Can /tg/ redpill me on the Alpha Legion? Are they secretly loyalist even after having betrayed the Emperor? How does that even work?
>>43859024
It's likely that some of them did legitimately fall to chaos over time.
Maybe.
Yes.
No.
Maybe?
>>43859024
They dismissed this lie and worship death
In one of the books after Legion (where the loyalist AL idea was introduced) Alpharius mentions that most of the marines haven't been informed of the true reason for the AL switching to Horus's side. If that remained the case, then it stands to reason that most of the AL would in fact have gone to Chaos in the end.
>>43859024
Alpha Legion is so shattered and disseparate at this point that it hardly matters what their Primarchs' original intentions were. If you run them, you can pretty much take your pick.
Kind of the same deal as with Night Lords. They were "just" renegade for a long time. But they've spent ten thousand years cut off from Imperial propaganda in a universe where you're constantly and actively trying to be influenced by literal telepathic space-gods. You might be able to make a case for the Night Lords retaining that, but at this point you can pretty safely run them as full-on Chaos.
All the loyalist Alpha Legion are pretending to be chaos in order to backstab them.
All the traitor Alpha Legion are pretending to be loyal in order to backstab them.
Soon there will be no one left but Omegron pretending to be Alpharius.
>>43859177
>Soon there will be no one left but Omegron pretending to be Alphariusin order to backstab him.
>>43859024
>redpill
Anyway... Nobody knows the truth or maybe they actually do or maybe they told us already or maybe there's something more behind the scenes or it's all an elaborate ruse.
They're a mystery wrapped in a... They're like a puzzle box stuffed in the middle tesseract turducken hypercube of lies and misdirection and bullshit and espionage and they like it that way. Their actions during the Heresy just kept upping their sneaky levels and considering they haven't stopped existing, there's no reason not to assume they haven't kept sharpening those skills for the 10,000 years since.
>>43859024
Pussies all of them. Their Primarch got his shit wrecked in a fight against Roboute Guilliman who's honestly pretty weak physically compared to other Primarchs (though still a cool guy.)
Kind of?
>>43859024
They're openly garbage and mary sue tier, how's that for a redpill?
>Oh, all of our marines are better than yours, for no real reason.
>Oh, we have a space fleet hundreds of times bigger than any other legion, for no real reason.
>Oh, we have blackmail dirt of everyone and everything, for no real reason.
>Oh, that loyalist chapter? It's actually just us in disguise. How did we do that? Who knows!
Everything about them is them getting whatever they need without any rational reason behind it, they just have it because they need it. Every story about them is just them going "Nuh uh, invisible force field!" for everything.
Fuck the alpha legion and every fucker who's like "Hurr durr I am alpharius, hurr durr all your guys are secretly alpha legion, alpharius-kun."
They're a shitty meme legion with a meme that's worse than blood for the blood god.
>>43859219
I cant remember where I read it but theres one of those blurbs of happenings that says the AL once turned an entire chapter into traitors/Alpha Legionnaires by polluting their psycho-indoctrination with subliminal messages that were activated in a crucial moment.
>>43859250
That's what they want you to think. For all we know, it was a body double that Girlyman killed on Eskrador; Alpharius does that, you know.
>>43859349
>Eskrador
It never happened, its a story put in the annals of UM by the Alpha Legion and passed down as tradition so no one can question its veracity but it never happened.
>>43859275
>they're mostly harmless
Alpha legion shill detected
>>43859349
>>43859375
Of course, because it's impossible for alpha legion to ever loose a fight. They're too perfect to ever have a fault or failure.
Isn't that right, alpharius-kun? :^)
>>43859275
your jealousy is showing mate
>>43859404
That's Omegon you're talking to, Alpharius is over there..
I'd like to take this time to say that however bad the Alpha Legion is the Space Wolves are worse.
That is all.
>>43859404
>too perfect to ever have a fault or failure
>LaughingBludRehvens.holo
>>43859275
This tbqh my familia
>>43859415
Not even jealous, but their whole gimmick has become so overblown that they turned into the batman of 40k in terms of fluff. They're written by fanboys that never let them be flatfooted or caught off guard and can always do the job of more powerful individuals better and faster, and they're able to do all of this "For secret reasons". They've just become a mary sue legion that draw in people who like to pretend that it's impossible for their favourite legion to ever lose at anything.
>>43859275
>worse than blood for the blood god
>worse
I don't think that word means what you think it means.
>>43859024
sooooo.....
Alphiruis meet up with mystic space eldar dude #9 in one of the books, dude said the imperium must collapse in order to be reborn as a new empire and thereby saving all the galaxy from chaos and nids.
Being a bro who wasn't retarded like the rest of his brothers he realized that the imperium was too big and too much was already set in stone to just remake it.So he went sneaky and offically joined the traitors (while low key being loyalist) to slowly infiltrate all of chaos and learn its secrets so that when the fall finally happened they would pull out their ace in the hole and save the imperials from certain doom.
He tried to warn Rober guilliman but the fucker was too asshat to understand the subtle message under his words when they fought one on one.Alphirus died trying to relay the message in vain, but Omeg would carry on the plan.
While it may seem like the AL are spread out and unorganized like any other chaos force they are actually guerrilla stylizing it (as is their usual sneakyness).Omeg is still about planning the imperums 'controlled' collapse and their unexpected counter attack aginst chaos.
>>43859526
>Rober guilliman
>not Rober Guile-man
>>43859565
Sorry but I don't care much about the smurfs or their by the books leader.
>>43859512
I'll admit I'm probably bias because I know some really insufferable alpha legion fans, but even so their whole fluff has just been turned into nothing but snowflake garbage.
>>43859275
Fuck off, Omegron.
>>43859349
I want it to be real, but that's mostly because I'd like to see the primarch body count get upped as much as possible. Outright kill anyone that's useless post-heresy. Kill all of the loyalists except maybe Guilliman since he's preserved at the brink of death anyway. Kill Perturabo because his contribution post-heresy is "destroyed a forge world once" when there are bottom-tier chaos lords with more to their name. Kill Lorgar so that the actual reason he's stitting in a basement since there heresy is because he's now an empty husk with Erebus occasionally pulling the strings. I guess the four bound to the chaos gods can stay since they're basically a higher tier of greater demons now with being primarchs once upon a time little more than fluff. Get rid of all the giant do-nothing manbabbies so that the link between 30k and 40k is that much more erased and drive home the point that what's left is vultures on a carcass more than ever.
These guys are still a thing?
I must've killed their primarch like 200 times already.
>>43859606
Honestly I actually prefer Omegon, specifically for that one short story where he went around team killing alpha legionnaires and got his guys to quit that "I am alpharius" bullshit.
>>43859640
is that what you call it Roboute? We still have the picts
>>43859663
I think you have your picts mixed up. I swear I killed 200 Alpha Legion Primarchs.
>>43859299
It's true, they sabotaged their whole recruitment, perhaps even fostering their recruitment numbers, and then set up a perfect assault against the chapter, timing it so they could just walk away with half their chapter.
CSM have to recruit somehow, and those that spend too much time in the Eye or around Chaos stuff get mutated and make more.
>>43859705
Well they could just make a deal with Bill
>>43859072
I don't know.
Can you repeat the question?
>>43859663
Felt Obligated
Would Omegron technically count as 1 of the 2 missing primachs?
>inb4 Gork and Mork
>>43859888
yes, yes this pleases me
>>43859496
Why are you trying to avoid the filter for your nonsense, senpai? Extra lame of you desu. If you're gonna type like a retard you should take your medicine.
>>43859917
>Omegron
No such primarch exists so naturally there would still be two open primarch spots.Alpharius and Omegron were supposed to be one primarch who became twins when the Emperor "accidentally" added Chemical X to the recipe.
Yes...
No....
Maybe....
Can I phone a friend?
>>43859024
Alpha Legion are what writers pull out of their ass when they can't find a good reason for a backstabber or a saboteur. Just, "Whoops, he was Alpha Legion! Guess you were fooled the whole time, you silly marines!"
>>43859210
Something something your humble spymaster.
>>43859917
I'd like to think at least one of those primarchs tried to march his legion out of the Emperors bullshit and got blown to pieces for turning his back. It would make more sense why Horus was afraid of Emp's tyranny.
Alpha legion is the equivalent of pic related whenever they show up anywhere.
>>43859072
>>43859874
>>43860013
>>43860002
Thanks, doc.
>>43859743
I really want to make a character like him in BC. Any suggestions?
>>43859995
Damn it Slanesh!
>>43860008
Dear god...
It all makes sense now...
>>43860158
What the fuck is the sauce of that? I've been wondering that since I was ten.
>>43860499
Nazca, incan warrior reincarnation animu
>>43859024
>redpill me
I want this meme to stop.
>>43860221
Always watching.
Especially when you are alone, in the bathroom.
>>43860103
In the fluff it is hinted that in both cases it was due to catastrophic gene-seed corruption/break down.
>>43859640
>Implying Guilliman isn't the third Triplet Primarch of the Ultra Legion
>Implying there aren't 3 missing Legions, but the XXth just had half their forces dress up as the XIIIth
>>43860158
You're not the boss of my now!
Alpharius has actually constructed this galaxy out of cardboard, wood and cloth.
He is waiting for the right moment to reveal that it is in fact a very carefully planned killzone, where he will also reveal that he is the emperor, all the primarchs are alive and loyal, the horus heresy was actually a trap to lure the nids and other forces into a more central position in the galaxy where they will release superweapons equal to that of the aether orb.
>>43859504
They have been found flat footed before. In Scars Alpharius's blockade couldn't do shit to the WS because they had no idea what they were capable of.
is betrayal at Calth good for starting Alpha Legion?
>>43862563
The fleet that was multiple times larger than they should ever be able to have, but just somehow had for no real reason.
>>43862404
He stole that idea from Blazing Saddles!
>Tyranids finally fall on terra and assault the Emperor's palace
>The golden throne suddenly falls over
>It was a huge cardboard cutout
>>43859917
>‘The Cabal will deal directly with the primarch of the Astartes Alpha Legion,’ G’Latrro stated.
>‘You are,’ said Alpharius.
>‘With the *entire* primarch,’ said the insectoid.
>Alpharius paused. ‘You are,’ he repeated.
>‘A show of trust is perhaps in order on your part, seeing that you hold us at gunpoint?’ said G’Latrro. ‘A token to signify that true secrets can be shared between us?’
>Alpharius glowered for a moment, and then nodded. Omegon, in his gleaming, blue-black infiltrator armour, walked slowly over to stand at Alpharius’s side. Soneka and Rukhsana exchanged brief glances of confusion. Grammaticus looked up, fascinated.
>‘Cut off one head and two shall grow in its place,’ said G’Latrro. ‘Alone amongst the genic sons of the Terran Emperor, you are the only twins. You are both the primarch, one soul in two vessels.’
>>43863438
To be fair, it was stated that at least one "battle barge" there was a redeco'd heavy cargo ship. Extent that statement to
>imply
things about the rest of the fleet, and...
Citiation: just read Scars yesterday.
>>43859024
They are just rogue guys who do whatever they want.
Loyalist/Traitor, it doesn't matter because those affiliations are just tools for them.
Its why all the naive anons who are trying to lump them into some 2D good guy/bad guy category are dumb as fuck. How complicated is it to see that they are on their OWN team first and foremost. And that they are loyal to each other, barring some Alpharius Omegon tension. The Alpha Legion are true freelancers who give no fucks. Which in this universe of narrow organization and overwhelming hierarchy is confusing to the manchildren who don't understand.
Rogue military units are not that hard to understand.
>>43864759
... so what your saying is Alpharius/Omegon are Naked Snake/Punished Snake, and the Alpha Legion are Militis Sans Frontiers?
>>43864355
I read Scars, and the alpha legion were just as bullshit in that book as they always are.
>>43859995
Have another.
>>43860939
I know, anon. We all do.
>>43859024
You need to understand the plan to understand their motives. The plan is to annihilate Chaos by making Chaos win. That is, Chaos can only be defeated by destroying the very thing it feeds on: Psychic Life. So, they joined Chaos to destroy Chaos, which makes them enemies of the Imperium. There's no need for every Legionnaire to know the true motives of their mission, just that they need to accomplish it as efficiently as possible.
>>43859275
>They're openly garbage and mary sue tier,
You mean like EVERY SINGLE FUCKING SPACE MARINE CHAPTER?
>>43859024
They're loyalists in the sense that they want the Imperium to lose and Chaos to win.
Because they thought that Chaos will magically fade away if it wins.
>>43859089
Cold blood night and serpent's breath?
>>43865275
>dat teeny tiny tear drop
>>43859275
>Better marines for no reason
Each legionnaire was trained to operate at an individual level, which means they need to be trained to preform at some degree in every specialized role.
There's also the possibility that Omegon wasn't scattered like the rest of his brothers and grew up on Terra when his legion was still forming. The Luna Wolves were reported to have a very potent gene seed which could be contributed to Horus being reunited with his legion very early on. It wouldn't come as a surprise that if the primarchs grew with their legions the marines would have a much stronger genetic ties with said primarchs and be plain better.
Take the Raven Guard and their mucking around with their gene seed as an example before shit hit the fan. The first legionaries after making them purer were much closer to Corax physically than all other marines before them.
>Space fleet?
Only fleet I remember is the Alpha, Beta, and a fake fleet of cargo ships. I would like to know where that tid bit is coming from.
>>43859024
Some fell to chaos.
Some are still loyal.
Some are just fighting anyone to prove they're the best.
Some just want to see the galaxy burn.
>>43860207
Buy Medicae, SL: Chymistry, Trade: Chymist, Master Chiurgeon, and maybe Trade: Armorer, then bitch at your gm to somehow get you mechanicus implants or counts as to get medicae mechadendrite
Besides that it's mostly on you to be the medical madman
I don't think we can ever know. Mostly because we have no sense of how strongly Alpharius' original goals still live in in his gene-sons.
Say what you will about the Night Lords, but their situation is far more clear cut. Some continue to follow the ways of their Primarch and the goal of actually winning the Long War to tear down the Imperium, while others have given in to Chaos and its powers and promises. You even have marines surviving untainted to the years of modern 40k from the Great Crusade to show that it's possible.
But the Alpha Legion? You can't be sure. All of their actions seem uncoordinated but could be part of a master plan, the legion Tzeentch would have adopted if he hadn't ruffled his feathers over magic. There is no way to distinguish the actions of a Chaos-tainted Alpha Legionnaire from one that is still pure and for the Emperor in secret. They may have interconnected cells, or be independent warbands that have long since lost all contact. There could even be infiltrators in their ranks - it's not like it's too hard, when gene-seed of every stripe is theoretically available to everyone and Chaos apothecaries and techmarines can reengineer a perfect Alpha Legionnaire loyal to their own desires, complete with bald pate. And sometimes you see an Alpha Legion warband working for the Black Legion or something.
>>43859024
I imagine at this point even the alpha legion doesn't know the "true" loyalties of the alpha legion. Half of what they do is probably hidden witchhunts within the alpha legion to try and intrigue their way into discovering the affiliations of other alpha legionaries and get those of the "wrong" affiliation killed off, and half of what's left is hiding their true affiliation, but also not making it seem to much like they're on the other side to avoid accidental friendly fire.
>>43859275
>>43859504
>>43859404
relax your sphincter Gulliman
>>43862404
>>43863491
10/10, better than 90% of BL stuff
The bit that always got me was, why did the Alpha Legion have to be Space Marines? Other unconventional legions, Night Lords and Raven Guard I get. They're shock troops basically, they use their superhuman abilities to augment their role on the battlefield. But the Alpha Legion? Who never seem to actually fight, they're the master ruse-men who outdo the Inquisition and Tzeentch and nobody knows where their loyalties lie? Why are they space marines? They could just as well have been a Rogue Inquisition Ordo or something and it wouldn't make a bit of difference
My bet is that most alpha legion don't even know anymore. They got so involved in their scheming that even they forgot which side they are really on.
So they just keep doing what they were doing before out of routine and completely forgot why they are doing it
>>43868124
Cuz when they need to fight, they better do it good
>yourhumblespymaster.jpg
>>43859504
I think they'd have made a good Tzeentch legion myself; all those plans within plans, so deep not even their chapter masters know the truth, all for no real reason. Schemes for the sake of scheming.
>>43865320
>the plan is to let Chaos win, thus destroying it
Wow. Halo-tier "racial suicide might starve the flood - it's worth a try!" derptitude.
>you need to understand
Ah-HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! No.
You need to understand that the point at which BL shitscribble crosses the line from Grimdark into Grimderp is seen in concepts like this "plan" (as if the Evil Twin [whatta tweest!] asspull hadn't already alerted us to the imminent arrival of the Red Herring Express). You need to understand that we needn't perpetuate their awfulness.
It's enough for everyone to know that IW, NL, AL and WB didn't ALL sell their souls like the other renegade legions. Even the Luna Wolves are not canonically "wholly owned and operated" by Abaddon, so there's wiggle room in all five of those "chaos" factions - that's the "red pill" on all of them, including Alphas:
Some warbands welcome warp entities, some tolerate them and some hate what their beloved Legion became and now resist all warp influence as a result. That's just the law of averages.
Sure, people are free to "believe" whatever they want about fiction, but for cryin' out loud, can we not keep it above Tiger Beat levels of derp on /tg/?
>>43859024
>redpill me
Jews did Horus Heresy.
>>43864877
Uh yeah pretty much.
Though I suppose a better analogy would just be actual deep state secret societies or mercenary units like Bob Denard's associates who just took over the Comorros and have no loyalty except to their own.
Didn't these OP Mary Sue marines get the Primarch and Super Marine research themselves or something?
Jesus christ, a legion full of Alpharius clone Primarchs 2.0 would be gay as shit. What's next, they try to clone the Emperor to replace him with an even better Alpharius-hybrid?
>>43868124
Girlyman put it best; Space Marines are not just superhuman in physique, but in mind and willpower too.
The AL are one of the few that make use of this enhanced intellect for more than just tactics.
Also the AL's niche was probably to be the elite special forces. When conventional war doesn't work, the Big E would send these guys in.
>redpill
Feminists, Anon. Feminists. Also you should not have to wipe after you do number two.
>>43859024
It's been implied, and is probably true because GW doesn't understand subtlety. From what I understand, they avoid exposure to the Warp as much as possible and generally work by themselves.
>>43870287
If AL used the primarch gene themselves they would have won already. Shit man, newly transformed RG initiates were besting veterans the first day they walked out the apothecaries.
>>43871344
...maybe they DID win.
And all they do is just let the fighting continue to see who are the best to recruit/influence/assassinate/corrupt of all factions. Human, xenos, daemon, or machine.
My fanfic senses are tingling.
>>43859435
Space wolves are the worst legion
>>43865320
ahaha that sounds retarded
Alpha Legion are the Gray Knights.
>>43871251
Then everyone who's been deceived by chaos is secretly loyalist, desu.
>>43871512
you spelled "best" wrong.
>>43859024
started as a yes, changed to a no, but maybe its a maybe?
alpharus was loyalist, omegon was corrupted
alpharus died, or ,maybe he didnt and it was omegon. or perhaps neither.
and this is all unconfirmed, even the unconfirmed bits.
>>43863241
This is something I would also like to know, but I'm a little worried that if I do start AL, its just going to be part of a wave of tons of people playing alpha legion.
>>43868124
Because of various reasons
1)when the Emperor was around, the Inquisition didn't exist
2) when the emperor was around the assassin temples didn't exist
3)In the Emp's original project space marines were going to replace humans in all aspects of warfare, including infiltration and intelligence, so he made himself warriors for every occasion
>>43859072
This is the correct answer. Any other one is true. And false. And both.
>>43859275
Guilliman, pls.
>>43868124
>who never seem to actually fight
That's wrong. A big part of Alpha Legion tactics isn't just behind the scenes stuff. They're also brilliant military strategists who attack the enemy from multiple sides. They're big on using the military intelligence they gather to exploit their enemy's greatest weaknesses in order to achieve swift, decisive victories.
Alpharius just likes to show off sometimes and will make these overly complicated battle plans that wipe out the opposition to a man, even when a direct assault would have been the more expedient option.
>>43874403
>2) when the emperor was around the assassin temples didn't exist
Yes they did, anon.
>>43874584
What would sex with a femal eversor be like?
>>43874603
Well, the Eversor in that book was a guy. But I'd imagine it'd be quick and painful, either way.
>>43866080
>Each legionnaire was trained to operate at an individual level, which means they need to be trained to preform at some degree in every specialized role.
Which is somehow super different than what every other legion does and naturally makes every alpha legionnaire better than any other legionnaire.
>>43874584
The first assassins ever were created by Malcador to kill Horus, but were just made official. When the emps created the primarchs the temples didn't exist
>>43874630
m-muh alpharius
muh legion
Got to be one of the worst handled parts of black library's HH, which is saying a fucking lot.
>>43871461
>...maybe they DID win.
>And all they do is just let the fighting continue to see who are the best to recruit/influence/assassinate/corrupt of all factions. Human, xenos, daemon, or machine.
>My fanfic senses are tingling.
>disgust.jpeg
>>43868723
What makes you think they aren't a Tzeentch Legion? Ahriman doesn't even worship Tzeentch and is still his greatest Champion.
Btw
>Alpha Legion = Tzeentch
>Iron Warriors = Nurgle
>Night Lords = Khorne
>Word Bearers = Slaanesh
>>43874621
Just how I like it.
>>43866080
>Each legionnaire was trained to operate at an individual level
So are the fucking World Eaters. They don't fight as a team and train exclusively in fighting purely their way without regard to co-operation, but that still doesn't make every single one of them into the best warriors out of all the legions.
And if anything wouldn't a legion that focuses on bringing out the strengths of everyone and working in co-ordinated co-operation would easily outdo a team of lone wolves.
>>43874762
Tzeentch is just alpha legion propaganda
>>43874814
Yep. That's why the Ultramarines (and previously, the Emperor's Children) are canonically the best legions.
>>43874635
Did you read the book? That's definitely not what happened. The Assassin Clades (precursors to the Temples; they only weren't called that to avoid religious association) were definitely already in operation well before the team that was sent after Horus.
>>43874678
>>43874678
>Anything worse than Perpetuals.
>Anything worse than mustache-twirling Horus.
>Anything worse than Battle for the Abyss
Please get your horrible taste in check, anon.
>>43859024
What's the biggest ruse the AL ever pulled?
Any recommended books that feature them?
>>43874930
>Perpetuals were introduced in the first alpha legion HH novel
>>43874930
How can you post without text, anon?
>Any recommended books that feature them?
Legion
Deliverance Lost
The Seventh Serpent
The Serpent Beneath (Short Story in The Primarchs)
>>43874972
Just because they were introduced in Legion doesn't mean they have anything to do with the Alpha Legion itself. Regardless, they were fine in Legion and only got horrible later in the series when they were hamfisted into so much of the plot.
>>43875054
I know they're not related, but it's funny that two pretty shit things happened to be both published into the HH line at the same time.
>>43874814
I don't ever recall any AL marine besting a WE in melee. I think your hyping them up with what level of Mary sue you think the're at.
There can't be an Alpha Legion discussion without fanboys spouting memes or buttmad shitposters.
Being Alpharius is suffering
>>43871617
Mother Unit! The Cogitator has gotten into the Synth-Everclear again!
>>43859177
Holy shit, if this doesn't describe Alpha legion I don't know what does
