to instant death.
Additionally, Feel No Point rolls can never be taken against D weapons OR weapons with Instant Death. That is in the rulebook.
>>46641899
Doesn't FNP rule say that D weapon hits negate FNP?
>>46641924
>psychers dont even work you fucking idiot, ever heard a culexus assassin? you are so fucking bad at this game.
SUPER-GIGA-MEGAULTRA APOCALYPTIC SMASHFUCKER SSG10 can kill a culexus without the aid of the libbys, negating it's use.
Seriously either learn to mathhammer or stop spewing shit.
>>46640452
>but why not just merge the Daemon and CSM codices together then?
This was the point of Khorne Daemonkin and we're expecting a major thing for Tzeentch soon, with the space wolf stuff. Khorne Daemonkin are certainly not top notch but by Chaos standards they're really cool and effective.
>>46641959
Yes, but the other point is true as well.
>>46641709
adding pic related to >>46641952 so you can see for yourself.
>>46641962
>hes so fucking stupid that he thinks 1 2+++ rerollable smashfucker is better than 2 of them without having to deal with psycher (which never work in tournament play, but youd know that if you werent retarded)
kek
How's this list teegee? It's an attempt at fluffy Inquisition dudes.
PRIMARY DETACHMENT - INQUISITION
HQ - Ordo Malleus Inquisitor - 87
Power Armor
Hellrifle
Daemonblade
Psyker (ML 1)
Empyrean Brain Mines
3x Servo Skulls
HQ - Ordo Xenos Inquisitor - 70
Conversion Beamer
ELITES 1 - 213
7x Crusader
2x Death Cult Assassin
1x Eviscerator Priest w/ PP
2x Acolytes Power Armor Plasma Guns
1x Acolyte Power Axe Power Armor Combi-Melta
Dedicated Transport - Chimera - 65
Storm Bolter
Psybolt Ammunition
2x Heavy Bolters
Elites 2 - 183
2x Jokaero Weaponsmith
1x Psyker
7x Acolytes w/ Storm Bolters
3x Acolytes w/ Carapace and Plasma Guns
ALLIED DETACHMENT - SPACE MARINES EXORCISTS
HQ - Librarian - 100
Bike
Plasma Gun
TROOPS - Tactical Squad - 85
1x Plasma Pistol
1x Boltgun Sarge
Tactical Squad - 85
1x Plasma Gun
1x Boltgun sarge
ALLIED DETACHMENT - MILITARUM TEMPESTUS
HQ - Command Squad - 140
4x Melta Guns
1x Plasma Pistol
TROOPS - Scions - 175
2x Plasma Guns
1x Plasma Pistol
+5 Scions
1203/1200. Most of my opponents don't care if it's only like 5 pts over and I can always drop a servo skull.
https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Chapter_Master_Smashfucker#SMASHFUCKER_PRIME_VERSUS_THE_PRIMARCHS
Smashfucker is currently winning:
Smashfucker: 2
Primarchs: 0
More mathhammer to come. At the end of this I'm going to do a super battle where Smashfucker faces off every primarch in the entire game all at once. Though the way things are looking, I don't think every primarch in the entire game can do enough damage to bring Smashfucker down.
So, I keep hearing Tau players buffing their BS to 10. Is that necessary or is it overkill?
>>46641996
Whatever man, you're wrong, but I have better things to do than basically do the Warhammer version of duck season and rabbit season with some frogposting autists, so fine, you win.
Your way is better. Happy now?
>>46642027
Also, according to my math, it would take 71 clones of Angron to kill SMASHFUCKER PRIME.
>>46642028
Wildly overkill. Most of the time, 5 will do. 6, if the weapon's Gets Hot. That tends to be the hyperbole of people who have been left with a bad taste in their mouth from facing Tau.
>>46642043
>your wrong
>but i cant prove shit
>actually youre right
shouldve just said that from the start 2bh lad
>>46642027
Who has he faced so far?
>>46642061
I've done Perturabo and Angron. Next up is Rowboat Girlyman, and then Corax.
>>46642058
That's not what I'm saying, but whatever. Feel superior of you want, I really don't care.
>>46642028
Complete overkill. You need 7 markerlight hits for most units to get to 10, which means you're looking at firing 14 of them for that many counters on most units.
More efficient is paying 2 counters to boost BS from 3 to 5, and another 2 to ignore cover. That's 4 hits, which means you only need around 8 markerlights.
Furthermore, BS 10 is indistinguishable from BS 5 with a twin-linked gun.
Always remember when facing Tau to kill their markerlights quickly. They're a huge force multiplier.
>>46642027
I'm not seeing the Primarchs fight yet.
>>46641026
It still comes out to only a 2++ FnP by my count.
>>46642086
>Feel superior of you want
oh i do
>>46642112
Add in the Marine Decurion.
>>46641664
>one punch man
Aw shit now what this all about?
>>46642027
>only has 3 wounds
lel. Clearly the easiest way to kill him is to have36vindicare assassins fire Shield-Breaker Rounds. No armour, invuln, or cover saves of any kind allowed.
>>46642058
>>your wrong
>>but i cant prove shit
>He thinks this doesn't apply to both of you.
Whatever I'm glad you two are going to shut up now.
>>46642224
>trying to stir it back up
M8, why?
>>46642224
Why the fuck would you start it up again?
>>46642061
>>46642104
Nope, for shits and giggles I skipped to Horus. Smashfucker Prime Wins again.
>>46642224
ive already proven shit
2 rerollable 3++ > 1 rerollable 2++ because its literally 2 motherfuckers in 2 different places at the same time smashfucking 2x the amount of shit without having to rely on psychic bullshit.
>>46642216
>lel. Clearly the easiest way to kill him is to have 36 vindicare assassins fire Shield-Breaker Rounds. No armour, invuln, or cover saves of any kind allowed.
He still gets his rerollable 1+ feel no pain
New shitposting
>>46642260
>>46642266
Does he? Oh, the salamander thing. Well, without it, 36 is pretty close. More like 40 since I was just assuming BS 8 will hit, which isn't the case.
>>46642322
You can't wound something with a 1+ feel no pain, especially not a rerolable one.
>loyalists have a character that makes the wraithknight, GUO, and every damn thing in the game look weak and easy to hurt
i'm happy for you loyalists, enough your new fancy fun stuff
>>46640443
>The Rai-Dens
>Chapter creed: And they run when the sun comes up
>>46642358
>S5
>vs GUO/WK
>>46642470
He has a combi-meltat that can be fired an infinite number of times, a thunderhammer and a lighting claw
>>46641512
got any for Ultras?
>>46642544
>S5 AP2
>combi-melta
Lol try again.
>>46642722
How about you try again? What on earth about thunderhammer and lightning claw makes you think he's at all talking about the special 30th anniversary marine?
![1460489224697[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/Xcu8cI1.jpg "1460489224697[1]")
