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Pathfinder General /pfg/
Ultimate Intrigue is out and 99% of the archetypes are bad, even the Magical Child
Unified /pfg/ link repository: http://pastebin.com/TvnRtPbt
Old Thread: >>46042423
>>46047063
You were the Chosen One's replacement. Oh well, time for Knight-Chandlers!
>>46047106
Second for this, even if I like their stuff.
How is Metamorph alchemist vs. Skinchanger druid?
>>46047147
Metamorph alchemist gives up everything except mutagen.
Skinchanger druid keeps animal companion and spellcasting.
You do the math.
>>46047165
What makes the Metamorph good?
First for this anon >>46047106 at some point whining in the thread about groupthinks and circlejerks, like he does every night at around this same time.
>>46042426
>>46042426
>>46042426
This thread is four hours older.
>>46047184
This thread is better.
>>46047170
Nothing.
>>46047063
>Using the old pastebin
Shameful, anon, just shameful.
Next time use: http://pastebin.com/XehJXVjp
>>46047063
First for clerics with more skill points.
>>46045259
>>46047063
>TFW WHEN YOU SPEND AN HOUR AND A HALF CRAMMING TOGETHER A TROVE UPDATE FOR THE PASTEBIN AND IT DOESN'T MAKE IT INTO THE GODDAMN PASTEBIN
https://mega.nz/#F!dsxR3KCJ!tbmlmKB_IsgDtzzrlXkVVQ
YOU LOSERS ARE JUST LUCKY QANONADORES EACH AND EVERY ONE OF YOUBECAUSE IF SHE WASN'T SO CAUGHT UP INLOVING YOU TO FUCKING PIECES, SHE WOULDN'T BOTHER WITH THIS SHITTY BUSYWORK
>>46047205
It's literally just a far worse cloistered cleric from 3.5.
>>46047184
It was also made after the last thread was made-as such, we ignored it for the most part. But then, somebody last thread did the same thing, and now there's four /pfg/ threads, and I imagine the mods are going to be a bit peeved about that.
>>46047198
>This thread is better.
Yes, but >>46047082 is the best new thread, it has a trove link that's actually been updated for the first time in months.
Can anyone post Gray Paladin?
>>46047227
Previous thread, it sucks. Let's not make us all experience that disappointment again.
>>46047217
... Is that a FIFTH one?
The fuck?
>>46047213
>>46047082
>>46042426
Fuck it, I'm out. Hopefully this shit show is sorted out by tomorrow.
Sleep tight, /pfg/
>>46047207
I tried, but alas nothing but shitposters who don't respect QANON's gracious time on tonight.
>>46047227
Right here, sugarlips: >>46045238
>>46047253
Yeah, it's shit, but at least Tyrant Antipals are good.
And by good I mean 'replace/change very little, allowing them to do almost anything unarch'd antipals could'
So yeah. Good. Does the job.
>>46047253
>>46047284
How comes they did it right with Antipaladin but did it so wrong with Paladin..?
JESUS SHITTING DICKNIPPLE CHRIST, FIVE GODDAMN THREADS.
FUCK THAT NOISE, QANON IS STAYING RIGHT HERE UNTIL THIS SHIT DIES DOWN. SHE'S PLANTING HER FLAG, THIS IS HER GODDAMN EMPIRE, AND YOU'RE NOT PRYING HER FROM IT WITH ANYTHING SHORT OF COLD IRON FORGED FROM THE POWDERED FUCKING HEMOGLOBIN OF A THOUSAND GODDAMN WAIFUS (PLEASE NOTE QANON DOES NOT SUPPORT THE BLEEDING, GENERAL HARM, OR DEATH, OF WAIFUS)
Is there a reason to play Kineticist now that Warlock comes out?
> 6th casting from Sorc/Wiz list
> Doesn't kill itself with its blast
> Can use blast in iterative
>>46047369
Was there any reason to play a kineticist in the first place?
DSP save us!
We want a GOOD CHA-based mahou shoujo vigilante, not this vapid shit Paizo threw at us!
>>46047306
Couldn't begin to tell you. Still, not like it's the first crappy paladin archetype they've ever thrown at us.
I actually do like what they gave us, but I still wishVigilante had been a PF implementation of the Chameleon because that would've been the perfect way.
>>46047420
That's WIS-based though, not CHA.
>>46047403
"Magical girl" is a profession, not a class or an archetype.
There are fighty magical girls, casty magical girls, bardic magical girls, completely peaceful magical girls, etc. etc.
>>46047382
aether kineticist can be fun, you can rogue better than a roguenot that that's hard
>telekinetic finesse=ranged legerdemain at lvl3 at will
>telekinetic flight
>telekinetic invisibility which works against sound
>animate object to have someone's possessions literally rob themselves
>lift thousands of pounds
still not great of course but given the right campaign it can work
>>46047382
ALL DAY
L
L
D
A
Y
>>46047369
I'm still fucking mad about Kineticist
>You will never take so much fucking burn you look like you're on fire/became nothing but water/etc in order to take out the BBEG in one epic shot
>You will never slowly turn to ash/drip away/etc after saving the party at the cost of your life
Fuck! All I ever wanted out of this class was to burn twice as bright and die a heroic death of my choosing.
>>46047458
Well, the vigilante has the whole elaborate transformation sequence thing going for it-that helps a bit.And I really want mauler Animal Guide to be a thing, because nordic Magical Child who calls upon the power of motherfucking Fenrir or some shit sounds funny.
https://archive.4plebs.org/tg/thread/43294723/#43300120
What's the background of astomoi in your campaign? Why haven't you played one yet?
>>46047520
You're not fooling anyone, Pastor.
>>46047516
Even if it did work, isn't it just a really shitty Unchained summoner?
>>46047516
The Magical Child can still cast spells even untransformed.
That's dumb and unfitting.
Just had an idea. >>46047458 made a good point. There is countless flavors of magical girl. So how about a magical girl archetype for most classes?
>>46047568
Yes, but I'd feel a little better about it.
So all-in-all the Vigilante brought a fair number of disappointments:
General
>no archetypes stack
>no archetype that uses evolutions/wildshape/medium spirits
Warlock
>magus spell list now
>prepared casting instead of arcanist casting
>half the abilities are on the cabalist
Zealot
>lost the patron abilities
>lost access to Hunter casting
>lost access to being a 6th level necromancer
Cabalist has the fluff for being a 6th level necromancer but lacks the Empower Symbol/Channel Energy which are on the Zealot
Wildsoul doesn't get Hunter casting or Animal focus despite being perfectly set up for it
Most transformative is the Brute which kinda sucks from a cursory glance
>>46047588
What exactly are the criteria? It doesn't seem like you need a particular archetype at all, just hats of disguise to do a costume change sequence.
>>46047568
The vigilante social talents gives them more of a skill base, and allows them to have incentive to have skill stuff to increase versatility
>>46047108
How do we fix the Mahou Shoujo?
>Witch Spell List
>Familiar grants spells and transformations
>CHA casting stat
>Bonus to social skills and Power of friendship (and Yuri)
>>46047535
It's nothing because I forgot they existed. Only one other person in my group even knows the exist, we're probably not even going to bother with Noob Saibot.
>>46047653
Who needs that shit when you have an eidolon and Summon Monster I through IX as SLAs?
>>46047664
LEWD
E
W
D
>>46047664
Don't forget
>Become one size category smaller and appear as if you were a child, incur no further age modifiers but still die of natural causes when your time comes
>>46047582
There are a few magical girls who don't strictly need to transform, like Nanoha. Hell, Sakura doesn't even have a transformation, just a gay seamstress.
>>46047664
Transform into a cute loli, regardless of race, gender and age
>>46047633
Warlock use Sorcerer/Wizard spell list you dum-dum.
>>46047761
Throw that idea to Paizo. Those SJWs would prolly eat it up as some kind of 'progressive views'
>>46047761
But I like my middle age magical man.
>>46047633
>Most transformative is the Brute which kinda sucks from a cursory glance
considering all the hulk-type builds available by playing an alchemist I just dont see the point in a Brute
>>46047643
There is more. The cute outfits, social skills, and familiar.
Basic ideas I have for a general magical girl archetype
>Scaling weapon and armor while transformed. Kind of thinking about letting players you know, pick more stuff about their magical girl gear, what kind of enchantments are on their weapons and armor
>A bit of the vigilante dual identity stuff
>CHA becomes your casting stat
>bonuses to social skills
I'm a shit at balance so odds something I said fucked up a class.
>>46047803
>>46047803
As long as you feel pretty, I won't stop you.
Less-lewd question for DSP devs: Marksman has a talent list, but no ability to manifest talents. Was this an error in UPsi that had meant to be fixed? How many talents does a marksman get?
Would "magical girl' work as an akashic VMC (an actually good VMC) for any non-akashic class that grants access to a "costume" of veils?
>>46047826
>familiar
The familiar is for the group, not for any individual magical girl.
>>46047863
Good point, maybe have the familiar be a teamwork feat or a feature that lets the magical girl bind herself to one as a way to join a group.
>>46047834
Passed to internal.
>>46047805
The brute is literally nothing but negatives. It even specifically notes that you don't get any ability score boost from being Large, so all that does it make you a bigger target.
>>46047901
>>46047863
Its called the familiar mascot archetype, iirc.
>>46047633
Don't worry, the brute sucks from an in-depth class as well.
Look, the gist is that 'magical girl' is such a diverse goddamn array of possibilities, the only consistent feature is fancy outfits. They don't even have to transform into them, as noted earlier, Cardcaptor Sakura just has a friend who shits out frilly dresses for her and she just gets changed before heading out.
>>46047633
Cabalist is Arcane. It having religious stuff tied to it wouldn't make sense.
Arcane Necromancer, not a Divine one.
>>46047826
I wouldn't mind seeing an option for a PreCure-type magical girl, either. You know, the kind that do most of their fighting with DBZ-level insane hand-to-hand abilities and then asspull an Elemental Flux attack for the killing blow.
>>46047960
Most of the Precures are PoW initiators fighting in frilly dresses.
>>46047535
Wow, I guess really nobody knows that these guys exist.
>>46048017
People know the exist, they just tended to not really click with people.
I mean they're less snowflakey than the munavri which is wierd looking at them, but there you go.
>>46047935
Will agree to some extent.
Look at all the mahou shoujo anime and not many characters would fit the Magical Girl archetype.
>Symphogear
Party of Bards and Skalds maybe a Rubato
>Nanoha and by extension Strikers
Wizards who learned PoW and wrote them in their spell list
>Madoka
Ironically, none of them are straight-up "magical". You can actually roll most as psionic or path of war classes.
>Precure
As stated a while ago - PoW classes fighting in frilly dresses
>Sailor Moon
Yeah, probably the only group of Magical Girl archetypes
>CC Sakura
Harrow inspired Sorc or Occultist
>>46048044
>munavri
Light blindness is a bitch, though.
>>46048085
>Creatures with light blindness are blinded for 1 round if exposed to bright light, such as sunlight or the daylight spell. Such creatures are dazzled as long as they remain in areas of bright light.
>The creature is unable to see well because of over-stimulation of the eyes. A dazzled creature takes a –1 penalty on attack rolls and sight-based Perception checks.
It's not that bad.
>>46048048
Sakura is a wizard.
>>46047915
Appreciated. Seemed like a weird omission, but I might also be the first person to actually make a marksman since the book came out and nobody noticed. I can get by without talents, but it would be nice to know regardless.
>>46048102
She strikes me more as an Arcanist.
Alternatively, consider the fact that each of the cards is a living, conscious spirit, and she's a Binder.
>>46048085
There's a bitter resentment of realizing there's a pair of glasses that fixes Light Blindness but they cost 20k gold and are functionally no different from a pair of fucking sunglasses. Fuck you, Paizo.
>>46048125
This. Sakura's magic is from her implements. It really does make her a Binder, Occultist, Harrower.
>>46048116
Okay, so from what we can tell, it's a relic of sorts. Talents were originally an optional system, but playtesting and revisions made them an assumption of the system. Marksman got missed in the process, so it still has a talent list but no default talents.
I don't know what's going to happen there in an official sense, but the suggested ruling is that they get 2, similar to Psychic Warrior, Dread, and Cryptic.
Thanks for the catch, anon!
>>46048128
It's to discourage people fromplaying Drow.
>>46048048
We do not speak about StrikerS, anon. EVER.
>>46048146
Yeah, I remember seeing that rule in the original PsiAug:Vol1, but I hadn't looked at it since getting UltPsi, so I guess I forgot, too. Two would have been my guess as well. Thanks, and you're welcome!
>>46048189
I literally just started watching Nanoha last night, blind beyond "it's a mahou shoujo classi"
Is StrikerS something infamous I should skip :?
>>46048160
It's to discourage people fromusing the custom magic item rules to do the exact same fucking thing for 1k.
>>46048257
Well, Penumbra isn't an official cantrip. It was one of those devblog ones.
>>46048128
Eh?
I mean it's not much better, but a constant item of Protective Penumbra would be 18k to buy.
Could a character challenge an enemy and rage at the same time if they had both abilities?
>>46047170
Metamorph gets mutagen + giant form 2 + discoveries
That's all the class features it gets
>>46048375
How hard is it to cut colored glass and fit them onto frames?
Sunglasses aren't magical, yet they can logically fix light blindness.
>>46047432
I am playing a knight chandler as a magical girl right now: While I had a lot of hesitations about being WIS-based, I am really getting it to work now.
>You're not highly charismatic, so you're a bit shy, awkward around people, and not confident in yourself
>However, because you have wisdom you actually have a good intuitive sense of right and wrong, can read people properly with sense motive to see if their intentions are good, and have the willpower to resist the worst of magic effects
This got reinforced even more when the GM threw another vigilante hero at us and while he was cool, it took quite a bit of frantic talking and getting beaten up first to convince him that we were on his side.
Don't dump wisdom as a vigilante defender of justice, guys.
You can't tell right things from wrong things if you can't even tell your right foot from your left.
>>46048376
Yes
>http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/advancedPlayersGuide/baseClasses/cavalier.html
>http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/coreRulebook/classes/barbarian.html
Entering a Rage is a free action. Challenging someone is a swift action.
>>46048410
>not getting Wis based Bluff and Diplomacy from traits
Why?
>>46048397
Other option is technology.
A pair of specs costs 1000 gold. A brown veemod chip costs 200gp. Slot it in and they negate light blindness/sensitivity. Takes one charge a day, though.
>>46048048
>>46047108
>My group will never agree to play a party of Sentai, Mahou Shoujos, Tokusatsus, or even color coordinate their outfits.
How does level adjustment work in pathfinder?
Exactly the same as 3.5?
>>46048397
Logically, you could use smoked goggles to fix light blindness. It's a terrible idea because smoked goggles are terrible, but Paizo.
>>46048468
None
>>46048468
Nope.
Level adjustment isn't an official thing in PF, if I recall.
>>46048453
>not playing a spellcaster and using Suggestion to manipulate your party into coordinating their outfits
>>46048468
Level adjustment doesn't exist in Pathfinder.
>>46048444
I... didn't know a WIS to bluff trait existed.
Thank you for that.
>>46048481
I can at least see where they're coming from.
Light Blindness is supposed to be a WEAKNESS.
Letting it be solved with a pair of sunnies means it ISN'T a weakness, unless a DM specifically goes to capitalize on it, and they can only do that so often without making the game about it.
It's like material components for spells. It's technically a thing, but a lot of DMs don't go for it, meaning that in a lot of cases, it ISN'T a weakness.
Also, Lenses of Darkness. They're 12k to buy, not 20k.
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/wondrous-items/wondrous-items/h-l/lenses-of-darkness
How/ Where do I get friends that play tabletops?
>>46048468
It was supposed to raise the average party level at 1-8 or some shit but nothing changes on the player end.
>>46048497
That only works if you have a sense of fashion.
Did you read the second to last chapter of Dungeon Meshi?
>>46048233
StrikerS suffers from being twice as long with twice the cast and half the characterization (and the same amount of plot) as the other two series.
I still LIKE it, but it's definitely the weakest offering of MGLN. You should watch it if only for completeness' sake (and because the ending is righteous), but that doesn't mean you'll have to watch it ever again.
>>46048497
>not playing a spellcaster and using Suggestion to manipulate your party into not wearing anything
>Unchained Combat Economy
Who thought this was a good idea?
>>46045087
>>46045108
1d6+1 to 1d6+5 'damage'?
>>46048757
You can iterative with them, and use stuff like rapid shot with them. Also Arcane Strike bumps the damage up some.
Heck, you can use Deadly Aim if you choose to not have them as touch attacks.
Reminder
>>46047922
You get reach at least, which is pretty useful.
>>46048676
I like the idea of the Unchained Action Economy, but to be good, the actual game would need to be designed around it.
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?481694-Dreamscarred-Press-Presents-quot-Tzocatl-The-First-Language-quot
>>46048860
>2 + Int skill points on a 3/4 BAB class
Come on, it's Int-based, but really?
>>46048799
I almost want to make a 7 int alchemist just to spite this archetype
>>46048860
The warspeaker is a one-level dip class for Charisma martials because of these:
>Yaotlalia: Starting at first level, a warspeaker may use this ability to gain an insight bonus on attack rolls equal to her Charisma modifier.
>Itlacoa: Starting at first level, a warspeaker may use this ability to gain an insight bonus on damage rolls equal to her Charisma modifier.
So it looks like Metamorph stacks with Toxicant.
That or Bramblebrewer if you wanna be a giant tree.
>>46048860
I know it's thematic and all, whatever, but I really hate that there's a bunch of ability names in there I have no idea how to pronounce.
Maybe you can become an extra ordinary magician.
I wish that d20pfsrd would do pages for combinations of archetypes and the resulting class table.
>>46048860
Is there anything stopping a character from "taking 20" on Tzocatl checks, which was a major problem in the original version of Tzocatl?
As far as I can tell, nothing here stops a character from "taking 20" on edicts like Imperative of Deflection or Command of Prowess or litanies like Litany of Sight Unbroken.
>>46045537
You already have aegis for frilly dress, any flavor of soulknife for weapon, inertial armor and Form Astral Armor powers for armor, call weaponry, claws of the beast powers and Goddess boosts for weapon, even temporal acceleration power and few Hourglass maneuvers for >>46045139 za warudo.
Since you are not playing pointbuy-based game, you must combine what you want from different classes.
>>46048860
Cool. Can we have mecha aegis and biomecha druid now?
>>46045558
5th level Flux stance gives you ability to throw energy bolts. Use soulknife if you want to throw something before level 9.
>>46046769
Are separate pdfs of powex, akasha and soulknife not included on purpose?
>>46048515
what's it called?
>>46048952
That would be very time consuming for the people running the site.
Good thing no one has found out you can buff cleric with armour and absolutely wreck armies...... Oh wait
>>46048952
Are you volunteering? Because _I_ don't have that kind of time.
>>46048988
The literal fuck are you talking about?
>>46048963
Given that you get -5 for using an edict 2 turns or more in a row, in effect you're burning 20 turns to roll a 15 instead of a 10.
>>46048986
That's what turning it into an actual wiki instead of just using Google Pages is for.
>>46047848
>akashic VMC
Why not just take veilshaping feats?
>>46048963
I like the idea that magic is something you can do better or worse depending on how much time and care you can put into it.
>>46048189
>>46048639
StrikerS have awesome Fate voice.
>it's definitely the weakest offering of MGLN
Have you tried Force?
>>46048997
A character can alternate between any two of Imperative of Deflection, Command of Prowess, and Litany of Sight Unbroken (just as examples) to effectively take 20 on both of them.
>>46049090
No, he can't, by the same RAW that lets you take 20 on this to begin with.
Sure, it's "common sense" that he could alternate between edicts until he gets 20s and just consider that taking 20, but that's not how take 20 works RAW, so he can't.
And if you appeal to common sense, you've opened yourself up to the GM saying no to the whole thing.
>>46049105
Nothing is stopping the character from repeatedly making the Tzocatl check until it appears as a 20, then accepting that result and moving on to the next buff edict/litany that can benefit from a 20.
>>46049135
Sure there is: the game moving on.
You can't "take 20," the rules action, to expedite it (not without it turning into "take 15," anyway), so you'd have to physically roll each die. And while you're doing that, the party moves on to do other things, leaving your character to die to an errant owlbear.
>>46044649
>Fey Tricksters kiss their allies to buff them
Lewdest archetype confirmed?
Why does the master of many styles monk have to give up the one thing that makes using multiple styles at once desirable in order to use multiple styles at once?
>>46049170
>monks
>getting a nice thing
Where do you think you are
>>46049178
Unchained monks get nice things
I mean, not caster-level nice things, obviously, but still, nice things
>>46049135
That assumes that the other PCs are going to be alright with you just standing around speaking in a clear and loud voice until you naturally get the 20 you're looking for.
>>46049150
Isn't that pretty triggering?
>>46049170
MoMS is a pure AOO class
>>46049215
Would it make a decent 1 level dip for brawlers?
>>46049208
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MGlXO5u9jUE
>>46049241
>New MoMS
>Dip
I have posted here before. I am writing a adventure path using Paizo and DSP content. I now need to begin play testing of book 1. Anyone who is interested please use the attached character guide to create a character.
My skype is: Slowcogs (the cartoon one)
If you wish to play please send me a proposed character. If it is obvious you didn't read the character guide from your sheet I am just going to deny you on the spot.
The game will either be on Tuesday or Wednesday evening PST. Exact scheduling will be dependent on group. It will be played by text and live.
Reply to this post with questions.
>>46049149
>>46049208
Considering that most edicts take only a standard action or a swift action to activate, it is well worth spending roughly ~20 standard actions or swift actions for a natural 20.
An 8th-level advocate with Intelligence modifier +7 has a Tzocatl check of +13, increasing to +15 for an edict they have the Favored Edict feat for (which they can gain as a bonus feat).
If that Favored Edict is Litany of Sight Unbroken, at the start of the day, they can keep pushing for a 20 (spreading out activation attempts across rounds) until they can finally have continuous True Seeing for the entire day at 8th-level.
Also, even without abusing 20s, Command of Flight gives the entire party effectively at-will flight at 6th-level.
>>46049245
>tzocatl_party_readies_buffs.gif
>>46049180
>>46049215
Guys it doesn't say the kiss has to be on the lips.Most people will think it does though which is fine.
>>46049258
Here is a map of the Steaming Sea and it's surroundings, the kingdoms of Norine.
>>46049247
New MoMS?
>>46049267
>kisses applied other places
T-that's even lewder!
Is this a good array for a Knight Chandler?
as Human (+2 Dex).
STR: 10 DEX: 18 CON: 12 INT: 8 WIS: 16 CHA: 10
>>46049260
>Considering that most edicts take only a standard action or a swift action to activate, it is well worth spending roughly ~20 standard actions or swift actions for a natural 20.
Oh, in-universe it's not much time, no questioning that.
But rolling 20 dice is going to take up "the party has started traveling again and probably has run into their first encounter" in terms of time, so you're long gone by the time you're done; the party's already forgotten about you.
>Also, even without abusing 20s, Command of Flight gives the entire party effectively at-will flight at 6th-level.
This is not out of line with magic spells and items.
>>46048980
Cunning Liar, from Heroes of the Streets.
http://archivesofnethys.com/TraitDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Cunning%20Liar
>>46049286
Traveling speed is one move action per round. There's nothing stopping you from doing this while walking, unless the edict requires a full-round action for whatever reason.
>>46049286
Declare that your character is using their move actions to follow the party.
Your character could even use their standard actions to alternate between edicts and their swift actions to attempt a Litany of Sight Unbroken every other round.
>This is not out of line with magic spells and items.
What Paizo or Dreamscarred Press options allow a 6th level character to grant the entire party at-will flight, usable both in and out of combat?
>>46049284
Dump Str completely and bring up your Int.
Is it weird that I'd rather just have a Tzocatl system that makes it plain at will abilities, no rolled check, scaling to the equivalent of taking 10 with an 18 (plus level increases) Int?
I mean, that's how I'd use it anyway. Actually needing to roll stuff just feels like busywork.
>>46049330
Probably better long term, but that leaves you extremely vulnerable to Strength damage knockouts (or deaths, from Shadows) which are fairly common. It also only gives you a 23 pound budget for combat gear until you can afford magic items to solve that issue (and a chain shirt alone weighs 25 lbs).
These aren't insurmountable issues, but you should know what you're getting yourself into before you decide if it's worth it or not.
Hmm.. Gray Paladin is pretty bad but I guess lossing Divine Grace means you can play one without heavy investment in CHA now. Might be good for Dorf Paladin.
>>46049284
Are you going in melee with d8 hd, 12 con and light armor? I'd go with 10 16+2 14 10 14 10. Or dump the fuck out of that cha you are not using for anything.
>>46049330
Is Int super necessary? as >>46049366
I lose out on carrying capacity and am vulnerable to Strength damage.
Is Katana expertise worth the Exotic Proficiency feat in your opinion or should I just stick with a martial finesse weapon?
>>46049378
You still have Lay On Hands and spellcasting keying off of it.
>>46049378
There's a dorf paladin archetype already for low cha lmao
>>46049180
Talked to a 6'2".
All of these are bad for the tall person's spine.
Just learn to tip-toe.
>>46049389
Depends on your starting level.
Dumping Int makes you vulnerable to Int damage!
>>46049284
Dump str to 8 or even 7. Maybe even dump CHA to 9 if you don't think charisma=appearance.
Bring INT to 10 (you need those skillpoints), raise CON to 14 if you can.
>>46049420
Intelligence damage is much, much less common than Strength damage. If either one is a significant vulnerability for your character, you can invest in magic items to resist ability damage and drain later on.
>>46049284
>>46049434
Addendum: Not only do you want a slightly better int for skillpoints (Which you especially need if you want to make use of Mystic Artifice for crafting wondrous items/wands/etc), but because Spellcraft is your elemental flux skill thing.
>>46048860
The Acolyte of the First Word should probably be made Unchained monk-compliant.
Blade Barrage still has an Intelligence-only damage bonus, and is still quite a weak edict overall.
Imperative of Emulation refers to a "maneuver."
>>46049415
That archetype can't smite evil or cast spell though.
Alright with a mix of Advice I decided on
STR: 9 DEX: 18 (16+2) CON: 14 INT: 12 WIS: 14 CHA: 9
This is a fair distribution yes?
>>46048444
Which trait gives Wis to Diplomacy?
Lethal Grace seems pretty good for a company that absolutely hate Dex-to-damage. 1/2 level to damage is pretty sweet.
>>46049480
Str 7
Dex 16
Con 12
Int 12
Wis 16
Cha 10
Pick a +2 Dex/Wis race.
>>46048515
http://www.archivesofnethys.com/TraitDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Cunning%20Liar
>>46049503
Meant to reply to >>46048444
Stats for an Orc metamorph alchemist, 20 point buy:
str 22
dex 12 or 15
con 12 or 15
int 5
wis 10
cha 5
r8 my build fampires
>>46048468
They use a fucked relationship of CR = Level which was ostensibly true at MAYBE the very earliest stages of design, and is still literally the backbone of encounter design, but has never actually been true for any monster listing.
>>46049500
It's not even dex to damage.
It's the same (More or less) as the AWT Trained Grace. An additional benefit if you're using dex to hit and str to damage.
Takes a little weight off just one power stat. It's more efficient to have two stats at 16 than it is one at 20
>>46049378
>the class is worse, so its better
>>46049529
Well they're right.
Plus, Smite Foe means you're not a one-trick pony when it comes to evil stuff.
>>46049529
see >>46049518, removing things from classes can open up new build opportunities!
>>46049378
I... I have no idea how that logic makes sense in your head.
>I will be a 10 CHA dwarf
>Therefore playing a paladin that does loses divine grace and gets nothing in return is better than playing a paladin that gives +0 divine grace, because I'm losing out on less!
What?
How do I make the dankest Sin Eater Guru, /pfg/?
>>46049578
/pfg/ only faps to PoW and the psionic classes with PoW options.
/pfg/ doesn't give a fuck about the other psionics or akasha.
>>46049578
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?377818-PsyBomb-s-Guides-to-the-Akashic-Mysteries!
Dos it benefit an unchained monk to take a level in chained monk to get MoMS in order to combine dragon style and jabbing style? Or would a single class unchained monk get more damage?
>>46049648
>unchained monk to take a level in chained monk
Can you do that?
>>46049648
Unchained classes can take their parent classes' archetypes. MoMS works with unchained monk.
>>46049653
Nope.
>>46049677
Monk is an exception. Unchained monk explicitly can't take archetypes from chained monk.
>>46049682
>>46049653
Hot take: They're classes with different names.
>>46049677
Only if they have the same features that can be traded away. Which in UMonk's case is almost none of them. Can't even trade away flurry because it works differently.
>>46049697
Holy shit WHY
>>46049717
Says so in the book.
>>46049719
No I mean why would they fucking do that, to Monk of all things?
>>46049717
Because UC Monk is so massively different.
Rogue was purely more things.
Barbarian changed how rage worked.
Summoner fiddled with eidolons and the spell list.
Monk changed... at least three quarters of the class.
My group got mad after they had Pass Without Trace used against them. I feel it is very justified for enemies to have access to the same stuff PCs do. They can go fuck themselves.
>>46048860
Exploit Defect is listed as a master edict in the list, but is an initiate edict in the text.
Intimidating Warcry does not mention the duration of the shaken effect from the demoralization.
Come to think of it, the very base of the Tzocatl system is a little harsh when even apprentice level edicts have a base Tzocatl DC of 15.
A 3rd-level advocate has, at the very highest, Intelligence modifier +5 for a Tzocatl check bonus of +6... against DC 15.
A 15th-level advocate has, at most, Intelligence modifier +9 and a Tzocatl check bonus of +20. Master edicts (gained at 12th-level) have Tzocatl DCs of 25-27.
This is not as bad as it seems: a failure to hit the DC still results in the edict activating, simply in a very (and I do mean *very* weak form). However, in order to bring those edicts up to the level of even a tier 3 caster's spells, the advocate needs to beat the DC by 3, 5, or some other increment, which is a very daunting task given the DCs.
In other words, the 3rd-level advocate with a Tzocatl check modifier of +6 actually needs to roll an 18+ or 20+ total result to actually have decent effects.
How is this supposed to make for an effective "dedicated caster"?
>>46049716
Hot take: The class feature has the same name, so unless it refers to a specific mechanism being replaced (such as the BAB substitution) it should work.
>>46049648
Single Class Unchained Monk gets more damage anyways, especially since they have full BAB and Flurry can stack with Haste and their Ki point to gain and extra attack - they can simple spend another point of ki and set their unarmed attacks on fire anyways. Or use a qigong technique to gain an actual aura of damage.
>>46049717
>>46049725
Why would you want to weaken an unchained monk by added base monk stuff to it is my question.
>>46049725
Paizo hates the monk. And all martials in general, too.
>>46049781
No no, unchained monk was a LOVE LETTER to monks. It's just that monks also have a lot of fucking rad archetypes that can't play ball even though nothing would really go wrong from allowing them.
>>46048860
Demand Object's esoterica, Electrospark's third cadence, Forbid Action's esoterica, Mandate of Agony, Manipulate Fate's emphasis, Phantom Guardian and its emphasis, Voice of the Dragon's natural armor bonus, Whirling Gale's second cadence, Word of Annihilation's esoterica, Bolstering Voice and its esoterica, Litany of Sight Unbroken's esoterica, Mantra of Retributive Shielding's esoterica, Mantra of Vitality's esoterica, Recitation of Flame and its esoterica, Supplication of the Master Arcanist, and the Rhetorical Blade's Whirling Gale should *all* key off Tzocatl modifier in general, not just Intelligence.
>>46049804
The thing is that most unchained monk abilities make the best archetypes superfluous. When you can combine style strikes with the bonus feats and take a bunch of styles anyways (because the one ability that prevents taking styles is only useful when your opponent is using style feats whichmost GMs never do), and the ability to use any Qigong technique right out of the box, that covers 90% of the useful archetypes. MoMS is good, but an unchained monk surpasses them vanilla because of the availability of their ki abilities.
>>46048860
The esoterica are wildly inconsistent in their power level.
Command of Imbuement:
>Esoterica: Any masterwork weapon you wield is treated as a +1 weapon instead while in your hands. If you wield a magical weapon, it is treated as having an enhancement bonus one higher than its actual enhancement bonus.
Electrospark:
>Esoterica: Any magic weapon you hold gains the shocking special property. If the weapon already has the shocking property, you may instead remove the shocking property to grant the weapon the shocking burst property. Changing a weapon’s special property to shocking burst or returning the weapon to normal is a swift action. If the weapon leaves your hands, it returns to normal at the end of the round.
vs.
Petrify:
>Esoterica: You gain a +3 insight bonus on Craft checks when working with rock or stone.
Ventriloquism:
>Esoterica: You gain a +1 insight bonus on saving throws versus figment effects.
Mantra of Sheltered Life:
>Esoterica: You gain a +2 insight bonus on Heal checks.
Are we supposed to believe that all of these apprentice-level esoterica are equal?
>>46049559
It trade those ability with looser Code of Conduct isn't it? You can now be paladin of sarenrae going around beheading people and justify it as "for greater good" and GM can't force you to fall.
Hey guys, I'm doing a pathfinder game next week, and I've a little experience with it, but could use some reccomendations. I'm interested in playing a party face / archer. Alternatively a mounted combatant. Any class reccomendations, and builds? level 1 20 point buy.
>>46049891
What is it about this outfit that makes it seem so enormously slutty? IDGI
>>46049928
Paladin can do all these things.
>>46049928
>archer
Paladin or Bard
>mounted combatant
Paladin or Cavalier with the caveat that mounted combat isn't actually very good choice for a PC, because while it's powerful, most combat generally doesn't take place in open plain where you can use your mount to the best effect. I'd probably go for vanilla Paladin with archery feats, it's pretty easy to make even if you don't know the system very well.
>>46049928
Sacred Huntmaster Inquisitor with Conversion Inquisition.
You get animal companion, proficiency in all bow and all class skill on face related skill and the ability to use WIS instead of CHA on those skills.
>>46049947
Mounted combat is viable for Small characters, at least...
>>46049939
>>46049947
> Paladin
> has enough skill per level to be face
> can't even bluff with out the risk of losing all class feature
Ahahahahahahaha
>>46049912
That's one of the failings of the archetype, really.
The original paizo paladin's code was already kind of vague, and now on top of all that, this archetype now says 'the code is looser but we won't tell you in what ways', so basically your code is now fuckall up to interpretation and the GM could screw you over just as much. Though any GM who looks for every opportunity to say 'whoops you slipped up now you fall' isn't worth playing with.
Besides, the entire point of playing a paladin is the fluff, otherwise you just be a warpriest or something.
>>46049891
Touhou, can you arrange your criticisms in a text document so I can pass them along in the playtest thread?
>>46049978
Any DM that makes you fall for basic bluffing wasn't a DM you were gonna have a fun time with anyway.
And besides, a face doesn't HAVE to lie. It's not an explicit requirement.
>>46049978
Why do only weaker classes have such debilitating limitations on alignment?
>>46049978
>lying
>ever
Having no-one doubt your word because you're a man of honour is much the superior tool to simple deception.
>>46049998
In contrast, the Tyrant archetype for antipals is great. It changes almost nothing, and makes it easier for Antipaladins to play nice with parties.
>>46050014
>Anti/Paladin
>Monk
>Barbarian
>Druid
I dunno what you're on about man. That's a 9th level caster, good, middle-of-the-road classes, and... monk.
Alignment requirements are all over the shop, not just on weak ones.
>>46049978
>bluffing
>making you fall
Fuck off Gainax.
Human paladins with 10 int have 4 per level easily. At 20 point buy he can invest in a 1 int mod.
>>46050008
> Additionally, a paladin's code requires that she respect legitimate authority, act with honor (not lying, not cheating, not using poison, and so forth), help those in need (provided they do not use the help for evil or chaotic ends), and punish those who harm or threaten innocents.
> act with honor (not lying, not cheating, not using poison, and so forth)
> Bluff (Cha) : You know how to tell a lie.
HONOR
O
N
O
R
>>46050037
Bluff is also stuff like nondisclosure. Hiding the fact you know something and aren't saying. Selective application of the truth.
It's called wiggle-room, man.
Random question from forever GM here. Just for the potential feedback.
Current big bad in my Pathfinder campaign has a unique ability, or specifically, four unique abilities.
The first removes memory of an object from everyone within a certain radius.
The second removes memory of a place.
The third removes memory of a person.
The fourth removes memory of a Diety-like figure, so gods or demi-gods.
The party is, for plot reasons, mostly immune to these effects. The only last about 5 seconds before the party regains memory of the person place or thing.
So far I've used it to simulate rapid teleportation when the party fought her.
She was constantly making them forget her, so they would, for about 5 seconds, during which time she would move, and they would remember her, there brains freak out, because logical errors, and just fill in the blanks, IE: She was totally just over there the whole time, yup, that makes sense, derpa derp.
Any other ways I can use these abilities to mess with them?
Thoughts? Questions? Comments?
>>46050029
>Gainax
But how if you can't believe in yourself, and you bluff to the extent that there's nobody you can believe in to believe in you, how can you be a paladin?
>>46050048
Whether or not that counts as honorable conduct is still very debatable.
After all, it definitely isn't honorable to look for technical loopholes rather than sticking to the intention of an oath.
>>46050029
And human Inquisitor have 6 per level even if you dump int to -2 mod.
>>46050109
Honor's a fucking weirdass vague concept itself, which changes wildly from case to case.
Hell, a lot of the time it's a personal thing.
>>46050071
A jojo fan, I see.
Also make the PCs forget about the existence of your arrows or bullets so they're flatfooted against them because they aren't aware the bullets exist until they hit them.
Use it on rogue allies to give them all the sneak attack.
Make PC party members forget each other, or forget their own weapons or gear.
Make the party wizard forget their spellbook or component pouch.
>>46049954
Thanks, I like that idea. I originally made a Zen Archer Monk for the ranged aspect, but realized I was interested in being the party face as well.
>>46049947
Paladin's a definite probability, I probably won't go Cavalier for the fear that most combat situations won't use my mount.
>>46050142
Jojo? As in, Jojo's adventure or whatever it is?
Never seen it, someone in that has similar abilities I take it?
The projectiles thing is genius, as is the sneak attack thing.
Party members forgetting eachother and such doesn't work too well, as the effect only lasts for about 5 seconds, I mean, to them it would just look as though their companion blipped across the room somehow.
Keep in mind I'm using the very real effect of your brain making shit up to fill in blanks or logic errors, cuz' I enjoy that little biology tidbit, just wondering if theres something I'm not thinking of that could give them logic errors and other mindfuckery.
Forget your sword before you swing it, drop it on the floor cuz you forgot, swing empty fist, miss, excellent.
Potentially this could hinder spellcasting and such, but only for one turn at a time.
>>46050191
What if people forget their own bodyparts?
Do their brains invent them having lost them? Could inflict them with stuff from that, them thinking they've lost limbs or other bodyparts.
>>46048860
Great, another project handed over to Ssalarn.
Not sure what the original was like, but we can certainly expect it to be late and shitty now.
>>46050186
Suggestions for race? I'm thinking Aasimar. Definetly seems like the best race all around.
>>46050186
Also at higher level, you could do a 1 level dip into Cleric for Aura of Good (abuse it together with Litany of Righteousness), and another Domain or Inquisition (ie. Chivalry Inquisition could net you another mount which you can turn into a Griffon)
Inquisitor is a pretty flexible chassis to build around.
>>46050226
which race are allow?Drow Noble?
>>46049998
You knew after reading it again.. Gray Paladin's code only prevent you from doing evil stuff not chaotic stuff...
>>46050247
I believe theres no restrictions currently.
>>46050211
Oooh... Maybe forget about legs, fall prone?
Could be fun...
Forget about arms? Auto disarm?
SHIT. I coukd emulate combat maneuvers with this stuff... Which is good, since the BBEG is a caster and doesn't physical combat.
>>46050247
>>46050276
After looking up Drow Noble, I'm inclined to say he won't allow it, haha.
>>46050275
>>46050141
Yeah, the paizo paladin code is a mess and if a player doesn't want to play a fully classic altruistic knight in shining armor then there are going to be debates between the GM and player if they don't come to an agreement.
5e actually does pretty decent paladin codes, and lets you choose one of three.>Tfw oath of the ancients can also fit Magical Girls
>>46050312
There's a fourth oath in 5e now
>>46050358
Oh yeah, the crown. That one's pretty good, too. (As an oath to roleplay, haven't studied the mechanics)
>>46050218
What's wrong with Ssalarn?
I kinda like the idea of a Deep One Hybrid Mesmerist (Vox) that does the who Aklo thing even though its not optimal.
>>46050275
But according to paladins those are one and the same. Otherwise they would have no problem doing nonlawful stuff and their alignment requirement would just be Any Good.
>>46050446
>according to paladins those are one and the same
Yes, which is why Smite Evil works on chaotic creatures too.
>>46049938
Sideboobs.
>>46050446
Gray paladin's CoD replace Paladin's CoD completely.
Paladin's CoD has this line.
> help those in need (provided they do not use the help for evil or chaotic ends)
Gray Paladin don't. It even emphasize that other than Evil Act, you can do whatever the hell you want.
So, creating an undead Warlord for a game. The DM is allowing the following 3.5 books: The Completes; Races of: Stone, Dragon, Draconomicon; MIC, Libris Mortis, Heroes of Battle and Horror, Dragon Magic.
Are there any feats/items there for me to be able to affect my own character or other undead with morale bonuses?
Is there any way for martials to do ability score damage without relying on a magical item in Pathfinder?
>>46050594
There's an advanced rogue talent called Crippling Strikes that lets you deal Str or Dex damage (I think) with a sneak attack. I'm sure there's more but that immediately springs to mind.
>>46050594
Poisons and some feats.
What can I do with Kineticist's Aether Puppet ability outside of combat?
Thinking about using it to play chess with statues, any other idea?
>>46050614
Which feats?
Does a Wild Shaping Druid take on the physical ability scores of the creature he turns into, or is the ability score modifier shown in Beast Shape the only change they take?
>>46050667
Ability score modifier shown in Beast Shape are the only change they take.
>>46050671
Awesome. They take the full health of the animal as temporary hit points though, right?
>>46050690
No. Your health stay the same.
Maybe this guide will help you make sense of Polymorph rule?
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1avbOKg848X3Z3dVpmdrpxtR__zan2jj_NzP0uZU9LTw/edit#bookmark=id.rbc174hhiftf
>>46050594
If Path of War is allowed, then Steel Serpent and Unquiet Grave have multiple maneuvers that deal ability score damage, plus a couple from Black Seraph.
>>46050705
Ah okay. Coming from 5e. I was told it was a lot more similar than it apparently is.
>>46050654
Neckbreaker, Bonebreaker, Exorcist's Rebuttal, Destroy Identity, Voracious Blade, Siphoning Blade, Icy Stare, Blood Drinker.
>>46050705
So is there any clear advantage to Wild Shaping in combat over just staying in human form?
>>46050777
You take natural spell and summon bears while you and your pet bear bear the opposition.
>>46050777
Did you read that guide I linked? Here what you get if a level 6 Druid turn into a Dire Tiger.
- +4 STR -2DEX +4 Natural Armor (as beastshape 2)
- Your land speed is now 40ft
- You get Dire Tiger natural attacks (2 Claws, 1 bite)
- You get Dire Tiger ability listed in beastshape 2 (low-light vision,scent,grab,pounce,rake)
Pounce and Rake is the important one here. It's allows you to charge and make 5 attacks.
Was oracle mystery (or was it curse?) from ultimate intrigue posted in the last thread?
Is there anything that's not shit in that book? Except antipaladin archetype that only changes your and your pet's alignment.
>>46050897
I see. I wasn't considering Natural Spell. I was mostly worried about being too squishy with only a d8 Hit Die and committing myself to the front line as an animal.
>>46050908
I did read it, but it seemed like it wouldn't be worth it compared to the abilities you lose and the enemy's ability to focus fire on the sudden tiger in the room.
>>46050927
>sudden
Wild shape have hour/level duration. Enemies see two tigers with the party. Then one of them roars and makes obscene gestures at them, and they find themselves in the middle of firestorm.
>>46050927
Natural Spell is basically a feat tax for Druids, in that there is ABSOLUTELY NO reason not to grab it as soon as you can.
>>46050975
We're still at a fairly low level and I have very few hit points compared to the rest of our party. When I said sudden I meant a tiger that is suddenly in the room when it wasn't before.
>>46050986
I didn't know about the spell until now. I'll definitely take it when I can.
>>46050927
>I was mostly worried about being too squishy with only a d8 Hit Die and committing myself to the front line as an animal.
This is a valid concern. Buff yourself with barkskin, stoneskin for tough fights, and consider http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/magic-armor/magic-armor-and-shield-special-abilities/wild on higher levels.
>>46051001
>When I said sudden I meant a tiger that is suddenly in the room when it wasn't before.
Then wildshape into rat or raven, it doesn't hamper your spellcasting in any way with natural spell.
>>46049419
Nah, get a shorter girl so she can kiss you down there instead.
This Druid talk has me thinking, can a Druid wear Living Steel armor? It's technically organic. And for that matter, does Living Steel counter Brilliant Energy weapons?
>>46050927
Use those buff spell and control spell on your spell lists man.
Ironskin,Entangle, Euphoric Cloud etc.
>>46051018
But anon,I AM the shorter girl
>>46051017
So far I've only used it to turn into eagles for recon and to get above enemy reach so I can change back and rain spells on them. The party is only level 4 at the moment.
>>46051029
I'm the party's only caster. I've been relegated to DPS and healing at the same time while our barbarian and ranger tank and flank.
>>46051001
Did you dump CON? Melee druid needs at least 14 CON.
>>46051045
I have exactly 14 Con, but I haven't rolled above a 3 for health. I'm considering taking Toughness just to compensate.
>>46051054
>rolled HP
Literally worse than rolling stats.
>>46051044
That's the trick anon. You don't needs to cast as much healing when you learn how to cast a good control spells.
Example : The room has 4 enemies. You cast Euphoric clouds to cover 2 of them. Now only 2 can attack your Barbarian. This pretty much half your opponent damage output.
>>46051083
I did it because last time I rolled a Wizard I never rolled below a 5 for health. I became almost as tanky as the fighter.
>>46051088
I tend to go for touch attacks more often. I think my DM has a personal bias against casters. He admits to fudging rolls for saves to make encounters "more challenging" and to keep us from invalidating his enemies. My solution has been to focus on spells that just do damage, or at least don't get negated on a save.
>>46051044
healing in combat is pretty inefficient in Pathfinder.
Enemy do much more damage than you can heal (like 2-3 times higher). It's better to kill or disable the enemy instead of healing damage in combat.
>>46051126
Yeah, I've heard as much. I tend to only drop heals when my allies are unconscious or within one hit of going down.
>>46051114
>I think my DM has a personal bias against casters. He admits to fudging rolls for saves to make encounters "more challenging" and to keep us from invalidating his enemies. My solution has been to focus on spells that just do damage, or at least don't get negated on a save.
You should focus on hitting your DM in the face.
>>46047108
So I can now literally play a magical girl in PF.
Can I have a lewd outfit?
Can I be a boy who transforms into a girl?
>>46051138
>changelings
>aegis
>alter self
>sleeves of many garments
>glamered armor
Do you even befriend?
>>46051136
I can kind of see his point, but it is very frustrating to have his Sorcerer boss who I know has awful saves save on two consecutive Bursts of Radiance.
>>46051114
Many control spells did just that. Area of Entangle still becomes difficult terrain. Euphoric Cloud still block vision and break line of sight.
>>46051149
I meant as part of the switching identities mechanic, not via separate magic.
>>changelings
Aren't they 3.5 only?
>>46051163
But don't those effects also get in the way of my allies?
>>46051164
You mean the Disguise skill?
>>46051164
Changelings in 3.5 weren't actual changelings from hags, they were just half-doppelgangers. Completely different in concept and execution from the newer ones in PF.
>>46048860
A 5th-level advocate has five apprentice-level edicts and one apprentice-level litany. Although these can be used at-will, these are all the equivalent of middling 1st-level spells.
Furthermore, the 5th-level advocate has, at best, Intelligence modifier +6 and a Tzocatl check modifier of +8. The DCs for apprentice edicts are 15, and they hand out meaningful upgrades only when rolling at least an 18 or a 20. Thus, 45% or 55% of the time, all the 5th-level advocate can do is toss out a meager effect equivalent to a middling 1st-level spell.
How is this supposed to make for a competent 5th-level character?
Then suddenly, at 6th-level, the advocate gains Command of Flight and can grant the party at-will flight speeds in or out of combat.
This seems highly lopsided to me.
Also, the edicts list down a "War Cry" apprentice edict that does not exist.
>>46051181
>>46051199
PF changelings don't genderbend, sadly.
>>46051164
>switching identities
Have your GM tried to not metagame NPC knowledge? Also >>46051180
>>46051207
Post it in playtest thread on gitp ffs.
>>46051171
Learn how to use it anon. You don't have to center the spell on the enemy. Cast it a bit further away so the enemy closet to you got caught on the edge of the spell.
If enemy are spread out then cast the spell to divide them, and use standard action to dismiss the spell once you are done cleaning up the one on your side.
Coordinating range attack is another good trick.
>>46051207
Where are you pulling your numbers from? Did you account for +2 masterwork competence bonuses? What about feats? What about magic items?
>>46051180
>>46051212
Disguise isn't a genuine swap. It's just a disguise. TG themes won't work with it.
>>46051219
DSP collects feedback from these threads too.
GitP is more permanent, but they check here plenty. Stuff does get relayed.
>>46051234
a tzocatl check is not a truespeak check. it is not a skill check. it is a special check with a bonus of 1/2 class level + key modifier. some classes get bonuses, occasionally. most don't.
>>46051234
Anon, speaking as someone who turned truenaming on its head, much to the chagrin of my DM, and someone who playtested Tzocatl in its original form I can more reliably get truenaming checks off than I can/could with tzocatl checks.
Honestly the system needed the equivalent of binder tools, hell it could learn a lesson from binding and try to make it so that you're more than likely able to hit the checks, exceptionally low rolls (let's say 5 or below) are what you need to be hitting to fail, anything else should just be gravy.
>>46051411
That's what I'm thinking. I looked through the Tzocatl doc and didn't see any magic items or feats to boost your checks yet so even if the checks seem off now it might be because they're trying to account for item/feat support later?
>>46051480
There are some feats or at least were lexicon specializations last I checked and even let you specialize in certain edicts, increasing your fuck it I'm calling them truename checks be cause my muscle memory is better at than than tzocatl.
>>46051199
>>46051209
>>46051254
>>46051212
My group gets confusing sometimes. Game started in 3.5 and has a half-doppleganger changeling assassin. And then I joined after they updated to PF and brought in a half-hag changeling cleric. They're dating, sort of.
>>46051506
The only readily available feats that directly boost your Tzocatl check modifier are Favored Edict, which grants +2 to a single edict; and Favored Lexicon, which confers +1 to one lexicon. These are pathetic bonuses, and I can only see them being useful for, say, someone trying to attain the True Seeing from a natural 20 with Litany of Sight Unbroken early.
Master Edict is a feat that grants a +4 bonus to your Tzocatl check modifier for *one* edict, but it requires Favored Edict and Studied Edict, hardly a cheap investment.
Compare a 5th-level advocate attempting to use Electrospark (incidental damage and a daze) to a 5th-level bard or inquisitor simply spending a 1st-level spell slot on Ear-Splitting Scream:
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/e/ear-piercing-scream
Ear-Splitting Scream is clearly the superior combat option here, and it costs but a 1st-level spell slot on a class that has many other combat options.
>>46051209
Changlings in 3.5 don't genderbend either, it explicitly states in their info they can not change genitals just appearances.
>>46051603
Yup, for once I'm agreeing with you 2hufag. The bonuses are piddling, but once you get to 6th level they let you get out of rusty dagger shank town and give you a wopping +2 to your truename checks!
With the way shit scales, that just isn't enough. The effects are stronger than truenaming, but the fact that I'll fail to reach a cadence that makes it worthwhile on a mastered edict 4 out of 10 times makes it less than worthwhile subsystem.
So.. what do magical girl has over unchained summoner? From what I see...
- 4+INT skill points instead of 2+INT
- A bunch of class skill (Acrobatic,Appraise,Diplomacy,Disguise,Escape Artist, Intimidate, Sense Motive, Sleight of Hand, Stealth, Swim) but only has 3 knowledge skill (Arcana,Dungeoneering,Local,Plane) instead of all knowledge
- Martial weapons proficiency
- 2 good saves (Reflex and Will) instead of 1 (Will)
- Social Talent (pretty shitty)
- A few vigilante talent
Not sure if it worth a trade for Eidolon though..
>>46051663
>for once
>>46051675
If you want to play a !notsummoner just play a monster tactician.
>>46051604
>GENDER AND SEXUALITY
>An important aspect of a changeling’s identity is the issue of gender. Unlike doppelgangers, which are entirely genderless, a changeling does have a default gender that manifests in adolescence, but each changeling can adapt his or her form to be of either gender, hermaphroditic (both genders simultaneously), or entirely genderless. A changeling can alter his or her gender (and reproductive abilities) as part of using the race’s minor shapechange ability.
>If a changeling in a female form conceives a child, she loses the ability to change her gender until after the child is born.
Races of Eberron Page 45
>>46051559
I wish they'd just think up different names so we can have both. Which in practice means PF adding a half-doppleganger race.
>>46051604
Source? The one in my game has a female form but if still male could have some odd implications.
>>46051690
But anon
I want a maho shojo
>>46051741
>so we can have both
What prevents you from using e.changeling? There's even PF conversion https://sites.google.com/site/eberronpathfinder/conversion-info/races/changelings
>>46051797
Aegis. Synthetist.
>>46051797
But anon, there are better ways to be maho shojos/shonen. Aegis, Chosen One and Knight Chandler, that's before you even talk about becoming Kamen Rider with red mantis stuff
>>46051741
True, but they'd probably cut them down to a 1/day Alter Self or something.
>>46051732
>>46051795
Oh, nevermind
>>46051732
That last part seems rather off.
There's several days between fertilization and implantation, and until the latter one is technically not pregnant at all. In fact quite often implantation fails anyways.
Does the ability also stop functioning for maybe a week after a good bang, only to start back up again once the changeling's on the rag?
What the fuck.
>>46051828
>True, but they'd probably cut them down to a 1/day Alter Self or something.
The defeats the point a bit, unless they can maintain that form shift 24/7.
>>46051858
>Does the ability also stop functioning for maybe a week after a good bang, only to start back up again once the changeling's on the rag?
This is my new house rule.
>>46051732
Ah nifty, we never had races of Eberron in my old group that played Eberron so, looking back over the books, I think we based that off the description for their shape change ability in Players Guide to Ebberon.
>Minor Change Shape (Su): Changelings have the supernatural ability to alter their appearance as though using a disguise self spell that affects their bodies but not their possessions. This ability is not an illusory effect, but a minor physical alteration of a changeling's facial features, skin color and texture, and size, within the limits described for the spell.
And somewhere someone dug up a thing on Disguise self where it couldn't be used to change gender, it was so many years ago I can't recall it precisely.
>>46051869
>defeats the point
Well we are talking about Paizo...
If nothing else I suspect they wouldn't want it to compete with kitsune for shapeshifting. Just look at how screwed shifters are.
>>46051921
>shifters
*skinwalkers
My mistake
>>46051889
Yeah, Races of Eberron had some neat stuff for changelings. They had a feat they could take that would negate critical hits by instant rearrangement of internal organs, so their shapeshifting ability was (became?) quite intensely physical.
>>46051816
>>46051820
But I've played those! I want to try this now!
>>46051948
Yeah changelings were always one of my favorite races, I was so excited to see PF was adding them, then very disappointed by what we got.
>>46052017
Same here, anon. I miss them terribly (and don't have a game to import one into).
>>46051869
>This is my new house rule.
Imagine telling a player they can't infiltrate a castle because that knight two nights ago went ball's deep on his changeling.
>>46052106
Technically they can still change form, just not gender
>>46052106
>>46052135
So she'll just have to pretend to be a harem girl instead of a warrior to infiltrate the castle.Serves her right for being a slut.
>>46052184
>Implying the Changeling isn't in a loving relationship with the knight and wanted to consummate their love on the eve of a daring mission.
>>46052196
And now she's dead, because her transformation power failed her when she needed it the most.
That knight unwittingly fucked her to death.
>>46052228
no, he never loved her back and was secretly working for her enemies.
He knew what he was doing
>>46052196
Then the knight gets to escape questioning his sexuality and keep being the one wearing the pants for a couple of weeks longer.
What is wrong with you people?
>>46052228
Just because she can't use her shapeshifting does not mean the infiltration is a bust, there's still things like a hat of disguise or good old fashioned Disguise/Stealth checks, which she should have invested in.
>>46052267
A physical, visible form of autism.
My necromancer is setting out to achieve godhood and slay Iomedae.
It's gonna take some time, but I've got a pretty solid plan.
Just gotta make sure I don't die before I achieve immortality. Once that's in the bag it'll be a simple enough ladder climb in power.
I figured some of you guys hate Iomedae as much as I do, so I'd let you know I'm doing something about that bitch.
I regret posting that text from Races of Eberron.
>>46052267
Do you want a list? Because this might take a while.
>>46052276
You can see us?Lewd!
>>46052276
She can shapeshift, just not into a guy, which is limiting depending on circumstances, but still lets her sneak past anyone who recognises her and pretend to be other characters.If her own powers can't transform her while possibly pregnant, is it ok for other magic like a hat of disguise to be able to?
>>46052331
A hat of disguise is an illusion. Changeling shapechange is an actual change.
>>46052331
Hat of disguise is only an illusion, isn't it? I don't see why a hat of disguise would be stopped.
>>46052331
Hat of disguise is illusion only.
>>46052277
I'd love to hear how a scrub with some skeletons is going to achieve godhood.
>>46052331
HoD is illusion. Changeling physically, biologically changes.
>"does this form make me look fat?"
>every 6 seconds for 9 months
>>46052401
>So if our baby is born without a face try not to scream.
>>46052365
a 15th-level necromancer is still a 15th-level wizard, bucko
>>46052331
HoD will work, but if you touch her it will show up as invisible tummy bulge and so on.
>>46052365
Fun fact:
Did you know that Lastwall is in a horrible tactical location, with only one "sort of" ally nearby that'd only MAYBE help it full-scale defend itself?
If you could somehow rile up a whooooole bunch of unga bungas from Belkzen, get a few spookyboys from Ustalav, and march right in there, I wonder how long it'd last. Couple weeks? Then, if you were to team up with Molthune against Nirmathas... I'm just thinking out loud, of course.
>>46052245
He did love her, he's just more comfortable when she's not turning herself into a guy.
>>46052460
He's a /d/eviant and only gets off on futa.
New thread
>>46047082
>>46047082
>>46047082
>>46047082
>>46052460
I actually had a changing that changed gender every day, and never looked the same way twice, was a lot of fun messing with the party.
>>46052476
Then he should have thought about that before getting her stuck as a girl.
>>46052493
People need to stop fucking making so many threads just so they can be the OP.
>>46052552
Anon who said she's just a girl? It's possible she's stuck with a bulge in addition to a baby bump
>>46052570
That's an 11 hour old thread that was posted as part of the double-new thread clusterfuck from last night, you mong, I posted that so that some dipshit autist didn't make YET ANOTHER new thread.
