I am playing a necromancer in D&D 5e. How can I hide necromancy? Cause in the current setting necromancy is seen as evil. Stuff like not casting certain in front of paladin or keeping spells in a separate boo.
>>45610892
What "necromancy" are you doing?
>>45611003
I am currently level one so none at all right now. But I am talking about casting stuff like "animate dead" or "contagion"
>>45610892
>>45611034
I'd say go the route of an alchemist. Write your spell book in code. So you've got general, non-necromancy spells, rituals, and ideas written out for anybody to read. If you read, for example, the 1st word of each sentence in a side-note on page __, you've got a compressed explanation of Animate Dead.
Other than that, illusion magic would definitely help hide the fact that your risen dead are rotting corpses. When you raise a corpse or cast a spell you also use a minor illusion to make look like another spell with a similar effect. Maybe invest in some really strong perfumes or incenses to cover smells and play it off as a magical aid or supplement.
>>45610892
Make a different character who can actually function in civilized society, especially if the rest of the party is going to be spending alot of time in said civilized society.
I get that necromancy and demon summoning and dark magic are cool and all, but there are some things in these games that are really just meant to be used by the villains, hiding outside of society in their secret fortresses... not so much meant to be used by the heroes.
>>45611494
what you say is true, but I feel like it would be a fun challenge playing a character who has to hide his profession in fear of death or reprisal.
>>45610892
>>45611034
>in the current setting necromancy is seen as evil
>animate dead & contagion
>"Ugh, just because I'm raising murderous corpses and spreading virulent plagues doesn't mean I'm evil, you shitlords."
>>45611561
I never claim I wasn't evil. I was asking on how to hide it.
>>45611561
Animate dead could be used for good, easily. The corpses obey you. They don't need to be murderous.
>>45611609
but doesn't the act force and bind a soul from it's rest. that's sounds evil.
>>45611609
>They don't need to be murderous.
>Skeleton
>Medium undead, lawful evil
>Zombie
>Medium undead,neutral evil
>The corpses obey you.
But when you die they're set lose upon the world.
>>45611655
That's mainly higher level spells and intelligent undead. But with Animate Dead a mage is making creatures that hate the living and that are 100% evil.
>>45611655
I mean. A skeleton has no brain and has been dead for dozens of years before someone rose it. If it coming back for a month or two will serve a greater purpose, is that really evil?
I mean imagine you raised an army of the dead to defend a city from raiders, then laid the souls to rest again afterwards. I don't think that's very evil.
>>45611609
It's 5e, undeath is eviler there than in 3.5.
>>45611698
>when you die
then unanimate them before you die. You're a fucking wizard, you can do that sort of thing. Also, just don't raise so many at a time that you being murdered would mean big trouble for people because of your undead now shambling around.
>>45611713
Imagine being somebody enjoying the afterlife. Then being pulled out to fight an unknown enemy for an unknown wizard. The guy doesn't want to. you shouldn't force people like that.
>>45611655
lets say that you have been dead for 70 years, wouldnt you like to come back for a little while?
its like a little vacation from the afterlife.
>>45611757
It is for the greater good. He'll go back to kicking it I'm the afterlife later, but if he doesn't lend me his now useless physical body his bloodline is going to die alongside hundreds of others.
He will be dead forever. He can stand what will be, in the long run, a momentarily lapse away from the afterlife.
>>45611797
>fro
Not everyone wants to be a hero. Some people just want be left alone.Isn't that kinda his right by being dead. To be left alone to rest. What if he is not willing, what if his bloodline in the raiders, what if he hates the village cause they mistreated him. you don't know the line story of the skeleton.
>>45611734
>then unanimate them before you die.
How are you gonna do then when a Drow ninja sneak attacks you for lethal damage?
>>45611713
You are literally introducing more evil into the world. According to this line of thought it's fine to summon a hundred Pit Fiends to build a city because it all "balances out" in the end.
>>45611797
>It is for the greater good.
>ends justifies the meme
wew lad
>>45610892
Keeping your necromantic spells in a different spellbook is a good idea.
Better idea is keeping your necromantic character in a different campaign.
>>45611555
So you either want to be gimped or a special snowflake. Got it.
>>45611555
>Fun challenge.
No, all it's going to do is piss off the rest of the party because you're going out of your way to make a character who can't help them to his full potential or risks getting them into serious trouble if he does.
>Speak with dead
>Yo nugga u care if I res yo bonez
>Spirit will either say eh id rather you didn't (yes) or FUCK NO I WAS A GODDAMN PRIEST YOU NIGGER (Maybe)
>>45610892
i think it's a pretty cool idea and I honestly don't see what sort of autistic group would have a problem with it.
But then again, I don't know the 5e rules.
In 3.5e core RAW there was nothhing saying raising the dead disturbed souls or that undead attacked innocents when you died so it was pretty easy to make a good or neutral necromancer.
In 3.5 there were a lot of spells that didn't necessary look evil to the untrained eye. Fear + blindness at low levels or enervation and waves of exhaustion at higher levels don't necessary look evil to the untrained eye. All the fighter, the City Watch and the general public would know is that the you chanted some mumbojumbo and then the 'BadGuys' started fighting a lot worse.
Maybe you GM will make those spells wreathed in ominious red energy or something suspicious but I still don't think it'd be too hard to convince people you're a good guy if you're doing good deeds (or appear to be)
>>45613120
>>45610892
But every necromancerr wants his undead army, what's the point otherwise?
This would be very hard to do without an accepting or stupid party.
You might be able to convince with moral arguments (they're already dead, it's for the greater good). Maybe offer to only raise enemies / non-sentient species / volunteers or something.
Hiding it from your party would be hard.
Hiding undead from others wouldn't be quite so hard.
>Focus on skeletons 'cause they smell less
>Dress them in concealing fullplate, hides their features and most peasants won't be questioning you if dressed as a lord surrounded by a squad of knights. If you go for a vaguely religious theme then you might be able to say they've sworn vows of silence or some shit.
>If you can't afford plate you could go for the exotic foreigner look, dress them in robes / costumes / whatever national dress you feel like appropriating and have them carry your palanquin through the streets. Naturally the 'slaves' don't speak Common.
>Leper dress might work. I guess you could pretend to be head leper or a brace priest ministering to them. Might be banned from cities / relegated to slum districts but I doubt you'd get many people examining you closely.
If the city checks 'ID' or something at the city gates this might not work in which case
>Have them walk into the city through alleys at night (if not blocked by city walls).
>Have them shipped into the city in crates and bribe the port authorities.
>Build a false floor in your wagon
>Have them enter the city via the aquaducts / sewerage system / canals / catacombs
>Just have them wait outside
In isolated areas like dungeons / jungle ruins, you shouldn't have any issues with your retinue once the party's on board with it.
In smaller towns and villages either have them wait nearby or go for one of the retinue ideas. It definitely should be hard to squeeze together enough coins for a at least two sets of fullplate for you 'knightly bodyguards'
>>45611845
Yeah but why would summoning 100 pit fiends to build a city be wrong if they didn't harm anyone during construction and you unsummoned them once the job was done?
>>45611609
because raising the dead in d&d is inherently evil
deal with it.
>>45610892
Ooh, make him smooth, and easy, and casual.
Think Mark Whalberg's character from "Pain and Gain", or think Rocky Balboa from the first Rocky. Very charming, funny, lots of banter, generous and empathetic, but at the same time, he's seen a lot of shit, and he doesn't like the way society's keeping him down.
If you want, give him lots of money if you want to. Make him moderately wealthy, and always willing to lend a hand to someone less fortunate then him because he understands what it's like to have come from such a low place in life.
Just generally make him a very likable person to the entire party.
And then when they find out about his secret, play it out like it legitimately hurts that his friends are judging him for that. Kind of do the whole "Guys, you've known me for X amount of years, I can't believe you'd hang me out like that!"
I don't know, I just really like the idea of a necromancer who's a genuinely good guy, and instead of crumbling under all the shit he's been through, he ended up rising past it and becoming a better person.
Your character's gotta be mean too. And not "mean" as in "give me your lunch money, punk", but "mean" as in "hey, you touch my sister again, I'm going to reanimate your eyeballs into sentient, living beings who'll try to claw their way out of your skull and escape into freedom."
And then he probably would do it, because your character is also kind of a hot head. And then he'd be all "Well I SAID I would do it, wouldn't I? I SAID I would do it!"
And then he'd calm down and realize he's being cruel, and he'd turn the guys eyes back into normal little eyeballs, with an silent, kind of defeated, "...I told you I would do it, man."
Just thinking about it is making me pretty excited to make this character for one of my own games.
I change my mind, OP. Donut steel. This one's aaaaall just for me.
>>45613886
because summoning spells used to summon an evil creature are evil spells.
>>45610892
This is a cool idea, I don't get the unconditional hated towards all things necromancy on /tg/.
Will it work? Probably not. I tried doing it once, the paladin cast detect evil pretty much immediately when he got suspicious and I was smote like no one's ever been smitten before. Which was fair enough, it's what I was expecting to happen anyway.
>>45610892
What class has access to necromancy spells? Sorcerer, mage or warlock? Or is it a class of its own?
>>45610892
I am currently playing a CN necromancer, so I'll offer some advice.
Don't try and raise an army.
I use it to communicate with the dead, animate strange beasts we kill to learn their anatomy, and to understand diseases and plagues so I can cure them.
Necromancy is not always about creating an army of the dead, it is a forbidden art that can be used to understand biology at its core.
And I must stress the communication, it's impressive how much you can learn from the dead.
You can learn everything from the layout of the land to a bit of history lost to the ages.
>>45614221
In 5e, I think all of them do.
Don't have the book in front of me though, so at the very least, I know the wizard does for sure.
>>45614179
he love necromacy but we dont like people that do the whole hiding the fact his a necromancer from his party thing
only thing worse then that are those people who try to cry its not evil when its pretty dam clear the the books it is.
speaking of evil spells though who the fuck thought it was a good idea to make deathwatch an evil spell worst part of the book of vile darkness by far and then they made it fucking core in 3.5
>>45611757
What is summon celestial outsider.
>>45611757
now raising the dead is definitely evil but animate dead does not work like that
its a magic intelligence in that skeleton nothing more.
>>45614105
Yeah but...
why?
>>45610892
Sew your skeleton friends pretty uniforms. And Masks.
Raising undead is evil because
A: they are killing machines on a leash (your life/spell control)
B: You are unable to garuntee that you will re-dead them before the leash expires.
As a GM, I would strive to emphasize this, simply because it is forgotten in many games. In settings where the undead are NOT murder machines, I am totally down for neutral necro shenanigans. But no wizard can %100 garuntee that he will be able to live or maintain control over his undead 24/7, which is what many necromancers attempt to do.
Plus, think of what an enemy spellcaster can pull. Death Cleric and Oathbreaker come to mind, other undead, hell just vanilla wizards who have dispel magic.
A tear in the Weave could dick it up too, or a magic item. Dozens of ways necromancy can go wrong and unleash horrors on the world. No, necromancy
in settings like those is evil, forrr sure.
>>45610892
>Necromancy
>Necro Man Cy
>Non ecro MaCy
>Canon Mercy
>Yam Concern
>May Concern
>Man Once Cry
Hidden already.
>>45611842
And I don't CARE about the story of the skeleton either. Village has problems and needs saving, skeleton can such it up and stop being a whiny bitch for a little while. Aside from that, he's just about guaranteed to eventually be resurrected by some necromancer eventually anyway. Probably even to his wishes given the fact his family specifically chose not to cremate him.
>>45610892
Rejecting The Gift of Men is what brought The Doom of Men upon us. Accept the natural end of your lifespan you heretic.
>Behold! we are not bound forever in the circles of the world, and beyond them is more than memory, Farewell!
>He fell into sleep. Then a great beauty was revealed in him, so that all who after came there looked on him with wonder; for they saw the grace of his youth, and the valor of his manhood, and the wisdom and majesty of his age were all blended together. And long there he lay, an image of the splendour of the Kings of Men in glory undimmed before the breaking of the world.
You should do it op, it sounds fun.
I don't understand what these other people get out of an unbudging world where every game in a system has to be the same with the same hero's and same stories.
>>45614645
The thinking is that as fun as ethics debates can be, pausing a game so two people can bicker about fantasy morality isn't very fun for the other people. Therefore, D&D just makes a shitton of ethical prejudgements for everyone in an attempt to make things go smoothly.
>>45616645
While an excellent line of thought, the same logic would imply that saving a life, summoning an elemental, or even starting a campfire would also be Evil acts because you can't be certain it won't lead to bad things happening.
>>45610892
What's the background of the paladin? Or has it not been delved into?
>>45616852
Lol no
>>45617860
Shame a lot of those pre judgements are garbage or just annoying.
>>45610892
Necromancy can be fun depending on how you decide to do it. Because it doesn't have to be just power-mongering wizardry. Ecclesiastical necromancy is a thing.
>>45618612
Like, you can have "Imma call up skeletons and zombies and force them to do shit for me" or you can go with "I'm basically the kid in the Sixth Sense and I can see restless spirits and can also strike bargains with them".
But that also might move into clerical shit or some other schools of magic. The difference can come where in one you're obviously doing some devious shit if anyone finds out, and in the other you have things happening like bandits suddenly exploding into clouds of blood because you make a deal with an angry ghost.
>>45618677
I mean, you can combine the two and have the angry ghost possess the bandit's skeleton and have it tear itself out of his flesh. That's a classic. But yeah. Looks bad to any people sworn to uphold good.
>>45618677
Undying Warlock is probably the easiest way to do that (in 5th ed D&D). Ghosts don't necessarily attack on sight and speak with dead can be at-will.
>>45618706
Transmutation can also be fun. Then your end-game isn't lich. It's some eternal abomination. Instead of manipulating the dark energies of necromancy, you're manipulating raw primordial life. Do weird shit like giving yourself the flatworm's ability to transcribe consumed memories and go around with your hand wrapped up because it has an illithid break in the center or some shit. Warp creatures to your will. Grow forests of killer plants. Dermal plate wild boars. Tzimisce shit up.
>>45618843
Or hell. You can also give people cancer. There's an idea. Canceromancer.
>>45618902
Thank you, I am about to play a ratfolk necromancer and now I know what my end game is
I once played a game where a necromancer would get consent forms signed by people before their death and compensate them accordingly. Ain't nothing evil about that.
