Why is smoking marijuana seen differently from smoking tobacco in terms of harm and benefits?
How do you quantify harm? Also, butane?
>>7750756
I'm guessing they took data based off of crimes/assaults where the offender was high, and probably recorded hospital/suicide/whatever data to record self-harm.
Marijuana is way more psychologically harmful than physically harmful though
>>7750760
>Marijuana is way more psychologically harmful than physically harmful though
If you're weak willed and easily succumb to addiction
>>7750726
Weed smokers typically smoke like one or two per day, typical cigarette smokers smoke like twenty. Big difference. Also no nicotine in weed. Different dependence/addictions. Different total user numbers. But! The netto carcinogenic potential of the burnt plant content is more or less the same.
>>7750726
>benefits
shit, I can smell your dirty dreadlocks and joblessness from here
>>7750760
They are not that different on that chart btw.
>>7750767
it isn't just a matter of addiction, it's being in the "high" mindset.
>>7750784
So people who say that marijuana is literally less harmful than tobacco/cigarettes are fooling themselves?
Cannabinoids naturally occur within the human body. The carcinogens in tobacco products just cause harm.
(Nicotine isn't harmful if consumed in small amounts.) (Just like cocaine (Because the cacao plant ist awesome.))
>>7750837
Carcinogenically yes. Psychotropically yes and no.
>>7750784
Oh hell no.
http://www.cureyourowncancer.org/how-cannabis-oil-works.html
tl;dr
>it has been shown that THC and CBD cannabinoids have the ability to kill cancer cells directly without going through immune intermediaries. THC and CBD hijack the lipoxygenase pathway to directly inhibit tumor growth.
>>7750851
That's what every pothead believes.
Inhaling burnt plants is ALWAYS carcinogenic.
>>7750864
Okay. I'll take my science elsewhere.
>>7750871
>thc having an anti-carcinogenic effect means inhaling burnt plant matter is good for me
smoking doesn't change your behavior like marijuana does kek
also apart from the actual medical and psychological side, tobacco has been around for a longer time and it's more popular
>tobacco appears in europe in 18th century
>used for 200 hundred years, no one knows that it's harmful
>in 1950s when health risks are discovered one third of usa population smokes tobacco
>>7750726
LSD is safer than canibas?
why do mostly americans insist on legalizing another drug? because that's what weed is, it's not heathy as people in some shitty vice "documentary" claim, so what's the benefit of legalizing something that increases risk of cancer and has an negative effect on your thinking.
Hit me with your knowledge, convince me that the people that want it legalized are educated to a degree that the understand pros and cons of weed.
>>7751003
>convince me that the people that want it legalized are educated to a degree that the understand pros and cons of weed.
>implying people have ever known/understood what they're voting for
>>7751003
We don't legalize it because it's healthy but because a lot of us really don't care what pot smokers put in their bodies.
We do care that a ton of money and time is spent keeping them in jail though.
You have to take into account the typical behaviour associated with drug use. Someone who uses heroin once a week with a reasonable dose is not really doing themselves any harm. The trouble is that this isn't really a typical usage pattern. The chance for overdose is high and so is the potential for addiction. Likewise when considering the harm of tobacco you can't think of an idealized world where someone smokes one cigarette a week, you have to take into account the usage pattern of a typical user which is far higher.
No units on x axis
I am going to have to deduct 100% credit from your report because it means absolutely nothing.
>>7750756
>>7750760
the harm index takes into account the harm to self, physchological and social as well as physical, and harm to others, from physical violence, the emptional damage (eg of losing a loved one from drink driving) and to society as whole (eg. through the crime associated with the production and supply of the drug
>>7750784
>>7750767
cannabis can have physchological effects, especially for people with predsipositions to certain mental illness
David Nutt was government drugs advisor in the UK and was basically fired ("forced to resign") after presenting the results of this study to them
>go do some science so we can be informed when making drugs policy
>OK
...
>I'm back, I did some science
>Errr... sorry, no those aren't the results we wanted you to get
>>7750726
>more dangerous than benzos, GHB, and steroids
>unlabeled graph
>>7750880
>the only way to ingest cannabis is via joint
>my conceptions of pot smoking stopped evolving past 70s stereotypes.
>>7750877
Good for you anon!
>>7750978
Most people use it only once
>>7751043
>cannabis can have physchological effects, especially for people with predsipositions to certain mental illness
So it's an issue of individuals needing to know and be responsible with themselves instead of a spooky drug making people crazy? Gotcha.
>David Nutt was government drugs advisor in the UK and was basically fired ("forced to resign") after presenting the results of this study to them
Probably because attempting to quantify social harm is crackpot tier
>>7751003
only eating big macs is bad for my health but that's legal
>costs of those in prison and law enforcement
>fuelling black market and criminal gangs in other countries by keping it illegal
>less harmful than alcohol therefore weak moral arugment for having one legal and the other illegal
>illegality promotes impurity... some types of weed are way too strong or even can have synthetic materials that are harmful that make them visually look better
>>7751059
>Probably because attempting to quantify social harm is crackpot tier
how else do you write government drugs policy except by attempting to quantify harm in some form or another
>>7751064
not to mention how thousands of peoples live are ruined by being imprisoned for possession of small amounts when they're young
>>7750880
If you had taken 2 seconds to read the link in question, you would know that this conversation is about the anti-cancer effects of cannabis oil, and has nothing to do with burning plant matter.
You must be a hit at parties.
>>7751073
Quantifying physical harm is one thing.
'Quantifying' social harm is something entirely different, and is open to much more subjectivity.
>>7751064
>only eating big macs is bad for my health
Proof
>>7751086
it's a weighted index afaik to account for uncertainty
>>7750871
>>>r/science
>>>r/atheism
>>7751095
Big Macs have a shitton of cholesterol, sodium, and trans fat I think. And their food taste like shit anyway so why even eat there.
>>7750726
That chart doesn't seem right. Cannabis and tobacco aren't all that different on that chart. Yet, we know that tobacco kills a Holocaust's worth of people every year on this planet (6 million+) while cannabis doesn't even have reporting on the number of deaths it causes which is close to zero.
>>7750851
Yes, we know that cannabis, when used properly, is one of the healthiest substances one could put in their body. There's a reason so many industries hate it - money, or more specifically the threat to profits that the cannabis plant presents.
>>7751137
>putting a whole cannabis in your body
>>7751003
Cannabis probably doesn't increase your chances of getting cancer. There's some debate over whether it could increase your chance of lung cancer but there are 2 rebuttals to that:
1) Eat it
2) Vaporize it.
As for pros and cons, I'm cool with letting people have access to a recreational drug that isn't alcohol or tobacco. Tobacco kills 6 million people a year. Alcohol damages nearly every organ in your body and kills thousands a year. Cannabis statistics aren't even recorded because the number of deaths it directly causes is nearly zero if not zero.
And then you have statistics like in Colorado where deaths from prescription lain pills are down where access to cannabis exists. Bottom line, it's really not this evil, harmful drug we've been told it is. It's actually very safe and we are not seeing crime, violence, health problems etc. go up where it has been legalized.
>>7751137
To clarify-
Antioxidant
Anti-inflammatory
Neuro-protectact
Anti-tumor
Potentially anti-cancer properties
Pain relief
Anti-anxiety (not all users, but this is strain dependent)
Potentially helps prevent Alzheimer's
This list goes on...
I know, sources. Just Google it. There's loads of research.
>>7750847
>cacao plant
yeah dude dont eat too much chocolate you'll be geeked out
>>7751193
Saw it. It's a stupid anti-science answer.
>>7750972
>Tobacco
>Around longer than marijuana
Pick 1 and only 1 faggot. Marijuana was one of the most used medications 6000bc to 1800ad across most of the world where it grew.
>>7751161
Don't forget bronchial dilator. The fact that it makes it easier to hack out the nasty shit left in your lungs by smoking might actually have a POSITIVE effect on cancer rates in those who smoke both marijuana and tobacco.
>>7750756
Look at this loser not huffing butane
>>7750726
There is absolutely no reason to believe cannabis is any worse than alcohol or tobacco. Every argument against cannabis in comparison to alcohol boils down to arbitrary platitudes.
The only difference between alcohol, tobacco and cannabis is that the former two have an established industry, while the latter doesn't. You don't need to be a conspiracy theorist to see that it reeks of lobbying and bribery. And I don't even smoke week.
>>7751429
Butane has loads of health benefits:
Antioxidant
Anti-inflammatory
Neuro-protectact
Anti-tumor
Potentially anti-cancer properties
Pain relief
Anti-anxiety (not all users, but this is canister dependent)
Potentially helps prevent Alzheimer's
This list goes on...
just google it senpai
Here is a chart that's actually useful.
>>7751309
So ... You smoka de nobel weed?
hi, op.
The word u are looking for is: propaganda
>>7750972
>smoking doesn't change your behavior
of course it does. addiction is a big changer of behavior
>>7751059
>attempting to quantify social harm is crackpot tier
u shouldn't be posting a board dedicated to science
>>7751459
>Alcohol more harmful than heroin, meth and cocaine
>Cocaine is only a little more harmful than tobacco
>Only tobacco and alcohol are legal across the entire U.S.
Why?
>>7751716
It doesn't change you mentally is what the anon obviously meant. it's not an inebriator.
>>7751742
It impairs you're ability to focus when you don't have the subtstance, which will have big knock on effects for mental function and therefore personality as a whole
>>7751458
>Butane
>anti-inflammatory
Kek
>>7751431
I think the triggering of latent mental problems is actually specific to cannabis and not the other two.
>>7752353
except alcoholism, which is thought to have a genetic component
>>7751732
More interestingly Buprenorphine, a strong opioid drug even stronger than heroin is legally used in opiate replacement therapy is vastly less dangerous than heroin, all due to its legality and regulation. If diamorphine was available to addicts in controlled amounts then I argue that the it would place herojn on a much lower scale.
>alcohol
>the blood of christ
>the drug only white men and jews traditionally use
>this bad
>>7750837
The typical effects of marijuana last upwards of 45 minutes, whereas tobacco lasts somewhere around 10.
Basically, you smoke A LOT less weed than tobacco to stay high all day every day. You're clearly either trolling, or have not ever used tobacco or marijuana. People that have used both would know (even if you've just known a tobacco smoker and go out for drinks or something, they go out for a cig like every 20min), although they're clearly batshit crazy because we all know marijuana causes mental illness in 112% of users.
>>7750860
>Weed is acutually a bit worse because you inhale stronger and deeper and it's without filter tips.
Using that logic, tobacco is likely far worse due to all the additives. Marijuana rarely has any sort of thing
>inb4 m-muh DARE officer t-told my class weed is always laced with meth and crack and acid
Heroin is the most harmless drug on the list, it's just that being a full time junky under current circumstances is a hard lifestyle.
>>7750860
>without filter tips
That's why I use a bong
>>7751732
Alcohol is worse because its legal so everybody does it. It's not like one beer is worse for you than one heroin.
>>7750860
What if you smoked 10 weed cigarettes per day or only a few joints a day instead of 20?
>>7752562
there are plenty of precsription drugs that get on the chart before caffeine
>>7750726
people don't shun weed because it's bad fo your lungs. it's bad for you as a person who should be a productive member of society.
I've never heard anyone say "I don't know what to do with him, all he does all day is get high on tobacco and play videogames"
>>7752578
Bongs are pretty ineffectual at filtering out tar and the like. You'd be better off vaporising it.
>>7752974
But isn't it a logical conclusion to say that weed is bad for you because you smoke it? Breathing a burning plant in your body is likely bad regardless, I don't see how it can be different from cigarette/tobacco smoking with the exception that it's probably done less often.
>>7752581
Yeah, seeing as how they tried to make alcohol illegal once and they didn't win on that front, what makes lawmakers think they'll be able to make other drugs illegal? They're failing hard with marijuana too, there's way too much effort put into shielding people from heroin meth and coke.
>>7753773
Alcohol is a cultural thing that we have been using for at least seven thousand years or so, meth isn't. Alcohol is engrained into the fabric of our society.
You won't get otherwise good citizens upset they can't have a bump of cokeduring a Christmas dinner, for example, and that's an important difference. Outlawing booze is like outlawing bread.
>Mushrooms not harmful to others
I know of someone high on mushrooms that saw a person with down syndrome on the street and beat him up because he thought he was an Uruk-hai
>>7750860
>without filter tips
why wouldn`t you use filter tips on joints?
>>7754340
he's talking about an actual filter not a rolled up piece of cardboard you twat
>>7750837
depends on how you look at it
smoking one gram of weed or one gram of tobacco will have similar physical effects on your body. the psychological effect is vastly different of course.
regarding physical harm - smoking 20 joints a day is almost unheard of. it would be expensive as fuck and you'd be so blazed out of your mind, you wouldn't be able to get anything done at all.
on the other hand - smoking 20 cigarettes a day isnt a big deal for a smoker.
so of course, since tobacco smokers tend to consume huge quantities of smoke compared to marijuana smokers, they end up suffering much worse health effects from it.
regarding psychological effects - nicotine is addictive as hell, but apart from that, not very harmful. it wont fuck with the rest of your life.
marijuana on the other hand fucks shit up in your mind, and will severely impact the rest of your life.
>>7754310
really cool anecdote dude, I bet that for sure represents the statistical norm of what somebody tripping on shrooms does when they see a disabled person
>>7754919
Yes, I a completely sure not a single person tripping on mushrooms other than the one I mentioned has ever felt aggressive
>>7752646
Try it out and report back in a year. Watch your bank account and ability to think clearly deplete (was there at one point).
>>7754919
>le no true scotsman
That shit had to be banned in Amsterdam because fucking tourist kept trying to fly out of hotel windows.
>>7750726
Why do people smoke it anyway? Why not just eat it with some fatty food?
>>7755488
It gets you high the quickest apparently. Drinking/eating something will take a while for you to get high.
Also, the obvious one is that smoking is pleasurable and cool looking.
>>7754310
I've used pretty much all the popular drugs including LSD and gold cap mushrooms. Never understood how mushrooms have such great looking stats. I felt like I had taken poison and my face was melting off. I had a walnut taste in my mouth for 2 days and took about a week to recover psychology. After the visuals stopped I had shifting grids and patterns everytime I closed my eyes. Could not sleep till morning because of this.
Never again, horrible experience.
