Pathfinder General /pfg/
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Previous thread: >>44175359
>>44183249
awoo?
![[wolf sounds].png](https://i.imgur.com/I3YqqsC.jpg "[wolf sounds].png")
>>44183256
awoo.
>>44183249
Reminder that Fighter is the most based class
>>44183275
>>44183309
What is the best KIND of fighter, post WMH?
>>44183256
>>44183275
>>44183350
>>44183249
>touch
>>44183353
I'm open to hearing more about this. It seems like WHM made Fighters actually usable?
>>44183353
Myrmidon/Lore Warden is the new hotness. Skill points for days, unique deeds, and all that. You can even add Martial Master to essentially paragon surge maneuvers using Advanced Study.
Is there anyway to boost the save DC on Splash Weapons so they remain competitive?
>>44183448
What is the Myrmidon from again. Cant seem to find it on the SRG.
>>44183429
Aw, it's adorable
>>44183507
PoW: Extended
>>44183507
Path of War: Expanded playtest.
I wish Tattooed Sorcerer stacked with Wildblooded. I mean, who doesn't want their Primal Air Sylph Sorceress to have lightning tattoos all over?
>>44183526
Extend Maneuver metamartial feat wot
Hey /pfg/, help me out here for a second. I seem to recall seeing someplace an ability or spell that lets you cast spells through an ally or enemy. Anyone know offhand what it is?
To help get attention, here is a shygal.
>>44183540
I meant Path of War: Expanded Archetypes Document
>https://docs.google.com/document/d/1tbBIinA90VQW8eriM0TZTZCbHsSU6cdv7_44J8w564s/edit?pref=2&pli=1
>>44183545
your tactics are vile.
How do you mean, cast spells through an ally or enemy? Do you mean ray attacks have to deal with soft cover from creatures?
>>44183448
I personally think that the mutation warrior synergizes better with the myrmidon, as it better fills a gap in the myrmidon's repertoire (flight), and a mutagen confers a dramatic increase in raw numbers. Additionally, the Lore Warden's reduced armor proficiencies are not ideal for a Strength-based fighter.
Of course, if you wish to be a Dexterity/Wisdom-based myrmidon who makes semi-frequent use of combat maneuver... maneuvers, then the lore warden is certainly more ideal.
>>44183545
I think that's the Witch Hex, Scar. Not sure.
>>44183577
Recollection hit me because it was a feat that you could get in Descent, but I'm pretty sure I've seen the effect in PF before
If I remember correctly it had one of two uses, either allowing you to cast spells through your allies (so ray attacks originate from their space) or giving enemies a will save to prevent being the originating point of a spell you cast.Hopefully you'll see just how vile it is in greentext form in the future.
>>44183600
It's close, but it's a much closer-range effect and has a much more general use.
>>44183580
>Additionally, the Lore Warden's reduced armor proficiencies are not ideal for a Strength-based fighter.
Did you know: Lore Warden, by RAW, doesn't lose any armor proficiencies?
>http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/armor-proficiency-heavy
>Special: Fighters and paladins automatically have Heavy Armor Proficiency as a bonus feat. They need not select it.Good luck convincing your DM, but rules are rules, and the only way to interpret the RAW on it to lose the armor proficiencies is that Lore Warden nukes all armor proficiencies, even ones from other classes..
>>44183309
Based how? It's a fucking awful class, and the only way it's improved is by trading out every aspect of it for archetypes which poach class features from things with more thought put into them than "darrr he swing wepn"
>>44183249
Warcraft Books for Warcraft Anon.
https://mega.nz/#F!XYNxHazb!v6Wzoz2qCWwBvWSaBUCV1w
>>44183372
Is there a reason anyone would pick a martial weapon instead of an exotic one with the Half Elf racial trait? It seems weird that they would mention both, like there's some limitation on the exotics that got left out.
>>44183801
Melee weapon? Possibly greatsword or falchion, maybe shortsword for TWF. Also longbow.
>>44183801
The majority of exotic weapons are exotic not for game balance reasons but because they're weird and the person who categorized them can't see a bog-standard fighter or barbarian picking one up and making good use of it. In terms of numbers, there are way more worthwhile weapons in martial than in exotic. The rare exotic weapons that used to be good have been nerfed in the transition from 3.5 (ahaha spiked chain ahaha).
>>44183801
Also, the same reason anyone doesn't just roll up a wizard because they want to win the game: fluff.
>>44183748
Pandaren Racial Traits
• +2 Stamina, +2 Charisma, –2 Intellect. Pandaren
are tough and quite friendly, but their isolated culture
has limited their exposure to intellectual stimulation.
• Medium: As Medium creatures, pandaren have no
bonuses or penalties based on their size.
• Pandaren base land speed is 30 feet.
• +1 natural armor bonus to AC.
• All pandaren gain Dodge as a bonus feat, even if
they do not meet the prerequisites.
• Pandaren have a +2 racial bonus on Listen and
Spot checks. Pandaren are attuned to the world
around them.
• Automatic Language: Common and Pandaren.
• Bonus Languages: Any unrestricted. Pandaren
enjoy learning new languages.
• Racial Levels: Unlike humans and some other races,
pandaren can take a few levels in “pandaren” as a class to
develop their racial qualities more fully.
>>44183915
>stamina
>Listen and Spot
>>44183825
> Shortsword
You means Gladius which is Shortsword+. Hell, Shortsword proficiency feat let you use Gladius anyway.
>>44183748
Tuskarr Racial Traits
• +2 Stamina, –2 Intellect. Tuskarr are sturdy and
easily weather physical hardship, but their simple society
does not allow for much intellectual stimulation.
• Medium: As Medium creatures, tuskarr have no
bonuses or penalties based on their size.
• Tuskarr base land speed is 30 feet.
• +1 natural armor bonus to AC. A tuskarr has a layer
of tough blubber beneath his hide.
• Weapon Familiarity: Tuskarr treat the net as a
martial weapon instead of an exotic weapon.
• +2 racial bonus on Fortitude saving throws against
cold effects. (This includes magical and nonmagical
cold effects.)
• +2 racial bonus on Profession (fi sher), Profession
(whaler) and Survival checks. These skills are class
skills for all tuskarr characters.
• Automatic Languages: Common and Tuskarr.
• Bonus Languages: Low Common and Zandali. Most
tuskarr do not learn more than Tuskarr and Common,
but those who do speak the tongues of their enemies.
• Racial Levels: Unlike humans and some other
races, tuskarr can take a few levels in “tuskarr” as a class
to develop their racial qualities more fully.
>>44183945
>Guy asks for some stuff from the WoW d20 RPG.
>You're shocked that the stuff from the WoWd20 RPG gets posted.
>>44183372
>>44183748
(Core Book)
Troll Racial Traits
• +2 Agility,–2 Intellect, –2 Charisma. Trolls are wiry
and quick, but their primitive culture has not allowed for
much intellectual stimulation.
• Medium: As Medium creatures, jungle trolls have
no special bonuses or penalties due to their size.
• Jungle troll base land speed is 30 feet.
• Low-Light Vision: Jungle trolls can see twice as far
as humans in starlight, moonlight, torchlight and similar
conditions of poor illumination. They retain the ability
to distinguish color and detail under these conditions.
• Rapid Healing (Ex): Jungle trolls heal twice as
quickly as normal (they heal double the normal number
of hit points after a period of rest). Trolls can improve
this natural ability even further by taking racial levels.
• +1 racial bonus on attack rolls with thrown weapons.
Jungle trolls are skilled hunters and are particularly fond
of the javelin and the throwing axe.
• +2 racial bonus on Survival checks. Survival is a
class skill for all jungle troll characters. Jungle trolls spend
most of their time in the wilderness and know its tricks.
• +2 racial bonus on Jump and Tumble checks. Jump
and Tumble are class skills for all jungle troll characters.
Jungle trolls are amazingly agile and acrobatic.
• Automatic Languages: Common and Low
Common.
• Bonus Languages: Goblin, Orc and Taur-ahe. Jungle
trolls know their allies’ languages, and Goblin is always
helpful.
• Racial Levels: Unlike humans and some other races,
jungle trolls can take a few levels in “jungle troll” as a
class to develop their racial qualities more fully.
>>44183915
>>44183959
(Dark Factions)
>>44183915
I feel like having negatives to stats doesn't fit very well with Warcraft races, as even orcs are shown to have the occasionally supergenius.
Pandaren also have mages and conquered an entire continent. +2 Constitution. and Charisma are good, though I probably would have picked Wisdom.
Getting Dodge and Natural Armor makes sense, a little strong at early levels but it fits the flavor.
>>44183945
Probably being ported from the 3.5 based warcraft RPG's rules.
>>44183965
This is one of the gayest .gifs I've ever seen and I've been in /mgg/ a lot lately.
High Elf Racial Traits
• +2 Intellect, –2 Stamina. The high elves are magically adept; however, their willowy builds are frail.
• Medium: As Medium creatures, high elves have no special bonuses or penalties due to their size.
• Highelven base land speed is 30 feet.
• Low-Light Vision: High elves can normally see two times farther than a human can in starlight, moonlight, torchlight and similar conditions of poor illumination.
High elves retain the ability to distinguish color under these conditions.
• Magic Addiction: High elves are addicted to the use of arcane magic. A high elf must spend 1 hour each morning in meditation, resisting the distractions of
addiction, or take a –1 penalty to effective caster level for all arcane spells and a –2 penalty on all saving throws against spells for that day.
Devoting time to resisting the addiction is unnecessary if the high elf is within 50 feet of a moonwell. If the high elf is able to drink directly from a moonwell, the
addiction abates for a number of days equal to the high elf’s Spirit modifier (minimum of 1 day).
• Racial Animosity: Night elves and tauren can instinctively sense the disturbing innate arcane energies that addict the high elves. Because of this, high elves
suffer a –2 circumstance penalty on all Charisma-based skill checks made when relating directly to night elves and tauren.
• Weapon Proficiency: High elves receive for free the Martial Weapon Proficiency feats for the longbow, composite longbow, short sword, and longsword.
• +2 racial bonus on saving throws against mind- affecting spells or effects.
• +2 racial bonus on Concentration, Knowledge (arcana) and Spellcraft skill checks. These skills are also considered class skills for all high elf characters.
• Automatic Languages: Common and Thalassian.
• Bonus Languages: Darnassian, Dwarven, Goblin, Kalimdoran, Orcish.
• Racial Levels: High elves can take a few levels in “high elf” as a class to develop their racial qualities more fully.
>>44183793
I will never be able to look at that MS the same again.
>>44183748
Tauren Racial Traits
• +2 Strength, –2 Agility. Tauren are incredibly
powerful, but they lack grace.
• Medium: As Medium creatures, Tauren have no
special bonuses or penalties due to their size.
• Tauren base land speed is 30 feet.
•Natural Weapon (Ex): A tauren’s horns are a natural
weapon, and all adult tauren are profi cient in their use.
Tauren horns deal 1d8 points of damage (plus bonus
damage from Strength). Male tauren horns tend to be
more prominent than those of females.
• Weapon Familiarity: Tauren may treat tauren
halberds and totems as martial weapons rather than
exotic weapons.
• Weapon Profi ciency: Tauren receive the Martial
Weapon Profi ciency feats for longspears and shortspears.
Tauren are skilled hunters.
• +2 racial bonus on Handle Animal and Survival
checks. These skills are considered class skills for all
tauren characters.
• Automatic Languages: Common and Taur-ahe.
• Bonus Languages: Goblin, Low Common and Orcish.
Tauren tend to learn languages for trade or exchanging
ideas.
• Racial Levels: Unlike humans and some other races,
tauren can take a few levels in “tauren” as a class to
develop their racial qualities more fully.
>>44183646
That's interesting because of how proficiency is represented within the game. The class states that you are proficient with heavy armor, not that you gain the feat. The heavy armor feat itself states that the fighter and paladin gets it automatically as a bonus feat. However, similar stipulations are made for both light and medium proficiencies on classes.
>Special: All characters except monks, sorcerers, and wizards automatically have Light Armor Proficiency as a bonus feat. They need not select it.
The Arcanist class is not proficient with any type of armor or shield. However, because the arcanist isn't a monk, sorcerer, or wizard, I can argue that my arcanist gains the feat as a bonus feat automatically. Same for the witch and any class aside from the aforementioned three that would trade away light armor proficiency.
What's actually happening is that taking a level in fighter should grant you the bonus feats light, medium, and heavy armor proficiency, plus shield proficiency and tower shield proficiency. But it seems in design space there is cognitive dissonance between a class having proficiency and having the feats. Then Lore Warden would only need to state that you lose the feats from your fighter class as its source.
Still, it's like a card game's rules stating "on the start of your opponent's next turn they cannot draw a card" and then pointing to the rule that says "at the beginning of a player's turn (you) draw one card". The argument is that the new rule cannot overrule the previous rule. That's what overruling is. Ruling over rules. RULES.
Questions on Toxicant
>1
Is there a duration for the secretion? I can't seem to find it. Does it just work for all day?
>2
The rules don't say anything about how often you can surpress your secretion, other than suppressing it is 1 hour long. Can I just supress it again for another hour once the hoir runs out?
>3
How useful is Throw Anything? I can't seem to decide whether I want to go Vivisectionist/Toxicant or just Eldritch Poisoner, and the only difference is that one has Throw Anything and the other doesn't. Thoughts?
>>44183748
Forsaken Racial Traits
• +2 Strength, –2 Agility. Undeath grants physical power but dulls refl exes.
• Medium: As Medium creatures,
Forsaken have no special bonuses or
penalties due to their size.
• Forsaken base land speed is 30
feet.
• Darkvision: Forsaken can see in
the dark up to 60 feet. Darkvision is
black and white only, but it is otherwise
like normal sight. Forsaken can function
just fi ne with no light at all.
• Undead: Forsaken are undead rather than
humanoids. This provides a Forsaken with numerous
undead traits:
— No Stamina score. Forsaken do not possess Stamina
scores and gain no bonus hit points per Hit Die.
— Immunity to all mind-affecting effects (charms,
compulsions, phantasms, patterns and morale effects).
— Immunity to poison, sleep effects, paralysis,
stunning, disease and death effects.
— Not subject to critical hits, nonlethal damage,
ability drain or energy drain. Immune to damage to their
physical ability scores (Strength and Agility), as well as
to fatigue and exhaustion effects.
— Negative energy (such as from a death coil spell)
heals Forsaken, while positive energy hurts them.
— Forsaken do not heal naturally.
— Immunity to any effect that requires a Fortitude save
(unless the effect also works on objects or is harmless).
— Uses her Charisma modifi er for Concentration
checks.
[Contd]
>>44184104
— Not at risk of death from massive damage. Unlike
other undead, a Forsaken is not destroyed when reduced
to 0 hit points or less. Instead, at 0 hit points a Forsaken
is disabled. She can perform only one move action or
standard action each round but does not risk further
damage from strenuous activity. Between –1 and –9 hit
points, the Forsaken is down. She is unconscious and
cannot act, but she does not risk further damage (unless
her enemies attack her or some other unfortunate event
befalls her). At –10 hit points, the Forsaken is destroyed.
— Not affected by raise dead and reincarnate spells or
abilities. Resurrection and true resurrection can affect
Forsaken. These spells return a destroyed Forsaken to
her undead life; the Scourge’s curse makes it virtually
impossible to bring a Forsaken back to life as the
creature she was before she died. Only wish or miracle
can accomplish that.
— Forsaken do not breathe, eat or sleep. Forsaken
spellcasters still need 8 hours uninterrupted rest before
preparing their spells (see Chapter 15: Spellcasting).
• Automatic Language: Common.
• Bonus Languages: Goblin, Low Common, Orc and
Thalassian. Forsaken learn the languages of their enemies
and their allies (who may soon become their enemies).
• Racial Levels: Unlike humans and some other races,
Forsaken can take a few levels in “Forsaken” as a class to
develop their racial qualities more fully.
>>44183801
For almost martial weapon there's a stronger exotic weapon. Except Longbows and most throwing weapons. The Nodachi was clearly supposed to be an exotic weapon, but it's Martial. I don't think there is a direct obvious upgrade to the Greatsword, but there are similar weapons like the Elven Curve Blade, Flambard, and Bastard Sword.
>>44183825
Wakisashis and Falcatas are better than Shortswords, Elven Curve Blade and such are better than Falchion. And there are a lot of weapons about the same but better than Greatsword, but not quite.
You're right about the Longbow unless you go 3rd party.
>>44183793
Don't Bawoo
>>44184015
>Probably being ported from the 3.5 based warcraft RPG's rules.
Its direct copypasta from he 3.5e based wowd20 RPG PDFs shared >>44183748.
>I feel like having negatives to stats doesn't fit very well with Warcraft races, as even orcs are shown to have the occasionally supergenius.
I didn't write them, anon, I'm just copy pasting the things the anon was specifically looking for, from the book, and saying where he can find them.
These are the official racial writeups for the official RPG.
>>44184078
While that's true, your last comparison is incorrect. There are a lot of things that just give you proficiency (classes, some races, creature types iirc?), and then there's feats that give you proficiency.
The fact that the Lore Warden (and other archetypes that mess with armor) doesn't get rid of the feats is an oversight on Paizo's part. However, it's really just a problem of them being lazy or not realizing when they copied it out of D&D, since those feats have had those rules since Third Edition.
The example you give with a card game is a different situation. That one is:
>Rule says I do one thing
>Overriding rule says I don't do that thing
The lore warden armor situation is /this/:
>Rule says I do thing A (have armor proficiencies from class)
>Rule says I do thing B (get bonus feats from class)
>Overriding rule says I don't do thing A (lore warden armor proficiencies)
>Rule B still stands
If this didn't work, then that means that a lore warden likewise wouldn't be able to take the feats with their normal class bonus feats. However, I highly doubt it'd fly in a real gameeven though I'd allow it, myself...It's an amusing RAW break I wanted to point out.
>>44184119
at least apply basic formatting so you don't expand the page to infinity with this garbage
>>44184155
Ah okay, nevermind then.
>you will never be a Cleric of Shelyn
>you will never find a Wyrmling Black Dragon and manage diplomacy with it by sculpting likenesses of it from clay
>you will never eventually teach it to truly appreciate art, rather than its own vanity
>you will never prove the power of nurture over nature
>you will never watch the lustre first appear on its scales as it defends your temple of its own accord during an attack
>you will never see it grow into a young adult Lead
>you will never grow old while reinforcing what it has learned so far
>you will never be visited by the grown Lead Dragon on your deathbed
>it will never thank you for everything you've done as you close your eyes one final time, awaiting your eternal rest
Why even live?
>>44184183
Eh. Was in a hurry. And I'm done now.
I'll keep that in mind for next time I post something though.
>>44184085
1) There is no duration, although it's assumed to last until you sleep at which point you have to make it again. Just a side note here, there's nothing stopping you from also taking the Mutagen/Cognatogen discovery and using them simultaneously.
2) You can suppress it an unlimited number of times per day.
3) Throw Anything is what gives you Int to damage for splash weapons. If you're going for Vivisectionist you can safely drop it.
However, there's other differences between Toxicant and Eldritch Poisoner worth looking at. Besides Eldritch Poisoner having a limited number of doses per day, the poison effects between the two archetypes are very different. Toxicant is much more focused on status effects over damage, letting you incapacitate enemies earlier on at the cost of less actual killing power. Eldritch Poisoner on the other hand is much heavier on the ability score damage, with secondary effects as just that, secondary.
>>44184291
it's appreciated
>>44184162
The last thing I was stating was how it should be, not how it is. The source of proficiency is partially abstracted, instead of being explicitly stated as gained as feat. Being a fighter should say a fighter gains those five feats, plus gains simple weapon and martial weapon proficiency feats, but it doesn't. The problem is 100% a RAW issue.
It's more an argument that strict adherence to RAW can be flawed. Which honestly sucks because then you get shitty FAQ and errata bullshit. The feat that the fighter gains the feat automatically obviously RAI's as the fighter's proficiency class feature and the feats' source are one in the same. I agree with you that if a DM said straight up "if there's ever a RAW vs RAI I'll follow all RAW" then he'd need to rule to approve it, but otherwise I'd rule that the fighter with the archtype losses his inert fighter feat bonus.
I want you to know that I understand what you're saying. The feat's special stipulation is a magnet that attaches to every fighter and the wording doesn't remove it. It's just stuck on the fighter. As a rule lawyer your case has very strong standing, but as a judge I'd rule against you because fuck the wording you're guilty, life sentence!
>>44184442
Aww, I don't want to go to fighter prison, though. It's boring. They don't even have AMF cells, for god's sake!
>>44183437
Someone came up with this last month.
>>44184320
Thanks mate. I think I'll stick to Toxicant/Vivisectionist. It seems it will work better for me since I plan on also dipping a bit into Slayer, and I'll probably want to carry some acid or AlchFire flasks in the early game.
>>44184442
>>44184515
don't worry buddy, you can appeal to a higher court
Curse of the Crimson Throne DM here.
Getting ready to send my players down into the dungeon under the graveyard to hunt down Rolth (he's not there) and end book 1. So I think I've got about 3, maybe 4 sessions left before the end of the book.
I'm in the market for add-ons here. I don't want the city to go full plague-mode right away, as it's tradition in my games to usually have at least a week of time between books, though I usually fill that with some sort of small adventure because players really can't come up with things to fill a week of time with.
So yeah: I need all kinds of little quests, distractions, and mini-threads I can use to pad things out while he ministrations of the plague slowly work in the background until the story starts.
>>44184517
question on bravery +2 etc
does this mean it skips the +1 of bravery, or at the level it gets +2 bravery, it gets the +1 bravery ability?
>>44184633
from the general rules on archetypes
>If an archetype replaces a class feature that’s part of a series of improvements or additions to the base ability (such as a fighter’s weapon training or a ranger’s favored enemy), the next time the character would gain that ability, it counts as the lower-level ability that was replaced by the archetype. In effect, all abilities in that series are delayed until the next time the class improves that ability. For example, if an archetype replaces a rogue’s +2d6 sneak attack bonus at 3rd level, her sneak attack doesn’t jump from +1d6 to +3d6 at 5th level—it improves to +2d6 just as if she finally gained the increase for 3rd level. This adjustment continues for every level in which her sneak attack would improve, until at 19th level she has +9d6 instead of the +10d6 of a standard rogue.
>>44184715
cheers
Did anyone figure out how the "Bard that throws 50 great swords" thing works?
>>44185052
Not sure about 50, but you can do one per CL with a single spell slot/standard action: http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/s/sonic-thrust
>>44185052
Sonic Thrust
Technically it's "Throws CL of swords"
>>44185071
>>44185074
Thanks! Gonna have to pick this up.
There are anons in this thread, RIGHT NOW, that have never wooed the awoo.
>>44185103To be honest, I've never seen the appeal of Pathfinder's APs. There are good adventure paths out there, but I don't care for Golarion and I don't care for current Paizo's writing.
Also, my DM tends to be incredibly creative with his plots, so why would I go to an AP when I have that?
>>44185103
You gotta smite ALL the evil, son.
So, Agents of Evil and AP #100 are tomorrow. Plus something about Cheliax that nobody cares about.
Anything people are looking forward to?
>>44185133
not hearing about golarion
Best Class/Build for this Concept? Basically a "Paladin" (Want the holy authority theme) with an attack dog that will grab people and allow me to grapple them and restrain them. Focuses on using non-lethal take downs and such. 1st party only.
>>44185165
Spiritualist refluffed, honestly. Their phantoms have some decent defender abilities, and you can even summon it like a paladin's magic horse. Detect Undead is a fitting and fluffy thing (maybe you could get your DM to swap it for Detect Evil).
>>44185119
Who publishes Pathfinder APs besides Paizo and whatever company made Way of the Wicked (the only complete 3PP AP I've heard of before) anyway?
>>44185165
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/races/core-races/half-orc/redeemer-paladin-half-orc
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/cavalier/archetypes/paizo---cavalier-archetypes/constable-cavalier-archetype
Or just a Cavalier with this order, get a Wolf mount.
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/cavalier/orders/paizo---cavalier-orders/order-of-the-blue-rose
>>44185165
>>44185198
you could also go this as a prestige class if you go the cavalier route but still want a holy theme
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/prestige-classes/other-paizo/c-d/chevalier
>>44185074
>>44185071
>>44185052
>tfw going to play a Bard with a massive stack of weapons on hand and shout "MONGRELS" as the verbal component every time I use this spell
>>44185165
Sacred Huntsmaster Inquisitor?
>>44185133
Stuff from AP #100 has been leaked, specifically the Aroden article. It was not impressive.
>>44185198
>>44185201
I like the Cavalier into Chevalier, thank you!
>>44185213
This is a good idea as well, I will keep it in mind.
>>44185133
Agents of Evil tantalizes me slightly because some of the things I've heard are in it so far sound intriguing. Hopefully it will be another good book instead of a rubbish one. As for AP#100 though, I would only care about the Aroden article but it was already leaked (and very disappointing). Instead, I am only looking forward to the reactions from folks on Paizo's board when the book and its article are officially released. I think I'd have preferred if any of the crazy conspiracy theories were right (IE Aroden was deleted for meddling in the Dimension of Time, Aroden was actually an Annunaki, Aroden was transexual, etc) rather than what we actually got (He was a really good blacksmith). At least they would have stirred some more interesting discussion, for better or for worse.
>>44185243
One important thing to note though is that it doesn't disprove Aroden as an Annunaki. In fact, only an Annunaki could have crafted a sword that fine using space tech.
>>44185194
Not necessarily Pathinder. The /concept/ of adventure paths can be done well. I have yet to see a good one for Pathfinder, and I've only seen one good one for 3.5 (Age of Worms), and even /it/ had a ton of issues that the DM has to sift through to make it function. It was only good because the plot and setting were well-done, and it called back to a lot of the cooler fluff that got scrubbed away from Greyhawk in 3e D&D. Curiously, Paizo wrote that one, too, so I'm going to chalk it up to the settings being different and the writers having different goals with the current set of stuff.
Mind, I also haven't looked too hard beyond occasionally checking out Paizo adventure paths to see what they've got, and looking through D&D ones. I don't like playing through adventure modules most of the time; I greatly like them for setting up the fluff of a setting and telling stories about what has happened or is happening in a world, but I'd rather have a DM who makes up his own game (in an established setting or a homebrew one. Whichever the DM prefers). It's more fun to play in games where the setting and plot is tailored to the group's preferences and the character backstories created and the goals of the PCs, rather than having to take characters and run them through the rails of a plotline written up beforehand.
>>44185119
I'm a DM, and while my players tell me I excel at improvisation, character voices, and dialogue, I really suck at the planning aspects of running a campaign. While I've gotten fairly far (with good supposed results) just winging every session, APs let me focus on my strengths as a storyteller and leave the planning up to Paizo.
Currently running Reign of Winter, looking forward to seeing my Paladin woo the awoo, and also to [spoiller]having them fight Russian soldiers in WWI[/spoiler].
>>44185243
The other thing it reveals is apparently that it took him a couple of weeks to die? Something about disappearing near the start of the Chelish civil war or something, then the death only happening when all his clerics lost their spells.
I remember talking about casting the spell that turns a coin into something that you can throw with the force of a bullet, and being told that casting that spell for several minutes then throwing a bag of it probably shouldn't count. Sonic thrust and the thrust aspect of telekenesis should allow me to trigger each individually. I believe it's from the dirty trick thing that got released.
The thrown weapons have to succeed on an attack roll. This means it'd calculate like any other thrown weapon right? I'm curious as to interactions with certain things.
A bard's competence bonus gets applied to the things thrown right?
The +5 on a weapon gets applied, or just uses the mental stat plus BAB?
Enchantments on weapons apply for the damage done right? Standard damage means what the weapon would usually do, instead of calculating what an object of a sword's size would do?
If you get a quickened true strike cast, does the first object's attack roll get the bonus?
Putting returning on all your weapons that get thrown lets you spam this spell right?
Can things like being a sharding weapon, or having the ricochet or ranged disarming apply? What wacky things can we accomplish, not necessarily OP?
>>44185165
Be an actual Paladin, and just take Nature Soul -> Animal Ally feats in order to gain an animal companion? Alternatively, just ask your DM to let you have a dog with your divine bond (mount) ability. It reads "This mount is usually a heavy horse (for a Medium paladin) or a pony (for a Small paladin), although more exotic mounts, such as a boar, camel, or dog are also suitable."
>>44185272
Wow, awesome lore. Totally worth the hype.
>>44185286
I think it was from Heroes of the Street, actually. But I could be wrong.
>>44185234
Btw any Inquisitor can get Mount (as Cavalier class feature) via Chivalry Inquisition.
They also has access to Animal Domain but you will needs boon companion to make it function at your level.
>>44185271
Yeah, that's fair. APs aren't bad, I just don't enjoy Paizo's writing or setting. The best way to run an AP in my opinion is to rewrite parts of it as needed, while using the general long-term plotline and framework as a helper along the way. It does the heavy lifting and you tweak it to be great instead of just another AP.
I want to run Savage Tide from Dungeon Magazine at some point, honestly. Sadly, I doubt I'll get the chance, since I've got a backlog of game ideas I want to run that my players are interested in before I'll get to it.
I wish I had the time to DM more than one game at once.
>>44185286
>>44185289
Coin Shot from Heroes of the Streets.I just realized I have no Railgun reaction images
>>44185272
Didn't we already know that though? Or am I imagining that? Because I think I knew that before I read the article.
Pic unrelated, but will hopefully cheer up someone in need of cheering.
>>44185308
I tend to flavor encounters, and try to give my players a bit more control over the events that unfold, while maintaining the overall plotline. It tends to make things chug along much slower, but the players seem happy, so whatever. My biggest thing is working elements of the character's backstories into the plot.
Would love to see a "bugfix" for Wrath of the Righteous, as I'm told it could be a pretty great campaign were it not for the absolutely terrible sections that spoil the pot.
>>44185308
CoCT DM here.
I love running APs, but most of them are not great. However, even the really well-written APs suffer from the problem of being constrained to a 15-17 level limit and 6 very thin books with which to publish the plot in. And while they're written ASSUMING that DMs will understand that it's their job to flesh things out and pad the runtime as necessary, most DMs don't do this and they end up running what amounts to a screaming-fast railroad ride through a story that suffers bad pacing and development.
In contrast, I'm running one of the best-written APs (Curse of the Crimson Throne), and my players are currently 22 sessions in, and we're not out of the first book yet. This is because I am still using the overall plot of the book, all the elements from the published story are still there, they're just spaced out by blocks of other content, usually stuff I've pulled from other small modules and books, in service of writing a much more coherent narrative that gives things time and space to develop and allows the players to experience as much of the setting as possible.
This is my new philosophy going into all APs, and I've done a few this way, re-writing them extensively with extra content and such to run better.
One of my players has challenged me to do so with Second Darkness. I...don't know if I will accomplish that.
>>44185406
Do you still have your PCs leveling up with experience gain, or just when it feels like it's a good time to level up? Adding a lot of extra content seems like it would either force you to toughen encounters later in the AP or let the party steam roll them for being a higher level than the book assumes, unless you're just ditching the experience system in the first place.
>>44185356
We comfy pathfinder thread now. How do your characters like to spend their free time? Taking long baths in the sunset, eating a home cooked meal, or taking care of your animal companion?
>>44185406
Nice. Good luck with Second Darkness, I'm sure you've got this.
How's that done with your pacing? My biggest issue with my own DMing is that I keep fucking up pacing and ending up spending way more time than anyone intended on specific things or locations, then not being able to get as much time as I want in other areas. And on one hand, it's great as long as everyone's having fun, but it's still a bit annoying.
We spent a full six months of sessions in the "starter dungeon" of this game, because the party ended up doing a lot of rescuing and RPing in addition to some of the normal murderhobo activities. Ended up expanding it to include some more setting and overarching Big Plot details, and they ended up getting three cohorts for the party out of it and a potentially recurring frenemy.
>>44185439
>Do you still have your PCs leveling up with experience gain
Fuckin' no, man. I level them up when I want them to, and that's fine with us. Basically, I use the actual content of the published adventure to determine what points they need to actually level up, since that's a pretty solid metric of when they should.
But then, I think that players should spend long stretches of time at each level. I mean, with experience points, you're just rocketing through tiers and never spend any time actually feeling the level they're at, since they're always quickly approaching the next.
>>44185452
My character is a cat (used to be a wizard's familiar, is now her own highly-magical being thanks to some divine intervention) who spends most of her time lounging, sleeping, or completely rebuilding pieces of furniture in the party's base of operations with the fabricate spell and massively-boosted craft checks. Our little terrorist cell's hideout is fancier than most grand hotels at this point.
>>44185457
>How's that done with your pacing?
How's what done?
>>44185475
A cat managing not only to stop itself from destroying furniture, but actually making some? Amazing.
>>44185479
Er, spreading out the book, adding in new stuff, 22 sessions on one book. How much of it's new stuff, how much of it's expanded stuff, and how much of it's stuff that took longer than intended (if any)?It's 3am, I fucked up my question, sorry.
>>44185467
You know there are experience "speeds", right?
>>44185165
I'm a guy looking into being a non douchebag slaver character. Inquisitor is basically Paladin Lite, and Cavalier can easily be just a non divine Paladin substitute.
The grappling part of your character concept requires feats, and can give you trouble if your focus is on capturing things alive. A trick I like to use is the Merciful weapon enchantment, which lets you make your attacks nonlethal without the -4 penalty, can be suppressed at any time, and adds 1d6 damage if you do nonlethal damage. I also like the Sapping weapon quality, which adds 2d6 damage of nonlethal. Your allies can attack like normal to weaken it, and then you attack like normal with your Merciful Sapping GreatAxe and then the dude will drop unconscious instead of dying. No need to invest feats into grappling just to get to something with a ring of Freedom of Movement.
>>44185487Well, she destroys it first, before repairing it to be ten times better.
She's also spent time making elaborate art pieces and selling them on the black market, and at one point created a sapient construct made of stacks of magically-infused paper that could fold and unfold itself into a variety of shapes and forms. It's colossal size, and managed to get out and do stuff on its own. Last I heard it was spending time helping people load heavy stuff at the city docks (my character made sure that they were paying it a fair wage when she found out).
>>44185452
Give him a good punching bag and he'll be there for hours. If he considers you a friend, but doesn't know your native language, that's another way to keep him occupied - teach 'im!
He can also sometimes be found writing letters to his parents.
Are there any monster sheets around? I need to brew ahalf-dragon vampire broken blade initiator
>>44185452
Carving a small wooden statue of things he encounter then makes a small theather show using those statue to the village children.
>>44185510
>slaver
>nonevil
Pick one and only one.
>>44185452
Swimming. Beating up marine life. Beating up people who agree to swim with her (though she lets them know she's going to do that when she asks them to join her). Maintaining a lighthouse.
>>44185406
Weird. Running RoW and the PCs are moving pretty slow. About 4 sessions in and we've not even reached the first bandits.
>>44185526
I can see it being done well if he's working within the system and treating his "property" more or less like human beings. Also, there's the Bond Servant angle.
>>44185516
Scholarly Little Mac, sounds like lots of fun
>>44185525
All bards should aspire to be wood carvers, it wood only help them out.
>>44185540
I am sure the local nautical life are big fans of her! I think I would pass on a swim though.
>>44185490
Oh. Well, it's hard to explain in concise detail and I really don't want to type out the whole entire thing right now, specifically because it is 3AM, but I'll do what I can. All of the specifics are actually written up in a thread on the Paizo forums with some discussion on planning and stuff, that details every session.
Basically, I tend to pad out every every actual major story point by working in the equivalent of a small published module in there to allow things to develop. So the original hunt for Gaedren I stretched to 5 sessions or so, mostly with made up stuff. I did the same with the Renegade Guards, making the investigation into them take a session or two, by involving them in robberies of stores and warehouses that only served to stretch that investigation, but also set up a later plot thread. Devargo was the same, with me sending the players to him undercover, meaning I had Devargo send them on three different jobs, one of them being The Veteran's Vault (the PFS module) and one of them being Daggers At Midnight (an old 3.5 module) that each lasted 3 or 4 sessions. We just got to the point of rescuing Trinia, and now they're just resting in town and buying furniture for Zellara's house which they intend to use as a base while I give them bits and pieces of the developing violence against Shoanti and other minorities in town as a way to set up the final dungeon for the book.
I've been happy with the pace so far, and my biggest concern has always been that I have no one to talk about my planning with, so a lot of things I tend to just run blind without running them by another DM first.
My players don't know CoCT, so if you asked them which parts of the campaign I made up, they wouldn't have any idea. The answer is "most of it".
>>44185560
Let's see...
>Never sell to people known to abuse slaves
>Also don't sell slaves to places that are basically death traps (salt mines, to the death fighting pits, etc)
>Don't beat your slaves
>Don't rape your slaves
>Treat your slaves with the dignity you are capable of affording them
>Your slaves are to be as healthy as you are
>Your slaves are to eat what you eat
>Your slaves will be as well dressed as you are
>You will help your slaves better themselves
>You will allow the slaves the opportunity to buy their freedom
>Don't split up couples
The only question is how to get people to work when they don't want to work without whipping them or starving them. Mental compulsion is an option, but it's a little skeevy, and also expensive.
>>44185526
Didn't say nonevil brah. The way I'm building my character it could easily just be a True Neutral bounty hunter, but I want non douchebag character that isn't fedora tier. I smash a bandit chieftan's face in for the bounty like a good murder hobo, but maybe after we strip him of his possessions I give him the chance to sign away his freedom for a couple years in exchange for me not killing him with my contract demon buddy? Or bestow geass/quests on defeated enemies to perform a task and return to me? I'm still exploring my options and don't want to shit up the threads with my character idea constantly.
I want to be an evil character who isn't "secretly wishes he was the BBEG" necromancer, "rape the farm and pillage the women" murdersavage, or "slits wizard's throat in the middle of the night" rogue.
I tried looking it up. Do cartomancers get access to 54 spells a day? With those being the ones she can only know per level?
Rookie DM here, we play over skype and I got problem players. What do I do? I don't think I can handle kicking them out because they are close friends.
Uh...
While stances and boosts are fairly self-evident
What happens if you use a Strike with an Autofire or Scatter weapon? They're not exactly very effective and neither are strikes, overall, but can they together become a viable thing to do?
>>44185692
Talk to them one on one about it.
>>44185692
>Dude, this and that other thing you do is fucking not cool. Why do you guys keep doing that.
>>44185699
I believe official word was "they don't interact, but there's probably decent ways to houserule it, like it just affecting one target."
The PoW devs actively did not want to touch scatter rules (or most of gun rules).
>>44185618
Maybe pay them as if they were employees, but don't actually let them leave. If they don't work, they don't get money. If they don't get money, they eat the same gruel you eat everyday. This way, your slaves are fairly often eating better than you.
>>44185728
Yeah well they wrote the fucking rules, and right now I have a warlord with dragon pistols. Nothing written official is kind of a problem.
I'm edging towards allowing it, since even the culverin guy doesn't touch scatter, and initiators just boost and full attack.
why is the samurai so aggressively mediocre? did they think "it's banner is like a bard, but this class fights good, so we can't have it work as well as bardic performance for mass combat, and also it won't have spells because it's so good at combat, and since it's so good at combat we won't give it any worthwhile combat buffs"?
>>44185768
The most reasonable way to rule it would be that yes you can use them, but the strike only applies to one target of the AoE. Otherwise shit like a Scatter weapon, or the 3.5 Giant Blade or something is just an AoE machine.
>>44185768
initiators just boosting and full attacking is a failure to get what initiating's all about, and smack whoever's doing it thanks
>Honorable Stand (Ex): At 11th level, a samurai can make an honorable stand, deciding to fight the target of his challenge to the bitter end, no matter the cost. He can make an honorable stand once per day at 11th level, plus one additional time per day at 16th level. Declaring an honorable stand is a swift action. While making an honorable stand, the samurai is immune to the shaken, frightened, and panicked conditions. He does not fall unconscious while his hit point total is below 0. Finally, whenever a samurai making an honorable stand must make a saving throw, he can spend one daily use of his resolve to reroll the saving throw after the first roll is made. He must take the result of the second roll, even if it is worse. If a samurai making an honorable stand ever retreats from battle against his challenged foe, he loses the ability to make a challenge for 24 hours.
Uh, do I just give the samurai who uses this the benefit of his challenge? Does it cost a use of challenge or is it in a separate pool? How the hell does this work?
>excited about Weapon Master's Handbook
>everything is based off of Weapon Training
>go back and re look at various Fighter archetypes
>almost all the weapon themed ones completely replace Weapon Training, even though it often includes one ability that is essentially the same thing.
>Weapon Training is usually gained at 5th level anyway, so its near impossible to get it for other classes unless you go three levels in Weapon Master archetype, which restricts your Advanced Weapon Training stuff
>once again, Lore Warden and Mutation Warrior are the only useful Fighter archetypes
Dangit Paizo. One small blurb. All you needed was one small ruling that said
>when an ability from an Archetype that would replace Weapon Training would still provide the same bonuses, please treat that ability as Weapon Training for the purposes of the feats and Advanced Training options in this book.
Then I would've been happy. But no, Fighters still can barely have nice things.
>>44185618
Added bonuses to most of these:
Well treated slaves might be in a better position than the average lowest-grades of a given locale or organization. People don't all notice when they've got it better than the next guy, but people sure as fuck notice when folks got it better than they do. The wiser/better slaves will notice that jealousy.
Additionally, well dressed, well equipped, healthy slaves openly known to be able to eventually just buy out their freedom from you give you, as the owner, a good image and reputation.
This is especially valuable as you move up in the world;
>If he treats his SLAVES like this, imagine what it must be like to be a real worker or vassal!
>>44185734
Reduce their debt according to the reasonable but low-end (as in "new-guy in a proper job" not as in "we'll only hire H1Bs and pretend this decrepit bus is 20 apartments they can live in") of the job/duties they're performing for you. When their debt is paid, the collars come off that same evening, perhaps with an offer to continue as a free worker (with of course increased pay and benefits if they were any good or worth keeping).
>>44185734
>>44185847
>>44185618
It's worth noting that preventing escape/mutiny really isn't that hard when you're an Adventurer, and they probably are not.
>>44185526
>I'll take "What is contractual indentured servitude" for 600, Alex
>>44185811
The failure actually lies in the combat system proper.
>What is a strike?
A strike is generally (there's some late exceptions) a single attack as a standard action, inexplicably incompatible with Vital Strike
>When do you do this?
Usually you try not to, barring the exceptions like Pounce and Elemental Wrath, except in conditions where you are forced to use your move action.
>Why is this the case?
Because even +14d6 to a single attack with a Save-or-Stun rider pales in comparison to just firing off an extra six fucking arrows at the guy, and in the case of your longbow can easily remain true even if you didn't apply a boost or damage stance.
>Why aren't people understanding?
They ARE. You're just doing easily twice the damage because even as buffed as the one strike can be, a full attack is still better
>What can be done about it?
Not fucking much without revamping how combat itself is done, because "DEAD" is the best status ailment you can deal.
>>44185844
>New Weapon Training option lets you get Dex-to-Hit on any weapon group you want
>STILL NO FUCKING WAY TO DEX TO DAMAGE OUTSIDE OF WASTING MONEY ON AN ENCHANTMENT
God dammit. One thing, Paizo. ONE SIMPLE THING.
>>44185893
To be fair, Dex to hit with giant weapons is the best image ever. I just picture a man barely lifting a massive sword and the letting the blade slide off his hands along the flat part, effectively dropping it on the target with style.
>>44185893
Well, at least Elves can now get Int to Damage along with Dex to hit for thier racial weapons
>Longsword Dex Magi Intensifies
>>44185893
Well, for what matters, there's one that let's you double the Weapon Training bonus to damage while wielding Finesse weapons with STR to damage. Add in Duelist Gloves for another +2, and it's a good comparison vs dex to damage.
>>44185912
All I've ever wanted was just to be able to make a Dex-based Polearm fighter who didn't have to forgo max Dex because you absolutely need Str to be able to damage anything.
The Dex-to-Hit on polearms is part of it, sure, but unless you want to fuck with a +0 damage bonus, you're still MAD all day.
Int to, because if you're remotely sane you're playing a Lore Warden.
>>44185356
You might have read it on their forums.
Honestly, basically everything except the blacksmith thing was said elsewhere before now anyway, and that's the problem - the article didn't really say anything new or exciting or touch on what people actually WANT to hear about (i.e. hints and clues to how he died and why). It just codified some of what was already known, and retconned Mythic Realms and the Starstone.
Two pages of the latest Pathfinder COMIC spoiled more about Aroden than the article did (and, incidentally, the article mentioned the same thing that was in the comic, so whoever was stupid enough to put said comic pages up as a preview managed to torpedo that "surprise").
>>44185452
Sitting in the crow's nest of his ship (he's the captain) in a folding chair with his feet up and a bottle of rum.
>>44185844
Weapon Master get nice things too since they can take Advance Weapon Training as bonus feat.
>>44186104
Bit it only affects thier chosen Weapon for the class, so some of them become pointless.
>>44185844
Paizo's actually already done that, though admittedly buried it in their huge list of FAQs. Here you go, bud:
http://paizo.com/paizo/faq/v5748nruor1fm#v5748eaic9qto
It even specifically calls out things that "effectively" replace Weapon Training in the examples. As long as it acts exactly like Weapon Training for whatever weapon it specifies then it counts for shit that needs Weapon Training as a prereq.
The most common example of this was the dueling gloves or whatever.
Guys i'm thinking about letting my players choose only between casters in my new campaign. Oracle, Cleric, Witch, Wizard, Sorcerer, Druid. Is is too unbalanced? Party of 5
>>44186200
nah, fucking do it
its only shitty when people are mixed in a party, like cleric/wizards with rogues and fighters
all tier 1s would be pretty good
>>44186200
shaman, arcanist and psychic too, right? and you're making sure the spontaneous casters aren't a class level behind on 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th, 8th, and 9th level spells?
>>44186132
>Example: The dragoon (fighter) archetype (Ultimate Combat) has an ability called "spear training," which requires the dragoon to select "spears" as his weapon training group, and refers to his weapon training bonus (even though this bonus follows a slightly different progression than standard weapon training). Therefore, this ability counts as weapon training for abilities that improve weapon training, such as gloves of dueling (Advanced Player's Guide), which increase the wearer's weapon training bonus.
>Example: The archer (fighter) archetype gets several abilities (such as "expert archer") which replace weapon training and do not otherwise refer to the weapon training ability. Therefore, this ability does not count as weapon training for abilities that improve weapon training (such as gloves of dueling). This is the case even for the "expert archer," ability which has a bonus that improves every 4 fighter levels, exactly like weapon training.
> Therefore, this ability does not count as weapon training for abilities that improve weapon training
Unfortunately, so far to my searching, only the Dagoon has any wording that refers to it as a Weapon Training Bonus. Meaning its only the Dragoon whou can use the new stuff, and all the other archetypes are still SOL.
>>44186132
The problem is that it doesn't say it counts for prereqs there, only for the purposes of things that would improve the original.
>>44186110
But the one that matter like versatile training doesn't really care about that.
>>44185210
A hilarious combo is to do it with Paladin using unsanctioned knowledge. You get Smite on each shot, and you have full BAB.
>>44186233
Well it's better than a total shit-out-of-luck.
A DM's more likely to look at that and go 'yeah alright' than they are to knuckle down and look at the precise wording.
And of those who DO look at the precise wording, a lot of them would still let it count because fuck why not, the RAI is clearly there, and they're a Fighter, WMH or not.
>>44185074
>>44185071
>>44185052
>>44185210
And people tell me bard isn't a blasting list.
>>44185210
Hm
Barbarian or Fighter
>>44185133
i'm still looking for the updated statblocks. I wanna see a BBEG Kineticist.
>>44186455
barbarian. trade heavy armor for rage. and rage is worthwhile.
>>44186455
Invulnerable Rager Unchained Barbarian and take all the damage reduction increase abilities.
Have fun laughing as monsters do literal 0 damage to you. Double it up with Human FCB + Superstition and laugh at puny spellcasters.
>>44186403
> Play Thundercaller Bard
> Standard Action : Sonic Thrust
> Move Action : Thundercall
> Swift Action : Thundercall
I heard you like blasting so I put more blasting into your blasting.
Wait, are monks still not proficient with their unarmed strikes, or am I just missing the line?
>Monks are proficient with the brass knuckles, cestus, club, crossbow (light or heavy), dagger, handaxe, javelin, kama, nunchaku, quarterstaff, sai, shortspear, short sword, shuriken, siangham, sling, spear and temple sword.
Unarmed strikes are simple weapons, and improved unarmed strike doesn't grant proficiency.
>>44187356
If you wanted to be a furious pedant...
Unarmed strikes are like Natural Weapons, people are automatically proficient in them if they have them.
It's just that unarmed strikes are worse natural weapons, so you have the necessity for Improved Unarmed.
>>44187475
The humanoid subtype isn't listed as being proficient in their natural weapons, though. They're listed as having proficiency with all simple weapons, or as per class.
>Some creatures do not have natural attacks. These creatures can make unarmed strikes just like humans do. See Table: Natural Attacks by Size for typical damage values for natural attacks by creature size.
>>44186228
No, only that classes. Crb and Apg only
>>44187543
>The humanoid subtype isn't listed as being proficient in their natural weapons, though.
That's because everyone is automatically proficient with their natural weapons, full stop. It's not a property of your type.
>>44187572
What do you means by unbalance? All fullcaster party can do whatever they want even in rusty dagger shank town.
>>44187603
And the rules quote from Natural Attacks separates unarmed strikes from natural attacks.
>Unarmed strikes do not count as natural weapons (see Combat).
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/weapons/weapon-descriptions/strike-unarmed
>>44187633
Yeah, bad use of words sorry. Can they survive the first levels?
>>44187683
All the Divine Caster can be build as melee/martial. Cleric Oracle Druid has D8 and has access to Animal Companion (start out at 2HD so they has more average HP than Fighter).
They should be fine.
1st party only
Level 5 cavalier with +3 charisma and a mount
What can I do to maximize the benefits of leadership before I take it at 7?
Have you ever played as one if the weirder races like trox, caligni, or wyrwood?
>>44188167
Never.
I did get to play a mothfolk once, though.
>>44185526
Slavery is confirmed non-evil, as Sarenrae and her followers practice it.
>>44187964
You need to commit deeds to increase your reputation, and avoid things that would lower your standing in the eyes of your cohort targets. It's up to the GM to decide really. If you are a thief that has never been caught, your GM might not be keeping track of you gaining a reputation. In character from a non meta perspective how do you justify gaining a reputation with theives but negatives with Paladins even though you have never been caught? Well your cohort could be an Npc used as a contact in a heist, or you could have nickname among theives like "ghost hand robber" because they hear stories of a thief who seemingly stole from a safe without opening it, and your cohort has a gut feeling it's you. Meanwhile the Paladins will be "I've got a bad feeling about this guy" or "I heard things about you but not enough good things".
But it's literally just build a good reputation. If you are a champion of justice and want an evil douce bag cohort, too much of a "good" reputation will make it hard. Similarly if you have a practice of slaughtering puppies in public daily your reputation will be bad with the LG cleric you wanted as a healbot but good with the LE necromancer cleric that pretends to be a good guy.
>>44188332
I need a source to show my GM.
Since Desert Domain's Servant of the Sands is an Spell-like ability. You shouldn't have to pay for offering (material component) in the first place right?
>>44188341
You could have just said "roleplay" and cut out the alignment. A good cavalier could easily gain a reputation as a jouster or dragonslayer if they act right.
>>44188332
What is it with all the Good gods and being huge fucking hypocrites? I'm looking at you, Iomedae.
>>44188332
Citation needed, though this doesn't surprise me.
For the tier list is the false priest sorcerer the archetype or prestige class?
>>44188332
>tfw Not!Islam (Sarenrae) is a vibrant, hugely successful and fast spreading Neutral Good religion
>tfw Not!Christianity (Aroden) is decaying, ineffective, very dead and solidly Lawful Neutral
Thanks Paizo.
>>44188495
Time for Aroden to have a crusade.
>>44188432
ARchetype.
Never prestige class. There are very few prestige classes that don't drop tier from the original class.
>>44188332
Slavery itself is more Law/Chaos. Chaotic God like Milani hates it (she quite pissed at Sarenrae for being good god that accept slavery too).
>>44188527
Still no citation on Sarenrae using it. Gonna call BS if someone doesn't provide one.
>>44188378
Gotta have a flaw. Like Shelyn being okay with cheating.
Why bother yourself with the hypocrisy and bullshit of other gods when you can just worship Rovagug?
>>44188504
Aroden is hardcore dead and Iomedae's crusade is the plot point of Hell's Vengeance, the one where you whip those LG Crusaders a new one.
>>44188543
Wait, I thought HV was going to be the Evil AP
>>44188531
See Milani, one of her gripes against Sarenrae is that she supports, or tolerates, slavery.
>>44188555
It is.
You get to fuck up Lomodae's figurative shit.
>>44188555
It is, the primary antagonists of HV is the Glorious Reclamation, a LG Iomedaean Crusade.
>>44188592
>>44188597
Oh! Okay then. For a second I was actually worried.
>>44188531
http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2m4yv?Sarenrae-and-Slavery-how-can-they-coexist
JJ made a good post about it.
>>44188638
>Slavery and Neutral Good can coexist, even when the goddess is about redemption
>Gender roles and Lawful Good cannot coexist, even when the God is about family and traditional communities.
>>44188667
The doublethink is real.
>>44188592
Do we get to trumpet her?
>>44188752
No, sadly.not yet at least
Such that everyone can see it:
*NEW PLAYTEST ALERT*
*NEW PLAYTEST ALERT*
*NEW PLAYTEST ALERT*
The author of the DESTRUCTION SPHERE handbook for Spheres of Power has elected to release their handbook for open playtesting:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1c3LPA0j7qKpLFP2lOr3I9X9VUpH8vOvs17pKmTCj36M/edit?usp=sharing
Known issues:
>Doomblade mechanics
>Elemental Scion: streamlined method for accessing class abilities without spellpoint cost
>Spellcrafting: DCs
>Improved elemental blade feat: interplay with bound energy arsenal trick (too much damage?)
>Bound Energy Arsenal Trick: interplay with improved elemental blade
Please leave comments in the Google document. The author of this playtest is, unfortunately, reluctant to have "4chan in his inbox," so they will not be fielding questions on /pfg/.
That said, it is very much worth noting that the direction the author is taking the Destruction sphere in is "Destruction simply is not that astounding for damage, so it should be used as a versatile battlefield control sphere instead."
I personally find this to be a disagreeable direction, since battlefield control is what half of the other spheres do, and Destruction really should be the iconic sphere for directly dismantling enemies in a variety of ways. Still, there is little that can be done about it.
Some of you might find the create-your-own-blast-type rules appealing.
Which Druid Domain should I go for?
Ash get to play as Blaster a few time per day.
Plain get Haste and Pounce
Desert get Plannar Ally (and maybe Wishes?)
>>44188752
I'd play an epic-level mythic campaign where the goal is to take down Iomedae.
>>44188858
Might as well take out most of the gods, while you're at it. Drunk guy can stay, he's pretty cool.
>>44188803
Will it no longer be crap?
Because destruction sphere is pretty pathetic in output, even with some CL shenanigans.
I enjoy pitting my players against one trick pony builds that would have severely limited use as anything but an NPC.
I've done Mutagenic Mauler Spiky Grappleman, Stack Intimidate For Free Attacks man and Trip With Reach Consistently From Behind Lines man. Anyone got any ideas? I wanted to do some guy that uses a staff of burning hands as a flamethrower but put it down after the lack of any way to buff the spell featwise.
>>44188900
Destruction is being pushed as a "battlefield control + incidental damage" tool in this handbook rather than "destroy enemies," as you can see from the foreword.
>FOREWORD
>“You think destructive magic is just about burning your enemies to death, don't you? You wield a fireball and feel unstoppable. Let me tell you right now, that right there is the heart of the wizard's arrogance that annoys everyone so much, especially me. No matter how good at it you are, you will never cut down your enemies faster than a skilled swordsman. You're not supposed to.
>“Think like a wizard, idiot. The magic of destruction is so much more than blasting things. Have you ever blocked an enemy's advance with a wall of air, isolating them from their support? Or grounded a dragon so your melee allies could make quick work of it? Burning your enemies to a crisp is always satisfying, but the best magic-users know how to cripple their enemies at the same time, or control the shape of the battlefield to give their allies an advantage.
>“Destruction is its own form or art, apprentice. By the time I'm done with you, you'll never look at a fireball the same way again.” - From the introductory lecture by Archmage Throros of the Imperial Warmage Academy to an incoming class of apprentices.
>That's what this book is for. Not only does it expand the options available to a dedicated destruction user, it also gives tools to help them really make the most of their magic, and help game masters to vary encounters, modifying old creatures, to use destruction magic tactically. It also gives tools to those dedicated to a particular theme to be able to remain true to their theme without finding themselves useless in an uncomfortable number of situations.
Again, I disagree with this direction, but that is what the author has chosen for Destruction.
It is possible to *destroy* with Destruction by raising CL high, but it is not much better than other spheres with equal CL optimization.
>>44188900
even eventually adding 1.5x your level (more or less doubling the damage of those d6s) on single target for single blasts is certainly an upgrade, but you're still not actually a good blaster, and at the cost of evasion, improved evasion, non-knowledge skills.... that fucking hurts, man.
>>44188858
So would I, Lomodae is ass.
>>44189000
There's a couple of kineticist knockoffs (gather energy) that help a bit, but most of the control effects are either rather weak (and certainly do turn your damage into "an incidental", or require spell points.
I'll admit it's an improvement to destruction's previous capabilities, if you're willing to really go deep into it... But... bit of a "firearms" issue then; you're spending so much of your character just to do what anyone can do if they bother to grab a weapon.
>>44189085
>Please leave comments in the Google document.
>>44189118
he's gonna get 4chan in his inbox, and he is gonna LIKE IT.
Unchained Monk question.
Is it possible to two hand a fist and still flurry of blows for the 1.5x str bonus?
>>44189143
Unarmed Strike are light weapon. You don't get x1.5 STR bonus from wielding light weapon two-handed.
Would a 3rd level necro spell for arcane casters be OP if it mimics breath of life, but with much less healing, it's only temp HP, and you take equal damage to what you heal?
>>44189143
Use dragon style and ferocity
Gets you x1.5 Str to punches, except the first one, which is x2
>>44189237
Unfortunately I already need Ascetic Style, and I can't go MOMS.
>>44189000
I fucking hate that holy shit. Do you have his email so I can send him horseporn FUCK HIM for pushing this save or suck nonsense. THAT'S NOT DESTRUCTION THAT'S FUCKING CONTROL!
>>44189291
Maybe instead of sending him horse porn you could post a reasoned argument in favor of more blasting power instead of control? The guy writing the book (who is not me, let's be clear) is a pretty reasonable dude. I think you'd get a lot more out of him from just talking to him like a person.
>>44189320
Seconded. I know the guy, he did very good work during the Akasha playtest (and is one of the main reasons other than Ssalarn that the Guru turned out well). Just like any other feedback, reasoned arguments are better responses and more likely to be followed.
That said, good morning /pfg/
>>44189368
morning psybomb
how goes steelforge?
we got piledrivers yet?
Is the Dwarven Double Waraxe supposed to be dwarf-only?
>>44189280
Are you taking another archetype with UMonk? MoMS is one of the few that you can take with it since it only replaces Flurry and bonus feats.
>>44189435
Dwarf can use them as martial weapon. It's exotic weapon for everyone else.
What race do you want to see get a racial archtype, and for what?
>>44189499
Hamatulatsu Master, also one of the few which works.
>>44189291
>>44189320
>>44189368
Well I posted my bitching, with less insults. I'll probably get into nitty gritty stuff later. Just saying there are other spheres that do control better mechanically and thematically alongside default spell-casting, an how I fail to see why would you take the offensive sphere and make it all about not dealing damage.
Ideally, destruction would be HP damage+minor incidental effects, not the other way around. Maybe I'm the odd one out on this but aside from thematic and skillpoints, how is guy throwing fireballs around all day not basically "a martial", both rely on doing HP damage to deal with there problems.
>>44189570
From what I understand, the problem was that other spheres did the -HP job better and the writer just did the best he could, but I dunno if that's true or not.
>>44189557
Maybe dip 3 levels into Free-Style Fighter from WMH? That gives you the ability to use two styles simultaneously, on top of a bit of martial flexibility.
>>44189570
Well I kind of agree with you that Destruction should primarily be about destroying things so you're not the odd man out. I'd just rather see your (our) concerns addressed in a positive manner rather than them ignored because they had pictures of horse dicks attached.
>>44189595
Cutting my monk progression seems a poor trade.
>>44189603
I know. I was just having a knee-jerk reaction, I'm normally calmer than that. Holiday stress and all the bullshit made me blow up a bit, but I'm good. Strongest word I used in the comment was displeasure.
>>44189543
Trox with brawler or one of the occult classes
Reptoid with mesmerize or psychic
Caligni with bard, skald, wizard, or summoner
Wyrwood with rogue or shaman
>>44189606
get a robe
why do you want ascetic style?
create a shitty meme class or archtype
>>44189606
>>44189654
Better question, why do you want hamatulatsu master?
>>44189677
is he the guy/gal who has been posting that build in the last few threads?
the asmodean monk idea
personally, a moms monk with dragon style/ferocity for pure damage, and another for flavor, combo with twf feats, is pretty good
>>44189654
>>44189677
This is the build I have so far:
"Lawful Evil Human Female Unchained Monk
Hamatulatsu Master archetype
Dual Talent
Scholar of the Great Beyond (planes)
*insert campaign trait*
STR 17 DEX 14 CON 14 INT 12 WIS 16 CHA 7
Level 1: Belier's Bite
Level 1B: Weapon Focus Unarmed
Level 2B: Improved Grapple
Level 3: Ascetic Style (retrain Weapon Focus Unarmed into Cestus prior to this)
Level 4: Qinggong for Barkskin Ki Power
Level 5: Toughness?, Flying Kick
Level 6B: Hamatulatsu, ?? Ki Power?
Level 7: Hamatula Strike
Level 8: ?? Ki Power?
Level 9: Greater Grapple, ?? Style Strike?
Level 10B: Impaling Critical, ?? Ki Power?
The idea is to take advantage of Ascetic Style to have monk unarmed damage with a 17-20/x2 cestus with impaling critical. Hamatula Strike usage is planned to be Flurry of Blows into a grapple, and then releasing the grapple on my next turn and then flurrying to regrapple, effectively neutering the opponents turn, while still giving me my flurry attacks.
I'm aware of the Scorpion shenanigans I can have with a rope-dart thanks to Hamatula Strike now as well, and plan to use that, provided the DM is fine with it."
>>44189704
That is exactly me, haha.
>>44189603
>>44189629
Perhaps I had missed something, but this Destruction handbook contains no talents that allow your blasts to be ally-friendly.
The Epicenter talent allows your blasts to be self-friendly, but that does not account for your friends.
At the very least, we could push for something like this, perhaps along with generic +damage talents that help improve the Destruction sphere's blasting niche.
>>44189732
Gotta agree there.
Reflex-useless is an annoyance, but "hit allies" is a problem when using AoEs.
Destruction's not destructive enough, destruction costs too many SPs to do anything save "pretend you're a shittier crossbow", and destruction's not team-friendly enough.
I hate to say this but this booklet is the one chance that sphere has to get its fixes out. Even if new talents obsolete some of the original SoP, it's gotta be done, because destruction just can't stand on its own as a valid thing to do right now.
>>44189669
New Mesmertist Archetype
>Memtic Master
>Memecraft:The Memetic Master is a master of creating infectious ideas that he can spread. The memetic master can create a scroll of any Psychic spell he knows that requires a will save. Whenever a creature fails a save against either a Will Save caused by the Mesmerist or a scroll penned by the Mesmerist they must make a will save or shout a string of words that infects other enemies with the same effect. When an enemy is in earshot of an enemy under this effect they must also make a Will Save or be affected by the spell.
>this replaces hypnotic stare
There a literally meme class.
>>44188803
>>44189000
Eh, I'm okay with that. Afterall, as a martial low caster you already have good damage output from combat, especially with the one talent for Weapon infusion, and fore mid- and high-casters, giving them access to the ability to outdamage a martial despite lower BAB I'd somewhat silly.
Granted, they should have a talent that boosts damage based upon BAB to help Mageknights and such
But so far, from your description it sound somewhat acceptable, if a bit pointless since Destruction Sphere itself already had a bunch of cool riders and shape options (though my personal gripe is that many of them should of cost less to use) But I'll read the doc and see for myself. However my initial response so far is your being a reactionary autist as usual
>>44189797
I'm sorry for being autistic about Destruction not being good at destruction.
>>44189797
>martial low caster
This is Destruction handbook, not low caster handbook.
>>44189725
Ah I see, so it's not really about the damage and it's more about the grappling, using FoB to increase your chances
>>44189796
I always wanted to make a Mememeticist PrC (and by meme, I mean the the original definition, not maymay). I just can't figure out what abilities to give though.
>>44189840
>not reading all the way
Okay.
>>44189842
Yea, but I can't deny that my damage looks really poor so I'm trying to find a way to help with that. The Belier's Bite will make me nasty as hell at low levels, that 1d4 bleed can be critical, but eventually it'll be so minor, and 2d6+6+1d4 bleed is just chump change for lvl 10.
If I went lore warden/myrmidon into Mage hunter could I use Wisdom as my casting modifier to work off of the Wisdom from Myrmidon?
>>44189934
Nobody brought up low casters in the first place. Why are you suddenly talking about low casters?
>>44189937
Yes
>>44189669
A vapor wave bard that specializes in making high-tech good, or one that preforms death grips music to deal damage and status effects.
>>44189961
I'm talking about them in regards to the usual BAB levels they have and thier overall combat/damage capabilities, especially in concern to Destruction Damage.
Then again, if you had actually read the post, then you would have noticed that
>>44189404
Steelforge goes well, I'm working now on a bit of a DM tool for methods of handling the Big Six. First version came out like an essay, needs rewriting.
On the pile driver thing... it's one reason I'm here. Looking at two ways to adjust pricing on Nonmagical Item Enhancement, need to see what people think.
1) remove the "slots" thing, adjust prices upward to compensate.
2) shift it to a system of Plusses, much like magical. The power will be SLIGHTLY less per point, but with the advantage of not being magic.
Either way, the goal is for a maxed +10/+10 to take around half of the Max WBL.
>>44190037
>It's okay if Destruction doesn't do good damage because you have full BAB anyway!
You realize this is what you're saying, right?
>>44190038
Have you guys done some changes to the Angelwing Cloak so it doesn't look as obviously evil anymore?
