why arent you /communist/ anon?
dont you realize everything wrong with the world nowadays is caused by the internal contradictions of capitalism and it's system of class division and wealth inequality? dont you realize socialism is the only way to have a decent, fulfilling life?
>inb4 muh socialismo doesnt work
how did the USSR go from being a feudal shithole to being the first country in space in less than a century?
accept karl marx as your lord and savior, anons
>mfw comrades dont want to face the truth
accept the real redpill now
Communism reeks of over socialization. Everything is done within a group. Probably the best thing for robots tbqh.
>>28753735
yup. also workers get to take control of the means of production and control their own wages instead of having a guy who sits in his office to decide it all
>>28753600
Lmao Karl was a typical NEET. Read his real biography. Never worked a day in his life, slept on his friend's couch, and begged his parents for money until they died of old age.
Hitler on the other hand worked his ass off, went to college, fought for his country, and did everything he could for his people until he died. Marx caused the death of his own people, Hitler protected his. Shit just look at their hair and facial hair and you can tell what kind of people they are, Karl looks like a filthy hobo and Hitler is high and tight.
In the end everything he worked hard for was dismantled and drowned in the depths of international Jewry... when you realize that's the real problem you'll ne making some progress.
>>28753600
Fuck off, minarchist is where it's at.
>>28753925
>he wasnt perfect so his ideas are wrong
solid logic, anon.
unless you have something against his ideas, your criticism is retard strawmanning
>Never worked a day in his life
Marx spent an enormous amount of time writing and organizing. People put him up because they believed he was doing important things.
>>28753600
It doesn't work; it might as well turn the fucking government into a monopoly
No thanks I don't want to be barcoded and have my privacy invaded while paying high taxes and getting basic necessities in return
>>28753600
It would work if we were ideal beings
We are not ideal beings
If we someday create a perfect race of androids, then it might happen
>>28753600
Hahahaha, I used to be like that in my teens, edgy fuck my parents and shit. I say you're still young, OP, but remember, those who didn't have left wing beliefs in their youth are heartless, but those who didn't grow out of them are brainless.
>>28753600
Nice spooks OP.
>be robot
>physically, mentally and sexually inferior to most people
>support a system that by definition favors the strongest and most gifted people and shits on those who cant catch up with the alphas
Capitalist robots are retarded cucks.
>>28754118
Communism isn't necessarily utopian, it just seeks to build a society around sympathy rather than just malicious self interest. A civilization built around greed and maximizing personal possessions over and above what you'll have use for imo is ugly when it's a small society, a global civilization built on that is headed toward massive self destruction. I don't think humans are purely self interested, lots of evidence exists that suggests that humans are strongly motivated by social instincts.
>>28753925
I'm not a Communist but 'he was a lazy bum' is not an argument against his theories.
Karl Marx could have been a baby killing pedophile who raped dogs for fun and still be right (not that he was).
>first nation in space
And that's as far as they ever went. America went further and continues to do so.
Where are your precious Soviets now?
Capitalism might be shit but it's better than communism. Every country that disease has touched has fallen apart and left a huge body count in its wake.
>>28754055
>taxes
>communism
God the capitalist hegemony is real
>>28754165
>tfw heartless apparently
Am I an edgelord just for understanding stealing is wrong early?
>>28754288
But when a few individuals are given power over basically every aspect of a country, how can you expect them to serve everyone's interests?
Seriously, they could do whatever the fuck they want and could cover it up with state controlled newspapers. But what's important to remember is that this could happen with left wing AND right wing leadership. Authoritarianism in general doesn't work.
>>28754439
>quoting single words
nice argument you got there
>>28753925
Karl Marx was a journalist
I don't know what biography you read
>>28754439
this
http://www.forbes.com/sites/timworstall/2016/05/04/congratulations-to-venezuela-bolivar-notes-are-now-worth-less-than-it-costs-to-print-them/#3414e6c232c3
that's right, socialism definitely works
>>28754609
if one type of socialism in one country with it's own unique problems invalidates all types of socialism can the same be said for a single capitalist country failing?
>>28754445
I'm strictly talking about the ideology itself, and not about it's eventual consequences. The point is you're heartless for never having the impression that all people are inherently good and deserve equal goods.
>>28753600
>I just turned 18!
>>28754663
true, they're on different spectrums, i just felt like this one matched OP's very closely
>>28754687
>that all people are inherently good and deserve equal goods.
communism doesn't assume all people are inherently good or posit that everyone should have equal amounts of everything
>>28753971
>implying you cant be a communist and a minarchist
Communism always ends up as some form of dictatorship. Tito did far better than the USSR and China in that he did not kill millions of people. Cuba is functional, but it is a 3rd world shithole only 100 miles from the US.
A few soviets in the late 60's wanted to use computers to help with the allocation of resources. Had they gone through with it the USSR might still be around today with higher quality of life for the people.
http://chris-said.io/2016/05/11/optimizing-things-in-the-ussr/
>>28754687
>all people are inherently good and deserve equal goods
but only a moron would believe that, is intelligence now evil? You don't have to look very far to find people despicable in nature.
I've heard the meme saying before, and it kindof makes sense, but I don't see why we should excuse young people for being short sighted when they're more capable than that.
excuse my autism
>>28754771
Wouldn't libertarian Marxism like Pannekoek be "minarchist"?
>>28753600
because i understand that i am responsible for my destiny
>>28753925
wew
i hear this all the time but anyone that's read the biography knows it's bullshit
>>28754739
well considering Venezuela isn't ruled by a communist party I'm not sure where you got that idea from
>>28754774
Marxism-Leninism isn't the only type of Communist though
also Tito was a communist
>A few soviets in the late 60's wanted to use computers to help with the allocation of resources. Had they gone through with it the USSR might still be around today with higher quality of life for the people.
Chile tried that but then the US implemented a coup
"The chief mission of all other races and peoples, large and small, is to perish in the revolutionary holocaust." -Karl Marx Die Neue Rheinische
>>28754609
>Chavez dies and the US finally installs a government to kill the economy
>economy dies
Wow what a surprise.
>>28754609
Putting aside the collapse of the oil market. Venezuela was mismanaged under Chavez, the left was blinded by his rhetoric and limited efforts of nationalization/democratization, the positions of control were given to loyalists. Many critics within the Maduro government are on the left. Everything was done to strengthen Chavez's control over the country. The west played a sordid part, financing and supporting the coup that nearly ousted Chavez, but the blundering centralization that occurred is what is causing this catastrophe.
>>28755277
>the blundering centralization
This is the only way you can even try to govern a country when it's under constant attack by the US. Of course then it all goes to shit in the end, but it's hardly because of the economic or government system as such.
>>28753600
>accept karl marx as your lord and savior, anons
I can't accept anyone whose thoughts are rooted in Hegelianism.
>>28755382
>I can't accept anyone whose thoughts are rooted in Hegelianism.
triggered desu
no one has surpassed hegel
>>28755354
It hasn't been under attack since Bush left office.
>>28755429
Yeah, CIA suddenly forgot the country even existed didn't it.
>>28755429
Tell that to Honduras
>>28754473
This is a misunderstanding. Communism is literally defined as being stateless. Every single communist out there has this as a goal. The misconception stems from marxist-leninist thought, and their ideas of what the dictatorship of the proletariat entails. And while I think authoritarian communism is garbage, this notion of a lack of freedom cannot be used to slight communism as a concept. In fact, one could argue that you cannot have freedom under capitalism.
>>28753925
>Karl was a typical NEET
>Karl looks like a filthy hobo
ad hom, not an argument
>Marx caused the death of his own people
that was Stalin
stop riding hitler's cock stormfag
>le jew meme
Communism (real life version, not fantasy version) would be absolutely terrible for NEETs. Everyone has to work, and that has frequently mean working under terrible conditions. Just look at Mao's Great Leap Forward or Stalin's 5 year plans. Even at their best Marxist countries have only achieved mediocrity, certainly nothing close to a workers paradise. Command economies can't plan efficiently and that results in a generally poor economic performance.
>>28754445
>stealing is wrong
hahahaha
>private property rights
spooked
>>28755725
You're retarded and have no idea what you're talking about. Communism in a good country is great, in a shit country it's shit. Capitalism in a shit country is shit, in a good country it's not so great.
Command economy has nothing to do with communism btw.
>>28753600
I bought into a lot of Liberal Marxist thought in college. Then Conservative Capitalist thought in the first couple years of the industry blew it apart for the most part.
But I've come to conclude the world is much more complicated than either can fully explain.
>>28755793
Neither attempts to explain the world. Capitalism isn't even proposed in countries where it's the state religion, it has a terrible record of being successfully imposed if its rules are followed. In most of the first world it doesn't follow it's own rules unless on it's own poor people. Market discipline for the poor, nanny state for the rich.
>>28755777
> Communism in a good country is great
Germany's a pretty good country, and yet communism there never achieved anything other than mediocrity. They literally had to shoot people who wanted to leave for the West. No one was running away from the West to the East. West Germany achieved far more than East Germany ever did. So you can't blame muh war. South Korea is also doing pretty fucking well, while North Korea is a nightmarish shithole. Also literally every communist country in practice has been a command economy. Or you can talk about your imaginary never been tried communism if you want.
>>28753600
Communism has a class system with inner party vs outer party and various rankings within the political bourgeois
>>28756219
So does every group of more than one human being, what's your point retard?
>>28756101
Small semi-autonomous communities such as ottoman Palestine and modern Syrian Kurdistan have practiced forms of communalism and socialism with reasonable success.
No crazy wealth generation like capitalism, but they certainly get by.
IMO, socialism for raw material distribution, capitalism for produced goods/services and trade, miniarchism for rule, rationalist national-traditionalist conservatism for social values, may be the ideal system for a community.
>>28756273
Why would I swap one class system for another, especially one the purports to be the end of class systems?
>>28756335
Because one aims to uplift the people, while the other aims to oppress them. That's the only difference, in every human society you're going to have capitalism (in the meaning of things being based on credit/monetary transactions), and in every human society you're going to have hierarchies, the difference is that in communism the hierarchies can be social, cultural, intellectual, criminal, etc. while in capitalism they're pretty much only monetary/criminal. It reduces various value systems that normal human beings have to just one.
>>28755757
>he is currently using a computer
>he would accept a nigger stealing it as a morale action
>he is THIS cucked
nice try, spook
>>28756420
Those value systems exist in capitalist societies regardless. We make fun of rich people when they do dumb things and we make fun of lazyfags for thinking they deserve riches. We admire people who disregard currency in favor of other passions. You never stop being human.
It's just people, the people are the issue not the system, be the change you want to see instead of spewing prepackaged ideologies.
>>28756566
>>Those value systems exist in capitalist societies regardless.
Only insofar that they are inherent to humans as such, since the system does its best to eradicate them or make them meaningless through promotion of postmodern nihilism.
>>28756606
I agree, just like the left has tried to destroy Christianity through public education, I guess I see your point. Maybe we need less socialism.
>>28753925
How the fuck are you gonna conpare Karl Marx to Adolf Hitler
Theyre two completely different things. Christ polacks are uneducated.
Le marx killed his own people
What the fuck, lol
>>28755414
In one way or another he's the root of everything bad in today's world.
>>28756647
>muh creationism
The left has destroyed a lot, but religion in classrooms that it has no relevance in is a step in the right direction.
>>28756706
All you are is post modern trendy bullshit
>>28756647
They generally did, but to a different extent in different places - there's a huge difference in the relationship of (communist/socialist/etc.) governments and their respective churches in proper Soviet countries, in ex Yugoslavia and other non-aligned countries, and in Latin America for example.
Anyway, all I'm arguing for really is that since the power structure exists regardless, and propaganda exists regardless, you might as well use it to make the common person's life worth living.
>>28756706
Please understand that actual religion, especially in civilized countries, is very different to the American televangelism.
>>28756781
>ad hominem
Cultural Marxism and the scientific method are not mutually inclusive.
I have nothing against Christianity or Christians, but authoritarian YEC Christfaggotry (and anything like it in other religions or doctrines) is a setback to individual and collective human advancement.
>>28754430
the USSR did not exist to build communism in the latter half of its existence. the man who could have done it died and left no one competent in his place. communism had already helped the USSR stand alone against the most advanced empire in history for years and eventually defeat it, there was no more need for war communism. there was a need for satellite buffer zones, as russia had been invaded twice through poland in 17 years. it didn't happen again under communism, thus achieving its purpose
then the USSR was a state capitalist entity ruled by a vanguard party of octogenarians, one of the most militaristic societies to ever exist in europe. five seconds spent looking at the definition of communism will show you that none of that is communism
eventually the soviets willingly dissolved in spite of the results of the only democratic poll they ever took (no, estonians were not necessary)
no major wars happened after the second world war, there was no huge body count, that was the entire point of the term cold war
you are still alive because your parents were not turned into radioactive ash, because there was no war
china, vietnam, cuba, venezuela, socialist ba'ath parties, kurds, etc all continue to exist. even north korea is evidence that stalinism does not simply fall apart because of some hollywoodian, disneylandlike progression of time
there are also numerous failed capitalist states in history, and even more failed consitutional, democratic, or republican states
the end of communism and the beginning of neo-liberal economic shock therapy wrecked the primary successor states of the USSR: ukraine was never prosperous but it is now african-tier corrupt and threatening the existence of russia is still the sole purpose of NATO. the middle east is more destabilized than ever, and europe is fucked because of it. and marx is laughing in his grave.
>>28754430
Literally the only space related thing the US did first was the moon which wasn't even special for benefiting mankind
>herrr derr muh gommunism death count
What about any third world country ? They're mostly free market
I tend to be more of a social democrat. But socialism could be an ultimate goal once a social democracy is firmly in place I guess.
>>28757334
>the beginning of neo-liberal economic shock therapy
I don't understand how no one took this seriously in Europe, even though it's already happened in other "third world" countries and there were multiple books about it. I remember reading a bunch of shit by some trendy leftists I forgot the names of in the early to mid 90s, then everyone got seemingly caught by surprise when they did it to us in the late 90s/early 00s after the war.
>>28753600
You need to be thrown out of a helicopter.
>>28753600
>how did the USSR go from being a feudal shithole to being the first country in space in less than a century?
Subjugated Krauts.
You don't have to be ashamed to admit it, my country did it, too.
>>28755777
>Communism in a good country is great
Will this prophesy ever be fulfilled?
McDeutschland > Nemetskiy Shithole
