Is suicide selfish? I've contemplated suicide before but I couldn't go through because I thought maybe someone would grieve
I've heard people say its selfish because its inconsiderate of the feelings of the people who "love" you. I say its selfish to think that someone should live a life they dont deem worth living just because you find entertainment or emotional fulfillment in them.
A girl once told me that suicide is selfish.
Does that mean it's selfish?
No.
It means in my perspective is that I let my family down by wasting my life watching shitty movies at the theaters and walled in my own filth ignoring everyone when i got out of a relationship more than a year ago.
It's not worth it anon.
Just try and think of ways you could entertain yourself like playing the vidya.
Suicide is selfish because you will only end up saving yourself, while other people (who may not be as strong as you) will be stuck in this sad excuse of reality. Not trying to be edgy here, just thinking about the question logically.
>>29092036
Wallowed* if that's even a word
Who cares? When you're dead, they no longer exist, as will the term "selfish". No need to apply existant rules or morals to a ruleless moralless inexistence.
Selfish or not, it is a cowardly way out. Unless you live in a shit stain of a country, there really is no excuse.
Suicide is selfish.
But so are people and society.
People are hypocrites. The only thing in the world that matters is what you want for yourself.
People who say it's selfish are all normies. If you want to kill yourself, that's your own choice. Ultimately once you're dead, nothing matters anyway. Isn't that the point?
>>29091966
People try to shame you because if you kill yourself they can't help but feel guilty.
The thing about suicide is it's like murder but you only hurt the ones closest to you and your family has no-one to blame but yourself.
>>29092069
Suicide is cowardly.
But so are people and society.
People are hypocrites. The only thing in the world that matters is what you want for yourself.
If one wants to suicide. They should do it. Continuing to live for anyone else's sake but your own is a piss move.
Why do you care that it would be selfish, if you commit suicide you're already dead anyway.
I think it depends on the nature of the commitment you're backing out of, and whether that commitment is something you consented to or caused.
>>29092027
>who "love" you
When will this lie end. If you are on the verge iof suicide you know well nobody loves you and the only reason they try to talk you out of killing yourself is because it reminds them the pointlessness of life.
>>29092059
To add, when you kill yourself you're effectively destroying them by eliminating their ability to logically exist.
>>29092069
There are plenty of excuses for normies.
>muh child died
>muh cancer
>muh disability
etc
If the thought of your death upsetting someone is "holding" you back from suicide you're not really suicidal, you're just a sexually frustrated unmotivated melodramatic faggot.
Even on the brink of suicide he still bends over to other people's agendas. For once in your life if you want to end your own life, do it with pride. Don't skimp out on auicide because you're being guilt tripped to stay alive for another person's sake. Why do you bend over for other people's sake even as you're on the brink of suicide. Do you want to remain a pushover? Do you not even have the self-confidence to take your own life because you cave into your internalised guilt? Let me tell you, your guilt is a symptom of internalised manipulation. Never feel guilty in life. Feeling guilty and acting on that guilt will only result in self-sabotage.
If you want to suicide, do it.
Suicide isn't cowardly or selfish like all the normies that parrot these beliefs. It takes balls to pull the trigger, and you need to end the pain it is the only way. Normies that think otherwise only think about themselves and how they feel about it thus making them the selfish cunts we all know they are. I've been living since I was 12 because of them, and hated every minute of it. I want it all to end.
>>29092054
It is.
>>29092208
Selfish and cowardly are just words of manipulation desu. But that doesnt mean suicide is the opposite either.
People who kill themselves in the r9k age bracket are dissatisfied with life. They can either try to do something about their life or end it.
Personally, i feel that most suicides are irrational and the person pushed to the brink rather than logically deciding suicide is the answer.
The logic goes, for under 30s suicides, if you're going to kill yourself anyway, why not live however you can and want? But i guess even living however one wants is too much of an effort, so that also explains why people with depression are unable to kill themselves due to the psychomotor retardation. So the onlt time when they have the energy to kill themselves is when they've in a state of emotional hysteria.
>>29091966
for many people who actually go ahead with suicide due to ordinary depression, they calculate that the temporary grief they cause is better than the burden of their worthlessness.
however, this is a wrong answer to a poorly framed question. if you are thinking clearly enough to do this utilitarian calculation, and as I assumed you only have depression and not some incurable psychosis or addiction, the trivial answer is that one *can* bring more to humankind than they take. The truth, which drives them to ignore the answer to your question, is that they are sick of serving bosses, family, everyone and society as a whole. The selfish answer in this framing is to suicide, so the instinct to serve the self fights for it and wins against the beaten-down altruism.
But the selfish instinct lost before it got a say, because the question was how best to serve others, not how best to serve the self. Not always a zero-sum game, especially with something so ambiguous as life. If you get serious, ask the right questions.
Ever since I could remember there hasn't been a month that's gone by where I've waken up with the question "why haven't I killed myself yet" looming in my head. Someone like me was never really meant to be born. My father left my mother when I was a baby, my mother only had me to try and keep my father around. I would grow up extremely poor, the only pets I would have were the roaches who would crawl on my face and hands as I would try to sleep at night.
School was hell, I'd get the shit beat out of me by a group of kids who would relentlessly bully me all the time. I would have to almost run to the lunch line and be first in line to get something to eat and eat it fast before they'd find me and toss my food to the floor before jumping me. Homelife wasn't any better, my mother would beat the ever loving shit out of me as a kid. She'd beat me until I had snot coming out of my nose and couldn't cry anymore, it was pretty vicious and I ended up in Foster Care because of the very noticeable bruises she left me, only for her to take classes to get me back, start all over again and end up in Foster Care again. I still remember when my mother looked me in the eyes as an Elementary School student with such fierce anger telling me that the only reason she keeps me around is because of the welfare check.
I just can't relate to anyone no matter how hard I try, I always feel like the odd one out that just doesn't belong. I don't even feel human, just like a mistake. I don't know why I haven't killed myself yet but I feel a guilty burden for not doing the right thing and bowing out of existence.
>>29092326
This. Being suicidal should be liberating to them, instead they withdraw from everything
>>29092326
>Personally, i feel that most suicides are irrational and the person pushed to the brink rather than logically deciding suicide is the answer.
Try as I might, I see nothing rational about life. You're only hear because a man and a woman wanted to bump their genitals together to feel pleasure. You were born into this world without your consent and made to follow its rules or else face imprisonment or even worse. You're essentially born a slave that thinks it's free and the only way to get emancipation is through having lots of capital.
>>29092700
Calm down MR.fedora.
None of what you said makes any sense to anyone who grew out of adolescent idealism
>>29091966
That means you are not selfish.
Good for you.
>>29092915
Not an argument but I guess I shouldn't have expected one. Nobody wants to argue their positions anymore, only reinforce them in an echo chamber.
>>29092991
Your understanding removes all emotional value from human life and procreation, therefore creating a bias that would "logically" lead you to conclude that suicide is reasonable.
This science shit is really toxic, it's poisoning minds. Not science itself, but the way it's taught. Too cold.
>>29093050
This right here is a rather interesting post. I expect it to promptly be lost in the sea of piss that is 4Chan.
Is delusion necessary for a mentally sound human being?
>>29093050
Well, yes, we're talking about the irrational/rational logic to human life. I'm stating that there's nothing rational about life, it just is. Life is something that was thrust upon us without our consent.
What I think you're saying is that "love" makes life rational but that would beg the question of "what is love?" and if someone doesn't have love, would that make suicide rational?
>>29091966
Either it is or it is not. It is dependent on how much you love those who maybe will grieve.
>>29093096
It is the delusion of value that which drives us to do and do not. Why do you believe what you do? Your delusion of value -- or lack-there-of.
>>29093132
'There is nothing rational about life', yet you apply the rules of rationality to what is by nature, irrational?
You being a part of that nature, and applying that rationality, is irrational.
>>29091966
No. Go ahead.
>>29093176
Elaborate on the second sentence. I am unclear on what you were trying to convey.
>>29093202
Right, in a roundabout way, you're just reiterating my points. Life is irrational and trying to throw in concepts such as love and emotion into the irrational concept of life doesn't make it rational. A cow is a cow, putting into a horses stable doesn't make it a horse.
>>29091966
was going to do it back when i was 15 but i didn't have a rope. now i'm 24, NEET, and slowly drinking myself to death
i'll probably do it sometime soon
>>29093229
I thought you were the guy who was essentially implying life is without value. I was saying that value is a human thought process and exists to aid making decisions. Lack of value (0) is still value, in the same way -1 is still a numerical value. You believe everything you do based on your own ability to decide on what has more value as a belief than the other.
I know Noone will greive me, I'm just holding off until I get the money to pay my death expenses to be not a burden in death as I was in life
>>29093248
Unless you think it's a horse. Then it's a horse.
>>29093309
I disagree
blxxx
>>29093427
Everything that is anything exists as is only because we perceive it as we perceive it. Each perception is as absolute as the last, and each perception may only label in tandem, not claim.
A horse is a horse because we call it a horse, not because it is a horse. The concept does not exist outside of ourselves, one of the absolute truths not subject to paradoxes.
>>29092915
gee you sure showed him. so what is your meaning of life?
>>29091966
In my opinion, suicide isn't selfish ONLY if:
>1. It is a rational decision that you've thought about very thoroughly.
>2. You've actually got no one who cares about you.
>3. You die in a way that doesn't bother others (i.e. don't jump into a moving train/car or hang yourself waiting to be discovered by a neighbor)
just give a full disclosure on why you did it and everything will be fine tbH faM
trust me
>>29093503
A horse is something that meets given parameters and universally held standards such as 4 legs, long hair, two eyes straight teeth. While the horse shares several similarities and characteristics of a cow, cows are still a seperate species of animals with their own unique and universal set of parameters.
Just because you might perceive something one way, doesn't make it true. You might perceive a bed of lava as a nice relaxing pool but reality will always set you straight.
You could perceive life as rational or irrational but in either case that wouldn't necessarily make you right.
>>29093620
Had several successful suicides already?
My plan when I get to retirement age and haven't saved a penny is just going on vacation on the other side of the world and drown sailing/surfing some dangerous place, maybe get a life insurance 5 years earlier. They'll probably cremate the body and mail it to my relatives of burial.
>>29093503
You're a pretty dumb chap, aren't you. A horse is different from a cow. We can examine behaviour and biology. Call a cow a flobbly and call a horse a trotter, that's fine. They're still different animals because, in reality, they are different animals. Call them both horses and they're still different animals.
Reality is reality. Ride a horse and ride a cow and you'll get completely different experiences. They will interact with you in different ways.
Thinking everything is purely down to your perception is pretty arrogant.
>>29093726
Thinking the human perception has the rule to name what is and what isn't is pretty arrogant. When we die, those concepts no longer exist. You no longer exist because there us no way for you to prove so. Any means of proving so is gone, and so are you.
That's what they are. Concepts. Inexistance is another absolute truth.
Therefore, you are false. Stop applying your own rules to a physical existence that follows its own rules. Once you realise that you can change perceived rules, you wont be such a lifeless husk grasping onto simple-science based perceptions that deem themselves physically absolute when they will never be.
>>29091966
No, unless you make a mess. If you're to kill yourself with dignity then no like a sleep pill or slow asphyxiation, but if you jump off a building or gun splat yourself in public that's selfish. It's only selfless when you don't care about anyone's feelings and you basically shove your death down their throats, but if I were to dispose of myself in a discreet or possibly isolated manner fuck all else I have a right to end myself after all I never truly had a choice. So if suicide is selfish, so is giving birth.
>>29093835
>When we die, those concepts no longer exist. You no longer exist because there us no way for you to prove so. Any means of proving so is gone, and so are you.
Not him but that's just unequivocally false. Those concepts and several other people have existed long before you were born and will continue to do so long after you die. Just because you didn't exist while things were going on doesn't mean they never existed and it doesn't mean that they'll disappear when you disappear. Time will go on, regardless if you can "perceive" it or not.
>>29091966
who gives a fuck you retarded faggot? if you're fucked up to the point that you want to end your life then who gives a flying fuck what other people think
>>29093844
>if you jump off a building or gun splat yourself in public that's selfish
Giving a fuck about other people seeing you die would be the last thing to think about.
>>29093918
this, holey shit you're a fucking retarded faggot kill youself>>29093844
