need help from ausbot lawyers right fucking now
i need you guys to tell me what are your experiences with obtain preliminary discovery from big companies
Im going to go challenge paypal in court without a lawyer.
>Challenging a multi billion dollar company with a Lawyer
>Challenging a multi billion dollar company WITHOUT a lawyer
Choose none
Say goodbye job and weekly income needed to survive
Say hello unemployed loser who tried poking a hornets nest
>not going to today tonight and saying you're a hard working fair dinkum aussie bloke being ripped off by the corrupt megacorporation
What did they allegedly do?
>>28063497
TRU BLU BATTLAAAAAAAA
>>28063497
>going on Today Tonight instead of a A Current Affair
How will we appeal to the pensioners?
>>28063464
>>28063436
Are you a lawyer? a solicitor i spoke with said if i challenge paypal in court and lose ill have to be prepared to pay $50k in legal fees. How true is this?
Its a preliminary discovery case, my main opponenent isnt paypal
>>28063318
>Im going to go challenge paypal in court without a lawyer.
why would you ever do this
they will fucking jew you to death
There's no risk involved if you kill yourself after you lose the case
go for it, follow your dreams
Might as post my affidavit
>>28063318
why no lawyer? too poor?
and yes, you'll have to put up bond to cover their costs, which will easily be more than $50k. ya dummie.
if you can't afford to hire a lawyer, nor pay bond, then you shouldn't even think about a case against paypal.
instead, if the amount is small, take it to qcat.
>>28063318
>without a lawyer.
Not even i am that dense OP, i hope you at least know the laws, and can stand up for yourself when the judge or other lawyer is throwing questions your way.
>>28063578
Pic forogt
>>28063318
alright, here's some advice.
1. you will need to post bond, whether it's cash or property doesn't matter, but we are talking $200k+
2. get a lawyer, if you can't afford one, don't bother with your case. you'll need someone to prepare discovery on your behalf because no one will talk to a non-lawyer.
3. if the amount is small, take it to qcat.
>>28063605
top kek you're actually serious
>>28063605
OMG IT'S FOR AN IPAD?!
JUST FORGET ABOUT IT YOU DOPE.
NO COURT IS WASTING THEIR TIME FOR <$1000, GO TO QCAT (IN NSW IT'S ADT)
>>28063605
>using the fee-less option of paypal that basically says the money is a gift for a several hundred dollar item
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAA
>>28063580
No i cant okay? Yes i have $70k in my life savings but im not putting $50k into it. My question was will i really have to end up paying paypal $50k in legal fees if I lose, the solicitor actually said $50k-$100k
Ive read the ucpr especially s5.2 which is the order im seeking for.
Ive also read some case laws.
E.g.
Roads and Traffic Authority of New South Wales v Care Park Pty Limited [2012] NSWCA 35
AS v Murray [2013] NSWSC 733
Lahoud v Hooper [2015] NSWSC 1026
Brydon v Australian Rail Track Corporation Ltd [2014] NSWSC 1560
>>28063605
You're a dumb faggot that deserved to get scammed
Hope you take them to court and wind up eating your own shit for the rest of your life because you're permanently in debt.
>>28063645
you have to post bond, if you lose, you'll have to pay whatever their legal fees are. they will have the best baristers onr etainer and your bill will be $200k +
>>28063605
You paid them through the gift option
You literally gave your money to them as a gift
Some nigger in Africa is laughing at you with two great bloody handfuls
>>28063662
What if i do it without a lawyer? How much would it be if i lose then?
>>28063690
>actually asking this question
You really shouldn't take them to court, anon.
You're not smart enough for this.
>>28063690
you're missing the point slightly. before the case even begins you will need to post security (cash property etc) to show you can pay their legal fees if you lose. depending on which court you lodge at, this amount is $200k+.
what i do recommend to you thoug is to lodge it at nsw QCAT, called ADT, this is small claims court where you pay $100 and go argue your case without a lawyer, they can claim costs but it can't exceed $5k
Please tell us you haven't submitted anything yet, OP, and you can just walk way. I'm getting nervous for you.
>>28063540
>$50k in legal fees
I do not understand this at all. Why does it cost so much to sit in a room while some guy wears a wig and listens to people argue?
And on a more serious not, how can any average Joe EVER stand up to a party with a lot of money, if they risk bankruptcy to do so? Lem.
>>28063739
they can't, a (corporate) company is the amalgamation of years and years of making wealth through hundreds of people's labour and lives. even if they bent you over your desk and stuck their fist up your ass then ransacked your room, you wouldn't be able to take them on.
OP DON'T DO IT!
YOU WILL LOOSE
YOU WILL LOOSE EVERYTHING
PayPal President and his scamming smile:
>>28063683
I zeroed the bitch to living in Brisbane i am 100% confident. Shes exclusively scamming Australians
>>28063708
What so you want me to say? Just do nothing? I havent studied law so no i don't know how bonds work. What do you want me to fucking say? I want to know how much could lose if i take paypal to the local court and lost. Its a preliminary discovery case for teo ppls bank account number, im not suing paypal for damages
>paypal can bribe the judges
>paypal can hire lawyers and pay hundreds and thousands / millions
>op is defending himself
lmao
>>28063758
but OP, look up how to write a letter of demand, and send it to paypal's australian registered address, their legal team will contact you to try sort out something, if they don't go to ADT.
>>28063787
anyway, i'm going now. good luck.
>>28063769
No matter what way you look at it, this whole thing isn't worth it for however much you got scammed.
Just lay down and take it, learn from your own idiocy before you fucking bankrupt yourself.
>>28063605
Bro, if they tricked you into using a "gift" system, you're cooked. You COULD get a lawyer to argue for you that you're stupid and didn't understand what you're doing, but you're honestly suing the wrong people. Paypal merely provides the means, not the ends. To argue (without a lawyer and no law experience of your own!) that Paypal is somehow responsible for your poor decision making is laughable at best.
Sorry bruh.
OP you fucked up. Simple as that. You can't get out of this. You got scammed, Paypal warns against this kind of stuff, you didn't listen. You have no case, stop making these threads you fucking autist.
My mum is a lawyer and tells me stories about people like OP that call her up all the time seeing if they have a case in similar retarded fashion as OP has been doing.
No shit, she actually got phone calls from a guy complaining that someone was talking shit about him on the WoW forums and he asked my mum if he could sue them. Fucking LOL.
>>28063769
>Just do nothing?
Yes.
>I want to know how much could lose if i take paypal to the local court and lost.
Everything.
>>28063605
You're dumb man, by gifting the money you forfeited intelligence
>>28063787
I did
they claimed "data protection reasons" which means the privacy act. I knew they wouldnt release it to begin with but i had to make 'resonable enquiries" before i could do it at court.
Well from what youve said about $200k it doesnt matter now does it? Because i sont have that kind of money for the bond
>>28063831
Dude i need to take paypal to court to obtain preliminary discovery i said this many times. How am i suppose to find the scamming bitch if i dont have her location? Im not siing paypal for damages
>>28063831
Those gears in that picture can't move, can they? Their placement is wrong...
>>28063868
Go for it op, atleast you'll make it to the newspapers etc.. be a hero
>>28063868
>sent two payments
>scammed out of $1480 in two days
>>28063868
How are you so dumb that you fell for this twice? Why are you paying for an iPad over the internet through shady PayPal transactions? Are you a middle aged woman?
>>28063885
If it's anything like here in America, they don't have to\won't give up that information unless requested by law enforcement. Just as the response to the Letter of Demand states, the won't do shit unless the police are involved. Even then, then police will look at this as a civil matter, not a criminal matter. Especially because of the personal payment method.
>>28063901
That's the joke.
OP, open up their email headers and does it contain a sender IP address? You can find roughly where they are from that. What other info have you got on them?
>>28063967
Are you just here to roast me or help me after youve roasted me? This botch has been scamming people for 1 year, ive apoken to so many ppl who got scammed by her over the course of 1 year.
Her scam system is solid, if i lose or if i cant fins her im doing ehat shes doing. This experience has been disullusioning for me, the police wont help because of their limited reaoueces, i cant go through civil channels because i dint have $200k to throw down.
Fuck it id you cant beat them, join them. I already know how she works feom following her activity over the past year anyway
>>28064022
Fucker is from brisbane. Paid $500 for a Private investigator to pull out the ip addresses of 5 of her ebay accounts. All are in brisbane using telstra
>>28063868
Sounds like your mistake man. What the hell were you buying anyways?
>>28063769
Paypal didn't do anything wrong bruh, you sent the money to them as a gift. The best thing you can do at this point is use this as a learning experience. Sorry to break it to ya m8
>>28064081
So why didn't you just buy an iPad at a store? Instead of now being out $2000 and still wanting to waste more
>>28064134
my god.... I need paypal to release her bank account number because the bank account number holds her name and address, but lets be optomistic and assume she still lives in the same place, okay?
Paypal wont release her bank account number for me to locate her whereabouts so i need to take paypal to court to obtain preliminary discovery. Said this like 3 times prior
>>28064081
>paid a PI $500 on top of the money he has already lost to find her rough location within 40km
Learn to cut your losses nigger, holy shit. Paypal has made it clear that you're in the fault, even if you find this bitch and take them to court, who says they wont turn around, call you a retard, and tell you to fuck off and live with your own stupid mistakes?
>>28064171
Ok well guess what? PayPal won't. Now what?
>>28064147
Not that its relevant anymore but i just wanted to resell them for a slight profit ($50-$100) margin. I think ill just resort to her same tactic, surely if the police isn't giving a fuck, no one else can do anything about it through litigation either
>>28064171
It will only have her name. Not address.
>>28064189
Either i take them to court or resort to what shes doing. Looks like ill be doing the latter
>>28064202
Explain. I read the ID verification requirements of the big 4 banks in Australia. One of your id has to contain your current address.
>>28064234
>or resort to what shes doing
You mean scam your money back?
Because the scam she's trying to run is the most basic bitch scam possible that anyone with a brain shouldn't fall for.
How the fuck did you end up giving her two payments?
>>28064262
You wanna tell me how shes getting away with it for the past year raking in approx $2k a week based on my own experiment of replicating her method? Shes made $100k so far and no one is doing shit, if ahe were to stop now, she'll end ip finishing ahead, but she wont, because she knows no one will do anything. You want to tell me how much of a basic scam shes running? Her scM is low key and insignifcant enough that yhe police wont investigate, yet she makes enough to live comfortbly for herself, tell me whats stopping me from doing the same for even 3 months and stopping with $10k?
>>28063831
we are not russian here, what does that book say, lrn2post
>>28064320
How do you know she's making $2k/week? How do you know she has made $100k in a year if you don't even know her name?
>tell me whats stopping me from doing the same for even 3 months and stopping with $10k
The fact that you fell for it AND you paid her twice.
>>28063945
S-sauce?
Original blox
OP is a dumbass for falling for this scam, him sperging out only makes it funnier i bet you wear (pic related).
>>28064371
What does it say, rus?
>>28064417
Whatever mate im not asking for your validation, if you think shes making piss poor money and is running a failing system, then go ahead. She can quit now and still be ahead no problem if she chose to.
>>28064421
One off from a no-name guy on /v/, made it while practicing facial animations in SFM.
>>28064480
How are you even making these assumptions? How do you know she isn't actually selling an iPad but thought she'd try make some free money and you were her first scam?
This whole thread proves you're fucking retarded.
>>28064520
Pic related
You know i could post 40-50 of these, maybe even 80, but im not going out of my way to convince you, you pnviously have your own agenda of which im not going to bother catering for.
And the part about how im estimating $2k and poaaibly more? I already said that but you didnt notice apparently
>>28064171
Why should they give you her protected information? Because you're unsatisfied that you didn't get anything in return for the gift you sent? It's useless dude, I know it's shitty but legally there is no recourse. I don't think any laws were even broken.
>>28064599
Jesus christ...Do you even know what preliminary discovery entails?
>>28064569
>listening to people who ask to give or receive money outside of ebay/paypal
this is 1998 anymore kid
you deserve everything you get
>>28064320
>You wanna tell me how shes getting away with it for the past year
She targets retarded people like you.
>>28064631
>>28064630
oh okay cool
Dfefefe
>>28064648
No im serious. This isn't the 90s or really early 2000s where people actually bought/sold things to each-other on ebay using 3rd party methods.
The sole reason ebay/paypal are together is because of these scamming issues, and yet you still went against the rules and paid outside of the WAY YOURE MEANT TO PAY.
How new are you to ebay/internet? You should know better than to send money unless you're specifically paying through the proper channel that's built for the specific reason of avoiding scammers, instead you decided to go around it because you fell for some simple scam.
This is 100% your fault. The warning signs are everywhere, you ignored them.
Anytime someone ever messages me on ebay to pay for something outside of ebay I instantly IGNORE + BLOCK them from ever bidding on my stuff or me ever seeing their stuff.
But for real bro, why'd you pay her twice?
>>28064621
A preliminary discovery will not be granted because there is no cause to believe that there was any wrongdoing. You sent someone a gift.
>>28064690
Oh okay cool
Jsjsjjs
>>28064696
>third time ive answered this
Yea nah...
>>28064710
>this much misinformation
Have you actually read the UCPR and the caselaws regarding when a preliminary discovery may be granted? Seriously theres more to it than just the 5 minutes of googling you did.
>>28064456
i dont know thats why i asked
>>28064742
okay then mr know it all have fun with your court case lmao
you came here asking for opinions, and everyone's opinion was that you fucked up majorly. Even paypal told you "tough shit". I don't know what you're expecting to come of this. The money you sent to that girl is hers now. The ONLY way I could see you getting getting money back is if you make a big enough stink with paypal that they just refund you themselves. But I doubt even that will happen because these kinds of scams happen all the time and you just gotta cut your losses.
>>28064818
Cool :)
Jejejhhf
Guys, stop replying to OP. This is literally the 20th thread he has made this week. Guy probably spent some Goodboy bucks and Xmas/Birthday money on some "investment" to buy the Ipads cheaper than retail to resell and got scammed.
Now he has nothing better to do besides obsess over it.
>>28064861
>no change in unique ip after youve made your post
Yea i already said that mate, stop trying to sound like you figured it out yourself
Finally the trolls have be quiet. So easy to defeat them
>>28063318
I'm not sure how much has been covered in this thread, and I'm too lazy to read through it.
>without a lawyer
This is your first mistake.
>>28063540
>how true is this?
While the estimate may be off, if you lose, you will probably have costs awarded against you.
I know that you really, really want to win a court case against a giant like PayPal and get a nice payout, but life isn't like "The Castle".
They will hire solicitors, possibly council as well.
I read somewhere down there that you haven't studied law. Actually going to court is only half of it. You need the correct forms, lodged with the correct court, in the correct process. You need to be in communication with whoever you're bring action against and observe all the proper forms.
IF you somehow manage to do it all right, you'll have to be damn sure you know you're interpreting the legislation right. Oh, and by the way, most interpretation is determined by precedent.
Anon, for your own sake, please do not do this without a lawyer, if you're going to at all.
>>28065297
Do you have access to a legal caselaw database such as lexisnexis? Id like to know how past preliminary discovery cases with paypal turned out. Austlii and caselaw.gov.au doesnt thave any
Whats wih the other anon saying ill have to put in a $200k bond to even start proceedings? >>28063728
>>28065297
not OP but lmao @ common law
what a mess.
if we had european civil law and the scammers were residing in the same region, OP would of actually got something done
>>28065402
I dont even know what im missing here. Ive read the ucpr and the local court act and local court rules; and have 5 caselaws relating to preliminary discovery especially the rta v care park case.
Ive been to the courtroom a few times at my local court to listen to the people during their hearing.
What am i missing now? Sure ill take up more time in court and be slower to respond but what else am i missing that is essential to my case
>>28065347
I do, but the thing is, I only have access through a proxy for the firm I work at, or my uni.
What's the reference of the case? If you don't know what that is, it'll have something like "111 CLR 22".
Plus, LexisNexis doesn't have the reports of the ones you need - Westlaw AU has commonwealth law reports.
>Austlii
Useless for anything legit. They only put up unauthorised reports of cases.
Caselaw.gov (I'm assuming NSW) is only going to be so useful. It only goes up to NSW Supreme Court, and you need to be sure there hasn't been a decision in the High Court.
>re bond
To be honest, I don't think he knows what he's talking about. A bond is a monetary payment to the court as a guarantee, or as the result of a breach.
You will have to pay filing and administration costs, like a few hundred dollars or more depending on the court.
>>28065402
Fucking oath. But then, common law is pretty useful. Adds uniformity. Civil court codes are a disaster of random interpretation. OP is just as likely to have some crackpot pro-corporate judge.
>>28065469
>whats the reference of the case?
im not sure what you mean by that, but if you mean my case then i havent commenced proceedings yet, ive been told by the solicitors ive contacted that ill end up paying 10s of thousands of dollars for this and a preliminary discovery case is more complex than things that doesnt involve preliminary discovery.
If you were asking for caselaws ive sug up. Then heres what i got
Roads and Traffic Authority of New South Wales v Care Park Pty Limited [2012] NSWCA 35
AS v Murray [2013] NSWSC 733
Lahoud v Hooper [2015] NSWSC 1026
Brydon v Australian Rail Track Corporation Ltd [2014] NSWSC 1560
As ive said previoualy i cannot find any caselaws involving preliminary discovery with paypal
>>28065508
common law is more liable to abrupt change due to precedence. when you have a massive technological shift and the resulting change in standards of living as is the case in the last 60 years, seemingly normal societal norms become illegal, and disturbing and sick ways of acting in society are legalized. its an autistic (lol) interpretation of legislation. in australia, gay marriage is illegal but the more severe 'down the path' liberty of gay adoption is 100% illegal. im sure people here have heard about that child molestation scandal. what a mess.
common law as is, gives judges the power to rewrite the law by handing out verdicts. you allow one person with a questionable moral character doing these decisions you create so much legal beaurocracy that they just stop caring and common people can no longer dispute these low level cases outside of a court room.
the other more dangerous thing, for high level cases with juries, is jury nullifcation. while common law can be invoked to rescue someone from a fictitious crime, it can also be abused to pardon murderers in enclaves and communities with criminals
so common law in reality is just a
>>28065459
if u waive your rights on paypal then there is a 100% chance you will lose.
the only way you can win is to prove you are systematically retarded to the point where your lack of mental acuity affects your ability to read and interpret a contract
>>28065679
>im sure people here have heard about that child molestation scandal
Give me yhe brief
>>28065679
oh i was meant to say that gay marriage is ILLEGAL and gay adoption is LEGAL
>>28065540
>reference
>NSWCA 35
Is what I meant.
>AS v Murray
Facts are related to extortion, plaintiff wanted an injunction and damages. Not related to your matter.
Plus it didn't solve anything. Just a reading. There'd be no reason to use it.
>Lahoud v Hooper
More on the money, but same thing. No points of law clarified.
Preliminary discovery is only really relevant if you think that PayPal has information you want or need.
You're then applying for specific orders from the court to hand it over.
There are rules in legislation.
Look, you may have a case in civil law for breach of contract, but it isn't with PayPal (see Electronic Transactions Act for more details.
You're looking at an entire matter with PayPal, just to get at whoever scammed you.
It's not worth it.
>>28065731
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-12-10/peter-truong-jailed-over-global-paedophile-ring/5146366
can't find the brief for it but this is a lead
>>28065679
>liable to abrupt change
Yes, but that's flexibility, which is a good thing. Allows the law to adapt.
What norms are illegal, and what ways of acting are legalised? I'm not saying I don't believe you, I'm just not sure what examples you're talking about.
>gives judges power to rewrite the law
It doesn't really. In a case of confusion, or ambiguity, the judges chooses which way the court will view it (i.e. the meaning of a word in the legislation, or the correct way to apply a legal test). There are checks and balances to this. One: appeal. Two: hierarchy, binding precedent on lower courts. Three: legislation that is definite.
>you allow one person with a questionable character
Same problem everywhere. Luckily, judges are the people who are expected to follow the law literally to the letter, and get called on it all the time. Not just anyone can get a job as a judge.
>people can't dispute outside a court room
Yes they can. Alternative dispute resolution, arbitrators, mediators, ombudsmen, etc.
>jury nullification
>fictitious crime
Not sure what you mean.
You can't be in a courtroom unless you're prosecuting a crime in the Crimes Act (or whatever act in whatever state you're in).
>pardon murderers
Juries don't actually make rulings. They make other decisions.
>>28065754
Can you stay for a while just to convince me this isnt worth it. If you genuinely believe im going to end up over $10k out of pocket after this, just destroy me as best you can and break my delusion that i have a chance in court.
Responding to your post, i do have something i want from paypal, the bank account number linked to the paypal account i sent the money to.
NSWCA 114 - paragraph 17 - it says it doesnt have to be the last piece of the puzzle
>>28065903
The bank account number should contain the name and address. All i know is the bank account belongs to Bendigo, i could perhaps keep trying and get the bank account through deception but if i take Bendigo to court for preliminary discovery im going to get asked howd obtain the account number and then the case will be dismissed
>>28065754
I figured i could use AS v Murray as a basis i for bona fide intent to commence proceedings because i don't believe the scammer will even show up in court which makes my case easier, because it says in the ucpr i can only resort to using preliminary discovery if its for commencing proceedings
>>28065903
Cupac v Cannone right?
If so, couldn't find any reference to what you mean.
>this isn't worth it
It really isn't worth it.
You want the bank account number from PayPal. Now, I'm not a specialist on this, but they have privacy guidelines, as well as requirements in legislation re privacy.
What you're looking for is a court order to get them to provide it.
Assuming you get it, what are you going to do with the account number?
>break my delusion
Firstly, never forget that while it's not always realistic, you deserve justice. However in this world, you're going to have to pick your battles.
If you did it yourself, I think you'd be under 10k. However, and I can't stress this enough, you can't do this yourself. You don't have the expertise, materials, or resources you need to put together a case that a judge will listen to, much less agree with.
Your only real option is with a solicitor, and that will be well over 10k.
As for whether you'd have a chance in court, assuming you go the route of hiring a lawyer, I genuinely don't know.
All I know is that if you get a hold of whoever scammed you, you'd have a case under contract law. But you may never get a hold of them due to the difficulty of getting their info from PayPal, which I don't think you can win.
>>28066021
Also for Lahoud v Hooper paragraph 42, i wanted to show that i did make reasonable inquiries.
I wrote a letter to paypal requesting the bank account here >>28063868, but they said they cant due to "data protection reasons" which i think they meant the privacy act. So that means my challenge is to show that even the privacy act allows company to release information
Under privacy policy principles 11 1) d) where disclosure is authorised under law which is the ucpr 5.2
>>28066135
ROADS & TRAFFIC AUTHORITY OF NSW v AUSTRALIAN NATIONAL CAR PARKS PTY LTD [2007] NSWCA 114
i need the account number to get the bank to release the holders name and address through preliminary discovery
>>28064371
>>28064456
It says engineer
ignore this
>>28066021
>>28066154
>>28066228
You're not using precedent correctly.
You don't need to use examples of how others did it to show why you're doing it the way you are. You need to go by procedure.
Here:
http://www.judcom.nsw.gov.au/publications/benchbks/civil/discovery.html
This is what is used in practice as general guidelines.
I've linked the "discovery" section, pick what you need, go to table of contents for civil law in general.
DO NOT take this as me suggesting this is what you need. This is just to show you how much work goes into it, and exactly why you'd need a lawyer.
>>28063605
o fug
you're fucked lad, it's all your own fault and now paypal are gonna destroy you.
desu if you're dumb enough to fall for this scam in the first place
and purchase iShit iPads, then you're dumb enough to think you can win in court over this.
>>28066154
This is the letter. The other one was the response. Not sire if its relevant just going to post it anyway
Op what are you going to do when you get her information and address? Just knock on her door and ask for thought money? It's not like she will be forced to give it to you
>>28066396
for her money*
bloxx
>>28066396
She fucking will when i release her address to the 50-80 ppl i spoke to who got conned by her AND when i make a report to queensland police with all the shit ive been gathering on my computer on her
OP why did you send the money through the 'friends and family' method?
You would have had full buyer\seller protection if you'd paid the normal way.
>>28066318
Im after this part -
[2-2290] Preliminary discovery to ascertain identity or whereabouts of prospective defendants
Yes, keep showing me how difficult it is so i can accept its beyond me
>>28066461
Look mate, i fucked up okay? But so did many other people whos getting scammed by yhis fucking brat of a woman. If she was a nigerian scammer fair enough. But shes some fucking australian residing in australia
>>28066503
But wait, was it you who insisted on sending the payment that way? Or did she suggest it to you?
>>28066535
Look man it was me. The reason why i want to pursue this is because i lost $1.5k because i got scammed by her twice under different accounts. Other ppl got scammed $500 so theyre more likely to just accept it. Not trying to say i disnt fuck up but some people the spoke to got convinced to send via friends and familu.
Look, the biggest reason why i and other ppl got scammed bu her was because shes australian, i would never expect to get scammed by an Australian, if i saw the exact same listing and the exact same way she talked, but say shes from another countey, i wouldve nope the fuck out
>>28066479
It is beyond you. Not a lawyer though.
I need to go to sleep, but I'll reiterate: if you want to do this, find a lawyer. Be prepared to pay out the ass.
And more than ANYTHING - if you see a lawyer, ignore all I've said to you, and listen to him/her.
Good night, good luck, be more careful next time.
>>28064048
>ive apoken to so many ppl who got scammed by her over the course of 1 year.
if thats the case, why not contact these people and pool resources instead of taking her on by yourself?
>>28066598
Go check out reverseaustralia.com and look through the numbers there, there are literally thousands and thousands of aussie scammers, and probably tens or hundreds of thousands of australians getting scammed like this every day.
Stop wasting everyone's time, YOU did things the illegitimate way and lost some money. Just accept it and move on. Do you even think the police would prosecute her for anything if they tracked her down? Do you think they'd waste their time? Do you think the courts would care? They won't.
Just exercise more caution in future.
>>28066479
Honeslty i dont know what to say.
I did my affidavit and annexures.
I made reasonable inquiries
I have copies of our conversation and hence agreement on ebay and email correspondence
I honestly don't know what im missing i know that the more you know the less you understand. I think i understand enough to go at it alone because i obviously don't know enough to realise what im getting myself into.
Also my only income is centrelink. So i thought id be judgement proof until i work, but i just don't know anymore
OP paypal exists as a transaction company.
You and she had your own interactions that were independent of paypal.
They are under no obligations, legal or ethical, to release your data. Hell, as far as they're concerned I could (somehow) dox your ebay account, let's say you were sloppy with picture editing or something, and use the exact means against you.
"Paypal pls hlep he scammed me ;( "
and they should "release" your data to me?
>but I have screenshots!
Easily editable in browser.
The simply truth is the way paypal is going about this is the proper way for them to. Can you imagine a large company handing out everyone's information to any random schmuck who requests it? "b-but mine's legit!" yeah, it may be, but from their standpoint they're running an impersonal business. They have rules to prevent this kind of thing, you did not follow them. Case closed.
>buying anything from ebay
after getting a sound recorder that was really just a the plastic base of one with a rock inside, and boxing gloves filled with wall insulation from accounts with 99% ratings i've decided never to use that site again.
>>28066617
because i want to personally fuck her up
>>28066699
umm it started to sound like you are suggesting doing something illegal, and frankly i don't think a freaking ipad is worth it .
>>28066615
Thanks anon
Chjdjd
>>28066699
anon stop being a git and just count your losses already
you're just digging yourself into a deeper hole.
>>28066699
Yeah, see, your entire mindset is the problem.
Not paypal, not the court system. Not even the scammer. It's you avoiding the proper procedures.
>I want to avoid fees!
>better send it via personal route
welp. that fucked up!
>I want to get money, better get her account
>paypal isn't letting me ignore their privacy concerns ;-;
>better sue them
Hey, OP, why not a class action(?) lawsuit?
>I don't want justice or money really though
>i wanna fuck her up personally!
>>28066770
don't forget him coming to 4chan for his personal lawyer army.
The OP is terrible.
>>28066710
No man, its the idea that she can run such a simple scam and get away with it. Honestly the police refuses to do anything because of their limited resources, but they covered it by saying its a civil matter, so if its a civil matter and i cant do anything about it unless im willing to pay x20 what i lost to recover 1/20 of my legal fees worth, whats stopping me from doing the same thing? Honestly, if ive been fucked over and theres nothing i can do nor can anyone willing to do anything unless they have money to blow on a lawyer to recover $500 why shouldnt i just scam my money back like what she's doing?
>>28066818
Most people aren't as stupid as you. Most of us wouldn't try to save a few bucks by handing away the financial protection paypal offers for business transactions.
So go ahead, try making your money back that way. If you find someone stupid enough to pay you via that method, good on you.
>>28066770
Not gonna lie, if i really wanted justice i couldve ask the ppl to pool our money together. I even kept important details about the scammer for myself and refusing to give them out. I might as well be honest, im after revenge not "justice"(police doesnt even give a fuck), and if i cant have it, im scamming poeple too
>>28066867
You have mo idea how many ppl ive apoken with and how many ppls shes acammed. If youre from australia youd know that her acam works because shes australian. The fact that shes been doing yhis for 1 year and the fact ive confirmed it with ppl who bought from her over the course of the year and the fact she still hasnt been caught proves this.
If she were to suddenly say .okay ive made enough money, time to stop" nothing will happen to her, she wouldve finished ahead and if this is the reality of whats happening here especially wh ive been following her for 1 year, it makes so mich sense for me to just resort to scamming, might as well just do this for 3 months and come out ahead like she is.
OP - can't you just get their return address from ebay? Like buy some cheapo shit from them and when you receive it just see the return address. Should work if they ship from their residence or if they're dropshippers or using a warehouse that should give you some decent info.
I mean you were an idiot for falling for the gift trick. Paypal is pretty savage when it comes to people not playing by their game. I had a guy buy something from my ebay for $300 and I shipped it out to the address, which was seller protected (better know I check for this shit before I ship out). It ended up being a package forwarding service located in the US for Canadians so they didn't have to pay customs. They ended up signing for and stealing the dude's package.
When he opened up a Paypal case against me, Paypal pretty much told him to fuck off after they saw the package was signed for and delivered successfully. It was settled in my favor in less than 5 mins and I got to keep the $300 with no further hassle.
>>28066934
What is her "scam", though?
If you'd paid the normal method, the default and recommended and only method for all ebay transactions... you'd be able to reclaim your money.
How many people can she possibly have scammed?
>>28066960
Her return address is fake, i pretty much know her M.O. Theough folowing her for a year, If i cant take paypal to court then im scamming. The fact that this scam is so simple and that no ine has hears of it and completely focused on nigerian scams or the sort is why it works
>>28066968
I dont want to reveal too much, but the main scam style is
>post item up for auction
>include "msg me for a buy it now price"
Now the only reason it works is because shes Australian & and desceiptions that Australians can relate to e.g. "I got this phone from a new contract but prefer my old phone"
Any other generic scammer pulling the same shit willl not work.
Swriosuly she does not come off as a profrssional scammer, shes most likey some fucking 21 year old woman who discovered scamming.
>living in australia scamming australians
You know on the surface it looks like youre pretty mich asking to go to jail, but it works because australians trust australians
>>28067051
You appear to be borderline psychotic.
You've been asked several times to explain how she's "scamming" you specifically, but you don't give any details.
This insistence that Australians trust Australians just isn't true. That's why there are all sorts of protections in place.
Any item bought through ebay is automatically classified as a normal purchase. To transfer money as a gift to friend/family involves ignoring specific warnings about why you shouldn't be doing that.
The fact that you're still going on about this a year later suggests that you need help.
>>28066995
>>28067051
Have you went to ebay instead of Paypal? Show them the same screens of the the 'message me for no fee' and the transaction between you two.
At the most this should be grounds for her account to get closed. If you get multiple people to come forward about it they might even get a criminal case going.
How much feedback does she have?
>>28066968
>How many people can she possibly have scammed
Each time she successfully scams one person, she closes her listing. Each avg scam amount is $300-500, this month she had 40 closed listings. You do the maths
>>28067102
>>28067097
She makes a new account everytime too many people reports her. She gets away with it because she has dynamic ip. Ebay and paypal could report the incident to the police but think about how many scammer accounts gets reported to police and how many are even dealt with? E.g. 10 ebay accounts under 10 different IPs is seen as 10 different people in the eyes of ebay as opposed to 1 person with 10 accounts
Again, despite what i say, the fact shes still doing this proves it works. And again, if she were to stop today, she'd finish ahead
>>28067180
You're insane. She can't have 10 ebay accounts, she would need a different bank account each time because ebay and paypal both keep bank account details on file to cross-reference and check that people aren't doing what you're suggesting. Every time this person creates a new ebay account, they'd start with 0 positive feedback and thus have zero social proof, and so only complete idiots would send money without buyer protection (contravening paypal's terms and conditions in the process) to someone with such low feedback.
>>28067232
She has so many different bank accounts from many different banks. If youre from australia youll be famailar with some of them. I can only confirm that she has used these ones.
Anz
Bendigo
Suncorp
Commonwealth
And good part, its not even one bank account per bank
>>28067232
And how shes has enough bank accounts for 1 year? Like i said i pretty mich know her M.O.i tried opening a day to day account with ANZ, closed it one week later, opened the same account type 1 month later and had a new bank account number
look up contract law
true it was a gift but you had no intentions of gifting him the money but then again its the paypal youre gonna challenge to the guy himself
law is in your favour but the opponent not really, youre gonna be knees deep in debt because of this
>>28067280
How have you confirmed this? How are you 'tracking' her if she's constantly creating new accounts? If she selling the same item with the same description? If so, wouldn't ebay pick up on this? Couldn't you report to ebay that she's doing this? What you're saying doesn't sound at all believable. What reason would she have to use multiple accounts anyway? Any account she opens is traceable to her, it doesn't matter if she closes it or not.
>>28067307
>i tried opening a day to day account with ANZ, closed it one week later, opened the same account type 1 month later and had a new bank account number
If you did this more than once the bank itself would get very suspicious and report you. Any bank account you've had with them remains on file, and it's attached to your main file.
>>28063605
Looks like you've got a cast iron case you fucking retard, after your glorious victory you can sue some of these Nigerian princes.
You tried to gain through dishonest means and you got burned, accept that it is your fault and stop being so fucking stupid.
>>28067364
No worries, ill just do what shes doing and the people who get scammed by me will be in the same situation as me having only themselves to blame.
>>28067385
right on mate
>>28063645
Anon, you're asking fucking /r9k/ legal advice, these people couldn't help you get a job washing cars for free.
WHAT THE FUCK ARE YOU DOING?
>>28067395
oh excuse me im a solicitor
how can i help you today
>>28067361
This goes back to what i said about police not giving a fuck unless the problem affects a significant portion of the population/community. You seem to be very intrigued by this. Whats your angle?
>>28063769
You had two options, paypal would have protected you if you had paid their fee but instead you used their free service and now you expect them to go back in time and not let you be a fucking mongoloid? Please go through with this you triple nigger, it's fucking hilarious.
>>28067394
cheers
Djdjh
>>28067411
I'm not intrigued, I think you're delusional and an asshole. You think you can bully people, and you have no morals. You say you're perfectly willing to scam other people just because YOU were stupid enough to get scammed.
You come here to r9k to use the board to solve this problem YOU got yourself into. The whole business model of Paypal is a success because it's built on common sense.
You basically handed a random strange some cash, and now you're upset they made off with it and you want everyone else to get on board to solve the issue of your own irresponsibility.
You're also repeatedly dodging the specific questions about your claims.
>>28063868
THE JEWISH BASTARDS OP THEY'RE FUCKING SCAMMING YOU JUST LOOK AT THIS UNITELLIGIBLE MUMBO JUMBO, ONLY A HIGH PRICED LAWYER COULD UNDERSTAND THIS LEGAL JARGON!!!
That you fell for this twice makes it 20x as funny.
>>28063660
Nah nigga you are piece of shit faggot who should get jumped by 8 niggers for being such a fucking nigger.
Im not even OP, and i agree that he was dumb to do this shit, but still, no need to victim blame.
>>28067424
Im beyond this desu. Based on personal experience with police and evidenced by the attitudes in this thread. If i utilise her method and people lost money for walking into a mousetrap with cheese on top, they only have themselves to blame which in turn vindicates me, the scammer.
Im only posting now to get a feel of how people react to this. And so far its looking in my favour
>>28064048
>botch
>ive apoken
>ppl
>if i cant fins her im doing ehat shes doing
>limited reaoueces(?)
>id you cant beat them
>feom
This is like fucking Flowers for Algernon 2, Algernon goes to court or something.
>>28067468
Are you arguing with me because im presenting a picture of part of a reality that goes against your own view of reality? Because this is what i was hinting in my previous post.
>>28063967
Unrelated to the topic but this morning as I was taking my groceries and walking away from a cashier at Coles, I overheard her starting back up a conversation with the security guard which she had put on hold to serve me. I was fucking around with juggling the change, recipe and wallet that time so I was there long enough to hear the conversation. Apparently she tried to download a torrent of some movie through KAT but ended up using the wrong address (so a phishing site) and downloaded their "app" so she could download the torrent. She told the security guard that shortly after that her computer started playing up and that she can't even open up a browser any more because whatever virus she installed keeps redirecting everything to shady spam links.
Top fucking kek, people are so fucking stupid. After hearing this I laughed to my self without thinking and muttered "you dumb cunt". They overheard me and I coped a pretty savage look before I walked off.
>2016
>young person getting scammed from obvious fake site
How do these people manage to survive normal life?
>>28067468
Sorry for causing you ire, but whats the specific question again?
>>28067477
No worries mate, shouldnt be hard to recover my money through her method anyway
>>28067512
Typing on ipad, forgive me.
>>28067493
>says nigger 3 times
>then says victim blaming
Are you tumblr or not?
> NEETS go to all this effort for $200
Just being a wage slave for a day would make you enough to buy the iPad, and between preparation and court attendance, you're putting 30 hours of effort into this claim.
I agree with >>28064690 but the mentality ITT of "you made a mistake, now you deserve to die" is really pissing me off. Is it that hard to empathize with people? I mean, this guy is trying to fuck some scamming whore, thats enough for me to support him.
>>28068184
>empathize
the guy sounds kind of psychotic
>>28068388
Op here. Haven't you forgotten im on r9k? Id say r9k has the highest percentage of warped people followed by /pol/.
But its true, if you cant beat them, join them. Im open to debate
>>28068799
i may be a depressed loser, but im on not the sort irrational lunatic that spends several times more money and effort from being scammed just out of vindictiveness.
>>28068831
Arent you referring to when i said i intend to scam people because the scammer is getting away with it?
I didnt spend several times more money an i had lost. In r9k where the avg person is already somewhat out of whack, its not surprise youll get even more interesting people as you go further across the spectrum.
E.g. Avg r9k is a depressed loser, ao someone on the extreme end would be someone like elliot rodger.
Avg. /a/ tard likes anime, someone on the extreme end is a weeaboo
