>tfw my roommate says a hot dog is a sandwich
>>29524923
I mean it kinda is a type of sandwich
it has a top piece of bread, a bottom piece of bread, and filling
more importantly why are you talking with your roommate and not just staying in your room with the door closed, this will solve all your problems
>>29524923
Are you just gonna take that shit? Beat him down, teach him not to fuck with you
>>29524923
>friends think that a boneless wing isn't a chicken nugget
>>29524982
The hot dog bun is one piece of bread. Furthermore, the hot dog bun itself is designed for the purpose of holding the hot dog, and so shouldn't be considered as a separate entity. The culinary creation of the hot dog, despite linguistic individuation of the hot dog as meat, refers to the hot dog and the bun as a commercial object. This is why you don't see vendors charging extra for buns.
>mum says chicken doner meat and salad is not the same as boiled chicken breast and salad
>>29525169
No you faggot buns can also be used for holding sausages which are also eaten as distinct entities therefore bun are an additional addon and a separate entity itself.
You're right that op's friend is retarded for considering something on top of a curved piece of bread a 'sandwich' tho.
>mexican I dated in hs said "hamburger sandwich"
>after we split she had the innocence raped out of her
>>29524923
What the fuck is it then, a cake?
>>29525241
That would be a sausage in a hot dog bun. I remember an upscale fast food joint that did this. It shut down (and for that matter, sold the sausage and bun as a singular entity referred to as the colloquial hot dog).
>>29525291
>false dilemma
A hot dog is a fucking hot dog.
>>29525322
People rape language all the time, that doesn't change the meaning of words until it becomes commonly accepted. Clearly consumers boycotted due to their linguistic ineptitude.
The point is that buns are used for other things. They're just marketed as hot dog buns when mass produced because of the assumption that people will eat them with mass produced hot dogs.
>>29525169
Hey i p-put spaghetti sauce in buns
>>29524923
>>29525169
>>29525322
But you are not right and your pseudo intellectual deconstruction of the topic makes you look like a faggot.
>>29525169
>the hot dog bun itself is designed for the purpose of holding the hot dog
I've had pulled bbq pork, azn meats with pickled cabbage and cilantro, and all sorts of other shit served in buns.
The way they make bread at most sub shops, it's like a GIANT hotdog bun.
>>29525489
>some faggot journalist said something once therefore it's right
>>29525381
Language is determined both by people and commercial interests.
The bun has been integrated into the ritual of hot dog eating, therefore it is a part of the hot dog itself. A sausage in a hot dog bun is a chimeric invention that does not easily adhere to the conventions of practiced linguistics.
Are you arguing that the hot dog bun was invented for another purpose than holding the hot dog?
>>29524923
hbhggh
>>29525489
Noone says, "Hot dog sandwich."
>>29525646
>The bun has been integrated into the ritual of hot dog eating, therefore it is a part of the hot dog itself.
That's asinine. Is a straw part of a milkshake? Are chopsticks part of sushi? Are chips part of salsa?
The original reasoning is irrelevant anyway. They author is dead.
>>29525726
No one says "cheesesteak sandwich" either, that doesn't make it any less of a sandwich.
>>29525857
People say "cheesesteak sandwich" at least a thousand times more than "hotdog sandwich"
>>29525607
You sure showed me with that green text.
>>29525901
Thank you for confirming that they are both sandwiches.
>>29525842
>That's asinine. Is a straw part of a milkshake? Are chopsticks part of sushi? Are chips part of salsa?
You don't eat the straw or chopsticks, and nobody orders only salsa.
>>29525857
You got me there.
>>29524923
Hot dog is a sandwich OP. I'm glad we could work this out.
Sandwiches are just hotdogs put on their side OP.
>>29525951
that doesn't confirm they're both sandwiches retard. you can't just say something once and declare it's true. there exists some cutoff and hotdogs are below it and cheesesteak is above it
>>29525968
nobody orders plain hotdogs either
>>29524923
>meat between bread
>not a sandwich
OP, you have some shit screwed up in your culinary taxonomy. What the fuck do you call meat between bread that isn't a sandwich? Do you have a classification for that?I didn't think so.
>>29525067
A nugget is made of ground chicken. That's a distinguishing feature of a nugget. A boneless wing is just fried chicken.
Jesus christ you people are bad at classifying food.
>>29526040
>could i get some more chips and salsa please?
>i would like one hot dog on a bun.
one of these doesn't sound right.
>>29525364
But the term "hot dog" refers to the meat, with OR without the bun. You wouldn't called sliced roast beef a "sandwich," it's just roast beef. Therefore, when you add a bun to a "hot dog" (JUST THE MEAT) then it becomes a hot dog sandwich. We just don't say "hot dog sandwich" because it's a waste of breath, like saying "reuben sandwich" or "cheerios cereal."
>>29526063
Nuggets are also fried.
>>29526069
>implying they wouldn't bring you out more salsa if you asked for more chips
>>29526104
I do say reuben sandwich though.
>>29526021
>you can't just say something once
But it's well established that in American history the term hot dog sandwich has been regularly used. Along with the term Coney Island sandwich and frankfurt sandwich.
http://chroniclingamerica.loc.gov/search/pages/results/?dateFilterType=yearRange&date1=1836&date2=1922&language=&ortext=&andtext=&phrasetext=hot+dog+sandwich&proxtext=&proxdistance=5&rows=20&searchType=advanced&sort=date
> there exists some cutoff
You're trying to establish some arbitrary definition that serves your purpose. Even if you did define this magical "cutoff" you would still be wrong in the face of all the historical evidence that the hot dog is a German American sandwich.
>>29526107
So? What's your point? You suck at classification. There are some real fuckin' idiots on this board.
>>29526164
if there is no cutoff then i hereby declare a hotdog a type of pizza and you can go fuck yourself.
clearly the modern conception of 'sandwich' has changed and the hotdog is not one
>>29526156
But you don't need to. It's like saying "tuna fish" or "ATM machine."
There is no reuben that is not a reuben sandwich, there is no ATM that is not an ATM machine, there is no tuna that is not fish, yet however there ARE hot dogs that are not hot dog sandwiches.
Obviously you cunts don't know about a sausage sandwich. It is functionally the same thing as a hotdog. If it's a sandwhich, a hotdog is too.
>>29526231
The m in atm stands for machine. Thats a bad example
>>29526206
It means that boneless chicken wings fall within another sub-category. That category being nuggets, seeing as they're the same sorts of chunks of assorted chicken meat.
>>29526240
open faced sandwiches aren't sandwiches any more than womens' basketball is basketball
>>29526246
it's still a valid example. The language is throwing you off.
>>29526265
The classification chart that I provided you is correct. Challenge it directly.
A boneless wing is not a nugget because boneless wings are battered and fried whole tenderloins whereas nuggets are ground chicken paste formed into patties. Yuo are ignoreing the grinding process and equating whole cuts of meat with ground meat. That's idiotic.
Do americans really call the sausage in a hot dog, hot dog? Are you guys retarded? the whole thing is called a hot dog and it is made up of sausage and bun. Goddammit.
>>29526300
>tuna - tuna fish
>automated teller machine - automated teller machine machine
No. Fuck you.
>>29526284
Firstly, define a sandwich.
Secondly, sexist much ;).
>>29524923
It literally is, though.
A sandwich is simply meat between bread. That's what a hot dog is.
>>29526336
>between
But a hot dog is just one piece of bread.
>>29525489
>piping-hot weiners
>>29526284
An open-faced sandwich is definitely an abuse of the term "sandwich," but who is playing the game of basketball doesn't change the game. You could have a basketball game between ant colonies. Just because none of them are good at it doesn't change the rules of the game.
>>29526307
>Do americans really call the sausage in a hot dog, hot dog?
>the whole thing is called a hot dog
>it is made up of sausage and bun
this doesnt make sense but here's some pure unadulterated cancer for you
>>29526348
but it is bread that encapsulates the meat. A gyro in a pita is a sandwich -- one piece of bread. a hoagie is a sandwich -- one piece of bread. a wrap or a burrito is a sandwich -- one piece.
>>29526371
But hot dog isnt a legit word for a sausage.
>>29526240
that looks like a soggy monstrosity
not a sandwich
>>29526381
Fuck your entire post.
>>29526300
It's not valid though. There is no difference between boneless chicken wings and regular nuggets, therefore there is no need to separate the two.
>>29526371
"hot dog" refers to the meat itself and nothing else. "hamburger" refers to ground beef. It may be stupid, but we actually do say "go to the store and pick up some hamburger" rather than "hamburgers" or "hamburger meat."
"hot dog" is ALSO short for "hotdog sandwich" as hamburger is short for "hamburger sandwich" although hamburgers are different because it is also correct to call the whole sandwich a "hamburger" because that is its original definition. Language has distorted one, but not the other. "hamburger" is just any quantity of ground beef but "hot dog" is a discrete singular encapsuated hot dog sausage.
>>29526399
The hot dog bun being invented to hold the hot dog doesn't change what both of them are: a piece of meat, between a piece of bread.
>>29526386
a hot dog is a TYPE of sausage.
>>29526420
I wrote for you as clear as day that the difference is whether the meat is ground or whole. I am forced to conclude that you are a retard if you can't understand that.
>>29526440
The hot dog bun is just an abomination of a european bread roll. Stop making "hot dog bun" a thing.
>>29526444
No it isnt. Frankfurter is a type of sausage. Hot dog means sausage in a bun
>>29526455
>abombination
>not describing a great deal of american cuisine
>>29526355
except it literally does change the game. they have to make everything smaller.
>>29526381
a burrito isn't a sandwich either are you just trolling? subway sandwiches have the bread almost separated with just crust keeping them together. buns have greater continuity which makes the hotdog more like a wrap which is not a sandwich
>>29526455
our packages of rolls literally say "hot dog bun" on them. we use them for almost nothing else whatsoever. It's far too late.
>>29526494
>our packages of rolls literally say "hot dog bun" on them
That just means that ALL of america is wrong and I'm right.
>>29526381
>burrito
>sandwich
I've heard it all now.
>>29526444
Chicken nuggets aren't defined by what they're made out of. Some nuggets are made out of slurry, like you described and others from chicken breast. They are still chicken nuggets.
>>29526473
the meat of a hot dog isn't even a sausage. sausage implies ground to a certain rougher consistency, not molded from meat paste
>>29526485
it does not change the game. you don't have to make anything smaller. That's just stupid.
You can put ants on a regular size basketball court and give them a regular size ball and make them play by the same rules. There's no reason you can't do that.
They won't do very well, but it doesn't change the game itself. it just changes what happens in the game.
You people and your taxonomies. I'm really losing faith in you. this is supposed to be the "Smart but doesn't try hard" board. You're all just... actually stupid.
>>29526519
>Chicken nuggets aren't defined by what they're made out of.
literally everything in the universe is defined by what it's made out of.
>>29526535
OUTSIDER OUTSIDER SOUND THE ALARM REEEE REEEE REEEE
>>29526545
>what are spheres?
>>29526535
>you don't have to make anything smaller
if you don't make things smaller and don't include rules excluding men then it's not women's basketball, it's just basketball. women's basketball was invented because women suck at basketball
women can play basketball (badly). but that would be a different thing than women's basketball. you're just a retard who can't comprehend parsing ambiguity
>>29526569
spheres are shapes that are DEFINED BY THEIR CONSTITUENT CHARACTERISTICS, i.e. the set of all points equidistant from any given point.
The sphere is therefore defined by its center point, a chosen distance, the concept of "equidistant" and the concept of "all points equidistant." in other words, it's defined by what it's made of.
>>29526578
The rules excluding men are not rules of the game they are the rules of the competition.
>>29526643
"points" aren't things that really exist.
>>29526578
>muh ambiguity
you're just a relativist and you use it as a crutch for not understanding how to classify ideas.
>muh definitions are shifting according to whatever my feelings tell me
>>29526664
Neither are nuggets.
>>29526683
parsing ambiguity has nothing to do with classification you retard. english is not an unambiguous language. the same string of characters can refer to multiple distinct ideas.
>>29526659
are you claiming you can have women's basketball games which do not exclude men?
>>29526703
those do exist. i've eaten them.
Sandwich is a kind of hot dog
>>29526766
>equating existence with physicality
I sure hope you're not serious.
>>29526853
>guys the plane of platonic ideals is totally a real thing i promise
>>29526754
This whole thread is about nothing other than classification. It is about what does and does not define a thing. You brought up basketball, and I pointed out that basketball is a set of rules and nothing more. You suggested that altering the constituent elements of the pieces of the game alter what basketball "is" and I refuted you. You struggled to understand and called me stupid, which is why we are at this pont in discussion.
basketball is not who plays it, it is a set of abstract rules.
>>29526878
you're posting on the internet right now because of the abstract ideas that facilitate communications technology. to tell me that those abstract ideas are not real is to deny that your computer can exist at all.
>>29526898
and the abstract set of rules are changed to include limitations on who can play it. you can get a women's basketball rulebook and look it up if you don't believe me.
it is about classification and some faggot decided to make it about parsing because they can't distinguish between women's basketball and basketball played by women.
>>29526910
my computer is not made out of ideas. if all sentient life died tomorrow my computer would still exist. it is made in accordance which patterns converted from electrical patterns in human brains but that does not make the visualizations of those brains 'real'
>>29526964
your cmputer and indeed all things are made of abstract ideas. There is no computer except in your mind.
>>29527029
>implying monads aren't made of clockwork powered by elves
>>29527076
only weak minds confuse abstractions for fictions. you're out of your league here.
>>29527098
>implying abstractions aren't made of clockwork and elves
>>29527123
>proving my point twice in a row with the same language
then again, I don't have to listen to you because language is not material so it isn't real
>>29527177
it is real. it's made of clockwork and elves which are also real. i don't know why you're so confused about this.
>>29527205
Go on guys, I'm enjoying your conversation
