who /vegan or vegetarian/ here?
Been vegan for half a year now, here's some of the positives
>less acne
>slimmer face and body
>slightly more energetic and better mood
>saving animals lives
and some negatives
>your normie friends actually justify the suffering and death of animals so you get in heated debates with them all the time
>your family still won't go vegan after educating them several times
>realize the human race is fucking scum for the way we treat animals
Please kill yourself, everyone fukcing hates vegans for a reason.
>>27532810
I'm pescatarian. I'll only eat fish if they're wild caught tho. I realize that predatorial relationships are a part of the natural order. I don't consider animals raised in captivity to be part of the natural food chain so I don't eat them. I want to be a vegetarian someday tho
You sound like a fucking faggot. Kys
>>27532845
I also make sure to buy cage free eggs. Honey is not vegan fyi
I wouldn't wanna be a vegan. It's annoying if you don't live alone. Your parents don't wanna cook for you.
>>27532810
Animals don't even have a soul, so why bother? It's not our fault if the food chain is structured this way
>>27532939
nobody has a soul you religious kek
animals are living sentient beings and feel pain just as well as we do
>>27532810
stop this shit just to feel better than the others, you fucking faggottarian and go kill yourself, cunt
>Saving animals
Kek, no vegan has ever been to agriculture college. Ever.
The animals we eat are utterly dependent on us. They're breeds that have evolved over thousands of years to be docile and good for food. That's it.
Stop eating them, and most of them will just die out anyway, because they can't live on their own.
Veganism promotes the destruction of entire breeds of animals just for their own smug sense of self satisfaction.
Veganism promotes the conspicuous consumption of staple, easily grown foods from other countries, driving up the price for native inhabitants. Your tasty bowl of quinoa probably starved some poor South American.
You're all sick fucks.
>>27532810
If you are a vegetarian you are a faggot who can't commit to the cause. Vegans are heroes tho
>>27533040
Nice reddit argument
*tips katana*
I go for veg-options whenever possible and I used to only buy vegetarian options when I lived alone but I moved back with my folks a while ago and all meals here have meat products
that's why I can't wait to move out and go back to my vegetarian diet.
>>27533040
Stupid cunt
Even then it's worse that we've developed a life form purely for consumption. Killing sentient beings isn't moral
>>27532810
Meat consumption is neither ethically justifiable nor ecologically sustainable. It is however, culturally acceptable and I have a physical addiction that I am unwilling to overcome, especially if it turns me into an unsufferable cunt.
Imho there's nothing wrong with the dairy industry in principle but widespread misconduct is rife, I try to buy organic or at least free range but I am lost my job quite recently and can't afford it atm
>>27532845 has the right idea. I don't believe fish can properly process suffering in the same way mammals can. I do intend to go pescatarian at some point in my life, but right now cheap epicurean gratification is one of the only things that gets me out of bed in the morning.
There's way too much human suffering in the world for us to prioritise animal welfare above ours, and I for one am actively directing my efforts towards alleviating the former (I volunteer for a mental health charity, probably more that you can say you've ever done for your fellow man you self-righteous cuck). And for the record I've had sub 15 BFP since I was 13 and my poops are smooth, quick, and firm
Vegitarianism I can get behind, I'm one myself. But veganism is nearly impossible in the 21st century.
>>27533064
I don't think vegans should alienate vegetarians considering we are so few in number lol.
>>27533160
With all the monoculture grains and shit vegans eat it just destroys the habitat causing lots of animals can't even live anymore so they die wastefully
>>27533166
Im neither. I was vegan for 3 months but I couldn't make it permanent. Vegetarians still contribute to animal suffering. Dairy is rape and slavery while meat is murder.
>>27533009
Even if you're not religious you can't deny that humans have also a non physical/spiritual part that moves them. Well, technically even plants feel pain, as I've said that's just how the food chain works
>>27533161
>I have a physical addiction
That's just because your body is designed to eat meat you fuckwad
>>27533207
I'm vegan and I think saying Meat is Murder is really misleading. You can't murder an animal.
>murder: the unlawful premeditated killing of one human being by another.
It's okay to say it's cruel though.
>>27533160
You are aware that we had to do so in order to develop agriculture and live as we do now, right? Globalism would never have happened without meat. Without globalism, you wouldn't have the varied diet you'd need as a vegan to survive. Think you can live off what's native to your country and live well? Go ahead, try it.
Animals eat animals.
>>27533076
Fact: Reddit is brimming with faggots.
Fact: Vegans are faggots.
Explains how you'd be so well acquainted with what's said at reddit, hmm?
Food in general is a fad that is on its way out.
>>27533204
false. It takes 16kg of vegetables to contribute to 1kg of beef.
>>27533254
this. can't wait for soylent to become the norm.
>>27532841
I don't hate vegans, I think they are right. But I couldn't give up meat (yet).
Lifelong vegetarian and within the last few years pescetarian here, I don't do it for ethical or moral reasons, I've just never liked the taste of meat. Both normies and veggies find me weird. :c
>>27533252
Globalism exists now. It's no longer a necessity to eat meat. It contributed to brain growth, it doesn't now. Even then it is argued that it was cooking food that contributed to brain development.
It was necessary. We are evolved to a point where it isn't anymore.
>>27532810
I'm vegetarian as well. Not exactly a purist, I'll sample a small bit of meat if it looks good every now and then (usually no more than a couple of times of a month). If that disqualifies me, well, idgaf.
I feel better. I eat better food (whole foods, prepared from the fundament up, no processed shit) than I did before. It's moral, ecologically sustainable, whatever this cuck: >>27533040 will say (keking heartily at his shallow dipshit arguments). It's cheaper, a lot healthier in the long run, etc. I could go on and on.
In short: meat cucks, eat my fiber-rich shit.
>>27533299
Start in bit, my friend. Restrict meat to the weekend (5-2 division). It doesn't have to be binary - make it a spectrum instead. If giving up meat permanently, just restrict it for 1-2 days a week.
t. Not a purist
I only eat meat from animals considered pests. It's the best of both worlds.
>>27532810
the only problem i have with a vegan diet is the insane amount of times I have to take a shit a day.
Literally shit 3 times in one day before.
>>27533040
Quinoa tastes absolutely disgusting. Fellow omnivore here btw
Who /carnian/ here?
I don't eat plants. They're really important for the environment. They clean the air, the soil and patricipate in important biological processes such as the cycle of nitrogen.
I don't use any vegetable products. In fact, I wipe my ass with leather. Vegetable eaters need to die.
/vegan/ for 10 years here
>>27532841
You hate vegans because you being aware of vegans leads you to be aware that your actions are unjustifiedly detrimental to the wellbeing of others. The existence of vegans therefore causes you to realize that you have to either stop doing something that you enjoy selfishly indulging in or continue doing something that you know is wrong. You hate us because of your own guilt.
>>27533226
Humans have a brain that allows us to be conscious. Nearly all animals (exceptions maybe being clams and coral?) have brains. The purpose of a brain is to allow an organism to be conscious. In that regard there is no difference between humans and most species of animals.
>>27533369
Same (although not vegan). At least it's mercifully quick and with shit that's easy to wipe.
>>27533384
it's called carnism you carnist scum
>>27533384
Lmao animal agriculture contributes to the environment more than transport in its entirety does
>>27533384
Origami post
>>27533299
It's not that you *can't*, it's that you don't want to. Try to eat less, and when it's tempting to eat meat/dairy/eggs, think of the animals imprisoned and killed for it. It makes it a lot easier to always think about why you're doing it. And even if you can't be perfect you can eat less meat/milk/eggs, and over time you'll get used to not eating it.
>>27533394
>the wellbeing of others
Me eating meat doesn't harm any other humans.
Or... you mean... you want to feel bad for a chicken? God damn you guys are like the biggest cucks. Chickens don't even like you, man. They make shitty pets. Most of them just get eaten by foxes in the wild anyway, and all that's happened is you've missed out on some tasty eggs and tendies.
>>27533369
>vegan
>shit once a day
>same as when I wasn't vegan
It's not because you're vegan, it's that you are eating some specific thing that causes that, or lacking some specific nutrient.
>>27532810
Vegan rightwing nut checking in, we are out there
>>27533459
>Me eating meat doesn't harm any other humans.
>what are environmental and ecological damage
Kek, do you even know anything? Industrial husbandry is a major source of climate devastation on the global scale and ecological devastation on the local level. That hurts humans.
>>27533160
>Killing sentient beings isn't moral
Guess that all depends on whose morals you live by now doesn't it?
>>27533464
More fibers in the diet, I would guess.
>>27533486
If right-wing ideologies weren't so retarded about climate change, diets and various social issues I wouldn't mind signing up at all. I guess climate deniers deny it because it implies the need for governmental action to regulate - a classic case of the map trumping the terrain.
Passive vegans are the worst. I spend a few weekend evenings releasing farm animals from local farmers.
>>27533523
I have no qualms about imposing my morals on you.
>>27533552
muh origami pasta sauce
>>27533523
You can tell that abot anythyng. It's not even an argument.
>>27533563
You morals of...not killing sentient beings?
I'm shaking in my leather boots.
Ur right desu but baka I don't have the discipline. I try to get ethically raised animals and only eat fish and chicken.
Someday I will try full veg.
There's no way to be a 100% ethical and survive in today's world so why bother.
>>27533614
Minimizing it to the bare minimum necessary. I don't have any illusion of a world without killing or a world without any consumption of meat or assorted products derived from animal husbandry, but that does not mean I don't see nuances. Less killing is most often preferable to more killing. If we, in the West, can cut meat consumption with 80% (which is still a consumption level higher than most of our history), that would go a long way in the right direction.
>>27533717
Being 90%, or 80%, or 50%, or 30% ethical is better than being 0% ethical. We can all do our parts to make things a little better.
youtu.be/PB_ZMiYy_OQ
Vegan blackbot here, watch the documentary earthlings. Underneath the witty "justifications" y'all know what is right. It's up to you
>>27533747
Tell that to the people/creatures you step on while you prance around glowing with pride.
>>27533510
I find it hard to care about some brownies seeing their island flooded in like 50 years. Your 'harming other humans' is in the most abstract way possible.
>>27532810
Let me start off by saying that I hate /pol/. I am very liberal, and I still say this with all of my heart.
Vegans and vegetarians who have that lifestyle either solely or mainly because they think they are helping animals are fucking idiots. You disgust me with your self-righteous shit. In fact, let me tell you something that all vegans that I have spoken to freak out when I say:
HUMANS. ARE. ANIMALS.
ANIMALS. EAT. EACH. OTHER.
THIS IS HOW THE WORLD WORKS.
>>27533801
Will you care when said (hundred of millions of) brownies flee to your neighbour and country from environmental degradations and disasters caused by climate change?
Climate damage is highly abstract in the sense that it takes many decades to cause, and the results are highly indirect and accumulative (many offenders sharing the same small, bad habits). That does not make it any less potent or dangerous for the continued survival of our civilizations, but it does explain why we are so ridiculously worthless at dealing with it (on a personal, political and suprapolitical level.
>>27532810
How do you justify eating plants, which have been proven to be living beings that can feel pain?
I'm not a vegan, but I am a pescetarian which is just a vegetarian that eats fish. Pretty easy since I live in Maine and I love seafood. Also healthy.
Don't think I could give up dairy, and eggs either etc. too much of a struggle.
>>27533827
That argument might hold some water if you personally killed the animals you eat with your bare hands and then ate them raw like an animal would in the wild. Animals kill for survival, they don't pay a grocery store for a pretty processed package of decomposing flesh from an animal that was killed miles away in a factory farm after living in horrible conditions.
>>27533827
>THIS IS HOW THE WORLD WORKS
But humans have a choice ahurrdurrr
I cannot respect someone who puts the glory of mankind on the same level as that of animals.
>>27533975
That child didn't go out and kill that chicken himself and eat it, it came from a factory farm like pic related, and got shipped in a truck to their local grocery store. That's not nature
>>27533975
See:
>>27533964
Origami posta
>>27533964
>animals dont eat dead animals killed by other animals
>>27534079
>that
>comparable
Anon, I...
>>27533758
I definitely think factory-farming style of livestock is bad.
But, the concept itself of killing a creature to eat it is not immoral.
Is this really equivalent to a lion chasing down a gazelle right outside of its home? Vegetarianism and Veganism have been practiced for thousands of years, they aren't a "new fad."
>>27534055
That snake invaded the mouse's home and ate the entire family while they were still living, suffocating to death while slowly being digested
The majority of animals get eaten while they are still alive
I'd say that human treatment of animals as food is the best that could possibly happen to them
Going out and killing wild animals just for food would probably lead to the extinction of those animals
Farms exist to protect the populations of wild animals
>>27534102
great argument pal
>>27534113
i dont think an animal will give a shit whether it is mauled to death by a lion or killed in a factory
>>27534127
>living a short, brutalized, de-animalizing life in perpetual agony, terror and despair, before being led to a death-reeking factory where your fellow sufferers are massacred in front of you before it comes to your turn
>better than a relatively short, brutal death at the hands of another animal at the very end of your life
The point is that meat consumption on our current (historically unprecedently) level requires industrial animal husbandry. The answer is to eat less meat, not to try to maintain the same levels by hunting wild animals.
>>27534155
I paid back with an argument of the same worth. Do you need me to spell out why that is not comparable? Is that necessary for you to understand?
Im vegan and OP is a faggot. Veganism is only an option in first world countries really. Humans were designed to be omnivores and you are not going to change the world/anyone around you by choosing not to consume animal products.
I recently went vegan.
The meat industry is fucking disgusting i don't want to put that shit in god's temple(my body)
It's p easy actually but i still eat some meat with my family and hate it
>be vegan
>choose vegan options/items
>sold by the same megacorporations and businesses involved in the meat industry who just siphon across the marked up profits.
>suffering continues.
>many small businesses selling vegan options or in charge of farming lease/rent or buy seeds/land/farming supplies from massive corporations who provide the supplies/factories/feeds and even fund research into modification of animals. Monsanto own something like 80% of all agriculture patents, for example.
>all people are vegan
>dont need to manufacture meat anymore.
>corporations produce excess wheat in a weight of enough to make a massive dent in world poverty
>it is burnt for the continued existence of industry for the sake of industry.
OR
>alleviate animal suffering by removing or banning demand for meat and animal husbandry.
>millions upon millions of humans now suffer because of lack of income.
I wish I could feel like I made the world a good place by just changing my diet like you can.
Unfortunately the problems are a bit more involved and by taking a business class instead of an art class/basket weaving class, you too can help forward humanity and our choices of consumption.
>>27534055
The stupidest thing we do as men is believing anything we do is out of the cycle of nature.
Our skycrapers are complex termite mounds, our killing factories are complex marching food-lines of carried corpses, just like ants do it.
>>27532810
You do realize you can have all the pros with a well balanced non-vegan diet, correct? You'd have eat something besides pizza, takeout, and cut off the fucking sugar. If something's living just to be ground or fried, you can't expect someone to really care about them. An exception to this is cows that are milked. Not all of them are treated like shit either. If you want to make a difference, find the source of what you're buying. The Wendy's near me was using tomatoes from a farm that was improperly treating their animals, so I stopped eating there. Simply be an educated consumer and you don't have to be a faggot vegan preaching dumb shit trying to convert people like a fucking Mormon.
>>27534196
Yup, even if animals really didn't feel pain or suffering it's still ridiculously inefficient to pump them full of grains, water, and antibiotics their whole lives in order to harvest trivial amounts of meat from their bodies when you can just eat the grains in the first place. Most of the crops being grown currently go to livestock. The moral arguments are irrelevant when people resort to "I don't give a fuck about what happens to any animal", it's unsustainable and destroying ecosystems.
Didn't this happen in a brave new world or something?
A great way to create an underclass is by feeding them low quality or scarce protein by limited accessing to high quality protein, which creates weaker lower classes. Most of the reason you guys are beta is because you were raised on shitty ready meals where any meat or protein is 'fortified' with wheat substitutes and gels, just like in vegan foods. Can't hurt to look into it, if you find yourself offended.
In the end, they just would feed them goo made out of insects and real foods were kept for the elite.
Even if you trash my conspiracy, there's some better, more rational considerations here:
>>27534239
>>27534196
It seems you don't actually understand what goes on at farms
Chickens are far more comfortable there because not only do they have access to more food and water, but they live without the threat of predators
They actually don't comprehend that they could die any second, birds are smart, but they aren't that smart
And why are you arguing that dying at the hands of another animal is a better choice when killing and eating live animals has been deemed inhumane since the beginning of standardized farming practices
If the answer isn't to try maintaining the same levels of food by hunting, stop using that as part of your argument
You can't say that human's treatment of animals as food isn't comparable to wild animals because most humans didn't personally hunt and kill them
also
>relatively short
if you're lucky
but it's been documented that most animals die from blood loss, which means that they really only pass out when the predator is like 10% done eating them
>>27534220
>designed
Anon...
>>27534307
These are really my prime reasons. It's inefficient, unhealthy and contributing to fucking up our ecosystems and environment. Seriously, fuck meat production.
>>27534369
fine
evolved to accommodate multiple food sources
you don't have to shit on someone's religion just because you're an asshole (read as: vegan)
>>27534360
>taking dietary advice from Brave New World
kek
>>27534362
See:
>>27534307
Is it so bad to kill poor animals, oh noes
But back when we were their breakfastit was so right
Back when they hunted us it was fine, wasn't it? Will a Lion now say "I won't eat that poor human because he has a family" will a crocoile let itself starve because killing an animal causes it pain?
This is your logic, vegans.
Animals have the right to kill people and other animals, yet humans don't.
And I am not even being intolerant here, it is just rules of nature. Kill or be killed. If you love animals so much, go let them eat you, because "it is their instinct so it is fine".
>>27534239
"We can't free the slaves and make owning slaves illegal, think of all the families that will lose income from their plantations. Maybe if you took a BUSINESS CLASS like ME you'd understand."
"If you stop the third reich then thousands of Nazis will suffer from losing their jobs"
"If you ban human trafficking imagine all the slave brothel operators going out of business, how will they feed their families?"
>>27534394
If you vegan assholes have to shit on everyone else's lifestyle, I'm sure as fuck going to shit on your stupid fucking imaginary friend in the sky.
>>27534369
Sorry, poor word choice. Humans are omnivores, I don't believe in a higher power lol
>>27534220
>What is India
>>27534410
>Invokes godwins law.
Typical vegan. Let me have a try.
"I don't mind millions will suffer, more than under nazis, slaves and trafficking combined because I watched a documentary about chickens with sad piano music now I buy only vegan options at subway (right next to the meat they also sell) and I'm a good person"
>Maybe if you took a BUSINESS CLASS like ME you'd understand.
Maybe if you took any class you'd stray further away from tired old strawmen like the above.
>>27534362
Your argument implies that the chickens are going to die anyway and that we're doing them a service by killing them "humanely." If you don't breed chickens in a factory you don't have to kill them at all, even more humane everybody wins. And male chicks are put into grinders after hatching as they're no use to the egg industry.
>>27532868
chicken are considered "cage-free" as long as there is a doggy door at the entrance to their tiny coop you retarded goyim
t. farmer joe
I'm a pescatarian but my parents raised me vegetarian and now they're vegan.
Vegan food tastes like shit other than you know vegetables/fruits. I don't think I'll ever turn vegan.
My parents do it for health reasons not because of the animals.
>>27534406
Yeah, but those animals are instinct driven. Humans can reason. I eat meat because I don't give a shit, but there will come a time when humanity only feeds of vegan food. Because it more ethical and economical. Once the technology is advanced enough, there will be no reason to waste resources and land with fuckloads of farm animals. Just get proteins from plants and 3d print meat.
>>27534520
I don't know what you're talking about. Non-meat food is delicious. Lr2 cook properly, or stop drinking/eating sugary processed crap which fucks up your palate.
I can kill whatever I want. I could literally go and snap a rabbit's neck right now. What are you gonna do about it, weak cunt?
>>27533076
*unsheathes fedora*
>>27533544
Right wing is the best wing. Freedom can only ever be achieved with structure first.
>>27534529
>humans don't instinctively want to eat meat
>the smell of cooked meat doesn't trigger salivary glands
>the pleasure gained from eating a hearty meal isn't an instinct
please define """"animal instincts""""
>>27534529
>Because it more ethical and economical.
no, otherwise we'd be doing it.
> there will come a time when humanity only feeds of vegan food
Humanity has never been 100% anything. If you've found a way that we'll all agree on a single lifestyle choice then please share it with every government in the world so we can apply it for world peace. This is unrealistic and removing mans choice for anything results in bad times, most notably things that become contraband become black marketed and coveted behind doors.
> 3d print meat.
That's cool though, I'd eat this forever, I like what google did with the space burger but so long as they can prove it isn't harmful sometime later.
as a vegan, I don't understand why other vegans/vegetarians legitimately think they're helping anyone (including animals) other than themselves. For fellow robots who feel like shit physically, a high carb low fat vegan diet helps your body feel energized. You gotta take B12 vitamins though or you're gonna feel like shit
>>27534529
Wrong.
Eating the real thing will still be a delicacy, if only for the high cost.
>>27534473
Are you serious? Millions will suffer if we phase out animal exploitation by the population slowly going vegan? Would you have a similar reaction if McDonald's decided to close down and their poor workers had to find other employment? There's no vegan switch that's going to lay off every farm worker overnight causing them to "suffer" the tragedy of not being paid minimum wage to kill animals everyday.
>>27534520
All food is vegan until you put animal carcasses or bodily fluids onto it ya dingus. And there are plenty of vegan alternatives for those bodily fluids and flesh
>>27534437
vegans get shit on because they shit on everyone else
nobody made fun of vegans until they got uppity about it
nobody makes fun of vegetarians because they learned to swerve
>>27534481
And your argument implies that what we are doing isn't natural because it's not the exact same as what other animals are doing
And they would die anyway because if we didn't have farming practices we would still eat them into extinction, it has happened with so many other animals
>>27534578
>Right wing is the best wing. Freedom can only ever be achieved with structure first.
>tfw no global carbon-emission rights market
>tfw no massive VAT tax on meat, fuel, energy, and other climate damaging materials
>tfw no market-based solution internalizing social costs to private producers/consumers
Just give the marketplace the frame to work within, and let incentives run their course. Goddammit.
>>27534529
Humans also have instincts. If not we wouldn't even be alive. And this will be shocking for you, but meat was the decisive factor that made us evolve.
http://www.livescience.com/23671-eating-meat-made-us-human.html
GG, no re.
If you find something that's delicious as a bacon wrapped steak then I'll become vegan.
>tfw you realize vegans can only exist in a first world advanced society that is easy to live in and has everything you need
>as soon as society collapsed or if they were to try to live in some shithole african country or in true nature they would die off
>>27534638
Once again you're implying that we HAVE to eat them. The wild ones won't go extinct if we.don't.eat.them.
>>27534582
>no, otherwise we'd be doing it.
>what are externalized social costs
Private consumers and producers don't pay the full cost of production for meats and other animal husbandry related things
>>27534678
Best burger I ever had was a vegan burger in a hipster place in Warsaw
t. meat-eater
>>27534688
>What is India
>>27534405
meat tastes better than vegetables do
until there is a way to produce non-meat foods that tastes better than meat foods, we will eat the foods we like
Scaling back our consumption of meat isn't the answer, that's like saying you can create an engine that produces less smog
Not eating meat isn't the answer either, just as walking everywhere isn't as efficient as taking the bus or a car
The answer is to produce foods that replace and improve on the place meat has, but until non meat foods taste better than meat foods, we will eat meat
>>27534690
We do have to eat them
It's our animal instinct to eat meat, which is just one of the reasons it tastes so good
The wild ones won't go extinct if we set up farming systems
If people didn't have to eat meat, then why did we start hunting and killing animals millennia ago?
>>27534713
>meat tastes better than vegetables do
You say that because you've never had any good vegan dishes. Shit is cash. Learn to make some, not even for stop meat-eating, but to see what you're missing.
Brb, going to grab some of my tomato, paprika, kidney bean, onion, garlic, chilli, zucchini stew on the stove. Cash as fuck.
>>27534275
>trying to convert people like a fucking Mormon
Stopped reading there. Thats not what were trying at all and you know it.
>>27534688
>Die off
No, I would just start eating meat again. What are you, retarded?
>>27534751
"When I see a fat ass it's my instinct to rape it, why else would it feel so good. Sex slave brothels protect women in society from being raped, also we've been raping each other for millennia it's obviously natural and ok."
>>27534798
You cant kill an animal. You are too emotional and feminized.
>>27534763
>good vegan dishes
I've had vegan dishes
meat still tastes better
potatoes and onions taste better with bacon fat
your problem is that something wrong with your taste buds, obviously by your need to tell people what your "stew" is made out of, as if just the inclusion of those ingredients alone makes it taste better and cooking has nothing to do with making food
hint: that's not a stew, it's a sauce I'd pour over pork
>>27534842
I'm assuming you're trolling but I ate and loved meat for 22 years. I've killed animals before and I'd do it again if me or someone I cared about was hungry. There is literally nothing wrong with eating meat if you're in dire straights, it doesn't go against my morals and it is quite tasty too.
"Vegans are so stupid it's just a new trend."
"the concept of flesh-avoidance can be traced back to ancient Indian and eastern Mediterranean societies. Vegetarianism is first mentioned by the Greek philosopher and mathematician Pythagoras of Samos around 500 BCE. In addition to his theorem about right triangles, Pythagoras promoted benevolence among all species, including humans."- time.com/3958070/history-of-veganism/
>>27534835
>eating animals is the same as rape
nice argument, asshole
but beyond the pure misappropriation of ethics, your analogy is flawed because laws protect people from inhumane acts against them, and not only that, but consensual sex exists
what's the meat argument equivalent of an alternative that satisfies urges of both parties, both the consumers and the consumed?
should we only eat animals who consent to being eaten?
>>27534890
veganism isn't flesh avoidance
vegetarianism is flesh avoidance
next time research the origins of consuming absolutely no animal products whatsoever
>>27534854
Man, you have to learn to cook before. Vegetables, legumes and various spices makes rad shit happen, you just have to know how. You can't just dump onions and potatoes in a pot of water and expect magic to happen.
>>27534868
Then why dont you just eat meat?
>>27532810
Cry a fucking river you hippy cuck. Meat is good for you cause of protein. Supplements are filled with artificial shit. I have no doubt in my mind that any healthy meat eater can beat the everloving shit out of you with little to no effort.
>>27534552
My parents are the vegans and they cook fine and so do their other church members.
It still tastes like shit to me. Have you ever had a vegan bunt cake? Literally tastes like fucking air.
Also I'm a healthy eater because my parents have never allowed unhealthy food into the house so my palate has never grown to like junk food.
>>27534636
Um obviously? Those alternatives taste like shit to me. My parents house is like a vegan kingdom so I've tried them all.
>>27534903
Vegetables you fucking idiot. Can kleptomaniacs freely steal because they have a strong urge to do so? I have a strong urge to shit on my neighbors car and he offered no solution to satisfy my urge so I'm gonna do it.
>>27534918
>you're implying cooking has nothing to do with food
>"b-but also in addition to my previous argument there's this thing I totally didn't leave out"
you listing off ingredients that your stew is comprised of isn't a compelling argument that vegan food tastes better, it just shows that you know little about actually cooking food
I used to work in a butcher shop and knew quite a bit about the meat industry. AMA i guess
>>27534919
He benefits from modern technology and abundant sources of vegetables like all the other first worlders on 4chan. He's not living in bumfuck africa in a mudhut having to resort to eating a cow
How good is whey protein for replacing meat?
Holla holla, i'm about to blow you out on this:
>As a vegan I do not cause suffering to animals.
This is untrue.
See:
>>27534239
>choose vegan options/items
>sold by the same megacorporations and businesses involved in the meat industry who just siphon across the marked up profits.
>suffering continues.
>many small businesses selling vegan options or in charge of farming lease/rent or buy seeds/land/farming supplies from massive corporations who provide the supplies/factories/feeds and even fund research into modification of animals. Monsanto own something like 80% of all agriculture patents, for example.
So you may respond:
>But I don't *mean* to cause suffering like meat eaters.
What you actually mean is:
>As a human, I mean well.
Everyone means well. But you cannot criticize the suffering caused by the agricultural and farming industry until you correct it and remove it.
>But I can mean to dislike it by not eating meat.
But you still contribute to it in a way no different to a meat eater by purchasing any number of thousands of items, including vegetables, that donate in a monetary sense to any number of massive businesses.
>Well this is unfair, I can't win.
You can, go into business and change it, but as of now, you are now enlightened about the fact you have nothing morally on meat eaters just by observing the facts of reality.
Thanks, next customer.
And a recap for the slow ones:
>As long as you utilize society, you contribute via wealth to the industry causing suffering.
>Whether you eat vegetables or meat, pay taxes (especially in the US (See: FDA))
>Even if you mean not to, others who eat meat can mean not to cause suffering either.
>>27534954
But that doesn't satisfy the reason we eat meat
That's like saying, borrowing your analogy, choosing to abstain from sex entirely is just as good as having consensual sex
Setting up a system where you tell people where their flaws in security are by stealing things and then returning them isn't a better solution to just getting over yourself
Writing a strongly worded letter with a drawing of you shitting all over their car isn't a better alternative to just bottling your emotions up
you have to be retarded
The problem is not simply consumption of animals. The problem is our population and the amount of resources we consume in total. Even if we eat only plants, we will continue to grow and consume at an unsustainable rate. It is this uncontrolled growth, unlike that of any other species, that will kill us in the end.
>>27534981
Youre not getting a balanced diet if you skip meat.
>>27535011
Maybe in 200 years (but by then it won't be our problem). As of right now, there's a limit set by the government on how much food farmers are allowed to produce because of oversaturation. The government PAYS farmers to only produce a certain amount of food. I forget what the bill is called but it's legit. Too much food is bad for the economy and most of it would go to waste anyway. Unfortunately this means food prices will be higher than if there was no limit.
>>27534987
I just want to add that this was a deconstruction of the moral high ground idiocy of veganism, to show it's absolute horseshit and if you subscribe to it you are guilty of the sins you lament in others, which I find personally to be the component that draws many of the middleclass feelgood type idiots who do it selfishly for this factor.
This is not a nutritional argument which is a completely different field I'm not educated in.
But the moral argument is deeply flawed and anyone touting it deserves to lose support for their cause.
>fuck the environment
Don't care about that shit one bit. This planet could fall into the sun after I die, and it wouldn't bother me one bit.
>fuck your morals
Having a high moral standard is great. Trying to push them on other makes you an asshole.
>fuck the animals pain and suffering
Until a chicken or a cow can build machine guns and nukes, we run this bitch, and are on the top of the food chain
T. Murica
>>27535052
>eat protein
>make sure you get iron somehow
wow so hard
>>27535011
True. But the population growth is slowing down right now. The era of having 10 kids is over, and the rise of porn and autism will take care of it.
I actually think the world population is going to decrease in our lifetime.
>>27532810
Some questions:
1) Do you oppose the death penalty?
2) Do you oppose abortion?
3) Not counting taxes, what percentage of your income do you give to alleviate poverty?
4) Not counting court-ordered activity, how much time a month do you volunteer to help the poor?
5) How do you plan to raise children knowing that a vegan diet is potentially lethal for infants and certainly delays/permanently impairs development?
i feel like ill be a vegetarian in the near future but being a vegan looks expensive / like a lot of effort
>>27535106
>I don't even know what 'amino acids' *means*!
FTFY
>>27535120
>eat your dog
i'll need sides with my burger as mine have gone into orbit
>>27535106
You could also just get all your nutrients through shakes and pills but that will also make you sick and weak.
Get real faggot.
I kill animals for fun, i don't even eat them. Small bords, rodents, a cat here and there. Once shot a dog that was running wild on my lawn.
Where is your god now?
>>27535115
>1) Do you oppose the death penalty?
No
>2) Do you oppose abortion?
No
>3) Not counting taxes, what percentage of your income do you give to alleviate poverty?
I give my pocket change or dollar bills to the poor whenever I'm walking down the street or something
I don't count how much I give away, but at least it's something
>4) Not counting court-ordered activity, how much time a month do you volunteer to help the poor?
I help people who I see need help, I don't go out of my way to help people like in a soup kitchen or something
>5) How do you plan to raise children knowing that a vegan diet is potentially lethal for infants and certainly delays/permanently impairs development?
I want my kids to be able to eat literally all foods, I'm a decent cook so I'm going to develop their palate early on
I know this question set is for vegans, but still
>>27533040
You promote torturing animals to get cheaper meat.
>>27533040
Meat eaters support extinction of wild species by destroying habitats since meat takes a lot more land to make than plants.
>>27535150
I actually buy meat and then throw it away just because i want to stimulate the mass meat industry.
I dont even eat like meat lel. I just want to trigger vegan fags.
>>27532810
Vegans pushing forward being vegan primarily for moral reasons is why people do not take ethics seriously, it has jumped the shark.
>>27535142
No it wouldn't, not if you got all of the nutrients and calories you needed.
>>27535181
Who gives a fuck? Everything on this planet will go extinct at some point. Earth ain't gonna last forever.
growing plants is harming animals too. your whole existence is harming animals. you are an animal and harming yourself (we're genetically omnivores). kill yourself.
>>27534127
These huge levels of meat consumption exterminates many species.
>>27534775
Literally the last line.
>your family *Still* won't go vegan
You're literally Mormon in the food industry.
>>27535218
It was a counter argument to his post.
It isn't for the planet though because you would have to cut down forests to get arable land, so it really is more detrimental than helpful..
>>27532810
You are an omnivore. Animals aren't equal to you.
Get over it you massive faggot.
>>27535209
Bzzzzt. Wrong.
By your logic you can live on a diet of candy (carbs), olive oil (fat) and whey (protein). And then eat a bunch of pills for all the vitamins and miners you will need.
Do it if youre so sure, faggot. I want to watch you die a slow miserable death.
Two reasons why i won't be vegan:
1. I live in a inner-city, very hard to find 'vegan only' places
2. Every SINGLE vegan/vegetarian looks like they survived a death camp in Poland. I'm looking i have a normal body type and i don;t want to destroy my genetics by not eating protein.
3.i don't care about animals anyway lmao and not buying meat products isn't going to save them.
If you want to help stop killing animals in slaughter houses,then i suggest protesting or become a politician.
>>27535314
>miners
Meant minerals obviously
>be me omnivore
>work at a place that caters to vegans/vegetarians
>they pay for my check
>I go buy bacon cheeseburger for lunch
>let the grease from burger fall into someones tofu
>oh well
>>27535011
That problem becomes very much larger with a very high meat consumption l
>>27533717
So you don't take anything like ethics or morals or whatever into consideration in any decision?
>>27534239
>millions upon millions of humans now suffer because of lack of income.
Do you think that the industrial revolution was a bad idea since it took a lot less labor to produce the products?
Shit needs to die so I can live. We create environments for them to benefit me.
Vegan about 4-5 weeks now. Feel pretty much the same, gotten a bit better at cooking out of necessity.
Relied on beans for a lot of meals in the first couple weeks, which made my farts and shits stink BAD. Not as big an issue now, but they're still at least slightly worse than my meat farts.
Being a vegan is kind of like being atheist, it opens up a huge new pool of entertainment and content on the internet. It also shares that aspect of easily winning arguments and debates, meat-eaters are almost as shameful as Christians, they repeat the same debunked bullshit, move goal-posts, rely on anecdote, become emotional. It's more fun that being an atheist because you're often the underdog as well.
I come from a mildly dysfunctional and negligent family, I love our dog more than them, it's great not having to rationalise that. Bitter-sweet I don't live at home any more though.
Vegan food is also pretty tasty, and meat and dairy are disgusting and weird if you think about it long enough.
You vegan cucks won't last for more than 2 months.
>falling for the vegeshill
5 chickens had to die to make my lunch today.
I've been vegan since last December. And vegetarian for two years before that. It's going well.
I'm just really happy to see more and more people going vegan recently. It's really going to be a significant and positive impact.
Vegan day 3 here
Running out of energy
All my hair fell out
Lost ability to walk and speak
Currently bedbound
Help
>>27532810
r9/k/ here,
If going vegan is for the animals, I think I fucked up.
>went vegan
>still go hunting
>kill deer
>donate deer
>receive cash
>buy ammo and repeat
Should I stop? I honestly love hunting and it's the only thing that lets me justify having my guns to my family and go outside regularly.
Holy shit OP triggered alot of people. Im not vegetarien but if people get this pissed just because some people are maybe I should consider it.
>all this vegan shilling
That one anon is right - non stop shitting as a vegan. You shit your entire day away.
>>27535821
Deer have had good lives and little environmental impact. I think its okay
>>27535821
Don't stop eating vegan, but continue hunting if you truly want to. I mean, it's not vegan to hunt obviously, but it's better to hunt and eat vegan than hunt and eat factory farmed food.
Best case scenario you stop hunting though, maybe practice target shooting instead or something.
>>27535880
To be honest, if animals have to be killed, I think hunting them in the wild is the best of both worlds.
>animals live pretty full and meaningful lives
>humans get their meat when the animals are "done using it"
The mindless slaughter and industrial breeding seems cruel - dietary bullshit aside.
I'm vegan for 4 months now. Feels great man, still no friends though
3-4 shits everyday, who has time to shit that much?
Also going vegan made me girly and skinny and made Stacies catty.
Go aid in the development of lab/vat grown beef and meat then or shut the fuck up while I eat this filet.
>>27535839
If you think this is funny, look up those edgy af vegans like this guy. He's right, and I like his style.
http://youtu.be/H73zgvD5x48
>>27535951
It's a common misconception that a vegan diet won't give you enough nutrition.
Although I'd like people to go vegan, at the same time I like how exclusive it makes me feel. Not that I talk to people or whatever, it's just a good display of self discipline I feel.
>>27532810
People like you were culled from early human society for being useless pussies. I long for the days when we could shun our defective brethren to die out and remove that line of weak genes from the race. Now its all "save the animals. Don't eat cows!"
Plus....vegan men are the biggest beta cucks ever.
>>27532810
Vegan here. I completely agree with your post.
>>27532810
faggot
original comment sponsored by your favorite burger joint
>>27536018
I got skinny/skinner than 95% of teenage girls as a vegan.
They got catty af. If you like fat shaming indirectly you should go vegan.
>vegans have no problems with untold millions of chinks living lives worse than factory farm animals making their iphones and gopros, t-shirts and furniture and basically everything else
>but what about caged chickens thou
>>27536211
Well, you have to start somewhere, dude.
>>27536324
Humans are FAR more important then animals so you should start there.
>>27536211
>>27536324
You're right, you have to stop somewhere. But after I went vegan I started to think about that stuff more and so I think I'll start buying quality over quantity in clothes, and go to second hand shops for shirts or small furniture ect.
>>27536456
Start not stop*
>>27533563
oh watch out guys the vegans are going to come and make us into fucking pussies like they are somehow haha
>>27534890
pythagoras also was so scared of beans that he refused to run across a field of them when being chased by a lynchmob
>>27535692
>being a vegan is great because it allows me to win arguments on the internet
Like poetry.
Vegans act like assholes and their arguments are usually riddled with logical fallacies, lying and factually wrong information.
I could never ever give up milk.
>>27537144
You probably mean cheese. Milk is easy to replace with soy milk or almond milk for cereals and you can hardly tell the difference when it's mixed with stuff. Chocolate doesn't has cocoa butter instead of milk butter a lot of the time so you don't even have to give up most sweets.
I think cheese is the only dairy product that's that miss-able. Still gave it up though, sometimes I use vegan cheese but it's not really as good.
>tfw just realised people who are vegetarian or vegan for health reason instead of the 'save the animals' meme no longer exist
>it's just some social label to make themselves look 'quirky and unique' and 'superior morals' now
Fuck this earth. I've seen every sense of logic in our world dissappear now..
>>27532810
Oh wow an actual vegan thread. Now just post 40 more per hour for the next week and you might have posted as many threads about veganism as meat eaters post threads about bitching about vegans (then claim vegans won't shut up about themselves).
>>27532810
I dunno if you're really a vegan OP.
>>27534688
>save bucks nationally and save environmental destruction because we can now source all the nutrients we could ever need from vegan shit
>still have meat eating adaptations for many generations to come
>if society ever turns to shit we can still go back to hunting for meat
>Don't stop eating meat anyway
We should honestly just cut down desu fampai.
>>27533552
You're giving people an excuse to continue eating meat. They'll just paint you as ruining a farmers life, which in their heads is worse than thousands of animals. You end up reinforcing their headcannon, which is worse than just being passive about it.
>>27537415
I'm vegan for health reasons. And animals too, but honestly I'd probably eat animals and humans if that's what I needed to not starve.
God, this is pure cancer.
