Christianity
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You are currently reading a thread in /r9k/ - ROBOT9001
You are currently reading a thread in /r9k/ - ROBOT9001
Please Robots, save your souls before it's too late
Jesus loves you, he can save you
Start going to Church once a week and start reading the Bible
Please, I love you all and want all the happiness in the world for you
Why are there two separate versions of the 10 commandments in the same bible?
I'll read a little bit of the bible just 4u, OK?
I have trouble believing.
Christianity is the devil
Remember that Catholicism is the only real Christian religion and that the others are heretical offshoots. Don't go through all that trouble going to a Lutheran Church when it will only lead you straight to hell.
>>28030965
Reminder that only Quakerism and Jesuitism is the one true fauith, all others are heretical.
>>28029210
>he fell for the Christian meme
>>28030965
What about Orthodox?
The Orthodox churches are actually less pussified than the Catholic Church at this point.
>>28031026
You fell for the other meme.
>>28030997
I went to a Jesuit high school. I hadn't heard of Jesuitism but it sounds similar to some stuff I learned in a Theology class on ethics.
>>28029210
>tfw even the most modest reading of jesus' teachings completely precludes the existence of robots in any Christian society
>tfw most or all of them are faking it to signal to others or out of a misplaced sense of obligation
YOU enjoy YOUR future in hell, numbnuts
>>28031058
>converting to Orthodoxy
>still a robot, but it has done wonders for me, and I credit it fully with saving my life
Other than being the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church, Orthodoxy is the best as far as having a spine and willing to stand up for its theological principles while not going retard like Protestants do.
>>28031126
>even the most modest reading of jesus' teachings completely precludes the existence of robots in any Christian society
Explain.
Christianity generally promotes chastity and extols support for those in social or economic poverty.
>>28031148
>>28031058
Except they aren't Christians
As people like yourself show
>>28031290
Now, wait a minute, wait a minute, how the fuck do you gather that?
>>28031317
>Dude muh pussy church XD
>doos velt ;_;7
Fuck off donatists
>>28031058
>>28031148
http://www.pravmir.com/west-should-learn-from-russia-to-accept-muslim-refugees-patriarch-kirill/
>>28031338
How in the hell is holding to the unchanging faith being a Donatist?
I mean, have you ever been in an Orthodox Church? Donatists think that sinners shouldn't be allowed in Churches, the Orthodox spend most of their prayer on asking God to have mercy on us as we are sinners.
>>28031415
Capitalism and democracy (both Protestant ideas) are more destructive than Islam.
>>28031415
Did you actually read the article? He is talking about how it is not creating a problem in Russia like it is in Europe, how radical Islam is not spreading in Russia.
Keep in mind, that the Orthodox Church has actually been blessing weapons used to bomb ISIS and other terrorists.
We are called, as Christians, to accept refugees. Not only can it save their lives, but we can convert them to the true path, saving not only their Earthly lives, but their soul as well.
Europe is just going "muh tolerance" and ignoring any and all problems because they are unwilling to have a dialogue of any kind and do not base their charity on Christian values.
>>28031076
Basically you're a Jedi, except the force is Jesus and the order is your fellow Jesuits who prefer to seek knowledge and truth and peace.
>>28031453
Because the Orthodox church isn't that and Donatists only expected perfection from clergy. Like you faggots
>>28031531
Not a Protestant so I don't care
>>28031182
>social poverty
I mean, well here you go.
Jesus didn't break bread with the tax collectors and whores just to get them to stop sinning, but to extend goodwill towards those disenfranchised in serious ways besides money. Same reason he spurned the pharisees and their own petty codes of law and social order.
When it comes down to it, most self-professed Christians will do the bare minimum of this to signal their moral superiority to others and preserve their egos.
>>28031661
The Orthodox don't expect perfection from clergy.
Read the life of St. Mary of Egypt. It is about a clergyperson who thinks he is perfect in his asceticism, and then is humbled when he meets a former slut who has embraced an asceticism and faith that is far stronger than his.
>>28031685
>When it comes down to it, most self-professed Christians will do the bare minimum of this to signal their moral superiority to others and preserve their egos.
This is certainly true, but it does not mean you can't be a good Christian. It just means good Christians are rare.
>>28031685
>most self-professed Christians will do the bare minimum of this to signal their moral superiority to others and preserve their egos
This does not take away from the Holy truth of His message. Nor does it take away the holiness of those who do undertake such a task. I will not lie and say that I don't falter, I do, many, many times, but there are those who are far, far better and more holy than I am.
>>28031685
I volunteer whenever I can (we have outreach programs to the disenfranchised) and teach Sunday school at my parish anon
Sorry I can't help you
Sorry you'r
friendly reminder that all religions are sex cults at root
enjoy getting cucked by a corporation
>>28031531
>Capitalism and democracy (both Protestant ideas) are more destructive than Islam.
Are you... Joking? You are joking, right? I can't actually believe someone could be this dumb.
Look, man, I wish I could suspend my rational thought enough to believe, it seems like a much easier life, but I just can't
>>28032036
>implying both haven't led to the situation we are in now with massive suffering, alienation, and the destruction of moral values
>>28032073
Reminder that Aquinas objectively proved God's existence
>>28029210
>Floating omniscient, omnipotent being cares which room I sit in on a certain day of the week
>Same being cares what words come out of my mouth
Fuck off Christcucks
>>28032105
Well no Christians don't believe in some floating being
>>28032036
Anon is righy though, you just aren't objectively examining things to understand what he means.
Climate change will ruin society. Cars kill 30,000 annually in direct accidents in the US alone, plus 50,000 indirectly. And that's just cars. Capitalism is destroying the ecological system we all depend on.
ISIS cant come close to this level of destruction.
>>28031770
>This does not take away from the Holy truth of His message. Nor does it take away the holiness of those who do undertake such a task.
You're right. It doesn't affect whether the claims themselves are true or false, merely shows that most who profess belief are insincere, self-serving cynics
>>28031756
>just means good Christians are rare.
So western society and the Christian community both broadly reject or ignore the moral imperatives at the core of your belief system, and you feel this is ok?
>>28032164
>and you feel this is ok?
As a Christian, no I'm not
>>28029459
the iorny
>>28029210
How do I believe in God?
>>28032226
>Aquinas
>Leibniz
>Prayer and self reflection
Augustine is based too
>>28032226
You other do or you do not no trying needed.
>>28032096
>something had to be first thing
>therefore bible is right
whatever you say mate
>>28032226
God is real just open your eyes dude jesus christ you have the internet
>>28032272
Aquinas never claimed that his 5 ways proved the bible or were meant to.
The only people who launch that claim are goal post moving faggots who can't refute him
I genuinely like Christianity and feel that having it helps give people direction and a good set of values. I don't go to Church however and was never baptized. Is that a no - no?
>>28032272
The first cause would have to be a being that we would recognize as having the characteristics of God, otherwise it couldn't be the first cause, m8.
There must be a first cause.
Therefore, there must be a being with the characteristics which we recognize as those of God.
>>28032309
this thread is about Christianity
it makes enough sense that something had to be the first thing for me to believe that, but then so what?
>>28032290
What is the start of the every thing.
the big bang is just a theory.
Theory nothing more.
>>28032327
okay, so what exactly are the characteristics that are recognised as those of god?
>>28032341
your priest would know more than me about that
>>28032368
>not of material substance (therefore not bound by laws of physics)
>sentient (otherwise it would have no reason to cause anything)
>>28032314
>Is that a no - no?
If you want to be called a Christian then yes.
Keep the Sabbath holy, Christ made a church (Catholic) for all human salvation, and he instituted the sacrament of baptism for the forgiveness of sins and cleansing of original sin and said it's necessary
>>28032249
>>28032096
>mfw
It's like you've never heard anyone critique these arguments before. If you think anything about philosophy besides mathematical logic is objective you definitely need to read more.
>>28032327
>There must be a first cause.
Why?
>>28032395
non-material sure, sentient's a bit iffy because it could have created something without consciously "wanting" to, non-sentient or even non-living things have effects on the world all the time
even then, nothing worth worshipping or altering your life in any way because of, and definitely not reasonably filled in by any god described by religion
>>28032341
>>28032375
A Roman Catholic priest formulated the Big Bang Theory
A scientific theory is something which explains a set of facts about nature we have. So "just a theory" doesn't mean much here. It's all based on the facts and the theory is adjusted when new information comes to light assuming the theory conflicts with the data
>>28032425
>Why?
Because there cannot be an infinite regress of causes.
>>28032396
Fuck Catholicism. You're directly disobeying one of the ten commandments by idol worshiping. Also, the bible says nothing about needing a fucking pope.
>>28032441
irrelevant. consult your padre
>>28032439
Why would it have created something if it didn't consciously want to? If it didn't, then something would have had to caused it to do so, which would make it no longer the first cause.
>>28032442
You just restated your claim. I'm asking you to support it.
>>28032452
>idol worshipping
Orthodox here. Icons are not idols, and what Orthodox and Catholics do with them is not worship.
We recognize that the image is not actually the object of reverence, what is being depicted is. That is to say, an icon of Jesus Christ reminds us of the actual Jesus Christ, thereby directing our thoughts to heaven.
If it were idolory, then we would think the icons themselves are what holds the power, that is to say, we would think the icon of Christ is literally Jesus Christ. We do not think that.
>>28032471
the very notion of a first cause means it doesn't have to obey laws of causality as we know them, so why does non-sentience necessarily mean it had a prior cause where it's mere existence doesn't?
>>28032496
Because it makes no sense at all for there to be an infinite regress of causes. It is a logical contradiction. If there were to be an infinite regress, then there would be nothing to cause the initial chain of events, because there would be no initial chain of events. However, if there is no initial chain of events, then there can be no subsequent events.
>>28032441
this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WrxlU0lNfb8
>>28032452
Matthew 16:18-19
>>28032452
Are you the anon I responded too?
We don't worship icons any more than a person worships a picture of a family member in their house. The purpose is to help focus your mind on what you're praying about.
As far as the Pope goes, yes the papacy is in scripture.
Read Matthew 16 in light of Isaiah 22 to show Christ creating an office (that had existed for the throne of David before) and giving it to Peter. Said office had "keys" (which weren't just some symbol, but was Christ handing authority to Peter to lead in his stead while he wasn't present on earth.), successors, and all the authority of the king.
In John 21:17 Christ tells Peter to feed his sheep. That is, to lead in the good Shepard's physical absence. When Peter dies who feeds the sheep? His successor.
>>28032523
Because creation of the universe is separate from its existence. The being exists without input, but it has to take action to create the universe. Its action also has a cause, which is the being.
>>28032396
Oh, okay. What's the difference between Catholics and Protestants? Someone explained it to me once but I can't really remember.
Jew whore cucks her beta husband, claims child is from god... aka Tyrones God tier weenie.
Kek. Best religion ever
>>28032600
Protestants don't recognize Apostolic succession or Church tradition, instead believing that all authority comes from the Bible (sola scriptura).
This is, of course, a contradiction, because the Bible is a Church tradition, but, shhh, the Proddies don't want to know that.
>>28032597
if we suppose a being can exist without an action, why not an action without a being?
assuming a first cause leaves more potential situations than just a god because it requires by definition that we abandon the logic we used to get back to this first cause
not to mention that beings can spontaneously "take action" simply due to the state in which they exist, like radioactive materials
>>28032600
Protestants are too varied a group to pin down entirely, but they generally all agree to the idea that Scripture is the sole source of authority in doctrinal matters, and that faith in Christ is all that's need for justification towards salvation.
The Catholic church holds that it is the church established by Christ, and holds the entirety of the truth. Salvation outside the church is objectively "impossible" (exceptions such as invincible ignorance are recognized, and we recognize that we can't know for sure who goes to hell).
The Catholic church maintains this position because it considers itself the only valid and licit dispenser of the sacraments instituted by Christ (Eucharist, Penance, etc.).
We hold that Sacred Tradition from the apostles that isn't in scripture is just as authoritative as Sacred Scripture (which is part of tradition in a sense anyway since the church compiled the bible).
Catholic recognize apostolic succession from the apostles to the priesthood while Protestants believe in a "priesthood of all believers" (a generalization of course since there are exceptions).
>>28032707
>>28032648
Oh, alright, thanks anons. That cleared things up for me quite a bit.
>>28032700
What would take the action? There would be nothing to act.
And if there is nothing but the being, then there would be no state to influence that being's action.
>>28032789
the point is that's no more useful a question than "what created the being?"
there's still the state of the being itself
>>28032648
>implying jesus wouldn't be doing backflips in his tomb (if he were still in there) if he caught the Catholics selling tickets to heaven, throwing paranoid shitfits over 'heresy', refusing to allow the laypeople to even read the bible in their own language, launching inquisitions, flying off on anti-semetic rampages etc etc
>implying Luther wasn't based af for allowing people to actually fucking read the book and think for themselves
I only pray to Shrek niggerfag.
>>28032819
I'm not a Roman Catholic, I'm Eastern Orthodox. The Roman Church is heretical, definitely, but the Protestants are moreso.
>there are protestants who think gay marriage exists
>there are protestants who think women can be made priests or Bishops
>there are protestants who think that moneylending isn't a sin
>there are protestants who don't think that premarital sex is a sin
>there are protestants who don't think anal sex is a sin
>there are protestants who think the poor can go fuck themselves
Protestantism is nothing more than an abortion of Christian doctrine.
>>28032819
>that one guy who doesn't know there has always been a secret order of christians who understood the true nature of christ separate from the popular mass of christians that met in secret
>>28032819
You're now aware that the general populace at the time was fairly proficient in Latin and Newton published his works in Latin specifically so everyone could read them
You're now aware that most translations into the vernacular were done by the Catholic church first
You're now aware that people were never forbidden to read the bible
You're now aware that the inquisitions were the safest, and most objective courts in the world (even more than secular ones) and were done to keep the accused from mob justice
You're now aware that the Church took measures to protect the Jews of Europe from physical danger
You're now aware that indulgences were never sold by the Catholic church and are not "tickets to heaven" and were never advertised as such
You're now aware that Martin Luther supported the dispensation indulgences, but opposed individuals who abused them
>>28032895
There are Christians from every denomination that think those things.
Orthodox and otherwise. It's western secularism that leads to it
>>28032807
There is a difference between existing and taking place. An event can't just sort of happen.
>>28032955
There are protestant Churches that actually endorse it though. Orthodoxy will never bow to it. The laity of a protestant church can actual control it and force it to take heretical positions.
>it is a logical contradiction
No
>>28032550
>there would be nothing to cause the initial chain of events, because there would be no initial chain of events. However, if there is no initial chain of events, then there can be no subsequent events.
Linguistic juggling. You've swapped out "the events immediately caused by the first cause" for "any events that could have caused current events" without justification, again directly assuming what you're trying to prove.
There's also the matter of an infinite regress of causes being compatible with a first cause (strong transfinite induction) provided we take "causes" to mean "logically implies." And the can if worms where you assume a deterministic universe/well-defined causality
>>28033014
Well that's true, but that's just by the nature of Protestant organization (or lack thereof).
It's not like most of those people go to any church anyway.
Please, if any of you get the chance, read some Bart Ehrman, historical Biblical scholar, former evangelical taught at Moody Bible Institute, and now an agnostic. Christianity as known today is simply the product of people far removed from historical events who wanted to make their own religion.
Also, the argument of suffering really hasn't been answered by Christianity. https://youtu.be/Q5zXiKuV_8I
I had sex whats the point I rejected everything I learned growing up and became a slut to vagina
I'm also confused about what religion gets into heaven, can't I be buddhist and reincarnate as myself again with all my memories
>>28032980
and a being can't just sort of exist, that's the very reason we came to assume a first cause of everything, yet here we are
>>28033049
>Bart Ehrman
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A0iDNLxmWVM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWbShiINl4s&list=PL1mr9ZTZb3TUYymBPce08oyuhnHLLkR_B&index=4
>problem of evil/suffering
http://www.strangenotions.com/why-horrible-suffering-does-not-disprove-gods-existence/
http://www.strangenotions.com/stephen-fry-job-and-the-cross-of-jesus/
http://www.strangenotions.com/why-would-god-allow-suffering-caused-by-nature/
>>28033031
>but that's just by the nature of Protestant organization (or lack thereof).
That's my point. It leads to heresy by its nature. You need tradition or you will end up as a heretic.
>>28033027
Let me restate it.
Without a first cause, then there can be no events, because there would be nothing to cause a sequence of events.
You would, quite literally, have to assume that there isn't a material universe with time for the infinite regression to make any sense, because otherwise you would have to get at a beginning, which would be a first, and therefore not an infinite regress.
>>28033074
That is why we have to infer that the being is not of our material existence, as otherwise it would be subject to the same rules as us, and therefore couldn't be the first cause.
>>28033073
>I persecuted the church of Christ and killed many of his disciples, what's point?
>>28033073
>>28033173
Also, St. Mary of Egypt.
>>28033201
I prefer based St. Moses the black
REMINDER
https://youtu.be/3-q_6SlJJec
>>28033172
either that or it's not what we would really call a being at all
to even try and put something which must not follow the same rules as the rest of the universe into a categories that are pretty much based on those rules at all doesn't make much sense
>>28033241
Nobody here once made a utilitarian argument for Christianity
Pope did nothing wrong btw tbqh
>>28029210
I was staring at that pic when my low battery noise went off. I want to kill.
>>28029210
Thanks Jesus, but you're a piece of shit if you're real, so fuck off
>>28029210
Imagine if god really did care about us, but all this horrible shit happened to you anyway?
That would be horrifically worse.
>>28033491
>implying human morality can be superior to divine morality
>be atheistnot by choice
>decide to pretend to be xtian and go to church
>qt gfs in cute dresses everywhere
>somehow acquire one and start pumping her regularly
>its a sin before marriage but literally no christian girls care at all
>realize everyone else at church is just pretending too
The pussy is so much better than skanky edgy feminist clubslags, too. I can't understand why anyone here would pass up church. It's literally the sole reason there's an no gf epidemic.
>>28033577
Wanna buy some Cheese Pizza?
>>28033615
You're dusgusting tbqh
Worse than obnoxious fedoras
>>28033155
>Without a first cause, then there can be no events, because there would be nothing to cause a sequence of events.
Intermediate causes cause subsequent events well enough. I don't suppose you deny this point, or you'd be arguing for precisely two events, a first and a final. The existence of intermediate causes certainly doesn't by itself presuppose the chain is capped at the "past" end.
>have to assume that there isn't a material universe with time for the infinite regression to make any sense, because otherwise you would have to get at a beginning, which would be a first, and therefore not an infinite regress.
What is the smallest real number in (0,1)?
>adhering to the grandfather of Bolshevism
no thanks
>2016
>placing your faith in man
Who here /commonfilth/?
>>28033685
You dirty menshevik
>>28033669
Elaborate on what made you upset, and why you feel that way.
I don't mind people believing in Christianity, and I like it when it drives people towards altruism and compassion. Same thing with Islam, Jainism, Sikhism, Judaism etc.
But what is absolutely absurd and stupid is the constant infighting between sects. Muslims killing each other, Christians killing each other and hating other sects. That shit isndumb,especially when the disagreements are about metaphysics and other nonsense that can no be proven.
I'm a humanist, and that suffices for me.
The only true religion is Islam
>>28034351
Can you find me an example of Christians killing each other for their "sect" in the last 100 years?
>>28033027
>Linguistic juggling
Definitely not. Have you ever taken philosophy 101? You just need to *read*, friend. Not skim over it and wait for your turn to launch your pre-made argument you have been waiting to use beforehand. Or maybe you did not understand his terms.
>>28034376
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Troubles
>>28034376
Sure, take a look at the IRA the catholics and the Protestants in Ireland.
Or Anders Breviek, or various psychos attacking abortion clinics.
>>28034441
that has more to do with land, ethnic background, and political representation
>>28034457
>destroying baby death chambers
>psycho
epic
>>28034457
>anders breviek, or various psychos attacking abortion clinics
that's not christians killing for sectarian reasons
I think i'm past the point of no return
>>28034484
>>28034499
Point stands anons. The other robot posted about the troubles which is proof enough.
Even though Breviek is a religious extremist killing other Christians to wake them up to a false threat.
My point here isn't what you think it is, most people have a history of violence.
Except of course for the Semai, Hopi, and Quakers. These three groups are a beacon of hope for all people of all faiths and no faiths alike.
Yet everyone else continues to bicker over bullshit.
To my mind humanism is sufficient,and I'm tolerant of your ideas, just don't let it intrude into politics when your ideas are based on unprovable axioms.
>>28034381
>Definitely not.
I pointed out where and how.
Words and phrases have multiple differing contextual meanings, rather than absolute ones. They have no meaning independent of the particular definitions we assign them. Solid argument rests on a consistent choice of definitions.
I'm not dismissing outright the possibility that those two line up or one leads to the other, mind you.
The argument from first causes leaves all of its definitions rather nebulous, does not reduce to infinite regress implies A(and)~A, leaving it as a supposedly "self-evident" (ipse dixit) statement and banks heavily on difficulties with conceptualizing the infinite to appear plausible. Let me ask you, does 0.99...=1?
>>28034762
>To my mind humanism is sufficient
No it isn't. If you just try to feed everyone there will be awful overpopulation and the world will get overrun with 75 IQ Africans. You have to make ethical decisions about who lives and dies in the world. Trying to save everybody will make the world a complete shithole in 100 years.
>>28035128
Strawman argument, and racist.
Try again.
>>28029416
The "second ten commandments" werent the ones being engraved, so the first ten (that jesus repeated partially to the rich young ruler)
>>28035128
>75 IQ Africans
A major Christian demographic
>>28035261
>racist
Are you unfamiliar with race realism?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_and_intelligence#CITEREFTizard_et_al.1972
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nations_and_intelligence
The majority of people in scientific fields believe the IQ gap is partially genetic.
And it may be a strawman argument depending on what you consider humanism.
