MtG Spoilers
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Post your jank combos and synergies here.
>>46183361
Why would you discard the jank equipment? There are better cards to pay the cost, like madness ones
>>46179443
czech em
Are you guys getting your Lilianas cheap right now for the Jankiest Sacrifice/Madness synergies ever seen?
Rare land nicknames?
Showlands
Handlands
peeklands
>>46183515
Handlands
>>46183515
Gay bitches
>>46183515
Handlands
>>46182496 #
You are an idiot. 4 mana, deal 8 damage? It isn't supposed to stay on the field for long.
Have you ever encountered RDW or Burn or fucking any fast deck?
It is undertuned, 5 power would've been more reasonable, but what you are asking for is legitimately retarded.
>>46183399
Swords and path aren't mistakes though. White has a long history of getting to do things in exchange for benefiting the opponent in some way. It also has a long history of being the best at removal.
You've got oblation, path, swords, and now this. You've got angelic edict, archon of justice, catapult master, councils judgement, crib swap, dispatch, exclusion ritual, have of justice, Iona's justice, mangara, trostanis judgement,
All of the above cards are able to permanently exile every targetable creature in the game.
You're wrong about swords and path being mistakes. Their party of a common theme, and the best at it.
Also your card vocabulary is shit.
>>46183515
SHADOWLANDS
>>46183515
I look forward to the inevitable retarded debate over their nicknames.Oh wait, no I don't.
>>46183515
HaNdLaNdS
>>46183696
Need a 1 sylabus word before land mate
SHOCKland
FETCHland
CHECKland
FASTland
ShadowLand doesn't qualify
SHOWland it's gonna be.
Or SHITland.
>>46183659
Lots of people, including people at Wizards think of cards like Swords where the drawback is completely pathetic as much of a color pie breach as Psionic Blast.
Exile being that much better than Destroy means that White regularly ends up being the color that is best at removal. This shits on black. Black is very heavily defined by being the best at removal.
It is true that currently, White gets lots of unconditional exile. But this is a thing they have mentioned they want to move away from.
It is a subjective thing to discuss. The same way when people propose new mechanics for red. They both discuss changing the color pie, shifting it. Most MTG players want to only add to colors, not take away.
>>46183911
syllable* fuck english m8
>>46183911
TANGOland :^)
>>46183911
>SHITland
Are you going to propose it each time a new type of dual lands is released ?
>>46183975
Are there even enough Wolfs and Werewolfs in Standard?
>>46184019
Maybe? We would need to see the rest of the set first.
>>46183497
I feel like we're going to see a lot of decks that run at least a combined 6 of Lilianas and Jaces.
I'm not really into Standard, is Rally rotating with SoI? That's still the best deck in Standard, right?
>>46183935
>But this is a thing they have mentioned they want to move away from.
Not him but you are dead wrong, R&D is divided on "white exiles a creature but gives something back effects" which is known from an answer MaRo gave like a month or two ago. HE is against it but that doesn't mean everyone, but in and out of R&D is.
Also we are literally getting this card in this new set so how the fuck can you claim that "this effect is something that white doesn't do and is totally a thing from the past like psionic blast!"?
>>46184019
We already have 11 in SoI
>>46184057
>MaRo is opposed to white exiling
Is he aware that's one of the only things making white relevant in eternal formats aside from graveyard hate and exceptions like Death&Taxes? Like, even in casual shit formats like EDH, white is known for two things: Enlightened Tutor, and cheap exile effects.
What, in MaRo's opinion, is white's strength? If he wants to take away good cheap removal, what's left after that? White weenies?
>>46183515
Homelands.
>>46184163
Because they are shit ?
>>46183959
As long as they release shit-tier land, yes
>>46184019
There are a few cards that make wolf tokens and a few other werewolves. Still over a hundred cards not revealed yet, so maybe some cool cards to see there. Tribal is a pretty important component of the set, so there should be.
>>46184057
>the drawback is completely pathetic
Yes, Mark wants to white to get only soft removal like O-rings. But it is a safe bet that others in R&D don't want to print insane cards like Swords in Standard sets.
It clearly isn't universal and I'm sure some guys in R&D just don't give a shit and want white to get fucking everything except card draw, but I do think there's a reason why white's completely unconditional removal like Trostani's Judgement and Angelic Edict is costed closer to Scour From Existence than Path.
Personally, I feel that common is fine, but Black getting worse removal than White at common will always bug me a bit.
>>46184125
I don't see it
>>46184261
It's not a kill, it's a suicide.
>>46184149
MaRo is fine with white exiling but conditionally like big creatures and attacking creatures and creatures that did damage and exiling in a form that can be reversed and shit.
But no Exile+you get life/cards/lands/cards etc. To be fair exiling shit and giving something back is totally white
>>46184261
Noob
>>46184125
I've heard of suicide black, but that's ridiculous
>>46184149
Maro literally doesn't give a fuck about formats other than kitchen table. He pretends to, as the face of MTG design, but every opinion he has in regards to color pie is pertaining to casual MtG.
That's why he is so strict about color pie shit. Because in his mind, Red and White aren't broken. Direct damage is super important in these kinds of formats (so Red doesn't need anything else) and White has O-Rings, undercosted flyers, weenies, anthems, etc.
On some level I get it, but I can see it being frustrating to people who play MtG completely differently. Fortunately, Maro isn't in charge. That's how shit like the uncounterable cycle happened in RtR. They wanted a 5 card cycle that would shake up eternal formats. Maro said it didn't fit in, uncounterable is boring and is more or less entirely a RG thing.
I'm still mad that Supreme Verdict is UW rather than RW as it should be. Even if that cycle ended up being really good for eternal and EDH.
>>46184274
If he had his way, blue would be better than white at removal. White an green would do literally nothing but drop creatures and fights. Fuck that kike.
>>46183515
I love these. I want 4 of each.
>>46184289
>>46184125
My favorite is the one that uses One with Nothing and just Sinkholes the swamp.
>>46184336
Maro's a designer, he just makes cards he thinks are fun. Worrying about how they play in formats is for development.
>>46184387
>cards left in library and graveyard
ONE JOB
Atarka Furries incoming
>>46184437
I believe it uses Tormod's Crypt still. I don't know how it gets rid of the library since if they use Leveler, they have to get rid of it.
>>46184420
I am still waiting for someone in development to make a blog so that I can release years of pent up rage at them.
Design does their job fine like 60-70% of the time at least, making cute cards like that 13 one (even if they fail alot like 3 of the new PW being boring samey shit) but development have been taking a nosedive these past few years, and I am not even mainly talking about the abysmal powerlevel.
>>46184437
You can still crypt it out.
This is the thread for jank, right?
>>46184514
I suspect this is why they don't.
Just bitch at Forscythe on Twitter like everyone else.
>>46184450
>Unironically using weremaro and Wolf of Shitiest Mythic
>>46184420
Yeah, but he still cares about the less than obvious things that contribute to fun in the very long run. That's why he doesn't want certain colors to do certain things, because he assumes that thirty years down the line, people will still be playing MtG and he doesn't want all of the colors to have homogenized by that point.
I say this as someone who is constantly vexed by enchantments when playing a monored deck in EDH.
Like, I get it, if every color ends up with flyers, eventually flying won't feel special to certain colors. Which ends up with decks not feeling special, which blah blah blah.
>>46184514
Planeswalkers tend to actually be mostly handled by development, since there's so many things to adjust.
>>46184614
Like in total? Having control over the abilities +/- values, the walker cost and the loyalty aren't enough?
I would like some source on this claim
>>46184557
Pretty sure he actually IS using them ironically there. Or at least being sarcastic in general.
>>46184557
Weremaro is legitmately my favorite card in this set.
I had a Maro deck and Multani was my favorite card in that deck.
>>46184019
I want them to reprint immerwolf, but they won't because intimidate isn't a supported keyword anymore. Hopefully they'll make a new version with menace or something.
>>46184557
>Wolf of Shitiest Mythic
But that's not Geralf's Masterpiece
>>46184704
Geralf's masterpiece has like 3 times more chances to see any play than borringwolf
>>46184743
Sadly
>>46184679
It's total shit but I like him too for some reason. I don't even play casual
>>46184704
The Wolf is literally the worst Mythic in standard right now. Its absolutely terrible in every single scenario, you could even consider picking anything else over it in limited.
>>46184743
It does trigger madness
>>46184669
You'd have to dig through Maro's articles/blog for that. Creative comes up with the characters, obviously, and design makes an initial pass. They just end up being getting changed a lot in development; abilities will be switched out, costs adjusted, that sort of thing. The end result is that development has more of a hand in their design than with any other card type.
>>46184678
Jace's stupid face ruins everything the encroaching spectre of another fucking Eldrazi block doesn't.
>>46184125
How do you play Tormod's Crypt if you've discarded it???
>>46185011
Play Crypt, hold priority and cast Spite.
>>46184125
>tfw Slobad.
>>46183975
I want to run this with mono-green wolves, no werewolves at all.
>>46183975
That'll require EDH. There's like, two wolves in standard that aren't in SOI and they're garbo.
>>46184533
Welp, now I'm hard
>>46183515
Tango lands because it requires two cards
W/B/r Vampires looks fun as fuck. I may have to sneak in a Triskaidekaphobia as an alternate wincon for fun.
>>46184336
>Even if that cycle ended up being really good for eternal and EDH.
...Supreme Verdict was part of a cycle?
>>46184533
Yeah, I thought the same thing
Goldnight Castigator looks like utter trash without that, is the problem
>>46183361
That are for Heir to the Night is really goofy, right? It's not just me?
>>46185588
Yup. Each guild in RTR got one uncounterable spell. Most weren't good enough for serious play, but a fair share were.
Supreme Verdict, Loxodon Smiter, Abrupt Decay, Slaughter Games and Counterflux.
>>46185614
Oh baby
>>46185562
W/B seems to be more of a cleric thing at the moment
>>46185656
Her cleavage is a bat.
>>46185689
3.5/5 I guess
>>46183361
>cast heir turn 2
>turn 3 discard incorrigible youths to transform to heir of the night
>cast incorrigible youths its madness cost
>attack for 7 on turn 3
it's not even that far fecthed, and there are still a decent number of other discard outlets and madness cards to keep the deck consistent.
>>46185752
Slaughter Games saw some standard play for a bit. I assume that's the .5?
But yeah, Counterflux is my fave out of all of them, but I am pretty sure it has only ever seen play in EDH.
But yeah, that's what happens when a cycle is super influenced by development. Notice how everyone always talks so highly about RTR and shits on the rest of the block? Because RTR with this cycle was designed for spikes, while shit like the primordials and lots of other shit in GW was for Timmies only. Johnny could suck a dick.
It didn't help that GW also ruined limited.
>>46185609
It's a 4 mana, 4 power flyer with haste. There are red decks that would be happy to use it as a curve topper.
>>46185838
Johnny's fine, he got biovisionary
>>46183361
>Creature that transforms combined with an equipment that's best on transform creatures
GREAT JOB SHERLOCK
>>46185858
Yeah, but I mean, c'mon. Neither Furnace of Rath nor Dictate of the Twin Gods were broken, so why make a damage doubler with only the downside of running a damage doubler and instead of the proper, swingy upside, you get a measly 4 damage?
I'm just really disappointed, I guess. It would have been nice to have a proper damage doubler on a body, although obviously if the did that, she wouldn't still have 4 power for 4cmc.
>>46183515
As much as I'd love speedland or quickland or something because they're basically just a flavour of fastland, I think handland is the best.
>>46186002
Didn't-mulligan-to-fourland
What kind of card(s) are required to make WG Weenie waifu clues meta relevant?
>>46185614
That is one hell of a good way to cheat out something big.
If only such a thing existed in this low-power set.
>>46186234
Knight of the white orchid, maybe that new sorcery that exiles as you can sac the clue token for it, Thalia's lieutenant
I know I'm torturing myself by doing it, but whenever TMS does spoiler coverage, there's always at least 2 quotes/jokes/notes from one of these threads. I swear that guy is lurking in here.
>>46185719
How did I not notice that before, good eye anon.
>>46186243
there are still a lot of eldrazi in standard
Currently sitting on 4 of the BFZ R/B dual lands for my casual Eldrazi aggro deck, but planning to put together W/G Humans.
Should I stock up on the BFZ Dual land for that as well? I've got a feeling both of those will have a pretty big price spike soon.
>>46186516
The second the full spoiler releases the Battlelands are going to spike a lot. I suggest stocking on a playset of each one as soon as you can, the price will just go up and up when the demand skyrockets.
>>46186516
So basically buy another 4 RB lands and 8 WG lands now.
Figured as much.
>>46186393
Just checked the last one, with Triskaidekaphobia
I'm with you, Wedge is lurking in here
Hi Wedge
Man that's Tamiyo and Jace in Avacyn's Judgement artwork.
>>46186779
I noticed him using nearly exact quotes back in the Oath spoiler season as well.
He actually is a fa/tg/uy in every sense of the word.
>>46186779
Literally who?
>>46186793
Probably immediately before Anguished Unmaking
>>46186393
We aren't exactly original or creative geniuses. Most of the jokes we make or remarks we say about spoiler cards are ones everyone makes.
They do make me smile every time though. I wish the gatherer was working again. MTG fans poking fun at Magic cards is my favorite thing. Especially on commons and uncommons that would otherwise be ignored outside of limited.
>>46186836
Found Wedge
>>46186839
So that makes it Avacyn's poor judgmentof getting in the way of a millenia old vampire
>>46186002
since the lands request a basic land to come untapped, the only correct answer for these new lands is
>basicland
>>46187222
They don't require a basic land
>>46187222
basiclandtypeland
>>46183515
Needlands
Cuz you'll need lands for these to work
>>46185990
Because a flying 4 mana 4 power with haste would be fucking retarded if it also doubled it's own damage, or just as retarded if it doubled the damage of the spells you cast.
>>46187463
>Because a flying 4 mana 4 power with haste would be fucking retarded if it also doubled it's own damage
Well, yes, that's why I said it wouldn't have 4 power.
I'm just disappointed because I like damage doubling spells. They provide a really cool upside with an equally cool and dangerous downside, and sticking one of those on even a weak body would be pretty cool, I think. To me, this card has the dangerous downside without the equally impressive upside that cards like Furnace of Rath usually have.
>>46187614
maybe you should just get good, lol
>>46187614
The upside is that it's an aggressive curve topper with evasion that swings immediately.
It's not a cool splashy furnace of rath card, it's designed to kick shit in as effectively as possible. Time will tell if it's good enough to do that.
>>46184772
> at worst 5/5 for 5, at best 5/5 for 5 that turns dead cards into removal
This is damned good in limited, you salty scrublord.
>>46186243
Since you need at least 5 mana to cast this. Just play ramp and hardcast those fatty. On turn 5 you could be able to chain World Breakers more consistently than assembling this combo.
>>46187614
This is the problem when people evaluate cards. This was never intended to be a damage doubler. It isn't furnace of rath. It never was going to be. R&D knows that a furnace of wrath attached to a creature would probably have to be 8 mana and be completely useless in any format.
It is just a beat stick with a drawback.
>>46184450
Still needs wolf/werewolf lords and cards that trigger and prevent transformation.
>>46184261
>play swamp and black lotus
>sac lotus for BBB, tap swamp for B
>cast both rituals for BBBBBB
>eight black mana in pool
>use five mana to cast leveler
>put library in graveyard
>cast tormod's crypt
>while it's on the stack, use remaining mana, discard hand, and sacrifice your permanents to cast kaervek's spite
>crypt resolves
>sac crypt to exile your graveyard
>you now have no library, no permanents, no cards in hand, and no graveyard
It's suicide black to the extreme.
>>46187863
b-b-but what's the point ??
>>46187880
Killing yourself in one turn
>>46187863
That's not what Leveler does!
>>46187945
Oops, misread. Result is the same though.
>>46187989
True, but Leveler would be a lot better in normal game play then.
I swear there was a version of this that left your opponent at twenty though.
>>46183515
Shitlands
>>46187814
Why is this a problem, exactly? I'm saying I don't like the card because it reminds me of one of my favorite sort of effects, but it's not nearly as cool because it's not the same thing.
>R&D knows that a furnace of wrath attached to a creature would probably have to be 8 mana and be completely useless in any format.
What? Why on Earth would it have to be that expensive? To begin with, creatures are easier to remove than enchantments. Hell, in this case, the creature in question is even saying "Hello! I'm here! If you have any means of dealing damage to me whatsoever or forcing my controller to block, I will almost certainly die to my own effect!" You could even make the fucker a 1/2 if you wanted to because its toughness being one point higher would literally not matter because of its own effect.
Second of all, there IS a creature with a Furnace of Rath effect. Well, not exactly, because it was actually a ONE-SIDED Furnace of Rath, with additional upsides and evasion to boot, for SEVEN mana. In context, claiming that a Furnace of Rath creature would "have to" cost 8 is just dumb.
And did a beat stick like this (which I acknowledge it is, obviously) really have to be a mythic rare? I can't really see wanting to play this in any deck other than an extremely aggressive one, which might be difficult to make work in a draft environment. I might just not know enough about draft balance to make that call, but I just can't see picking this without a deck that could also remove it at will with sacrifice effects or something.
>>46183935
>black is heavily defined at being the best at removal
Umm no it fucking isn't and never has been
Black had always been the most LIMITED at removal, only being able to deal with creatures, the only color that can neither remove enchantments not artifacts
However black was, and still is, the color that gets lots of creature removal
>>46188067
Kaervek's Spite deals damage to "target player," so you can target yourself if you want.
>>46187463
it could be fun if it was a 2/9 with double strike, at least it would have the small upside of the first strike and +x/+x would be doubled too which is nice
>>46184234
Why should it bother you that black gets worse removal than white?
there is basically nothing black isn't better at than white, besides having versatile removal
Black has life drain where white has life gain
Black had card draw where white hopes to topdeck, I guess
I have no idea why people hate on white, the most gimped of all colors constantly
>>46183975
Ehhhh... Should've been Immerwolf as an enchantment.
>>46188195
Sorry, I obviously meant creature removal. I'm fine with W getting a liom's share of enchantment and artifact removal (though I wish green and red got more exile when it comes to that).
Things are honestly fine right now, but the most played creature removal in Legacy and Modern (correct me if I am wrong) is red or white. And white having tons of other types of removal is why I would rather black get the best creature removal.
>>46188266
but then, ass formation would be a lot more OP, and we would kind of play combo in standard (?)
>>46183975
>>46184019
>>46185392
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/21-03-16-xeb-gruul-wolves/
>>46183515
>Allied colors enter untapped lands
>>>>>>>>>Again
>>46188270
What? White has a huge portion of the color pie. It gets flyers when red and green don't, it gets spot removal, it gets Wraths out of the ass, it gets bears unlike R and U.
White being the best weenie color and also getting efficient shit like Baneslayer while Green, the color of fatties gets hyper chump block able turds is why people hate white.
Fuck, red, the most aggressive color in MTG finally got a 2/1 for one with no drawback, while white has had one since the games inception.
>>46188467
Wait, is the vamp guy really the first 2/1 in red?
>>46188218
It was Demonic Consultation. I remembered.
Swamp, Dark Ritual, Lotus Petal, Sinkhole, Demonic Consultation, One with Nothing, Tormod's Crypt.
>>46188467
And its a rare. Hell if we'll ever see Goblin Pikeman as a common for R.
Meanwhile, White could probably field an entire deck of 2/1 1 drops (not that it'd be good, but they probably have enough creatures.
I remember Red players in the Origins prerelease picking up bonded Servant solely so they could get a 2/1 for 1.
Someone had an interesting idea regarding the text of the Clues over on the mtgsalvation board:
"[Remember] to have Jenrik research Markov Manor."
"Consider [this:] the shepherd turns on her flock. Why?"
"The symbols-When did [they] change?"
"With angels [came] mysteries."
"Their chanting grows louder [as] the tide rises."
"Fore every answer, [three] questions."
"You speak to me of the threat of Ulamog. But [do not forget: they came as three]."
Ugin's Insight
>>46188525
Yes. First one without a drawback. Red is not a creature color like U, so it gets shit creatures.
Dragons are the only cheap flyers, traditionally. They actually have a rule called the dragon rule when it comes to that. It is also why they don't get bears, but instead get pikers.
>>46186243
Hey buddy, remember us?
>>46185838
>But yeah, Counterflux is my fave out of all of them, but I am pretty sure it has only ever seen play in EDH.
Sees some play in modern.
>Slaughter Games saw some standard play for a bit. I assume that's the .5?
Also has seen some play in modern.
>Because RTR with this cycle was designed for spikes
Is this just a euphemism for 'had powerful cards in it'? Do people actually think that RTR was good for competitive play?
>>46188416
>Huntmaster of the Fells
>Standard
>>46188563
Please.
No.
Captcha: STOP
>>46188525
First one drop, and the others have pretty severe downsides.
The only one a quick search shows me that has promise is Tattermunge, which has to attack each turn and is Hybrid Red/Green.
>>46188595
No, they specifically talked about it in developmental and design articles.
For most non-spikes, uncounterable variations of normal cards are drearily dull.
>>46188563
I mean jokes on you, I want this shit story to be over ASAP. Avengers, I mean the Gatewatch, is not fun.
>>46188582
>shows up pretending to be a reality bending motherfucker
>dies to a fireball
kozi-who?
>>46188605
read the description
They dont have arlin Kord in the database yet so huntmaster = arlin
Goblin guide = village messenger
Wooded foot hills = game trail, the new r/g dual land
>>46188563
>mfw the moon bursts open and Emrakul comes out of it
>>46188563
I'm sticking to my 4th sister theory until I'm proven wrong!
I want to make a W/G humans list with CoCo/Sigarda top end at first since I imagine something like that shouldn't cost much
Then once a couple weeks go by and we know what cards are legit I want to build something else.
Maybe Babby Jund with Asylum Visitor, Red Bob, Tireless Tracker, Arlin.
Maybe even go all the way up to include a pair of Dark Dwellers and Oath Chandras.
>>46188563
>there won't be a cool Eldritch Moon trailer to show WHATEVER bursting out of the moon
>>46188563
Where exactly are you getting the placement of the words from? I don't want to jump to conclusions. That and the fact that "Do not forget" changes to "remember this" makes me wonder if a confirmation bias might be at play.
>>46183432
what a fucking retard
>>46188989
remember and do not forget are synonyms you monkey
>>46188301
fucking agree
>>46184533
Nigger Ángel is shitty Ángel. They totally ruined innistrad
>>46188563
What were the different numbers for Tamiyo's journal again?
>Ugin's eyes swiveled back to Sorin. "Where is the hedron mage? Where is Nahiri?"
>The notion of shame had long since evaporated from Sorin. Over the millennia, Sorin's human frailties and neurosis had grown, blossomed, and withered away—he was as immune to regret as he was to old age. And yet, for the first time in years, an uncomfortable feeling grew within him, an unpleasant itch, the sense that he was responsible—solely—for something important going awry. It wasn't remorse exactly, just a dull, discordant echo ringing in the space where remorse had once resided.
Reminder that Sorin brought this on himself and whatever he did was the first thing to make him even think about the concept of guilt in thousands of years
>>46189159
Good, fuck that nigger in the ass
>>46189073
Well, of course they are, but when you're taking your clues from the exact words, the exact words used become relevant.
I mean, if somebody said
>Remember to have [Jenrik] research Markov Manor.
>With angels [came] mysteries.
>Consider this: the shepherd turns [on] her flock. Why?
>[Their] chanting grows louder as the tide rises.
>Fore every answer, [three] questions.
>The [symbols] - When did they change?
and then used this as evidence that Jenrik was actually a lithophiliac who was working for Nahiri all along because trios of cryptoliths get him hard, you wouldn't think of that as compelling evidence. I'm aware that a lot of people already anticipate that Emrakul will make an appearance in Eldritch Moon, but I'm curious as to how strong the case for that really is.
>>46189159
and this justifies her tanking an entire world how
>>46188989
It's not my theory, and I agree that it's more convenient than definitive... but it's interesting nonetheless.
>>46189243
It might not, but it makes for a better story than Nahiri just randomly sperging out and deciding to fuck his home up for no real reason
It can't be "muh eldrazi", she agreed to that.
>>46186563
Why is he demand going to be high if fetchlands are rotating
>>46189159
Daily reminder that you will never be as cool as Sorin.
>Why live?
>>46189277
Reminder that during all these mysterious events regarding brainwashed angels and mysterious motives, a master telepath in a hoodie is standing 5 feet to the left.
>>46189361
>Jace: Wait a minute that clue...
>>46189089
I have nothing against any other race, but Wizard's whole "muh diversity" thing is starting to get on my last nerve.
>>46189431
Oddly enough, I think I would have preferred it if it had just been the Angel. At least they have the excuse of being mana constructs and not needing to look European.
>>46189411
Speaking of clues, has anyone made any progress on the posters?
>>46189509
the posters were a fucking waste of time.
They were pointing on a clock face that pointed to the card number of Nahiri's pw card
>>46188467
All you have to do is look at he history of magic to know white is gimped
White is largely shit in every single era of magic besides color pie breaking or otherwise broken cards like Lin sivvi or Stoneforge mystic
If it doesn't involve cheating things into play, white is literally useless
Path to exile is one of the only viable mono white cards in all of modern
Notice that the viable way to use white in legacy is either as a splash for swords to plow shares or by abusing aether vial, a non white card
>>46188968
I don't think bothering with green or sigarda is worth it. Just play mono white and go wide. You get fucked by boardwipes and lots of removal but that is just what white weenie decks do.
>>46189557
>Red is starting to get all kinds of pseudo card draw
>Four colors now have access to varying degrees of decent to amazing card draw
>White has to live with occasionally being able to fetch a few plains IF your opponent has more lands than you do
White is suffering
>>46189557
How is Stoneforge Mystic a break in the color pie? White gets equipment support all the time. Is Stonecutter Giant a break too?
And when it comes to Legacy, isn't Miracles a thing that really likes to run Entreat the Angels and Terminus? I'm not 100% on that but I don't think they only ever use Bonfire for their wincon. You could make the same argument that they also "abuse" a nonwhite card (Top) to get the most out of it, but this is Legacy after all. It's a cutthroat format where if anything can be abused it will be.
Old janky combo deck I ran in standard a few rotations ago. Actually did extremely well against MBD, GW midrange and esper control, because of it's speed, it's 30% chance to win on turn 3-5 and it's disruptive nature that people didn't run answers to in their sideboard because it wasn't meta. Lost to MUD and burn.
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/i-guess-i-won/
>>46185614
I really like show and tell but there's nothing worth running it for in standard right now. I miss Enter the Infinite and Worldspine Wurm.
>>46186281
>no direct damage to opponent
>three unopposed turns to kill
worthless
>>46186437
Eldrazi's ETBs are cast-based, and Briarbridge Patrol puts cards onto the battlefield instead of casts them, making them also worthless. You might as well just ramp instead and cast the fuckers instead of this combo that costs 4 and 5 and is difficult to acquire and protect.
Still waiting on 10+ CMC uncastable timmy cards.
>>46189558
I was hoping the Dromoka's Command could help deal with Radiant Flames
>>46183515
>third block in a row with no good enemy duel lands
Why does Wizards jerk around Ally colors so hard?
Who is going to be the next planeswalker in joining the Gatewatch?
>>46189824
Probably Lili.Maybe Tamiyo?
>>46189698
I just realized, we have 4 different R/W motivations that are going to end up represented this block.
Classic Innistrad R/W, being a desperate band of villagers going against the church in hopes of surviving
Avacyn, being corrupted into a Boos style avatar of extreme justice and vengeance
Nahiri's cultists, who will an organized cult after the chaos of whatever she's trying to use to destroy the plane
And Nahiri herself, who is motivated by a personally vendetta against Sorin.
>>46189687
Maybe but white weenie is a tapout type of deck, holding up mana just in case they might boardwipes you isn't where you want to be. Plus it makes your mana worse(even with battlelands and handlands) because not being able to go t1 dude, t2 dude etc due to a tapped land is just bad. However if you are really worried about boardwipes you can run that 3cmc white spell that gives your dudes +1/+0 and indestructible for a turn.
>>46189883
True enough. Probably want to save non creature spots for the vigilance anthem or Gideon
>>46189641
Stoneforge isn't color pie break its just obviously more powerful than a normal white card and doesn't have any functional equivalents with her equipment cheating ability
You're right that terminus and entreat the Angels are good in miracles but again, only because of the "cheating" miracle cost
Literally the only thing viable about those cards at all is the miracle making them ridiculous under costed and instant speed
Making Angels and wiping the board are proven to be just okay in eternal formats
Black and red usually have more relevant board wipes in eternal formats, whites board wipes are too high cmc
>>46189916
Vigi anthem and the sorcery exile if you just have to have maindeck removal are the only non creature spells I can see running. So far Thalia's Lieutenant and the flip chick who makes dudes are really good creatures. The deck just needs one more good white human to complete it. A banisher priest would be really good because you could forgo non creature removal or something like the original Thalia to help you disrupt your opponent.
>>46189842
Pretty sure Tamiyo is getting killed soon, can't have more than one monocolored potential protagonist. Wizard has to print more Jace and she's eating development space.
>>46184771
It may have to do with it being completely crazy in any multiplayer format.
Its gonna be an EDH allstar, I'll tell you that much.
>>46189950
>Stoneforge isn't color pie break its just obviously more powerful than a normal white card and doesn't have any functional equivalents with her equipment cheating ability
I have to admit, I'm baffled by your thought processes here. I agree fundamentally that white, eternally, is the least powerful color, but you're supporting that by somehow claiming that the white cards that ARE strong, eternally, just don't count as white because they're "cheating" somehow.
>>46190140
They don't have to kill her though, she can just be the Super Friends' Oracle, gathering information and shit instead of actually travelling around combatting threats.And then shove her into the background to never use again because fuck you Kamigawa will never be revisited.
>>46189698
>no good enemy duel lands
>he doesn't play painlands
>>46189557
White is a good control color. Swords/wrath effects/ghostly prison effects are the standouts.
Savannah lion creatures are fine in white because there's no other support for aggressive white strategie like there is in red.
>>46189616
>Best removal
>Best planeswalkers
Fuck you. Blue is the true loser in magic, almost always used as a support color, very rarely has blue been able to stand on its own.
>>46190168
Nah, what he's saying is probably that those cards are only good because of a broken mechanic or another card making them extremely powerful and that they are not representative of White's power, as they are far in between exceptions rather than the rule.
>>46190339
this has to be bait
>>46190339
>Best draw
>Best disruption
Fuck you. Green is the true loser in magic, almost always used as a support color, very rarely has green been able to stand on its own.
>>46190467
>Best Creatures
>Best land ramp
Fuck you. Black is the true loser in magic. Half the good stuff kills you and White removes better than you
>>46190467
>Best creatures
>Best pump spells and combat tricks
Fuck you. Black is the true loser in magic, almost always used as a support color, very rarely has black been able to stand on it's own.
>>46188595
Huh?
RTR had Decay and Deathrite, both of which redefined Legacy. Anything else is just candy.
Objective historical color ranking
1. Blue
2. Black
3. White
4. Red
5. Green
>>46190531
this
>>46190502
>>46190523
Black mind
>>46190531
What? In eternal formats, it's certainly:
1) Blue
2) Black
3) Green
4) Red
5) White
What does white even fucking have other than Balance?
>>46190531
Pfffft
>U
>B
>R
>G/W
And in stuff like Vintage it's
>U
>Brown
>B/R
>G
>W
>>46190628
What does red have other than burn?
>>46190339
was getting caught part of your plan?
>>46190628
White has always had the best removal
>>46190676
swiftspear and titan's strength
>>46190676
REB and Pyro?
The one vintage-playable goblin?
>>46190628
>What is Sword to Plowshare
>What is Path to Exile
>What is every sideboard hate ? RiP, Stony Silence, Leyline of Sanctity...
pls
>>46190697
Which is useful in vintage how?
The best colors in vintage are:
1. Blue
2. Black
3. Brown
4. Red
5. White
6. Green/black cards
7. Utility lands
8. Actual green cards
So it looks like clue's are getting a meme deck, or so it seems.
Also, Kalitas just keeps on going up and up. I'm so happy i already have 2 and one is foil, its like earning free money by doing nothing.
>>46190723
And Dack and artifact removal
>>46190531
Objective last 5 years color ranking
1. Green
2. Black
3. White
4. Blue
5. Red
>>46190760
>8. Actual green cards
Oh yeah, because fastbond isn't an entire deck archetype or anything. And Oath doesn't exist either, I suppose.
Hell, Sylvan exists too.
>>46190760
I'm not talking about Vintage specifically, I'm talking about the color's power throughout the history of the game.
>>46190787
Forgot picture
>>46190697
Removal is far less relevant in Legacy than in Modern, and even less so in Vintage.
>>46190754
>what is channel
>what is goyf
>what is mongoose
>what is fastbond
>what is deathrite
>what is decay
Hell, what are Xantid Swarm and Choke?
>>46190787
I have 3, 1 Prerelease, 1 in Russian and 1 in weeb
THAT TIME I WILL NOT BE LEFT ON THE SIDEROAD, FUCK YOU JACE
>>46190523
>Best graveyard interaction
>Best land destruction
Fuck you. Red is the true loser in magic, almost always used as a support color, very rarely has red been able to stand on its own.
>>46190821
>>46190754
And I even forgot Oath, take it for free my friend.
>>46190821
Green is played alone in a deck ?
Meanwhile :
Blue : Merfolk
Red : Burn
White : D&T
Black : Pox & Mud
Green : ???????
>>46190815
Fastbond isn't a deck anymore. Gushbond is a bad storm deck. Oath is "powerful", but as archetypes go, the only reason I'd play it is because it's got a good shops matchup. Every color has good cards. Green's just pale in comparison to the rest.
Reminder that as shit as white has become, it is the only color in the history of magic to produce a card so degenerate it is banned in every format despite not being a dexterity card or an ante card.
Nohhing can ever take that away.
>>46190902
Elves. Splashes black, but is mono green in the maindeck
>>46190927
Not in 93/94
>>46190902
Elves, which is better than every one of those decks except D&T.
Also
>mud
>black
If we want to get really techical, we can list all of the nonsense stompy decks for each color too, and green even has the best of those in Sylvan Plug.
WHEN IS THE REST OF THE SET
FUCK
I NEED TO KNOW WHAT THE LOW CMC UR SPELLS ARE, I HAVE IDEAS
>>46191036
Dragon Stompy is also a way better monored deck than burn.
And moat stompy is by far the most boss stompy
>>46191093
Friday nigga!
>>46190902
>Black
>MUD
No? I don't even know what you could be referring to, did you mean to say mono-colorless?
Also, not only does green have elves, but sylvan plug is significantly more viable than mono-black pox as well.
>>46190840
I'll drink to that. Red is slowly getting love now that it's branching out into the "impulsive plays" (the risky draws, cast or lose, that sort of shit), but it's still the worst color in the game right now. I wish they'd make looting red and give Blue the safer, but more expensive draw spells.
>>46191158
What's more viable? Pox or Juzam Stompy?
>>46190927
Which card?
And here I thought we were in return to Innistrad. Calm down everyone, nothing in this set actually happened, it's clearly an Un-set in disguise.
>>46191185
Shahrazad a.k.a. Mr. Bones' Wild Ride: the card
>>46189557
I'll admit that I don't give a fuck about eternal formats. But given that we are talking about the color pie when it comes to commons printed in standard legal sets, it is easy to see why White seems to get a whole lot over other colors.
Fucking Topan Freeblade still pisses me off. And they get by far the best flyers.
>>46191279
13 has always been a silly subtheme for Innistrad. Personally I wish they would have fun cards like Triskaidekaphobia ALL the time.
>>46191279
THIRTEEN TIMES THIRTEEN
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHAhhhh
>>46191120
Dragon Stompy is my jam
>>46191356
Im just joking. Im happy magic still remembers how to make cards fun.
>>46191370
...169?
>>46187411
Underrated post.
>>46191354
Isn't it banned in pretty much every format much like ante card were?
>>46191410
Every format except
>>46191026
>>46191410
Did you even read the reply chain
>>46183515
>only two have flavor text
this triggers the autism
>>46191026
What's that?
>>46191171
Still don't know how you're supposed to play red outside of burn.
So many strategies completely fuck it over. And it's not like red has amazing creatures or anything.
I think it's bullshit that reds boardwipes are usually more self-damaging than not, indicative of red's biggest problem, it has 0 synergy with itself.
>>46191831
you don't, outside of burn red is at its strongest supporting other colors.
>>46190531
This is wrong
As much shit as green got, it's had effects like Oath, Survival, and Sylvan Library. Red is much worse than by comparison. There's a reason the joke on the legacy pick a deck chart is "Red cards bad"
>>46191831
That's by design. Red's philosophy as color has always been "nuke everything to the ground, hope you're left standing."
>>46191917
Just once it'd be nice to actually have it be one sided in red's favor.
Or maybe some better permanents. Any good permanents really.
>tfw only good at spell slinging
>still not as good at it as blue
>>46192026
We did have a one-sided board wipe in red's favor, it was miserable. Bonfire of the Damned.
>>46191831
Red is by far the color with the most narrow design and WOTC's laziness is to blame. It seems like they don't even try to make red something more than just burn spells. It's like they treat Red as a "leftover" color. Red was cucked by WOTC themselves.
when's the full spoiler supposed to drop?
>>46192075
Friday
>>46191831
Imperial Painter. Blood Moon effects are the most one-sided things Red has going for it.
>>46192026
I agree it needs better permanents, especially enchantments. Red's enchantments are always like a billion mana and do so little for what you put in. Red's enchantments should hit like a truck if they're more than 3 mana.
>>46189159
>>46189243
I actually love Nahiri because she isn't some overly edge or overly goody two shoes white character. Also she's powerful af and a qt kor to boot (kors are the most qt and /fa/ race aside from vamps).
Maybe sorin took her virginity or something and left her.
Full set spoiled when?
>>46192122
I feel like enchantments as a whole are very underrepresented in Magic currently. There are so many creatures nowadays with static effects, and even activated abilities, that could have been enchantments.
>>46192181
Three colors basically can't interact with them. Making them dudes allows for red and black and blue to do stuff to them.
>>46192181
Sad how they wasted Theros's theme with shitty enchantments
>>46184450
Just realized how cute wolf of devil's breath is with lava axe
>>46192181
Devs have to be careful about what they put on enchantments. 2/5 colors just cannot deal with them in the slightest, and a 3rd color can only deal with them a little. A powerful enchantment is worth more than an equally powerful permanent of any other type except lands.
>>46192293
This is getting less true as the game becomes Creatures: The Gathering. Being a creature makes a card easier to deal with, but the upside of being able to attack and block at all is becoming more and more important.
>>46186417
>not checking the cleavage first for every vampire
It's 2016, anon.
>>46192244
I don't know how blowing up enchantments isn't already a part of red. Can't speak for black, but taking something away from blue would be nice too.
I could see a red mage saying "this is some nice magic you've weaved here. Very intricate, beautiful. I wonder what it looks like on fire."
>>46192293
>>46192181
This is true, but there are two ways to solve it.
1. Continue putting neat enchantment-style effects on creatures
2. Give all colors at least nominal ways of dealing with enchantments
one of those is harder than the other one, though
>>46192244
Turning anything into dudes allow any colors to interact with them since we are undergoing the Creatures: The Tappening transformation.
>>46192388
>Red enchantment-specific counterspells
do it
>>46192332
True enough, but imagine an enchantment like Ghostly Prison being reprinted in SOI. Decks not running green or white would be fucked until it rotated out.
>>46190467
oh really?
>>46192490
MEME POLICE I GOT A WILD MEME HERE!
Memeing this hard is illegal and it'll get you thrown into the meme jail for like 9000 (xD) years if u keep up that memes you dip!
>>46188957
>yfw oath of the gatewatch is really the story of gideon and jace trying to make sure the most powerful pyromancer in the multiverse is under control
>yfw bolas originally tricked her into going there because he wanted to trap her in the hedron network
>yfw nicol bolas was willing to let the eldrazi loose to capture chandra
>>46192552
Anon, I can tell you failed the final exam at the academy, clearly you cannot grasp that the quiz was 9001 questions instead of 9000 for a reason.
>>46192622
>Nissa just stumbles into their plan completely unknowingly and they just go along with it
>>46192431
I was thinking more along the lines of
>destroy target enchantment. CARDNAME deals damage to its controller equal to its CMC
or maybe
>Destroy target enchantment, then add red mana to your mana pool equal to its CMC
So it's got burn or a ritual stapled on.
>>46192641
>>46192431
I like it more when it's:
>Take control of target enchantment until end of turn."
or
>"Enchanted enchantment deals X damage to its controller during its controller's upkeep."
These things are fine ways to interact with enchantments in red.
>>46184149
>what is white's strength
Defensive abilities and creatures. You can give white great removal that punishes aggression and it's really supposed to be the primary color of efficiently costed creatures (shared with green, although green mostly cares about fat things). Part of the problem is that every color is getting progressively better creatures because they want the game to be creature-driven. There's nothing wrong with that but it means that they really need to push white's low drops for that advantage to stick out and that's not really something they've been doing too consistently (you can find example of pushed white dudes of course, but you can find them in every other color as well).
White could have been really cool and interesting but it fell victim to design laziness somewhere along the way. That's basically the trajectory of Magic in a nutshell though.
>>46183515
Will these things be cheap? I hope so.
>>46190902
Elves, Stompy ?
>>46183361
Here is an awesome combo
Turn one place a untapped blue mana producing land and cast Delver of Secrets
>>46192293
>>46192244
Imo each color should get 1 weakness which they find difficult to deal with, but there should still be some more enchantment interaction in red/black (something like red's temporary steal effects or redirects or trigger copying)
Also, they for some reason they have never had a weakness for blue or white (I know blue is weak right now, that's besides the point).
I think:
Blue: can't deal well with graveyards and/or lands.
Black: can't deal well with artifacts
Red: can't deal well with enchantments
Green: can't deal well with creatures
I don't really know what the weakness could be for with though, it basically has almost everything, unless you somehow gave it a weakness to instants or sorceries, which most colors already can't deal with and seems like it would just lead to less interaction vs combo/control.
>>46189233
>Remember to have Jenrik [research] Markov Manor.
>With angels came [mysteries].
>Consider this: the shepherd turns [on] her flock. Why?
>Their chanting grows louder as [the] tide rises.
>The [symbols] - when did they change?
Oh my god. Jace is going to research mysteries on the symbols!!!
>Remember [to] have Jenrik research Markov Manor.
>[With] angels came mysteries.
>Consider this: [the] shepherd turns on her flock. Why?
>Their chanting grows louder as [the] tide rises.
>[The] symbols - when did they change?
Oh my god. To with the the the!!!!
>>46183911
LANDland
>>46192806
Black can't deal with enchantments as well
Blue can't get rid of things permanently
>>46192806
White's weakness is the most glaring of all the colors. White has all the answers in the world, but no means to draw them. Mentor of the Meek is the absolute best draw engine white will ever see.
It also has shit ramp, but so does blue outside of high tide.
>>46189431
Oh man. I fear for the future of the game. Anon doesn't like it when they put black people on his cards! Will they stop in time? Is it too late?!
>>46190840
>Removal can also kill your opponent
>Fastest creatures
Fuck you. Colorless is the true loser in magic, almost always used as a support not-a-color, very rarely has colorless been able to stand on its own.
>>46192765
They're going for $6 right now which seems about right. They might go up more a bit during their life in standard but not by much. There is literally 0 demand for these things outside standard because they're just worse checklands on every turn except 1.
>>46192938
>Hey diddle-diddle, Reality Smasher up the middle
>>46192867
>It also has shit ramp, but so does blue outside of high tide.
The problem with that, though, is that blue also has the best card advantage -- and if you can always draw enough cards, you'll always hit your land drops, ramp or no. White doesn't anything approximating that advantage at all.
>>46192721
>setting fire to things to burn your opponents
Fucking love it. Maybe give them the option to pay mana to destroy whatever it's attached to as well?
>>46193043
Also blue can just cheat shit in. White can only do that from the graveyard or with artifacts.
>>46192864
>Black can't deal with enchantments as well
Yeah, I know. It makes no sense to me how it is supposedly sensible for 2 colors to not be able to deal with a permanent type.
>Blue can't get rid of things permanently
Bounce is permanent with countermagic and countermagic is permanent.
>>46192867
I meant like as a partial balancing factor, like instead of playing retarded cards like gaia's vengeance to improve a blue matchup you would play flashback cards as mild hate. This would increase diversity in 2 ways at once by encouraging different card types while discouraging dominant decks (rather than just a normal strong hate card which just discourages dominance and makes the game less fun)
Or that's the idea of it anyway.
White's lack of card draw is a weakness, but it isn't exactly exploitable in the same manner, I suppose the natural weakness it gets is removal, but it is also the color of protection spells, so that might need to change for that idea to work.
>>46193056
Nah. They're going to have to get rid of the enchantment itself. It's red's way to ensure it can do SOMETHING against enchantments.
>>46192878
Man, no one likes niggers. Especially other niggers. The only people that like niggers are white people trying to look tolerant, hip and with it
>>46192721
>>46193056
They've already tried something similar to this actually.
Most of these tools that Red needs are things it's gotten once, only never be used again.
>>46193142
>teehee look how profane I am, surely someone will take notice
Here's your (you).
>>46192721
R
Enchantment
"At the beginning of each players upkeep that player may sacrifice any number of enchantments they controls. Then each enchantment they control does damage equal to its CMC to the player."
I can't think of better way to word this but I guess you get the idea.
>>46193142
>Man, no one likes elves. Especially other elves. The only people that like elves are humans trying to look tolerant, hip and with it
I just realized I've never seen a black elf in Magic. I guess the racists can consider that one a victory.
>>46193189
Oh I'll translate into SafeTalk
No one likes the poor oppressed people of color, especially other poor oppressed people of color who have internalized racism
>>46193269
If there's one thing I hate more than niggers, it's elves
>>46193269
Elves were smart enough to fully complete their genocides. Like the Phyrexians.
>>46183515
Cluelands
>>46192388
The idea about global enchantments thematically is that they are untangible magic woven through basically all things.
Red blows up artifacts by bashing it, kills guys with fire or throwing rocks and gets rid of enchantments on dudes by setting the guy on fire.
But if someone makes Grakk feel warm and fuzzy inside, no matter how much you set him on fire, the problem won't go away.
That's thematically. Which, who cares, you can spin anything thematically. As for it not being able to do so mechanically, because it is part of its legacy.
Theoretically, direct damage should be the most versatile thing in the game. It kills dudes, players, nowadays planeswalkers. But it turns out that making direct damage any good is dangerous, so we end up with a lot of shit in red.
>>46193269
>I just realized I've never seen a black elf in Magic.
Multicolored stuff aside, Lorwyn has those.
>>46183696
Ryan Adams, pls
Can someone key me in on the elf genocide thing before the thread dies? I know that Nissa unleashed the Eldrazi and didn't give a rats ass about other planes but is there something else I'm missing?
>>46190525
>"Is this just a euphemism for 'had powerful cards in it'? Do people actually think that RTR was good for competitive play?"
>Huh? There were powerful cards.
I know. I don't think I like decay, deathrite is... alright I guess. I consider neither gifts to competitive magic though, just because they are strong. And some of the strongest cards for modern/standard were fucking terribly designed for competitive play.
RIP, the entire uncounterable cycle (decay makes some sense, but otherwise I no), pack rat, sphinx's revelation
That being said, looking at the full set, there are quite a decent amount of good cards I do like, but I'm not sure if it was much a net positive nonetheless.
>>46190814
Last 5 years is pretty varied
Blue was fantastic 5 years ago
Now it's bad
I would say for the last 2 years red has been one of the better colors
Last 2 years objective:
Green
Black
Red
White
Blue
>>46193386
Even then, blue has had dtt and cruise
>>46193316
>if someone makes Grakk feel warm and fuzzy inside
>implying red isn't also the color of making people angry and convincing them to attack
>implying "attacks each turn if able" isn't almost entirely owned by red
Thematically, I think red should be allowed to strip someone of all their magical buffs and fight them like a man. Mechanically, though, I'm not going to extrapolate on how that should work.
>>46193295
So, are you trying to argue that racism isn't a thing while being racist?
>>46193316
I really hate how the justification is always "red is too dumb to dispel the magic." Red is impulsive, that isn't the same thing as dumb. Plus red is the secondary spell color, they're supposed to be really good at magic. If they can't counter things in the moment they could at least get the ability to remove a damn enchantment now and then.
>>46188553
Mate at one point recently white could run almost an entire standard deck full of 2/1 for 1
>>46193269
I just looked through all of them and while I didn't look at alt art, the only ones I found who look vaguely black (due to facial structure, there are plenty of brown elves) are Elvish Visionary, Mul Daya Channelers, Oracle of Mul Daya and Radha, Heir of Keld.
>>46193465
Is there a story behind Radha's sword? It looks like it used to be really huge. Like it belonged to a giant or something.
>>46193433
Eh. I love Red, but I think they know that most people who love Red love characters like Jaya or goblins or barbarians.
I understand how nice it is to get a Feldon here and there. Or hell, even a flavor text like this or the entire world of Kaladesh does wonders for Red's thematic identity.
But stupid red has way more fans. Look at Goblin Chieftain. That card's flavor text is absolutely hated. Both of them. For two sets, it dared to give goblins a bit of dignity and was mocked for "not sounding like a goblin". They fixed it. People love stupid goblins and they love stupid red. Flavor text like Stranglehold will always be what red is about for some people.
And hell, even mechanically, there is something very satisfying about "getting rid of an enchantment" by killing the player controlling it.
And I do want to point out that it isn't necessarily "too stupid". It might just be too stubborn, the same way Green won't kill a person via assassination but will have a their bear maul their face off.
>>46193418
Fair enough.
>>46193665
Probably something like this happened. I couldn't find anything about it though. She was a Keldon Warlord at some point, it seems.
Also, coincidentally, this art looks like it features a black elf.
>>46193667
>I understand how nice it is to get a Feldon here and there
Nail on the head. He's the reason I started liking red. It was nice to see something beyond GRR ANGRY SMASH
Even now with SOI that's what Red is. Red is the new black. "It's cliche to assume that black = evil = villian, I know, let's put red in and make the cards shit and the characters one-dimensional!"
>>46193433
I always figured it was less 'Red is too dumb' and more 'Red wants stuff to happen'.
Blue uses counterspells and effects to just stonewall people, while Red prefers explosions and stuff going off constantly on both sides.
Cards like pic related are a good example of how Red would try 'dispeling' and enchantment. Basically saying 'let's see how you like it' and flinging it back at them.
Stuff still happens, and Red gets to be chaotic, clever, and keep itself free all at the same time.
>>46193796
People always go "It's so great to see a white villain!" when the villains are always white. Konda, Heliod, Elesh Norn, Radiant, Akroma, Azorius in OG Ravnica
It's really not THAT rare. I guess they're doing it to red
>>46193796
>>46193883
I'm actually curious to see a tally now. Which colors have the most and least villains across magic history?
>>46193796
>>46193667
Oh wow, I said "even a flavor text like this" and forgot the image. Oops.
Anyway, if you don't like barbarians and their mindset at ALL, you won't like Red. I like caring, creative Red too, but if you genuinely don't like flavor text like Skullcrack or Jackal Familiar, Red will disappoint you at every turn.
>>46193909
Black is probably still king with the biggest of bads Yawgmoth and the newest big bad in Nicol Bolas.
But even in Shadows over Innistrad. Avacyn and her angels and Nahiri are both started white and continue to be part white.
>>46191401
If only that was its card number
>>46193955
There's a time for caring and creative and a time for barbarism, and I think there's a place for both. The key is to make sure that the flavortext on the barbarian cards isn't all 'durr, smash'.
The examples you gave are good ones. Lava Axe is another nice example. Showing that even in the feral side of Red they're that same playfulness and wit is important.
>>46193882
Red understands auras and whatnot pretty well, but when you have situations like Red blowing up something like Brave the Sands or Shadows of the Past, you get into a question of what really is going on.
Admittedly, how the fuck does Green and White do it?
People associate those sorts of effects with a sort of spiritual cleansing. A sort of pristine world.
>>46193955
I like both, but variety is nice. Is black isn't always the villain and white isn't always the good guy, can't red not be a complete retard now and again?
There are some great ones. Feldon, Obliterate, that Ogre fighting the Phyrexians, and I guess the Izzet guild sort of counts.
I'd love more monored revenge flavor. They're sort of doing it with Nahiri, but she's still white. Somehow.
>>46193962
Isn't Nicol still three color? It wouldn't make sense to classify it as only black imho. I'd argue that green or blue is likely the one with the less villain and even they have their race of trouble makers. Like the Cephalid or Lorwyn elvesthough the elves are also black.
>>46194043
Honestly, while I was looking, I found a lot more "serious" red flavor text than I expected. Feel free to look through these.
http://magiccards.info/query?q=ft%3A.+c%21r&v=card&s=cname
I do feel Red is the best at making comedic flavor text though. Aggravate remains one of my favorite flavor texts ever.
>>46184049
>I feel like we're going to see a lot of decks that run at least a combined 6 of Lilianas and Jaces
Hnnngh yes.
>>46193667
They release what, ~200 red cards a year? There's a chance it might be possible to satisfy both audiences, it's not like you have to pick one or the other to make cards for.
>>46194074
She's white because theoretically, it is a righteous fury for a previous misdeed. A sort of eye for eye, balance in the world, biblical god sort of thing.
>>46191026
>93/94
>The most needlessly shit solved format (even above tiny leaders) and doesn't actually include all sets from 93/94
>>46191554
See my response above. It's basically another speculator attempt to increase the price of older cards to steal autismbux from unsuspecting NEETs and people with nothing better to spend their money on.
It's a shit format and already solved. Its only interest is purely in nostalgia.
>>46194077
He's grixis which has black as the dominant color but that's a fair point.
>>46194055
White usually gets it because they deal with non-physical effects more, and that shows in their removal. Law Magic can banish most things regardless of form, as opposed to Red/Black which is typically more physical in nature.
Green is more about the sense of removing unnatural things, since focuses more on Enchantment and Artifact removal. Often this is seen as wearing something down through the passage of time.
Blue does it by dispersing the mana of the Enchantment (bouncing) before waiting to carefully deconstruct it as it reforms (countering).
While not every removal spell applies to every card in a flavorful manner, I understand perfectly well why and how the colors that get Enchantment removal do.
That said, I think the place where Red and Black shine is more in 'punishment' effects. They might not know how to blow up a non-physical thing like an enchantment, but they can make it painful enough that you don't want to be holding it either.
>>46194119
Wow, I guess red mana really does turn you retarded because that's the dumbest justification I've ever heard. What's worse is that I'm sure she'll actually be vindicated and redeemed, probably join the watch of the oathgate when it's all over and her crimes Nissa'd out of memory.
>>46191026
>93/94
Banned in every real format.
>>46194116
Well, sure. Here, as a bit of research I looked at very red card with flavor text in Standard.
http://magiccards.info/query?q=c%21r+ft%3A.+f%3Astandard&s=cname&v=card&p=1
There are 137 of them. 12 of them are comedic. That's 12/137. People say that red gets characterized as stupid in flavor too much, but honestly, that's just because it is the stupid and funny flavor text that people remember.
Sure, there are serious flavor texts that also embody that sort of stubbornness, but the brutality and strength and passion of Red isn't made comedic in these.
>>46194249
We don't actually know what Sorin did that was so bad. It has been hinted at, but not outright stated.
>>46194331
So these morons are walking around with rusty, brown, stinky swords?
Pretty stupid if you ask me senpai
>>46189431
You know black characters have been in Magic since the 90s right? They even had an African themed block.
>>46194427
And how many white people were in the african themed block?
>>46193883
Everyone's always talking about white villains, when what we need are more black heroes.
>>46194375
I knew someone was gonna say something to that effect.
I personally love the Red notion that the world doesn't have to be complicated. Sure, your sword might not be as well maintained as the other guys, but you'll fuck him up with it nonetheless, because you are stronger, faster and don't hesitate. You don't need the frivolities and pretension and you are free to do what you want, when you want it.
This sounds super edgelordy, but all color's power fantasies end up like this. The color philosophies don't really hold up to close scrutiny and applying pragmatism to it kills that sense of wonder.
>>46194830
Solid card, especially if you can pull off Delirium.
Not sure if it deserved a Rare slot though, since it's literally just a wolf covered in eyes.
>>46194830
God, I fucking love Delirium. I am so glad it appears on more cards and isn't just a limited fodder mechanic like Fateful Hour and Outlast.
Also, jesus christ, horrifying art.
>>46194847
probably because it does some interesting stuff with delirium.
>>46194856
For when this thread is dies.
>>46194830
Oh, now we're talking.
>>46194830
THROAT WOLF
>>46192622
Stop. You're making my dick to hard. It can't be contained.
>>46191831
Back in the day you used to be able to play Ponza style decks, which was a tempo oriented red deck that employed land destructrion spells to gain an advantage. It was also used in prison style decks and decks like wildfire.
You'll notice those all have land destruction in common. It's not coincidental that red became a one trick pony for a long time after wizards decided 3 mana stone rains and other well costed LD effects were no longer acceptable because they were "unfun"
So, like everything else bad about magic, you can blame scrubs and casuals
>>46193909
Most is black still by a significant margin. It's harder to find sets where black isn't evil or at least very dubious.
Least is probably green. Wizards has complained about how hard it is to write green villains before.
I remember talking about this with a buddy many years ago. We came up with expansionist Darwinist elves utilizing spider calvary.
>>46195373
What are they talking about they have a green villain it isNissa.
>>46194074
Hidetsugu of Kamigawa was red and was extremely intelligent in his own mildly demented, demonic way.
But in case, you cannot have red that values intelligence for its own sake, because that's blue's theme.
>>46184057
Jesus christ. That's obscene.
>>46183950
KEKland :^)))))))))))))
>>>/reddit/
;)
>>46183602
Top kek, i had a phase in my life where i would quote nothing but Chad warden quotes
i knew all his videos
6 whole months
my girlfriend left me
i sprayed liquid ass in her face
shit was cash
Sarah Valdovinos...whata catch bromos
chad you bastard
ruined my realtionship
>>46195373
>Wizards has complained about how hard it is to write green villains before.
Eco-terrorist. Peta. Crazy anti-civilization naturalist. "Humans are a virus." Evil druids. Nature good, civilization bad. Racist elves. How is this difficult?
