When people call the Tau "space commies" when Communism is the abolition of class structures when Tau have one of the strictest class structures
>>46480555
Is this a troll thread where people point out that every communist government has a class system?
>>46480555
Tau'ism is strongly centered around neglecting/surrendering your personal desires and interests to that of society at large, suppressing individuality and criticsm. Same as with the 'communist new man' attempts.
Tau'ism is actually space confucianism
When a species spends a century to reach adulthood, but comes out with a comparable level of skill as one that took only a decade and a half, then both proceed to develop at the exact same speed and have the exact same possible limits.
Rather than a rigid class system it's pretty much on the level of selective breeding.
>>46480882
I see what you did there
>>46480555
They're probably more national-socialist than communist, like everything in 40K.
What does it matter. It's an Alien philosophy/political system invented thousands of years into the future. It'd be like Attila the Hun discussing about the merits of Liberalism.
>>46481895
>It'd be like Attila the Hun discussing about the merits of Liberalism.
Won't stop authors from trying.
>>46480659
No, it's a troll thread where I have to point out that every "communist" government is fascist. Is democracy fundamentally flawed because there's only one ``candidate" on the ``ballot" for the position of ``President" of the ``Democratic" ``Republic" of Congo?
>>46483202
>true communism has never been done before!!!!!!!!
>>46483202
>every "communist" government is fascist
Except that when going by the literal definition of a Communist State, both China and the USSR fit the bill. Honestly go fuck yourself kid.
>>46483260
Please, provide a single counterexample
>>46483284
You understand that the phrase "communist dictator" is an oxymoron, correct?
>>46483334
His counter examples could be the USSR China, or Vietnam.
Also, please. Even ignoring that you claimed Stalin's Russia was fucking Fascist, which is the stupidest statement I have ever heard, how do you argue that the USSR post Stalin wasn't communist?
>>46483433
Not that guy, but you're fucking retarded if you believe in a "Communist" "state."
>>46483284
>>46483433
they were
>state capitalism
>>46483202
The difference is there are tons of examples of functioning democratic republics. If every single time you try something it turns out shitty and totally different from how your theory said it would, you should really start asking yourself whether your theory is shit.
>>46483671
ML states turn out shit while reform socialists generally run functional countries out in europe. And then, democratic socialists like ortega don't have the basketcase dictatorships like hard commie countries.
The truth is that there's shitloads of varieties of socialism and communism and about 5 or 6 of them that are internationally relevant.
These sort of discussions always fuck up because one person is talking about one kind of leftism, someone else is talking about a different kind and everyone is treating all types of leftism as if they're the same thing.
>>46483433
Is it really that hard to tell the difference between
>Everyone owns everything
and
>No one owns anything
>You know, except for the dictator and his cronies
Communism is probably impossible in a group larger than a couple hundred. Any country you've ever heard of that called itself communist is literally just fascism by another name.
How much has the political climate really changed in Russia since the collapse of the USSR and they started calling themselves a democracy (well, constitutional republic, nominally the same as the US)?
>>46480555
People don't call them 'space commies' because they literally think the Tau are communist, idiot. People call them 'space commies' because nobody likes commies and nobody likes the Tau.
>>46483433
The problem anon is that communism doesn't fucking exist. "True" Communism CAN'T exist because it's an impossible utopia. In reality communism actually does mean a despot dictatorship because that's what it always degenerates into.
>>46483671
>If every single time you try something it turns out shitty and totally different from how your theory said it would, you should really start asking yourself whether your theory is shit.
No one has ever actually tried it on a national scale. The problem is that revolutions require leaders, and communism requires a lack of leaders. Once someone has led a success revolution and has complete power over a country, he's not going to immediately throw that all away and become just like everyone else. Even George Washington was effectively king of the US for 8 years.
when people think slaanesh is all about dick and pussy
its the same people that think tzeentch looks like a lord of change
>>46484143
I always figured tzeentch would look like an amorphous blob of psychic fuck you honestly.
>>46484059
It's because it can't be tried on a national scale. Trying to achieve communism causes virtually the entire capitalist world to declare war on you.
Lenin was the first far left leader to successfully take over a country. There had been plenty of failed uprisings at this point, hell the destruction of the paris commune inspired his theories about organization.
A leaderless and non-heirachal revolt is incapable of defending itself or winning a war. That's why marxist-lenninist theory is based around "how to win a war" as that was the main problem facing communists. So there's a vanguard of professional revolutionaries organized in a structure based on the prussian military.
Russia tried the whole thing of having workers councils run everything and virtually no government, full communism at first. The problem of that is it completely doesn't work when a country is in the middle of both a civil war and an external invasion.
So the 20th century communist regimes were what happened when theory met reality and failed. Then the theory was altered so that it wouldn't be a utopian pipe dream.
to GET BACK ON TRACK, i always get miffed whenever people consider the dark eldar to be the less common or rarer faction of the species
>>46480882
You FUCKER
>>46480555
Ehhh the Tau have more of a caste system than a class structure as such, and whilst I think almost all communists on Earth would agree that caste systems are Not Communist, it's probably possible to make the case in the context of an alien race?
More than that it's pretty good shorthand for explaining what the Tau are about though; they're a brutal dictatorship with extremely strict expectations for members of society, but they also put the needs of the group before those of the individual, and are communal in organizing who gets what and who DOES what.
So I wouldn't call them "space commies" when I was in a group of polisci bros, but if you want to explain to someone not really into polisci or 40K what the Tau are about, it's not the worst way to do so.
communism works just fine the trick is that it only works if literally everybody involved is on board, so there's no way to change a society and make it communist
Which means that communism will never play out on a large scale in our lifetimes
But within our lifetimes you will see the rise of self sufficient communist communities everywhere
>>46483911
>How much has the political climate really changed in Russia since the collapse of the USSR
It has changed radically since that time. I mean, just look at the expanded role of the Orthodox Church and the involvement of independent businessmen in the Government. Look at foreign relations with former bloc nations and the role of the military in government.
>Any country you've ever heard of that called itself communist is literally just fascism by another name.
Only no. Even under dictators, those communist countries had policies that where diametrically opposed to fascist ideologies and policies. Fascism was literally founded as an extreme opposite to liberalism and Marxism.
Besides. What you would bend over backwards to call communism is impossible outside of small tribes, so there is no point in defending it.
>>46484339
Probably because the Eldar have a bunch of Craftworlds but the Dark Eldar have one "city". People who don't read about what Commorragh really is think that means it's relatively tiny.
I think a much more apt name for them if I were to describe them to someone who had no idea who they were would be "Japanese clans in space"
Because thats what they are, its a clan based caste system.
>>46484285
I think that unlike the first three, Tzeentch looks different every time you look at him.
And that you are driven insane by looking at him, so noone can say for sure.
When people call the Adeptus Mechanicus stupid for not trying to fuck around with the scraps of technology they have left over from two galactic-wide civil wars
>>46484397
>Look at foreign relations with former bloc nations and the role of the military in government.
Yeah, all those former bloc nations sure are glad to have their independence watched over and protected by mother Russia.
>t. Ukraine
>Even under dictators, those communist countries had policies that where diametrically opposed to fascist ideologies and policies.
Like what? That you don't pay for the no food you get if you're not one of the cool kids, vs having to pay for your no food?
but the castle system dictates your work type rather than your status
a member of the air caste is no better or worse than a member of the water caste other than from their own achievements or merits
the way you are born has no impact on your socio-economic status in the tau system so it is fairly communist
The issue is the merchants and trade which make it a less strict communism as property is theft
Also arguably ethereals are higher in status and respected but that is probably the issue of communism that the ruling group is still better off regardless so its not 'perfect communism'
>>46480555
Communism is supposed to be the abolition of class structure, in the same way that the Greater Good is supposed to be the total equality of all beings.
For the same reason that a classless stateless society is an oxymoron, a hierarchical society where everyone is equal is also impossible. Both are actually just tools to legitimize a centralization of power.
"Communism" can't be achieved through socialism, the anarchists were right all along.
Although there's still the matter if anarchism would really actually be better than what we have now.
>>46484516
>in the same way that the Greater Good is supposed to be the total equality of all beings.
Total equality is a capitalist ideal, though. It's what allows the 1% to justify fucking over everyone else because "they could have been here if they worked as hard as I did."
>>46484143
Khorne looks like a Nid, Slaanesh looks like it is in withdrawal, Nurgle looks like he was just in an orgy and Tzeetch looks like a mollusk.
>>46484542
Could it be much worse? I'm honestly not sure.
>>46480555
yeah, Tau are space goblins.
>>46484587
>Blaming the 1% for your problems
Bill Gates didn't take any money out of your pocket that you didn't give him willingly. The government did, though.
>>46484600
The good ol' days, friend.
>>46484587
I'm referring to the Tau, who are big on equality, but still have one group who are obviously in charge and valued more than the others, i.e. the Ethereals.
>>46484601
If you look at history for a second, you'll see that what we have now isn't actually bad.
>>46484587
>what allows the 1% to justify fucking over everyone else because "they could have been here if they worked as hard as I did."
This is an strawman, people will advocate capitalim not because of the possibility that they might have been millionaires, but because they believe it is the best system to run an economy, the same system that protects the 1% properties also protects their own, which might not be at the same level, but is better than what other systems have to offer, the average middle class individual lives the life of a king when compared to most people through the ages.
>>46484659
Because it's based on Plato's Republic. A ruling philosopher king class, a soldier class, etc. It just has the aesthetics of weeaboo mecha, and the writers write it out like an oppressive Communist regime.
>>46484634
Look, if you have done literally zero reading about Communism, why are you even talking about it? Even reading the Communist Manifesto would give you a much greater clue than you have now, and that's just an early piece of semi-intellectual rabble rousing. What's next? "There can never be equality because people aren't equal?"
>>46484795
>reminder that rational pricing can't occur in a planned economy
>>46484795
>fuck! I have no arguments...
>I will just tell him to read more!
>>46484510
>a member of the air caste is no better or worse than a member of the water caste other than from their own achievements or merits
Except for the etherial cast... which are the bosses.
>>46484741
Plato's republic would be an incredibly oppressive place to live as well.
>>46484486
This. On top of the fact that one wrong bit of AI can lead to murderous robots, a wrong angle/design can summon daemons from the warp, the tech typically has to be designed to withstand the various climates and environments that humans inhabit (everything from paradise worlds to god damn dead worlds), etc. It's not even easy to design technology on Earth in modern times. Now imagine you needed tech that would not only need to work in environments like jungle planets, death worlds, ice worlds, rocky worlds, oceanic worlds, hive worlds, etc., but also be able to withstand the warp and various other forces that don't even make sense according to our normal logic. It's not that easy to just come up with shit. And the only stuff that typically does work is stuff from the Golden Age of Technology.
On top of the fact that most of this information was lost and you just lost your god who did know this shit and all his sons fucked off, died, or became evil. And half of your own scientists fucked off to the warp and tore Mars, the library of all this knowledge, a new asshole. To say "omg just make a new fukn technology alredy!" is retarded.
>>46484891
I know. I'm not the dude you were fighting with. Just saying it aligns more with that sort of caste system than Communism. The fluff is what makes it seem similar to Communist gulags and stuff. But the actual government setup is closer to something along those lines.
>>46484510
>property is theft
>Hey bro can I use your toohbrush while I take a shit in your bed?
>but that is le personal property silly!
>what's the difference?
>magic!
>>46484955
I am not that guy.
And its funny how many people paint Plato as some kind of proto-fascist.
>>46480882
>the Tau of Pooh
>>46484996
He was. He believed in a very ordered society full of castes. He also believed in communal raising of children and then assigning them to the caste where they would fit best. With presumably kids who were smart going to the philosopher kings, kids who were strong and tough going into the soldier class, shit like that.
A lot of little ideas that would come to define Fascism and Communism came from his Republic that was ordered. He thought it was the best way to design a society.
>>46484882
you may want to read to the end before you reply you silly goose
>>46484992
i have literally no idea what you are saying
I don't believe that property is theft is that whats you are trying to mock
i was getting into the perspective of a communist critiquing tau caste
but btw you can borrow my toothbrush while you take a shit in my bed anytime sweetheart <3
>>46480882
Taoism and confusionism are pretty opposed tho
>>46484634
The world would be a much better place with more Bill Gateses and fewer Larry Ellisons and Steve Jobses. I don't get why people seem to single him out for rich people hating. He's pretty much the posterchild for effective altruism.
>>46484740
Capitalism is great and would function well if corporations were the giant, faceless, uncaring, purely rational actors everyone likes to pretend they are. But instead, they're run by people, and those people are out to do what's best for themselves, not what's best for their company. Sometimes those are the same, sometimes it means running a company into the group and cashing out with a hundred million dollars.
The forty hour workweek is an example of something that benefits executives rather than businesses, since it's the point that the most work is extracted from each employee, rather than the point at which the most work per dollar is gained (which is somewhere around 25-30 hours a week). No one really cares about efficiency though, since the value of labor has been insanely devalued by a massive, generations-spanning price fixing scheme.
Just saw this banner while viewing this thread. Figured it was relevant.
>>46480555
>Communism is the abolition of class structures
In theory. In reality it creates a new bureaucratic upper class to run the command economy, but this isn't a "facts that trigger Marxists" thread.
>>46480555
But communism clearly has a class system, in theory it does away with classes, but in every actual regime that has followed communism there has always been "we are totally equal with opportunity except shit is strict and the bosses are best"
>>46485123
>The forty hour workweek is an example of something that benefits executives rather than businesses, since it's the point that the most work is extracted from each employee, rather than the point at which the most work per dollar is gained (which is somewhere around 25-30 hours a week).
When the 40 hour work week was made it was during the birth of unions and was in the 1800s. Before that, your average worker just worked pretty much until whenever the fuck the boss wanted them to. And farmers worked sun up to sun down. Then we came up with 8 hours a day with 8 for working, 8 for your personal time, and another 8 for sleep. Add that up by 5 (assuming weekends off), and you get 40. It wasn't MADE by executives to fuck over workers, it's a result of compromises made a long time ago. And it's a lot better than it once was. Maybe NOW we know it's not the most efficient, but nobody knew that back then enough to go "okay, let's make it 40 hours a week just to fuck everyone over".
>>46483202
>every "communist" government is fascist
So, your argument is that we can't judge practical examples of communism (a type of socialism) because every purportedly communist state actually practiced fascism (a slightly different type of socialism)? Give me a break, this meme of fascism being far right and communism being far left needs to die quickly. Fascism is far left and communism is farther left. pic related
>>46480555
While describing Tau society as "space communism" is wrong, describing them as "space communists" is perfectly accurate.
>>46485263
Fascism could be right wing or left wing. Depends on whoever is in charge of said Fascist state. But the left/right thing in and of itself needs to die. I don't care if an idea or right wing or left wing. That tells me nothing about it. I want to know if the idea is good or not and how useful it is, not whether or not it leans a particular way.
>>46484865
>>46485374
>Fascism could be right wing or left wing
Yeah if you shit on the definition of fascism and think every authoritarian government is fascist.
>But the left/right thing in and of itself needs to die
But i agree with this. When "right wing" can apply to both fascism and liberalism it becomes kind of meaningless.
>>46485513
That's mostly America though, most of the rest of the world's "left" & "right" are actually mutually exclusive.
>>46485542
The terms can mean so many different things they're meaningless.
>>46485374
>But the left/right thing in and of itself needs to die
True enough. It can be useful for talking about the political climate in a specific place and time, but it becomes useless while trying to compare two different types of radical socialism, fascism and communism, created by two different cultures and utilized by two other cultures. Calling fascism "right wing" or "left wing" says a lot more about how you feel about those two things than it does about fascism. I tend to think of "left" as being about centralization and at a certain point command economies, so I would call fascism leftist, but I realize that isn't objective.
My main point was that people try to paint fascism and communism as opposite extremes, when in actuality you could easily describe fascism as leftist.
>>46485513
>the definition of fascism
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascism
"Historians, political scientists, and other scholars have long debated the exact nature of fascism. Each interpretation of fascism is distinct, leaving many definitions too wide or narrow."
The only true system is a capitalist one run entirely by co-ops.
>>46485617
Well, yeah. But in the local context they have a given meaning. When you try to apply Texan views to Venezuela shit stops making sense real quick.
>>46485640
Yeah becaue every fag wants to call their political opponents fascists, but fascism is more than just an authoritarian government, it's also a social movement around the idea of national unity.
>>46484452
tzeentch always was the most eldritch of the chaos gods, except he's actually extremely smart rather than insane. of course once you reach a certain level of meta like tzeentch has done you pretty much look insane at that point anyway.
>>46480555
>Portable, man-held Directed.Energy.Weapons more powerful than present day ballistic firearms
>Plausible sense of scale is notoriously skewed
>GW can NOT into good writing and lore, or consistency, for that matter
I shiggy diggy.
Please hire better writers, GW. It's okay to retcon your mistakes and dish out a little extra dosh on creative types who aren't autistic.
>>46485993
>plausible sense of scale is notoriously skewed
obligatory planet of guardsmen
>>46480555
Lore view that triggers me:
>lol well if its a fantasy setting then you've GOT to have elves, right? xD
>>46486063
I wonder what they do with all the waste.....
>>46480815
So, North Korean Juche in space?
>>46486367
more or less
which means space commies
>>46480555
I'm more triggered by the fact that Tau men have vaginas instead of noses.
*Note the clitoris at the top of the vagina.
>>46486507
Tau men are much more susceptible to skull rape on the battle field and their menstrual period makes for an unpleasant surprise given that tampons cannot be worn without impairment of sight.
>>46486507
They probably have noses instead of genitals.
Masturbation for them is picking their nose.
>>46485374
The idea of abandoning a relevant divide like the age old "left and right" which is still very relevant in modern politics and tells us plenty of useful information regarding it and instead paint all policy ideas with the same brush and ask if a given policy is good or bad is overly simplistic and ignores the political reality of governments and their legislation.
Ignoring the underlying political ideology of a given idea is to severely limit what you know about it's viability and actual purpose. The general thrust of the notion of right and left; that politics is divided into two competing groups that struggle to either maintain/strengthen the current status quo or weaken/change it, is still sound. What do we learn from knowing whether or not a given policy idea is establishment friendly or not? We're given an immediate idea of the kinds of groups that are likely to support it and those who would push back against it if it actually made it into a bill being discussed in a chamber like the American congress or the house of commons in Britain.
Just understanding the mechanics of a given idea and it's feasible implementation is putting the cart before the horse. Basically all legislation that gets passed into law in the west these days is subject to a lot of negotiating and changes made due to political compromise between competing parties with different interests; an extension of the timeless struggle between left and right. Fretting over whether or not you can get the content of a law just perfect is politically inflexible when it can be voted down by the opposition and a few rebels on your side of the bench. If all representatives adopted this dismissive attitude towards the political nature of legislation and insisted we simply rate things on what they personally believe is good (something that isn't necessarily an empirical quality) then nothing would ever get passed.
>>46486548
A female Tau has a smaller vagina indicating that she received smaller cocks, implicating Tau men as having micropenis'. Female Tau, on the other hand, must have large cocks because we see the male Tau vagina as quite large. The large female cock is also evidenced by the fact that the female Tau vagina is shaped like a Y, the Y chromosome is the unique difference between male and females. Large vaginas make male Tau at greater risk of yeast infections as well.
>>46486640
Since official lore states Tau are hermaphrodites we must question what they were doing in the warp, unharmed, for so long. Clearly they are undercover servants of Slaanesh, aka the Great Tranny.
Where were you when you learned that Tau are just another arm of Chaos?
>>46484452
>>46484285
>>46484143
i always thought tzeentch would look like Hermaeus Mora from elder scrolls, specifically from the dragon born dlc in skyrim
>>46486670
Note the similar facial structures of Tau to Slaaneshi Daemonettes.
>>46484996
He kind of was. He even advocated banning art, music, and poetry that didn't glorify the gods or the state. He was one of the first STEM-only autists who think it's dumb that they should have to learn what a painting is.
>>46486321
rations
>>46485263
>He thinks ideologies are arranged on a line and not a horseshoe or even a circle
>>46486763
we've uncovered the greatest conspiracy. tzeentch's dickery knows no bounds. 40k end times tau and chaos brothers in arms.
>>46480555
WHERE ARE THE FEMALE ORKS?
>>46487014
>he thinks ideologies are things unto themselves rather than a collection of policies to be judged independently
>>46487131
>He thinks you can treat a thing by its constituent parts without losing information
>>46485263
>Bernie Sanders
>fascist
You know, when you find yourself having to just make shit up to advance a cause, that should be the point when you seriously and objectively reevaluate your beliefs.
Oh wait, don't tell me you actually legit believe old Bernie is a fascist. America pls.
>>46487186
That is true, but my point is that ideologies are not things in the sense that an immigration policy is a thing. You can judge, say, the Nazi Party as a whole, but talking about "fascism" as a whole is useless because it's inherently a set of beliefs and not a thing unto itself.
>>46487210
The focus was the quote by Hitler, commonly labelled a fascist, which is remarkably reminiscent to what most would recognize as radical socialist rhetoric, to show that fascism and socialism/communism are not opposites but very closely related. I got the image from a thread talking about how it was just as valid, and perhaps more valid, to say that Bernie is like Hitler as it is to say that Trump is. I don't personally think either are very close to Hitler, but both he and Bernie are socialists. Again, not to say that all socialists are similar to Hitler, but that association can't be denied.
>>46484636
Where are my Thousand Sons
>>46480555
It always pisses me off when people associate Khorne ONLY with berserk, non-thinking rage or a complete lack of strategy. Sure, it's his most apparent attribute, but he's also a god of honorable combat and just war in general. You can be a Khornate and NOT be a rampaging berserker. You can be a Khornate and actually use tactics and strategy in war.
>>46487592
Not really, he is literally RAGE made manifest, favorites are decided by:
>1) How much blood did the champion spill
>2) How much did he bleed
>3) Was it fighting? No? good. Yes? better.
>>46487592
>ou can be a Khornate and NOT be a rampaging berserker
correct, but you can't be a CHAMPION of khorne without it
the "muh honor", "muh strategy" khornates are the casual baby followers.
>>46486389
So Tau now based space Korea?
>>46487715
I wonder...
> In a moment of absolute rage a magos biologis smashes a vial with a sample of a terrible bioweapon.
> This bioweapon causes the affected to pour blood from all orificies and attack each other.
>Magos is actually proud and goes heretek, gets blessed by...
Who would do the blessing? I mean, ignoring that plagues are one of the things that Nurgle cares for the least.
>>46487818
bloodtide was a nano-virus infected by khorne, and basically did just that
>>46480555
>Lore views that trigger you
>the Force is balanced between the light side and the dark side like yin and yang!
No.
The one thing I actually hate from TFA is the fact that they made this "light side" nonsense canon by referencing it. There is no duality, there's the Force and there's the dark side, which is a CORRUPTION of the Force and is about as necessary as cancer.
>>46486670
>Official lore states...
Source
Human beings are and always will be (so long they remain baseline human) nonrational, nepotistic social animals, not utility-maximizing economic individualists.
Almost every ideology, particularly utopian movements, activily ignores or believes in it is capable of overcoming that human nature.
>>46480555
The Tau are more like Confucist/Taoist china, with an extremely strict emphasis on respecting and obeying your betters, and a highly stratified/grouped society.
Let me guess. Some idiot has argued that fascism and nazism is socialism. Liberal, conservatice and socialist movements have its roots in Enlightment and Ratonalism.
Facism comes from Romanticism. It is about passions and abstract ethos. It doesnt care about to run an economy. It cares more about aesthetics, spirit of nation than boring numbers.
>>46483093
Is that the whole series?
It ends?
Because I read from Wizard's First Rule up through The Pillars of Creation. I got Naked Empire, but every time I look at the cover I get physically ill at the prospect of reading more about how great Richard is and have to hide the book.
If I'm this close to being done, I might power through it.
After thousands of years of artificial selection, it is likely that the Tau have removed all natural instincts that presented obstaclea of Tau ideology. Even Farsight's Enclaves follow The Greater Good.
>>46485234
When the 40 hour work week was created, it was by "captains of industry" (commonly credited to Henry Ford, in fact) in response to labor unions seeking significantly lower hours. By then it was already becoming common as the people in charge started to realize that >100 hour work weeks were only as effective as ~5 hours.
>And farmers worked sun up to sun down.
Debatable, but there's a substantial amount of the year with nothing to do but normal chores (cow milking and shit). There's a lot of hard work involved in farming, but for the most part a plant isn't going to grow any faster in summer or sprout in winter regardless of how hard you work. Even on days when workers go out and in with the sun, it's unlikely that they were working for more than 8-9 hours, considering meal and rest breaks.
All in all, we're looking at about 2000 hours a year for serfs, which is comparable to a 40 hour workweek, but with more days off, and this is for the very bottom of the barrel, so to speak. Artisans and skilled laborers would be expected to work significantly lower hours for significantly greater pay.
>tfw you realize that your perfect life is equivalent to that of a medieval day laborer
>>46488418
I'm not sure you'll want to. Naked Empire roughly doubles the preachiness level, and Chainfire increases it to about 85% more than that. Phantom and Confessor take the preachiness back down to excessive but tolerable levels.
Will there be any triggers ifThere're aliens that are copies/expys of the Space Marines?
>>46489896
If you're going to copy space marines, at least try and recognize and emulate how rock solid their core design is.
Modern sci fi really likes those fucking panel lines all over the place, and I hate it. Being more detailed is not always better. Fuck.
>>46481832
>probably more national-socialist
Maybe the 4th reich will have cannibal nigger Sturmtruppen and jew insects Fallscharmjägers but until that, no.
>>46488705
>All in all, we're looking at about 2000 hours a year for serfs, which is comparable to a 40 hour workweek, but with more days off, and this is for the very bottom of the barrel, so to speak.
interestingly one of hte weird side effects of the soviet economy was that factories, especially ones in the more remote areas of the USSR, would often experience a problem called "Storming" - basically because of the Soviet Union being made up of small sub-units called "soviets", a factory had to get all its materials from local refineries, which in turn had to get all their refinable material from local mines.
Which meant that if there was a hiccup down the supply chain, it'd stop production all the way up that supply chain and factories or refineries couldn't just get more materials from neighbouring soviets.
Then a second problem exacebated this; quotas were assessed on an annual basis, rather than quarterly or monthly, which meant that if say a mine was having problems meeting quota AND supplying local refineries with material to refine, the mines would stop supplying refineries but would instead spend all year working up enough material to make their quota before finally shipping anything out to refineries.
Which in turn meant that refineries would then wait until they'd gotten enough materials that they could meet their quotas before doing any refining, which led to "storming" at the manufacturing end as factories that had lain dormant for in some cases 11 months of the year had to suddenly get all its workers working double or even triple shifts, non-stop for the remaining month of the year to meet their quota, before everyone was paid off and left having nothing to do for the remainder of the year.
>>46480555
>muh "all these failed communist governments are actual comunists" arguement.
I'd just like to take a moment and thank all commies like you for being the one thing that everyone, no matter how opposed they are to our belief system, can agree is stupider than An-Caps like me.
But seriously, every communist government has had a class system. Tau are space commies, no matter what filthy reds like you say.
>>46483202
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>>46490119
LITERALLY TOOK 2 POSTS
JESUS CHRIST /TG/
I'll tell you why /tg/ is the ultimate shitposting board. I'll tell ya.
Somehow this board manages to attract half the autists on both /pol/ and reddit, resulting in a clash of half-assed political views that has never before been witnessed.
/tg/ is a battlefied. The unlimited potential for real-world analogy provides an infinite breeding ground of shit-slinging for these camps of retards. Neither calls this place home but both come here every day, ready to jump at the first opportunity to claim ground for their shit-tier faction, and neither will give because this board finds the perfect balance between free speech that /pol/ preserves to keep the fun rolling and the authoritarian regulation that reddit provides to keep their autists in check.
Except they both just come here and bring the worst of it all and fuck up a perfectly good board. If we gave WH40K its own board and quest threads their own board, we might actually rid ourselves of this cancer that is destroying us.
>>46490613
>LITERALLY TOOK 2 POSTS
Are you kidding? This started with OP. This is a troll thread.
Anyone could look at this and see it was supposed to provoke an argument about the ideals of communism vs. the history of those who called themselves "communists".
>>46483260
Yugoslavia
>>46490613
Second post was a samefag, I responded because I unironically enjoy arguing on the internet. Also because I'm right and everyone else is misinformed.
>>46490613
>/tg/ is the ultimate shitposting board
How can you unironically believe this in a world where /a/, /v/, /b/, and fucking /s4s/ exist?
>>46490880
Yugoslavia was revisionist "market socialist" bullshit and actually capitalist
>>46483093
Use this picture and filename instead.
>>46491403
Badmean
>>46491403
>>46483093
Never read this, anyone care to explain what it is about?
>>46492095
Second this. Explain you grognards.
>>46492095
>>46492257
The series has a completely ridiculous author objectivist morality where the hero is always 100% perfectly morally right and all the villains are 100% evil strawmen of people goodkind doesn't like.
It's like a reddit politics comic in epic fantasy form.
The whole "I now present my ideological opponent as a furious and sad person who spouts gibberish and logical fallacies. Here is me giving a cool and disinterested response which is factual and well reasoned."
>>46480555
People who think the Imperium is right/100% justified, or that every single alien species is inherently evil/predatory to mankind. Or the people who think the Emperor was a totally good guy and not a ruthless authoritarian who massacred everyone that refused to submit to him. Or portray Space Marines as totally unbeatable and above-it-all, when the fluff is full of examples of them playing petty politics with each other and getting outmaneuvered. It really sucks the fun out of the setting for me. But, whatever. There is no badwrongfun. Just bugs me how default this view is on Teeg.
>>46483503
>brocialists
Legit kek'd. Thanks anon.
>>46492614
>this default view
But that's wrong, you little faggot.
Unlike your Grievance Studies professor, the Emprah can see the future, so He took the steps He adjudged necessary to ensure the survival of our species. Consider this goal for just a minute and see if maybe you'd agree that sidestepping universal human genocide may be a priority a SMIDGE higher than finishing your 6ft vagina costume in time for that big Pride Rally.
I'll wait.
>>46480555
Let's see - Forced-labor death gulags; Unwanted races sterilized;
Rigid caste system with no possible crossover; Party elites treated
like gods; Routine officer corps purges; Former heroes suddenly being
named traitors; Teeny, tiny dicks - Nope, that's communism all right.
>>46492614
No faction in 40k is "right", everyone are total assholes. The Imperium only cares about one thing, the prosperity of humanity. Why is that so bad?
>>46483433
>>46483503
this is for both of you Communist State is literally a fucking oxymoron. communism can not exist as long as states still exist. socialism is the closest you can get. communism is entirely untested
>>46493350
Anon, you fundamentally misunderstand the relationship of the two things in question there. The ultimate goal of Communism is evolution into either Socialism, or something more closely approximating that ideal.
Communism was always conceived of as an imperfect transitional step on the path towards a truly just and equal society that met all of humanities needs.
In this it was an abject failure.
But seriously, at least know the first thing about how it was thought of. I mean, nobody expects you to really get inside "Socialist Realism" or the "Dialectic of History", but still.
At least get that much.
(And no, I won't be explaining the Dialectic. It's too involved and I'm starting to get a nasty hangover. Read a Book Motherfucker.)
>>46492614
>or that every single alien species is inherently evil/predatory to mankind.
I can agree with them not all being evil (they have ever right to try and thrive/Empire build too) but for the most part none of the alien races really ever attempt to interact favorably or diplomatically (obviously the Imperium's attitude towards them is one major player in this) except for the Tau. And as above that's really only for the sake of trying to bring them into their Empire.
>>46492614
>or that every single alien species is inherently evil/predatory to mankind
This is a cold hard fact, though, do remember the imperium was created to break out of total alien enslavement
Humans in 40k are assholes, but being assholes is the only way to not be put under the jackboot of some other asshole. This has been the case since rogue trader.
>>46488034
yeah i always hate the light side bullshit in EU glad that all of its die
too bad jj pull the light side again
>>46480882
>>46485044
>The carcass tasters, featuring a Kroot, a Khornate demon, and a nid
>>46488034
Not that I enjoy defending Captain Nepotism's Two-Hour Fiat Commercial, but technically, just tossing around the term 'light side' doesn't mean that we're treating the balance as good or necessary. 'Light' could just be a term here for 'not fucking evil'.
>>46490190
>can agree is stupider than An-Caps like me.
An-caps and libertarians are the equally retarded inverse of communists and socialists.
The libertarian left are just retarded hippies.
Truly, the center and authoritarian-right are the superior political views.
>>46492095
http://sandstormreviews.blogspot.ca/2006/08/goodkind-parodies.html
This should explain a lot.
>>46493491
You've got it backwards. What the USSR practiced was called socialism by them.
>>46490880
Yeah sure. We really loved goli otok and waiting in lines for bread.
>>46486670
Don't quit your day job for that career in comedy. Unless you plan to do gigs in junior high's.
>>46480659
tl;dr there are no real communist governments.
>>46495872
>leftist babbies think muh Clinton is purposely sabotaging Sanders
>actually there's just nobody in the US who wants communism
>>46492409
sounds like every argument I've ever seen on this here blue & yellow website
>>46492614
The problem is you're clearly a heretic, a traitor and, possibly, a mutant. The Imperium is the only bastion of good and purity in the universe, the space marines are the ultimate personification of this and therefore ARE above it all, we know this because the emperor said so. Do you doubt the emperors word?
Seriously though, you're right. They're just as bad as the rest, but it's fun to take the imperiums side and espouse their propaganda. On tg I've always assumed it's tongue in cheek, they defend the emperor as if they were part of the imperium. In RL it'd be frustrating if they actually misunderstood the fluff that badly though.
>>46498579
>/tg/
>not misunderstanding the lore terribly
>>46491403
My girlfriend unironically loves this series.
>>46490613
I really wish the mods and janitors would do their fucking job and banish these kinds of things back to /pol/ where they belong.
>>46492614
>every single alien species is inherently evil/predatory to mankind
How long was India a colony for? How much more similar are Indians and brits compared to mi-go and brits?
There's your answer you dumbass. Indians aren't inherently evil/predatory, but they're still not useful in any meaningful way. If anything they're a drain on USA food supplies.
It doesn't matter if they're "inherently evil" or whatever that means. Their morality is pretty much never the same as ours(the most human-like xenos is arguably the necron/necrontyr), so yes, they are inherently "evil". Most aliens in other fiction are just humans with pointy ears or blue skin. 40k's aliens are a bit more alien. The Enslavers probably don't think they're evil. They very much are. The Eldar don't think they're evil(if redirecting orks to Armageddon to save 10k eldar lives isn't evil to you), but they very much are.
Many xenos want to kill us, but they're just looking out for themselves. We do the same thing, and that puts us on opposite teams.
Also many xenos empires worshipped chaos like no tomorrow.
Your philosophy is that of a fag.
>>46496987
my comrade
>>46484795
>"There can never be equality because people aren't equal?"
Uh... Yes? I did read the Communist Manifesto, btw. I notice that it predicted a global Socialist revolution that only happened in shit countries, and then a move towards classless, stateless societies that also never happened.
Marx was a retard. Maybe if he had ever held a real job for a day he would realize why.
>>46498741
If misunderstanding the lore means tau get titties, then I'm for it.
Tau philosophy doesn’t cover much of the communist belief system. The Tau have castes. They love trade and tie it to their foreign affairs and expansionism. They exert control over their neighbors without forcing them to adopt Tau methods of governance. None of those align with communism.
The meme is based entirely on "the greater good". Yes, communists are a fan of that way of thinking too, but they're not alone. Fascism (the general kind, not nazism) is fundementally about people existing to serve the state. In the US we don't take it nearly that far, but ask any American soldier how far he's willing to go for his country. Look at JFK's "ask what you can do for your country" quote and wonder if we're communist for liking it.
imo, they're most similar to Imperial Japan during WWII. East Asian Co-Prosperity Sphere and all that. A blend of Chinese Confucianism (know your place, serve your superiors) and Western Colonialism (like it or not, we're going to civilize you and make money in the process). More parallels there than with the USSR or PRC (or North Korea, which is stuck with the mentality the Imperial Japanese taught them, but Tau tech is too advanced for a comparison to make sense).
>>46507869
>The Tau have castes
implying commies don't. We've already had this discussion, read the fucking thread.
>>46509535
In practice, yes, communism has classes. But they're not castes. You can be invited into a higher position, and you can fall out of one too.
The Tau caste system is downright feudal. Again, closer to prewar Japanese society.
>>46510658
I mean, no caste system has ZERO social mobility.
>>46511446
>no caste system has ZERO social mobility.
I saw on /news/ the other day how a woman in india was murdered by her family for marrying a man from another caste. Her own family! The people she trusted above all others killed her over some stupid social structure!
I honestly hope with all my heart it was an isolated incident.
The USSR never called themselves Communist, only Socialist, because they recognised they hadn't achieved full Communism yet.
If they can recognise that, why can't you, anon?
>>46484992
Private property =/= Personal property, come on, this is basic shit.
>Lore views that trigger you
Oh you play chaos marines? Which legion? Isn't the Horus Heresy the coolest and most interesting thing in all of the 40k lore?
>>46498579
Its obvious everywhere and anything sucks in the 40k Universe, but hey why not cheer for my species yea?
>>46480555
Because real world communism always created stratified societies while preaching equality; just like the Tau.
>>46514769
Tau never once talk about equality though. They talk about the greater good of society, and use eugenics and class to determine the role you play in society.
If anything, Tau are national socialists, not communists.
>>46514769
I don't think they've actually ever said anything about equality. Where are people getting that from?
>>46480555
>Communism is the abolition of class structures
>Russia ranked people's ration script based on their profession
>Cuba pays people according to their profession
>North Korea gives more food to party members and military than others because they're ranked higher
>>46480555
>Orks can tie a stick and a rock together and it will shoot like a gun because they BELIEVE!!! waagh XD
>>46515442
shut up, ork a best
>>46514818
>Tau never once talk about equality though. They talk about the greater good of society,
False.
The Lusha in Fire Warrior speaks about the Greater Good. He says that all castes are equal, from the farm worker earth caste to the Ethereal in his palace.
>>46515118
The codex and the Fire Warrior novel.
The codex says that water caste tell the races that join the Tau Empire that everyone are equal in the Tau Empire but the Tau are the first among equals.
God, I fucking hate pinkos. Bring back the commie hunting days
>>46514769
>Because real world communism always created stratified societies while preaching equality; just like the Tau.
Just like any political system?
>>46515388
>He doesn't get the concept of social classes.
>sovietslaughingwithborsch.jpeg
>>46515442
Isn't that ALMOST right though? (If you remove all muh irony)
They are an uplifted species. Who are the true masters behind the Ethereals? Is itthe Cabal?
>>46515922
Eldar
>>46515825
>>46515846
Sounds like those idealists from the American and French revolutions with their equality obsessions.
>>46494515
How do those boots taste citizen?
>>46484143
why is nurgle's mark a cock n balls in this?
>>46486143
if your novel doesn't involve elves, you should title it All The Elves Are Dead to let people know there's no elves in it.
>>46520784
Like power, glory, and progress.
>>46520875
because he is next to tzeentch
>>46480555
>I am a fucking idiot
-OP
Speaking of Tau, my friend has an artbook by one of the artists for GW, full of black and white 40k art.
Anyway, on the last two pages there are sketches of Tau. Both, in cloth and armor and the signature said, well I don't remember the exact year now, but I do remember that it was 5-6 years before Tau were introduced.
This always makes me wonder how far in advance GW is actually planning its shit. People often think say that its 2-3 years, but this is pretty much double the amount.
>>46523744
They recycle concepts a lot. You can find a Kroot in the Big Black Book (3rd edition rulebook) which has the best grimdark art throughout too
>>4648989I thought the same thing actually..
Vex are sorta like necrons
>>46480555
Oh no I get mad when people make fun of my fuckin weeaboo snipers because of abstract definitions of a political system that's absolutely trash anyways.
All the castes work together for the greater good of the Tau Empire. Sounds like what communism really should be for humanity.
>>46515442
Dattebayo!
Stop thinking about the phony ideals that Communism espouses and think about what it was in practice.
The most central similarity is the claim that all individuals are equal, but in practice they are strictly class-structured (ie - some are more equal than others)
There is also the glossing over of nasty totalitarianism with soft language and the claim of altruism (The greater good vs the needs of an individual is a blatant reference to communist ideology).
That isn't to say that Tau society is a Communism cut-and-paste, but it is meant to emulate communist society in practice, with perhaps some Hindu cast elements thrown in.
>>46528360
>Stop thinking about the phony ideals that Communism espouses and think about what it was in practice.
The people leading "communist" revolutions were never communists. They were all just your normal, run of the mill dictators that make grand claims about how everything is going to be better after they execute all the people that disagree with them. The same thing has been done with pretty much every form of government. The only reason communism has such a shitty track record is because there was a huge amount of push back against the idea from rich people (most importantly including Murdoch-type media barons) starting over 50 years before the Bolshevik revolution, and the USSR and the dictatorships it supported or inspired provided plenty of ammo for additional shitsmearing.
>>46528581
I agree that the communism we see is a hijacked version of what the intellectuals who created it wanted. However, that doesn't change the fact that when calling Tau communist, we have to think about how communism was enforced in the soviet states - that was the original intention, and it is the comparison that makes sense. They are deliberately Orwellian, not meant to be a representation of the original ideals of Marx and crew.
>>46490613
>somehow blames this on 40k and quests
>>46528360
I just don’t see it. The Tau don’t emphasize equality, they emphasize putting aside personal gains for the good of society. The only talk of equality in Tau fluff is when they talk about the different castes being of equal importance – which is not something you can say about the de facto classes in communist societies.
Communism does have a bit of “the greater good” mentality, but it doesn’t emphasize it as much as the various forms of nationalism do (up to and including fascism). Communists also make a really big deal out of the revolution that gets them there, something that never happened in Tau society.
They’ve also got a mercantilist economy and foreign policy. Commies just don’t trade like the Tau do.
